Marcus Camby: Good Deal or Bad Deal?
by Ben Golliver on Apr 19, 2010 3:32 PM PDT
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PrintA consensus seems to be building that the Marcus Camby contract extension deal is as good as done. So let's turn our attention to the pressing question: good deal or bad deal?
On balance, a guaranteed 2 year / 21 million dollar deal is solid for the Blazers. Those numbers provide roster stability at a reasonable price for a reasonable length, exposing the team to an acceptable amount of risk.
First the risks. Camby turned 36 years old in March so this deal, as reported, would take him through his 38th birthday. Not many NBA centers remain productive at 38 but, then again, not many NBA centers remain productive at 36. In addition to his age, Camby has missed significant chunks of multiple seasons, including 20 games last year, 26 games in 2006 and more than 50 games in 2003. He missed short stints as a Blazer with minor ailments, tweaked ankles and the like.
When Camby has played there has been no question about his impact on games. He's averaged more than 10 rebounds per game in 9 of the past 10 seasons and he's been a defensive mainstay throughout. Camby's play since he was traded to Portland prior to this year's trading deadline has been nothing short of spectacular: He's averaged 7 points, 11.1 rebounds, 1.5 assists, 2.0 blocks and 1.1 steals per game and he's shooting nearly 50% from the field. He's been lauded by his teammates and coaching staff alike for his leadership both on and off the court. For stretches, especially in Brandon Roy's absence, Camby has even been the most valuable Blazer this season. As a cherry on top, his skillset is an ideal match for that of Roy and LaMarcus Aldridge in that he produces extra possessions without needing the ball in his hands and can operate out of the high post if needed.
Given his current game-changing level of play, there is little doubt that Camby will continue to make a big-time impact next season. He is able to play either the power forward or center position, as a starter or a reserve, and impact games regardless of how many possessions he is on the floor. Next season, a front court rotation of Aldridge, Oden, Camby, Cunningham and Pendergraph is well balanced and fairly deep. It figures to be among the league's best, especially on the glass. After next season, the thinking likely goes, Greg Oden should be commanding every last minute and touch and Camby's role likely diminishes into that of a smaller-minute backup. That's a nice chain of succession.
Thanks to the recent re-injury of Joel Przybilla and Oden's ongoing rehabilitation, the Blazers clearly had a signficant short-term need to address their frontcourt if they were to reach their stated goal of making a deep playoff run in the near future. Had the Blazers not agreed to an extension with Camby, he would have hit the open market this summer and teams like the New York Knicks, Denver Nuggets, Los Angeles Clippers and others had already expressed varying degrees of interest. With no firm ties to Portland, Camby's flight risk this summer was high. Getting this done quickly is a win for both sides but particularly for Portland.
As for the contract terms, any chance of re-signing Camby to a one year deal (with a non-guaranteed or team option on the second year) evaporated thanks to his solid recent play. Without question, someone would have given him a guaranteed second year this summer. The $21 million dollar figure is squarely in the middle of the ballpark that's been guessed at for some time (including in the comments here). It's right on for the production that he will provide next year and it's probably a little high in the second year. But that's the premium you pay to keep him here and, in a worse case scenario, the second year figure makes for a nice expiring contract.
For Przybilla, this signing makes him even more likely to serve as trade bait at next year's trade deadline, assuming the Blazers are unable to move him this summer. His roughly 7.4 million dollar contract is set to expire next season and, depending on the length of his absence, could be covered by insurance. Given the nature and extent of his knee injury it was difficult to imagine Przybilla impacting games before the middle of next season at the absolute earliest. The Blazers simply aren't in a position to wait on him or cross their fingers and hope the old Joel will be able to make a comeback.
For Oden, this signing carries significant weight. First, the big dollar salary commitment suggests that the Blazers will not rush to extend Oden this summer. An extension for Oden already seemed uncertain due to likely differences in his perceived value but committing this much money (and wasting no time in doing so) indicates the Blazers believe Camby is a key component going forward.
If anything, this move ramps up the pressure on Oden to produce and to earn his playing time. Nate McMillan is an unabashed fan of what Camby brings to the table and Oden is set to enter his fourth full season after being drafted. The training wheels and kid-glove treatment, so to speak, now become be a thing of the past for Oden. It will be time to sink or swim, his starter's minutes and, in turn, the size of any future extension, will hinge on his ability to beat out Camby next season. In the past, Oden has responded well to a similar competition with Przybilla. Ideally, Oden is your opening night starter next season. But that's not by default any longer. That should serve as excellent motivation as he continues through his rehabilitation process this summer.
If there's a bright side for Oden, though, it is further affirmation that this organization will reward him handsomely if he is able to impact games as he did at the beginning of this season. While they are different offensive players -- Camby is a mobile, face-up threat while Oden is a traditional back-to-the-basket bruiser -- their effects on the defensive end and the boards are similar. In Camby, Oden can see exactly what he needs to do and how much money he'll be given if he does it. He'll also have one hell of a mentor.
If there's one final concern with this deal it's the matter of contract-year incentive. Marcus Camby has been killing himself the last two months. With two guaranteed years in hand, does he come into camp fully in shape and ready to go from day one? Is he able to play for 70+ games again next season? Does he relinquish the starter's role a little too easily? Nothing from his time in Portland suggests those will be problems, however these are risks that go with any veteran player that's playing for a final pay day.
In this case, I believe paying Camby and hoping he returns motivated and stays healthy over the next two years is a much safer play than any of the obvious alternatives: letting him hit the open market this summer, waiting for Przybilla, relying on Oden alone or trying to find someone else who can do what he can do.
Put simply, Marcus Camby's contributions have been invaluable, but 21 million over two years seems like a fair number to place on them.
-- Ben Golliver | benjamin.golliver@gmail.com | Twitter
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Great Deal
Now how about extending Juwan Howards contract
On game day, I leave the turkey alone because it is some chemicals in that thing. Nate Mcmillian 11/26/09
don't think so. Doubt Joel will ever play in the NBA after his injuries and GO hasn't proven to be
a player who can play most of the season. Even if he does, his minutes are limited.
Yes please.
Or for the league minimum as a 15th man.
CKTK: A music blog. We write about what we want to write about.
"Newspapers are an important part of our lives. Not to read, of course, but, when you’re moving you can’t wrap your dishes in a blog."
-Stephen Colbert
How about he stays as a mentor to Pendy?
He can teach him the art of the pointedly hard foul.
"My shoulder is OK. And away we go." -- Nic Batum
"wang-dang diddly wubba SPROING wow-wow" -- Dave
I think that is the skill
that Pendy has already nailed down.
I H8 ORNG
by shenanigans on Apr 19, 2010 10:18 PM PDT up reply actions
He can still do some good things.
Good midrange jumper, some effective low post moves, and manages to get away with giving a lot of fouls that would be flagrants if committed by someone else (he just gets away with it because he’s been schmoozing with the refs all night).
The big thing is that every workplace is better off when there’s someone like that around.
Keep your expectations low and you won't be disappointed.
I don't think it matters.
We can sign Freeland either way. It is an issue of how much PA want to pay.
The Cap always matters
I’m not sure we have much choice, but this is a big, big chunk of our space to dedicate to someone we hadn’t planned on needing.
All that glitters isn't chrome
no it is not...
we were already going to be over the cap… due to the trade we owned Camby bird rights… we own the rights to freeland so we can sign him to the MLE… which was the thought originally.
/////
((o))
/////
We weren't going to have cap space anyway
we still have the MLE money to sign Freeland if that’s what we wanted.
I thought we could offer Freeland over a MLE since we hold his rights...
any cap gurus out there?
Wouldn't he be on his rookie scale contract still?
Rookie contracts are always allowed as an exception.
If the Blazers want Freeland that badly
they could offer him the MLE
but the real question is: how badly does JF want to come to play in Portland?
they don’t let just anyone on this roster, ya know…present Aussies excepted
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
haha
The Leeroy Rule: being insistent >>>> being correct
by leeroyjenkins on Apr 20, 2010 8:34 AM PDT up reply actions
The Blazers as a Product
Are going to be a lot more exciting the next two years with this kind of insurance at the Center position.
Why doesn't the picture have a witty caption?
blah blah blah blah lame comment - lame commenter
by Bandwagon Butcher on Apr 19, 2010 3:37 PM PDT reply actions
"What ball? I don't see a ball"
Phil Mickelson: "A Great shot is when you pull it off.....a smart shot is when you don't have the guts to try it"’
by 92wastheyear on Apr 19, 2010 3:39 PM PDT up reply actions
"Oh I don't think so daddy long legged, or whatever your name is."
Travis to Patty, "Why you sound like that?"
by Kroes32 on Apr 19, 2010 3:41 PM PDT up reply actions 2 recs
Durantula antidote
you can’t stop Kevin Durant, you can only hope to…sign Marcus Camby to contain him
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Good deal - it had to be done
No way could we let Camby walk. It’s a little on the high side given his age, but the team just could not take the chance. He’s too important to us now.
The only question I have is if this means the team will now have to struggle this summer to dump salary to get under the tax threshold, or if Allen will just pay it.
I really don't think he's gonna be shredding salary anytime soon.
Sure their might be some moves but it’s not gonna be to shed salary. To me this move is a sign from Mr. Allen that the time to win is now, which is very encouraging.
Clownzano + Batum - Clownzano = awesome
Encouraging...maybe
To me this move is a sign from Mr. Allen that the time to win is now, which is very encouraging.
Let’s all hope that this isn’t a sign that PA’s cancer is more serious than has been indicated.
"My shoulder is OK. And away we go." -- Nic Batum
"wang-dang diddly wubba SPROING wow-wow" -- Dave
so this is opposite land?
We have 36 year old geriatric ballers dominating while our fresh new talent walk around on crutches…anyone else see the problem with this?
Geriatric Dunk Squad!
3/7/10 - Andre Miller Tomahawk jams on the Denver Nuggets.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R-JVgm7F1QA
1/4/10 - Juwan Howard dunks on Chris Kaman.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HTkOqDgLb6s
4/12/10 - Marcus Camby drops 30 and 13 on OKC to cement 50 wins.
http://www.nba.com/blazers/media/camby_chant_041310.mp3
by Eat Politicians on Apr 19, 2010 3:41 PM PDT reply actions
It's Certainly a Problem but...
It’s not anything we’ve brought on ourselves. It’s all been bad luck. Not much we can do about it except keep on truckin’ with what’s been working for us.
And it’s been working extremely well.
I would say it is a probalem .....and a solution
Phil Mickelson: "A Great shot is when you pull it off.....a smart shot is when you don't have the guts to try it"’
by 92wastheyear on Apr 19, 2010 5:56 PM PDT up reply actions
Good deal. It has precisely the right length and expires just when we would have to give new deals to Nic, Jerryd, Rudy, and Andre and Jeff.
Of course there is risk involved considering Camby has been more healthy than usual this year. But with a solid big man rotation, at least there should always be 1 healthy C and 1 healthy PF now. He moves better than e.g. Garnett at a younger age does now, since the vast majority of his injuries have been little ones. A sprained ankle there, a broken finger here. His only serious injuries were a partial ACL tear and a necessary hip surgery after another tear. He is aging, but there is still fuel in the tank.
by Norsktroll on Apr 19, 2010 3:42 PM PDT reply actions 2 recs
I banked on Camby's risk when he was playing all-star ball midseason
In my fantasy league, I traded Camby, expecting the inevitable injury, for Luol Deng and Jose Calderon. That trade… was not successful. I’m a total supporter of both the Outlaw/Blake for Camby trade, but this contract seems a bit too rich for me to really get behind.
Mar-Cus Cam-Bee clap clap clap-clap-clap!
by JonathanPDX on Apr 19, 2010 3:44 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
Hey if worse comes to worse it is a sizable expiring deal in two years.
Plus I am sure it is insured.
except in two years after a lockout and new CBA...
expiring deals may not have the same value they once did. still though i think it was a very reasonble and calculated risk that makes the blazers better next year and the year after.
Actually, if there's a hard cap
Expirings become VERY valuable, since you won’t be able to sign your own FAs to exceed the cap.
You would have to manufacture space, and the best way to do that is expirings.
by TheThinWhiteDuke on Apr 19, 2010 10:53 PM PDT up reply actions
HA!
ONE vote for “Bad Deal.” This is a no-brainer. Good work by the Blazers again. (KP? Miller? Who cares, in this case?)
No,,,,
Not many other owners are willing to pay luxury tax right now. There really wasn’t much for KP or Miller to negotiate seeing as though he is basically getting the max he can be extended for.
Quick said it was Allen
after the OKC game, who pushed to get this done soonest.
I’m sure KP was at least on board, and we know Nate’s feelings about Camby.
by TheThinWhiteDuke on Apr 19, 2010 10:54 PM PDT up reply actions
Not to mention:
Let’s focus on Camby here. He’s a very, very smart player. Even if he misses games, he contributes to this organization in big ways.
Remember Wayne Morse?
He cast the one vote for “Bad Deal” on a pretty important senate resolution a few years back.
Keep your expectations low and you won't be disappointed.
Good deal.
Answers a big question for this team going forward. Now if we could just figure out that darn PG of the future question …
"These are dreams that we have." --Rudolfo Fernandez
i voted "good"
b/c it is exactly that.
I am very satisfied with this move.
S
The Princess of Blazersedge
Twitter.com/sophiabiabia Follow Me!!!
" It just takes an iron fist to keep the riff raff under control and her princess hand is mad strong" - Idoltime
Really?? I guess we're desperate for centers
this is a lot of cash for a dude this old, and your right ben, camby has been workign his a** off for the last few months, can he keep this up? if we can trade pryz this summer this deal makes a lot more sense, right now it seams like we’ll have like 24 mil tied up in three centers who could all get injured at some point, hmmmm. still, I like to see camby on next years team, I’m just kind of cynical about players health right now
by StocktonNEP on Apr 19, 2010 3:58 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
Yes we are
Centers are the NBA luxury…hope we have them
Elizabeth had a partner and he had a rap from the cops, Him and Lenny Suckerpunch were just out Tooling around
by Lizzy Lowblow on Apr 19, 2010 10:17 PM PDT up reply actions
The question should be
Great deal or greatest deal?
by ozqb3 on Apr 19, 2010 3:58 PM PDT via mobile reply actions
Camby's $$
Wouldnt Camby just be assuming most of what we are paying Darius Miles this year (9 Million) I beleive Miles contract finally ends after this season so that frees up that 9 Million so we essentially are giving him $2 Mil more then that.
Anyone know for sure the status of the Darius Miles contract?
Yes Miles contract expires this summer taking him off the books. Though with the extensions to Roy and Aldridge kicking in, Allen will have to pay significantly more for next years’ team. Signing Camby and possibly also a #22 and/or #44 pick and using the MLE would put the team into the luxury tax.
Not necessarily above the Luxury tax line?
They’ll be well over the soft cap, but are you sure they are going to break 70 million in salary next year?
Here's where the team is
Roy – $13.1 million (my best guess given the BRI and cap projections)
Aldridge – $10.7 million
Camby – $10.1 million
Przybilla – $7.4 million
Miller – $7.3 million
Oden – $6.8 million
Webster – $4.8 million
Bayless – $2.3 million
Fernandez – $1.2 million
Batum – $1.2 million
Cunningham – $0.8 million
Pendergraph – $0.8 million
That’s $66.5 million for 12 players. You could see re-signings of Mills and/or Howard. You could see the Blazers bring over one of the European players (Freeland and/or Koponen). Plus you have to potentially account for the #22 pick in the draft.
That puts the Blazers right at or just over the projected tax threshold, which will be lower than the $69.9 million figure of 2009-10.
"It's Our Time":http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O99POVJfglY
by Storyteller on Apr 19, 2010 4:36 PM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
I could see us trading our picks
+ players or euros for either a backup or even starting 1. With the flexibility we have we could stay just below the tax or just slightly into it & health willing championship round. Regardless This is the year to either trade our picks outright or trade out of the 1st round.
Somebody step up! - Mike Rice
Better yet
Trade the picks for spare parts for the Blazers’ roster. Knees, shoulders, groins, what have you. Anything to prevent a repeat of the 2009-2010 injury-fest.
"My shoulder is OK. And away we go." -- Nic Batum
"wang-dang diddly wubba SPROING wow-wow" -- Dave
Thank you, KP
We didn’t get to 50 wins entirely by chance.
Nate did a great job of keeping the team focused and motivated, but KP is the guy who stocked the shelves of the emergency pantry in the basement, and when the emergency hit, he managed to trade two extra cans of SPAM (sorry Steve and Travis) with a neighbor for a perfectly aged steak.
by upper left corner on Apr 20, 2010 6:26 AM PDT up reply actions
this is why I was thinking
that to use the MLE the Blazers would need to deal Webster’s 4.8 mil salary for “nothing” other than to improve their draft position
but that’s assuming the Vulcan’s have given Paul a hard cap on how much he can spend this summer and that the LTT is actually that amount
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
well
Rudy wants out and Prz has an essentially insurance covered salary to trade so those two for a roleplayer and some cap space is my guess…
Geriatric Dunk Squad!
3/7/10 - Andre Miller Tomahawk jams on the Denver Nuggets.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R-JVgm7F1QA
1/4/10 - Juwan Howard dunks on Chris Kaman.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HTkOqDgLb6s
4/12/10 - Marcus Camby drops 30 and 13 on OKC to cement 50 wins.
http://www.nba.com/blazers/media/camby_chant_041310.mp3
by Eat Politicians on Apr 19, 2010 11:14 PM PDT up reply actions
Love the deal.
At absolute worst he becomes a valuable 11 million dollar expiring contract in another year, at best LMA, Nic and Greg all learn a thing or two from a former DPOY and the Blazers get a guy who beasts on the boards, blocks shots and quarterbacks the defense all while being able to play off of LMA or Greg.
by nikolokolus on Apr 19, 2010 4:07 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
Deal works on every level
We get one of the best bigs in the NBA. We get “one hell of a mentor”, a natural leader respected by officials, feared by players revered by coaches around the league. If (when) he comes off the bench he can play both center and PF, making LMA more valuable. * We keep OKC and other prospective rivals from acquiring him*
These next 2 years will be critical in building a championship team, Marc can and will be pivotal on and off the court.
$20-25 mill? pfff chump change ;-)
Mess with the game, it'll mess with you.
by MBux on Apr 19, 2010 4:08 PM PDT reply actions 2 recs
What a potential lineup!!
For stretches next year we could use a lineup of – C-Oden, PF-Camby, SF-Aldridge, SG-Batum, PG-Roy
Now that would be a big long fearsome defensive unit with some offensive punch as well.
Lovin that, GoG.
I’ve been imagining that line-up for the last month or so. Not to mention still having the ability to go small with L.A., Nick, Roy, Miller, and one of Cunningham, Rudy, or Bayless.
Can you say match-up problems?
by yellinatthetv on Apr 19, 2010 8:05 PM PDT up reply actions
Haha
Can you imagine how LMAs eyes would light up when Nate told him to stand in the corner and shoot open threes all day?
Just hope it doesn’t Frye his brain.
by TheThinWhiteDuke on Apr 19, 2010 10:58 PM PDT up reply actions
I voted "other"
1. First off, until it’s signed, the deal is rumor— not news.
2. It’s most important the Blazers have at least ONE reliably healthy center. Both Oden and Pryzbilla have had a history of multiple, long-term injuries. I believe it would be foolish to give up on Oden as long as his injuries don’t affect his mobility.
Does Camby provide stability at center, according to reasonable NBA expectations for injuries and a decline in abilities at his age? I am not completely sure. I want to look at him AND Oden and wonder if I am taking too much risk that I have to scramble for another mid-season center and disrupt my roster.
3. Just based on the limited evidence, coupled with Pryzy’s probable inavailability and the unpredictability of injury, I think this is a good signing. The problem initially seemed to be whether Camby was even willing to come; it looks like he might.
4. On a side note, If I were Paul Allen—incredibly wealthy and very sick—I would be spending as much of that money on the things I valued most—anything that would aid in my health, including my attitude toward life. To sum up, my motto would be: to he’ll with the luxury tax.
Honor Alaa Abdelnaby.
First in the NBA. At least alphabetically
by OhOhOden on Apr 19, 2010 4:17 PM PDT via mobile reply actions
I think it is news
When just about every source including Camby himself has confirmed it. The league office is just dotting the I’s and crossing the T’s as it were. I don’t think Camby’s going to Hedo out on us right here.
Because of Hedo
and rare situations like it, the only news is literally what was reported here: lots and lots of sources say it’s a done deal.
People in all kinds of situations have changed their minds at the altar. Why should we make more of this than it is?
Honor Alaa Abdelnaby.
First in the NBA. At least alphabetically
as of 4:18 pacific time
Good: 508
Bad: 12
Methinks the people like it.
MARCUS CAMBY!!! MARCUS CAMBY!!! MARCUS CAMBY!!!
Why the hell are the Blazers overpaying AGAIN?
Didn’t they learn anything with the LMA contract?
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Overpaying is pretty irrelevant for the Blazers at this point
LA’s deal is a mil or two higher a year than the open market would have yielded but if the time comes that we want to make a big trade for a star you need that type of sizeable contract and that deal is hardly among the worst in the league. If LA progresses next year that deal can very quickly become entirely reasonable.
As for this deal, Camby’s potential production next year warrants a 10 mil or so pricetag. If he plays anywhere near the level he has since we traded for him then it is only fair that he be well compensated. I think the only problem people will have with this deal is that he is 36 and at that age players are supposed to be taking less money and lesser roles in theory. Problem is, Camby warrants a larger role and better pay than any big man anywhere near his age. When you factor in his ability to play PF and C, the skills he should teach LA and possibly Oden and the fact that this gives us at least two of our key vets for next season, I love love love this deal.
Get back to me when the Vulcans play with the books 12 months from now...
They blow the team up. You watch.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
If they want to lose any money they make out of the franchise then sure they should go ahead and blow it up
Wait and see how long it takes for this fanbase to turn hostile. They can’t be that stupid can they?
Nicolas Batum AKA Mr. Third Quarter
On Josh Smith "He's strong as a 2nd curtain"
On Lebron "...it's hype, he's not a defender"
On Aaron Brooks "He's tiny, he has a small body but he's super fast and has a real gesture"
On Steve Nash "First we'll have to try and stop this Canadian guard, a young kid with a bright future!"
On Defense "They all piss me off with Dwight Howard...Guys like Bruce Bowen or Ron Artest were legit defensive men of the year. For me that's the profile of a denfender.
On The Playoffs "I don't want Dallas to win because I don't want Rodrigue to be NBA champion, I would be pissed. I don't want him to be NBA champion in his 1st year, this bastard....I put myself in mode asshole!"
I'm pretty sure NY
would have given LMA as much or more, barring a LeBron move to NY.
by TheThinWhiteDuke on Apr 19, 2010 11:00 PM PDT up reply actions
5 year deal based off potential =/= 2 year deal based off production
Michael Jordan is the Nicolas Batum of America
by thomasikehara on Apr 19, 2010 5:49 PM PDT up reply actions
Games played per season.
He’s missed 20+ games each season for at least half of his NBA career. It’s not a long-term contract, but it’s a lot of money to spend on a 36 year old injury-prone center when you already have 2 injury-prone centers. It would really suck to see all 3 chilling behind the bench next year. Other than that Camby’s a great player.
Keep your expectations low and you won't be disappointed.
Michael Jordan is the Nicolas Batum of America
by thomasikehara on Apr 19, 2010 6:37 PM PDT up reply actions
Why would they have learned anything from the LMA contract.
Has that hurt their flexibility at all yet? It’s short, which makes it good.
by Nick Van Excellent on Apr 19, 2010 6:48 PM PDT up reply actions
Banging into the luxury cap now. The cost of giving $5M or so to LMA + Camby will become apparent shortly.
Have another beer everyone, to quote my crazy sister: “Easy Prices!!!”
Check back with me in a year…
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Read: $5M TOO MUCH to LMA + Camby
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Could we stop the madness
of suggested Oden, Camby, and Aldridge all play at the same time. Aldridge absolutely can NOT play SF.
Well
For stretches I think Aldridge can play as a SF. Even if he gets beat off the dribble the guy taking it to the hope well run into Camby or Oden. Also if the Blazers went to a zone it would increase Aldridge’s effectiveness as a small forward on the defensive end.
by GiftofGame on Apr 19, 2010 4:23 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Oh come on...
when has Aldridge EVER played even a minute at SF? If it was even on option it would have happened during the Joel and Oden twin towers experiment. Playing Aldridge at SF makes about as much sense as playing Dirk at SG.
I have to rec this I don't know if you put hope instead of hoop on purpose but roflao.
OK I beat this 6’11" guy off the dribble attack the hoop oops Camby-Oden make that hope!
Somebody step up! - Mike Rice
Compare this deal (avg of 10.5 mil a year) to what some other centers around the league are making this year.
Eddy Curry – $10,500,423
Samuel Dalembert – $12,025,694
Shaq – $21,000,000
Tyson Chandler – $11,700,000
Jermaine O’Neal – $23,016,000
Emeka Okafor – $10,797,500
Erik Dampier – $12,115,500
Brad Miller – $12,250,000
Andres Biedrins – $9,000,000
Granted none of those players would get that kind of money if they were free agents today, but it provides a good contrast to the deal we are getting with Camby (which I’d argue is excellent).
As follows:
1. Worst contract in the NBA.
2. Overpaid and untradable even though they want to
3. Bloated contract of aging superstar heading for retirement
4. Overpaid given performance, has been subject of a contract dump already
5. Bloated contract of aging superstar heading for retirement
6. Actually could use this as a base for Camby, other than the fact Camby is 36 and nobody is gonna be paying him this much in the current economic environment as a FA.
7. Grossly overpaid product of dunderbutt billionaire, the guy who brought you the Raef LaFrentz deal
8. Miller is another potential baseline. Also has been contract-dumped, I note.
9. Biedrins is a young player, not comparable to the nearly-retired Camby
Blazers are bidding against themselves and paying approximately $6M too much over the course of this deal. VERY VERY few teams have more than MLE to work with and none of those are gonna be investing in a 36 year old Camby.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
playing for GS?
"In fact you might say that Ugly is the Blazers' secret weapon this year."
"Game 75 Recap: Blazers 118, Knicks DNP"
-Dave
Tyler Durrden on Durant:
"He’s like the fonz riding an electric unicorn throwing magical love buckets in from heaven"
Hollinger on Durant in crunch time:
"Durant finds Joe DeRosa open at the 3-point line... and that should about do it. "Marcus Camby" chants fill arena."
He has an arthritic package?
That’s pretty extreme, even for a Golden State injury.
by TheThinWhiteDuke on Apr 19, 2010 11:02 PM PDT up reply actions
You astutely picked up that these are all poor contracts. Kudos. That is the price of length in this league. Camby almost certainly could have got more money in free agency from Denver or NY than he got from us, and is a perfect stop gap for the next two years as we evaluate the long term viability of Greg and Joel.
A list of poor contracts is being cited as a reason to extend a poor contract to Camby.
I’m not the one who picked the crappy deals to use as lame justification, I’m just pointing out they’re crappy deals.
The correct bid for Camby is MLE +$1M per year, which eliminates about 7/8 of the league from being able to pay matching money.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Cool, bid that
and we lose Camby. You are saying you would rather have no Camby than overpay for Camby? It’s not like we have financial flexibility anyway due to Roy and Aldridge’s extensions kicking in.
Exactly.
Camby would have garnered a lot of interest on the open market. It’s a two year deal, so even if unforeseeable events take place, we are not locked into a contract long term. And given our current situation with Joel and not many viable options on the FA market, who cares if we spent a couple million extra.
by resurrect_ha28 on Apr 19, 2010 4:42 PM PDT up reply actions
Okay, game on... Over to Storyteller's Site...
http://www.storytellerscontracts.info/resources/09-10salaries.htm
Here are the teams under $50M for 2010-11
Atlanta $47.6M for 8 players
Bulls $31.8 for 6 players
Clippers $33.5 for 6 players
Miami $27.9M for 6 players
TWolves $34.7M for 9 players
Nets $23.6 for 9 players
Knicks $17.8M for 6 players
OKC $40M for 12 players
Sac $32M for 9 players
Wizards $41M for 8 players
Realistically, that is the ENTIRE field of teams that are in the big bidding war for a 36 year old free agent center.
Of these, who exactly is a threat to pay Camby more than $8M??
MAYBE the Thunder, I suppose.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
OKC, Knicks, Clips, and probably more
I don’t think anyone is saying we didn’t over pay, but the amount that we overpaid is negated by the alternative of potentially losing the guy to free agency. This is a lot of money for a 36 year old player, I get that, but the amount of years isn’t something that will bind us long term.
I like the idea of you and others going against the grain of common thought and trying to look at the deal from another perspective, but in this case it just seems like you are being a Debbie Downer. It’s been a great 24 hours to be a Blazer fan and unanimously across the board people wanted Camby back. Did we overpay a bit? Yes, but now we don’t leave it up to chance in the free agent market.
Just enjoy the playoffs and quit complaining for the sake of it.
by resurrect_ha28 on Apr 19, 2010 5:19 PM PDT up reply actions
ZERO percent chance of the Knicks spending big bucks on Camby...
They want 2 megamax guys, plus a bunch of minimum wagers.
VERY LOW prospect of the (cheap) Clips spending big bucks to bring back the guy they just traded, given they already have the Great Big White Hope as their starting Center (you don’t pay backups $10M unless you’re Kevin Pritchard, eh?) and Blake as their incoming low post masher. That’s not happening either.
So you have OKLAHOMA CITY. Are you willing to dump about $3M a year because you’re afraid OKC is gonna outbid you and Camby is gonna chase bucks to live THERE?!?!?
Apparently so, if you’re KP.
That’s the bottom line…
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Dunleavy had thought the Clips had a good chance of getting Camby back
… and imagine he would have a similar role as backup 4/5 as here. And his family is there. You never know
"its tough to play with one eye, unless you're a pirate." Delonte West
"una canasta a Pau en la cara" Rudy
by Honka Playboy on Apr 19, 2010 8:33 PM PDT up reply actions
next time KP should contact you since you obviously have a ton if useful knowledge and understanding of how things work…..
you're kind of saucy, aren't you?
"its tough to play with one eye, unless you're a pirate." Delonte West
"una canasta a Pau en la cara" Rudy
by Honka Playboy on Apr 20, 2010 8:16 AM PDT up reply actions
I would've prefered a 3 year deal for 21-25 mil
with the 3rd year being a club option
but I’m not going to quibble about this deal being the reason the Blazers can’t compete for additional FAs in the market place in years to come. Compared to the Hedo offer last July, this Camby deal is cake
We all know hard hard it is for the Blazers to get “free” FAs to agree to sign in Portland. Hopefully, this small-market city will be a better “destination” for ring-chasers in the years to come, but for now the best way to target (and bag) a veteran who’s contract is expiring is exactly how the Blazers did it with Marcus: deal a couple of extra components who were expiring anyway, bring the big guy into the family and let him experience playing with the team and hearing the fans cheer for him, then make him an offer he can’t refuse before he changes his mind.
Yes, the amount of money spent will (once again) have the rival GMs around the league rolling their eyes at Paul and Kevin, but from their perspective a “Camby in the hand” sure beats the alternative—which was Juwan Howard starting at center
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
by two4larue on Apr 19, 2010 6:08 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
GREATEST COMMENT EVER....
a "Camby in the hand" sure beats the alternative—which was Juwan Howard starting at center
I love that!
Elitism - It's lonely at the top. But it's comforting to look down upon everyone at the bottom.
by thankyouforblaze on Apr 19, 2010 6:53 PM PDT up reply actions
Correct here. Andre Miller money...
I would’ve prefered a 3 year deal for 21-25 mil with the 3rd year being a club option
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
lol, I actually thought you were a spambot for a sec as I was scrolling down
"I’m getting more expensive by the game" - Amare Stoudemire
by In Walks Rudy on Apr 19, 2010 9:02 PM PDT up reply actions
None of these teams are long-term competitive and it's doubtful they want to be so
These ownership groups want one thing and one thing only’ to suck cash out of the till. So you’re prolly right when you say they wouldn’t bid against us for a player like Marcus. But that’s precisely the difference between these teams and the long-term winners.
Correct Bid?????
1) We got him, not the other 1/8 of the league.
2) We were/are already over the cap limit.
3) Paul Allen’s happy.
4) Camby’s contract expires in 2 years.
It was perfect bid.
"Brandon eats first around here" - KP
by BlazerFanSince1970 on Apr 19, 2010 5:32 PM PDT up reply actions
KP has proven himself a poor negotiator in the Roy and LMA deals.
With Oden still to pay.
The Portland Trail Blazers are gonna end up getting blown up for financial reasons because of dumb overpayments like this one.
Quote me.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
I will quote you..
when we all find out how this turns out….. because I don’t know…and clearly you don’t either.
RoadBlazer
And he was marginalized weeks before this deal went down.
You may be entirely right about the valuation of this deal, but given the politics in the front office, I don’t see how it is remotely possible that this deal hasn’t been kissed and blessed all the way up and down the chain. If there are Vulcans who think it is too generous, then I have no doubt that PA told them to step off.
by conspirator5 on Apr 19, 2010 8:54 PM PDT up reply actions
agreed
Allen would have given the deal his blessing.
and timbo, stop being such a hater…
Elitism - It's lonely at the top. But it's comforting to look down upon everyone at the bottom.
by thankyouforblaze on Apr 19, 2010 10:08 PM PDT up reply actions
Allen wants the deal done...
It has already been reported that Allen told KP to get the deal done after the Thunder game.
by Brandon James Smith on Apr 20, 2010 5:26 AM PDT up reply actions
what about the fairness of the Martell, Travis, and Blake contracts?
#52
"We have nothing to lose." - Martell
by Cablinasian on Apr 19, 2010 10:57 PM PDT up reply actions
what about Orlando paying Gortat, Bass, Lewis, and Vince big money? Will they implode?
#52
"We have nothing to lose." - Martell
by Cablinasian on Apr 19, 2010 11:06 PM PDT up reply actions
The owner of the Magic was born in 1926
He is at least as eager as Paul Allen to see results fast.
I think we’ll likely not be able to keep all of Rudy, Jerryd, and Bayless in 2012 plus a good point guard (Miller or other) even if we wanted all of them back. But I still think that’s a pretty good deal for Camby. There aren’t many younger backups/potential starters of his quality around, and they come with longer contracts attached and wouldn’t really like playing behind Oden and Aldridge. And in February 2011, Camby is an expiring deal already if worst comes to worse. It’s not a millstone around the neck of the franchise.
So Timbo is this deal better or worse then the deal the L@kers gave Artest?
Somebody step up! - Mike Rice
by We-B-Dunkin on Apr 19, 2010 11:29 PM PDT up reply actions
I'm amazed
you think Okafor is a comparable….and that no one would pay him that much. And Biedrins also being comparable except that he’s so much younger? Biedrins is also more injury prone, and will never score like Camby can. Also, despite you thinking he’s nearly retired, he is playing at a very high level. And at the very least, he’s only 1 year from being a valuable expiring contract.
With the new higher figure for the salary cap next year….AND with all the teams that cleared cap space hoping for a shot at LBJ, there would be several teams that would look to sign Camby…..and they would have over-paid.
If the Blazers wait and get into competing for Camby’s service, they may well have had to pay more.
"I'm a man, but I can change.....if I have to......I guess." - Red Green
by antediluvian on Apr 19, 2010 4:40 PM PDT up reply actions
They will pay after most of the big FA's re-sign with their original teams.
Camby would get his $$$ you pay big for bigs period
Somebody step up! - Mike Rice
I think you also have to consider the possible alternatives
Which are…?
I think it’s easy to criticize the deal that is available to us now, but I’m fairly certain that in “future hindsight”™ it will still seem a good choice. You mention above that Okafor’s contract is a good starting point; I think it’s a fair thing to say that Camby is easily $2mil/year better than Okafor, and I’m pretty sure his stats bear that out.
Joel is out. We need another center. What other potentially available center would be a better fit/value?
Okafor would get it easily.
Not to belabor the point but he’s a fine player. What’s a fine 4-5 position player worth in the the world’s best basketball league.
Blazers got a great deal.
MC could still have several good years left in him. Remember Dikembe last year before the injury. He was 42! Tall, long, intelligent big men can contribute as long as they can get up and down the court.
"I just played my game. I didn't do anything special. Just take the open shot, make cuts to basket, get rebounds. That's it." ~Nic Batum
by vanceanthony on Apr 19, 2010 4:23 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
it's definitely a good move
gives us a nice safety blanket for the Oden/Pryzbilla injuries
and as Ben mentions in the post, this makes Pryzbilla a possibly very valuable trade chip next season if his contract is covered by insurance
The deal is only for two years, so even if he drops off in year 2 we have a 10-11M expiring contract that’s also trade-able if we want to use it like that (I don’t know if the new CBA would effect that)?
I’m all for this – I remember when the Andre Miller signing was scrutinized, when some questioned the Juwan Howard deal, and when some doubted the Camby trade – VETS ARE IMPORTANT! – And they won us a playoff game last night
WELCOME TO PORTLAND PERMANENTLY MARCUS!
by rip_city_swagger on Apr 19, 2010 4:24 PM PDT reply actions
Other
Would have said good, but they should have knocked off a million for missing that dunk.
by palaiti on Apr 19, 2010 4:29 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
I like this deal.
It’s the way the NBA works to a certain extent. Talent is underpaid early (rookie scale) and overpaid late. Even so, I think this is a good move. We need a reliable 4/5 big to back up both Aldridge and Oden. There’s no way we land a player of anywhere near Camby’s caliber and fit on the open market. It’s a risk because of his age and injury history, but a smart one and one that doesn’t hamstring the team if it doesn’t work out.
"In fact you might say that Ugly is the Blazers' secret weapon this year."
"Game 75 Recap: Blazers 118, Knicks DNP"
-Dave
Tyler Durrden on Durant:
"He’s like the fonz riding an electric unicorn throwing magical love buckets in from heaven"
Hollinger on Durant in crunch time:
"Durant finds Joe DeRosa open at the 3-point line... and that should about do it. "Marcus Camby" chants fill arena."
Good deal--not only does he produce, but he makes the other bigs around him better.
And LMA and GO can continue to learn a lot from this guy, even when he gets too old to contribute much on the court.
Who else saw Camby having this type of impact on the team?
I thought he’d be a serviceable piece this year then off to the markets this summer. But he’s really seems to has bought into whats going on in this organization and enjoyed being around the young talent. Cool story.
Perhaps a bit expensive...
But it ain’t my money! I like the potential MCEC that comes with it. If we extend Andre Miller into his third year, that should be about $18 Million coming off the cap in two years that could be used in various combinations with other players to bring back a nice younger piece. By spending more now, we give our roster great flexibility in the future (when we otherwise would not have much financial flexibility due to salary cap constraints).
We should still have a full mid-level exception for this offseason as well.
Oden + Przybillia + Camby + Aldridge = some of the greatest frontline depth in recent NBA history…maybe ever.
Oh yeah…L*kers suck.
Can I buy you a fish sandwich?
Expiring contracts seem like the best trade bait once you are in to Luxury Tax territory.
I think this is the point that Timbo is missing in the conversation above. Once you are over the cap the only way to land guys over the MLE is with expiring contracts. Having Dre and Marcus both coming up in the same year should give the team some decent options.
by upper left corner on Apr 20, 2010 8:15 AM PDT up reply actions
Good job, Ben
Yes, I’m in favor of this extension. But I would be remiss if I didn’t admit that I have some doubts/fears about it. I appreciate that Ben looks at the signing from all points of view and doesn’t just put forward a ‘rah rah’ piece.
There’s the issue of Camby’s health. There’s the issue of how it potentially could discourage Oden instead of motivate him. It’s a risky move. Yes, I believe that the potential benefits outweigh the risks. But the risks are there and we can’t just put our head in the sand and pretend that those risks are not there.
"It's Our Time":http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O99POVJfglY
by Storyteller on Apr 19, 2010 4:42 PM PDT reply actions 2 recs
PLEASE don't let this be another THEO RATLIFF situation!
Remember when he had 4 blocks per game for half a season once he was traded to Portland, then got big money and promptly sat down with an injury and for some R&R?
I hope we’re getting THIS Marcus Camby for this money and not the one who wants some retirement money and plans to sit on the bench. It’s for this possibility that I like that it’ s only a 2 year deal instead of longer.
"Oh, and Ted, give my love to the Princesses. Ted2: Who? Ted: You'll see." - Ted Theodore Logan.
Great Move
I love this. We’re paying for insurance and performance. This deal is completely indicative of what other bigs in the league are making. Length costs money.
SMART move.
Let him go, and you can’t replace his salary $4$ because of the salary cap;
even if you could, who are you going to get for $11 M who brings such a good fit to the team?
BUT, what kind of center are you going to get for MLE?
Wait ‘till you need to match and you don’t know what you get – maybe a little “bid-up” pay-back like KP did to Utah? Maybe 3 years?
Get him NOW while you are #1 on his list and motivate / remove distractions in the playoff run.
You gonna leave your NBA team dependent on two centers returning from injuries?
what kind of center are you going to get for MLE?
Maybe Mahinmi, emphasis on “maybe”
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
doesnt have the overall value of Camby
and is unproven on a Blazer squad, unlike Marcus
Elitism - It's lonely at the top. But it's comforting to look down upon everyone at the bottom.
by thankyouforblaze on Apr 19, 2010 10:09 PM PDT up reply actions
good stuff Ben,
but calling Camby the team’s mvp this year when he’s only been here a short while is jumping the gun in regards to Miller who has been here the whole year. A case could be made for both, but Miller isn’t getting the praise he deserves.
I still think it’s a good deal though.
Get busy livin', or get busy dyin'. -the shawshank redemption.
we got a two-headed MVP, around here
and the best part about it is, neither one wants to accept the award
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
You could argue that Miller made Blake expendable...
and Dre gets an “assist” for everything Camby brings to the team.
by conspirator5 on Apr 19, 2010 8:59 PM PDT up reply actions
It's a decent deal
I think the salary figure is too high. We’re paying for current production, and even if Camby were to be 36 again next season, he’s unlikely to produce at this level.
That being said, it was pointed out elsewhere that NBA contracts basically last for Years – 1 as they become valuable expiring contracts in the final year. So it’s a 1-year, 15 million dollar deal and might be able to turn into some intriguing 2nd-rounder from the upcoming draft or next.
M, period. Fresh, comma.
Ditto - I wish it weren't for quite as much money
I was hoping we could get him to sign for high single-digit $Ms given his age. But it is great to have him on the team for a couple more years. The team filled a huge need when they traded for him and having Camby and Oden on the front lines will be awesome. Maybe we can finally move Aldridge to small forward . . . . (jk).
Hopefully he’ll move his family up here so that isn’t on his mind.
Very psyched, even though it is a bit expensive. I guess it shows PA is ready to spend for a championship.
put a body on 'em
"I was hoping we could get him to sign for high single-digit $Ms given his age"
Why, seriously, why? They’re over the cap already so no matter what they pay for Camby they can only get free agents for the MLE anyway. If PA wants to spend his dough, why do we care?
Don't know why this would even be a poll
Seems obvious
I like to see the confirmation
"Knowledge will get you from A to B. Creativity will get you anywhere." Einstein
pending league approval
for those “unlikely” bonuses
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Love this deal almost as much as I love Camby's game
I even like Camby’s drawbacks I expect Camby will miss 15-20 games next year giving guys like Pendy, Dante and or #22 in the draft a chance to get quality post minutes and show their potential value for the team either on the court or on the trading block.
it would have been really cool if they kept this under wraps
then have camby announce it before the crowd before game 3
Michael Jordan is the Nicolas Batum of America
as the crowd breaks into an instant chant of
Mar-cus Cam-by
clap-clap
clap.clap.clap.clap
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Great Deal
Expiring contracts are awesome pieces, we used two to get this guy and look at us now. We have Pryzbilla’s in 2011 and Camby in 2012, chances to make the moves needed to get us into the championship if we look good.
On top of that we have shored up our front court with a great mentor who is excited to play for us. The deal is a Win on the court, in the lockerroom and for our long-term plans.
Great deal
He can make us a true contender.
"Good evening Blazer fans, wherever you may be!"-Bill Schonely
bench role...
Does anyone know if he is ok with coming off the bench?…..when and if Oden returns to the starting line up? I say good deal but not if he is going to have a problem with back up duty….yes I still believe in Oden!
by BigDaddy72 on Apr 19, 2010 5:51 PM PDT via mobile reply actions
Obviously he is
Oden has to start. Oden’s production was off the charts before he got hurt.
"Good evening Blazer fans, wherever you may be!"-Bill Schonely
Marcus has been quoted several times
saying that he would be fine with coming off the becnh, if he was asked to do it
next fall is going to be so much fun when Greg gets healthy, Nate will get to keep rotating 7-footers into the game, and none of them will be stiffs
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
I know we're all homers and stuff
But if they get healthy it has to be one of the best front courts in recent memory. Greg and Camby in itself is the second coming of the admiral/Duncan on the defensive end. Add a very good power forward in Aldridge, and then throw Joel into the equation who could start for half the teams in the NBA if healthy. That’s scary good.
Clownzano + Batum - Clownzano = awesome
He also said, however, that he wants to be a real contributor
Camby does not want to get a ring the way the ‘stache did, sitting on the bench and watching other people win it. Which makes this point: no matter how quickly or successfully Pryz recovers, the only way he sees PT on the floor is if Greg wipes out, and I think we can all agree that we don’t want that prophecy to come true.
Marcus even destroys any fantasies about Nate running a “twin towers” scenario too, because Camby is a “4” and is much more effective in the high post than Joel is.
Really, I think this signing is effectively the end of the Pryzbilla era in Portland. Which is a shame. I love Joel, but again, the only way he is here and is productive is if he has an excellent recovery and Greg really is a bust.
by conspirator5 on Apr 19, 2010 9:06 PM PDT up reply actions
Great deal.
financial flexibility plus having another elder statesmen that can teach our young guys while still be a rock solid player (not discounting what Juwan has done).
Oden/LMA
Oden/Camby
LMA/Camby… going to be awesome.
/////
((o))
/////
21 million for a bench player?
No question that he has had a huge impact on our team while Pryz and Oden have been out, but this is flat-out overpaying for the impact he will have going forward, out of fear that the free agency market will be so hot we can’t match a more reasonable offer.
I love Camby, and I think he’s a better fit with Aldridge than either Oden or Pryz, but I wouldn’t go over 8 million per season for a bench player with about a season and a half of good basketball left in him.
by Drexler4Ever on Apr 19, 2010 6:31 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
Camby may come off the bench
but he’ll still get 30 min and 10+ rebounds a game. At best Oden plays 30 min a game more likely 25 min, Camby will play the 5 when Gregs on the bench and the 4 when LMA is on the bench. If Camby comes off the bench he will be the odds on favorite to win 6th man of year.
Good defensive players don't win 6th man of the year awards
I see him being somewhat like Millsap for Utah this year.
Clownzano + Batum - Clownzano = awesome
I mean he could.
But he probably wont. I’m not saying he won’t be one of the most important players off of any bench because he will be. But the national media won’t take notice and go for the usual suspects like Manu, Terry, etc.
Clownzano + Batum - Clownzano = awesome
Oh, come on
I like the deal, but this is the kind of stuff that made me avoid the site for so long:
First, the big dollar salary commitment suggests that the Blazers will not rush to extend Oden this summer. An extension for Oden already seemed uncertain due to likely differences in his perceived value…
This just plants the seed of fear in people’s minds and divides people into camps. Referencing a story in another post makes the original story seem like there is more wieght behind it than there really is (especially if people don’t clickon the link and just assume that there was something said by one party) and causes it to crystalize in the reader’s mind more. That the original story is one you created solely from your point of view is shaky ground. Maybe stating that the original article was your opinion would have been worth including. I think the ramifications are nicely brought to light and overall it’s a quality read. But I think intentionally creating controversy is the nadir of this article and often the site. I’m not saying it’s an incorrect assumption, but taking that and throwing it at us twice before it’s even an issue seems like an ill-veiled attempt to stir up controversy.
maybe you should avoid for a little longer and come back with a good attitude
"I’m getting more expensive by the game" - Amare Stoudemire
by In Walks Rudy on Apr 19, 2010 7:48 PM PDT up reply actions
Maybe I should
I think I get too emotionally caught up in this stuff. I guess that’s why I have a problem with someone stirring the pot in such a manner.
I'll stir it some more: paying your backup C $10.5 Million a year makes it a 0.000% chance of keeping Joel Przybilla as 3rd stringer at $8M.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
You have to figure Joel is going to be rehabbing for a long time.
He certainly won’t be back any sooner than it will take for the insurance to kick in.
by conspirator5 on Apr 19, 2010 9:10 PM PDT up reply actions
I think the writing is on the wall there
The direct consequences of that seem more obivious. But I’m not going to write a post, then write another one linking the original to my new post as evidence further supporting my view.
Wow, speaking of over-analysis of sparse details...
It’s hardly a controversial, polarizing or insulting comment to postulate that the Blazers may let the FA market determine Oden’s value. Oden may make that choice himself. GO is a very rare combination of #1 draft pick/transcendent talent with very little actual playing history for which to judge future value at the end of a rookie contract.
You say “throwing it at us twice before it’s even an issue…”, but it clearly is an issue right now, as far as making sure we have a serviceable center and who the other centers are around him. If anything, signing Camby is a vote of confidence FOR Greg, as MC is an old vet on a short contract. If the Blazers brought in one of the Lopez bros or another young center and signed them to a 4-5 year deal, that would send a different message, wouldn’t it?
It's an issue
but I think there is more a middle ground than is stated in the original story and especially in the summary provided for the link. Paul Allen loses Oden, Paul Allen loses money, production aside. It’s an opinion and it comes of as much more than that. And the writer is the one who’s trumping it up. The link and the summary of that link are what I have issue with. And you’re right, this seems like a vote for Greg in a way. This doesn’t seem nearly as devistating to his chances as a Blazer as it would to Joel.
THIS IS GREAT
BUT WHAT THE HECK IS WITH HIM ROLLING HIS ANKLE EVERY NEW WEEK? SHOE CHECK TRAINERS?
by that i mean he is injury prone. He has had his share of ticky tack stuff this season as well
Fan of Greg Oden, Joel Przy, Batum, and Andre miller
He can't use his zimmer frame during the game
:-P
"My shoulder is OK. And away we go." -- Nic Batum
"wang-dang diddly wubba SPROING wow-wow" -- Dave
maxamillion711 won't be making a blazer video this year :(
Michael Jordan is the Nicolas Batum of America
Can't wait for Greg to start learning everything he can from Camby.
This is gonna be great. Still not too happy just because of his age though. However, always good to lock up a crazy solid player.
Travis Outlaw fan from the beginning.
poll fail
95% for, 2 % against, 1 % other
that equals 98%
Michael Jordan is the Nicolas Batum of America
twss
"I’m getting more expensive by the game" - Amare Stoudemire
by In Walks Rudy on Apr 19, 2010 9:03 PM PDT up reply actions
Anyone else think that three centers is a lot to have?
I think that this might mean that since Joel will most likely sit next year we package him and Rudy for a player in the 10.5 million range. We would still have the MLE and could get a first rate All Star. This would put us in to a championship window if everyone stayed healthy
Bring back Franz Bread Cards!
Camby Can play the 4 at times.
And Joel won’t be back until about halfway through the season if that.
I thought that it was said on the radio that Joel would be out all of next year. If that is the case, he could be traded with other pieces in order to pick up an All Star. Every team that makes it to the finals seems to have two or three. We have Roy, Miller and Canby, but we need someone else that is in the top 10 or 15 players to put us over the edge.
Bring back Franz Bread Cards!
Not a good deal...
A GREAT DEAL!
I know less than half of you half as well as I should like, and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve.
by haildablazer on Apr 19, 2010 9:21 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
If Camby can make Oden better than this:
http://www.youtube.com/user/NWsports100#p/u/77/h3VCcwqsi5M
I am all for it. Geez, I can’t wait to watch Oden in action again.
with 98% of precincts counted
YEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS this is a good decision.
I think one also needs to look at the total dollars. $20-25 million deals are not as high stakes gambles as $60-100 million deals.
It is a pretty generous offer, but I wouldn’t be surprised if there had been a big bidding war on Camby this summer.
It would be interesting if anyone has done studies on how quickly basketball players deteriorate at the tail end of their careers. I would think the decline per year is probably not extreme, in other words since Camby is still playing so well at 36, I bet he will still be playing pretty decent two years from now. It would be different if the caliber of his play had already deteriorated substantially.
And if all goes well, being able to use him not only as a player but as a mentor to Oden very well could turn out to be worth its weight in gold.
Oden
Considering how much went into the new contract agreements for Roy and Aldridge, which were comparatively simple, it will take a superstar GM to deal successfully with the issue of resigning Oden this summer. Hope the Vulcans have the sense to keep KP at the helm.
luxury tax
From hoopshype, Portland’s salaries for next year, not including Roy and a few low pay rookies is about $41 mil.
http://hoopshype.com/salaries/portland.htm
I’m not sure why Roy’s salary doesn’t show on there, maybe it was that clause I believe they put in his contract where his salary could fluctuate a little depending on what the salary cap is in a particular year.
I guess next year his salary is what, something like 14 mil? Add a couple mil for the rookies, that’s 16 mil plus the 41 shown on the table on hoopshype. That’s 57 mil.
So if Camby makes 11 mil let’s say, that puts their total salaries for next year at 68 mil.
As I recall they were saying the luxury tax threshold next year was going to be 68 mil.
So it would appear Blazers get in right under the wire. And that assumes that the 68 is a completely hard limit with no ifs ands or buts.
Blazers are making out like bandits to be getting Batum at $1 mil or so. One thing that is sure clear- players don’t get paid much early in their careers, but if they are good and in demand they rake in the dough in their later contracts.
Roy's making 13.5 mmil next year
http://www.storytellerscontracts.info/resources/09-10salaries.htm
storyteller adds up the 2010-2011 contracts (so far) and it comes to 59.5 mil. Camby’s extension now puts the Blazers well over the projected luxury tax threshold
How much more the Vulcans will allow PA to spend this offseason remains to be seen
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
The Deal is more important than the salary.
It doesn’t matter if they “overpaid” a little for him; the salary is only one part.
Once you establish that Camby fits the need for center and back-up power forward, you have to sign him. Why?
You can’t sign anyone else in the $11 million range; the ONLY reason you can sign him is because he is on the roster and they can re-sign him, otherwise the cap stops them from free-agents. Can’t sign and trade. MLE is it. Only thing available: grab Camby (“he’s better than we thought”).
Here’s the kick for the Blazers – by paying him a good salary they don’t need to sign for 3 years with a 36 year old. I could see OKC wanting a top veteran center who still brings it and making a “Millsap” offer. Someone above pointed out how his 2-year contract burns just when they need to start paying all the now cheap kids.
Blazers will do well if they can get Camby to sign while the sun is shining…
GREAT deal!
With Camby playing the way he is right now, Rip City is in pretty good shape for a HUGE upset of the Suns in the first round. Get BRoy back in the second round, and even if he’s not at 100 %, I give the Blazers even money vs either Dallas or the Spurs. If the playoffs play out this way, then Camby is worth every penny for this year alone. Throw in the impact he can make on and off the court for the next couple of seasons, and the deal looks better and better.
The front office has a jistory of throwing a lot more money at much worse players/teammates (see Kemp, Schremph, ZBo), so I find it funny that anyone would complain about Paul Allen cutting a nice check for such a classy guy who can still play…
Besides, they are essentially getting a “two-for-one” deal, if you consider his value as essentially another assistant coach for the young bigs.
"When the power of love overcomes the love of power, the world will know peace." Jimi Hendrix
by philly420pdxhilo on Apr 20, 2010 12:41 AM PDT reply actions
Break down shmake down
Fact of the matter is we are substantially better with this guy in than not. how many things does this guy do stat wise that doesn’t get counted. Where does the idea of knowledge passed down come into play with a fresh mind like Oden?
How much
were the blazers going to possibly pay Paul Millsap? Wasnt it like 4 years 36 million? Getting Camby for 2yr and 20 mill doesnt seem so bad.
paying out half as much $ as Hedo's offer, last July
contract is 40% shorter in guaranteed years
Getting Camby instead of Turk?…priceless
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
reasons for Camby's decision
People have been expressing various opinions on why Camby is signing. A couple more considerations:
1). He mentioned he likes the Blazer players and coaches. But a lot of teams have likeable players and coaches that garner respect from players. I think part of it is simply, with this team that is a KNOWN, since he has already played with them, with other teams there is always some risk of some sort of friction between him and a player or coach that he doesn’t necessarily anticipate beforehand.
2). Since family is a high priority for him, I suspect one reason he is signing now is that he can provide his family some certainty on what their situation is going to be for the next couple years, rather than having to put them in limbo for some months while he tests out the free agent market.
Also, if they plan to move to where he plays for the next 2 years, this gives them more time to move so it’s not as much of a rush. If their attachments to LA are strong enough they want to stay there, well it’s a lot shorter flight for him to visit them from Portland than from most NBA cities, especially New York. Although, there probably aren’t a whole lot of break periods during the regular season to visit out of town family no matter where they are located. My guess would be his family moves to Portland.
with this team that is a KNOWN, since he has already played with them, with other teams there is always some risk of some sort of friction
That’s why you take the chance and bring him in, in Feb. He gets a look at you, you get a look at him…and by the time April rolls around you both know if it’s a marriage, or not
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Anyone else remember the day the team made the trade for Buck Williams?
I remember thinking “this is it, this is the missing piece that will get us back to the Championship.” I’m thinking the same thing today.
Most folks seem to be talking about money or terms or wondering about GO’s reaction. I am thinking about having a three man rotation of Oden/Camby/LMA upfront. That is an amazing, versatile juggernaut:
1) Oden and Camby: Imagine the “block party” those two will have. Camby is one of the best weak-side shot blockers in the game. Imagine Camby playing the high post and feeding GO in the low post. Boomshakalacka! People have been begging for a back-up PF for the past two seasons. With all due respect to Juwan, Camby is far more formidable on the defensive end, and an even better passer on the offensive end.
2) Camby and LMA: We saw the results in Phoenix on Sunday. Camby’s ability to switch onto Amare was absolutely the key to the victory. He is a guy who has the size and length to really play center, but also the quickness to play out on the floor against PFs and on switches.
3) Oden and LMA: the original should remain our mainstay.
In my mind, Camby is a perfect compliment to our other two big men. As much as I love Pryz, and his grit and determination, Camby can do more.. Like Pryz, he is a great rebounder and a good shot blocker. Unlike Pryz, he can legitimately play both the 4 and the 5. He can play out on the court, and he has a decent face-up shot that has to taken into account by the opposing defense.
Obviously, he is long in the tooth and the team had to pay him a bit of a premium, but now that we are over the cap anyway, that just increases our trading options for the future. I totally disagree with Timbo’s argument about the money. Once you are over the cap, expiring contracts are the best way to facilitate trades. Extending Camby gives us flexibility to see how Pryz recovers; gives us insurance against additional injuries; gives us flexibility on the floor; and gives us future options for trading Pryz or MCEC, next year or the following year.
This definitely looks like another outstanding move by Pritchard and/or ownership.
by upper left corner on Apr 20, 2010 9:00 AM PDT reply actions
People have been begging for a back-up PF for the past two seasons
Yes, we have…but I was hoping for a banger and not “another” skinny guy
Oh well, Greg will be back in “beast” mode soon enough. And Juwan has provided the hard fouls. Hopefully, Pendy will pick up the slack in years to come
Don’t get me wrong, I love what Camby brings to both ends of the floor…I even like his shooting motion…as long as it goes in!
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Great deal !!
My faith in the braintrust is restored.
Mills ,Blake jr, Martell and the draft pick are expendable this summer, imo.
I may be the only one who likes the idea of bringing the real Blake ( who dropped a triple double for the Clips last game ) back as a back up pg, for insurance.
Take it to the Suns tonight….
Go Blazers !!!!
Til the wheels fall off.... Marcus Camby
Go Blazers !!
I may be the only one who likes the idea of bringing the real Blake…back as a back up pg, for insurance.
I’m 50/50 on bringing Steve back. First, how much will it cost? If you use the MLE on Blake is that the best FA to spend 5 mil on? (And with the team over the luxury tax, you’d be paying him 10 mil in LT dollars)
And there’s the issue “would Nate only use SB as insurance?” I think we both know how that would work out = more PT for Blakey than he’s really deserving of
In theory it’s a good idea. But let’s see how Bayless does during the playoffs first, before sinking all that dough on a “backup PG” with very well-known deficiences
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
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