Where do you think Portland's talent ranks?
by Gargen on Feb 24, 2010 9:09 PM PST
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PrintIn the comments of one of another fan post, somebody said that the Blazer's have top five talent. My initial thought was "woah, no way"... but after some more thought, I wasn't so sure.
I compared the Blazers to every team to see how I see it all shaking down. There are a couple rules:
- It's based on how much talent the players have this year and this year only. I intentionally used the word "talent" rather than "performance" or "production". Current potential counts, but future potential doesn't, so if you feel Batum would be better in another system, he gets rated accordingly, but if you feel Bayless is a couple years from being a mega-star, he only gets what he's worth this year.
- This is for rosters as they are right now (after the trade deadline). Season ending injuries count, but short term injuries don't.
I compared the starters of every team (mostly from the ESPN NBA depth chart, I made some changes I knew were due to injuries, probably missed some others) to the Blazer's starters, and then compared the benches as a whole.
One last note: although this was inspired by a "fire Nate" post, it's not intended in any way to say where our record should be. That would require a much closer look at injuries/schedule/trades/etc and that's more than I want to get in to right now. It's just a current talent level comparison. Anyway, on to the comparisons:
Atlanta
Marvin Williams = Martell Webster
Josh Smith > LaMarcus Aldridge
Atlanta Bench < Portland Bench
Winner: Portland (cause I trust Roy more than Johnson in the clutch)
Boston
Rajon Rondo > Andre Miller
Ray Allen < Brandon Roy
Paul Pierce > Martell Webster
Rasheed Wallace < LaMarcus Aldridge
Kendrick Perkins = Marcus Camby
Boston Bench < Portland Bench
Winner: Boston (by a hair)
Charlotte
Raymond Felton < Andre Miller
Steven Jackson < Brandon Roy
Gerald Wallace > Martell Webster
Boris Diaw < LaMarcus Aldridge
Tyson Chandler = Marcus Camby
Charlotte Bench < Portland Bench
Winner: Portland
Chicago
Derrick Rose > Andre Miller
Kirk Hinrich < Brandon Roy
Loul Deng > Martell Webster
Taj Gibson < LaMarcus Aldridge
Joakim Noah > Marcus Camby
Chicago Bench < Portland Bench
Winner: Portland
Cleveland
Mo Williams = Andre Miller
Anthony Parker < Brandon Roy
LeBron James > Martell Webster
Antwan Jamison < LaMarcus Aldridge
Shaquille O'Neal > Marcus Camby
Cleveland Bench = Portland Bench
Winner: Cleveland
Dallas
Jason Kidd = Andre Miller
Caron Butler < Brandon Roy
Shawn Marion > Martell Webster
Dirk Nowitzki > LaMarcus Aldridge
Brendan Haywood = Marcus Camby
Dallas Bench = Portland Bench
Winner: Dallas
Denver
Chauncey Billups > Andre Miller
Arron Afflalo < Brandon Roy
Carmelo Anthony > Martell Webster
Kevin Martin < LaMarcus Aldridge
Nene Hilario > Marcus Camby
Denver Bench < Portland Bench
Winner: Denver
Detroit
Rodney Stuckey < Andre Miller
Richard Hamilton < Brandon Roy
Tayshaun Prince > Martell Webster
Jonas Jerebko < LaMarcus Aldridge (side note: wow! Villanueva is already benched)
Ben Wallace < Marcus Camby
Detroit Bench < Portland Bench
Winner: Portland
Golden State
Stephen Curry < Andre Miller
Monta Ellis < Brandon Roy
Anthony Morrow = Martell Webster
Anthony Toliver < LaMarcus Aldridge
Andris Biedrins > Marcus Camby
Golden State Bench < Portland Bench
Winner: Portland
Houston
Aaron Brooks = Andre Miller
Kevin Martin < Brandon Roy
Shane Battier > Martell Webster
Luis Scola < LaMarcus Aldridge
Chuck Hayes < Marcus Camby
Houston Bench < Portland Bench
Winner: Portland
Indiana
Earl Watson < Andre Miller
Luther Head < Brandon Roy
Danny Granger > Martell Webster
Troy Murphy < LaMarcus Aldridge
Roy Hibbert < Marcus Camby
Indiana Bench < Portland Bench
Winner: Portland
LAC
Baron Davis > Andre Miller
Eric Gordon < Brandon Roy
Rasual Butler < Martell Webster
Craig Smith < LaMarcus Aldridge
Chris Kaman > Marcus Camby
LAC Bench < Portland Bench
Winner: Portland
LAL
Derrick Fisher < Andre Miller
Kobe Bryant > Brandon Roy
Ron Artest > Martell Webster
Pau Gasol > LaMarcus Aldridge
Andrew Bynum = Marcus Camby
LAL Bench < Portland Bench
Winner: LAL
Memphis
Mike Conley < Andre Miller
OJ Mayo < Brandon Roy
Rudy Gay > Martell Webster
Zach Randolph > LaMarcus Aldridge (Sacrilege, I know... but this year it's been true, Z-Bo's defense has even raised to semi-OK this year)
Marc Gasol > Marcus Camby
Memphis Bench < Portland Bench
Winner: Portland (a lot closer than I would have thought)
Miami
Rafer Alston < Andre Miller
Dwayne Wade > Brandon Roy
Quentin Richardson = Martell Webster
Michael Beasley < LaMarcus Aldridge
Jermaine O'Neal = Marcus Camby
Miami Bench < Portland Bench
Winner: Portland
Milwaukee
Brandon Jennings < Andre Miller
John Salmons < Brandon Roy
Carlos Delfino < Martell Webster
Luc Richard Mbah a Moute < LaMarcus Aldridge
Andrew Bogut > Marcus Camby
Milwaukee Bench < Portland Bench
Winner: Portland
Minnesota
Johnny Flynn < Andre Miller
Corey Brewer < Brandon Roy
Ryan Gomes = Martell Webster
Al Jefferson = LaMarcus Aldridge
Ryan Hollins < Marcus Camby
Minnesota Bench < Portland Bench
Winner: Portland
New Jersey
Devin Harris > Andre Miller
Courtney Lee < Brandon Roy
Jarvis Hayes < Martell Webster
Yi Jianlian < LaMarcus Aldridge
Brook Lopez > Marcus Camby
New Jersey Bench < Portland Bench
Winner: Portland
New Orleans
Chris Paul > Andre Miller
Morris Peterson < Brandon Roy
Peja Stojakovic > Martell Webster
David West = LaMarcus Aldridge
Emeka Okafor = Marcus Camby
New Orleans Bench < Portland Bench
Winner: New Orleans (another very close one, now THIS is an underachieving team)
New York
Chris Duhon < Andre Miller
Tracy McGrady < Brandon Roy
Wilson Chandler < Martell Webster
Danilo Gallinari < LaMarcus Aldridge
David Lee > Marcus Camby
New York Bench < Portland Bench
Winner: Portland
OKC
Russell Westbrook = Andre Miller
Thabo Sefolosha < Brandon Roy
Kevin Durant > Martell Webster
Jeff Green < LaMarcus Aldridge
Nenad Krstic < Marcus Camby
OKC Bench < Portland Bench
Winner: Portland
Orlando
Jameer Nelson = Andre Miller
Vince Carter < Brandon Roy
Matt Barnes < Martell Webster
Rashard Lewis < LaMarcus Aldridge
Dwight Howard > Marcus Camby
Orlando Bench = Portland Bench
Winner: Portland (only because Roy is more clutch than any of the Magic)
Philadelphia
Jrue Holiday < Andre Miller
Lou WiIliams < Brandon Roy
Andre Iguodala > Martell Webster
Elton Brand < LaMarcus Aldridge
Samuel Dalembert < Marcus Camby
Philadelphia Bench < Portland Bench
Winner: Portland
Phoenix
Steve Nash > Andre Miller
Jason Richardson < Brandon Roy
Grant Hill > Martell Webster
Amare Stoudemire = LaMarcus Aldridge (controversial I know, it's more a condemnation of Amare)
Robin Lopez < Marcus Camby
Phoenix Bench < Portland Bench
Winner: Portland
Sacramento
Tyreke Evans < Andre Miller
Fransisco Garcia < Brandon Roy
Omri Casspi > Martell Webster
Carl Landry < LaMarcus Aldridge
Jason Thompson < Marcus Camby
Sacramento Bench < Portland Bench
Winner: Portland
San Antonio
Tony Parker > Andre Miller
Roger Mason < Brandon Roy
Richard Jefferson = Martell Webster
Tim Duncan > LaMarcus Aldridge
Antonio McDyess < Marcus Camby
San Antonio Bench = Portland Bench
Winner: San Antonio
Toronto
Jarrett Jack < Andre Miller
DeMar DeRozan < Brandon Roy
Hedo Turkoglu > Martell Webster
Chris Bosh > LaMarcus Aldridge
Andrea Bargnani < Marcus Camby
Toronto Bench < Portland Bench
Winner: Portland
Utah
Deron Williams > Andre Miller
Wesley Matthews < Brandon Roy
Andre Kirilenko > Martell Webster
Carlos Boozer > LaMarcus Aldridge
Mehmet Okur = Marcus Camby
Utah Bench = Portland Bench
Winner: Utah
Washington
Randy Foye < Andre Miller
Mike Miller < Brandon Roy
Josh Howard > Martell Webster
Andre Blatche < LaMarcus Aldridge
JaVale McGee < Marcus Camby
Washington Bench < Portland Bench
Winner: Portland
By my count, that makes us the 9th most talented team. Adding Oden and Przybilla would easily jump us several spots.
I'm sure most people would disagree somewhere though. What does everyone else think?
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Long story short...
we have the best team of all time. ever. at everything. In every sport.
New Orleans Saints < Portland Trail Blazers.
The 2012-13 NBA season: a dynasty begins.
Our bench is thin in experience
I like the potential but let’s win a playoff series before we suggest that no bench in the NBA is better than ours.
Did I really do that?
Woah… I did…
Too much Batum love (with a healthy dose of Bayless/Rudy/Juwan/Cunningham love).
Russell Westbrook>>>>>Andre Miller
Russell westbrook is a lot better then Dre and has played better than Dre all year long
"Good, Better, Best, never let it rest until your good is your better and your better is your best." Tim Duncan
Maybe not
Miller ranks 9th in PER at 18.24
Westbrook ranks 15th in PER at 17.48
Miller TS% .534
Westbrook TS% .486
Westbrook is a better defender and rebounder, but overall production and offensive efficiency is another story.
by upper left corner on Feb 25, 2010 7:22 AM PST up reply actions
If Greg and Joel were healthy,
our roster wouldn’t be that far behind the LA’s, Clevelands, and Orlandos of the NBA
Get well Greg! Rip City is still behind you!
If we were healthy:
C- Oden/Joel
PF- Aldridge/Camby
SF- Batum/Webster
SG- Roy/Rudy
PG- Miller/Bayless
That’s a sick 10 man rotation and it’s not even mentioning Howard, Cunningham, or Pendergraph!
Get well Greg! Rip City is still behind you!
No offense Patty
but i dont think he should sniff the rotation (yet) while the other 3 have all played and contributed this year.
Get well Greg! Rip City is still behind you!
Without Oden we're between 8th and 10th
with Oden we’re a top 5ish team pretty easily. With a decent offseason, we could very easily have a top 3 or 4 roster going into next year. We just have to make sure our offseason doesn’t in anyway resemble the one we’ve just experienced.
There are next to no holes, and tons of players to fit into just about any kind of system or scheme you’d want to play.
It’s a Championship caliber roster with the right coach.
right coach being the key term.
"What people need to know is that those pictures were taken a year and a half ago, and I've grown since then." - Greg Oden
by dario argento on Feb 24, 2010 10:47 PM PST up reply actions
I honestly think we are a top 5 TALENTED team when Greg is healthy.
Oden is a top 5 talent at the center position. It’s just his talent is unrealized due to injury and playing time. Without Oden, I say a top 10 talented team.
"What people need to know is that those pictures were taken a year and a half ago, and I've grown since then." - Greg Oden
9th is optimistic but close
No way our bench is better than any bench in the league right now. But 9th isn’t too wild. If we get Oden and Przy back, add another year of seasoning on guys like Batum and Bayless and keep Roy healthy, it jumps way up.
This is a fun activity
In version 2.0 can we add multiple “>” and “<” to indicate the degree of separation (and maybe add them up to determine a winner)? Even more fun! For example, saying the Lebron > Martell or Anthony Parker < Roy is a bit of an understatement. Let’s emphasis it.
I haven’t been following since our game against Boston… Is KG hurt (again)?
Holding out for Hedo
i dont see how anyone can think baron davis is better than andre miller
davis one of worst point guards in league at this point in his career, and he doesnt even give a crap most games.
look at shooting %, and assist/turnover ratio
Baron Davis 55 1856 296 748 39.6 61 220 27.7 196 234 83.8 36 153 189 431 160 99 33 161 15.4
Andre Miller 60 1840 289 645 44.8 13 62 21.0 233 287 81.2 67 131 198 329 128 59 7 121 13.7
davis 28% from 3, but takes 4x as many as miller
He'd be better if he cared like he did in Golden State
I invoked the “current potential” clause on that one.
Well to get an accurate comparison you really have to compare their top guys down to their 15th man
Does it really matter that LeBron is better than Martell? Isn’t it more important to see how LeBron shakes out to be against Roy? And how Anthony Parker lines up against Rudy? Still, a fun thing to look at. I do this in my head all the time.
You are way way way too high on Miller
Millers is better than Derrick Fisher and that’s about it in the West. The only ones that matter in the East are the playoff teams and all of them have better point guards than Miller.
I am hands down the greatest Blazers fan on Blazersedge.
Point Guards Better Than Andre Miller
East
Rajon Rondo – Boston
Devin Harris – New Jersey
Derrick Rose – Chicago
Mo Williams – Cleveland
Delonte West – Cleveland
Brandon Jennings – Milwaukee
Jameer Nelson – Orlando
Gilbert Arenas – Washington
West
Chauncey Billups – Denver
Russell Westbrook – Oklahoma City
Deron Williams – Utah
Monta Ellis – Golden State
Baron Davis – Los Angeles Clippers
Steve Nash – Phoenix
Tyreke Evans – Sacramento
Jason Kidd – Dallas
Aaron Brooks – Houston
Chris Paul – New Orleans
Tony Parker – San Antonio
Point Guards on the Same Level as Andre Miller
East
Nate Robinson – Boston
Chris Duhon – New York
Allen Iverson – Philadelphia
Louis Williams – Philadelphia
Jose Calderon – Toronto
Jarrett Jack – Toronto
Kirk Hinrich – Chicago
Will Bynum – Detroit
Rodney Stuckey – Detroit
T.J. Ford – Indiana
Luke Ridnour – Milwaukee
Mike Bibby – Atlanta
Raymond Felton – Charlotte
West
Jonny Flynn – Minnesota
Stephen Curry – Golden State
Shannon Brown – Los Angeles Lakers
Jose Juan Barea – Dallas
Kyle Lowry – Houston
Mike Conley – Memphis
Darren Collison – New Orleans
Point Guards Worse Than Andre Miller
East
Keyon Dooling – New Jersey
Sergio Rodriguez – New York
Jrue Holiday – Philadelphia
Marcus Banks – Toronto
Lindsey Hunter – Chicago
Acie Law – Chicago
Jannero Pargo – Chicago
Sebastian Telfair – Cleveland
Chucky Atkins – Detroit
Travis Diener – Indiana
A.J. Price – Indiana
Earl Watson – Indiana
Jeff Teague – Atlanta
D.J. Augustin – Charlotte
Rafer Alston – Miami
Carlos Arroyo – Miami
Anthony Johnson – Orlando
Jason Williams – Orlando
Earl Boykins – Washington
Randy Foye – Washington
West
Anthony Carter – Denver
Ty Lawson – Denver
Ramon Sessions – Minnesota
Eric Maynor – Oklahoma City
Kevin Ollie – Oklahoma City
Jerryd Bayless – Portland
Patrick Mills – Portland
Ronnie Price – Utah
C.J. Watson – Golden State
Jordan Farmar – Los Angeles Lakers
Derek Fisher – Los Angeles lakers
Steve Blake – Los Angeles Clippers
Bobby Brown – Los Angeles Clippers
Goran Dragic – Phoenix
Beno Udrih – Sacramento
Rodrique Beubois – Dallas
Garrett Temple – Houston
Jamaal Tinsley – Memphis
Marcus Williams – Memphis
Marcus Thorton – New Orleans
George Hill – San Antonio
I am hands down the greatest Blazers fan on Blazersedge.
If you credit NO with Paul then why not credit Portland with Oden?
(both out with knee injuries)
Fun run of fantasy basketball – too bad the game doesn’t cooperate like this.
"The one thing we said about this team right away is they mirror what their coach's personality is and that's to be hard-nosed and play extremely hard and play with intensity." - Alvin Gentry
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