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"It will be interesting to see what happens as Portland is a fit for a sign and trade, but unless the Blazers are willing to move a 2010 draft pick along with Blake and Outlaw, or include Fernandez, who would thrive under Mike D’Antoni and fit the bill at the two position, a sign and trade for Lee seems unlikely."

2 months ago Fff_tiny HurraKane212 25 comments 0 recs  | 

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From the link:

“David Lee

for

Rudy Fernandez

and

Joel Pryzbilla"

I just about fell out of my chair laughing… those poor NY fans… So desperate to have something good happen.

by JordanLeDoux on Aug 30, 2009 2:59 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

The media is the same. If there is a rumor about a trade of Jeffries back to Washington, they write “but the Knicks would of course demand Foye, Young or Miller in the deal” when in reality they Knicks would be happy to shed his salary for a half-eaten sandwich.

With Lee they don’t want to lose him for nothing, but if he signs the QO he won’t be very happy and might leave them like Gordon.

I highly doubt KP considers any trades for Rudy unless he gets a proven star back that can put the team over the top. He is much too cheap and has too much potential to throw him into a deal for another backup at a position with even less minutes available.

There's Gotta Be More To Life

by Norsktroll on Aug 30, 2009 3:36 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I would do

Blake, Outlaw, and 2010 1st rounder for David Lee. But no way the Knicks are ever getting their hands on Rudy!

Roy, Aldridge, Oden, Rudy, Batum, Outlaw, Webster, Bayless, Blake, Miller, Joel... Holy crap!

by axel360 on Aug 30, 2009 3:04 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

I wouldn't

David Lee wouldn’t get enough minutes to make it worth it.

PG is finally a strength for us, we have a very solid rotation with Blake now playing back up. Why give that up for a guy who’s going to be struggling for minutes behind Aldridge?

And love or hate Outlaw he is a good scorer off the bench.

Now sure Blake and Outlaw both expire, but the chances of getting Blake to resign for cheap are higher if we don’t ship him out for one year.

I really like Lee, but I just don’t want to hurt our depth for him to play a few minutes a game, even if he is great insurance for our bigs and would have good production in those minutes. I would rather keep Blake, knowing full well Lee is the better player.

by Bskey on Aug 30, 2009 3:34 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Good luck getting that deal to work, NY blogger-man!

Lee would be BYC in any sign-and-trade and since Portland no longer has cap room to absorb the extra salary, essentially NY would have to send at least one other significant salary to the Blazers to make it work – and Portland would also have to send out more than just Blake and Outlaw.

1) Who on NY’s payroll would Portland want? Hill and Gallinari perhaps, but I expect they would not be available.

2) Who on Portland’s roster would NY want? The Blazers don’t have any more expiring contracts, and NY’s unwillingness to disrupt their plan for cap space in 2010 makes it unlikely that they’ll take any non-expiring deals other than perhaps Bayless, Rudy or Batum – but as already mentioned, they’re not available for Lee, IMO.

by Storyteller on Aug 30, 2009 7:41 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I posted this in the "Knicks Want Rudy" thread

with respect to the difficulty with Lee’s BYC status.

I don’t think Lee will agree to a sign and trade with the Blazers.
He wants to start and play 30+ minutes. There’s only about 10-12 minutes available behind LMA. He’d want another 20 minutes at center. I don’t see him starting at center or getting that much time. Joel is a better defender, and GO has a more important future and needs all the minutes he can stay on the court.

Another large problem with a sign and trade for Lee is that he would be a BYC player. That makes trades very difficult.

For instance, without our $2.7M in cap space, if we traded Outlaw ($3.6M) plus Rudy ($1.2M) for Lee now we could take back $6.1M (125%*$4.8M + 100K). If Lee signed for $6M (he probably wouldn’t) then the Knicks could only take back $3M (because Lee is BYC) * 125% + 100K = $3.85M, so the deal doesn’t work. However, if NY threw in Joe Crawford the deal would just work because Crawford has a minimum salary (0.74M) which counts as an outgoing salary for Knicks but not as incoming salary for Blazers (according to my reading of Larry Coon’s salary cap FAQ #70).

But I wouldn’t trade Rudy in a deal for Lee. He has more value to us than Lee as long as Joel remains here (which I think he will).

A deal that would work, and one that I would do, would be to wait for the salary cap money at the start of the season and then trade Outlaw ($3.6M) plus Bayless ($2.1M) plus use our $2.7M in cap space for Lee ($7.6M) plus Crawford ($0.74M). (Knicks can receive $4.54M * 125% + 100K = $5.8M). We could go as high as $8.4M for Lee’s salary and the deal still works. Crawford’s minimum salary is again necessary to make the deals work.

Lee would probably be ok with that salary, but not the playing time in Portland. I doubt the Knick’s would value Bayless and Outlaw’s expiring contract enough to do the deal. But they are in a pickle because if they want to sign a max player like Wade or Lebron next summer they may have to renounce Lee then to get the cap space they will need (assuming he signs a decent one year deal with them now) to sign one of those guys.

I think the BYC calculations above are correct but if I messed something up I’m sure Storyteller or AK will correct me. :)

by BlazerFanSince1970 on Aug 30, 2009 8:18 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Your numbers look fine

I just don’t see Lee sitting out the entire training camp and preseason just to wait for Portland to get cap space – all to play 12-14 MPG behind Aldridge. As you point out, playing time is a huge issue.

by Storyteller on Aug 30, 2009 10:19 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Exactly. I just don't see why Lee would want to come to Portland, but

at least this is a BYC deal that works on paper, probably satisfies his current salary requirements (most likely adjusted lower by now), and has a finite (but low) probability of satisfying the Knicks. But the playing time issues seem insurmountable.

by BlazerFanSince1970 on Aug 30, 2009 10:41 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

What about this?

David Lee (signed starting 7 mil), Jared Jeffries (6.4), Chris Duhon (6.0)

FOR

Martell Webster (4.3), Travis Outlaw (4.0), Steve Blake (4.9), Jerryd Bayless (2.1)

I don’t know… Lee would be backup SF and PF, just like Outlaw is now, while Duhon would be a good backup PG, and Jefferies would rot on the bench. Has potential, but I’m not sold.

by JordanLeDoux on Aug 30, 2009 3:30 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Yeah, the only way that the New York Knicks should tie up future cap space is if Donnie Walsh ...

could, oh, magically pry Amar’e Stoudemire away from the Phoenix Suns. Personally, I’m not a fan of Stoudemire; however, if Walsh could hypothetically obtain him for rookie big man Jordan Hill, Cuttino Mobley’s heavily insured expiring contract, Chris Hunter and Joe Crawford’s non-guaranteed deals, and $3,000,000 in cash considerations, then he should do it as a way to appease Mike D’Antoni and hopefully entice LeBron James to leave Cleveland for the Big Apple come 2010.

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=klr9zs

For the Suns, the only way this trade would ever happen is if Robert Sarver demanded that Steve Kerr cut costs for this upcoming season. In this example, here’s what the Suns would save by making my abovementioned trade proposal.

1. From the trade, the Suns would cut $2,922,205 in payroll and save $2,922,205 in pending luxury tax payments.

2. By waiving both Chris Hunter and Joe Crawford, the Suns would cut $1,472,840 in payroll and save $1,472,840 in pending luxury tax payments

3. Due to Cuttino Mobley’s contract being 80% insured, the Suns would recieve a $7,600,000 check to reimburse the team’s costs.

4. In total, that’s a savings of $16,390,090 for a player in Stoudemire who’s reportedly stated that he’d like to play elsewhere after this season.

Yet, the Suns would have to still be more creative to slide below the luxury tax level of $69,920,000 this season; though, it may be accomplished by waiving Sasha Pavlovic — whose contract is just partially guaranteed for $1,500,000 — and also trading Jared Dudley to a team like the Cleveland Cavaliers for Darnell Jackson and Jawad Williams, who both have non-guaranteed contracts and would be waived immediately after the trade.

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=nrojxu

That’d ultimately give the Phoenix Suns with a payroll of $48,263,909 in 12 active players, $9,500,000 in 1 inactive player whose contract would be 80% insured, and $11,500,000 in two waived players. In total, that’d be a payroll of $69,263,909 and just $61,663,909 out of Sarver’s account.

Stupid people have stupid ideas.

by AK1984 on Aug 31, 2009 2:06 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

From what I saw, Amar'e said this "might be his last year in Phoenix"

So I don’t think he actively wants a trade, but he doesn’t expect to resign.

Still, that’s quite an impressive money-saving plan.

You can measure skill and talent with your eyes, but productivity is shown through statistics.

by austinpwnz on Aug 31, 2009 2:50 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah, there's also some other benefits to it.

1. Jordan Hill was a star for the Arizona Wildcats, so he’s got some local ties in Phoenix.

2. With Amar’e Stoudemire joining the Knicks, that hurts the Utah Jazz’s chances of getting a top-five or so pick from New York in the 2010 NBA Draft.

3. I’m not a fan of Hill — who I think too closely resembles Chris Wilcox and Drew Gooden — but at least trading Stoudemire for him on top of cap relief gives casual fans a reason to buy tickets.

Stupid people have stupid ideas.

by AK1984 on Aug 31, 2009 4:29 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Works from NY's end

But Portland doesn’t send out enough salary to be able to bring on those 3. The Blazers are bringing in $19.5 million and only sending out $14.1 million. Portland would have to send out about another $1.6 million to make it work…..

BTW, Blake is actually at $4.0 million and Outlaw is at $3.6 million…..

by Storyteller on Aug 30, 2009 7:48 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I wouldn't want to that trade for our team

Too many good, cheap players going to NY just for Lee and Duhon. Duhon only looks good because of the SSOL offense.

by KitIsh on Aug 30, 2009 11:54 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

agreed, there will be no trades, unless there is one...

KP would be a terrible GM if he turned down a great (hypothetical) trade just because he said we were set. Who knows? Maybe KP gets offered an awesome deal he didn’t foresee.

Come on you gotta listen unto me,
lay off that whiskey and let that cocaine be. ~Johnny Cash

by HurraKane212 on Aug 30, 2009 6:33 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Hence my sig.

*Unless KP has a secret plan that makes this statement incorrect.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
><> ><> ><> ><> ><> ><> ><> ><> ><> ><> ><> ><>

by staylost on Aug 30, 2009 8:25 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

He would use mind control on opposing GMs to make it happen

"if Nate has Roy or Miller in the game at all times, that stagnation will turn into conflagration" -- two4larue

by jscot on Aug 30, 2009 11:47 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Having just watched the Oden compilation above

Lee is posterized in several of those. That is not disgrace but he is certainly not even trying to stop Greg. We wanted toughness down low in the playoffs – is anyone convinced Lee can bring that as a backup center and PF?

by lee3022 on Aug 30, 2009 10:40 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

As has been mentioned by Storyteller and BlazerFanSince1970, the New York Knicks and the Portland ...

Trail Blazers aren’t apt trading partners. Additionally, David Lee would be a poor fit on the Trail Blazers due to his shoddy defense and the minutes crunch that he’d create here.

From my perspective, the Miami Heat remain the best place for Lee to ultimately end up to start the upcoming season. The Heat possess a pleothra of expiring contracts — including Udonis Haslem’s $7,100,000 salary — and, moreover, would be able to absorb Jared Jeffries’ contract in a sign-and-trade deal involving Lee.

Anyhow, as I’ve noted numerous times before this, Donnie Walsh needs to move his ass and get on the ball.

“The first step would be to offer the overrated Wilson Chandler and Eddy Curry’s anchor of a contract to the Sacramento Kings for Kenny Thomas, who’s got an expiring contract and would be released immediately after the trade.

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=kobm3r

The next step would be to work out a sign-and-trade centered around David Lee going to the Miami Heat, so long as Pat Riley is also willing to absorb Jared Jeffries’ contract in any such deal.

1. The New York Knicks re-sign Lee to a six-year, $56,812,500 contract (2009-2010: $7,500,000; 2010-2011: $8,287,500; 2011-2012: $9,075,000; 2012-2013: $9,862,500; 2013-2014: $10,650,000; 2014-2015: $11,437,500), which includes an early termination option he can exercise after the fourth season.

2. The Knicks and Heat subsequently complete the following trade.

FROM MIAMI & TO NEW YORK
PF Udonis Haslem ($7,100,000)
SF Dorell Wright ($2,887,165)
PG Chris Quinn ($1,050,387)
SG Yakhouba Diawara ($945,000)

Outgoing: $11,982,552 X 125% + $100,000 = $15,078,190
Incoming: $14,936,590

FROM NEW YORK & TO MIAMI
PF David Lee ($7,500,000) {Base-Year Compensation Player}
PF Jared Jeffries ($6,466,600) {15% Trade Kicker}

Outgoing: $10,216,600 X 125% + $100,000 = $12,870,750
Incoming: $11,982,552

For the Heat, Lee would provide efficient low-post scoring and Jeffries would serve as the fifth forward on the team behind Lee, James Jones, Michael Beasley, and Quentin Richardson.

For the Knicks, the team moves Lee for Haslem — who’d split time at power forward with Al Harrington — and dumps Jeffries’ contract for a bunch of players with expiring contracts in Dorell Wright, Chris Quinn, and Yakhouba Diawara. Wright, Quinn, and Diawara would probably be released before the season, too.

As it stands, here are what I think should be Walsh’s top priorities at this juncture.

1. Dump Curry and Jeffries.
2. Sign-and-trade Lee elsewhere.
3. Wait patiently until Nate Robinson reluctantly signs his one-year, $2,911,077 qualifying offer.
4. Don’t take on any long-term contracts, no matter whether its from a trade (e.g., Jackson) or a free-agent signing (e.g., Ramon Sessions).
5. Head into the 2010 off-season with enough cap room to sign two maximum-level free-agents. With that level of financial flexibility, I could envision LeBron James and Amar’e Stoudemire in the Big Apple."

http://www.blazersedge.com/2009/8/29/1006707/captain-jack-has-abandoned-ship#20446236

Oh, and if I’m Walsh, I’d offer three unprotected future first-round draft picks in 2012, 2014, and 2016 — along with $3,000,000 in cash considerations — to the Minnesota Timberwolves for the draft rights of Ricky Rubio.

I’m not sure what kind of fly-by-night plan David Kahn has swirling in his mind, but it’s clear as day that Rubio doesn’t want to be stuck in hockey country. Thus, while Rubio’s value is at its highest due to his prodigious potential, Kahn should ship him off to New York — which is where the Spanish sensation should be anyway — for three future first-round draft picks to set aside for the former sportswriter’s, uh, titanic rebuilding project.

Stupid people have stupid ideas.

by AK1984 on Aug 30, 2009 11:30 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

David Lee is not coming to Portland

1. We don’t have the minutes he wants.
2. If we want a backup PF who can score but also gives up points on the other end, we have one.
3. We don’t have cap space for him.
4. Because of #1 and #2, we aren’t going to give up very much to get him.

All he really provides relative to Travis is rebounding. KP may have been willing to spend cap space to get an upgrade in rebounding, but he isn’t likely to burn 2-3 players with high potential for it. An upgrade in rebound and defense, perhaps, but not rebounding alone.

"if Nate has Roy or Miller in the game at all times, that stagnation will turn into conflagration" -- two4larue

by jscot on Aug 31, 2009 12:18 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

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