Best and Worst: Offseason Moves
by Dave on Jul 29, 2009 12:22 AM PDT
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PrintThe Emeka Okafor-Tyson Chandler deal probably marks the end of the big-time moves for the summer. Basketball guys usually go on vacation in late July and stay away through August. Anything is possible, but the next opportunity for significant moves will probably coincide with the opening of training camp. Until then we're stuck with learning the fate of Ramon Sessions, David Lee, and Lamar Odom. Woo hoo.
So, in a summer where more big names discussed, traded, and re-signed than we've seen in recent memory we're asking you what the best and worst moves have been so far. Which team helped themselves most by a specific move and which team tried to help themselves but are going to end up falling flat on their face? Any move or change of contract status is eligible. Give us your votes below.
--Dave (blazersub@yahoo.com)
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hah, my first bedge first, now i feel like a true basketball nerd!
Free Sergio... no really, please, take him.
Nerd! :)
But who do you not like the trade for? Charlotte? NO?
I think Okafor is better, so naturally I think it’s a better trade for NO.
Okafor is a good Center. Why is NO taking on a bigger, longer contract though? Mysterious...
They save a couple million in years 1 and 2, but are now on the hook for big bucks in years 3 and 4.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Yeah, it's mysterious from NO's perspective
Once of the complaints about Okafor is that many consider him to not be a true center; actually more of a 4/5. It seems a little awkward for New Orleans. Frankly, Charlotte may be getting the better of the deal, especially with salaries considered.
One extemely unlikely reason could be that NO could swing him to Oklahoma..
Oklahoma’s around 9 million under the cap and could do a simple Okafor for Thabo deal. This would give Oklahoma a real strong PF/C and would save NO 9 milion. Extremely unlikely but would seem to make sense.
by philthebballplayer on Jul 29, 2009 11:07 AM PDT up reply actions
Okafur on OK
would definitely strengthen that team. I might then need to start becoming concerned about them.
"Fernandez, to my eyes, is the Blazer who walks that walk most comfortably. A lot of Portland's fans (egged on, dare I say, by their local broadcasters) lament things like how Ron Artest or Yao Ming get to hit Brandon Roy's arms.
But I suspect Fernandez sees all that and thinks: We get to hit arms! Cool!"
http://myespn.go.com/blogs/truehoop/0-39-135/On-Playoff-Experience.html
Off topic but some dude named Dave called into Wheels at work. Sounded exactly like you Dave.
I think it was hour 2 of the podcast. Just had to say that.
Sure you can...
http://www.955thegame.com/Multimedia/ListenLive/tabid/69/Default.aspx
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
I was listening to KHTK a few weeks ago
(that’s the Sacto station that broadcasts Kings games) and a guy called in that I could have sworn was Dave. Same voice, same manner of speaking, knowledgeable, though about the Kings, not the Blazers. You don’t moonlight as a Kings fan, do you, Dave?
hate the Okafor trade if I'm a Bobcats fan
hate the Pistons’ use of their capspace on two overrated players.
hate/love the Raptors overpaying for Hedo and saving us from ourselves.
love the Spurs offseason, and think the good teams (ie LA if they get Odom back, Cleveland, Boston and Orlando) did well.
Very interested to see where the three guys you mentioned end up. I liked them all as Blazer targets even if none of them were ever likely to end up here.
Wow, this is exactly what I thought.
Thanks for saving me the time writing all this out.
I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer.—Dune
Don't you have better things to do than read & comment here?
Like freeing Arrakis from the clutches of the Harkonnen empire?
by MiledAnimal on Jul 29, 2009 9:48 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
That's heading down a treacherous path, M.A.
We all remember how certain members of the “Jail Blazers” had a taste for the ‘spice’…
by DonkeyShins on Jul 29, 2009 11:11 AM PDT up reply actions
I have blue eyes.
My wife says they are the color of diluted Windex.
by MiledAnimal on Jul 29, 2009 11:16 AM PDT up reply actions
Sorry to hear about your impending divorce procedings, man.
;)
I know less than half of you half as well as I should like, and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve.
by haildablazer on Jul 29, 2009 11:42 AM PDT up reply actions
You should hear how my youngest daughter talks to me.
I am way too permissive a husband and parent. I live in terror of how my wife and kids will abuse me when I’m too old to fight back.
by MiledAnimal on Jul 29, 2009 11:48 AM PDT up reply actions
lol
They’ll just stick you in a nursing home with this guy:
“Oh? Your fingers hurt, huh? Well… now you’re back is gonna hurt cause you just pulled landscaping duty!”
I know less than half of you half as well as I should like, and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve.
by haildablazer on Jul 29, 2009 11:51 AM PDT up reply actions
Do you have any idea how boring Bene Gesserit basketball is?
They all stand around flashing looks at each other, and then someone announces what would have happened had they actually moved.
by conspirator5 on Jul 29, 2009 5:56 PM PDT up reply actions
Not sure about LA
Remains to be seen whether the Artest/Ariza swap helped them.
I was uncertain about the Hedo move, so I can’t say I love the Raptors for saving us from ourselves. I tend to think it would have made us quite a bit better in the short term, and in 2-3 years he would have disappeared to the bench. I’m not sure it was a lot different from getting Miller, other than costing Paul Allen more money.
So I might disagree with you on the Hedo thing, but you could well be right.
Other than those two things, I think you nailed it.
When I rule the world, everyone will know how to use Excel.
by jscot on Jul 29, 2009 2:33 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
for a player that peaked 2 years ago like Hedo, a 5 year deal is incredibly dumb
Miller is only guaranteed for 2 years, which is huge.
by jksnake99 on Jul 29, 2009 9:59 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
I don't think it matters
for anything except PA’s bank account.
We won’t have cap space anyway. The only difference is we get an expiring contract, if we decide to move Andre. With Hedo, we would have to wait four years for him to be expiring.
Either move was simply to buy us into contention now rather than waiting a couple years for guys to develop further.
When I rule the world, everyone will know how to use Excel.
I don't get why people aren't more impressed with the Okafor trade
He’s small, but he’s such a better big man than Chandler that it ain’t even funny. He’s being really underrated. He isn’t an allstar, but he’s one of the best centers right now.
Morty
Chris Paul might make him an all-star
C Creg Oden
PF LarMarcus Aldridge
SF Nicholas Batum
SG Brandon Roy
PG Jerryd Bayless
Yeah, he could!
Though I don’t see Okafor as good of a catcher and finisher like Chandler is… I don’t think we’ll see many traditional Paul to Chandler type lobs with Okafor, as he isn’t that kind of athleticism.
But, he has rudimentary yet effective post moves and can score down low, so he should still benefit from playing with the best PG in the game. It’ll just take an adjustment from Paul, an adjustment I have no doubt he can make.
Morty
Hey, I for one am certainly impressed with what New Orleans did getting Okafor
Okafor is freaking awesome. Chandler is kinda good too, but New Orleans definitely got the better end of the stick on that one. Plus I thought Chandler is pretty banged up in the knees.
My religion consists of a humble admiration of the illimitable, superior spirit who reveals himself in the slight details we are able to perceive with our frail and feeble mind.
-Albert Einstein
The journey of a thousand miles begins beneath one's feet.
-Lao Tzu
Too bad...
we only get to see Przybilla square off with Chandler twice this year!
I tend to think this was better for NO than Charlotte. Okafor is a better all around player in my opinion. He is also younger and less injury prone…
"Do me a favor. Put your lip over your head... and swallow." Max Goldman
LOL
That’s the first thing I thought of. And, if Tyson is injured………again, that could be 1 or zero.
by blzrfan1938 on Jul 29, 2009 11:14 AM PDT up reply actions
Younger?
They are separated by 4 days on their birth certificate.
Witty Unpredictable Talent and Natural Game
You've seen their birth certificates?
Can you find one for Obama?
by MiledAnimal on Jul 29, 2009 11:34 AM PDT up reply actions
Yeah, I'll just ask TIH to get a copy for you.
I know less than half of you half as well as I should like, and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve.
by haildablazer on Jul 29, 2009 11:44 AM PDT up reply actions
Coconuts:
Good for eating, and looney tunes! Best thing ever?
I know less than half of you half as well as I should like, and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve.
by haildablazer on Jul 29, 2009 2:26 PM PDT up reply actions
Are you one of the "Birthers"
Did you see that wacky broad (PC) on The Daily Show last night? Wow. Just wow.
Witty Unpredictable Talent and Natural Game
Which one? The Dentist/Lawyer/Real Estate Agent?
That’s a broad resume for sure.
I know less than half of you half as well as I should like, and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve.
by haildablazer on Jul 29, 2009 2:27 PM PDT up reply actions
Yep
She Crazy. Comparing the Obama Presidency to Hitler was awesome.
Witty Unpredictable Talent and Natural Game
There should be a law that no one can say anyone = Hitler
until the person being compared to Hitler kills at least six million people.
There is a law...
It’s called “Godwin’s Law” and while it specifically applies to Usenet it’s applicability is universal:
“As a Usenet discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler approaches 1.”
That’s not exactly the law you’re looking for, but I think it applies.
by conspirator5 on Jul 29, 2009 6:03 PM PDT up reply actions
If the he ever decides to kill of a few million
Maybe he should hire her as his attorney. Or his real estate agent if he ever decides to move to the USA from the District of Columbia.
Witty Unpredictable Talent and Natural Game
Or as his dentist
If he…. needs a… tooth… thingy….
yeah.
…
I know less than half of you half as well as I should like, and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve.
by haildablazer on Jul 30, 2009 12:31 AM PDT up reply actions
If the allegation had no merit it would have died last year.
The lack of concern by Obama’s fans over this issue is both astounding and unsurprising.
Sometimes, though it isn't that some would refuse to believe
solid, legal proof or even a Supreme Court decision in the matter that disturbs me as much as the refusal of some to take such a matter seriously, as if it were unimportant or irrelevant.
Regardless of how this turns out — and I have zero expectation that even solid, legal proof that Obama is not American by birth would result in him resigning from office — I hope future candidates are required to provide ironclad proof that they meet all Constitutional requirements for office before they are allowed to hold office.
As far as I am concerned
It is a matter that had been dealt with many times over and is only cared about by a fringe segment of the population. THAT is why no one worries about it now, when it has come up over and over.
It is a stretch, a HUGE stretch, to say it is being carelessly ignored. It had been examined and brought up several times over the years.
You will never prove to some people that Obama isn’t a terrorist. Doesn’t mean ignoring those who say such things (when there is a lot of people like that) means people are ignoring a real issue.
Mortimer
I'm not the best one to argue this one way or another
because I’ve only been headline-surfing it, but I sure have not seen the proof of Obama’s citizenship that you guys seem to think is so convincing.
There are two sides to this story. Neither has proven anything. I’m content to let it play out to a conclusion. What’s the big deal if it does?
There will never be a conclusion
They show the birth certificate to non-authorities, people will say it is fake.
Just like people who think the moon-landing was fake— some people think it is fun to think something and will continue to think it no matter the lack of evidence.
The birth certificate has been checked and re-checked many times over. It has been checked as much as anyone in public office has ever had their birth certificate checked. Much of the birther’s argument makes much ado about Obama’s dad not being a citizen, as if that matters. It is an argument made up out of nothing and based around his exotic and unique background.
If you have reason to distrust Hawaiian officials who have checked and re-checked the birth certificates, and the doctors who signed it and delivered him, then by all means distrust them. If not, it is a non-issue.
Mortimer
I'm a 9/11 Truther who believes that the Barack Obama Birthers are crazy.
That’s saying something, too.
Stupid people have stupid ideas.
Personally, I believe that 9/11 was an inside job by a one world gov't.
So, in essence, I’m admittedly a conspiracy theorist who believes that a crypto-fascist gov’t (i.e., the New World Order) covertly runs things.
Heck, former Minn. Gov. Jesse Ventura is my absolute favorite person in the media — as he isn’t a total blowhard like Genesis Communications Network radio show host Alex Jones — whenever he makes his guest appearances on Larry King Live as a pundit. I also enjoy watching Real Time with Bill Maher, too, no matter his candid disdain for 9/11 Truthers.
Also, I voted for Libertarian Party presidential nominee Michael Badnarik in 2004, as well as Independent presidential nominee Ralph Nadar in 2008. In the Nadar case, however, it was a matter of voting for the lesser of countless evils, even though I respect the world-renowned Lebanese-American for his work as a consumer advocate since the ’50s and long-lasting populist movement via his numerous runs for the presidency.
I’m a fan of Congressman Ron Paul (R-TX), too, and even voted for him in the 2008 Washington State presidential primaries, although I’m not a gung-ho supporter of him and his paleolibertarian platform. I’m more of a minarchist myself — which explains why I supported Badnarik — yet, I still have a lot of respect for people like Paul, Nadar, and even libertarian socialist thinkers such as Noam Chomsky.
Stupid people have stupid ideas.
by AK1984 on Jul 29, 2009 5:07 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
I'm sure you are aware of the correlation...
between your beliefs and the Biblical parallel to Armegeddon, The End of Times?..
Pretty heavy topic for a Blazer blog isn’t it?..
Yeah, it's odd that my viewpoint is shared by many religionists.
Basically, that makes me one of the small percentage of atheists who’s anti-statist, anti-globalization, anti-Zionist/pro-Palestinian — which is wholly different from anti-Semitism — an advocate of personal liberty, et cetera.
Yet, unlike far-right wingnuts who are conspiracy theorists saying the NWO/Illuminati correlates with the “Book of Revelation” within the Bible, I believe the powers that be are a powerful oligarchy of elitists (i.e., the 13 bloodlines) who’ll do anything and everything to stay in charge.
Whether it’s through the guise of Freemasonry, globalist entities (e.g., Bilderberg Group, Council on Foreign Relations, Trilateral Commission, et cetera), or even international organizations (e.g., United Nations, World Bank, et cetera), I conclude high-ranking members of the NWO worship a false belief system — which, according to many radical ultraconservatives who are extremist born-again Christians and the prototypical right-wing conspiracy theorists, is pure Satanism — who govern in accordance to their foolish, yet damaging religion.
Oh, and on a side note, the crazed conspiracy theorists who say fallen angels are aliens living among us as a draconian race of reptilian humanoids — such as Jeff Rense and David Icke — are completely insane.
Here, let me sum it up for you.
1. I believe that the NWO is a one world government.
2. I believe that members of the NWO worship Lucifer as a deity.
3. I recognize that many fundamentalist evangelicals believe the NWO/Illuminati will soon bring about the end times as foretold by John. Under their scenario, there would be a False Prophet (e.g., the Black Pope), an Antichrist who rules the world (e.g., William Arthur Philip Louis Mountbatten-Windsor), all sorts of disasters across Earth, et cetera.
4. I’m a hardcore atheist who believes in neither Christianity nor Judaism, God/Yahweh nor Lucifer, et cetera; ergo, I think that the NWO is a terrible crypto-fascist government and, moreover, think that the archconservative creationists who are major conspiracy theorists have it backward.
Again, I’ll totally admit that I’m ostensibly off my rocker. That’s life, though. Also, I know my signature of “[s]tupid people have stupid ideas” seems ironic right about now.
Stupid people have stupid ideas.
by AK1984 on Jul 29, 2009 11:51 PM PDT up reply actions 2 recs
that is just awesome AK
I was once in a band that named itself after a chapter in one of Robert Anton Wilson’s books about the Illuminati. Catch 23 – what a great name for a band. Too bad the band never quite measured up to the name. – Elgin
Without you out there, we're nowhere here
You remind me of that scene in
The League of Extraordinary Gentlemen where Dorian Gray says, “I’m complicated.”
There's a lack of concern
Because it’s a crackpot, joke of an allegation.
Witty Unpredictable Talent and Natural Game
I stand corrected!
Chandler has been in the league 8 years to Okafor’s 5 so he just seems older…
"Do me a favor. Put your lip over your head... and swallow." Max Goldman
We had trouble with Charlotte last year
was that due to Marion? How will this effect our series with them next year? Am I wrong here? I might be…
Everybody I've heard likes it from the Hornet's side.
It’s the Bobcats side (where it is probably about money) that it is being laughed at.
*Unless KP has a secret plan that makes this statement incorrect.
yeah people forget Okafor was the #2 pick in the draft behind Dwight Howard
by rip_city_swagger on Jul 29, 2009 10:38 AM PDT up reply actions
A close #2 at that.
Okafor was seen as the probable #1 pick most of the year leading up to that draft. He was regarded as the safe pick, Howard the gamble.
by MiledAnimal on Jul 29, 2009 11:01 AM PDT up reply actions
I understand the player part from the NO standpoint, but not the money part, since they are small market, shallow pockets, luxury tax adverse...
They’re making a huge commitment and they already have the prospect of a huge commitment to Chris Paul for the indefinite future, not to mention our friend Mr. West. That’s a team that is going to paint themselves into a corner pretty quickly…
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Over the next two seasons, Emeka Okafor makes less money than Tyson Chandler.
If nothing else, I hope that this deal finally ends the onslaught lamebrained Chris Paul trade proposals.
Stupid people have stupid ideas.
Now that they traded for a guy with a longer contract
There’s no way they can afford Chris Paul!!
They’re going to just build around Okafor, I hear.
Paul is as good as ours. Back to work on my first fanpost ever to raise the ultimate query: what IF Chris Paul…. was a BLAZER?
Mortimer
We think alike sometimes
I mean, What IF?
Witty Unpredictable Talent and Natural Game
by iDea on Jul 29, 2009 3:40 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Bobcats have a dumb GM named Mike Jordan
He drafted Adam Morrison at # 3 for heavens sake!
My religion consists of a humble admiration of the illimitable, superior spirit who reveals himself in the slight details we are able to perceive with our frail and feeble mind.
-Albert Einstein
The journey of a thousand miles begins beneath one's feet.
-Lao Tzu
Yeah, Chris Paul made Chandler look better than he is
"We don't back down to nobody." --Joel Przybilla
Super curious about SA
next year. I think they’ll be really good, but…
not good enough
I don't see how the Hornets made a bad trade from a personnel standpoint
Financially, it’s quite confusing. However, unlike Tyson, Okafor is capable of scoring in the paint without a perfect lob pass, and doesn’t look like a 3 year old trying to back down his opponent. He gives up an inch defensively, but they’re pretty much identical as rebounders. Defensively is where the Hornets take a hit, but Emeka was still the starting center on one of the better defensive teams last season. Okafor seems to be over his early injury issues, whereas Tyson just seems to find a new way to get hurt every year.
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 29, 2009 9:17 AM PDT up reply actions
More like five inches. Okafor is 6'8", Chandler is 7'1"
I don’t know enough about Okafor’s defense, but I’d be surprised if he plays it as well as Chandler.
Okafor has a better wingspan, and a higher standing reach
At least when Chandler and he came into the league.
Okafor is a good defender who doesn’t do as well against guys who can physically overpower him. He’s not as purely athletic as Chandler, but he can be a great shotblocker and a good defender. He’s just not that big.
But he’s loads better than Chandler. LOADS.
Mortimer
Significantly better, anyways.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Must.... avoid... obvious... joke....
I know less than half of you half as well as I should like, and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve.
by haildablazer on Jul 29, 2009 11:45 AM PDT up reply actions
Um, no, it's 2 inches
Okafor is 6’10 in shoes, Chandler is 7 feet in shoes.
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 29, 2009 10:55 AM PDT up reply actions
There's only one place to go for this kind of information, so I'm pretty sure I'm right
http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-pre-draft-measurements/?page=&year=2001&sort2=DESC&draft=0&pos=0&sort=
http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-pre-draft-measurements/?page=&year=2004&sort2=DESC&draft=0&pos=0&sort=
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 29, 2009 11:11 AM PDT up reply actions
Chandler, 6'11.5"; Okafor 6'8.75"
That’s 2.75 inches difference when they came into the league. Since then, Chandler’s grown a bit and Okafor has shrunk a bit (you didn’t hear about that weird height-reducing treatment he was on?), so I’m right after all.
by MiledAnimal on Jul 29, 2009 11:23 AM PDT up reply actions
Okafor was a fool to cross that Wizard
It didn’t take much to trick Emeka into drinking a shrinking potion.
O’, he could have been a great if he hadn’t!!
Mo
And again, Chandler is a great defender, but every week he has a new injury
So who cares? At this point he’s as valuable as Joakim Noah.
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 29, 2009 10:56 AM PDT up reply actions
Er, Shaq is 7-1
Do you truly believe Chandler is the same height? I haven’t checked the pre-draft measurements, but there just ain’t no way.
"We don't back down to nobody." --Joel Przybilla
Shaq is 7'1" without shoes, according to draftexpress.com.
Chandler is 7’1" in shoes, a good two feet taller than Emeka Okafor.
I always knew Okafor and Mugsy Bouges were the same player
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 30, 2009 10:12 AM PDT up reply actions
Nailed it
Although I allow a smidgen of doubt IFthe blazers were so very interested in TurkeyGlue. It could have been a smoke screen to force toronto to overpay, or the blazers may have really wanted him. I’m inclined to believe they wanted him and as such they have something that tells them he’s worth the cash… OR it could be a mandate by PA to move things forward before they’re ready regardless of cost, and then we were saved from ourselves but he still may have been worth the cash with a possible secondary move in the making to address another need. (sign and trade for Dre as an example… offensively the blazers would have just become a juggernaut and the youngsters would have had a crash course in “this is how you do it RIGHT”)
Out of all the moves that we know about out there for the blazers, I’m most happy with the one that was completed (the Jazz move being one I didn’t consider remotely likely). We now have a VERY good play maker that consistently has made the teams that he’s played on better.
Anyway, you nailed it allowing for my small doubt, but belief that ultimately it was good for us.
"Fernandez, to my eyes, is the Blazer who walks that walk most comfortably. A lot of Portland's fans (egged on, dare I say, by their local broadcasters) lament things like how Ron Artest or Yao Ming get to hit Brandon Roy's arms.
But I suspect Fernandez sees all that and thinks: We get to hit arms! Cool!"
http://myespn.go.com/blogs/truehoop/0-39-135/On-Playoff-Experience.html
Shaq to Cleveland
Call me wacky…
"No disrespect to Jeff Blake"
by Eat Politicians on Jul 29, 2009 12:35 AM PDT reply actions
For both best and worst?
Probably not what you meant, but I’ll go with it.
I know less than half of you half as well as I should like, and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve.
by haildablazer on Jul 29, 2009 12:36 AM PDT up reply actions
oh sorry
for best….
"No disrespect to Jeff Blake"
by Eat Politicians on Jul 29, 2009 12:37 AM PDT up reply actions
no no, I like the ambiguity.
It adds that certain zest.
I know less than half of you half as well as I should like, and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve.
by haildablazer on Jul 29, 2009 12:38 AM PDT up reply actions
lol
If I was smarter I would have left it as is…
"No disrespect to Jeff Blake"
by Eat Politicians on Jul 29, 2009 12:39 AM PDT up reply actions
PS
no one I have talked to agrees with me on this…but if shaq gets to dunk on Kobe for the game 7 final winning shot I can laugh and laugh and laugh until my head explodes…
"No disrespect to Jeff Blake"
by Eat Politicians on Jul 29, 2009 12:41 AM PDT up reply actions
that would be the definition of EPIC. I would LOVE to see that.
by BLAZER_FAN_199 on Jul 29, 2009 7:22 AM PDT up reply actions
you still think the lakers reach the finals
andre miller to oden for the dunk over bynum to win that series in 4. :)
For the Suns it was...
Suns getting a stinky bag of nothing for Shaq was the worst deal, closely followed by KP paying Golden State to take a backup PG off his hands…
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
I can never keep those western lottery deserts straight...
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Karl "elbows" Malone retired years ago
So yeah I think Cleveland has the only professional wrestler in the the NBA
oh agree
out of all the moves, this is definitely the worst, in my opinion.
My response? “Cavs just put a boat anchor around their neck.”
Maybe i’m wrong, we’ll see.
"Fernandez, to my eyes, is the Blazer who walks that walk most comfortably. A lot of Portland's fans (egged on, dare I say, by their local broadcasters) lament things like how Ron Artest or Yao Ming get to hit Brandon Roy's arms.
But I suspect Fernandez sees all that and thinks: We get to hit arms! Cool!"
http://myespn.go.com/blogs/truehoop/0-39-135/On-Playoff-Experience.html
I hate Shaq to Cleveland
I think that it ruins the year by year improvement by increments that the Cavs have made since LBJ was drafted. Shaq has had too many sidekicks and were they to win a championship, I think that his addition to the Cavs detracts significantly from the "narrative"’ that has been developing.
You aren’t wacky, I’m glad you brought this up because I would like to read some other opinions about this.
The Cavs were completely dismantled by Orlando. For the Cavs last year Orlando was their Houston. Had the Cavs played Boston…
Well
Best Move:
Jefferson to the Spurs.
With all the other moves, this one kinda flew by, but never underestimate SA.
Worst Move:
Hedo’s choice of spouse
Turkey Glue debacle. The only reason I name that as the worst move is because I was just coming around to the idea after really dragging my heels. Ouch.
I know less than half of you half as well as I should like, and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve.
by haildablazer on Jul 29, 2009 12:47 AM PDT reply actions 3 recs
How is Jefferson the best move?
Shaq, VC, even the Spurs’ other pickup Antonio McDyess are all better players than Jefferson. Jefferson can’t do anything other than take shots. It’s not like everyone on the Spurs forgot how to take shots over the offseason.
I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer.—Dune
He replaces a washed up combo of Bruce Bowen, Michael Finley, Ime Udoka in the starting lineup. That’s a significant upgrade to me even though he is past his prime.
Orlando probably got stronger overall, but not necessarily by replacing Courtney Lee and Hedo Turkoglu with Carter. Shaq to Cleveland is a complete unknown in terms of on-court impact (best move for entertainment value maybe). Ilgauskas already was their second best player last year, so it’s not like center was their big hole and now they will be playing slower with Shaq clogging up the driveway for LeBron.
When is "past his prime" for players these days anyway?
seriously… I really want to know what the cut off is now-a-days. I was thinking that Jefferson was kinda young when I read that (could be wrong), so I had to look it up and Jefferson is only 29. He has played in a lot of games due to some deep runs early with the Nets, so he has some miles on him. Past prime, or not, baring a major injury I’m thinking he still has 3-5 years until he is truly NBA old.
In Jefferson's case
“past his prime” happened the second he no longer got to play with Jason Kidd. He was overrated to begin with playing alongside Kidd (Just like Kenyon Martin was) and once Kidd left and he began to look like a slightly above average player rather than a borderline all star, people just assumed it was because he had gotten old.
You can also see this same phenomenon with the 29 year old Shawn Marion sans Nash.
Astute observation
hopefully Miller will make people think that Greg is 21 now.
I think you're selling Jefferson short
He’s a 20 ppg guy, he’s not a bad defender, he has three-point range but can finish at the rim, he’s a terrific locker-room guy who knows how to play within a system, and he has finals experience. The Spurs needed a #3 scorer who satisfied all those categories. Outstanding acquisition for them and in my mind puts them at the top of the conference when they were in danger of falling out of contention altogether.
"I take the little gummy bear Flintstones vitamins…I try not to eat the lady. I try not to eat the man. Just give me the car. I try to find the car. Yea, worst case scenario, I eat the lady." - Ron Artest, 2009
He's a decent player, sure
although he’s only scored 20 ppg twice in his entire career, but is he a guy who should be in the all star conversation? No. And yet, he’s making something like $15 million next year.
I loved the move for the Spurs because they only needed him to be a 4th option and play within himself and they need to win now, but unless I absolutely NEED to win a title now there’s no way I can justify paying Jefferson that kind of money. Just like Kenyon Martin is a solid, above average PF, but in no way deserving of signing an $80 million contract.
He's certainly overpaid
But hardly past his prime. He’s not an All Star, I think most everybody agrees with that, but SA wasn’t looking for an All Star, just a 3rd or 4th option. In that roll, Jefferson fits perfectly.
Witty Unpredictable Talent and Natural Game
which conversation is it?
Jefferson is past his prime, or Jefferson is overpaid? Because the later is unquestionable, but the former is certainly debatable. Is he a top-25 player in the league? no, definitely not, but he is a top-10 SF who can get to the rim and shoots 3s at a 40% clip. The best way to describe Jefferson is efficient in that the only times you see him force things is when 1/2 his team is on the injury list (07-08), or when he is playing on a crap team like last year and has to be the focus of the offense. He is not a #1, or even #2 scorer on a championship caliber team, but he is a perfect complimentary player on a squad with stars in place around him.
With Duncan, Parker and Genobly attracting most of the attention on offense expect RJ to have his most efficient year to date.
Yepper...
The Spurs don’t make bad moves! They always seem to work out.
Shaq to Cleveland is for show. Although I am glad he’s back east…
Orlando…I think Turkoglu and Carter are a wash offensively. I think they will miss Courntey Lee’s defense, though.
"Do me a favor. Put your lip over your head... and swallow." Max Goldman
Feels like a copout,
but the biggest winner and loser undoubtedly came in the same deal: the Zach Randolph trade. LA clips jettisoned a black hole of a 4 who plays the same position as the franchise’s newest savior, Blake Griffin, and they also managed to get a serviceable swingman in Q-rich who will contribute some depth to their backcourt.
When you think about it, LA really came full circle with this trade. They lost their franchise centerpiece and starting 4 in Elton Brand during the offseason, traded for Stat-bo to fill the void, picked up a new franchise savior, also at the 4 during the draft, and then dumped one of the worst contracts in the NBA. Not only is Zbo a TERRIBLE team player, but he also has an albatross of a contract, which as a triple whammy goes through 2011, thereby eating up cap space during the 2010 FA bonanza.
With this deal the LA clippers become a potential factor again in a few years.
On the other hand, with this same deal the Grizzlies become the new LA clippers.
"B-Roy is the best shooting guard I have played against"
-Ron Artest
by premthegrem on Jul 29, 2009 12:48 AM PDT reply actions 8 recs
+1
for stat-bo
"No disrespect to Jeff Blake"
by Eat Politicians on Jul 29, 2009 12:51 AM PDT up reply actions
I like it
I know less than half of you half as well as I should like, and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve.
by haildablazer on Jul 29, 2009 12:51 AM PDT up reply actions
Q-Rich was traded soon after
For Telfair, Craig Smith and Madsen. Trade one Blazer Bust in a roundabout way to get another. At least for LA Telfair doesn’t have the enormous contract. He does play the same position as their highest paid player who also demands the ball. Doesn’t matter if Davis can’t stay healthy but if he does I don’t see those two playing on the same unit.
Overall the trade of Randolf did get rid of a over the top contract they never should have picked up however the depth they gained doesn’t excite me. Maybe one of those players will contribute consistently, maybe.
Many good points...
but it’s the Clippers you’re talking about. At some point, Blake Griffin will suffer a season-ending/career threatening injury…..because it’s the Clippers.
"I'm a man, but I can change.....if I have to......I guess." - Red Green
by antediluvian on Jul 29, 2009 8:59 AM PDT up reply actions
We, as Blazer fans, need to watch our karma sometimes
Saying a player will suffer a career/season ending injury because he’s a Clipper, coming from a Blazer fan, is ironic and bad karma.
Witty Unpredictable Talent and Natural Game
Don't worry. He'll get flooded soon enough.
I know less than half of you half as well as I should like, and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve.
by haildablazer on Jul 29, 2009 11:48 AM PDT up reply actions
I would be worried about that....
if it wasn’t the Clippers.
C’mon……it’s a law of the universe and all.
"I'm a man, but I can change.....if I have to......I guess." - Red Green
by antediluvian on Jul 29, 2009 12:42 PM PDT up reply actions
Good comments..
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
No question: what was Memphis thinking???
They could easily have had Boozer (or Elton Brand) instead. That really makes it look bad.
All that glitters isn't chrome
Michael Heisley must own a lot of strip clubs.
by MiledAnimal on Jul 29, 2009 9:55 AM PDT up reply actions 6 recs
WHY HASN'T THIS COMMENT (ABOVE) BEEN RECCED TEN ZILLION TIMES??
It’s one of the funniest things I’ve read on here.
My religion consists of a humble admiration of the illimitable, superior spirit who reveals himself in the slight details we are able to perceive with our frail and feeble mind.
-Albert Einstein
The journey of a thousand miles begins beneath one's feet.
-Lao Tzu
Thanks guys. I still haven't received a check from Dave yet.
We are supposed to get $100 for each comment that goes green, right?
To make it worse
they (Memphis) are the last team to have any interest in Z-bo. Which means they will be stuck with him until his contract expires unless they are willing to pay someone to take him off their hands.
RE: What was Memphis thinking???
If they were dumb enough to do this, maybe they really did sign Miles for his game and veteran leadership. shrug
Good point.
They’re running that franchise like they’re the coneheads.
I know less than half of you half as well as I should like, and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve.
by haildablazer on Jul 29, 2009 11:52 AM PDT up reply actions
I can only assume
that Memphis did it to try and sell tickets.
Richardson was not going to put any fans in the seats. Randolph is, if nothing else, able to post stats and might draw a few corporate sponsors and make some more ticket sales.
by Storyteller on Jul 29, 2009 12:58 PM PDT up reply actions
Ariza and Okafor, both odd
I don’t like Ariza to Houston at all. How is expected to contribute to offense there? And yeah his defense will still be solid, but they already have Battier to fill that stopper spot. I dunno, just seems weird and they’re putting alot of pressure on him to produce.
Also, the Bobcats unload Okafor but they say they are building? I thought they wouldn’t listen to GWallace offers because they were building for a run? Not like this they aren’t. Maybe the lottery will provide for their title run in 2023.
RT: I thought they wouldn’t listen to GWallace offers because
Larry Brown loves GW to death, that’s why they’re not listening to offers
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
The Hornets have gotten worse [yay!], the Bulls have gotten worse [boo].
Detroit is … interesting [I’m going to hold off judgment until i see them.]
The Blazers’ offseason was solid as always.
The Thunder are continuing their rise.
Tyler Hansborough may not be a complete pile of suck.
The Grizzles are, as always, dumb. THEY GOT SUCKERED BY THE CLIPPERS. HOW DOES THAT HAPPEN?!?
Vinny Del Negro: Possibly the most unintentionally irritating last name in the history of last names [Hint: I can't for the life of me pronounce it correctly].
-Brandon Jennings: PG of the future!
RT: Grizzles are, as always, dumb. THEY GOT SUCKERED
It’s karma for jerking KP’s chain by signing Miles
Now Wallace should send Rudy Gay to KP for Travis and the balance will be restored…
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
I expect more from the Grizz...
Now if Minnesota had traded for ZBo, that wouldn’t have surprised me at all.
by DonkeyShins on Jul 29, 2009 11:14 AM PDT up reply actions
Sheed to boston could be good if he has the right attitude
Starting lineup of KG SHeed, Allen, Pierce, Rondo is long and strong. The talent is there just depends on chemistry and health.
I think Boston has to stick with Perkins in the middle
But Sheed’s a super-sub and the first big off the bench now that Powe and Big Baby are gone.
Perhaps
But didn’t sheed play center for detroit? It seems like there are only a 2 centers in the east who have the potential to abuse him or KG in middle
Perhaps long in the tooth!
Kidding aside, they are pretty scary if they stay healthy. All those guys are ‘ballers’ !!!
"Do me a favor. Put your lip over your head... and swallow." Max Goldman
The wrap
San Antonio Richard jeff … . . . .. Nice
-no more Mike and Foye Minnesota … a bit confused, you must have gotten somethimg for this what? (?), and for who Songaila. Well…ok C (almost +) pchhha Minnesota ha ha
Good bye Serg Saludamos te!!
Cleaveland Saquille. I Like, and You made your offering to the lord, Lebron
-Kobe’s still a Faker. Artest is tough but beatable … was Ariza thinking?
GS It’s Stefan not Stephen, be forewarned. (Don’t worry. Kind of an inside joke)
Boston: The rasheed is a straight punch to the east, You just haven’t gotten it yet… Yeah, right. Wilcox’ll do it fer ya
and
-Detroit
-Blakes a stud. Clipps Give em hell.
We know about Turkoglu Turkey glue?
-McMillan’s signing felt nice.
Stackhouse
Kidd- I don’t think your meant for Dallas
Zack- You just meant Quentin Richardson (Sorry Bud)
Utah- Bravo, I liked Millsap
Phoneix- You’ve nailed Nash’s coffin.
Toronto, You’ve taken Jarrett too- I’m confused on your motives.
Blazers- The jury’s out, Andre will have to wait and see. (Hooray for Blake’s back-up 3’s)
And the sealer (Drum role please)
Ba Da Bumb Ba Da Dumb Ba Da Bump
Ba Da Dump Ba Ba Dumb Ba Ba Dump
Ba Da………….
Ekafor for Chandler- Just that
All and All- It’s a tie for Cleavland and Boston… Good they can manhandle themselves on their own side.
In reality,
I think Blazer fans will look back on this offseason and see that we got a steal in Andre Miller and dodged a bullet with Turkoglu not signing. Miller is an extremely durable guard who, although 33, still can be effective and provide leadership. I love adding a great passer to get better looks inside to Greg and LaMarcus, as well as Miller’s ability to finish at the rim, something he will get chances to do with defenses keyed on Roy. I would have hated to tie up so much money on a wing player- I feel like that’s a position that should not be a high priority with Nic, Rudy, Travis and Martell around, not to mention the 4 combined make about as much as Turkoglu’s annual salary.
So by luck and fate, I think we come out big winners. I think what we’re seeing from the rest of the league is panic and go-for-it mentality, things that can barely be sustained. We’re contenders who added a great piece without sacrificing our sustainability as a contender.
I sure hope you are right
I was never that thrilled with the Turkoglu debacle, but am unsure about Miller. If he lives up to the hype that we’ve been seeing, then I’ll be happy. I’m just worried that he’s a bit over-the-hill and doesn’t add anything to our defensive shortcomings on the perimeter.
by DonkeyShins on Jul 29, 2009 11:15 AM PDT up reply actions
Top 3 Best/Worst
Best:
1. Nets acquire Courtney Lee and 2 expiring contracts in exchange for Vince Carter and Ryan Anderson. Nets not only find a taker for VC’s contract, but score a partially-guaranteed contract, an expiring contract, and a young, solid starting 2 guard. Great job, Thorn.
2. Ron Artest signed to mid-level contract. An upgrade at a price that can’t be beat. Good job, Kupchak.
3. Ty Lawson acquired for future 1st round pick. Lawson is a great fit for a team that wants to push the ball. He’s quick and capable and will allow Denver to play uptempo throughout a game. And by the time Billups’ contract ends, he’ll be experienced, still under contract, and ready to sign an extension. Nice work, Warkentien.
Honorable Mention:
*Rockets acquire Jermaine Taylor, Sergio Llull, Chase Budinger, and David Anderson for 2 future second round picks and cash considerations; successfully apply for an injured player exception and use it to sign Trevor Ariza. Who does Daryl Morey think he is? Kevin Pritchard?
Worst:
1. Pistons sign Ben Gordon to $11M per year contract. They basically have two players in Gordon and Rip Hamilton who are making over $20M combined but won’t be able to play at the same time. For the amount of money they spent on all their free agent signings, they probably could have afforded Gortat, Sessions, and Villanueva—3 young guys with great upside. Dumars, sry@ur tm.
2. Grizzlies acquire Z-Bo. Clippers have the 5th best move in actually creating space for their young big man to develop, finding a taker for Z-Bo, and getting an expiring contract to boot in one fell swoop.
3. Hawks acquire Jamal Crawford, draft Jeff Teague, and re-sign Mike Bibby. Predicting Bibby and Crawford will be unhappy with minutes while Teague’s development is set back 2 to 3 years as a benchwarmer.
Dishonorable Mention
Washington trades #5(Rubio, Flynn, or Curry) and expiring contracts…for expiring contracts. Maybe this move makes you a championship contender, Grunfeld; but it probably doesn’t.
"I've hacked into your brain. You're throwing a party and no one's showing up."
by ignign*kt on Jul 29, 2009 2:07 AM PDT reply actions 2 recs
That Ron Artest acquisition isn’t anywhere near my top 3. He and Ariza are two players going in opposite directions. That doesn’t even take into considerations the potential chemistry issues.
"I take the little gummy bear Flintstones vitamins…I try not to eat the lady. I try not to eat the man. Just give me the car. I try to find the car. Yea, worst case scenario, I eat the lady." - Ron Artest, 2009
I see that deal as a wash for both teams.
by MiledAnimal on Jul 29, 2009 10:40 AM PDT up reply actions
One of the most insightful comments of the offseason
“Why do you think the Rockets didn’t lift a single solitary finger to keep Artest?”
"I take the little gummy bear Flintstones vitamins…I try not to eat the lady. I try not to eat the man. Just give me the car. I try to find the car. Yea, worst case scenario, I eat the lady." - Ron Artest, 2009
I think both players are going to be solid. Here are a couple of thoughts.
1. Both are good defenders; but they’re different in that Ariza relies on his athleticism and length, while Artest relies on his bulk and strength.
2. If you saw the WCF, then you know Ariza was pretty much manhandled by Carmelo Anthony. Ariza’s still going to be overpowered by certain players, but Artest won’t. Artest can even switch on pick and rolls, keep a lot of big men from getting too deep into the paint with his bulk, and use his quick hands to strip the ball.
3. You guys certainly watched Roy torch Artest. Now, what Artest does really well is funnel his assignment into help or toward the baseline, which is exactly what the LAL defensive scheme calls for. So, while he may not be able to lock-up Roy(few can, anyway), he’s going to be in a system which plays to his strengths and he’ll be backed up not by a slow-footed Yao Ming but Drew Bynum and Pau Gasol.
4. I’m not worried about chemistry on the floor or in the locker room. As far as the Triangle goes, I expect a shift in roles. In recent years, Kobe has played a lot at the 3 while guys like Ariza and Vujacic have played at the 2. I expect Phil will get Artest to focus and bond with his new team by giving him a lot of responsibility in the offense. Artest will do a lot of ballhandling, bringing the ball up the court, initiating the triangle, and posting-up. He’ll be more than happy with the touches he’s getting on the floor, and he’ll keep Phil amused in the locker room.
BTW If Artest is at the “3” that means Kobe and Gasol will be lining up on the weak side. Watch out for the ball reversal/pick-and-roll. You’ve been warned.
5. I don’t think Ariza’s skills are going to decline in Houston; I just think his productivity will. I can’t think of one Rocket that will demand a double team, so no more open looks for Ariza, no more open lanes. No shot blockers in the paint, so no more gambling for steals. The fact that Ariza has a suspect handle will be exposed, so fewer slashes to the basket.
He’ll always be a good versatile defender, doing a fine job of guarding the likes of Tony Parker. Still, he’s not going to be the same player offensively until Houston can add an all-star.
In conclusion, I’m confident Artest is a perfect fit. Even if he were not, he’s still a great bargain at that price and his contract is very moveable.
"I've hacked into your brain. You're throwing a party and no one's showing up."
by ignign*kt on Jul 29, 2009 12:18 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
As long as he stays sane
I suspect you have nailed it.
When I rule the world, everyone will know how to use Excel.
great post, but I think Spurs getting Jefferson and DeJuan Blair at #37 trumps Lawson
by rip_city_swagger on Jul 29, 2009 10:45 AM PDT up reply actions
Interestingly, that pick the Spurs used was included by Houston when they traded for the rights to Luis Scola
We don’t know how good Blair will be, but I think at this juncture I’d prefer Scola.
"I've hacked into your brain. You're throwing a party and no one's showing up."
The best move is the acquisiton of Andre Miller
My reasoning:
1. He improves this team
2. He does not improve another team
3. He makes Philly weaker (they swept us)
4. His addition is better than Denver’s or Utah’s addition – Division Champion means something to me.
San Antonio and LAL improved as well but it should not matter if our second best move pans out:
That would be retaining the team nearly intact. It ranks right below Dre’s addition to me and nearly assures us of the best chemistry in the league once again. The improvement of last year’s rookies is also looming large and retaining them all allows them to grow together with the rest of the core. Exceptional depth and team-oriented goals by each player will more than offset the Artest and Jefferson acquisitions imo.
Yes. You are correct
And one thing you didn’t mention is that Miller is the perfect sort of addition for the young Blazers. Plus we didn’t have to give up anything. Miller is pure benefit and zero loss.
Adding Miller may end up improving us along the lines of the way adding Billups improved the Nuggets last year. I agree it was the best offseason move of the year. Way to go Blazers!
My religion consists of a humble admiration of the illimitable, superior spirit who reveals himself in the slight details we are able to perceive with our frail and feeble mind.
-Albert Einstein
The journey of a thousand miles begins beneath one's feet.
-Lao Tzu
We do give up Paul Allen's money
and we all assume that is bottomless. The contract was very favorable for the Blazers and short enough that the consequences of failure are relatively low (I would like to have $14M and call it a success for Dre no matter what).
I am not quite as optimistic as Miller=Billups but the raw material he is being given as team members seems to this biased fan deeper and better than Billups. If Miller can get Outlaw to shift as much as Billups got Smith to shift we are nearly unstoppable. I believe Outlaw will be better than Lamar Odom in another year or two.
Every member of the Blazers might bless this moment as each grows their averages in the coming 2 or 3 years to be able to demand a higher contact than otherwise, either here or somewhere else. Perhaps Miller is also our economic stimulus package. Let us hope he is more effective than the President’s.
Here's hoping you're right...
I do think he’s a good fit though.
Best offseason moves so far:
1. Ron Artest to the Lakers for a low amount, creating the strongest wing in the league and setting them up for a repeat
2. Richard Jefferson to the Spurs for expiring deals, re-opening their championship window in combination with all their other moves
3. Shawn Marion and other useable pieces (Humphries for toughness, unguaranteed Buckner as trade chip, Jawai as a project) to the Mavs for pretty useless pieces (The George, Wright) and cash out, legitimately giving them another chance for a deep playoff run. Would have been bigger and even ranked higher if Orlando hadn’t matched for Gortat. Still in a good position to convert assets later in the year.
Underrated: New Orleans (Collison), Denver (Lawson) and Utah (Maynor) all finding great young backup PGs in the draft to spell their star starters. Of course it’s still too early to know how the rookies perform, but those three are among the most NBA-ready players in the draft and replacing vets who did little for their teams last season.
Worst offseason moves so far:
1. Memphis converting an expiring deal for Darko Milicic for $7 million into $33 million for Z-Bo over 2 years, who will do nothing to improve their bad defense and at worst take away shots from their young players. They also selected one of the players with the biggest bust potential in the draft with Thabeet.
2.Toronto re-signing Bargnani for $50 million in addition to already spending $50+ million for Hedo (that’s not just bad bad bad for Toronto, it also sets the price level for mediocre big guys too high again).
3. Detroit spending a combined $95 million on Ben Gordon and Charlie Villanueva over the next few years.
Underrated: Orlando losing Courtney Lee in the Carter deal.
Cleveland selecting a complete project player from Joventut’s farm team instead of an NBA-ready one with their first round pick in the draft, who immediately re-signed for three years in Europe and is now about three years away from being three years away of becoming a quality NBA player. Maybe. That’s not what the Cavs need to keep LeBron happy and create an emergency plan should he leave.
I’ll not rate the Blazers offseason yet, but it should be in the upper half of teams, especially if they still do something to improve the PF spot or to consolidate.
Yeah pretty much agree with you here, I know Phoenix had to but signing a hundred-year old Nash for $11 mil per seems silly
considering they are a bubble team
Blazer Fan
by leeroyjenkins on Jul 29, 2009 6:32 AM PDT up reply actions
They're a 20 win team without him, how is it silly?
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 29, 2009 9:18 AM PDT up reply actions
Hmmmmm, salary cap for starters....
………………………………. The fact that they’re stuck with Mr. Horrific-and-Getting-Worse Defense for seconds…
They gave away Shaq and now will sink into the Pacific aboard the Good Ship Yesteryear…
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Not any worse off than Utah, last year's 8th seed
He was awful at defense when he took them to back to back conference Finals, their owner is too cheap to make any big trades to bolster the roster, and it’s yet to be proven Amare is a top 10 player without Steve Nash, who they also have to worry about keeping happy so he doesn’t opt out next season.
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 29, 2009 9:26 AM PDT up reply actions
Amare is still a big ?
a torn retina is a serious injury and could really impact his game on both ends of the court. Amare may or may not ever have the same capability as before the eye injury.
All Utah needs is to stay healthy
and they easily win 51-52 games, maybe more. If they keep Boozer, almost certainly more.
They had huge injury problems last year, or they would have had a much higher seed.
When I rule the world, everyone will know how to use Excel.
Actually Phoenix made some interesting moves/non-moves
Re-signing Nash and Grant Hill and not trading Stoudamire probably keeps them in contention for a playoff spot for another year. SSOL is back, but somewhat diminished. Sarver probably decided not to blow up the team for another year since they don’t have their first round pick next year due to the Kurt Thomas salary dump.
Agreed that it's "interesting"...
Completely disagree on significance. What “letting it ride after giving away Shaq” means is that they will NOT make the playoffs this year, nor will they be financially viable to improve themselves, nor will they be just bad enough to restock through the draft.
Extended mediocrity.
Which is good for the Blazers, I reckon.
Kerr should be the GM for Memphis, he’s got a very Memphis-like “feel” for player personnel moves…
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
How was Deron Williams a "vet who did little for (his) team last season"?
I do think Maynor was a good draft choice, but he’s there to back up Williams, and, they hope, develop someday into a trade piece.
Otherwise, good analysis.
All that glitters isn't chrome
Maybe I didn't formulate that clearly, the backups to the starters Paul, Billups and Williams were "vets who did little"
Now all three teams have better young players backing up the star starters.
Good call re Bargnani.
That signing smacks of a Toronto GM taking his cues from Chuck Swirsky and wanting to prove he made a great draft pick in 2006.
by MiledAnimal on Jul 29, 2009 10:05 AM PDT up reply actions
WHY WOULDN'T HE BE THE RIGHT CHOICE
I JUST SIGNED HIM FOR 50 MILLION, THAT MEANS HE MUST BE PRETTY GOOD.
M.
The sad thing is that some Raptors fans on RealGM and elsewhere think it’s a bargain, and that he soon will be a 25 and 10 guy, at least better than LaMarcus. Based on 2 good months he had after O’Neal was traded for Marion.
Yeah, looking at his month to month stats
He was all over the place, and one month of shooting .500+ from 3 point land really boosted his numbers.
He ended the year sorta bad, giving credence to the “he is a 7 foot tall streak shooter”, which is what he appears to be. Not a BAD player, and a very useful one in the right situation, but not a Big Three type player.
Maybe if they lose Bosh and the team is awful and he is the only one who can score, he could score 25, but I doubt it since he’d get all the attention then. I don’t think LMA will ever ever average 10 boards a game, so I can’t see Bargnani doing it.
Morty
There are Raptor fans who think Bargnani will be better than Bosh
Bargnani won’t even be as good as Okur.
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 29, 2009 10:57 AM PDT up reply actions
The worst move was Heisley not selling the Grizzlies
For their moves seem to telegraph an owner meddling into sheer idiocy and assured destruction.
Yeah, I can talk myself into Miller being good for us
I can’t talk myself into the same for Bibby after not being able to stand his game for so long.
Mortim’r
I'll buy on the Minnesota PG stuff...
Bibby? Meh.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
I was just picking something different for good
Since I’m pretty much “Meh” across the board.
by tominhawaii on Jul 29, 2009 10:05 AM PDT up reply actions
There's a lot of meh out there, but it's NEW, IMPROVED, EXCITING, EXPENSIVE meh...
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
LA getting Artest, Jefferson to the Spurs
I also really like getting Andre Miller, I don’t think it makes the team a true title contender but I think the team advances past the first round, at least.
Blazer Fan
A look at some of the under-the-radar moves
Best:
1. Denver letting Indiana overpay for Dahntay Jones, and then trading for a similar asset in Aaron Afflalo at half the price.
2. Boston (eventually) signing Marquis Daniels to the biannual exception. Outstanding move. Should remove the wear and tear on both Allen and Pierce during the regular season. They still need a back-up PG of some sort (probably not Marbury).
3. Cleveland taking Jamorio Moon from Miami. Adding both Moon and Anthony Parker will upgrade their perimeter defense. Lebron won’t have to defend the best perimeter player on the other team for long stretches, and this will help keep his energy level up (recall how he looked dogged at the end of most of the games against Orlando).
4. Clippers dumping Z-Bo for an expiring contract, which they turned into a few nice pieces. Something that isn’t being discussed much as a result of this deal is that the Clips could have a lot of cap room next year (possibly in the $30 mil range)…and they are going to have some attractive pieces in place for one or two of the elite FAs to consider in 2010. You add Lebron to Baron/Griffin/E.Gordon/Kaman/Thornton and that’s a contender.
Worst:
1. Portland not throwing its cap room at Odom or including Bayless in a deal for Hinrich. Odom and Hinrich are much better fits than either Millsap (assuming they didn’t trade Aldridge) or Andre Miller. IMO, for this team, Hinrich would have been the perfect addition. A strong defender. A guy that can hit the outside shot. And a guy who has a decent enough handle.
2. David Lee’s agent scaring off Memphis by outpricing his client. I have little doubt that MEM would have offered 5 years and close to $50 mil for Lee if his agent was demanding $12 mil per year. Instead, Memphis called the bluff and made a horrible trade for another ball hog….to pair with Thabust in the front court.
Totally disagree with this Portland stuff
Odom’s an overrated headcase and Miller is comparable to Heinrich – and frankly I think Miller is better for this team.
Blazer Fan
by leeroyjenkins on Jul 29, 2009 6:34 AM PDT up reply actions
In what way is Miller comparable to Hinrich?
Hinrich is a (much) better defender and a much better outside shooter. Miller doesn’t shoot outside and his defense is maybe marginally better than Blake.
Hinrich is used to playing on a more defensive minded, slower pace team. Miller is used to playing at a faster pace.
One of Miller’s strengths (over Hinrich and many other PGs) is his post-up game. on this team, how often will that strength be exploited/used?
so, please tell me where all of these comparisons are…..
now, on Odom. I agree that he isn’t the most focused player all of the time. This doesn’t make him a head case. He’s not a Marbury or Artest. Lack of focus, sure. Head case, nope. Anyway, Odom’s skill set would have better fit this team than Millsap or Miller. Leave it to the team’s leader (Roy) and coaches to keep Odom focused.
Maybe That Miller's career PER
is better than Hinrich’s season best. Let’s be honest with ourselves here, just because Hinrich can shoot a three pointer better doesn’t mean he can hold a candle to Miller’s overall offensive game.
As far as the pace, The sixers since Miller has been there have been the 20th and 21st fastest teams in the league. The Bulls have never been slower than the 11th fastest team in the league since Kirk’s been there.
I think that a lot of our lack of tempo the last couple of seasons...
had a lot to do with Nate’s overly tight grip, need for control, lack of faith in our point guards ability to make decisions on the fly and, most importantly, TEACHING this young team how to play sound, fundamental basketball.
He knows he has a team loaded with horses- we all do, but if you let the young stallions go out and stampede too early they’ll start to rely solely on that.
On the other hand, if you teach those horses how to dominate a slow paced game first, and then unleash their athleticism… there you have it- a 2-headed monster!
I think bringing in Miller is nearly the last piece in Nate’s brilliant scheme to dominate the world. He already seems to trust Miller. Miller reminds him of himself. He reminds him of a coach.
If Miller gels well with our team, Nate will be able to let his new floor-general loose to either run or slow things up with a young, and now offensively smart beyond their years, team of horses.
I’m excited. The Sarge has his General!
wow
still going on about hinrich? okay, here’s some reasons why miller > hinrich:
Contract – pay a proven vet $7 per for 2 years or pay blake v.1.5 $8-9 per. Adv – Miller
Defense – Hinrich is likely a little better, but is hardly the defensive stopper you seem to think he is. rajon fricken rondo torched him to avg almost a triple double. how is that being a defensive stopper? Miller isn’t as quick, but knows how to play team defense and will always be in the right spot (also avgs approx 1.3 steals per game).
Rebounding – Clear advantage miller, not even close.
Passing – Again, clear advantage miller.
Experience – Miller has been a proven top 10-15 PG for a long time, hinrich would be lucky to make top 15 and hasn’t proven to be consistant. Adv – Miller
Shooting – Wash. Hinrich is better 3 point shooter, but miller can knock down the med-range jumper at a high %. both excellent FT shooters.
Drive and dish/finish – another clear advantage for miller. better passing and better finishing.
Come to think of it, there really is no comparision b/w the 2, b/c miller is in a tier above KH.
by retirecards51 on Jul 29, 2009 11:42 AM PDT up reply actions
oh yeah
and it didn’t cost the blazers anything besides cap room to get miller, would have needed to trade away pieces to get KH.
by retirecards51 on Jul 29, 2009 11:44 AM PDT up reply actions
Kirk Hinrich didn't guard Rajon Rondo too often in the playoffs, but shut him down when ...
he did receive that assignment. Against Boston, Hinrich was usually busy with manning up on Paul Pierce and Ray Allen.
Stupid people have stupid ideas.
You or someone has made that point before.
Folks who think you aren’t patient don’t see how often you have to debunk NBA myths. I think you’ve debunked five or six Kirk Hinrich myths several hundred times just this month.
I know the sidebars are already crowded, but wouldn’t it be nice if there were a section in the sidebar providing links to common NBA myths and the truth about them?
Even better, a text box where BEdgers could ask you whether something NBA-related is true. We could call it “Ask AK.”
I was a heinrick fan too
I would still prefer him but I think Miller was the right move cost wise. Odom’s work ethic scares me.
Life's short, Stunt it!!
by Irwin Fletcher on Jul 29, 2009 7:50 AM PDT via mobile up reply actions
I agree that Hinrich+Odom > Miller
but I don’t think Kirk was acquire-able since the Feb deadline, afterwards it would’ve cost KP talent that he didn’t want to surrender (Rudy or Batum)
Blake+Outlaw = Cap’n Kirk was a fantasy trade, created and sustained by Bedgers
I would’ve tried to grab Odom for the 4/3 role, but I doubt KP had the scratch to make Lamar even think twice about PDX. Here’s hoping he goesback to South Beach
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
agree
I don’t think Hinrich was an option anymore. Hard to miss on something that wasn’t available.
I think Odom could have been an interesting fit. But I think KP knew that he would not win in this game. Guy likes the beach and really only wants to be in one of those two cities. PDX in the mix for Odom probably increases the odds that Buss steps up (as Odom really hurts him if he goes to PDX). So we would have have had a week-long wait, and this ending would have been just as inevitable as Milsap.
I am constructive on the addition of Miller. Gives us better flexibility at mid-season for a move. Assuming no injuries, we have the potential to move the odd-man out out at the 3, possibly with something else (cap space, pick, Bayless?) for something more interesting.
Last thought on Miller. If he really was Nate’s #1, you kind of have to go that direction after missing on your first two choices.
No complaints about our off-season. If we were a 45 team win team last year, my sentiment would be a little different.
by oregontrail on Jul 29, 2009 11:27 AM PDT up reply actions
RT: we would have have had a week-long wait
No, Odom was a UFA. If he liked KP’s offer the best, then L*A would not have had a week to match it.
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
but of course his agent would've taken the Portland offer back to Buss
and the back-and-forth offers could’ve extended for weeks, like it has with Miami…
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
What does 'RT' mean?
I keep seeing it everywhere and I can’t figure it out with context alone.
Peep the sig.
Retweet
It’s a Twitter reference, that much I know. As far as I can tell, people on forums are using it signify that they’re repeating something someone else said. I think…
I thought that too..
but nobody’s tweeting anything, much less retweeting. It’s super confusing.
Peep the sig.
Denver's move and not getting Hinrich
Even though they’re a division rival, I love what Denver did by letting Dahntay Jones go and getting a younger version of him for cheaper.
I also agree with part 2 of Worst 1. While I disagree about Odom, I would have LOVED to get Hinrich. Miller should be a good fit but IMO Hinrich would have been better.
I want to put points on your face.
Odom was never an option
Odom doesn’t even want to go to Miami to play – he’s trying desperately to leverage them for more from LA. He wants to be in LA all the way. There is NO way he would have even considered coming here at all, unless we threw a Hedo deal at him – and maybe that wouldn’t even have been enough.
People can bag on KP for not going after Odom all they want, but it’s just silly. Odom doesn’t want to play in Portland, and we had zero chance of signing him, so I think that is unfair criticism.
I also disagree about Hinrich. Getting Miller for only money >>> getting Hinrich for more money and 2 or 3 assets. Hinrich would have upgraded our defense at the point and not much else. Miller upgrades us in a multitude of areas that needed work.
How did you guys win that?
"We scored enough points. We scored 107, they scored 105.
-Nate McMillan Postgame, 3/4/2009
I agree miller is a better fit than heinrich
and what is with mem. dropping there shorts and grabbing there ankles everytime an L.A team comes calling?
If Hinrich had been a unrestricted free agent, would KP have signed him instead of Miller?
by MiledAnimal on Jul 29, 2009 10:09 AM PDT up reply actions
Excuse me. This is not directed at Mr. Animal, rather to anyone and everyone following this line here...
WARARARRRRRRRRAAAAAAAAUAGUGUGUAUGAUUGGAARRRRRRRRRRRAAAAAAACKBHTH!!!!!!!!!!!
(deep breath) GUZZUHARRRRRRAAAAAAUAAGHRAATHTHTUAAAARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRAUAUAUAGHAGHGARARRRRRRRRR!!!!!!!!!!!
(another deep breath) BRRAARARRRRRRRRRRRRRUGHGARRRRAWWWWRRAARRRUUUUGHGHAHRRRRRRRWRARRRRRRRSSSSRRARARRRRRR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, KIRK HINRICH WASN’T EVEN TRADED!!! WHY ARE WE TALKING ABOUT HIM AMONG THE “BEST/WORST MOVES” OF THIS SUMMER???!?!?!?!??!? WHAT KIND OF STRANGE COMPULSION CAUSES GOOD PEOPLE TO BE SO STRANGELY OBSESSED WITH A SECOND STRING POINT GUARD!?!??!?!!!???!?!?!???!?!??
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
by timbo on Jul 29, 2009 11:42 AM PDT up reply actions 2 recs
My new choice for best move of the summer.
Kobe Bryant.
He wasn’t traded.
Great move for the Lakers!!!
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Has he signed that contract yet?
I haven’t read that he has. But I admittedly don’t follow Laker news too much.
μὴ φοβοῦ, μόνον πίστευε.
Looks like the Beast Within is now the Beast Unshackled.
Quick, someone bring the gun, the whip, and the meds!
by MiledAnimal on Jul 29, 2009 11:52 AM PDT up reply actions
I feel much better now. (pant pant pant)
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
You know what makes me feel happy at this moment.
That Jerryd Bayless won’t see the light of day next season with two superior point guards ahead of him on the depth chart.
Stupid people have stupid ideas.
Or at least six months
When I rule the world, everyone will know how to use Excel.
absolutely
one of the best unintented bonuses of the Miller signing was that it sounded the deathknell for the nonstop Hinrich lovefest that has been dominating BE for months on end. I for one, won’t miss it.
How did you guys win that?
"We scored enough points. We scored 107, they scored 105.
-Nate McMillan Postgame, 3/4/2009
Now we got a good backup PG to trade for Hinrich with!
Andre Miller was always signed just to be a trade piece, just like Millsap.
THE PERFECT CRIME.
Back when KP drafted Brandon Roy, it was done with an eye on one day, someday, somehow, getting Hinrich with him in the same backcourt.
KP always gets his man.
Mortimer
I'll still advocate dealing Steve Blake, Travis Outlaw, and Jerryd Bayless to the Chicago ...
Bulls for Kirk Hinrich around the trade deadline if that’s a possibility. It’d take certain factors to make that a plausible scenario, though, but I’ll hold out hope in the meantime.
Stupid people have stupid ideas.
is it still OK to say
that KP not using RLEC to acquire Cap’n Kirk was the “worst non-move” of the 2009 trading deadline?
(ducks)
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
If Odom signs somewhere other than with the Lakers,
the Artest signing has the potential to be the worst signing, in spite of what Artest did in last year’s playoffs. Houston needed Artest’s bad shot creation and launching… he has the potential to completely derail the triangle all by himself though. Especially if they can’t bench him for Odom or Ariza. And Kobe has less pull over him than he has over other scrubs on the team. I could see them getting into a yelling match a lot this year.
RT: he has the potential to completely derail the triangle all by himself
Go crazy, Ron-Ron! We need an agent provocateur in the L*ker’s camp!
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
miller is a true point.
the blazers do not need another shooter they have plenty of them already…what they lacked last year was a guy who could feed the post consistently. i heard a stat that miller was third in the league on assists on shots made close the the basket..the problem last year was our bigs would work to gain position only to see the ball fail to be delivered down low….i agree heinrich is a better man to man defender but miller’s basketball I.Q is as high as anyones in the league..now nate will not have to call timeouts to draw up plays because miller will be able to get his guys in the right spot..heinrich is a notch above steve blake but is very similar to him..miller on the other hand is a true facilitator which is exactly what the blazers nead right now…not to mention they have been trying to run a more uptempo style for the last couple of years but the only point who could pull that off was sergio and he was not the answer.
I'm of the opinion
that where a shooter like Blake or Hinrich will have a better shot at making a 3 pointer to win a close game situation at the end than Miller, Miller will have already gotten your team like 6 more points at least over the course of the game. What’s worth more?
At least 6 points
and lets be honest heinrich would not get the final shot over roy, rudy, outlaw or webster
WORST MOVE:
Not getting A/C for my bedroom.
by BOSAKI on Jul 29, 2009 8:20 AM PDT reply actions 5 recs
You're only $80 and a visit to Sears away from sleeping comfort.
Or are all the stores in Portland sold-out of air conditioners?
by MiledAnimal on Jul 29, 2009 10:11 AM PDT up reply actions
Saw that Home Depot was sold out of AC units in nearly all OR stores..
except Newport. They are shipping the Newport units to other locations.
"I'm a man, but I can change.....if I have to......I guess." - Red Green
by antediluvian on Jul 29, 2009 10:44 AM PDT up reply actions
BEST MOVE:
Getting snow tires put on my car, last November ;^)
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
odom
lakers won’t win it again unless they get odom again.
The mavs have been really quiet…in that they’re trades have kinda been forgotten
but I think they might be really good next year… surprisingly good.
if their young players step up..like Jose and Jason terry continues to be a beast off the bench, ..
Kidd, marion, Dirk, Terry, gooden.
gooden and terry easily come off the bench and are a starting unit..
I give the mavs an A
Also
By getting Buckner’s expiring contract they’re still in position to make a moderately large trade (I personally think Jason Richardson since his agent has supplied the Mavs with nearly half of their current lineup, or maybe Dalembert) in September when he’s allowed to be traded again.
They’re a decent center and maybe a true SG away from being a pretty deadly team for the next year or two and Antoine Wright is the only player they’ve given up so far that wasn’t scraps.
flim-flam stories and tapas
I'm not sure how much better the Mavs will be this season
but I definitely give them an A for effort. Cuban is going all-out to win while Dirk is still in his prime.
by MiledAnimal on Jul 29, 2009 10:12 AM PDT up reply actions
Lets not forget
Miller has missed something like 3 games in 10 years which is amazing…heinrich has had some problems staying on the court in his career.
Andre is a freak of NBA health. Everyone else looks like porcelain compared to him.
Kirk’s injury history is pretty much average-to-good by NBA standards.
by MiledAnimal on Jul 29, 2009 10:14 AM PDT up reply actions
It's good, the only long-term injury he had was to his thumb last year. Apart from that he missed less than e.g. Blake.
Miller is rivaled only by Tayshaun Prince and Dirk Nowitzki when it comes to not missing games.
Hinrich has had one real injury
One he came back early from and is fully healed.
I dunno where this “he gets injured” rep came from, but you aren’t alone in saying it. I just don’t see how it is true.
Mortimer
Oh, man, the disease is even afflicting my man, Morty...
Wasn’t there an episode of Star Trek: Next Gen that covered this??? The whole crew became obsessed with a back up point guard and one by one became incapacitated until there was no one left to run the ship and it glided off into space on auto-pilot.
I’m pretty sure that was the last episode of the series…
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
I do like Hinrich
But if the Bulls don’t wanna trade him, then there’s nuthin’ we can do about it. I can live without him.
BUT, also, he ain’t injury prone or often injured. He just had one wrist/hand/whatever thangy that is okay now.
I refuse to lament a “lost chance” to get Hinrich that never existed, though. That is dumb.
Morty
Why won't this asinine fallacy die already?
During Hinrich’s first five seasons in the NBA, he played in 389 out of 410 possible games. For once, the facts ought to kill off this moronic myth.
Beyond Hinrich’s freak wrist injury last season, he’s been relatively healthy throughout his entire career—and that’s that!
Stupid people have stupid ideas.
It was a torn thumb ligament, although it's been oft reported as a wrist injury
But yes, that’s the only significant, big chunk of games missed for injury. Beyond that he’s had the normal ankle tweaks, hamstrings, etc. A concussion once, and a viral illness his rookie season. Nothing that would suggest an ongoing problem with a specific limb or joint, and he certainly doesn’t sit out a bunch of games for questionable injuries either.
So I don’t know where the injury-prone thing is coming from either.
In honor of the dearly departed, I declare July PB&J month - everyone raise a sandwich to the memory of Ben!
Shaq Cardiac
For me, Shaq represents the best and worst moves.
Phoenix managed to get rid of the anvil tied to their foot, picked up a fantastic defensive player in Wallace, and signed Nash to a new deal. Cleveland did get bigger(also much slower), but managed to cast King James’ leadership role in question by signing the high profile center.
I’m sure both teams will make it to the playoffs and neither will make it to the finals, which is an improvement for PHX and treading water for CLE…very expensive water.
107
degrees today or so they say….the suns bought out big bens contract right away and i dont see them making the playoffs this year..i like what the mavs did by getting marion but they are an old team and that window is small. I really like what the magic did. keeping gortat was smart and signing brandon bass will allow rashard to slide back to the 3 spot. losing hedo will hurt but carter gives you more at this point than lee does and they had to get alston off that team.
The worst is...
Toronto spending a combined $106 million on Hedo Turkoglu and Andrea Bargnani. There have got to be better ways to tie up your money.
Detroit blowing its cap space that it could have saved for 2010 on never-to-be-All-Stars Ben Gordon and Charlie Villenueva wasn’t too bright either.
My favorite move of the summer was Richard Jefferson to the Spurs for essentially scraps. That keeps them close to the top of the league for another couple of years.
Toronto also resigned rasho
Are they trying to field a all euro team?
..heh
I love how everyone mispells Kirk’s name.
Heinrick
Heinrich
It’s Hinrich.
Anyway! Here’s my “well that’s odd..” so far for the 2009 off-season, in no particular order:
Vince Carter: Let me see if I have this right. You give up on one of your best ball handlers in Turkeyglue, to sign a “way past his prime” guy in Vince Carter? What has Air Canada proven he can do in the last 2-3 years? Horrible horrible move to let Hedo go. I would have been throwing cash at Turk to stay in Orlando. He is the only reason their “inside out” offensive philosophy worked so well. Does anyone actually think Vince Carter is going to be lighting it up from 3 next year in Orlando? There’s a reason Dwight was hounding Hedo this off season.
Spurs: Bad knees or not, it’s ridiculous that DaJuan Blair fell as far as he did in the draft. The dude is one of the best rebounders coming out of college. He totally ate Hasheem Thabeet alive in CT. We’ll see, but I have a feeling a lot of teams are going to regret letting him fall as far as he did, including Portland. Choosing guys in the second round is supposed to be a low risk high reward sort of deal.
Milwaukie: First they dump salary and lose Richard Jefferson, one of the more underrated forwards in the league.. then they give up on Villanueva.. I’m just going to stop here because we’re talking about the Bucks. They obviously have no interest in being over the cap and are willing to just remain terrible. People care about the Packers in that state, not the Bucks.
Ben Gordon: Defense? What’s that? Dude I just score. Sorry man. Detroit gets what may be one of the most overrated guards in the NBA. If the Bulls didn’t think he was a starter for them, why on earth did Detroit throw 11 million a year at him? Then what’s even funnier is that the Bulls hadn’t even made Gordon an offer. The Pistons were bidding against themselves. Talk about overpaying.
Minnesota: Huh? You drafted two point guards in the lottery? Uh.. ok? Both of them need the ball in their hands to be effective. Rubio and Flynn are starters or very close to it on other teams. Now, to make matters worse Rubio sees the writing on the wall and is threatening to play in Europe next year. Well played T-Wolves!
Zach Randolph: Hi, remember me? I’m an above average 4 now playing for the Grizzlies where they already have a great draft pickup big man in Marc Gasol. I’m a locker room chemistry killer and you can count on at least a few run ins with the law every year. Oh, and about that ~ 25 million Memphis WAS going to have available next summer? Down to 8 million now, thanks to Z-Bo and Memphis’ bad management. I’m willing to bet Dunleavy is doing cartwheels in L.A. Somebody wanted his bad contract! Yipee! I’m not sure which is dumber, picking up Z or trading away Pau to the Lakers a few years back for basically nothing. Horrible horrible front office in Memphis.
Trevor Ariza: Hi, my agent is terrible. The Lakers offered me the same contract Houston did, but I thought MAYBE.. just MAYBE the Lakers would offer me more. But they didn’t, so now I’m stuck in Houston.. where they need scoring help? What do they think I am, a scorer? Don’t get me wrong. I like Ariza. But that team needs a lot more help w/o Yao Ming. Ariza is probably a lot more comfortable being a roleplayer, not someone they will lean on for scoring in the starting lineup. How he thinks after averaging 6.9 ppg for his CAREER.. that he’ll suddenly be what Houston needs.. is nonsense in my opinion.
The Timberwolves' draft, given all the great picks they had, merits comment for its rottenness, for sure.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
If you're going to criticize name spellings..
please spell DeJuan Blair correctly.
But yes, it’s funny how many people seem to sound it out and spell it their own way!
Peep the sig.
by 12sharks on Jul 29, 2009 9:29 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
It would help if "Hinrich" was pronounced the way it's spelled
or spelled the way it’s pronounced.
by MiledAnimal on Jul 29, 2009 10:25 AM PDT up reply actions
I disagree with you completely concerning Milwaukee.
Jefferson has been overrated, not underrated. Letting Villanueva go instead of resigning him to a big contract took a lot of guts, and will pay off in the long run. No one knows what’s going on with Sessions. which is working heavily to Milwaukee’s advantage at the moment. For years, the Bucks had been spending money to try to be a 40 win team, year in and year out. Their new GM seems to be willing to take the chance and blow it all up and start from scratch. Sometimes you’ve got to do that. Things will be worse for the Bucks in the short term, but Hammond seems to have an eye beyond this year. And as Blazer fans, we should remember that it wasn’t long ago that our front office started to think like that.
I’m not counting on Milwaukee to win in the next couple of years, but I think they’re going about getting better in the right way. Rebuilding on the fly by overpaying mediocre talent is a recipe for disaster.
μὴ φοβοῦ, μόνον πίστευε.
Richard Jefferson
How is Richard Jefferson overrated? ..lol?
Despite coming back from an ankle injury last year, he still averaged 19.6 ppg (.439 from the field), 4.6 rebounds, shoots .805 from the FT line, .397 from 3-point territory and averaged 1.3 – 3.6 of them per game. The past 6 seasons he’s averaged nearly 20 ppg. All of this at the SF position.
How many 3’s in the league post numbers like that? He’s very, very underrated and the Spurs know it.
He must be a phenomenal player
if he was able to pry the ball loose from Michael Redd’s hands often enough to average 20ppg.
by MiledAnimal on Jul 29, 2009 11:08 AM PDT up reply actions
How many 4's post better numbers than Zack Randolph?
Numbers aren’t the problem. The problem is that he didn’t make Milwaukee better. With Redd and Bogut, he wasn’t a bad third wheel. But both of them went out with injuries, and Jefferson showed that he wasn’t star material. He’s a good pick up for the Spurs, who need someone in that SF position with Jefferson’s skill sets. They also have enough players in front of him that he doesn’t have high expectations there. Still, at the money Jefferson is owed, and with the amount of respect he’s given, I feel confident in calling him overrated. He’s no All-Star, but people think he is.
Talent wise, he’s not much better than Travis Outlaw. Outlaw could post those numbers if given Jefferson’s opportunity. Would that be useful? Most would probably say no. Jefferson’s lauded defense was non-existent. 43% shooting just isn’t that efficient. Most Milwaukee fans are glad to see him gone, just like Portland fans were when Randolph left. And like Portland, Milwaukee got just about as much for him. At least they didn’t give up much to get him in the first place.
μὴ φοβοῦ, μόνον πίστευε.
Hello Toronto/Detroit
“Rebuilding on the fly by overpaying mediocre talent is a recipe for disaster.”
I LOVE PEOPLE THAT MAKE CLAIMS WITH NO INFO BEHIND THEM
I’m not a big fan of Vince Carter, but to claim he’s “way past his prime” is just silly. Dude averaged 21, 5 and 5 last year, All-Star caliber numbers
he’s a different kind of player, but he’s an upgrade over Turkoglu. They have a PG playmaker in Jameer Nelson, and shooters on the perimeter with a beast in the middle that the defense has to stay home on
Just because he played for the Nets and they’re never on TV or hyped, don’t make the generalization that Vince Carter hasn’t been playign well
by rip_city_swagger on Jul 29, 2009 10:57 AM PDT up reply actions
Way to stand up for correct spelling!
Jeff MacInis would be proud. After all, I can’t think of a former Blazer whose name was butchered by fans on message boards more than Jeff McGuinness. I used to feel so sorry for Jeff McEnis – after all, is it really that hard to spell MacHinnes?
its all about money
I’d say that san antonia taking advantage of the bucks being so cheap and getting jefferson was the best move simply because its low risk and they didn’t give up anything. For the worst the raptors putting up 100+ for bargnani and turk for five years? thats kind of excessive, I wish they would have waited or given bargnani less money so it would be easier to resign aldridge. I know the blazers are done making trades but we still have two big moves to make this off-season, any talk about that??
So..
After reading all of these posts, do some of you think YOU could run a basketball team better than the Grizzlies and Bucks. Maybe I’m horrible mistaken, but I sure do. Some of the moves those clubs make baffles me.
I suspect the owner runs that show in Memphis.
by MiledAnimal on Jul 29, 2009 10:30 AM PDT up reply actions
If so, I suspect the owner has a fondness for hallucinogenic mushrooms........
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Why?
Is Cleveland slower now that they have Shaq? Has anyone ever watched Big Z lumber up the court? He’s 7’3", 260 or so and has had multiple foot surgeries. And if you think Shaq and Z will play together that’s just silly. And as far as Ben Wallace being a great defender, I’m assuming you haven’t watched a basketball game he played in since 2006(And Phx bought him out). The best move of the summer is LA picking up Artest on the cheap (no he’s not going to kill the triangle with bad shots because once again you people are watching espn classic, the lakers hardly run the triangle anymore) and the worst is Detroit overspending. Actually Memphis taking Z-Bo and his contract is the worst, but I no longer consider them an NBA franchise.
Shaq/Z gives Cleveland the best Center tandem in the NBA.
No debate.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Guess I should say Howard/Gortat
I would take that pair over Cleveland’s
You'll be voting Oden/Przybilla in a few months.
by MiledAnimal on Jul 29, 2009 10:31 AM PDT up reply actions
Hope so
But you would be crazy not swap out for Howard/Gortat if you could right now.
That said, I think Oden/Pryz is pretty high on the list in the NBA right now. Top 5?
by oregontrail on Jul 29, 2009 11:31 AM PDT up reply actions
yeah
I’d put them 4th behind Howard/Gortat, Shaq/Z and Nene/Birdman, with plenty of potential for the Blazer tandem to pass all but Howard/Gortat within the next year or 2.
unless you count Gasol as a C (he has shown he can be effective)
in which case Bynum/Gasol is probably #2.
Hmmmm, I never thought about that. I think Gasol/Bynum might be best of the lot.
Now I’m debating myself.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Only because they are younger
not because they give better production
A Gentle Reminder
Guess I’m not supposed to say that you guys haven"t been watching your basketball. So I ammend my previous statement and would like it to now be read as follows: Ben Wallace is still in his prime, Ilgauskus is faster than Tony Parker, and Kirk is so amazing that I’d trade any and all blazers past and present for him
Well
the bucks decisions are all financially based decisions the memphis front office on the other hand has no excuses. just one bad deal after another.
I don't know about best moves, but the Spurs definitely had the best off-season
Blair, Jefferson, McDyess, and Theo Ratliff are all immediate contributors to a team that desperately needs to move way from just letting Tony Parker go 1 on 5. Less pressure on Manu and Duncan, they’ll have enough firepower to coast through another 50 win season and be prepared to battle in the playoffs.
I can’t decide what’s a dumber offseason, Dallas or Toronto. Colangelo spends 120 million for Hedo, Bargnani, and Jarret Jack in hopes Bosh won’t leave. Um, Bosh will happily jet to Miami, Chicago, Cleveland, wherever next season because the Raptors are still in no way a title contender. They let Anthony Parker go for no reason and signed a worse player in Jack. Cuban had another drunken sailor offseason, Tim Thomas, Shawn Marion, Jason Kidd, Drew Gooden…..how many extra wins does this garner them? 2?
The most pathetic offseason goes to either the Bulls or Knicks. Chicago refuses to part with Hinrich, and instead lets Gordon walk away for nothing in the name of cap space, then proceed to waste it on 1 year deals for Pargo and Aaron Gray. They keep saying they will be a player in 2010, but as it stands it’s going to be tough to sign a max FA next summer. The Knicks thought they would get Nash, Grant Hill, all these vets to make the roster attractive to LeBron. No one signed with them, and they will suck again.
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
Picking-up Jefferson and drafting Blair was smart for the Spurs
because they need help in the next three years, which is about how long Jefferson will be around and the probably max length of time that DeJuan “No-Knees” Blair’s career will last before he is forced to retire.
by MiledAnimal on Jul 29, 2009 10:36 AM PDT up reply actions
Nowitzki says the guy who defends him and other mobile PFs best is Shawn Marion. Maybe I’m a Dallas homer, but I loved that move. If they had landed Gortat or kept Bass, I would even say they are a championship contender. Now they’ll have to find a good move for Dampier down the road, which seems very possible since he is the best expiring/non-guaranteed contract at the deadline or next off-season. I could very well see them land another star player for that deal, maybe in combination with Howard who is a team option. Gooden and Thomas will quietly go away in a year, and they are replacing guys who didn’t do much either (in the tradition of The George, Malik Allen, DeSagana Diop, Ryan Hollins, …) so it’s not really hurting.
Good call on the Knicks offseason, apart from D’Antoni maybe being able to rescue Darko Milicic the draft and the trade season didn’t really go according to plan so far, and their own free agents aren’t re-signed or signed and traded either.
What's hilarious is that the idiotic media forgets the Knicks tried to do this in 1997 and failed
There were huge name FAs that year, Alonzo Mourning, Tim Hardaway, Michael Jordan, Charles Barkley.
The Knicks ended up using their cap space on………Allan Houston and a chronically injured Larry Johnson.
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 29, 2009 11:00 AM PDT up reply actions
Agree re the Knicks
How many times are you going to let yourself get used for leverage like that? Startling to see Donnie Walsh get played that way.
"I take the little gummy bear Flintstones vitamins…I try not to eat the lady. I try not to eat the man. Just give me the car. I try to find the car. Yea, worst case scenario, I eat the lady." - Ron Artest, 2009
To determine the best and worst moves
I first had to think of what I thought would play out this coming season, which teams would improve, which teams would regress, etc.. To do that I simply tried to do a very early projection of next seasons records for teams. After doing so it was easy to tell which teams I felt made the best moves, and which teams made the worst moves.
08/09 records—————————Projected 09/10 record
Lakers 65-17—————————-65-17: If they lose Odom this goes way down
Nuggets 54-28————————-55-27: A full season with Billups in Training camp leads to 1 or 2 more wins
Blazers 54-28—————————-57-25: Miller gives the Blazers a boost.
Spurs 54-28——————————-56-26: Jefferson makes them better, but the big 3 are not healthy yet.
Rockets 53-29—————————43-39: Loss of 2 main scoring options hurts badly
Mavs 50-32———————————46-36: No front court depth spells doom
Hornets 49-33—————————50-32: Improved health makes a big deal.
Jazz 48-34———————————-50-32: Improved health makes a big deal.
Phx 46-36————————————-41-41: Could be worse if they do trade STAT
Golden State 29-53——————25-57: This could blow up at any moment
Memphis 24-58————————-18-64: Z-Bo will complain when Mayo and Gay keep jacking up shots
T-Wolves 24-58————————-20-62: they lost productive players in Miller and Foye.
OKC 23-59———————————-33-49: 10 game improvement, but still seller dwellers
Clippers 19-63—————————30-52: 11 more wins with Griffin over Z-Bo
Sactown 17-65—————————20-62: They just won’t spend to win.
So with that done it is easy to see the biggest winner and loser in my opinion.
Biggest winner overall:
Clippers +11 wins – replacing Z-Bo with a 4 who should be just as good at scoring and rebounding, but will play within a team role. Now if only they could get rid of their crazy coach they might start winning more than losing.
Biggest loser overall:
Houston -10 wins – Losing both Yao and Artest will really hurt, a team full of role players, with a good coach can still win some games, but they will be fighting Phx for the 8th spot and the right to face the Lakers.
Biggest winner of playoff teams:
Blazers – +3 wins – Miller adds another creator and playmaker to a team that was already every efficient on offense, and will cause Nate to grow and adapte as a coach, freeing the team to push the tempo for easy buckets, and freeing Roy to be Roy without all the pressure to make every play.
Biggest loser of playoff teams:
Houston -10 wins – Same reasoning as above.
Ben II Blazersedge.com || New to Blazers' Edge?
by usmcr3049 on Jul 29, 2009 11:59 AM PDT reply actions 1 recs
Pardon the homer answer
But when the smoke clears (say, a couple of seasons from now), it could well turn out that the Andre Miller move was the best of all. If Miller provides badly needed veteran leadership—functioning as a true “coach on the floor”—he could make everyone around him better and help the Blazers reach the next level. All without giving up a thing.
How do you beat that? OK, some of the other off-season deals—e.g., Shaq to Cleveland—have the potential to pay off even bigger. But I sure wouldn’t bet on it.
"We don't back down to nobody." --Joel Przybilla
homer answer #2
My spouse and I were up drinking a while ago entranced in conversation, including convincing ourselves of all of the purely perfect talking points about why Hedo was going to take the Blazers to a championship. When the ESPN ticker went by saying he was going to Toronto, we automatically high fived, without words. Too much justification for a player when, for the money, there should have been no need for justification. Losing young talent would mean a lot more justification and possibly painful repercussions for a long time in the future.
My favorite: Hedo to Toronto, Miller to Portland
while artest can't guard quick guards like kobe and ROY.
BUT he can guard the big powerfull scoring three’s. like lebron, melo, and pierce. who just happen to be the closers on the l*akers biggest challengers.
simple as that.
I'll say this too..
Lakers minus Lamar Odom and they won’t finish higher than 3rd in the Western Conference for sure. I agree with usmcr3049. I’d even say without Odom they drop at least 8-10 more games than they did last season.
My best and worst are:
Best – OKC drafts Harden instead of Rubio.
Worst – Milwaukee trading Richard Jefferson for Bowen, Thomas and Oberto.
I think people are sleeping on a few moves
I think Dallas did rather well. Yes Marion and Thomas have not been good as of late but when they spent time with a great point gaurd they were both VERY important to their teams. Say what you will about Jason Kidd’s age (remember Stockton played his last season at 41 and Kidd should be mentioned in the same class) but he is still an elite PG which can make those guys thrive one last time.
The whole Chandler/Okafor thing. I dont know if it makes either team better or worse just changes the names on jersey. Chandler is never going to be a dominating offensive player but there is a stat out there showing that opponets PER is down a great deal when he is on the floor much more so than Okafor and while Okafor doesn’t have much of an offensive game its’s much farther along than Chandlers.
For San Antonio Jefferson is a good pick up. I don’t think he is under or over-rated he is a very good slasher who can also be a very good spot up shooter which will make the manu/TP drive and kick very nasty. he isnt the defender bowen is but he will work very hard on D.
Shaq to Cleveland will end up being fine. They talk about taking away the lane for Labron and that would be true if Labron were only a finisher. However Labron is a very smart and saavy passer making his drives even more dangerous.
IMO the biggest loser in the whole off season (excluding the Griz because that one needs NO debate but is also no fun) would have to be the Rockets. Morey is a smart GM and I am sure he is working on something or waiting til the trade deadline for a bottom feeder needing a expiring contract, but if Ariza is his only move then we have Epic fail.
Knew I forgot someone.
Detroit. Detriot Detroit Detroit. Oh Joe how far you have fallen. Ok CV not a bad player they didn’t really pay too much for him so ok but Ben Gordon… 50+ mil over 5 years for a smaller version of Rip that cant really defend all that well. You and Brian in Toronto have made me a sad sad panda.
strictly restricting to offseason moves
and not counting unforeseen circumstances (e.g. Yao Ming’s injury), the honor for the worst move would have to be shared between the Detroit Pistons and Toronto Raptors. The Pistons used up all of their cap space and got no productive players in return. As it stands now, it would be surprising if they even make the playoffs next year. Meanwhile, the Raptors managed to completely gut their roster of productive players and lost Marion (and more importantly, Jamario Moon, who they traded to get Shawn Marion). So, now the Raptors are left with only 2 productive players in Jose Calderon and Chris Bosh, and on the path to not win much in the coming season, which might lead even Bosh to leave the team. Considering all this, my vote for the worst offseason has to be Toronto Raptors.
Other notable mention:
LA Lakers: The Lakers managed to loose an extremely productive player (Ariza) and gained a poor on-court producer (Artest). This will have an impact on their win total in the coming season, however, they still have a very good roster and will still be the side to contend with in the West.
The team with the best offseason move would have to be:
Dallas: Resigning Jason Kidd was a very important achievement for the Mavericks and on top of that they acquired Marion, who is an upgrade
Other notable mentions:
Orlando: Carter is a major upgrade over Turkoglu, and they resigned Gortat. Their worst move was to get Brandon Bass.
Cleveland: Getting Shaq will definitely help out and they might now be the team favored to win it all next season. Also, Jamario Moon signing a contract sheet with them will make the Cavs field 9 above average players on the court, and that by all accounts is a formidable lineup, and gets my vote to win it all next season (barring injuries)
Portland: Though point guard was not the most lacking position last season, the addition of Miller will definitely add a few wins to this fine team.
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