How Good is Nicolas Batum?

  You could be completely correct about the role Batum plays and the ceiling his ability will allow.

  But how old is Batum? He’s still a young player. Actually, I think Batum does have the “it” factor…

  His smooth style has a tendency to make Batum look like he’s not putting effort in, and I think a degree of language barrier hampers his communication. But Batum has shown two factors that I think harbor well for continued improvement. #1. The kid loves playing basketball. He loves the game. A love for the game is a great foundation for continued improvement. #2. IMO despite his smoothness on the court, Batum has demonstrated a nasty assassin like quality. He doesn’t back down. I think he’s a bigger competitor than he get’s credit for being.

  So while I think Dave’s assesment might turn out to be spot on, my feeling is at this point why apply a “Don’t Shoot For The Stars” approach?

  Two years from now? If Batum hasn’t significantly improved, then I think you conclude that he isn’t going to be much more than what he is today…going forward….But IMO Batum is still young enough, with talent and qualities enough that there is still reason for significant optimism….

I’m just as happy as ever to have him, but increasingly less attached as the years roll by and the team’s situation evolves.

I am happy with Nic and Gerald, heck, that is our strongest position, upgrades/backups everywhere else should be our focus. If Oden can play we could be good at center. Our guards seem more uncertain, as far as being serious contenders goes.

Does LMA have the “it” factor?

High praise from that person indeed, since he has personally worked out both.

I’d agree though that he doesn’t seem to have the “I’m taking over this game” makeup and never really did as early scouting reports already attested him a tendency to let the game come to him too much and being fine if he just plays his role even if he was the most athletically gifted player on the court. According to a profile I think by someone at ESPN, neither did Durant until he got told to play more like T-Mac by a friend and coach. But that happened in his youth, and not when he was already a pro.

Though I definitely think Nic can be highly highly competitive wanting his team to do as good as possible even if he isn’t an all-out killer on the floor. So who knows how far away his ceiling still is.

Dave wrote: ""But," he said, “the kid doesn’t seem to have that ‘it’ factor, the kind of drive that the stars have.” I asked how many times he’d seen a player develop that factor and his basic response was, “You can’t.”"

“Even though they’re completely different players, waiting for Nicolas to turn into a star feels eerily like the wait for Travis Outlaw to do the same.”

I would rate him [Batum] the most likely Blazer to turn into Travis Outlaw in another 2-3 years (I hope not, but I have yet to see any of the aggression from him that will be necessary to fulfill the hype that surrounds him in Portland.)

By turn in to Travis Outlaw, I mean ….
never fulfill the high expectations people have for him, but earn a big contract based on potential, and then ultimately be seen as a failure because he will have been vastly over-paid. (No other similarity to Travis in playing style, other than a lack of rebounding for his physical ability.)

9/11/11

Batum’s lack of aggression is the missing “it” factor that will prevent him from being a star. He doesn’t have it, and I doubt he ever will. But he could still mature into a fine contributor and get better with age.

But I believe we can’t keep both Wallace and Batum past this season. It’s simply too much talent (tradable assets) at one position when we have other major holes to fill. Neither are legitimate power forwards or shooting guards. We are forcing Wallace into the power forward spot because we want to keep Batum around. One of them will have to go soon if we are to build a good team again.

In my opinion, it all hinges on Greg Oden (doesn’t everything about this team and its future hinge on Greg Oden?). If Oden signs a long-term deal with Portland (which I doubt) and if he comes back without incurring more serious injuries (which I think he will), then I would be inclined to keep Wallace and trade Batum to shore up another position while his trade value is still high. That is particularly true if after almost a year (or more) of rest with the lockout, it appears Roy can come back and can play a significant role for another 2 years. i.e. let’s see how far this team could get in the next 2-years with Oden, LMA, Wallace, Roy, and someone good for Batum.

On the other hand, if Oden signs a one-year QO with the Blazers and becomes a UFA next summer, or he simply becomes a UFA next summer because the season is called off, then Oden is gone for good. In that case, let’s trade Wallace (because of his age and wear and tear on his body from his playing style), and start a long term rebuilding strategy keeping LMA and Batum, with the expectation that Batum will be a quality contributor for another 5-7 years.

If there’s a problem with this, it’s with the Blazers rather than Batum. The team’s situation has changed since Brandon Roy and Greg Oden became bad bets.

interesting. i thought this very same thing about Andre Miller after his 1st season with Portland.

…specifically, Boris Diaw.

Many of the things written about Batum recently have been spoken of Diaw for years. Diaw, nowadays, is generally considered a good but unreliable player who can help you when he’s “on”, but you don’t want to be building a team around him, and if he’s among your top 3 players you’re asking for trouble.

One difference is that Diaw has been around long enough that he’s generally considered a flake and a lost cause (for those who think he’ll turn into a superstar; if you accept him for what he is, he’s fine). Batum has not been tagged with any similar labels—he’s still young enough that it is possible to pin his inconsistency on inexperience, rather than on an attitude of I-don’t-give-a-rip-about-being-a-star-coasting-is-fine-with-me.

Or maybe it’s more that I HOPE you’re wrong…the two might be indistinguishable for me at this point. Nevertheless, I do think that Batum has a higher ceiling than you do. The numbers, and impact on the games, that he is having this summer are better than his averages with the Blazers. In Eurobasket, you’re talking about games that routinely score in the 80’s, so scoring 15 points is not the equivalent to scoring 15 points in a 90-100 point NBA game.

I think Batum has more fire and more desire than a lot of people, yourself seemingly included, give him credit for, and I would not be surprised to see his game continue to expand in the next few years.

Outlaw rarely contributed much to games when his scoring wasn’t there. Batum has, in multiple ways. He plays defense at a much higher level than Outlaw ever did, and is a better rebounder and passer (in fact, I’m not sure Outlaw knew what a “pass” was.) Outlaw’s offensive game never developed much beyond a 3 point shot over the years either…Batum has a way to go, but his offensive repertoire is already a lot more varied.

Give a kid a consistently injured roster, an upside down front office, no clear coaching staff, confused position player identity, player lockouts, and a dark, rainy home season . . . where would you want to light your candle?

He has been on the floor gaining experience and killing it on defense. Offensively, he is not being used as a go to guy. Hardly his fault when you have Roy and Aldridge in there. If the plays aren’t being called for Batum, then why should we expect him to try and take over a game. When Nate asks more from Batum, we will have a more accurate way to gauge his ceiling.

Batum still has a one dimensional handle. Unless a guy with a limited handle has a post game, like LMA (oh, it’s sweet at times), he’s either going to flow in and out of the offense or have to force bad shot attempts.

I think Nic’s team first personality matches his skill set. You don’t want him charging into the D like Wallace does sometimes. Instead, the Blazers should thank their lucky stars they have Nic, and do their best to get some playaking at guard (or miraculously heal B Roy’s knees).

by talking to Blazer fans I thought he already was a superstar. I love the dude but I agree; he’s good but won’t ever be great.

To me it was never clearer than watching the Eurobasket tournament. Even on a team devoid of solid wing players, Nic put up the same stats, and played a very similar type of game to what he does with the Blazers. You’d think a player like Nic that has had to compete with guys like Martell Webster, Gerald Wallace, etc. for playing time would relish the opportunity to get huge minutes for his national team with no clear competition at his spot, and would flourish with that opportunity. But Nic played exactly as Dave described – solid defense and some promising offensive moments, but overall somewhat passive.

The problem is that while Batum can catch-and-shoot, and when hit in stride is smooth going to the hoop – he doesn’t have a handle (or confidence in it if he does have one), or any type of first-step move to use. He doesn’t shoot pull-up Js off the dribble, because he never takes anyone off the dribble. At this point he’s reliant on spot-up jumpers and scores in transition or off garbage plays.

While a lot of people love Nic and don’t want to hear it – it’s the straight truth. Dave was spot on in his assessment – when we had Roy/LMA/Oden as dominators he was the perfect complimentaty 3 – can hit open shots and defend. But with Roy’s downfall and Oden’s health struggles – we need a lot more punch from the position, and Nic just doesn’t have that. He’s a quality player and I’m glad he’s with the Blazers, but our team has gone through so much transitino that his role and fit with the team has also changed.