Summer League Game 1: Impressions
by Dave on Jul 11, 2010 5:09 PM PDT
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PrintThe Blazers hammered the heck out of the hapless Houston Rockets, racking up an 84-67 victory typified by good defense, control of the interior on both ends, and a fair amount of running. The entire squad did a good job of sharing the ball, muscling up, and doing the extra work necessary to make the game easy. No worries on that account. This was probably Portland's best Summer League outing in the last three years. But no matter how well or poorly the games go this week is all about gauging individuals, so here are the initial impressions.
Luke Babbitt: Babbitt's game was a mixed bag today. As with many of his teammates he started slowly and then warmed up as the game progressed. To the good: He seems to know what to do with his body, though whether he can get it where he wants it remains an open question. He can run north to south fine. He hit some jumpers and showed a couple of drives and the ability to take contact and not fall apart, albeit against a defense softer than tissue. The questionable: Both his moves and his shots look...deliberate. Other than those couple direct drives he was unable to create any separation off the dribble, perhaps the most worrisome part of his outing. His defense was adequate as long as he had the chance to gather.
Armon Johnson: Unlike Babbitt, Johnson created plenty of separation, both for himself and separating the opponent from the ball. He was fast in every way, had busy hands on defense, stayed in front of his man, and demonstrated some passing ability on the break and in the halfcourt as long as he could drive first. It was a sizzling day for him. He led the team in minutes played.
Patty Mills: Mills started the game forcing shots, playing shooting guard more than point. When the game opened up his game settled down and he looked good on the break. He was plenty quick in transition and hit his jumpers as well. As his offense cruised his passing confidence rose and he started dishing dimes. He added rebounds as well and ended up with a nice all-around game.
Dante Cunningham: D.C. helped the Blazers dominate the middle, throwing his body around, grabbing rebounds, and generally being a nuisance on defense. He hit a couple shots but mostly supported the guards.
Jeff Pendergraph: Pendergraph had a rough outing, missing most of his shots and collecting fouls. He looked a little slow and awkward.
The hidden player of the day was Ekene Ibekwe who netted a ton of blocks and some steals, playing like a mirror of Cunningham plus hitting his opportunities. Elliot Williams did not play.
Go ahead and share your impressions here. Nice win, but there's more to see.
--Dave (blazersub@yahoo.com)
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Liked Armon a lot
seems to have decent vision, made some nifty passes and really hounded his man on defense and fought through picks.
His stat line didn’t really reflect it, but I thought the team looked better in the half-court with him at the controls than Patty.
i disagree
patty started off slow but he he started clicking as time went on. patty had some slick dimes in the game and it just seemed like he was in a zone.
armon has been very impressive but his shot still looks a bit off, which is probably the only knock on him so far
by JMLakaShotCaller on Jul 11, 2010 5:17 PM PDT up reply actions
Patty looked great in transition
and his shot is comfortable, but he didn’t look comfortable out there until his shot started falling. And I’m not dissing Mills by saying I thought Johnson looked more comfortable in the half-court; he ought to, that’s all they played in Nevada.
it is going be a battle between the two
Johnson did himself some huge favors with his defense. He was better than Mills there and all the talk about these two is defense. Mills looked great once his shot started hitting, I agree, I can’t wait unril tueasday!
"Oh Yeah!" ~ Kool Aid Man
both have their strengths
and both do something the top two guys don’t necessarily excel at….Johnson with his defense and Mills with his three point shooting…
Seems the Blazers have four point guards that all provide unique value….
by blacknoiseNW on Jul 11, 2010 10:15 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
yeah
I think Johnson has an advantage over Mills because the constant issue we have is defense at the point.
"Oh Yeah!" ~ Kool Aid Man
keep them both trade Miller.
Patty made some great passes right on the money.
by prof.mike on Jul 11, 2010 7:42 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Yeah, Miller has never made passes right on the money in Summer League.
by Nick Van Excellent on Jul 11, 2010 7:59 PM PDT up reply actions
Miller's last summer league game was during the Taft administration
"..cocaine is a classy drug meant for men of finer tastes like Sr. Rudolfo Fernandez."
-AK1984
by TheTinfoil on Jul 11, 2010 7:59 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
He was probably too lazy to even show up.
by Nick Van Excellent on Jul 11, 2010 8:03 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Taft did have an amazing spread in the green room
"..cocaine is a classy drug meant for men of finer tastes like Sr. Rudolfo Fernandez."
-AK1984
I actually know a Taft joke, but I'm going to keep it in the cylander
too soon
"its tough to play with one eye, unless you're a pirate." Delonte West
"una canasta a Pau en la cara" Rudy
by Honka Playboy on Jul 11, 2010 9:05 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
OT Dorothy Parker joke
President Calvin Coolidge was a man of few words. He also slept a good deal, by day as well as night and was the reverse of animated. When he died after completing his term of office, Dorothy Parker on being told of his death asked,
“How can they tell?"
From: http://jvasanthan-penbrush.blogspot.com/2010/01/dorothy-parker.html
In KP I trusted!
I'll give it up: Taft joke in similar vein..
but jumps on his weight. Taft was serving in the Philippines after we, ahem, liberated them from the Spanish. He sent a message after a horseback ride saying “Rode 40 miles horseback today; feeling fine” and a cable came back asking “how’s the horse?”.
He was also narcoleptic and kept a cow on the lawn of the White House, which wasn’t unusual except his was a very tall cow
"its tough to play with one eye, unless you're a pirate." Delonte West
"una canasta a Pau en la cara" Rudy
by Honka Playboy on Jul 12, 2010 4:38 AM PDT up reply actions
he was a narc
"its tough to play with one eye, unless you're a pirate." Delonte West
"una canasta a Pau en la cara" Rudy
by Honka Playboy on Jul 13, 2010 6:41 AM PDT up reply actions
laying sod in his back yard
no joke
"its tough to play with one eye, unless you're a pirate." Delonte West
"una canasta a Pau en la cara" Rudy
by Honka Playboy on Jul 11, 2010 9:06 PM PDT up reply actions
i didn't know they bothered planting that kind of grass in hawaii
Treat people well because Karma can hit you at any second.
pakalolo?
Logical descriptions of complex worlds contain within themselves the seeds of their own limitation. A world that was simple enough to be fully known would be too simple to contain conscious observers who might know it.
by Sexual Tyrannosaurus on Jul 11, 2010 10:23 PM PDT up reply actions
Hehe. BE code.
I thought we left all this in the pot thread.
I'm just not crazy about player nick names...
by Hipster Olympic Team! on Jul 11, 2010 10:39 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
laying sod in his back yard
is that what the kids are calling it, now?
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
by two4larue on Jul 11, 2010 11:30 PM PDT up reply actions 2 recs
recovering from all the alcohol i thought about sending him
while i was in hawaii for my wedding.
I thought about sending him a lot, so he’s probably going to be gone a few more days.
"We get to hit arms! Cool!"
http://myespn.go.com/blogs/truehoop/0-39-135/On-Playoff-Experience.html
Confused about the love for Armon - but Mills looked great
If what Dave was saying is that he looked promising athletically, I would agree. But I didn’t see anything to suggest that the kid could be ready to get NBA playing time at the point next season. He’s a project.
Mills, on the other hand, was dynamite. Total control, great handle, ran the team like a pro. I have always been (and remain) a big Bayless fan. But Mills looked like “more of a point guard” than Jerryd ever has, including summer league. By far.
Frankly, this was a game with real NBA players (nine drafted guys, including at least two rotation players starting for each team) and Patty looked like an NBA point guard. It’s early in the summer, obviously, be he should have a big lead for that roster spot. I had an anti-Mills bias coming in, thinking he’s just too small to be an effective NBA player, but the kid looked great.
Q: Is Greg favoring his knee?
Frye: He favors dunking on your head, that's what he favors.
by KP Corleone on Jul 12, 2010 8:00 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Good to hear, I didn't watch
But that kind of play is what I want more of for out team. Fun to watch, total team involvement. Some people are so fixated on one on one defense, they seem to ignore the pluses of a guy like Patty on team play. Sure it is a style thing, a style I like, and a style Nate should be able to include, even as just an alternative. Please, let’s mix it up a bit.
Let’s develop a guy like Patty at point, who is already showing the critical playmaking skills that will make our team more dangerous, inject energy into all the players, working to position themselves to score expecting they will be rewarded. I remain a Patty supporter.
Plus, we get a whole intense country of new Blazer fans .
"You be realistic," Oden said. "I’m going to stay happy. All right?"
This:
Mills, on the other hand, was dynamite. Total control, great handle, ran the team like a pro. I have always been (and remain) a big Bayless fan. But Mills looked like "more of a point guard" than Jerryd ever has, including summer league. By far.
rec
Silent Swagger.
EI's the next Stephen Hill
Ekene Ibekwe blocked some shots
E I E I OH!
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
It's Old McDonald!
C’mon, get your preschool songs right!
Didn’t you ever have one of those dial-a-song toys? It was so funny seeing the bad toys in TS3 using one for gambling in the attic at the day care prison
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Don't tell me he wouldn't have started a few games last season, Morty!
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Shoot, we had JUWAN HOWARD starting a few games last season
So yeah, I guess Stephen Hill woulda’ started.
I am all for getting a true 3rd string center, even before snipers shoot the kneecaps off of our frontline. I think we can do better than Hill, though, with a cheap experienced vet.
M—
#52
It seems Steven Hill was a third-string center for the D-League's Tulsa 66ers last season.
Regardless of Grizzly Adams there, the two guys I’d target as potential third-string centers — particularly if Joel Przybilla is moved in a cosolidation trade — are experienced veterans like Rasho Nesterovic and Fabricio Oberto, who don’t need consistent minutes and can still be productive in short spurts.
Those are two dudes I'd be happy with as 3rd stringers, for sure
Dependable, smart, experienced, not-great-but-can-sop-up-minutes-at-an-important-position-without-hurting-you type players.
Morty
#52
Nice hypen-work there, Mort
I was born in '52, and I believe in #52. Hang in there, GO.
You too, Przy: everyone knows you're the heart & soul of the Blazers.
man
he looked good, all depends on what happens to the roster over the summer in terms of trades. I tell you what he is helping make people more comfortable moving Joel if we need to.
"Oh Yeah!" ~ Kool Aid Man
helping make people more comfortable moving Joel if we need to.
this is how summer league legends get started, one little pebble starts an avalanche
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
well Ultimately I would prefer Joel stay a blazer
but it just does feel like that is in the cards with Camby and joel’s expiring contract.
"Oh Yeah!" ~ Kool Aid Man
Marcus is just as much a backup 4 as a 5
don’t be so quick to flip Joel until you’re sure Oden and Camby can stay healthy. Historically, they haven’t
And whatever you do, don’t say “we’ve got EI now so we don’t need Przy anymore!” after one freaking SL game, unless you want me to write something that Dave may have to step in and slap me down for!
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
it would be a different story if Joel weren't coming off a serious injury at 30
"In fact you might say that Ugly is the Blazers' secret weapon this year."
-Dave
As for the Blazers...They are officially the NBA equivalent of a movie serial killer
-basketbawful
the only thing different about it
is the amount of time before he’s back on the floor. There is no advantage to trading him now while his rehab is in doubt. His EC will have the same value in Feb as it does now (the other team doesn’t benefit until next July, regardless) and by midseason Oden/Camby could be healthy, or not
Everyone knows Przy is hurt and recovering. Until one of the beat writers takes the time to write a story about how he’s progressing in rehab, some fans will assume the worst (that he’s never coming back to play in a Blazer’s uniform, ever again) and put his EC into trade proposals on a weekly basis.
But I’ve heard enough reports to the contrary to be cautiously optimistic re: Joel’s availability
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
There's at least one advantage, probably a few more if I think about it longer
More time to incorporate the new player into the lineup
"In fact you might say that Ugly is the Blazers' secret weapon this year."
-Dave
As for the Blazers...They are officially the NBA equivalent of a movie serial killer
-basketbawful
It just depends on the deal
If there is a good deal on the table that involves Joel’s contract being traded, if the deal is worth it, ya do it. Because of his injury, because it’s expiring, everything.
You can’t exactly turn down a deal now and expect it to be around in February, if it turns out trading Joel would be best.
I don’t WANNA trade Joel; it just depends on the deal.
I don’t feel like Ibekwe having a good summer league game means anything, though. He’s skinny and it’s one game.
M—
#52
definitely
A good deal could come around in December. BOOM. DONE. CHRIS PAUL
"In fact you might say that Ugly is the Blazers' secret weapon this year."
-Dave
As for the Blazers...They are officially the NBA equivalent of a movie serial killer
-basketbawful
It all depends!
At the very least, Joel deserves not to be dumped for just ANYBODY. Plus we can always use the insurance savings if he does continue to not be able to play.
If he’s part of a package that brings in a player we’ll have at least for a few seasons, is a good age and addresses a need, then it’s likely a good deal.
If Joel comes back and is good this year, it’s a testament to his rehab and a good amount of luck. That’s an awful injury twice over, so I just hope for the best.
—M
#52
That's what I'm saying
If the GM flips Joel now, for dreck, and then Oden or Camby get hurt (again) we’ll be sitting there in January with LMA and Pendergraph as the backup center
Why do that if you don’t have to?
Plus Przy is going to be worth more healthy as an EC than in rehab where there’s no idea if he’s going to be effective this year
and I don’t want to hear any more CP3 rumors, he wants to be in South Beach in 2012 and so it makes no sense for Portland to acquire a rental PG, no matter how talented he is
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
i don't see Joel getting moved for dreck
he will be in a package with probably miller’s expiring and others probably.
"Oh Yeah!" ~ Kool Aid Man
Right, he'd only be dealt in a much-needed consolidation trade.
It’s a simple concept, really. And, apropos of third-string centers, there are guys out there with experience like Rasho Nesterovic and Fabricio Oberto, who can handle such a limited role with no problem whatsoever.
Well I think with signing matthews
if Utah does not match, we are on the way to a more significant move before the season. Any move would likely include Joel and Miller’s expiring contracts…
Like I said above, it is not that I want to see Joel moved, I am just reading the Tarot cards here…it looks like a pretty likely potentiality at this point. If Ibekwe continues to perform like this it just makes it all the easier for the blazers to pull the trigger on a deal they are probably looking to make regardless.
"Oh Yeah!" ~ Kool Aid Man
Only got to watch about 5 minutes of the game ...
… but in that time Ibekwe had two block shots and a few points and rebounds.
Love to see where he is in four days.
Hopefully it’s not a fluke.
facebook.com/year5000
Terrific outing...if he keeps playing like this
give him Howard’s roster spot…he looked very impressive.
Barrett: You are going to score 35 tonight.
Bayless: Ya think?
MB off by only four, my oh my.
by thenatural007 on Jul 11, 2010 7:13 PM PDT up reply actions
Houston Lacked A True Center
Houston wasn’t playing a true center and Ibekwe was able to capitalize. He is a defensive power forward and plays a lot longer due to his wing span but he lacks true size. I want to see him against bigger players at the 4/5 before I would pass along “Very Impressive” judgment.
Jordon Hill is supposed to be a center, and the kid from Wake was listed at 7 feet
how big do they have to be?
"its tough to play with one eye, unless you're a pirate." Delonte West
"una canasta a Pau en la cara" Rudy
by Honka Playboy on Jul 11, 2010 8:54 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Hill is PF/C
McFarland played all of 5 minutes and did nothing. Jordan Hill is a PF, not any bigger than Aldridge. From the Dream Shake on J. Hill:
He will still need to bulk up to keep some of the larger centers of the league from backing him down easily.
And Jordan Hill is listed at 6’10" 235 where Ibekwe is listed 6’9" 220. If Ibekwe wants a spot, he has to develop some offensive game to compliment his defensive abilities. Against true NBA centers, he just isn’t big enough. Most centers are >250lbs and he would get man-handled in the post trying to work against guys that big. Even the better PF’s are all around 250.
Yeah, I couldn't help wondering what a Big Baby or DeJuan Blair would do to this stringbean
But Ibekwe is intriguing for sure. Great length (long arms!), quickness, and timing.
I was born in '52, and I believe in #52. Hang in there, GO.
You too, Przy: everyone knows you're the heart & soul of the Blazers.
Babbitt look unimpressive
I felt that his stats don’t tell the whole story. Yes he scored in double digits, however it was in summer league with a weak defensive team. I don’t think he was an upgrade over Martell and I don’t think he’ll become an upgrade over martell. Most of all, he looked very SLOW. I like how patty played, and #25 Ibekwe looked like a less talented tyrus thomas out there(which is no slight) on the defensive end. He impressed me with his D.
*** PHIL KNIGHT IS A GENIUS ***
he looked a bit like
an overweight adam morrison
by JMLakaShotCaller on Jul 11, 2010 5:18 PM PDT up reply actions
..................AT THE MOMENT
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
WAAA-STED DRAFT PICK!!! (clap, clap, clap-clap-clap)
WAAA-STED DRAFT PICK!!! (clap, clap, clap-clap-clap)
WAAA-STED DRAFT PICK!!! (clap, clap, clap-clap-clap)
WAAA-STED DRAFT PICK!!! (clap, clap, clap-clap-clap)
WAAA-STED DRAFT PICK!!! (clap, clap, clap-clap-clap)
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Neeext Chris Mull-in! (clap, clap, clap-clap-clap)
Anything still completely open. That he could have trouble creating separation was in every scouting report I’ve read, and I assume Born and Buchanan and KP knew that too and still liked him. I give him a year.
by Norsktroll on Jul 11, 2010 7:46 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
I can't get past the fact that they slaughtered Marty................. for HIM.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Ceiling = Omri Casspi
He is NOT a sniper, and that’s what he was supposed to be.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
kid was 50/40/90 in college and you are deciding after one summer league game (where he shoots 5 for 9) that he can’t snipe?
You may be right, but I’m not quite sure how you are drawing this conclusion.
No joke.
How dare he miss 4 shots.
by Nick Van Excellent on Jul 11, 2010 8:00 PM PDT up reply actions
I would mention that 49/44/86 were Luke Jackson's stats senior year in college
someone just brought that up on a Duck board. Sometimes it doesn’t quite work out at the next level, unless that level is the Idaho Stampede
"its tough to play with one eye, unless you're a pirate." Delonte West
"una canasta a Pau en la cara" Rudy
by Honka Playboy on Jul 11, 2010 8:44 PM PDT up reply actions
I certainly wouldn’t rule out Luke Babbitt being a bust a la Luke Jackson, but its hard to say where Jackson’s career would have gone if not for his chronic back problems.
Well, I see Luke Babbitt as a Troy Murphy 4 or a Luke Jackson 3; yet, ...
I concede I may end up wrong here. Heck, we’ll just have to wait and see.
I'd agree with you more
If you had said Babbitt would likely be a “White Tom Chambers”.
Just seems childish to predict any other outcome for our Luke Babbsie.
M—
#52
what's wrong with Chambers?
Actually, there was a lot wrong with Tom, but he had a nice NBA career. Luke would be doing pretty good if he wound up as good as TC
I just don’t have a lot of confidence in stretch 4s when it comes to winning playoff games. The only one who I can think of who had success was Big Shot Bob, but Horry was the exception that proves the rule. You could draft or acquire 100 players who are RH’s size and none of them may be able to play “PF” well enough to hold his own in the paint against bigger players for 25-30 mpg and knock down a dagger three at the end of the game 7
It’s like Travis Outlaw. He can be a cold-blooded maker of big shots late in games, but the stuff he doesn’t do for the previous 25 minutes is putting his team at a disadvantage…so where’s the gain for keeping him on the roster? Hopefully, Babbitt will be a more well-rounded player with better BBIQ than Catfish
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
I detest Travis Outlaw as much as anyone here; thus, ...
you’re preaching to the choir — although I’m an irreligious guy, so that’s an odd analogy for me — however, this topic has nothing to do with him.
Anyway, I don’t compare Luke Babbitt to a Tom Chambers 4 or Chris Mullin 3 — which, according to some people, is his alleged upside — rather, my feeling is that he’s a Troy Murphy 4 or a Luke Jackson 3.
With Babbitt, his solid athlectism is negated by his slow-footed, plodding defense and lack of a quick first step on offense. Due to those two factors, Babbitt will have a tough time transitioning from a mid-major basketball program in Nevada to the NBA.
For now, I believe Babbitt’s best position would actually be the 4 on offense in a spread system — such as that run by the Orlando Magic or the Indiana Pacers — that employs a defensive-minded center who can mask his flaws.
Yet, for better or worse, Babbitt is stuck here in Portland.
Jackson was a much less prolific 3 shooter than Babbitt
so I take his shooting numbers with a bigger grain of salt
Luke's numbers his senior year were better
did he shoot a lot less? Too lazy to look up
"its tough to play with one eye, unless you're a pirate." Delonte West
"una canasta a Pau en la cara" Rudy
by Honka Playboy on Jul 12, 2010 4:41 AM PDT up reply actions
He shot over 41% in college in two seasons (42.9 and 41.6)
Martell in college … well he never went there. In his first NBA season he shot 36%. And in his second. That seems like a reasonable target for Babbitt. And he probably will work a lot with the Blazers’ shooting coach and whoever replaces Monty to become a capable spot-up and catch-and-shoot option.
And I don’t think anyone wants to claim with a straight face Martell was ever useful when creating his own shot on the dribble. He could score effectively around the rim, and score just under 40% as a open spot-up shooter. And that’s it. If Babbitt can fill that role for less of a cost, and Matthews or whoever brings the slashing and the defensive element, then that could have been a good filling of this salary slot.
Honestly my biggest question mark with Babbitt is if his lateral quickness is good enough to defend (backup) small forwards. Not if he can hit open shots.
His release looked a little slow
That won’t get it done in the NBA, no matter how accurate you are. It’s a quicker game than college.
Of course, this was one Summer League game. And the kid didn’t look like chopped liver, certainly. At least he can dribble & pass the ball—unlike a certain recently-departed Blazer (i.e., Martell).
I was born in '52, and I believe in #52. Hang in there, GO.
You too, Przy: everyone knows you're the heart & soul of the Blazers.
Webster, today, is a much better defender
that may change. we’ll see about shooting.
"its tough to play with one eye, unless you're a pirate." Delonte West
"una canasta a Pau en la cara" Rudy
by Honka Playboy on Jul 11, 2010 8:03 PM PDT up reply actions
Seriously
I honestly don’t understand the devastation some people are feeling over losing Marty for Babbit. Even if Babbit is a bust (which I doubt he will be), we lost a borderline 2nd string small forward that has likely already hit his ceiling. Um, sorry?
by powellandpressmurder on Jul 11, 2010 8:03 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
The problem I have is that we may need Babbit this year
Martell started a few games last year, didn’t he? Similar circumstances will put Babbit in the starting five, unless Dante develops 3 point range QUICKLY.
I’d much rather have a known quantity, who won us some games last year, than a player whose weaknesses are pretty apparent and whose strengths may or may not translate to the NBA
"its tough to play with one eye, unless you're a pirate." Delonte West
"una canasta a Pau en la cara" Rudy
by Honka Playboy on Jul 11, 2010 8:08 PM PDT up reply actions
well, we’ll probably have Matthews, who I think will be a better version of Martell (albeit badly overpaid— and I’m not a fan of the offer).
I saw Martell last year play credible defense against LeBron
and other big 3’s (and even 4’s on occasion, though less credibly). Does Matthews have those kind of chops? Honest question, honestly!
"its tough to play with one eye, unless you're a pirate." Delonte West
"una canasta a Pau en la cara" Rudy
by Honka Playboy on Jul 11, 2010 8:48 PM PDT up reply actions
with Utah Wes guarded all of the gnarly wings
37 mpg in the playoffs again L*A, not bad for an undrafted rookie.
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Sad but true
Martell seems like a great young man. His enthusiasm and team-spiritedness were fun to see. But he was always a marginal NBA player. Leaping ability and a pretty (but inconsistent) jumper ain’t enough to get it done.
I was born in '52, and I believe in #52. Hang in there, GO.
You too, Przy: everyone knows you're the heart & soul of the Blazers.
Marty is a wonderful person but he killed me when he decided to let his
mind get in the way of his playing.
Stop clapping
You’re making my lights go on and off.
facebook.com/year5000
by Y5k on Jul 11, 2010 8:57 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
i agree
Michael Jordan is the Nicolas Batum of America
marty>babbitt
by thomasikehara on Jul 11, 2010 5:20 PM PDT up reply actions
I agree 100%
He will have a hard time defensively in the league
Speaking of cruel, Portland fired GM Kevin Pritchard an hour before the draft. Hey, he's only a top-seven GM -- there are plenty of those. Does anyone else think Al Davis died a year ago and took over Paul Allen's body? - Bill Simmons
Can't get over the fact that Pritchard -- fired earlier in the day -- is still running Portland's draft. If I were him, I'd be in Portland's war room loudly calling other GMs and saying things like, "I have an offer for you: I'll trade you our No. 23 pick, and in return, YOU HELP ME PULL THE F****** KNIFE OUT OF MY BACK!!!!! Do we have a deal????" - Bill Simmons
by blazeraddict on Jul 11, 2010 5:23 PM PDT up reply actions
babbitt did showed some nice things
his overall offensive game is or will be much more complete than marty party. He rebounded well, had some decent passes, and looks to be a lock to shoot in the 90’s from the ft line. This wasn’t his best game but he showed that he is skilled and may look better as he gets into better shape.
by HD on Jul 11, 2010 5:25 PM PDT up reply actions
I say this with no snark intended
but if dude is not in shape after a summer of draft workouts, I’m worried. Was he injured before the draft, I thought I heard he had a back or hammy injury, with of course renders the worries in my first point moot if that’s the case
Speaking of cruel, Portland fired GM Kevin Pritchard an hour before the draft. Hey, he's only a top-seven GM -- there are plenty of those. Does anyone else think Al Davis died a year ago and took over Paul Allen's body? - Bill Simmons
Can't get over the fact that Pritchard -- fired earlier in the day -- is still running Portland's draft. If I were him, I'd be in Portland's war room loudly calling other GMs and saying things like, "I have an offer for you: I'll trade you our No. 23 pick, and in return, YOU HELP ME PULL THE F****** KNIFE OUT OF MY BACK!!!!! Do we have a deal????" - Bill Simmons
by blazeraddict on Jul 11, 2010 5:27 PM PDT up reply actions
NBA game shape is a whole lot more in shape than college and draft workout shape
I'm a grown man stuck inside the mind of a 3 year old
by The Arkitect on Jul 11, 2010 6:36 PM PDT up reply actions
Babbit did look sort of tired
BUT he showed nice vision, passed the ball well and hit open shots. Aren’t those the main things we think he’ll be asked to do for us? He’s not going to be a defensive stopper. If he can be creative, spot up and avoid being a soft spot on defense he’ll fit just fine on the second team.
by botanyjames on Jul 11, 2010 7:31 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
His short passing game was good. But his job is a perimeter sniper megabomber killer death machine...
Somebody screwed up REEEEEEEEALLLLL bad…
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
I blame Paul Allen!
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Adam Morrison: no step vert- 25.5; max vert 30.5; lane agility 11.46 sec
Luke Babbitt: no step vert- 29.5; max vert 37.5; lane agility 10.98 sec
Now, Babbitt did have a poor time in the 3/4 court sprint, but comparing these two players in terms of their athleticism is just lazy and woefully inaccurate.
We shall see. I'm calling my shot.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Or calling my pot-shot, as the case may be...
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
One must admit that the "Small Western College Super Sniper Who Is Actually a Slug" threat is massive...
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
they'll have to include provisions for SWCSSWIAAS's in the new CBA
"its tough to play with one eye, unless you're a pirate." Delonte West
"una canasta a Pau en la cara" Rudy
by Honka Playboy on Jul 11, 2010 8:21 PM PDT up reply actions
At least the geniuses didn't sacrifice Batum to pick him with the #4 pick, I reckon...
What ever happened to last year’s 1st round sensational small forward taken in the first round, I wonder…
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Victor's never coming over after what happed with Sergio and Rudy
would you"
the Blazers will be lucky to get their first round draft choice back in exchange for Claver
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Love child #1 and #2?
Paul, we didn’t know you had it in you.
That Babbit kid has your smile!
In KP I trusted!
based on 5/9 shooting?
Babbitt looked fine to me.
by Kaanyr Vhok on Jul 11, 2010 10:12 PM PDT up reply actions
he used that 37.5 vert to attempt two jump passes
those can’t be unlearned.
"its tough to play with one eye, unless you're a pirate." Delonte West
"una canasta a Pau en la cara" Rudy
by Honka Playboy on Jul 11, 2010 8:23 PM PDT up reply actions
He showed about 8 inches of it.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Oden?
"In fact you might say that Ugly is the Blazers' secret weapon this year."
-Dave
As for the Blazers...They are officially the NBA equivalent of a movie serial killer
-basketbawful
We drafted him. He's ours now.
What’s the point of dropping all this trollish nonsense?
by levelhed on Jul 11, 2010 8:25 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
You KNOW that's the scout behind this pick.......
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
And the cuts are just beginning.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Send him to Spain, it worked last year.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
I'm making that, too — 'cept he's not even gonna see summer league action.
Conveniently forgotten.
Could have had Casspi…
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
I don't want Casspi, I want Beaubois
Well, last year it looked like stashing another wing player was the right strategy with 3 SFs on the roster. And Casspi wanted to come over and play immediately, which wouldn’t have happened in Portland (at least not before Nic got injured). Problem now is that Claver isn’t even the best player on his team, still needs a couple of years to develop, and has Rudy as a vivid negative example on his national team telling him stories straight from the horse’s mouth about life in the NBA when you are stuck behind other players. So, yeah, he’s the stashed pick I least see ever playing for Portland.
right
I would’ve rather had Beaubois and Blair than Claver and Pendy
Cunningham was the only decent pick out of 4 in 2009. They might be able to flip Patty and Jeff for something if they don’t hang onto ’em too long
If Dave thinks Babbitt is deliberate…Pendergraph plays like a rock’em sock’em robot (the red one)
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
55
the Blazers took a flier, for Paul’s sake
Mills might have been better off being undrafted, like Matthews was, then picked his own team
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
I like Patty quite a lot.................. for the Lakers next year.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
you've got Blake
don’t get greedy
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
heat
if the heat sign patty, he’ll play in 5 all star games. sadly, nate likes taller, bad point guards, much like himself.
I have to agree
I was a fan of Babbitt, but he looked like he was moving in Molasses. Not encouraging, but let’s see how he does in the rest of the games.
I am not surprised he looked slow
that was sort of his MO coming in. not athletic. I must say he did make some nice heads up plays and mixed it up well in the paint…
"Oh Yeah!" ~ Kool Aid Man
He tested out reasonably well on the athletic drills—his vert and lane agility were pretty good compared to his class/position peers.
but there is a reason he has the tag as not athletic
and it is probably because he is more deliberate in game situations. I don’t care if you jump 10’ in tests, it is what you do on the floor that you will be judged by. I liked Babbit today, he looked scrappy with a good nose for the ball. He hand good handle to.
"Oh Yeah!" ~ Kool Aid Man
He has a certain set of skills that will probably find him a place in the NBA.
My enormous fear, based upon an over-the-top reaction to a first impression, is that skill-set does NOT include zipping to an open spot and nailing the 3 — which is what is needed from a wing given the playing styles of Roy and Miller and Rex…
He looks to me to be more of a Casspi-style rucker — best case.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
He's not an upgrade over Martell
not on defense certainly, not in creating his own looks. For the time being, I’m going to pretend that we did not replace Martell with him
"its tough to play with one eye, unless you're a pirate." Delonte West
"una canasta a Pau en la cara" Rudy
by Honka Playboy on Jul 11, 2010 7:44 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
"not in creating his own looks"
Martell was terrible at creating his own offense. That’s arguably one of the reasons we drafted Babbitt.
I agree about Martell, and in all the tapes I've seen and tonight
I don’t see Babbit being better at it
"its tough to play with one eye, unless you're a pirate." Delonte West
"una canasta a Pau en la cara" Rudy
by Honka Playboy on Jul 11, 2010 8:10 PM PDT up reply actions
he can change directions while dribbling. That’s a start (and I was one of Martell’s biggest fanboys when he was around). The concern about creating space is valid, but it could go either way.
My opinion doesn't mean much
it based on one SL game, and 15-20 minutes of YouTube highlights. My eyes tell me Armon Johnson can play in the NBA. I might be wrong there
BUT – I counted TWO (2) jump passes. Go ahead and defend those!
"its tough to play with one eye, unless you're a pirate." Delonte West
"una canasta a Pau en la cara" Rudy
by Honka Playboy on Jul 11, 2010 8:19 PM PDT up reply actions
My eyes tell me Armon Johnson can play in the NBA
He’ll have a career as a backup PG, the hammer is not a good enough shooter to become a full-time starter. He’s not an upgrade over Bayless on Portland’s current roster, but he could be the next Robert Pack and have a longer NBA career than the 2 players Portland picked in the first round
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Did you just predict Armon Johnson's whole career off one game?
I’m pretty sure a guy that young can improve his shooting significantly in the 5 or so years.
by Nick Van Excellent on Jul 11, 2010 10:58 PM PDT up reply actions
It wasn't a prediction. More of a revelation.
Johnson’s doomed now.
by BlazerFanSince1970 on Jul 11, 2010 11:04 PM PDT up reply actions
doomed to a 14 year NBA career, like Pack?
I think AJ will take that, if it was offered
even if meant he wouldn’t start games except in rare cases
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Do you think he has enough game to be an NBA starter?
I know Andre Miller came out ot Utah, but it’s a long way from Reno to a starting NBA gig. ’Dre had Majerus as coach, Johnson played in a weak conference and on a below-average team
I think I’ve pegged him pretty well. I’m not saying he doesn’t have game, because obviously he does. But Armon is a little lefthand dominant and will have to learn how to run a team, just like Bayless is doing. Like the Pack-man, AJ has a nice athletic floor game but struggles with his shot. Guys like that tend to be career backups, sometimes for 10+ years
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
From 1 game
Armon had quite a bit better court vision than Bayless did. But, it’s one game.
He’s a great athlete who is more of a PG than Bayless is, and coming into the NBA as a better ballhandler. His knock is shooting, but that’s the one skill I feel almost anyone can improve on.
I dunno if he’s more than a backup, I dunno if he’s a new Antonio Daniels, but one game ain’t enough and he showed stuff that should transfer (athletic good defense, smart passes, good energy, very athletic overall).
You gotta imagine how he’d project out to be in a few years! Like a scout! ;-) joking wink
M—
#52
You gotta imagine how he’d project out to be in a few years! Like a scout
I did, I compared him to Robert Pack
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
whoosh
You can measure skill and talent with your eyes, but productivity is shown through statistics.
This is a stretch but Rondo couldn't shoot coming in to the NBA.
He’s not a left hand or one hand dominant like Armon but his knock was and has been shooting.
Being a Blazer fan is not exactly healthy.
Shooting is something players can learn, and compensate for
I’d even say that for some players, NOT being able to shoot early in their careers forces them to learn how to penetrate and finish amongst the trees close to the basket. That is a more important and reliable skill, if a guy can do that well.
Practicing shooting a lot with a shooting coach, working on form and consistency, will make MOST guys learn how to become decent shooters. Some skills, history suggests, are inherent and can’t be greatly improved— rebounding, playmaking are two obvious and important ones.
But shooting has been shown time and time again to be improved if one works hard on it— usually. Not everyone can be a good shooter, but if Joel Przybilla can go from 30% to 70% at the FT line, then ANYONE can improve if they work on it.
Morty
#52
exactly
Martel’s offensive game was the spot up 3 and allyoop finishes. His D and rebounding came along well, but I already think Luke might have a better nose for the ball and will have a more confident jumpshot. Wow lets write him off after one summer league game, even though we gave Martel all these years and he’s pretty much hit his ceiling
Me too.
Matthews will be at least equal on defense. So it’s probably a wash at the very worst.
by Nick Van Excellent on Jul 11, 2010 8:01 PM PDT up reply actions
If they get Matthews, all is forgiven.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Not yet. Dante is the D and Luke might be the O
…pencils out that he should equal Marty’s shooting or better. His rebounding is better and we’ll see if he is an “overthinker” or not as he gets some minutes under him.
but you can't morph them into one player
or play them at the same time
the fact that Portland has two halves of one backup SF in Luke and Dante is precisely why they’re trying to use their MLE to acquire a more-complete wing in Matthews
Martell’s contract was moved to make this offer sheet less damaging to the 2010-2011 payroll re: luxury tax. So indirectly, Matthews will be replacing Webster and Rudy, while Babbitt and Cunningham will take whatever minutes are available when the outcome of the game is not on the line
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Babbit better ball handling skills than expected
I know it’s completely ridiculous to come to any conclusions based on one summer league game but to my eye Babbit already appears to have better ball handling skills than Martel. At least twice during the game he faked a shot then drove straight to the rim for a easy deuce. He can dribble with either hand and even made a nice pass or two.
What I liked best about his offensive game was the fact that even though he didn’t quite have his shot dialed in (probably due to nerves) he found other ways to contribute offensively by getting rebounds, getting to the rim, and he even got fouled a few times. He didn’t just disappear after his first few misses as Martel and Rudy often did.
Defensively though he looked more like Martel in his first season than the Martel from last season. He gave Budinger far to much room, played the pick roll poorly, and on at least one or two occasions appeared to lose his man. On the plus side when forced to guard the post he did a pretty decent job. I don’t think lack of athleticism is his main problem on defense. I think it has more to do with indecisiveness and lack of desire. He seemed like someone who developed in an environment where defense was never given much importance. Hopefully he will embrace his defensive role and take pride in it the way that Martel did.
I think a lot of the criticism about Babbit is based on preconceived ideas. He has good size and his athletic numbers looked pretty good at the draft. Overall I’d give him a B for his first outing.
JRogero
Disagree about Babbitt looking unimpressive generally - he just looked like a PF
His shot and first step looked great. He hit some of the same types of shots he will get in the league.
He looked unimpressive running down the court – that I will agree with. The kid is stiff. He runs like Przy or Kevin Love. For a kid who’s supposed to spend time at the three, that ain’t good! He may be able to guard reserves, but it looks pretty clear he would be obliterated by elite guys.
But the dude can undeniably shoot the lights out, and he has a nose for the ball. He’s a shooter/scorer/rebounder who needs to continue to pack muscle on so he can be a stretch four off the bench. He can be very solid in that role.
If what the Blazers were looking for was a SF who’s going to handle the ball on the perimeter, though, it’s just not happening.
Q: Is Greg favoring his knee?
Frye: He favors dunking on your head, that's what he favors.
Agree
Luke needs to bulk up and become the next Troy Murphy
Unfortunately for him, Cunningham is already on the roster
Why do the Blazers stack players of similar skills at the same backup 4-3 position? I’m still hopeful that they drafted Babbitt because they knew he would make a nice trading chip for a blockbuster deal in about a month. But the way Chad is talking about him, LB seems to be in the team’s long-range plans. Skinny PFs are not conducive to winning playoff series, give me a player with some meat on his bones in May-June. At least Dante is tough and wiry and gets good lower body leverage against players who are 230+ lbs
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
The Troy Murphy comparison is what scares the living daylights out of me, because that guy is the ...
biggest defensive sieve at the 4 in all of the NBA. With regards to Luke Babbitt, I have a sick feeling in my stomach that due to his slow-footed, plodding nature, he’ll get torched on defense each and every play—no matter how much he practices or tries to improve his game. Athleticism is fine and dandy, but it’s not of much value when a guy has tortoise-like lateral quickness.
With Babbitt
I’d always stress that even if he is just Troy Murphy, he’d be a bench role player for us, and not a key guy we rely on in the starting lineup.
If he even becomes as “good” as Murphy, of course. Babbitt could go a lotta’ ways.
M—
#52
blazers summer league team>miami heat
Michael Jordan is the Nicolas Batum of America
marty>babbitt
by thomasikehara on Jul 11, 2010 5:20 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
ha ha!
Barrett: You are going to score 35 tonight.
Bayless: Ya think?
MB off by only four, my oh my.
by thenatural007 on Jul 11, 2010 7:14 PM PDT up reply actions
the 1988-1990 Miami Heat
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Liked Armon and Babbitt in the 1st half
Didn’t watch the 2nd.
Armon needs to learn to use his right. Not sure how you can have him, Williams and Bayless on the same bench. Has an NBA body and quickness right now.
Luke B is clearly going to be our designated whipping boy. He looked fine to me. Obviously needs to get in NBA shape, and I don’t think anyone expects him to play a lot this year.
It was clear from the comments on draft night that he’s going to have to work extra hard to get kudos from this board, from Dave on down. Not sure why. Anyway, I think he’ll disappoint you all by turning out to be an NBA player.
by Hawthorne Wingo on Jul 11, 2010 5:23 PM PDT reply actions 6 recs
Fair warning for all
This gets old really fast. If you want to make points about a player pro or con, please feel free to do so. If you’re going to say, “Anyone who has a critique of a guy must be biased or consider him a whipping boy or is rooting against him or must have something wrong with them because they see something different than I do” you need to find somewhere else to comment. It got old in Zach Randolph’s time. It’s gotten REALLY old since Sergio Rodriguez, Rudy Fernandez, Jerryd Bayless, etc., all of whom are nice players but all of whom also have critique-worthy elements to their game which are fair game to mention when those elements show themselves. There’s no need to repeat history with the current crop of rookies.
If you want to share what you thought was great about a guy’s game and why you think he’ll succeed in the Show, do it. You don’t get to insult everyone else in doing so. It creates a toxic environment. We’re supposed to be better than that.
—Dave
by Dave on Jul 11, 2010 5:31 PM PDT up reply actions 7 recs
have to say it...way to discourge opinions Dave
He was making an observation that some don’t get a fair shot. That’s life. Doesn’t mean he is right on that, but it’s a valid point because many were not fond of that trade.
by Sonic Boom on Jul 11, 2010 5:43 PM PDT up reply actions 7 recs
Opinions always encouraged
Accusations are not. Being able to tell the difference is fairly important. Normally I don’t comment on such things in public but a site-wide reminder is sometimes necessary.
—Dave
by Dave on Jul 11, 2010 5:55 PM PDT up reply actions 6 recs
Dude, it's your site
Ban me if you want to ban me.
But admit that the criticism of Babbitt on this forum is a little out of hand. This kid just played his first summer league game, matched up mostly against Buddinger, and did OK. 13 points, 5-9 shooting, a couple steals, a couple assists, didn’t get torched on D. Not bad.
But I come on here and it’s just like draft night. He looks like [random unsuccessful white player]. Everything good is discounted, bad stuff is emphasized or invented. If Luke is garbage, what’s 13th pick Patrick Patterson?
I don’t think it’s fair comment. I don’t think it’s legit criticism. I don’t think it’s based on what he actually did on the floor today. I don’t see how any NBA fan could watch that kid today and say some of this crap, unless they came into it with an agenda against him. As a Blazer fan, that makes me sick. If I’m not allowed to say it on your site, well, it’s your site and I respect that. Thanks for running it.
by Hawthorne Wingo on Jul 11, 2010 6:07 PM PDT up reply actions
the idea is to focus on the players and organization whether it be criticism or acclaim
but not fight with the community or call people out for being biased, having an agenda or being unreasonable.
There’s a huge difference between, “I think Babbitt will be good and surprise his doubters.”
and
“People who think Babbitt is bad are biased, no nothing know it alls.”
Don’t focus on the people, focus on what they’re saying.
I agree with your points. We shouldn’t be too down (or too high) on a guy after one summer league game.
"In fact you might say that Ugly is the Blazers' secret weapon this year."
-Dave
As for the Blazers...They are officially the NBA equivalent of a movie serial killer
-basketbawful
by Magnum on Jul 11, 2010 6:31 PM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
wow
I’m not sure why Dave was so offended that he needed to legitimately warn/dissuade Hawthorne Wingo’s comment, but I agree with Wingo, and for the most part agree with most of Dave’s insights, but it’s obvious that some people are purposefully anti-Babbitt based on the Martell trade and the fact that Babbitt is a small-school white player, much in a similar vein as Adam Morrison…
now, I was personally at the game today in Vegas, and though I don’t think Luke was the hottest thing on the floor today (since Armon and Patty looked soo good), but I still consider the guy a great pickup and I’m willing to give him some time to improve his NBA game (beyond the first summer league game). Now, based on Dave’s argument that “it got old” based on players like Jerryd and Rudy… common, we’ve seen these guys play for several years, and can more accurately say what their strengths and weaknesses are, yet Babbitt is brand new on everyone’s board. the guy deserves a bit of a break, and as much as he’s still untested and unproven, I think he’ll work fine in spot minutes, much like Dante and Jeff did last year.
No one will replace our TRUE whipping boy though, Rudy, because he’s ostensibly earned the spot on the team…
Elitism - It's lonely at the top. But it's comforting to look down upon everyone at the bottom.
by thankyouforblaze on Jul 11, 2010 9:11 PM PDT up reply actions 2 recs
Rudy has asked for this position. And he has earned it. It wasn't easy for him
but he came through in the end.
by Natsthecat on Jul 11, 2010 9:23 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
I doubt Dave was that offended by one comment
rather, nipping that sort of talk in the bud is a smart thing to do.
Keep the discussion about basketball and not about the biases (real or not) of the people in the discussion.
"In fact you might say that Ugly is the Blazers' secret weapon this year."
-Dave
As for the Blazers...They are officially the NBA equivalent of a movie serial killer
-basketbawful
Exactly.
People criticizing players is one thing. People criticizing other posters is another. The former, done constructively, can lead to great discussions. The latter generally never leads to anything worthwhile.
"[S]ince men enjoyed very great leisure, they used it to pursue many kinds of commodities unknown to their fathers, and that was that first yoke they placed upon themselves without thinking about it, and the first source of evils the prepared for their descendants. For, besides continuing thus to soften body and mind, as these commodities had lost almost all their pleasantness through habit, and as they had at the same time degenerated into true needs, being deprived of them became much more cruel than possessing them was sweet; and people were unhappy to lose them without being happy to have them." -Jean-Jacques Rousseau
If I comment on the quality of your comment
Or the tendencies I observe in how you reach your conclusions, that is bad?
I think it is more in how you do it. He did not name-call, which can get ridiculous (there, I said it) if not nipped. But Dave has a special aversion to the word ‘biased’. I am not sure why. Maybe it is problem with language used for racially based ideas. Again, a tender area. But I think that honestly noting bias in thinking is not something that merits exclusion.
In KP I trusted!
posting on the thought process or tendencies behind a comment adds nothing to a discussion about basketball
because everyone is biased to some degree. You’re not going to be able to separate the bias and spending time talking about it is just going to lead to bad places no matter how delicately it starts.
"In fact you might say that Ugly is the Blazers' secret weapon this year."
-Dave
As for the Blazers...They are officially the NBA equivalent of a movie serial killer
-basketbawful
We end up splitting hairs at best.
And it may be fun for the first hair or two. But it too gets old fast.
"[S]ince men enjoyed very great leisure, they used it to pursue many kinds of commodities unknown to their fathers, and that was that first yoke they placed upon themselves without thinking about it, and the first source of evils the prepared for their descendants. For, besides continuing thus to soften body and mind, as these commodities had lost almost all their pleasantness through habit, and as they had at the same time degenerated into true needs, being deprived of them became much more cruel than possessing them was sweet; and people were unhappy to lose them without being happy to have them." -Jean-Jacques Rousseau
by T Darkstar on Jul 11, 2010 11:41 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
I haven't got that much hair!
"its tough to play with one eye, unless you're a pirate." Delonte West
"una canasta a Pau en la cara" Rudy
by Honka Playboy on Jul 12, 2010 4:44 AM PDT up reply actions
In my opinion, everybody is going to have some degree of personal bias
which influences how they view a particular player. Having any sort of emotional attachment to that player, (in this case because they play for the blazers), will create bias (IMO). At the same time, we can’t call out somebody else’s opinion because we believe they are biased because it is not a statement that can be disproved easily, and it unfairly places the burden of proof on the person accused of bias to prove that they are unbiased and changes the focus of discussion. I think that can create an unhealthy atmosphere.
by premthegrem on Jul 11, 2010 11:06 PM PDT up reply actions
similar feeling
when i first opened this this morning I was a little taken back by some of the over critical evaluations.
My concern is the accusation you made back towards him.
That is of course assuming I can tell the difference.
by Sonic Boom on Jul 11, 2010 6:53 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
I hate accusations as well, Dave
Specifically, I hate it when Jerryd Bayless gets accused of being an NBA caliber point guard. Muahahahahahaha.
Treat people well because Karma can hit you at any second.
I thought Hawthorne's opinion was fair and not insulting or disrespectful.
by simoninaustralia on Jul 11, 2010 6:57 PM PDT up reply actions 2 recs
Personally, I think Babbit could work out really well for this team.
I was a bit dissapointed with what I saw today, but it wasn’t because I thought he was bad. It’s only because I was hoping to see “the best shooter in the draft” (per our scouts) drain some spectacular shots, and that didn’t happen. That’s not going to make me down on him. I seem to remember this other fella named Nicholas Batum who nobody ever heard of and looked really poor during Summer League. Everyone predicted he’d languish in the D-league and we’d never hear from him again. Funny how that works out.
I sense that Dave’s concern with Wingo’s comments comes down to the last paragraph specifically:
It was clear from the comments on draft night that he’s going to have to work extra hard to get kudos from this board, from Dave on down. Not sure why. Anyway, I think he’ll disappoint you all by turning out to be an NBA player.
That’s not an opinion of Luke Babbit or the team. That’s an opinion of the readership, and it’s a harsh one at that. If that’s how Wingo really feels, I’m not going to begrudge him for his opinion. He’s certainly within his rights to hold it. But the moment you start making your arguments about each other than about the game and the players, then you’re just setting the stage for people to spent their time choosing sides and hating on whatever side they didn’t choose, rather than discussing the game itself.
I would encourage Hurricane Wingo to keep posting his thoughts on Luke or anyone else. If he’s got a point that seems to run counter to the prevaling trend, that’s even better. I’ve always got 5 minutes and an ear for a contrarian position. But I have no time for people taking potshots at each other.
Like the Whos down in Whoville they did it without boxes or ribbons or bows, they did without centers or posting down low. They won without All-Stars and Spaniards and Frenchmen. They won with old geezers and sub-par defense-men. They won playing rookies from deep off the benches. They won with their grit and their guts in the trenches. And some who observed them have been known to say that their hearts grew three sizes (at least!) on the way. One hopes with their poise and their passion now proven that once they are healthy their game will be groovin'.
by conspirator5 on Jul 11, 2010 7:13 PM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
Hmm... did I miss my meds today?
I dunno why I said “hurricane” rather than “hawthorne.” Apologies to HW. _
Like the Whos down in Whoville they did it without boxes or ribbons or bows, they did without centers or posting down low. They won without All-Stars and Spaniards and Frenchmen. They won with old geezers and sub-par defense-men. They won playing rookies from deep off the benches. They won with their grit and their guts in the trenches. And some who observed them have been known to say that their hearts grew three sizes (at least!) on the way. One hopes with their poise and their passion now proven that once they are healthy their game will be groovin'.
by conspirator5 on Jul 11, 2010 7:17 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Wings have more trouble showing than guards in Summaer League
The screens are often not there to free them, nor do passes find them.
I will take 5-9.
In KP I trusted!
This.
"[S]ince men enjoyed very great leisure, they used it to pursue many kinds of commodities unknown to their fathers, and that was that first yoke they placed upon themselves without thinking about it, and the first source of evils the prepared for their descendants. For, besides continuing thus to soften body and mind, as these commodities had lost almost all their pleasantness through habit, and as they had at the same time degenerated into true needs, being deprived of them became much more cruel than possessing them was sweet; and people were unhappy to lose them without being happy to have them." -Jean-Jacques Rousseau
Indeed that is it (plus the whipping boy reference)
and I don’t think much more needs to be said on the topic either way. The site rules are clear. The position is clear. The warning is clear, not just to HW but to all. None of the things just mentioned talk about a player or about basketball, they are accusations against other people on the board and as such are not allowed. If a person cannot tell the difference between debating fairly and cutting each other down I cannot explain it any better than that and they probably won’t be happy or long-tenured here.
—Dave
by Dave on Jul 11, 2010 11:15 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Hawthorne Wingo is clearly going to be our designated whipping boy.
His comment looked fine to me. Obviously he needs to get in Blazersedge shape, and I don’t think anyone expects him to comment a lot after only watching half the game.
by Kaboomm on Jul 11, 2010 7:35 PM PDT up reply actions 2 recs
Not exactly fair to Hawthorne Dave
If you’re going to say, "Anyone who has a critique of a guy must be biased or consider him a whipping boy or is rooting against him or must have something wrong with them because they see something different than I do" you need to find somewhere else to comment.
You’re the boss here big D, and with great power comes great responsibility. His comment was pretty spot on, and you dropped a straw man on him – and promptly got rec’d green. Hawthorne deserves better IMO.
by levelhed on Jul 11, 2010 9:15 PM PDT up reply actions 11 recs
I believe that Dave was objecting to Hawthorne calling out posters as biased,
because such accusations have a tendency to derail constructive discussions. If I’m spending all my time defending my opinions as being unbiased, then I cannot spend that time discussing and defending my actual opinions.
by premthegrem on Jul 11, 2010 11:12 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
I agree!
I appreciate the site and all but its not gonna stop me from saying I think Dave is in the wrong on this one. I think its a slippery slope he is headed down and I would hate to see it become a trend to cut down a single poster like that. I saw nothing wrong with Hawthorne’s comments and if one where to go back and look at the draft threads you can see he isn’t exactly making this up. Regardless Dave’s response jump out to me in a negative way. Even if you feels this way Dave couldn’t you have chosen a better time/way to handle it? I have seen much worse posts by your own guidelines go on without response. I seriously question the timing and motivation of your response. sorry i think it needed to be said. Love the site and the work everyone does to make it that way. thanks!
Again
Not a specific warning to one person but a general warning using a clear example. Your own post says that this is needed by virtue of the “much worse posts” stuff. So again…warning issued, please talk about basketball without denigrating other posters or talking about them, and everyone on any side of this issue move on.
—Dave
patty should sign with the knicks
When the game opened up his game settled down and he looked good on the break. He was plenty quick in transition and hit his jumpers as well.
he seems much more comfortable in the open court than half court.
That would be a good fit for him
He’d be a mini Barbosa with D’Antoni
Speaking of cruel, Portland fired GM Kevin Pritchard an hour before the draft. Hey, he's only a top-seven GM -- there are plenty of those. Does anyone else think Al Davis died a year ago and took over Paul Allen's body? - Bill Simmons
Can't get over the fact that Pritchard -- fired earlier in the day -- is still running Portland's draft. If I were him, I'd be in Portland's war room loudly calling other GMs and saying things like, "I have an offer for you: I'll trade you our No. 23 pick, and in return, YOU HELP ME PULL THE F****** KNIFE OUT OF MY BACK!!!!! Do we have a deal????" - Bill Simmons
by blazeraddict on Jul 11, 2010 5:28 PM PDT up reply actions
Definitely.
He doesn’t look like a half court PG.
I'm just not crazy about player nick names...
by Hipster Olympic Team! on Jul 11, 2010 5:38 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
Hahaha.
He SO IS.
Camby can shoot though. Occasionally…
I'm just not crazy about player nick names...
by Hipster Olympic Team! on Jul 11, 2010 5:37 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
I saw Camby in Vegas today at the Game
rec myself, lol
Elitism - It's lonely at the top. But it's comforting to look down upon everyone at the bottom.
by thankyouforblaze on Jul 11, 2010 9:13 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
ask him what he thinks about Danny Ferry
as the next Blazer GM
Marcus was probably in Vegas lobbying for Pfund
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Is it too early to call a guy a bust after one pre-season game?
I’m afraid the last Pritchslap dealt by KP was upside the Blazers head. I would not be surprised if KP lands a job in Minnesota.
is it too late to wish I hadn't read this comment?
by blacknoiseNW on Jul 11, 2010 10:31 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
No commenting on commentors commenting on commentors.
by Nick Van Excellent on Jul 11, 2010 11:50 PM PDT up reply actions
No commenting on commentors commenting on commentors commenting on comentors.
by Nick Van Excellent on Jul 11, 2010 11:51 PM PDT up reply actions
no comment
Romance me with that Roy rainbow shot which took flight from way beyond the arc and sailed so high that before it came back down to earth sealing the victory, it kissed the rafters and said "You're mine baby."
AJ and Patty were good--AJ is more of a Nate guy.
Babs can’t get his own shot but knows where to be on the floor. How does he fit on this team?
Ibekwe has Joel’s tenacity on D and brick laying hands on offense. What position is he? Is he bulky enough to bang with bigs?
I'm just not crazy about player nick names...
by Hipster Olympic Team! on Jul 11, 2010 5:32 PM PDT via mobile reply actions
ibekwe
is 6’9, 220 lbs… hardly the stature of the F/C he’s listed as, but he certainly outplayed the majority of the houston rockets summer league team.
by JMLakaShotCaller on Jul 11, 2010 5:38 PM PDT up reply actions
If he's quick enough to move his feet on the perimeter
he could make an awesome defensive specialist off the bench. The Blazers DO have the two most explosive 3s in the league in their division.
I'm just not crazy about player nick names...
by Hipster Olympic Team! on Jul 11, 2010 5:41 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
yes
I'm a grown man stuck inside the mind of a 3 year old
by The Arkitect on Jul 11, 2010 7:12 PM PDT up reply actions
Trew.
Pierce is pretty good too.
I'm just not crazy about player nick names...
by Hipster Olympic Team! on Jul 11, 2010 7:16 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
no
I'm a grown man stuck inside the mind of a 3 year old
by The Arkitect on Jul 11, 2010 7:12 PM PDT up reply actions
make up your mind
"its tough to play with one eye, unless you're a pirate." Delonte West
"una canasta a Pau en la cara" Rudy
by Honka Playboy on Jul 11, 2010 7:49 PM PDT up reply actions
memo to haters
cant hate the talking lamarcus bobblehead doll (
by Captain fruit on Jul 11, 2010 5:37 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
All right, folks, let's calm down about Ekene Ibekwe and take a nice, healthy dose of much-needed realism. As ...
a result, I hope y’all temper this crazed frenzy about a guy who’s supposed upside of Ben Wallace won’t be reached due to his puny 8’8" standing reach. Whenever a guy has a less than adequate standing reach — which has usually to do with having incredibly broad shoulders (e.g., Ekpe Udoh) and/or a large head (e.g., Shelden Williams) — that makes them incapable of satisfactorily defending post players one-on-one inside. Ibekwe, who’s also got a way too slender frame, can’t get by solely on a nice wingspan of 7’6" long — which helps on weakside help defense, but not man-to-man defense — and his lone skill of being a mighty fine shot blocker. Remember, this is the NBA — and not the NCAA or some second tier league in Europe — that we’re talking about here. So yeah, everybody ought to take a deep breath, sit back, relax, and understand that we’re discussing the merits of total non-prospect in Ibekwe. Okay, I now have got that off my chest.
I was thinking something similar
but to be totally honest, I only caught the 2nd half of the game.
"In fact you might say that Ugly is the Blazers' secret weapon this year."
-Dave
As for the Blazers...They are officially the NBA equivalent of a movie serial killer
-basketbawful
I mean, heck, there are rare cases of smaller centers who are stout position defenders in the paint, ...
although those type of player are so few and far between. One such guy is Chuck Hayes, but he’s muscular, has a low center of gravity that gives him a sturdy base, is a tireless worker, and is very intelligent at playing strict man-to-man low-post defense. Ekene Ibekwe, however, is a guy who’s skinny, floats on defense — as he looks for blocks rather than trying to make stops — furthermore, the dude is stuck between two positions, as he’s a weakside help specialist at the 4 on defense and a garbage scorer at the 5 on offense. So yeah, I feel the need to hate on Ibekwe — who, no matter his on-court play, is probably a nice guy in real life — and bring some balance here.
Stephen Hill >>> Ekene Ibekwe
’nuff said
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Y'know, Maceo Baston is probably a good comparison for Ekene Ibekwe.
For Ibekwe, his best bet is staying overseas and establishing a solid career for himself; yet, if he truly wants to make the NBA someday, my advice would be for him to join the D-League this season and hope for a mid-season call-up by a ballclub looking for post depth at any cost.
Anthony Tolliver >>> Ekene Ibekwe
every other summer league there’s a guy who comes out of nowhere and wows the fanbase, then disappears like a vapor and becomes a trivia answer that eventually fades from memory
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Well, those are two different types of players stylistically.
Anthony Tolliver, who’s a pure pick-‘n’-pop 4, is more known for his offense than his defense. Ekene Ibekwe, though, is a raw, putback scoring 5 on offense, but he gets by on being a weakside help and shot blocking specialist at the 4 on defense.
They’re both fringe players, however, for whatever that’s worth.
He did do a nice job in the post against Jordan Hill
the first block, I believe, in the first half
"its tough to play with one eye, unless you're a pirate." Delonte West
"una canasta a Pau en la cara" Rudy
by Honka Playboy on Jul 11, 2010 7:53 PM PDT up reply actions
you mean Heat starting center Joel Anthony?
or will it be Juwan Howard?
"its tough to play with one eye, unless you're a pirate." Delonte West
"una canasta a Pau en la cara" Rudy
by Honka Playboy on Jul 12, 2010 4:47 AM PDT up reply actions
They'll have Big Z for the vets minimum as a backup...
And I would not be the LEAST bit surprised for one last gasp by Shaq… Shaq has already been paid and he knows a good party when he see one…
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
You speak mostly truth ak
Ibekwe is a borderline nab player. Maybe he could play for the warriors or something. But… You leave udoh out of this!!!! Hehe
OJ Mayo is the Blazers' PG of the Future
by GreatOden'sRaven on Jul 11, 2010 10:40 PM PDT up reply actions
True, I did slam Ekpe Udoh.
Remember, though, that I was once high on Shelden Williams, but then learned my lesson.
Udoh will be to you as Williams was to me, which is a real eye-opening experience.
we shall see
i still have faith.. time may prove you correct
OJ Mayo is the Blazers' PG of the Future
by GreatOden'sRaven on Jul 12, 2010 12:27 PM PDT up reply actions
back to topic and mabey only i feel this way but...
why are we showing off players for Miami? that with the wes contract we may not be able to afford to sign anyway. would it be WRONG to make guys like mills sign an offersheet before we use a bunch of minutes on them or does our acting temporary gm confidently believe that we can afford to resign him.
We can afford to sign Matthews (or else we wouldn't have made the offer)
And it works under the cap. I suspect none of these costs are of a serious concern to the team
We can't make Mills do anything.
He’s an unrestricted free agent. If we didn’t want to give him minutes, we wouldn’t. The Blazers have no rights to him at this point.
"One of the bright spots of the young season has been rookie point guard Jonny Flynn, whose name sounds like he should be the lead character in a Broadway Musical. "What are you doing here, Jonny Flynn?" "Why I'm here to court trouble, and woo a girl, and build the most fantastical contraption the world has ever seen!" -- Dave, Game 7 Blazers versus Timberwolves preview
"It was bad reffing...but not rip apart the fabric of time bad." -- The Arkitect, Game 79 Blazers versus Mavericks Post-Game Thread
by BlazersOrBust on Jul 11, 2010 6:04 PM PDT up reply actions
Technically we do have rights to him, in the form of an unguaranteed contract for Summer League
But effectively you’re right. Just wanted to note his actual contract status.
Blazers fan + Fan of Mills
Mills is a super talent – i hope for his sake he gets an offer from another team and we get to see him play more than 1 minute a game.
Almost a triple double (would have been if stayed out there) + 3.5:1 Assist:Turnover ratio (John Wall just went 1:1 [7/7])
Can’t wait for the World Champs to start so he can shine again against some proper talent
He doesn't look like a great fit to me though.
If he burns it up for another team it won’t surprise me. I just worry about PGs who can barely see over/around their man. At that point his versatility on offense is game-to-game.
He’s totally likable though. The Blazers could do a lot worse at backup PG.
I'm just not crazy about player nick names...
by Hipster Olympic Team! on Jul 11, 2010 7:21 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
can't see over?
His opponents are max 4 inches taller than him – managed to burn Paul/Kidd at the olympics just fine.
maximum - then he burns them with speed
would rather my PG was giving away 4 inches than any other position
this is a ridiculous argument
Mills stands at 6’0", the same as BE love childs Chris Paul and Darren Collison.
just because some players at the same size have extraordinary skills which enable them to compensate for their lack of height doesn’t mean it’s irrelevant. Paul Millsap is an incredible rebounder, which enables him to be a contributor at PF despite standing 6’8". Despite Millsap (and Boozer) succeeding, nobody goes around saying size isn’t an issue for 6’8" guy who projects as a PF. Same is the case for PG. Just because Paul has incredible distribution and shooting skills which enable him to compensate for being small doesn’t mean being under 6’0" isn’t cause for concern.
He managed to lose to Paul/Kidd at the olympics just fine.
by Nick Van Excellent on Jul 11, 2010 8:05 PM PDT up reply actions
I'm mostly just joking.
Mills did some good stuff in that game and some bad stuff too.
by Nick Van Excellent on Jul 11, 2010 10:50 PM PDT up reply actions
Ca't wait for the worlds
Given the reins of a team and showing what he can do on a global stage, his stocks will rise. Then Blazers can deal him to the highest bidder. Voila, everyone is happy.
I love Patty’s, he is a very talented baller. I hope he gets to play major minutes in a system that better suits his game.
this^
summer league is an audition for Mills, for another pro team (not necessarily NBA) If Patty was in Portland’s long term plans they wouldn’t have drafted Williams and Johnson
That won’t stop Kenny Vance from gushing about him, though
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
the Blazers don't have anything close to Mills' 3-point ability at PG
and Mills doesn’t have any major flaws. He measures equivalent to Paul and has a solid handle, excellent straight ahead speed, and a deadly jumper.
by blacknoiseNW on Jul 11, 2010 10:36 PM PDT up reply actions
I think Mills needs to take some 3 pointers in the NBA
Before you can say he’s a better shooter than Bayless. Bayless’ shooting is getting much better, and if I remember right, he was a better shooter in college.
Still on the Rex bandwagon.
by dan_the_man on Jul 11, 2010 10:53 PM PDT up reply actions
Bayless needs a little arc on his shot, and he might have something
in the meanwhile – Mills shot 50% in both D-League and in the NBA. He has legitimate NBA range.
by blacknoiseNW on Jul 11, 2010 11:50 PM PDT up reply actions
http://www.basketballprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=849
Per Pelton’s analysis (lots of sample size problems, etc), you would expect Patty’s 3 point % to drop 15% in the NBA, which would mean he would go from 50% to 42%. Given the sample size of only 42 shots, I don’t think it’s open and shut that the guy is an NBA level 3 pt shooter.
agreed
Mills’ is not a guaranteed NBA sniper. However, there is sufficient evidence to suggest that his strength is from beyond the arc. 42% would be pretty darn good, by modern standards – good enough for top 10 in the NBA.
by blacknoiseNW on Jul 12, 2010 12:17 AM PDT up reply actions
Mills has taken 4 3pt shots in the NBA
Again, I’ll wait on passing judgement until he has a decent sample size in the NBA. For the time being, saying he is a better shooter that Bayless right now is unfounded.
Still on the Rex bandwagon.
by dan_the_man on Jul 12, 2010 12:00 AM PDT up reply actions
are you saying that D-league 3-pointers are easier than NBA 3-pointers?
by blacknoiseNW on Jul 12, 2010 12:10 AM PDT up reply actions
my reply was meant more to point out that we have some data
albeit a relatively small sample size.
Of course, I also replied to dan_the_man before I read your link to Pelton’s article. 15% more difficult to be precise.
by blacknoiseNW on Jul 12, 2010 12:20 AM PDT up reply actions
perimeter defense
no one’s rotating out hard on shooters in Boise or Sioux falls
and the length vs athleticism of defenders isn’t in the same ballpark, either
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Yes, I'm saying D-league 3 pointers are easier than NBA 3 pointers
Defense is much better in the NBA. You’re much more likely to get an open shot and have more time to shoot in the D-league.
Still on the Rex bandwagon.
by dan_the_man on Jul 12, 2010 12:24 AM PDT up reply actions
MIlls has major flaws
if he didn’t he would’ve been drafted in the first round, last year
don’t denigrate CP3 by putting him in the same fanshot as Patty
Mills can shoot, and Nate’s looking for floor spreaders, that’s all I was saying. Bayless can also shoot (40% from behind the arc in March-April) while Patty was on the bench waving a towel
I think Mills is being showcased this week for a consolidation deal. The new Blazer GM will get an offer for Patty and flip him, and probably for something more valuable than a late 2nd round draft choice. That would result in Portland getting some value-added for one of their recently drafted assets
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
I'll stop comparing CP3 and Mills if you stop saying Mills is small
Mill’s size isn’t an issue – yet you try to make it one over and over.
by blacknoiseNW on Jul 11, 2010 11:48 PM PDT up reply actions
it is for Portland
and this is a Blazer’s website
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
It is a problem for us to have a 6ft point guard?
We have decent or great size at every position, so how is having a smaller third string PG a big issue – should be keep Armon who duplicates a number of Bayless strengths, gives you some D but is atrocious from the perimeter.
I would say not being able to hit a 3 is more of a problem for Portland than size – in that regard Patty>Dre, Bayless and Armon
"Money aint got no owners, only spenders"
- Omar Little on 2010 NBA Free Agency
Mills' size is a non-issue
we have a ton of data that shows Mills is average in size and comparable to more than one NBA starter in physical measurements. So, no – Mills size is not an issue for Portland.
by blacknoiseNW on Jul 12, 2010 7:46 AM PDT up reply actions
Two words backing this up: Damon Stoudamire
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
The Oregonian reported that we made a qualifying offer to Mills, so he is a restricted free agent unless they area wrong.
by BlazerFanSince1970 on Jul 11, 2010 7:13 PM PDT up reply actions
He's also listed as a restricted free agent by ESPN.
I think Mike Barrett was wrong today when he called him an unrestricted free agent about 5 times.
by BlazerFanSince1970 on Jul 11, 2010 7:15 PM PDT up reply actions
Utah has enough little guards already
Ronnie Price, Sunny Gaines
no need for Jazzy Patty
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
storyteller's got Patty with a 937k QO on his website
that’s an amount that could come in handy re: a consolidation deal
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
shavlik randolph was awesome for that one game.
batum was terrible during summer league.
just saying.
"There are a few teams you have to watch out for in the fourth quarter."
"Yeah, but Portland definitely is not one of them."
-New Orleans Hornets broadcasters at the end of the third quarter with the Hornets leading 74-59. Portland later ends up winning 97-89.
"They don't mind him shooting that shot at all. Rudy Fernandez is not that great of a 3pt shooter."
-New Orleans Hornets broadcasters right after a Rudy Fernandez missed 3pter. Rudy Fernandez finished the game with three 3pters on six attempts.
Shav's breakout game was during preseason
an untelevised game in Memphis, IIRC
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Dave's write-up did not give credit to Houston
They were 3-0 this year, and were 9-0 I think going to last SL.
In KP I trusted!
Caleb coached 'em up.
they looked like an actual team out there: unselfish, good D, nice sets, most everything in the flow of the offense.
It doesn’t mean a thing long term, but I like it.
Canales > Prunty
based on one SL game against a Houston team that had played it’s 3rd game in a row
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Caleb over Dean and Prunty any day of the week.
Treat people well because Karma can hit you at any second.
they call him coach K
it’s so cute
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
I see what you did there.
Can we make the use of that other guy’s name a ban worthy offense?
Nah… wouldn’t want to swell his ego anymore than it already is, his head might just explode.
by premthegrem on Jul 11, 2010 11:18 PM PDT up reply actions
Turns head to the left – cough
Romance me with that Roy rainbow shot which took flight from way beyond the arc and sailed so high that before it came back down to earth sealing the victory, it kissed the rafters and said "You're mine baby."
I thought Babbit looked fine.
He didn’t seem out of control other than those couple jumping “steve nash” type passes. Not really sure what was up with those.
He had an idea of what he wanted to do and tried to execute it, and it was against someone that got a decent amount of playing time in the NBA last year.
they are also known as "Jarret Jack" type passes
"its tough to play with one eye, unless you're a pirate." Delonte West
"una canasta a Pau en la cara" Rudy
by Honka Playboy on Jul 11, 2010 7:55 PM PDT up reply actions
Jarret Jack makes some downright bonehead plays on occassion
he was frustrating to watch when he was a Blazer…you love him one minute, bad turnover the next
Watching Jack try and navigate a fast break scared me
Treat people well because Karma can hit you at any second.
babbit looked okay, more than anybody i want to see
ibekwe the most on the blazers. mostly him and patty. i think personally. looking at that game. if that kind of game is consistently what we will get from pendy and ibekwe. that ibekwe should be kept, not pendy. love the kid. but hes a second year player and got dominated. patty had an all around great game. looked calmer and more organized.
I think Pendy's bulk makes a huge difference in real NBA games
he’s 240, Ibekwe is only 220…and Jeff will be asked to do much more in summer league than he will in a real game so it won’t always look pretty. That being said, Ibekwe was spectacular and this is definitely not intended to take anything away from him
He did look very very good...he blocked that blonde guy's shot at least twice.
But as other posters noted…Houston has no real Center so he didn’t have anyone BIG to really go against. The guy had great timing though!!!
yeah he said he wanted to look like he didn't belong in summer league
Like people would be saying, “what’s he doing in Vegas? He’s too good to be on the floor with these other chumps”
Sorry to break it to you Jeff, but you’re right at the level of your competence, this week
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Wow, I guess I saw a different game than most of you.
Babbitt – First professional game, made a majority of his shots, showed good body control, didn’t force anything, understood the game plan, and looked to have a high basketball IQ. He was drafted to be a shooter in the Chase Budinger mold with a slightly better prowess at rebounding and creating his own shot. I am not sure about the analysis of “not being able to create separation off the dribble.” I think the sample size for this analysis is much too small to make any meaningful observation. My take on Babbitt is this: If you are busting his balls after this first game, which I thought was decent, you might have an axe to grind.
Johnson – Armon is super quick and shows the ability to finish like Bayless, but with a better floater (to prevent the constant contact that enables Bayless to get to the line). Armon made some nice passes but forced a few and looked to be forcing the pace a bit much. Armon showed very active hands and played decent on the ball defense.
Mills – I thought Patty looked great. The guy almost got a triple double, he made some great passes, Didn’t turn the ball over a lot, didn’t force the offense, and showed a good understanding of the plan. In my opinion, Patty looks like he has put in tons of work this offseason and I hope it pays off. If I had to choose between Armon Johnson and Patty, at this point I would take Patty no doubt.
Pendergraph – Jeff looked like Jeff. I didn’t see tons of improvement other than slightly better footwork in the post. His mid-range game is nowhere close to being ready for prime time.
DC – Typical DC blue collar game. He looks to be in amazing shape and did all the small things necessary to ensure a spot on the roster again. As always, his mid-range game looked solid.
Ibekwe – Wake me up when/if he gets a roster spot. Good game, lets see what else you get us.
by swg777 on Jul 11, 2010 6:57 PM PDT reply actions 4 recs
Agreed
Patty dished 9 assists and hit a couple threes. I shot his shot selection was mostly better too.
Johnson made some nice defensive plays.
Babbit didn’t shoot well, but I doubt that will be a permanent problem. The one thing I noticed was he got good lift on the one catch and shoot he got curling off a pick at 15 feet. My guess is, he’ll take that role from Rudy/Webster rather than taking over the iso role from Trout. His D didn’t seem great to me, but Budinger is a pretty good challenge for a rookie in Summer League.
Patty was the reason this 1st summer game had a nice feel to it, and good movement.
A lot of Summer games look like the ball we play out in the street – not this one.
Romance me with that Roy rainbow shot which took flight from way beyond the arc and sailed so high that before it came back down to earth sealing the victory, it kissed the rafters and said "You're mine baby."
well it did if you were a Rocket's fan
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Touché
Romance me with that Roy rainbow shot which took flight from way beyond the arc and sailed so high that before it came back down to earth sealing the victory, it kissed the rafters and said "You're mine baby."
I guess disagreeing with you got my first post deleted.
but my beef isn’t with your opinion just your logic.
saying that we have to small of a sample size to criticize the play of a player for their mistakes and then praising that player for their abilities in the same small sample size doesn’t add up.
This is the game I saw as well
Patty was most impressive to me, followed by DC, Armon & Luke.
But Patty was just awesome. I’m not even sure what the knocks would be. I know it’s summer league, but he was a still a +20 to lead the team. DC’s energy was awesome, he was pressing almost every inbounds. He didn’t really seem to tire.
Agree
It would appear the only ones still rabbiting on about size/no shot/defence didn’t actually watch the game – he plays the 4th quarter he goes 20+/12/10
Such a shame...
that there’s not another opening for a guard! I liked what I saw in Armon, but Mills put up some good numbers out there. I only got to watch the second half, and thus missed most of Patty’s work, but from what I saw of Armon I think he’ll be the one in black and scarlet when the dust settles. It starts and ends with defense.
I really like the idea of a second unit with a strong defensive character. If the Blazers rock a Armon, Jerryd, Dante, Marcus and Joel bench, there won’t be many teams that will be able to put the hurt on us when the starters sit.
There exists a quality which is nameless.
It starts and ends with defense.
It should, but remember Nate is looking for shooters and Mills made a couple of 25 footers look easy
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
You can fix a bad shot,
but we can’t make Patty grow a few inches, and it’s tough to get any player involved defensively if it doesn’t come naturally to them.
There exists a quality which is nameless.
I agree
I was looking for one reason why Portland might consider keeping Mills
fixing bad shot mechanics takes time. You may never see Armon Johnson dropping in 25 footers with ease like Mills did today. Some guys have it, others don’t. If AJ wants to be an eventual backup PG for Portland, he’ll have to work on his 3-pt shot just like Bayless has been doing
Like I’ve said already, I don’t think Patty is playing for a place on the Blazer’s roster right now, he’s auditioning for another pro team—and not necessarily an NBA franchise. He could make a lot of money playing fewer games in Europe and much more easily find a style that suits his game. Like KP said the day Mills was drafted, he has a passport
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
healthy joel is still a huge ? mark. I think the Blazers may try to trade his expiring contract.
Also Joel was not good at catching the ball or shooting it last year BEFORE his injury (since his wrist injury..which I think was never correctly rehabbed..he was worse at both).
Was it just me, or did the blazers struggle to get defensive rebounds?
Seemed like pendy and ibekewe could have been more impressive in that regard.
by botanyjames on Jul 11, 2010 7:23 PM PDT via mobile reply actions
Looked that way for short periods
But according to Rice and Barret we dominated them on the boards . 20 more rebounds I think.
34 rbs for us, 25 for them. Just 7 ORBs for them
"its tough to play with one eye, unless you're a pirate." Delonte West
"una canasta a Pau en la cara" Rudy
by Honka Playboy on Jul 11, 2010 7:56 PM PDT up reply actions
I thought Babbitt needed a few minutes to shake off the jitters, then played pretty well until he got tired.
But, I wouldn’t bet $100 on anyone’s performance (pro or con) in the summer league. There’s just too many examples of players being bad in summer league and turning out good when playing in a more structured environment with and against better players (e.g. Batum), or visa-versa (e.g. Qyntel Woods). Lot’s of different reasons that both cases occur.
by BlazerFanSince1970 on Jul 11, 2010 7:41 PM PDT reply actions
I think
it says a great deal about a player if they can’t turn up for Summer League in shape + it is as good a gauge we can get of them being able to handle pressure at this stage.
Andre Miller hasn't turned up in shape for the start of the regular season for 11 years.
Don’t make too much of summer league. These guys haven’t been playing regularly for months.
by BlazerFanSince1970 on Jul 11, 2010 7:54 PM PDT up reply actions
If you are a prospect/borderline signing and you don't turn up in shape/ready to play...
…you don’t deserve your shot
but Babbitt's neither
the most difficult thing that every single NBA rookie talks about is adapting to the length of the season. They break down in March, because their body is telling them the season is over. Working out continuously after the end of the college season would just add to that level of fatigue at the end.
I strongly stress that Summer League just doesn't mean much, but
that said, Patty Mills looked more like a PG in that meaningless game than I’ve seen from Bayless in the last 2 years. Whether that could translate to the big show, against better players, who knows? But if he has 3 or 4 more games passing the ball like that he will certainly get another chance to show what he can do in fall camp.
by BlazerFanSince1970 on Jul 11, 2010 7:48 PM PDT reply actions
Pooh Jeter looked more like a PG than Jerryd last July, too
something usually gets lost in translation in the fall when you’re undersized
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
I really liked the way Mills looked
He seems like he knows how to run a team. Getting 9 dimes in a summer league game is not to bad. Im not understanding how he wouldnt fit well with this team?… he runs the break pretty good, and lets be honest, it would be nice to see the blazers do a little more running. He can spread the floor with his shot. I was pretty impressed by his deffense. He was in his opponents face all the way down the floor. It was only one SL game though… but i was supprisingly impressed by him. Small quicker pg can be effective in this league.. like aaron brooks. Im looking forward to watching him play some more.
"The difference between a democracy and a dictatorship is that in a democracy you vote first and take orders later; in a dictatorship you don't have to waste your time voting"
"I don't like jail, they got the wrong kind of bars in there"
Charles Bukowski
by jpaulson on Jul 11, 2010 7:52 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
the idea that Patty is a great deep shooter is a myth
he may be able to space the floor, but there is nothing in his track record that indicates he’s capable of doing so. He shot 40% from the floor in college and 34% from college 3. Jerryd shot 46% from the floor and 41% from college 3 vs. much higher-level competition.
Patty was 2-4 on three pointers last year.
Mills was 21-42 (50%) from 3-pt range in the D-League last year. Bayless shot 31.5%.
by BlazerFanSince1970 on Jul 11, 2010 8:08 PM PDT up reply actions
nba =/= d-league. The stats simply do not translate. Look at the leaders in 3 pt %: http://www.basketball-reference.com/nbdl/years/2010.html
Should we go grab one of those guys?
Oh, he shot 34% in college and that proves how well he would do in the NBA, but
then he works on his shot and shoots 21-42 in D-League, and 2-4 in his short NBA minutes and those “stats simply do not translate”? Thanks for that information.
by BlazerFanSince1970 on Jul 11, 2010 8:31 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Reggie Williams
seems to have made the transition pretty well. Statistics aren’t the complete story, it takes a set of eyes as well, which is why most people are able to conclude that Patty is a better shooter than Bayless.
shooting is not Mills' weakness
size and strength are. He’s a quick and willing defender, but he simply can’t keep penetrators out of the lane, and NBA PGs will post him up if he’s left out on the floor very long
that, and he can’t finish in traffic against NBA-caliber big men and doesn’t draw fouls particularly well
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
having played in a few real games
I have to say, I expected a lot more from pendy and DC… I liked DC’s energy though.
"The difference between a democracy and a dictatorship is that in a democracy you vote first and take orders later; in a dictatorship you don't have to waste your time voting"
"I don't like jail, they got the wrong kind of bars in there"
Charles Bukowski
correct - stress on second syllables
"its tough to play with one eye, unless you're a pirate." Delonte West
"una canasta a Pau en la cara" Rudy
by Honka Playboy on Jul 11, 2010 8:51 PM PDT up reply actions
just call him EI
as in E I E I Oh!
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Babbitt has a hard time creating separation against non-Wichita State players
Assuming he is a good shooter in the NBA (and from the NBA 3) and becomes serviceable on defense, it might have been worth the trade still. I think the latter is going to be the problem. And let’s not bring up Matthews as some sort of equalizer if Babbitt turns out to be a bust (no judgment yet from me). Matthews is not a better value than Webster. Longer contract, more money, and more uncertainty with a reduction of minutes due his way if he comes over.
by thelance on Jul 11, 2010 8:13 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
uncertainty with a reduction of minutes due his way if he comes over.
Matthews received 25 mpg with Utah, there’s no way the Blazers are paying him more to play less this year
he has a little competition from Bayless at the backup 2 and Cunningham at the backup 3, but when you’re the targeted FA with the “big” contract you’ve got a target on your back and Wes will get every opportunity to earn his money, if he doesn’t wind up back in Utah
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
I wouldn't put it past Nate to do a timeshare
We could have said the same thing about Rudy when we got him.
Why would we buy his rights, lure him here from Spain and only play him 24 minutes/game?
"In fact you might say that Ugly is the Blazers' secret weapon this year."
-Dave
As for the Blazers...They are officially the NBA equivalent of a movie serial killer
-basketbawful
they wanted Rudy to stand in the corner and shoot 3s and he balked at being asked to do only that almost from day 1
and when they found out how poor a defender Fernandez was, there was only so many minutes they could play him and keep winning games
the potential benefit of Matthews is that he would guard the SFs when he and Roy are in the game. With Rudy in there, Brandon had to swing to the 3, he got beat up and didn’t like it
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
you're moving ahead of my point
Why would we make that big offer to Matthews and not play him ~30 minutes a game?
Why would we buy Rudy’s rights, convince him to leave Spain and not play him ~30 minutes a game?
There are plenty of reasons why Rudy got lower minutes than he and his fans would like and there are plenty of reasons the same thing could happen to Matthews.
"In fact you might say that Ugly is the Blazers' secret weapon this year."
-Dave
As for the Blazers...They are officially the NBA equivalent of a movie serial killer
-basketbawful
they are much different players
Matthews can contribute without scoring and Nate would love having him on the court…if Rudy wasn’t scoring what was he doing for you?
by sammymohawk on Jul 11, 2010 11:27 PM PDT up reply actions
looking sexy
Nate likes timeshares. We have Roy, Batum, Bayless, Rudy and Babbitt to take minutes.
Matthews has different flaws. In two years we could easily be saying, “it’s obvious why Matthews is only getting 24 minutes/game.”
It’s not a given that Matthews will get ~30 minutes a game.
"In fact you might say that Ugly is the Blazers' secret weapon this year."
-Dave
As for the Blazers...They are officially the NBA equivalent of a movie serial killer
-basketbawful
Chad was talking about Matthews, tonight before the game
he said he’s the perfect player for Nate’s system and they see him playing a significant role, if Utah doesn’t match
I noticed that you like to use the term “timeshares” Perhaps you’re trying to get out of one, or are you doing the presentations and asking folks for a buddy list? Matthews has a key rotation spot waiting for him, not a shared condo at SF with Babbitt and Cunningham, if Wes comes through the locker room door, then they’ll just have to wait until it’s their weekend
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
that's standard "sports talk" for any potential signing.
We still haven’t traded Rudy. We still will use Bayless at SG in short stretches. We have a draft pick who will poach a few minutes. Nate is a coach who uses timeshares as we’ve seen with Rudy, Martell and Batum as well as Miller, Blake, Bayless and Blake, Jack, Sergio and Blake, Sergio, Bayless.
And Dante isn’t a small forward
"In fact you might say that Ugly is the Blazers' secret weapon this year."
-Dave
As for the Blazers...They are officially the NBA equivalent of a movie serial killer
-basketbawful
Wes Matthews can play the 3 in the high-low zone offense, but certainly not the 2.
Wow, this organization is run by nimrods — including both Chad Buchanan and Nate McMillan, amongst the rest of these supposed basketball operations gurus — which makes me shake my head in chagrin, as well as laugh at their utter idiocy.
Heck, there’s times wherein I wonder whether or not McMillan even comprehends his own coaching philosophy. The guy just seems like, well, a simpleton. Cripes, the guy comes off as a dunce in interviews and, moreover, I laugh whenever he tells his guys to “push the ball” in spite of being a down-tempo coach.
Truth be told, I think McMillan is a slow, simple person. Alas, that’s life for some folks.
Agree with the Nate comments. Nate is a simplteton.
Heck, there’s times wherein I wonder whether or not McMillan even comprehends his own coaching philosophy.
Couldn’t have said it better myself.
Being a Blazer fan is not exactly healthy.
I don't think Nate is slow at all...
His preferred overly cautions offensive style, which equates a turnover with 10 missed shots in his brain — THAT’S slow…
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Wow, serious over the top Nate Hate
It’s crazy that some on this blog can take a topic about a summer league game that Nate didn’t even coach in and turn it into a scorching critique of Nate. Talk about an ax to grind. Plus calling him a simpleton or a slow, simple person crosses a line in my opinion. Criticize his coaching all you want but name calling just make things seem mean spirited and a little childish.
JRogero
because of Roy
As I’ve been saying for 2 years, Brandon and Rudy play the same position, and need to be defending SGs. Roy is an all-star, and so to accomodate Fernandez, Nate played Roy a lot at “SF” but it wound up wearing down Brandon and didn’t satisfy Rudy. I strongly suggested that Fernandez be traded last summer, because I saw a train wreck coming, but various Bedgers were telling me that I was nuts, because there was nothing wrong with Fernandez’ role and everything would be just fine, for the duration of his contract. How do you like me, now?
Don’t compare Matthews to Fernandez, their impact on Portland’s 2-3 wing rotation would be the exact opposite, especially where Brandon is concerned
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
I thought you were nuts.
But Rudy was supposed to get better, not all pouty and disappear when given his big chance. So what I’m saying is that if I had been right, I would have been right.
"[S]ince men enjoyed very great leisure, they used it to pursue many kinds of commodities unknown to their fathers, and that was that first yoke they placed upon themselves without thinking about it, and the first source of evils the prepared for their descendants. For, besides continuing thus to soften body and mind, as these commodities had lost almost all their pleasantness through habit, and as they had at the same time degenerated into true needs, being deprived of them became much more cruel than possessing them was sweet; and people were unhappy to lose them without being happy to have them." -Jean-Jacques Rousseau
plus, Brandon and Rudy made it work pretty dang well the year before
it was always going to be an awkward setup, Rudy backing up our best player, but stranger combinations have worked.
"In fact you might say that Ugly is the Blazers' secret weapon this year."
-Dave
As for the Blazers...They are officially the NBA equivalent of a movie serial killer
-basketbawful
I'd say you saw the same thing a lot of other people saw and you shouldn't dislocate your arm patting yourself on the back
Matthews isn’t guaranteed ~30 minutes/game. Nate couldn’t even play Batum that much. Nate couldn’t figure out to play Miller over Blake. We traded up for Bayless and he got stuck on the end of the bench until the trade deadline this season (save injury time).
There are lots of reasons to think Matthews won’t automatically get 30/game before we even get to flaws in his game or a poor fit in our system.
"In fact you might say that Ugly is the Blazers' secret weapon this year."
-Dave
As for the Blazers...They are officially the NBA equivalent of a movie serial killer
-basketbawful
now you're rewriting history
I can assure you I was out on a limb all by myself by suggesting that Fernandez be dealt last offseason, I said “flip him before he starts complaining about his PT and demanding a trade. because as soon as he starts making noise about being unhappy his trade value would circle the drain” and that’s right where we are re: Fernandez, this summer
If other people saw “that” they were sure keeping it to themselves. I take it back, Kenny Vance saw it, too. But he’s been marginalized by a majority of Bedgers
I’m not guaranteeing Matthews 30+ mpg, the original take I responded to (thelance, not you) is that Wes would get less in Portland than he did with the Jazz (25mpg) That almost certainly won’t happen, unless he’s hurt
25-30 mpg seems about right. I want Roy and Batum playing around 35, that leaves 26 for Matthews at the 2-3. Nic and Brandon will probably miss a few games along the way, then Wes will start at the 2-3 and bump his PT up
OTOH, I don’t even want to contemplate who will replace Brandon or Nic in the starting lineup if Matthews is not acquired. Bayless? Babbitt? Cunningham? None of those options are satisfactory. (if you choose Bayless, then who backs up Jerryd—a rookie like Williams?)
Portland needs a backup wing like Wes, badly. I would’ve targeted Mike Miller or Raja Bell first but the front office thinks Matthews is a better option for the roster, so I can live with that and not complain about it too much.
The full MLE is just the price of doing business, you’re not going to pry a RFA away by paying him 3-4 mil/year, and the Blazers must feel that Wes is signifcantly better than Roger Mason, or they would’ve made the former Spurs wing a lower offer, instead
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Yeah, I never saw anyone advocating trading Rudy before the 09-10 season
You were the only one. /sarcasm
Shoot man, I suggested trades that included Rudy last season knowing that A) He plays the same position as our best player B) can’t play any other position effectively C) Has/had value around the league D) is on a cheap contract
You’re right, it does take money to pry away a RFA, but we should pick a better guy to target with that kind of money or not use it at all. It’s the Pistons mentality on a smaller scale. We better over pay this marginal talent lest we get nothing at all. Sometimes nothing or a minimum contract is the smarter move.
Random unfounded hypothesis that just popped into my head:
Whoever is in charge right now is desperately trying to make a splash as a way of justifying the KP firing. “We can do good things without him.”
"In fact you might say that Ugly is the Blazers' secret weapon this year."
-Dave
As for the Blazers...They are officially the NBA equivalent of a movie serial killer
-basketbawful
Allen, please trade Patty
Both you and I are fanboys of the Aussie but we both know he’s never gong to get a shot on Nate’s team. Nobody on Team USA could guard him several seasons ago and in this game he’s shown a much improved shooting and passing. Yet rather than exploit his strengths PDXs focus has been and will always be his lack of size on D.
If you’re not going to use him, trade him to a team that will. I’m sure Spurs assistant and Australian national coach Brett Brown would love to see him in San Antonio.
Why toy with the man, you knew he’d never steal minutes from Miller, Roy and Bayless, and now he’s competing for garbage time with Armon Johnson and Elliot Williams?
can't trade a guy that isn't on your team
"..cocaine is a classy drug meant for men of finer tastes like Sr. Rudolfo Fernandez."
-AK1984
yeah
still isnt on our team
Michael Jordan is the Nicolas Batum of America
marty>babbitt
by thomasikehara on Jul 11, 2010 8:32 PM PDT up reply actions
The Mikes went on at length about how pretty much anybody could sign Patty after summer league.
"..cocaine is a classy drug meant for men of finer tastes like Sr. Rudolfo Fernandez."
-AK1984
but we can match
I feel a toxic offer coming from the Jazz!
"its tough to play with one eye, unless you're a pirate." Delonte West
"una canasta a Pau en la cara" Rudy
by Honka Playboy on Jul 11, 2010 8:34 PM PDT up reply actions
yeah, weren't they saying UFA
Romance me with that Roy rainbow shot which took flight from way beyond the arc and sailed so high that before it came back down to earth sealing the victory, it kissed the rafters and said "You're mine baby."
Trouble with MIlls
is that he can’t really guard anybody either.
True
But there is a place for waterbug point guards in the modern NBA. Barbosa and Brooks don’t make their living specialising in D, and dare I say neither do CP3 and Nash.
I think Patty gives us a look that we don’t already have. Why have Bayless and 2 more Bayless clones (Williams, Johnson)?
cp3 is a great defender
he has been on the all defense team twice
Michael Jordan is the Nicolas Batum of America
marty>babbitt
by thomasikehara on Jul 11, 2010 8:44 PM PDT up reply actions
Yup.
There’s a reason that Deron Williams has owned CP3 in most of their head to head matchups.
I’m sure Spurs assistant and Australian national coach Brett Brown would love to see him in San Antonio.
If the Spurs really wanted Mills why didn’t they draft him 12+ months ago?
They drafted Blair 37, and some SG named Jack McClinton #51 (and he’s not even on their roster, anymore)
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
that's a poor argument.
Why did the Blazers let Matthews go undrafted last year and now throw a +$30 million deal at him? Just because a player didn’t look attractive to a team before doesn’t mean he wouldn’t later.
Watching the replay,
and that first half was great. They looked like a team!
Dante got his hands on everything! He has certainly earned a rotation spot. Throughout the season and indeed today, DC has shown an intensity that will make life difficult for the other team every minute he plays.
Patty is definitely in “game shape”.
Armon looks big out there! Maybe it’s the scale, but his size is going to be a huge advantage at the PG position. If he can pick up some of Andre’s back-to-the-basket game, he’s gonna knock some teeth out.
Babbitt might do better than I first thought. I think he’s overcompensating right now; maybe expecting more defense than is really there. I bet when he gets to the NBA there will be some nerve issues, but it’ll iron out. I don’t know which aspects of his game will translate, but I think he’ll be okay.
There exists a quality which is nameless.
Johnson=Miller
Johnson reminds of Miller when Portland gave up $2 million to get him it told me someone in the Blazers front office/coaching staff likes Miller and got his understudy.
I don't know about Miller ...
But I can see a little bit of Greg Anthony in him … but he’s got a ways to go.
without the post game
and a lot more athleticism
by Kaanyr Vhok on Jul 11, 2010 11:17 PM PDT up reply actions
I'm just saying....
If the Blazers happen to trade joel or andre’s expiring contract along with Rudy…. I think they should sign Ibekwe. I like him.
Go to Heaven for the climate, Hell for the company.
If roster spots open up due to a consolidation trade
I would not be opposed to that…but hopefully we would never have to count on him for any substantive contributions
Johnson v. MIlls
Nate seems to favor larger more Nate-like guards over smaller quicker more Payton-like guards. So, if Nate is the one to decide, I imagine Johnson will be the choice. They both looked really good to me, in different ways, with Mills being considerably more developed.
Payton was big
Payton was listed as 6’4, Mcmillan is 6’5, but Payton was not a waterbug Patty Mills type and I don’t remember Payton’s defense being a concern his nickname was “the glove” and he didn’t get that nickname cause he could smell it.
by Biph on Jul 11, 2010 9:01 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
yeah
the glove was definitely not an undersized offensive minded point
Michael Jordan is the Nicolas Batum of America
marty>babbitt
by thomasikehara on Jul 11, 2010 9:25 PM PDT up reply actions
Payton was 6'4" with extremely long arms and was as quick as anyone.
When he started out at Oregon State he wasn’t that great a shooter, but he steadily improved
ignacio
+1 for Spinal Tap reference
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Payton "smaller, quicker?"
I don’t remember that at all, he was a physical point guard who would back a guy down and was probably the best defensive point of his generation (maybe ever?). Mills is like a slightly taller version of Damon, though not as ball dominant and not as explosive. And I think Armon could be a Greg Anthony mkII (with time).
Gary could not make a jump shot to save his life coming out of OSU
but he worked at it and became decent after a few years in the NBA
but there are very few PGs who should ever be mentioned in the same sentence as Payton
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
They only guy I have ever seen who could do a one man double team
by southern oregon on Jul 11, 2010 11:07 PM PDT up reply actions
Gary Payton in five words: Great defender. Decent shooter. Jackass.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Good night!
it was a lot of fun to watch a basketball game I actually cared about. And thanks to you all for blabbing with me tonight
My local bar that has the NBA channel greeted me with mixed emotions. They like customers, especially in the post WC lull but don’t fully appreciate my enthusiasm. I facepainted a little pinwheel on my cheek
"its tough to play with one eye, unless you're a pirate." Delonte West
"una canasta a Pau en la cara" Rudy
You go, Honka Playboy, you go.
Don’t let ’em kill yer spirit.
There exists a quality which is nameless.
Face paint to go to a bar to watch a Summer League game?!?!
That’s gotta get some kind of Extreme Dedication award…
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
I liked what I saw from Babbitt. He seemed like he knew what play needed to happen. High Basketball IQ.
I even saw him lead the break once. Good passer, and I loved how he knows how to draw the defender out with his 3 point threat and then take it hard to the rim.
I think once he gets into better shape his shortcomings on D and creating separation will not be as glaring.
"What people need to know is that those pictures were taken a year and a half ago, and I've grown since then." - Greg Oden
I loved how he knows how to draw the defender out with his 3 point threat and then take it hard to the rim.
Very much like a young Chris Mullin. Taking it hard to the rim? More like in slow motion
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Patty and Dante looked pretty good
KP may have hit another home run on his way out the door, Armon and Luke both look like they know what they are doing on the court
by southern oregon on Jul 11, 2010 9:29 PM PDT reply actions
KP may have hit another home run on his way out the door
How about giving Mike and Chad some props, for a change of pace?
(Did KP “hit a HR” with Claver and Pendergraph too? They were drafted before Dante, after all)
All of the credit, none of the blame. KP is the teflon man even after he’s gone
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
find a middle ground
show some objectivity re: KP, that’s all I ask of anyone if they want to be taken seriously
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
How often do we congratulate assistant coaches for their work?
No GM nails 100% of their draft picks. Aside from awful busts there’s no point in highlighting a miss on a draft pick. Most of them don’t pan out. Besides, it’s not necessary to point out a person’s mistakes every time you bring up a success.
"In fact you might say that Ugly is the Blazers' secret weapon this year."
-Dave
As for the Blazers...They are officially the NBA equivalent of a movie serial killer
-basketbawful
as you well know
all we’ve been hearing for the past 4 years is how KP has been hitting HRs on draft day.
He’s had a few, like Batum. But now he’s gone and he’s still receiving all the credit?
If it seems like I’m being hard on Kevin, I’m not. I wouldn’t even say anything if I didn’t think there was a serious BE bias in KP’s direction and that the ledger needs to be kept balanced for objectivity’s sake. Like Dave said, we’re supposed to be better than that, we’re not just shallow Blazer fans around here who buy into everything the media is selling, right?
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
home run is a bit much when it's used on every good move
but he did good work on draft days. The worst thing one can say about KP is that he doesn’t have 20/20 hindsight while drafting.
"In fact you might say that Ugly is the Blazers' secret weapon this year."
-Dave
As for the Blazers...They are officially the NBA equivalent of a movie serial killer
-basketbawful
oh, there are worst things
but don’t take my word for it. If KP wasn’t culpable he’d still be employed
unless you believe it was all Paul’s fault, and A-Woj made everything up about agents and GMs being tired of listening to Pritchard’s bravado before, during and after deals
The truth is in the middle, and that’s where I try to keep the ball, between the lines
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Yep, he did things so awful that we can't get a clear picture of why he was fired
Arrogant GM? Better fire him in the most awkward way possible while disregarding his abilities and our ability to hire a comparable replacement.
"In fact you might say that Ugly is the Blazers' secret weapon this year."
-Dave
As for the Blazers...They are officially the NBA equivalent of a movie serial killer
-basketbawful
as an experienced starter having experience in the nba i can tell you that...
dante going to use that experience to tear it up tuesday
i didn;t know you played in the the NBA
What number were you, Capt. Fruit?
Treat people well because Karma can hit you at any second.
Patty is taller than all these guys:
Chucky Atkins, Denver
5’11"
Speedy Claxton, Atlanta
5’11"
Mike Conley, Memphis
5’11"
T.J. Ford
5’11"
Darrick Martin, Toronto
5’11"
Aaron Brooks, Houston
5’10"
Brevin Knight, L.A. Clippers
5’10"
Damon Stoudamire, Memphis
5’10"
Mike Wilks, Denver
5’10"
Nate Robinson, New York
5’9"
none of them play defense
"In fact you might say that Ugly is the Blazers' secret weapon this year."
-Dave
As for the Blazers...They are officially the NBA equivalent of a movie serial killer
-basketbawful
3rd string point guards need to have a specific strength
if they had an all-around game – they wouldn’t be 3-rd string point guards. Besides – a point guards most important skill is being a moving obstacle that stays in front of his counterpart. Mills has the physical ability to do that.
by blacknoiseNW on Jul 11, 2010 10:53 PM PDT up reply actions
well, if you've only got him pegged as a 3rd string guy that's fine
"In fact you might say that Ugly is the Blazers' secret weapon this year."
-Dave
As for the Blazers...They are officially the NBA equivalent of a movie serial killer
-basketbawful
I got no problem or argument if someone thinks Patty is a 3rd string, 13th man type player either
I really don’t think he’ll be much more. He’s not a very good passer (yes, 9 assists, most in transition), not a very good penetrater/finisher for how quick he is, he is super tiny (yes, height/size isn’t everything, but it’s important) and not very skilled aside from seeming like a good shooter.
I think if he wasn’t Australian, he wouldn’t be drafted. He’s an exotique. I am not optimistic about his chances to be a good player.
But 3rd string? Sure, if he shows he can shoot in the NBA and be decent. 3rd string isn’t an outrageous prediction, and once you’re drafted and in the NBA that isn’t a longshot prediction to fulfill. For some guys, once you’re in, you’re IN.
What he did tonight in the game will transfer less than what Armon Johnson did, if one asks me (and no one did or ever will).
Morty
#52
Patty could be about 9th man on the Lakers. I haven't done the math yet, but he'd get time there.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Not a good passer?
Did you see yesterday’s game? The guy was passing no-look bullets hitting guys perfectly in stride – knock his size, knock his post-up defence, but the footage shows he most definitely can pass (as well as elite speed and a well above average NBA range 3)
I think they were normal transition passes anyone else could make in that situation.
Yes, I did, indeed, watch, the, game.
M,o,r,t,i,m,e,r
#52
I had the same impression.
take away the full court stuff and I only saw about 4 half-court assists. Not terrible, but not exactly convincing.
w0rd
He had a good game, and 9 assists SOUNDS and looks great, but how the assists came matters… and who they came against.
Nuthin’ against his game, he played well. But it wasn’t THAT good; it was fine.
M—
#52
Patty also didn't show much quickness in the halfcourt
He didn’t seem able to use his quickness to get past his defender in the halfcourt. That HAS to be a big part of his game as a NBA small PG.
Unless we’re just talking 3rd string, like some here are. Then, he just has to fill a niche.
—M
#52
Here's the funny thing
I know Armon’s boxscore didn’t really show it, but he got to where ever he wanted to get on the court (mostly) and delivered some really nice passes on dribble drives and in pick and roll situations … trouble is the recipient failed to convert the pass.
He’s no pure pont guard, but he was much better than I expected.
I was impressed with his ball-control and passing
I felt it was better than Bayless during his first summer league, and even his second summer run.
It was one game, but I am intrigued by him as a backup who needs to learn to shoot and harness the athleticism to be more than a backup.
-M-
#52
Bayless really lit up SL his first go around.
We were all thinking he walks on water after that. Some people (including myself) were speculating that he might be pan out as a better nba player than D-Rose. Textbook example of the Belinelli Skew.
He did do things that translated to his NBA game thus far, though
He got to the line a LOT in summer league and scored efficiently, which he has done in the NBA quite well.
He didn’t really show a good passing game, just that he was WILLING to pass, or above-average court vision. The Bayless Theory is founded on the principle of him being able to defend the PG while playing off the ball on offense, so we weren’t too worried about him not looking like a fo-real playmaker.
While I agree he isn’t a great playmaker, his assist percentage last year was decent for a guy who gets called a ballhog a lot. Not great, but not bad.
I just felt Armon had a better feel for making plays for others than Bayless did, but Bayless was more gifted for steaming head first to the rim and finishing or getting to the line. After one game it’s hard to say what Armon will be, but I did think he looked more like an actual ‘PG’ than I expected.
Mo—
#52
Wait and see
There won’t be any definitive results after summer league but we might get a tease. The real battle between Mills and Armon will come in training camp (unless Rudy, Miller and Bayless all get moved in some blockbuster for a starting point).
Mills was passing like Pooh Jeter was, last year
it’s summer league, where the lack of defense can make guards look impressive
Mike D’Antoni said it today. Vegas is where you come to see how the rookies look playing their first pro games. What you feel about a player that you see in July is very often much different than how you feel about him in December
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
the thing about Patty that everyone forgets
is that if he hadn’t broken his foot 12 months ago, the Blazers planned to have him play overseas last season (“he has a passport” —KP)
So Mills’ has been on borrowed time since last October, as a member of the Blazer’s 15 man roster
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
If y'all recall correctly, I'm the main guy who kept yapping Patty Mills would force his ...
way on the roster — as he had to be tendered a one-year, non-guaranteed minimum-level contract for the Portland Trail Blazers to retain his draft rights — since the little guy showed no indication of wanting to play overseas.
“Patty Mills can force his way onto the 20-man training camp roster, because to retain his draft … rights the Portland Trail Blazers must tender him a one-year, minimum-level contract — albeit with a non-guaranteed salary — thus, if he doesn’t want to play in Europe, he can force the organization to ultimately put him on the 15-man roster come opening night (i.e., unlikely) or waive him and thereby make the Aussie a free-agent (i.e., likely).”
http://www.blazersedge.com/2009/10/1/1065531/blazers-training-camp-day-3-report#22133115
I got one thing wrong, though, which was my expectation that Mills would subsequently get waived. It seems I didn’t take into account the idiocy of Paul Allen when it comes to meddling with personnel decisions best left to the basketball operations department.
Patty had a dream to play in the NBA last summer
probably because living in Santa Clara was better than anything he had experienced elsewhere? As much as the broken foot set his development back 6 months, it couldn’t have come at a better time for his NBA career. He got to be on an NBA roster, and work out with the team all spring. Frandly, I don’t see what Nate or the scouts are seeing from Patty now that they haven’t already seen during team practices. but they’re doing Mills a favor by getting the rest of the NBA execs a good look at him this week
My joke (a few months back) was that Koponen broke his foot too early this year. If Petteri could’ve just waited a little while longer and come over to summer league and broken it then, then he and his agent could’ve parlayed it into a place on the Blazers 15 man roster this coming season!
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
you need to list weight as well as height
Nate Robinson is built like a fire hydrant and can use his strength to defend NBA guards who will just shoulder Patty right out of their way
Armon Johnson and Jerryd Bayless both have superior lower body strength, as well
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
can we stop talking would?
Paul/Kidd had their chance at the olympics to do that…they didn’t…Curry had the chance to do it in college…again…didn’t…
Why would Paul and Kidd go out of their way to pick on Patty when he’s probably the third best player on the team?
So you think Mills will be just fine as an NBA defender?
And yet, the Blazers signed Travis Deiner after they traded Blake, and then drafted Williams and Johnson this June. (not to mention Nate and KP were none too pleased when Paul insisted that Patty be placed on the 15 man roster, last October)
Mills may get a chance to show his stuff in the NBA for some other team, and then you can come back and tell me “Look, see! He isn’t getting posted up and abused by other NBA PGs…toldja so!”
And I’ll keep my focus on the Blazers and only pay attention to Patty if/when he’s a Blazer opponent
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
it's safe to say you are overstating the post up issue
PG’s aren’t measured on their post defense. CP3 is no bigger than Mills (height or weight) and can’t defend anyone in the post, either. However, the number of point guards that can post up effectively is very small – and even when you have one of the best post up guards against one of the worst – team defense trumps.
Look no further than the Phoenix series for the rebuttal…
by blacknoiseNW on Jul 11, 2010 11:44 PM PDT up reply actions
the Sun's series
the Blazers could and did post up Nash during the regular season, but in the playoffs Roy was hurt/ineffective and Gentry took advantage by playing Hill on Andre and sending help whenever Miller tried to penetrate. Batum was unable to make Phoenix pay for defending him with Nash
You can’t count on that strategy working in every series, because most NBA teams have SFs who can make PGs pay, down low
Besides, if Mills had Steve’s ability, he wouldn’t have slipped to 55 in the draft, and some NBA coach would be willing to live with the defensive mismatch because Patty would be performing like Nash in regular season games, instead of dropping 13-9-7 in Vegas
CP3 is considered across the league as a strong defensive PG, no one (except you, apparently) is making the same care re: Mills
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
you are making an incorrect assumption (Mills size is an issue)
and compounding it with an irrelevant argument that we need a post-up defender at the back-up point guard position. It’s a silly position.
by blacknoiseNW on Jul 12, 2010 7:49 AM PDT up reply actions
Actually lack of ideal size is an issue
It’s not because of post defense (though that can be an issue), it’s not because they can’t shoot over a taller defender, and it’s got nothing to do with staying in front of their man. But when a shorter point guard (with a less than ideal wingspan) is covering another point guard that guard is better able to see targets and is better able distribute the ball without fear of tips or steals.
I don’t know who the answer is at point, but you can’t disregard Mills size.
defense is also a big time issue
especially with this team that is so deficient in perimeter defense.
you don't need a post-up defender at PG
you need a player who won’t be expoited by NBA coaches and more-physical guards and who will constantly require help from his team’s defense
there’s a difference
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
haha...nice
Nate Robinson is built like a fire hydrant
by sammymohawk on Jul 11, 2010 11:31 PM PDT up reply actions
or bowling ball
I’m just saying, if you’re short at least be buff. If you’re neither you generally won’t last long in the NBA. There a are a few exceptions, but it’s a bad percentage play to draft 20 of them to find the one who can actually stick
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Patty Mills measurements compare well to CP3
He has the speed and lateral quickness to overcome his measurements just like CP3 has.
He has nowhere near the talent or ceiling of a Chris Paul obviously but he is not problematically undersized.
"Money aint got no owners, only spenders"
- Omar Little on 2010 NBA Free Agency
With that size
He has to be super skilled to get by. I don’t know if he has that sort of skill.
Guys can make it with his size, but the margin for error gets slim and he needs to compensate with great court vision, great shooting, ability to finish inside somehow, savvy, etc. He can’t be average AND small for the position.
—M
#52
Don't know if I agree
He has superior speed, can hit an NBA three with decent consistency and has better court vision than we saw last year for sure.
Watching some of his international games where he is primary playmaker (unlike in PDX) but doesn’t have to be the go to scorer (like at St. Marys) was revealing to me. I think he has the ability to be a solid backup point guard in the NBA while Aaron Brooks would be his ceiling. While that may seem like a lazy comparison I think it could prove accurate if Patty improves his ability to finish at the rim.
"Money aint got no owners, only spenders"
- Omar Little on 2010 NBA Free Agency
I am, admittedly, not high on Patty Mills
But I’ll be happy if he does prove to be a nice backup. I’m more than willing to be proven wrong by his play, if he’s still on the roster.
M—
#52
I think he is a small SG who suffers from a lot of the same problems as BayBayBoyToy
But without elite athleticism, and even smaller.
I think his combo of size, average skills, and SG type game, will mean he doesn’t have a good role in the NBA. BUT only time will tell, and I will only poo-poo someone’s believe in Patty if they think that he had shown from his college career that he was more of a PG than Bayless— I don’t believe he ever showed that.
While I think he was drafted because he’s an exotique, the same exotiqueness makes him more valuable to other teams and fanbases than he otherwise would maybe be just based on his actual game and stats. So it could work in our favour either way— either he’s good and we keep him, or his exotiqueness makes him tradeable.
It’s a low risk player to keep around and see what happens.
Mortimer
#52
Patty in college was simply the go-to scorer
He was no PG thats for sure plus his percentages stunk due to the awful shots he often took. Difference for me is that I don’t believe that is what he is as a player – rather I look to his success in a dual scoring/distributing role for the Boomers in international play during and since the Olympics. I think and hope that will translate, we will know after this season – either the Blazers of another NBA team are gonna give him a chance if he keeps playing well in SL.
There is one thing we can agree on though – we both hope you’re wrong.
"Money aint got no owners, only spenders"
- Omar Little on 2010 NBA Free Agency
I think he was drafted because he’s an exotique
Mills was drafted because Paul Allen likes quick PGs, KP admitted this much diring an interview last year
and Patty was kept on the 15 man roster last October because of Paul, as well
any pro team will be able to sign PM after Vegas is over—will that be Portland? Only Allen knows the answer to that question
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Pretty sure Mike Conley is not 5'11".
He’s 6’1" in shoes.
Funny… I’ve been thinking he was actually closer to 6’3". Guess not.
Being a Blazer fan is not exactly healthy.
true
would be extremely difficult to guard a lot of 6’3 pg’s. He isn’t going to be in nate’s rotation much with d
height and weight
both are important, Nate likes players who can fight through screens. McMillian didn’t think Babbitt did this well yesterday, and skinny Sergio was woeful at it—that’s why he’s gone
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
It's size (length and bulk) and attitude
If you lack the physical tools it’s tough to make up for that with just effort (Nate Robinson), and if you don’t have the effort it doesn’t matter how much length and size you have (Sergio).
Will be interesting...
…to see if Mills sitting the 4th quarter will cost him the Summer League MVP title – certainly cost him a triple double today.
Initial impresions
I’ve watched the game just about twice now and I thought Babbitt played fairly well. He was often placing himelf in position for an open shot, but didn’t always get the ball thrown his way – Johnson however, after years of playing with him, kind of knew where to look for him. I think Babbitt has pretty good court awareness, passed the ball well. He will likely be more of a spot up shooter, but isn’t afraid to take it inside.
If it comes down to having to chose between Patty and Johnson the defense might win out – Johnson being the better defender, but Patty would be hard to let go/not resign.
Mills an RFA?
Bad news for Mills if true. He could be a backup point guard on a mediocre team, or he could be a “no-play” 14th or 15th man on the Blazer roster. If he’s an RFA then he doesn’t get to choose.
Wow
That is an exciting bunch of young, smart, energetic, enthusiastic, unselfish players.
Not being able to handle a hangover will lead to a level of maturity.
Wheels to Jason Quick
Babbit can't get his own. He will need a system to excel
Can Nate provide that system?
by LicketyBrindleDowntheMiddle on Jul 12, 2010 3:25 PM PDT reply actions
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