The Blazers Future Regarding Free Agent Signings
I've noticed a lot of fan posts recently that speculate Portland's future. Whether it's a discussion about "blowing up the team," a trade drawer, or what to do about our point guard position, all of these posts illustrate an underlying sense of dissatisfaction with this current team.
I don't think I'm alone when I say that the current squad likely won't be going deep into the playoffs, and is even less likely to ever compete for a championship. We all have our hopes of the team we'd like to see put together, whether this be through trade or free agency. But what's the nitty-gritty? Let's examine the details of potential player movement where the rubber meets the road. This particular discussion will focus on free agent acquisitions.
Someone might look at the Portland's current contract situation with some of its players and figure this is a good thing. Lots of high, expiring contracts during an offseason with some real free agent talent available. Call me a pessimist, but this situation may prove pretty challenging and it revolves around a lot more than just our point guard situation, a popular topic.
For the purposes of this topic, lets assume that the Blazers make no trades. Once the current contracts expire (Camby, Felton, Oden, Batum, Smith, Johnson&Johnson) and if Wallace opts out of his option, the Blazers should be left with roughly $28 to 30 million in cap space. That's a nice chunk of change, but you then have to go out and sign a starting center, point guard, and small forward. Not to mention, you have to fill your lower bench positions. Let's take a look at each of these needs.
Point Guard
Looking at the available free agents out there, the most likely candidates I see to fill this spot are Felton, Hinrich, Williams, or Nash mostly because they're unrestricted and thus easier to sign. Foye, Lin, and Dragic are also unrestricted however these are candidates less likely to fill a starting spot as they have yet to prove themselves in this role (although Lin is quickly changing that situation). Likely restricted free agent options include Brooks, Augustin, Hill, and Bayless.
From the above pool, you're likely doing to spend $6-8 million on Felton or Hinrich. Felton sure isn't looking like a guy you'd pay more than what you're paying him now, and Hinrich really is in no position to negotiate for anything too much higher than the mid-level exception. You'd be spending significantly more on Williams (max contract - likely $16-17 million) and he's not likely to come to Portland anyway. Nash may be drawn here, but how much do the Blazers want to pay a guy who may only have 1 or 2 good years left? He makes $11 million now. Smart money says, you take Nash if you can get him for less than $10 million per, and no more than 2 years.
The restricted guys are much harder to figure. Phoenix may be willing to match a fairly substantial offer sheet for Brooks, especially if Nash leaves. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if a team had to spend upwards of $8-10 million to lure him away. Augustin, Hill, and Bayless could very well be had for not too much more than the mid-level exception ($5 million) depending on how their teams value them. For instance, if the Bayless/Calderon backcourt doesn't workout and the Raptors can't unload Jose, they may be reluctant to match an offer sheet. I can't see that Charlotte wants to spend too much to keep Augustin as they drafted his replacement last year. Similarly with Hill, if the Pacers want to make a big run at Gordon, Hill will be easy free agent fodder. All of these guys are gambles, but all have skills that Portland would favor in a point guard, and all have proven they're capable of holding down the starting position, albeit less so with Hill.
Small Forward
Interestingly, I think this is the Blazers' largest bugaboo. Some were upset that Portland didn't extend Batum. But think for a second. Why didn't this happen? I contend that Batum wasn't given a legit extension offer ($6-8 million) because the Blazers don't want to get stuck with a sizable contract for both Batum and Wallace for the '12 to '13 season. Remember how Wallace was rumored to be traded before the season began? Where there's smoke, there's fire, and the fire here burning for Portland is the contract situation with Wallace. With him having the option to extend at the end of the season, it becomes very difficult for Portland to plan their budget accordingly around extending guys like Batum. It would be an effective budget disaster to be paying Wallace $10 million to start, and Batum $8 million to back him up. Ergo, no trading of Wallace? No extending of Batum.
That being said, the chips have fallen. Batum and Wallace are probably the frontrunners in this free agent class. Chase Budinger is a very good shooter and maybe someone in the Wally Szczerbiak mold (think of Luke Babbitt if he actually played to his potential), and he's also unrestricted. Wilson Chandler (restricted) would be another guy to look at coming out of China. The options aren't super exciting after that.
If Wallace does take his option at $10.5 million, then say adios to Batum. I don't see how Portland would match an offer sheet. On the other hand, if Wallace opts out, then I think it's very likely Portland will sign whatever offer sheet is presented, of which I expect a team will try to sign Batum to the $7-9 million range. With a little luck, maybe less. If Wallace leaves and Portland doesn't mach an offer sheet for Nic, then Chandler is your best bet as a legit starter. Budinger is nice, but he's definitely less proven. Chandler would likely garner a contract similar to that of Batum.
Center
Hard to say what management is thinking about Oden. They are privy to details regarding his health that we as fans are not. For the purpose of this discussion though, I'm going to assume Oden will not play a game wearing a Blazer uniform again (again, I'm a glass half-empty kind of guy). Good news is, there's some great talent available in the free agent pool. Beyond Howard (no chance of signing with Portaland), you've got Kaman, Hawes, Camby, Mohammed, Gray, and Asik who are all unrestricted. A list made up of former all-stars, solid veterans, and highly talented youth. I think there's little question that, although some of these options will clearly produce more, all are capable of holding down the starting spot. Kaman and Hawes will likely get the largest contracts, with both likely getting double-digit million figures. Mohammed, Gray, and Asik can be had for much less (probably around the mid-level exception), but are not likely to be as effective. Camby could probably be signed for fairly cheap, but his durability is certainly suspect.
The restricted bunch also has some good talent. This gang is headed by Hibbert (current all-star) but also features Brook Lopez and JaVale McGee. Pulling Hibbert out of Indiana will prove a near-impossible effort by a team, and will likely require a high offer sheet being signed ($12-$13 million range) in addition to Indiana clearly wanting to put money elsewhere. McGee would be a good guy to have, but again, tough to pull away from Washington. I'd be surprised if he ended up taking less than $10 million. Same with Lopez, except a team just might be able to sneak in a lower offer, particularly if New Jersey has their sights set on signing both Howard and Williams. The complicating issue here is that Lopez is very likely to be traded in such an effort to acquire Howard.
Bench Spots
Not gonna get too much in the weeds here. I'd expect Portland would be able to sign a variety of guys, including ones they already have, to league minimums. You also have the salary exceptions with your draft picks. In the end, this shouldn't hold up any major efforts to acquire any of the above.
Alright, so there you have it. Roughly $28 to 30 million to sign a combination of the above. Personally, what I'd like to see happen is for Wallace to opt out, and for the Blazers to sign Batum to an $8 million deal. That would leave enough, potentially to go after a guy like Hibbert, Hawes, McGee, or Kaman at center (I'm not a huge fan of Lopez) and a guy like Hinrich or Augustin at point. You could also sign Felton back, given he may be easy to negotiate down to a lower contract as he's probably tired of moving, has said he wants to stay in Portland, and would have little leverage to negotiate for a larger contract.
Let me know what you think! I know that the team will change with a combination of trades and free agents, but just examine the free agency option for now. If the Blazers made no trades, how would you want them to proceed with free agent signings?
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Interesting, intelligent commentary
……..and you did some leg work. Much preferable to reading people talking about the latest hot All-Star of the year, ie Dwight Howard.
My quibbles would be of this variety: Mohammed and Gray can hold down a starting center spot? Picky quibbles.
I noticed that you skipped the shooting guard position. Perhaps because Matthews is under contract there for quite some time? The other positions all had free-agency pending, as you noted.
Strange times here in Portland. Thanks for the write-up. Oh, and thanks for writing your piece cleanly and without annoying grammatical and punctuation errors ;-)
This is just the beginning.
Thanks for the feedback.
The conversation gets MUCH more interesting when you inject trace scenarios into the mix. I’ve worked on several different scenarios, some of which have been hot topics on trade drawers, and others which have been actually considered by the Blazers. Needless to say, things get real dicey, real fast. I’ll post that topic a bit later.
I agree, Mohammed and Grey aren’t great options as staters. It’d be a give and take. For instance, if Deron Williams did express interest in coming to Portland, you could sign him for the max if you were willing to skimp on going with one of these guys at center. Not saying I would necessarily want to do that, just saying it could be done. I kind of see Grey as a Przybilla type of guy, with a little less shot blocking.
You hit the nail on the head regarding shooting guard. There’s essentially two main reasons for a team being locked in at a position: 1) The player is really good and has a long-term contract (e.g. Aldridge), or 2) The player has a long-term contract and is not really good, making him a poor trade prospect.
With Matthews, it’s not so much that Portland couldn’t move him in a trade, it is just difficult to do given he’s a bit overpaid for his production level. Besides, I don’t mind Matthews at the two. He plays aggressive defense, and for the most part, he doesn’t lose games for you. Will he ever flirt with all-star potential? No, probably not. However, there’s a reason we don’t resent his spot on the team as much as, say, Felton’s.
Jeremy Lin will be a restricted free agent.
Houston has a team option on Chase Budinger for next season.
Wilson Chandler will likely re-sign with Denver mid-season when he comes back from China, so that’ll then be the end of his current RFA status.
Omer Asik will be a restricted free agent.
"I Am Mine"
Just going off hoopsworld data.
Chandler and Brooks are definitely up in the air due to their Chinese contracts. Are they allowed to extend prior to season ending with their respective teams once they come back? That’s something I really don’t know. I just figured the same deadlines applied to them.
According to hoopsworld, Lin and Asik are listed as unrestricted but will be eligible for restricted free agency due to the details of their rookie contracts. Not sure how that all plays out in the long run or whose option it is.
As per Wikipedia’s summation of the new CBA: For 1st-round draft picks, restricted free agency is only allowed after a team exercises its option for a fourth year, and the team makes a Qualifying Offer at the Rookie-scale amount after the fourth year is completed. For any other player to be a restricted free agent, he must be at most a three-year NBA veteran, and his team must have made a Qualifying Offer for either 125% of his previous season’s salary or the minimum salary plus $175,000, whichever offer is higher.
The above doesn’t really apply to either Lin or Asik, however, given neither were first round picks.
I didn’t see where Houston has an option on Budinger.
Here are the links:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NBA_salary_cap
http://www.hoopsworld.com/2012-nba-free-agents
Yeah, it's good stuff.
I also apologize for being a jerk in parts of this subthread, as that was uncalled for.
"I Am Mine"
Not a problem.
I just posted the other day in a different thread about how my posts are frequently tongue in cheek. Sarcasm is becoming a lost art.
Also, people who have their ego hurt on a message board are lame.
"Also, people who have their ego hurt on a message board are lame."
Not quite the same as a bruised ego, but I get excessively riled up at times and I admit that’s not a good quality. I can’t fix that flaw, though, and my personality won’t change anytime soon.
But I don’t mean to be a buzzkill, even if I frequently come across as one.
"I Am Mine"
Best Friends
You two are like peas in a pod
by DonttrashCrash on Feb 10, 2012 8:12 AM PST up reply actions
"The above doesn’t really apply to either Lin or Asik, however, given neither were first round picks."
Read it again.
“I didn’t see where Houston has an option on Budinger.”
Research it again.
"I Am Mine"
Y'know what, man, I'll be generous enough to show you where you slipped up regarding RFA status.
“Restricted free agency exists only on a limited basis. It is allowed following the fourth year of rookie ‘scale’ contracts for first round draft picks (see question number 42). It is also allowed for all veteran free agents who have been in the league three or fewer seasons.”
https://webfiles.uci.edu/lcoon/cbafaq/salarycap.htm#Q37
For your sake, I highlighted the key passage in bold italics.
"I Am Mine"
But all of these depend on qualifying offers.
Do you know that these teams have already issued them to these players?
QOs are to be submitted between the season's end and June 30th.
Until then, we have no idea who’ll be tendered or non-tendered an offer.
"I Am Mine"
So is there any difference...
… between the RFA status of say, Batum, and the RFA status of someone like Asik? A difference that would matter, anyway.
Nah, they're both RFAs.
The only difference is the amount of their QOs, although that differs for each individual RFA.
"I Am Mine"
Good work. I'll address the center-free agent talk
The restricted bunch also has some good talent. This gang is headed by Hibbert (current all-star) but also features Brook Lopez and JaVale McGee. Pulling Hibbert out of Indiana will prove a near-impossible effort by a team, and will likely require a high offer sheet being signed ($12-$13 million range) in addition to Indiana clearly wanting to put money elsewhere. McGee would be a good guy to have, but again, tough to pull away from Washington. I’d be surprised if he ended up taking less than $10 million. Same with Lopez
Indiana appears to be poised to match any offer on Hibbert unfortunately. McGee is probably much more attainable, with the last few coaches being unable to coach JMc. After Arenas, Crittenton, Blatche, management will probably try to go away from those with “bad character” like we did for awhile. But now with McMillan and Camby/Thomas we can afford to deal & attempt to steer in the right direction. Its a big gamble on a big talent… No thanks on Lopez.
"We gotta get this $#!^ together guys!" - Phil
Probably right about Hibbert.
Alright, hypothetically speaking, let’s say Portland signed Hibbert to a 5-year, $65 million offer sheet. You still think Pacers match it? I’m really not intimately familiar with indiana’s situation, but a quick look says if they drop all of their contracts, match a $13 million offer to Hibbert, they’re left with about $13 million that they then have to use to sign Gordon in addition to replenishing their bench. I honestly don’t know how bad they want Gordon.
How much do you think it would take to sign Hibbert? Max deal?
Since Portland could only offer Roy Hibbert a four-year deal, it'd be something like a four-year, $52 ...
million contract. That’s somewhat similar to what the Golden State Warriors presented D’Andre Jordan this previous off-season, which the Los Angeles Clippers matched in a heartbeat. That’d happen in this case, too.
"I Am Mine"
Well that doesn't sound promising.
Then maybe they could land Spencer Hawes. He’s as Northwest as Microsoft.
That's a possibility.
However, I’m not sold that Spencer Hawes’ numbers so far this season are sustainable.
"I Am Mine"
I attribute them to Doug Collins
Not sure he could repeat what he is doing this year under a inferior coach like McMillan.
"We gotta get this $#!^ together guys!" - Phil
I know, but it sometimes takes years to
have a “breakout year”, for post players especially. Last year he wasn’t nearly as comfortable in DC’s system. Big ups to Hawes in the production leap though.
"We gotta get this $#!^ together guys!" - Phil
Hawes is playing pretty much the same as 2 other seasons
similar points/rebs/assists/minutes/blocks. his minutes were down last year, which probably led to his lower shots per game and scoring and rebounding. attribute the marginally higher averages to the team being so wildly successful as a whole and i think we’re seeing about what spencer hawes is capable of on a regular basis.
Similar PPG maybe...
… but much better in terms of efficiency which is due to him shooting 10 percentage points higher from the field than any season before this. Getting 10 points a game shooting 57% is much different than getting 11 a game shooting 47%.
He’s also getting more assists with less turnovers, (almost a full point in A/T better), rebounding much better than nearly all of his prior seasons, and blocking more shots. All of this resulting in better offensive efficiency ratings and a PER > 20.
So not really the same at all. Not even “pretty much the same.” Quite a bit stronger overall, actually.
Nice summary on Spencer Hawes' gargantuan leap in production.
It can’t be overstated how immense the jump is that Hawes has made, which may or may not last the whole season. I’d bank on him regressing somewhat, but we shall see.
Definitely have to see how the rest of the season plays out for him.
It’s not that his prior production was terrible, just not really what you’d like to see a team spend $12-plus million on.
If he was able to keep up this production, stay reasonably healthy (yes, I know both are big ifs), then he would be a good option. Especially since he may actually want to come to this neck of the woods.
I've emotionally moved past the hope of Hibbert
but I’d be pleasantly surprised if we landed him obviously. I’ve set my sites on McGee & I think he would fit here as a redemption story, learning from vets. Imagine JaVale McGee doing the spinning post alley oop, or if Camby can teach him the High/Low game. If you put Kurt Thomas’s brain in Javale McGee’s body you would have a hall of fame player.
"We gotta get this $#!^ together guys!" - Phil
Yeah. Also the wizards could end up going for a big man in the draft
Giving us easier chances to pry him away.
"Wide, girthy. Just like a Rhino. Sometimes my horns are visible."
I disagree with your assessment of the Wallace-Batum situation
“If Wallace does take his option at $10.5 million, then say adios to Batum.”
also Wallace’s option is 9.5 million from what i understand
I think regardless if Wallace takes his option, Blazers will do their best to keep Batum still for several reasons.
1. If Wallace picks up his option, that is still for only one extra year. This means that in 2013 Blazers could be without anybody in the SF position. It would be better to have both next year than have neither in 2013.
2. Batum is only 23 and Wallace is trending downwards, Blazers view Batum as part of the future – even if it means paying both starters money for one year.
3. Blazers financially could still afford to pay both next year if they have to:
2012 Numbers
Aldridge 13,750,000
Gerald Wallace 9,500,000
Wesley Matthews 6,505,328
Luke Babbitt 1,892,280
Kurt Thomas 1,352,181
Elliot Willams 1,442,880
Nolan smith 1,404,960
Batum* 8,000,000
Total 43,847,629
Salary Cap will most likely be 58 million giving Blazers another 15 million to spend still
Luxury tax threshold will still be 70 million, meaning blazers could spend up to 23 million in more unique ways (MLE, Bi-annual exception, mini mid level, retaining their own players [i.e. Batum]. Keep in mind this still would only be one year of retaining both, after which Blazers may still be able to retain flexibility.
-————————————
Also the probability of this is happening is slim, as it is more beneficial for Wallace to opt out for the longevity of his career. Wallace also informed the Blazers earlier this season he will opt out (link).
If this still holds true, I would not be surprised to see Wallace traded before the deadline or during the draft to get something back for him (at least a first round pick). We will have to see what happens.
Pretty sure you can't use the MLE and Mini-MLE the same summer. It's one or the other, if I remember correctly.
Being a Blazer fan is not exactly healthy.
I know,
I was just using it as an option the Blazers have
Since we're basically guaranteed to be under the cap when free agency starts
all we’ll have available is the $2.5 million “under-cap” exception and the veteran’s minimum.
Phase 1: Collect underpants
Phase 2: ???
Phase 3: Profit!
You get the full mid level under the cap
If you are over the luxury tax it is 2.5
No, it's $3 million of you're over the LTT, $5 million if you're under the LTT but over the salary cap, and $2.5 million if your under the cap
Larry Coon summarized it in this article, and the relevant portion reads:
For non-taxpaying teams, four years starting at $5 million (base salary grows by 3 percent annually beginning in 2013-14), with 4.5 percent raises. Taxpaying teams are limited to three years, a $3 million base salary (which grows by 3 percent annually beginning in 2013-14) and 4.5 percent raises. Teams with cap room (therefore losing their midlevel exception) get a new midlevel that is for two years and starts at $2.5 million (growing 3 percent annually).
Phase 1: Collect underpants
Phase 2: ???
Phase 3: Profit!
I messed up the last "you're"
But two outta three ain’t bad.
Phase 1: Collect underpants
Phase 2: ???
Phase 3: Profit!
Also, pretty sure we couldn't trade Wallace during the draft because he will be no longer under contract if he opts-out, which happens before then I believe.
CMIIW.
Being a Blazer fan is not exactly healthy.
Yes, if he ops- out otherwise they can trade him
I.e. Andre Miller trade
Actually, you can't trade players whose contracts may be or are over.
Miller was different, because his contract was merely partially guaranteed. Wallace would have to pick up his option before the July moratorium in order to be traded.
Phase 1: Collect underpants
Phase 2: ???
Phase 3: Profit!
No, his contract was non-guaranteed.
He had no choice in the matter.
Phase 1: Collect underpants
Phase 2: ???
Phase 3: Profit!
I don't see the team parting with Batum either.
If Wallace chooses not to opt out they’ll either trade him over the summer, or maintain a solid SF rotation for another year. Batum will be a Blazer for a long time.
Doers & Makers > Movers & Shakers
by Adam Randall on Feb 10, 2012 11:24 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Sure they could do it...
… but why would they? Keeping both of them, with Batum being a higher salary (you might be right about Wallac’s $9.5 mil – hoopsworld quotes $10.5 mil, but that could be based on incentives) further limits your ability to improve this team. You’re essentially paying more to stay the same.
Even with the numbers figures above, you’re left with 7 roster spots to fill, with two of them being a starting point guard and starting center. That $15 mil won’t carry you a long way on the unrestricted market, and likely even less on the restricted. Maybe you can sign a decent player at one of those spots, but you’d be scraping the bottom of the barrel for the other one. The other option would be to split that cap space on both spots, but then you’d likely be settling for mediocre players. You might have a chance at signing a quality guy at one spot, then spending your MLE at the other (think Hinrich at PG), but that’s a big risk. You’re other exceptions would then likely be used to fill in your bench spots.
In the end, what have they done? They’ve perpetuated the same SF quagmire that they have this year, Batum would still likely not start, and both would be unrestricted at the end of the season and you risk losing them anyway. All this, and they hindered their ability to make a big play in this upcoming free agent class. I honestly don’t believe the Blazers are interested in that scenario.
I do agree that it’s all likely a moot point. Like I said, I hope (and fully) expect Wallace to opt out. I understand why Portland didn’t extend Batum as they can’t count on Wallace opting out and they don’t want to be faced with the above. Just too bad ’cause I think they could have signed him to a cheaper, more secure deal if they had.
Agreed. Extending Batum is not something you want to do now if you want to keep your options open this summer.
In most cases the situation is beneficial for the Blazers. Batum plays stronger, more aggressive in pursuit of a good contract, the Blazers don’t guarantee themselves any other expensive contracts before the summer and should (decent probability) recieve a good realistic contract for Batum and match when the time comes.
My thing is the RFA matching period is shortened to 3 days. Which means, that could really hurt our chances of maintaining the cap space and bargaining with other free agents if Batum is quickly offered a contract. Gotta work fast and now, to have a game plan for this summer.
Being a Blazer fan is not exactly healthy.
I agree financially it limits your options financially
But if the Blazers really want Batum long term they may be willing to pay both for one year
If Portland wanted to have Batum long term, they would have extended him.
Yet they already demonstrated that signing him to an extended contract wasn’t worth the risk of ultimately ending up with two big contracts at the SF position.
I guarantee you, whatever group of monkeys are making personnel decisions for the Blazers, it was not in their plans to be paying Wallace $9.5 to $10.5 million and Butum $8 million next season. That will be a failure on their part, and I think they know that.
Good players
McGee simply doesnt know basketball,i cant understand why this guy is playing at the NBA…Roy Hibbert is a very good solution,Hawes is a good solution as a back up not as a starter…Paul Millsap and Dereck Favors are good players that will help this team a lot….Deron Williams,Darren Collison,Curry and Aaron Brooks are the best solutions for the point guard,if Felton is not here…Wilson Chandler,Paul George,Danny Granger,Monta Ellis are very good players…Keep LaMarcus,Wallace,Jamal, Wesley,Elliot,Nolan,Craig Smith and try to get some of the players above…This team needs a true center and a true shooting guard along with Jamal…
McGee has plenty of dumb plays sure.
McGee simply doesnt know basketball,i cant understand why this guy is playing at the NBA…
The reason he is still in the NBA is because despite those dumb plays, he is still a top 5/10 player production wise for the very thin NBA center position. After the cream of the crop in Dwight Howard & Andrew Bynum, he is right up there from a raw production standpoint. 10.7ppg, 8.7rpg & a league leading 2.9 blocks per game on only 28 minutes per game :O(With Hibbert putting up 13.6ppg, 9.9rpg, 1.8bpg on 30mpg) The selling point on McGee is with McMillan, vets like Camby & Thomas, if you can coach the dumb plays out of him, he can be an elite. NBA center.
"We gotta get this $#!^ together guys!" - Phil
McGee
He doesnt know to shoot,he has no low post plays,he doesnt know to move on the court…If you still believe he could be an elite player(now we are laughing),then believe it…
He is more productive then any center we have had
since Sabonis, so yeah. I’ll take him over riding LaMarcus into the dirt before the playoffs start every year.
"We gotta get this $#!^ together guys!" - Phil
yeah, he seems eager to be taught,
but the only person that washington that they have to teach him how to play as a big man is the generally horrible Andray Blatche.
"Wide, girthy. Just like a Rhino. Sometimes my horns are visible."
dont compare Big Sabas with McGee…Sabas was a coach on the court,he was the second playmaker of the team…McGee is a long guy that blocks and takes some rebounds,but other than that he does nothing on the court..He has no basketball IQ..
I'm talking about raw production, not roles on the team.
"We gotta get this $#!^ together guys!" - Phil
Think about his situation in Washington
quite the toxic environment.
Rajon Rondo’s career would have went a much different route if we wasn’t surrounded by 3 hall of famer veteran players & a terrific coach in Doc Rivers developing him. Same thing with Andrew Bynum out of high school, he would have flamed out on a team like Washington instead of the Los Angeles with Phil Jackson & studying from Kareem Abdul-Jabar. The Lakers invested a lot of time developing him to become the player he is today.
So what i’m proposing is give McGee a fresh start. Learn from the two most experienced, savvy front line players in the NBA in Marcus Camby & Kurt Thomas. Not only that but Nate McMillan has a reputation of being a hard @$$ when necessary. He would be brought here to start next to LaMarcus Aldridge, who himself has developed into one of the best power forwards in the NBA. McGee would not need to be superman, just simply play good defense, rebound the ball & dunk the ball when your PG sets you up- Much like Ben Wallace did not bring much of anything besides defense/rebounding/dunks to the 04’ Pistons, anything besides that from McGee would be gravy. Its a high risk high reward idea, but after Dwight Howard/Roy Hibbert in free agency & Andre Drummond in the draft, the available talent pool for quality NBA centers is very shallow. Keep in mind I would be totally against this idea if we had say a healthy Greg Oden or even a serviceable center like Emeka Okefor(though now his contract looks rough, with the Blazers potentially wanting to go through with another youth movement).
"We gotta get this $#!^ together guys!" - Phil
by 420Phenom on Feb 10, 2012 2:12 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
i see many nba games and this season 10 wizzards games so far…this guy doesnt seem to me that can be someone important in nba…i dont know how he could change,i just dont see something valuable on this player…(its not about McGee but if only we could get Marcus Thornton next to Jamal Crawford..this guy is a super 2,he is a killer…Just imagine Jamal and Thornton on the same line up…just a dream…)
Despite your Sabonis name, your not giving enough love for the big man
Anyways, the desire of having Thornton/Crawford on the same team is essentially the opposite of what is valuable to a team in the NBA, so I don’t know where your going with that. Both guys are chuckers, average passers who don’t play any defense- they play the same role. Any team that is willing to give as many shots as these two need to keep them happy would not be as good as our current team with the addition of JMc. Because we have a huge hole at starting center, not backup 2.
"We gotta get this $#!^ together guys!" - Phil
are you serious? Thornton and Crawford in the same backcourt?
I guess no one else on the team needs to shoot
"If I had a dime for every basket I made today, you'd still suck!" - from the book 'John Dies @ the End'
you can go with a small line up having 2 super scorers on the court and wesley guarding the opponent guards…or you can move Thornton to the starting line up and bring Jamal of the bench..we need another proven scorer and Thornton is a killer,you dont let this guy open for 3..
Bleh.
Thats a worse idea then gambling on McGee, imo.
"We gotta get this $#!^ together guys!" - Phil
i think we desperately need another proven scorer on the team…what i hate about our team is that we never had many true scorers in the team…we need a solid center and 2-3 guys that will kill the other teams when they are open…LA needs help from the wings…
I don't have a problem with Thornton
but I would never pair him with Jamal. McGee is valuable due to his size, wingspan, and athleticism alone. He’s not perfect, but he’s certainly not a guy I’d mind having.
"If I had a dime for every basket I made today, you'd still suck!" - from the book 'John Dies @ the End'
What our team needs is a lead guard(after losing Roy/Andre)
and a reliable center.
"We gotta get this $#!^ together guys!" - Phil
I'm assuming that Camby would resign to a Kurt Thomas type deal, yeah.
Depends on the SF situation with Wallace/Batum, but we could end up adding another solid player in free agency too yeah.
"We gotta get this $#!^ together guys!" - Phil
I remember, way back when, a trade where the Blazers acquired a Washintgon big man with a sordid reputation.
What was his name again? I foget, how did that work out?
Oh I kid ‘sheed. He gave us some fun times. In all seriousness, McGee looks like a he’d be a food fit on paper, but you can’t really count on Camby being here to guide the youngster. Sure, Thomas will be around to give him pointers but even at that, how likely is it that someone really ever changes?
McGee isn't even that much of a fool off the court,
he’s just a bit misguided on the court.
"Wide, girthy. Just like a Rhino. Sometimes my horns are visible."
I was in strong belief that with the right persuasion we could theoretically acquire both Deron and Dwight.
The Nets are clearly set up this summer to do some big moves. Only having a guaranteed ~9.4M (wild…), excluding Deron’s 17.8M option and the two other PO/ETOs (Jordan Farmar 4.25M and Shawne Williams 3.135M).
If they extend Williams to roughly the same amount they’d have 27.2M guarantee with another 30.8M left to spend… Again wild. If they sign Howard, who makes about 19.5M, to something similar that leaves 10.3M to spend for the remainder of their team.
I would not be surprised if they do what LeBron and Bosh did and lower their salaries a little attract another quality player but who? They’d don’t need anyone at SG, MarShon Brooks, is fine enough. So it’d be SF and PF. Unless they resign some of their expirings using bird rights. Their options are limited for a quality. Brook Lopez would be a fine piece to keep if you can play him next to Howard and unless he’s traded in a sign and trade for Howard. I’d imagine they’d offer him a good chunk of that 10.3M in hopes he becomes the 3rd pillar there.
But in the same vain, aside from our relative small market and non-existence in recognition, couldn’t we give them the same? LMA has a very good contract that is set at a good price. I don’t want to get into them but freeing up enough to acquire both Deron and Dwight is possibe. Even if the offers are 14-15M each. We’d have some flexibility to sign players with bird rights afterwards to fill in the voids. I.e. Camby at the vet. min. or even Joel Freeland if he could come over already.
Williams
Matthews (if not traded to free up capspace)
Batum
LMA
Howard
Bench
N. Smith
E. Williams
Babbitt
J. Freeland, C. Smith(vet. min)
Camby (vet. min), Thomas
You fill in the rest. We could make it happen. LMA needs to recruit, recruit, recruit. That’s an instant championship quality team.
Being a Blazer fan is not exactly healthy.
"LMA needs to recruit, recruit, recruit."
What’s his sales pitch? Because I don’t see one.
At some point, LMA’s relationship with Portland will play out like “Divorce Song” by Liz Phair.
I might not have the best pitch but that doesn't mean he shouldn't try.
But if I were LMA, I’d atleast start with “come play with me.” Should get the ball rolling.
Being a Blazer fan is not exactly healthy.
What’s his sales pitch? Let me give it a quick run down of what it might look like:
LaMarcus Aldridge sales pitch to _______________(insert who you want to recruit here):
Whats up man. Heard you are going to be a free agent this offseason. Portland could really use a player with your talents. I’m one of if not the best power forwards in the NBA right in the middle of my prime. I am the perfect team mate, unselfish & do not demand any attention. Portland provides some of the best arenas & fans are among the best in the NBA. Our owner is willing to pay whatever it takes. We have a wide selection of some of the best beers in America, some of the finest green and no sales tax !
"We gotta get this $#!^ together guys!" - Phil
It's a decent one.
better then kobe bryant’s you can play with me, but I won’t pass you the ball because I’ll be too busy trying to pass kareem on the all-time scoring list.
however, our coaching/front office situation isn’t really solid enough even though I guess a lot of players think Nate’s a good coach. most players who look to leave their teams seem to be leaving because of horrible GM situations, especially the Howard deal with Otis being probably one of the worst GMs in the league.
"Wide, girthy. Just like a Rhino. Sometimes my horns are visible."
Vancouver, Washington
that’s what it’s for, right?
"Wide, girthy. Just like a Rhino. Sometimes my horns are visible."
Or he spends a lot of money on cars & other amenities
A lot of NBA players do that…
"We gotta get this $#!^ together guys!" - Phil
Yeah, the average Oregonian actually pays far less in taxes as a percentage of their income than most other Americans
Of course, with the progressive income tax we have, I’m not sure that would hold true for someone making millions in wages. But the sales tax is potentially a huge boon
Phase 1: Collect underpants
Phase 2: ???
Phase 3: Profit!
Yet, Texas is lower than Oregon, so Dallas > Portland to the likes of Dwight and Deron.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/State_tax_levels_in_the_United_States
Now, if only New Hampshire had a team.
Well, in all fairness to myself
You’re the first one since dpnim’s original comment to bring up Dwight, Deron, and Dallas. I thought we were assessing LMA’s overall recruitment pitch, not the state’s appeal two specific players over one particular city.
Phase 1: Collect underpants
Phase 2: ???
Phase 3: Profit!
Thats true, but after Texas(Mavs/Spurs)/Florida(Heat/Magic)/Tennesee(Grizz)
We are right there when it comes to the tax issue. In addition to being so close to the Washington border allowing them to own a house across the river like mentioned by YoniRap. I’m not saying we will be able to lure DWill/Howard & thats fine. But if we got say Steve Nash in a trade I think this is one of the destinations he would consider staying.
"We gotta get this $#!^ together guys!" - Phil
A guy can dream.... and I'm right there dreaming with you
But its never going to happen..
There is NO reason to take less money to come play in small town Portland.
Howard next to LA would be sick… sick I tell you
Aldridge acting as 1-800-COME TO PORTLAND NOW recruiter aside, these acquisitions are not that realistic.
What you’re suggesting is like the swiss cheese model in reverse, where instead of all the holes lining up to cause disaster, they all line up and what comes is a rain shower of benevolence on Portland.
Let’s figure Portland has $28 million to spend before they exceed the cap. So they somehow convince both Williams AND Howard to come to Portland, and do to this for $14-$15 million dollar contracts (holes 1, 2, 3, and 4). While doing all of this, the rest of the NBA forgot about signing Batum to an offer sheet, or Batum’s mail got lost (hole 5). They are then able to match Batum’s serendipitously belated offer sheet to $8 million, be fine with being well over the cap, and need to still sign the rest of their bench using exceptions, which is likely to carry them into the luxury tax (hole 6).
Theortic? Yes. Plausible? No.
This just in from the Wishful Thinking Department! Both Greg Oden’s and Brandon Roy’s knees have magically healed, and Dr. Jack Ramsay will be coming back to coach the Blazers!
Rec'd
I was hoping for Hibbert before. With how well he’s played now though, and his All-Star selection, he probably gets max from Indy, or at least someone else. After seeing the contracts that DeAndre Jordan, Kwame Brown, Nene, and Tyson Chandler got, imagine a legit All-Star center.
McGee may have merit. He hasn’t thrived with Andray Blatche, Jordan Crawford, Nick Young and other ball-hogs/knuckleheads. Sooner or later, they’re going to have to dilute that immaturity. In Portland, with two of the oldest, wisest players, who also happen to play his same position, I wouldn’t be too worried.
We’ll also have the draft to fill out our roster.
We'll most likely use our cap-space to facilitate trades and acquire assets.
Also, a point no one seems to be talking about at center is the possibility that Sam Dalembert and the likelihood that Lamar Odom will be free agents. Houston signed Dalembert to a deal that is only guaranteed for $1.5 million next season and declined team options on three rookie scale deals, planning ahead for summer 2012. Dallas, meanwhile, is likely to buyout Lamar Odom’s deal that is only guaranteed for $2.4 million.
Odom has been terrible for Dallas, but he’s a guy who could potentially be had for a short term deal while he attempts to make a comeback. And Dalembert is just a really solid player who could be had by the highest bidder.
Phase 1: Collect underpants
Phase 2: ???
Phase 3: Profit!
Yeah, no one has ever mentioned Dalembert around here !
He’s supposed to be in Miami by now right ?
Apparently I was supposed to list my degrees to be taken seriously in the boys club. Hows is that next procedure scheduling going on Odens left knee anyway ??
Peace out boys. Thanks Ben, keep handling your business ;)
Get LA some help Paul.
Go Blazers !!!
just win baby !
You know, I almost put "except Frenchie" in parentheses, but decided not to since
I hadn’t noticed you mentioning him much since free-agency. I knew better at the time, and regret it now. My bad!
Phase 1: Collect underpants
Phase 2: ???
Phase 3: Profit!
I'll never understand why Miami went after Shane Battier than Samuel Dalembert.
As much as I like Battier, he wasn’t what the Heat needed to fill out its star-studded roster.
I've always wanted Dalembert here.
He was always solid or better in Philly. Ah well.
Considering purchasing a ticket on the Rebuild Now bandwagon.
I like Dalembert.
However he’s not likely to be a game changer for Portland. About the best you could hope for is 6 -7 points, 8-9 rebounds and a couple of blocks per. There’s no upside beyond that. He’s well into his prime, and likely heading downward in the next season or two (can anyone say Gerald Wallace?).
He’d be a good guy to pick up for the MLE if you used up your other resources improving other positions. I’ve never found him to bge a guy to “go out and get.”
Yeah, and I realize that
But with Camby aging, and possibly retiring or leaving, we’re gonna need to plug that hole (unless we tank). It would definitely be a move to keep us from back-sliding in the near term.
And if you get him on a reasonably sized contract, he’ll always have some trade value.
Phase 1: Collect underpants
Phase 2: ???
Phase 3: Profit!
It would be a lateral move.
Acceptable if you made significant upgrades in the backcourt. Not acceptable if it’s an attempt to upgrade your frontline.
Personally, I’m tired of lateral moves (e.g. Miller → Felton).
That's what I meant, although I articulated my meaning very poorly
It’s not an upgrade, but a treading-water move with the likely departure of Camby.
Here’s my thing: we’re not going to tank, and we’re not going to get Dwight Howard and Deron Williams. If we’re not going to tank, then at the very least I want to see some decent bball from the home team. Signing Dalembert or picking up Calderon for the last year of his deal (assuming we whiff in free agency) aren’t moves to get excited about, but some semi-decent mediocrity (a la Philly, Indy, and Denver right now) is better than, for instance, the crap the Blazers have right now.
Phase 1: Collect underpants
Phase 2: ???
Phase 3: Profit!
unless the crap we have right now can get us an awesome draft pick
in june
"Wide, girthy. Just like a Rhino. Sometimes my horns are visible."
Let's Sign This Guy As A Free Agent
This will definitley help our home court advantage!
by jonnyplastic@yahoo.com on Feb 11, 2012 3:04 PM PST reply actions
This has probably been covered elsewhere and i missed it
But why wouldn’t Greg Oden’s “setback” salary reduction have given us $7 million or so to add a free agent or be used as salary space in a trade? Just curious.
The Blazers don't get compensated for paying a player less than the Qualifying Offer
They can, however request an injury player exception (assuming Oden cannot play). In a sense adding another roster spot for basically the minimum amount of salary. ?

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