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Offense or offensive?




How many of you like our offense? Well if you do then you won't want to continue reading but if you don't then read on!

Our current offense seems to about creating space to get off jumpshots. Has any team that shot jumpshots ever won an NBA Championship? I doubt. We all know its about getting as many easy shots as possible, 'Points in the paint'. Piant points win Championships! Just because we have a few players that can score in the paint does not make us a good team at scoring in the paint. Its about a team philosophy, a system designed to get everybody scoring at the rim. Can our players become accustomed to look to drive the ball instead of settling for the jumpshot? Way the hell not. This jumpshooting system that we are playing is clearly not working. We don't shot a high FG% and we have to work much harder to score than we make our opponents do. Its not like our defense is good, cause its barely average.

I don't know if its possible to get him but I'd like to have Rick Adelman coach us next season. Mainly cause I believe that a free flowing high post offense suits us best. Adelman's Kings had 2 bigs that could pass the ball in Webber and Divac. While Oden and Aldridge would need to improve their passing a little, it could still work. Webber didn't come into the league as a great passer of the ball, he learnt to do it under Rick. Oden and LMA could as well. Its not like our posistioning has to change alot since LaMarcus spends a lot of time around the free throw line anyway. Aldridge's passing has improved a lot this season and this would allow a ton of space for Roy, Bayless, Rudy and Batum to drive to the basket more. Oden's FT% is quite decent so I don't know why he doesn't take a bit more 10-14 ft jumpers to keep the defense honest. It wouldn't surprise me if thats what he will be working on in the summer. The High Post offense will negate the need for playmaking PGs and helps the team to move the ball more than we currently do. It also requires that players run more to get open either for shots at the rim or open perimeter shots.  It should also be succesfull against zone defenses. I can picture Bayless bringing the ball up the court and looking for Oden in the low post and LMA around the free throw line. Jerryd will likely find it a challenge feeding the big guy all the time so he passes to LMA. LaMarcus has the whole court in front of him and waits for Roy to come from behind him to cut to the basket. LMA pumpfakes him man and creates a passing lane to get the ball to Roy cutting to the hoop.2pts! Its time we stop lambasting him for not scoring inside more and allow him to play his game. In time Oden will be able to pass as well and LMA can play from the low post and take turns.

While I don't expect the players will be able to change into this system in one training camp, I do want to see this high post offense played at least 30% of the time. Its doable but probably not under Nate.

I know our chances at getting Adelman to coach us next season is slim to none but either way, this is the offense I'd like to see implemented for 2010-2011.

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Why change a good thing?

Hollinger currently has us 6th in offensive efficiency and Basketball Reference has us 7th. This is considerably better than Adelman’s Rockets, who fall towards the middle of the pack in offensive efficiency in both measures. If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it.

I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer.—Dune

by Muad'Dib on Mar 6, 2010 6:46 AM PST reply actions  

Oh brother!

So as I do agree with your frustration with our offense, I have to question your belief that Adelman will make us a better team period. The last thing this team needs to do right now is deal with another change. Everyone on this team up to coach Nate is still trying to prove themselves and find what works. Give it time. Oh, and our defense is one of the best in the NBA. It is the reason we have the record we do now.

by chea on Mar 6, 2010 6:51 AM PST reply actions  

no
our defense is one of the best in the NBA. It is the reason we have the record we do now

I fight like a girl
"Being mad ruins my day way more than it ruins the day of the person I’m mad at." -Dave

by galacticlove on Mar 6, 2010 7:56 AM PST up reply actions  

yes

I am referring to a healthy Blazers unit. My bad!

by chea on Mar 6, 2010 9:37 AM PST up reply actions  

It was the reason for our record in the first half

however, in the second half it has been our offense. Now, our defense is below average.

by jnewhouse on Mar 6, 2010 1:54 PM PST up reply actions  

good defense, or good defensive players?

our defense was elite before Joel and Oden went down, then it went down the pooper. That’s a sign that the team relies on the bigs for defense, and that those two players are great at what they do, but that the system doesn’t work on the defensive end for the other guys

by HailOden! on Mar 6, 2010 2:02 PM PST up reply actions  

Wrong...

It means you need a center and depth in the front court to play good defense in the NBA. Take away the top two centers on any NBA team and see if their defense is affected.

PTB Liberation Day - 2/10/04

by tssbro on Mar 6, 2010 4:55 PM PST up reply actions  

Forget about Adelman

Let’s get Iron Man and have him suit up as a player/coach!

(if we’re going to wish for things that can’t/won’t possibly come true…why not go all out?)

by Marvin100 on Mar 6, 2010 6:55 AM PST reply actions   1 recs

Our pace is the slowest in the league (30th) and it was slow last year at 29th.

Last year we ended the season at #2 in offensive efficiency. This year we haven’t had enough time together but still rank 7th. This leads me to rethink the idea that we take too many shots late in the clock. Bad shots will not take you to 2nd in the league on offense (7th this year).

The only explanation for a very slow pace and a very high offensive rating is we work the ball for a good shot. Hence, a shot late in the clock is not bad as long as it’s not a desperation shot. Sometimes this can lead to a boring looking offense, ala the Spurs recent history. But you can’t argue with their success.

Contrary to the Spurs, when this team has had some time to gel, it’s going to be some fun basketball to watch. Think…last 20-25 games last year. Some of the finest, most exciting ball to watch of any team last season.

Romance me with that Roy rainbow shot which took flight from way beyond the arc and sailed so high that before it came back down to earth sealing the victory, it kissed the rafters and said "You're mine baby."

by Blazer1342 on Mar 6, 2010 7:20 AM PST reply actions  

Sometimes this can lead to a boring looking offense, ala the Spurs recent history. But you can’t argue with their success.

This has been my take, as well. Nate’s system may not be a carbon copy of the Spurs’ but the grind-it-out teams tend to do better in the post season than offenses that rely on the SSOL philosophy. But there are more elements to winning the title than just playing a slow pace, of course. Team defense and scrappy rebounding are also critical, and I’m not sure that Nate and his staff have all their ducks in a row, especialy regarding PnR defense, etc. But at the end of the season, hoisting the trophy is the ultimate goal, and if one of the “sacrifices” that fans have to make is watching a boring offense for 82+ games a year to eventually reach the top of the mountain, then it will be worth it all.

When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!

by two4larue on Mar 6, 2010 11:14 AM PST up reply actions  

I was parroting the mantra of bad shots and late shots.

But you can’t have it both ways, somewhere along the way you have to look at the data and realize there can’t be that many bad/late shots or our offensive efficiency would suck.
Yes, it could be better this year, but 7th isn’t too bad for a group that still really doesn’t know each other.

Romance me with that Roy rainbow shot which took flight from way beyond the arc and sailed so high that before it came back down to earth sealing the victory, it kissed the rafters and said "You're mine baby."

by Blazer1342 on Mar 7, 2010 7:57 PM PST up reply actions  

borring but good

I’ll take wins over suns basketball any day.

by vullkem116 on Mar 6, 2010 7:49 AM PST reply actions  

Adelmans Kings were a jump shooting team that never won an NBA championship

#10, #21, #52

Pie Doesn't Win Championships, Cake Wins Championships

by The Arkitect on Mar 6, 2010 9:30 AM PST reply actions   2 recs

yup

Ball handling and dribbling are my strongest weaknesses."—David Thompson

by Benson on Mar 6, 2010 9:34 AM PST up reply actions  

Adelman, Really??

What is this fixation with Rick Adelman from those that dont like coach Nate?

The guy has missed the playoffs or lost in the first round just about half of his seasons in the NBA. His talented roster is playing .500 ball this year, averages only 3 ppg more than the Blazers, and shoots a worse FG %.

The high post is a nice system if you have the tools to run it well. I’m not sure the Blazers have the players to run that system right now.

Ball handling and dribbling are my strongest weaknesses."—David Thompson

by Benson on Mar 6, 2010 9:34 AM PST reply actions  

in rick's defense

his starting center is 6’6

Awesomeness (ô'səm-nes)
1. n. Something that inspires awe
2. n. Nicolas Batum

by thomasikehara on Mar 6, 2010 11:13 AM PST up reply actions  

and ours was 400 years old

until about 3 games ago

Ball handling and dribbling are my strongest weaknesses."—David Thompson

by Benson on Mar 6, 2010 11:38 AM PST up reply actions  

Nostalgia, I suppose

time to bring the old guys out of retirement too! (RIP, Kevin).

by jigglyai on Mar 6, 2010 5:47 PM PST up reply actions  

Okay.
How many of you like our offense? Well if you do then you won’t want to continue reading…

I like our offense, so I stopped reading as asked.

Wearing the black band for Jarrett Jack, Ime Udoka, Fred Jones, Sergio Rodriguez, Channing Frye, Luke Schenscher, Shavlik Randolph, James Jones, Josh McRoberts, Steven Hill, Jarron Collins, Michael Ruffin, Steve Blake and Travis Outlaw. Sacrificed to the unmerciful god of progress.

Blazersedge.com || New to Blazers' Edge?

by T Darkstar on Mar 6, 2010 9:36 AM PST reply actions   2 recs

i am tired of all these 100 point games

in the slowest offense in the league

Awesomeness (ô'səm-nes)
1. n. Something that inspires awe
2. n. Nicolas Batum

by thomasikehara on Mar 6, 2010 11:12 AM PST reply actions   3 recs

while nate is not a perfect coach

i dont think a coaching change is warented unless something really bad happens, and there is a better alternative available

Awesomeness (ô'səm-nes)
1. n. Something that inspires awe
2. n. Nicolas Batum

by thomasikehara on Mar 6, 2010 11:14 AM PST reply actions  

and isn't rick under contract for next season??

this isn’t college football

Awesomeness (ô'səm-nes)
1. n. Something that inspires awe
2. n. Nicolas Batum

by thomasikehara on Mar 6, 2010 11:15 AM PST reply actions  

Yes Rick is under contract. If Nate continues to learn as he has this season, I think he will be fine.

He does seem to be outcoached by Sloan, Jackson and Karl..oh and Brown. And maybe Westhphall..

by Natsthecat on Mar 6, 2010 2:56 PM PST up reply actions  

That is a pretty big task to not get outcoached by those guys...

but Nate is still 5-6 against them this year with 4 of those losses against Utah. Not great but not really domination except by Sloan.

PTB Liberation Day - 2/10/04

by tssbro on Mar 6, 2010 5:05 PM PST up reply actions  

You know what wins championships?

Being a top team in both offense and defense.

by Sound_Automatic on Mar 6, 2010 3:34 PM PST reply actions  

I would say

the team with the best, healthiest roster.

by Billy Hoyle on Mar 8, 2010 9:30 AM PST up reply actions  

Saying that Nate's offense is the reason we lose

Appears to be ignorant to me. Our offense is better than average, and largely based upon our players – we don’t run with Brandon Roy in the line-up, period, because he doesn’t push tempo, and he’s on the court the majority of the game. Aside from that, our players work to create good shots, get to the free throw line, don’t turn the ball over, and go for offensive rebounds.

Yeah, we don’t get a great amount of points in the paint. Well, we don’t really have an offensive post player right now, so what do you want? When Oden was healthy, we played the ball into the post more; now our team is good at jump shots, so we get good jump shots.

Our offense plays to our strengths as a team. I think any change will hurt the team with the roster as it is.

If you ever hear of someone punching out a girl scout and stealing her Samoas, it was me
- Mortimer

by Clevelander among roses on Mar 6, 2010 4:21 PM PST reply actions   1 recs

perhaps combining macmillans offense with better off the ball movement

as a long time season ticket holder years ago for the utah jazz, i actually grew to enjoy a slow deliberate halfcourt offense as run by jerry sloan. however, there seems to be much more standing around with the blazer offense than with the jazz offense. you have continuous cutting and slashing even when they run a pick and roll.

it seems that even with the successes last season, and the relative success this season (accounting for injuries); there is way too much stagnation on the offensive end for the blazers. we can throw out all sorts of efficiency numbers, but last season the blazers lost in playoffs to a team with much better movement. rockets moved the ball and themselves better, that decided the series. you can’t expect roy to ge thot at the end of every game and win it.

by utahcoyote on Mar 6, 2010 10:41 PM PST reply actions  

Exactly! By the way,

I never said that we should play a run and gun system did I? My point is that the most important stat when judging an offense is NOT offensive efficency! But ‘Points in the paint’. You get that by 1) playing aggresive defense that then allows you to get fastbreak pints, 2) moving the ball and man to maximise ball movement, and 3) not settling for jumpshots.
How are the Thunder playing great defense without a center? They are 4th in the league in opp. FG% and we are below average, so don’t blame this on losing Oden and Pryzbilla.
The reason I mention Adelman is because he has coached a very exciting offensive team when with the Kings and a strong defensive team with the Rockets. Don’t you wonder what he could do with a balanced squad of players like we have?
Regarding the Jazz, they play an offense that requires them to score in the paint and not settle for perimeter shots. Our guys don’t try half as hard as them in trying to get POINTS IN THE PAINT!

by VinnyB on Mar 7, 2010 2:49 AM PST up reply actions  

Why is points in the paint better than offensive efficiency?

This seems to be a completely non-sensical argument, made simply to hate on Nate. If we score efficiently, who cares how it is done? By your logic, you’d rather see the Blazers force everything inside, scoring 70 points but all in the paint, rather than mix it up getting the best shot they can, which is often an open jumper for this team, and getting 100.

Points are not rated on quality, they are all equal. Offensive efficiency is much more meaningful than any other stat in saying whether an offense works, in my opinion.

If you ever hear of someone punching out a girl scout and stealing her Samoas, it was me
- Mortimer

by Clevelander among roses on Mar 8, 2010 7:37 AM PST up reply actions  

we need to slow it down!

We have to many 100 point games and not enough defense is being played, we need to stay around the low 90’s points wise the blazers thrive and do alot better when they are not trying to out score the other team, we are not the Phoenix Suns we cant pull out games like that!

by nolan.waters.kinney on Mar 8, 2010 8:35 AM PST reply actions  

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