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We should not have traded Martell Webster for a D-League player

I have heard multiple times on this site and the radio that the Martell for Luke Babbitt trade has turned out to be a dumb move because he is in the d-league now. Every time I hear that I can't help but think "what are you talking about? We didn't trade Martell for Babbitt." We traded Martell Webster for a backup small forward spot and minutes, and for a rookie who didn't need minutes. The blazers at the time they made the trade were probably already thinking about the free agency period, and the player that they coveted played that position. Wesley Matthews is without question better than Martell. Martell dreams of one day becoming what Wes is in his sophomore season. He is way better at defense and attacking the rim. I know Martell would have been very upset about playing the role Babbitt is playing this year. This is why I think that was a good trade. I also don't think going to the D-league is a bad thing. Its a chance to get him game minutes since we don't have enough to go around and we can call him back up if needed (like we just did).


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Webster was a salary casualty

more than anything, they probably would have kept had he not been getting $5 million….

Webster’s D was far better than he tends to get credit for too…the Big difference between Webby and Wesley is wesley fights over picks better…

"Oh Yeah!" ~ Kool Aid Man

by PDXBuckeye on Dec 20, 2010 1:49 PM PST reply actions  

probably so

but not as wide a gap as most would assert is all I am saying. Let me put it another way, Webby was no longer a defensive liability, his early reputation clouded many people’s judgment though.

"Oh Yeah!" ~ Kool Aid Man

by PDXBuckeye on Dec 20, 2010 1:57 PM PST up reply actions  

+1

the only reason i think it gets magnified to that level is that martells offense is so streaky and offense is easier to judge than defense…so people naturally assume martell had a bad game if he didnt shoot well.

Roy is like herpes...he comes and goes, but we are stuck with him for life.

by Philthyanimal on Dec 20, 2010 4:13 PM PST up reply actions  

definitely.

and given that level of performance assessment, poor broy’s got no hope unless that quick first step and crossover comes back.

"If you've got the hoops version of love handles they'll expose them mercilessly." - Dave

by Oh. Em. Gee. on Dec 27, 2010 12:26 AM PST up reply actions  

It's more than that.

Wesley is better at keeping scorers out of their sweet spots, seems to get beat less, and is more aggressive. He’s also a better team defender.

Webster’s only advantage over Matthews is that he’s a better athlete. Both work hard and hustle but Wesley is definitely an upgrade on defense.

"I don't get much. I don't expect much. I don't give much. I'm generally happy with whatever comes my way."

by Benjamanic on Dec 20, 2010 4:49 PM PST up reply actions  

and yet even more than that.

If they hadn’t traded Webs then it’s likely that the team never makes a run at Matthews in free agency and we end up missing out on him.

Babbit looks like he’s maybe a scrub, but if that’s the cost of getting Matthews I’ll take it.

by nikolokolus on Dec 20, 2010 9:51 PM PST up reply actions  

“Webster’s only advantage over Matthews is that he’s a better athlete.”

I don’t think so. Wesley’s quicker and more agile with less body weight.

by JakeN1985 on Dec 20, 2010 10:43 PM PST up reply actions  

Yea, Webster's defensive advantage is size

He’s better able to handle big strong guys like Melo and is a more capable rebounder and shot blocker (when he’s on).

On the offensive side of the ball, Matthews’ ability to attack the basket and manufacture high-percentage looks without the team having to run plays for him is invaluable. Matthews seems to be no better scoring off the bench, however.

"...it was like he brought his own personal cross-wind to the arena." - Dave

by DC Blazer on Dec 21, 2010 9:24 AM PST up reply actions  

I agree

I’m hoping Babbitt gets to stay in PDX for a couple of games and get some minutes.

by jons_guitar on Dec 20, 2010 1:54 PM PST reply actions  

2010 draft one of the worst ever for blazers

They went went in with two mid first round picks and came out with nothing plus giving away Webster, a parting gift from KP I guess. It would have been better to just give the two picks away for nothing.

by Planet29 on Dec 20, 2010 1:55 PM PST reply actions  

Elliott hasn't even played yet

and Luke at least has skills for a 6’9’’ guy, he just needs to quicken up. I think it’s a little early to be passing definitive judgments on the draft that happened 6 months ago.

"If I had a dime for every basket I made today, you'd still suck!" - from the book 'John Dies @ the End'

by sammymohawk on Dec 20, 2010 2:40 PM PST up reply actions   1 recs

agree and disagree

I didn’t like seeing webster go but i think babbitt could be a good player in the future

by Ryan Tade on Dec 20, 2010 2:02 PM PST reply actions  

Don't forget about Ryan Gomes.

"I hate to advocate weird chemicals, alcohol, violence, or insanity to anyone but they've always worked for me." - Dr. Hunter S. Thompson

by Mr.Howl on Dec 20, 2010 2:09 PM PST reply actions  

The decision to part ways with Martell was more about being a fiscally responsible team than it was trying to upgrade. Everyone knew Webster was a better player than Babbitt when the deal & draft went down. But the Blazers had seen enough to know Martell wasn’t worth what he and his agent would likely ask when his (then) current contract was up. The Blazers already had Roy, Batum and Fernandez with no real way of knowing that Brandon wouldn’t be Brandon this season. Plus they had their eyes on Matthews who is a far, FAR better player than Martell is.

It’s good to remember that trades don’t just happen on a 1-1 basis in terms of immediate upgrades on both sides. Sometimes you trade a player because, for what you SHOULD pay him, he doesn’t fit into your system anymore based on the personnel you already have.

"You know, when you are in the game, you hear 20,000 people behind you, you don't feel anything."
- Nicolas Batum on playing through his shoulder injury during the 2010 playoffs.

by halo_on on Dec 20, 2010 2:11 PM PST reply actions   1 recs

I have been told by a friend inside the organization a few years back.

That Webster was a bit of a head case. He took criticism real personally and would be in a funk for weeks at a time. I think that played a bigger role than people realize. That and forcing Nate to play Batum.

witty statement here

by Escrote on Dec 20, 2010 2:34 PM PST reply actions  

Trading Martell for the 16th pick to free up salary was a good move, and the Wesley acquisition has worked out much better than I expected. At the time, I though Babbitt was a solid pick. The early returns on it aren’t good. Its so far looking like a weaker draft than most people thought— only Wall, Cousins, Favors, Bledsoe and Booker have been anything other than awful so far. Looks like maybe Landry Fields would have been the right pick, but them’s the breaks. I’m not ready to totally give up on Babbitt yet either, but he sure looks panicky and has been horrible ineffective so far.

by jksnake99 on Dec 20, 2010 3:11 PM PST reply actions   1 recs

Right, it was a financial thing. I stand by my earlier assessment of it and the subsequent moves, too.
“In an odd way, everyone lost in this deal. The Minnesota T’wolves gave up way too much in value — although Ryan Gomes’ partially guaranteed contract might’ve been overvalued at the time — for a mediocre player in Martell Webster.

The Portland Trail Blazers overpaid financially for a mediocre role player, as well as drafted someone in Luke Babbitt who’s flawed and doesn’t fill a need whatsoever.

The Utah Jazz lost a guy, Wes Matthews, who fit its system well, while replacing him with an over-the-hill Raja Bell.

The Los Angeles Clippers moronically wasted precious cap space on Ryan Gomes.

So yeah, everyone’s a loser!"

http://www.blazersedge.com/2010/7/17/1570685/summer-league-game-4-open-thread#42303735

"They say it has no memory. That’s where I want to live the rest of my life. A warm place with no memory."

by AK1984 on Dec 20, 2010 4:23 PM PST up reply actions  

You still think Wes is a "mediocre role player"?

He’s not the second coming of Brandon Roy, but he looks like a solid starter/sixth man. At bare minimum, he’s a good role player.

"...it was like he brought his own personal cross-wind to the arena." - Dave

by DC Blazer on Dec 21, 2010 9:28 AM PST up reply actions  

I hated the Martell move and I hate it even more now.

I hated the Bayless dumping, and I hate that one even more now, too.

The draft of Claver was terrible and the draft of Babbitt was terrible.

All this seems really obvious.

"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal

by timbo on Dec 20, 2010 3:29 PM PST reply actions  

I'm more "meh" on those moves

We don’t have room roster or salary wise for Webster plus he was hurt to start the year. We could use his shooting, but not at that price.
We should have tried to get more for Bayless, but he’s another guy that doesn’t fit here and needs more minutes.
Non lottery picks are very hit and miss, I don’t really care that Claver and Babbitt aren’t good picks. It happens.

I’d say the Bayless move was the worst one. Even if he doesn’t fit we can use him on the 2nd unit.

None of them were good moves, but none of them are hurting the team. We’d still be struggling.

#52

by Magnum on Dec 20, 2010 3:38 PM PST up reply actions  

I hated the Bayless move at the time

But moving him has cleared many of the minutes Rudy is taking now. If Rudy continues to return to form it will make the Bayless dump look good, IMO.

"...it was like he brought his own personal cross-wind to the arena." - Dave

by DC Blazer on Dec 21, 2010 9:31 AM PST up reply actions  

agree but

W/R/T Babbitt and Williams – who was better that would have reasonably been drafted instead? You can’t pick whatever late 2nd-rounder has hit, because that’s not the replacement pick.

I think this is a rock/hard place situation. The 2010 Draft was supposed to be good (it doesn’t look that great) and the 2011 Draft, bereft; so trading out wasn’t really that viable.

In retrospect, the move would have been to trade both #1’s for (say) Denver’s 2010 and 2012 #1 picks.

M, period. Fresh, comma.

by manzell on Dec 20, 2010 5:26 PM PST up reply actions  

I'm fine with both

They made sense financially and both Jerryd and Martell clearly wanted out. We got assets for both and in the case of Martell, we got the freedom to go after Matthews.

by MadBlaze on Dec 20, 2010 11:09 PM PST up reply actions  

The Webster trade was about freeing time at SF for Batum and Webster requested to be traded rather than play backup anymore.

After you consider the cost of Babbitt and paying off Gomes the money issues were very secondary.

"You're not too smart, are you? I like that in a man." - Matty Walker in Body Heat (1981)

by BlazerFanSince1970 on Dec 20, 2010 4:30 PM PST reply actions  

I was irate during the draft

We missed on a talented french big man in Kevin Seraphin and he was still on the board. Just like taking Victor Claver in 09 when we could of drafted Rodrigue Beaubois. Ugh.

Draft Terrence Jones

by 420Phenom on Dec 20, 2010 4:45 PM PST reply actions  

yea

I was hoping we were going for Seraphin. Size and athleticism is a pretty good combo.

by JeffePortland on Dec 20, 2010 5:03 PM PST up reply actions  

Babs is terrible.

But Marty is more a head case, IMO, than a baller. Every time I look at Webster, I think that WARP could just as easily be referred to as the Marty discount.

I really believe the guy works hard, gives what he has, but ends up w/ the short stick, game after game. I watched him play. I saw his stroke. I witnessed his effort. And I felt the redundancy of his clank. Then I was sad.

by damonrayhymer on Dec 20, 2010 5:55 PM PST reply actions  

Babbit is not an NBA player

he will be playing in Europe by 2012

"you better hide your kids, hide your wives, hide your husbands, cuz dey rapin everbody out here "
-Antoine Dodson

by flynn4blazers on Dec 20, 2010 6:18 PM PST reply actions  

...

I disagree with this post. I hate seeing Martell not on the blazers (has that kind of not right feeling) but it comes down to money and minutes. Martell was incredibly inconsistent and was determined to start over Batum but never could make a case for it.

This caused the Blazers to be somewhat clogged, and then comes the money part. Blazers had to choose who they wanted and it was Batum and Martell wanted more minutes. Babbitt if your classic real rookie, you really dont know if he will be good or not at this point but he can shoot the ball. He is very raw right now, that’s for sure.

Blazers chose Batum as their started… until Wesley Matthews came from the sky.

As for the Bayless trade… I don’t know about that one but the way New Orleans has been playing lately (really bad) that future 1st round pick is looking better every game.

- www.ichabodmedia.com
- www.twitter.com/ichapod

by brandonmitchell on Dec 20, 2010 9:39 PM PST reply actions  

Webless

It would seem that Webster and Bayless wanted more playing time, but with things being the way that they are, Webster incessant clanking and Bayless’s lack of court vision, neither was doing much to earn those minutes. I say goodbye and good luck.

Selling donuts on another planet.

by Arcturas on Dec 21, 2010 10:34 AM PST reply actions  

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