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BRoy for 6th Man of the Year!?! Fast Breaking, Rip City Style

OK, maybe I'm crazy.  I've been called worse...  But ever since I started thinking about fit, I've been obsessed with this idea:  BRoy should be the Blazers 6th man, an award he'd win yearly.

Star-divide

Personal Background:  In my glory days of single manhood, I grew up with Larry Bird, and what I consider to be the best NBA team ever, the 1986 Celtics, with the best 6th man ever, Big Bill Walton.  I didn't follow the legendary Russell Celtics - the NBA was really unknown then, even in Boston because of the '67 Redsox, and Bruins winning Cups, but I did learn one thing about hoops as a youth:

Fast Break basketball is the epitome of the sport. 

Fast breaks (Easy Points) and Defense win championships.  The NBA is most fun to watch when these best-in-the-world athletes are running the entire game long.  The team that always plays up-tempo can outlast the other team – they just run out of gas by the 4th.  Russell and Cousy's Celtics invented it; Kareem and Magic revived it with ShowTime and had awesome battles with the '86 Celtics (with the incomparable passer Bill Walton coming off the bench – he and Bird were amazing together), and I believe it's time for:

Fast Break, Rip City style.

To create a dominant fast break team you need at least four, preferably more, of these ingredients:

#1: a great defense, ideally with occasional suffocating full court defensive pressure (keeps the pace high)

#2: dominant defensive rebounding, and a solid outlet pass scheme

#3: more than one person who knows what to do with an outlet pass (one guy on each wing, ideally),

#4: greyhounds (guys that can run all day, obvious, if you can make it a track meet, you need the horses… or dogs)

#5: A good solid half-court offense, too, so teams just can’t forgo all offensive boards and stop your one skill

 

And most importantly,

#6: Serious depth - you must have a great bench, and, ideally, a 6th man who can come in and put up points in a hurry, any time the offense stalls.

 

When I look at the possible starting 5 below, I believe we can start each game with a physical, punishing, fast break, points-in-the-paint attack.

#5: Greg Oden:  (Dominant Defensive Rebounding, Check… And a BIG time finisher)

#4: LA: (part 2 of #2, and add 1 Greyhound)

#3: Nicolas Batum: (far more suited to a running game, he’s a greyhound, a finisher, and can handle the ball)

 

Now, I think most Blazer observers envision these three starting, at least at the beginning of the year before we know about Martell, and Nic earned it.  The other two choices are where the fun begins.  My point guard has to be:

#1: Andre Miller:  I love Blakie, but obviously, Andre is the first choice for the outlet pass.

 

Now, what this squad doesn’t have is a shooter. Martell might supplant Batum in this role.  (And in fact, I have an alternative proposal, too that would make this work.  What incredible depth Nate has.)  But you also want a runner, and a guy that can handle the ball.  Our best #2 that fits that job description is

 

#2: Rudy Fernandez:  He and Andre would team up for multiple highlight reel plays each week, and if no break, hmm., how about Andre drive and dish to a big, or back out to the wings for a Rudy 3?

 

So, my starters are GO, LA, Nic, Rudy, and Andre.   Kind of an obvious omission there, our All-Star Guard, BRoy.  Now, I can more realistically see Brandon fitting this role as he ages, and there’s little reason for Nate to open himself up to this kind of abuse (but he’d get CoY if it worked), but I think Brandon Roy is the perfect, prototypical 6th man.  

 

But before you dismiss this idea, take a look at the second unit, who comes in over a 2-3 minute period after 7 or so minutes of bruising fatiguing play:

 

Brandon Roy, first off the bench for Rudy – he would be consensus #1 pick for 6th man of the year in this role…

Steve Blake, solid point guard playmaker, ideally complements BRoy.

Martell Webster, the outside shot threat needed in Nate’s pattern offense…

Travis Outlaw, a bit of an undersized 4, and if we need a big, this could be Pendergraph, too

Joel Pryzbylla, the Vanilla Gorilla, beating up on the other teams tired #1 or lousy #2 5.

 

I just think not only does that proposed first unit have great fast break quick start domination potential, but they have some serious half court offensive threats:  In addition to Andre solo trips, Andre to Rudy on the fast break. Andre Miller to Oden on the pick and roll lob, Andre to LA, other side, same thing.  Oh, they stop that, how about I hit Rudy on the wing or in the corner?  He’s covered?  Go to the rim for a lob.  Or, how about swinging it to Nic for a Pippen-like drive to the hoop?  None of that’s working?  “BRoy, you’re in”…  BRoy drive left, two foul shots, BRoy pull-up jumper…  (opposing coach: (“Time Out”)

 

And you can bring in a rested all-star, and 4 other starting quality offensive players off the bench?   I’m telling you, Dante, Graph and Bayless are going to average 10+ mpg in about 50 games this year, because we’ll be winning a lot of games early.    

 

I _really_ hope that we don't rely on Brandon anywhere near as much as we have in year's past.  Sure, need a game winner, by all means, it's Brandon's shot.  But if we play up to this squad's abilities, and utilize our assets in a fast break up-tempo game, we won't need many game winning miracles from BRoy..  BRoy has one weakness that have seen:  he's not a good fast break player.  So let not try to fit that square peg..   But there is no reasonto squander the considerable fast break talents of this squad because it doesn't fit your best player's talents. But if we cam keep Brandon around 30 mpg, just think how much better a rested BRoy would look in June 2010 in the finals.

 

So, in conclusion (sorry so long, but it's a nice lazy Sunday, too hot to be outside):  If you look at the criteria needed for a fast break team, we fit the mold.  We have a dominant defensive rebounder and very good team rebounding.  We have incredible depth.  We are the youngest age per minute team in the NBA (just made up that stat, but I like it), with a fleet of guys that can run all day.  The starting lineup I propose would have a great ballhandlers and halfcourt attack.  The bench would be the best in the league, behind BRoy, the perennial sixth man.

 

In fact, I really wish the Blazers would bring in a fast break coach, somebody who knows how to get the wings filled, couple of dribbles, a pass or two, slam dunk basketball...  Get a big man for Greg to teach him the finer points of the outlet pass.  Get a scheme together.  A fast break can be a play, too!

 

So Your Thoughts:

- would you like to see the Blazers run more?

-do you think BRoy, coming off the bench behind a fast break unit, could be the ultimate 6th man?

 

 

Poll
Blazer Fast Break Basketball, with BRoy as 6th man is:
Crazy idea, what r u drinkin?
298 votes
Never going to happen with Nate
69 votes
So crazy it just might work
45 votes

412 votes | Poll has closed

2 recs  |  Comment 47 comments

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And watch Rudy get destroyed by just about every starting shooting guard in the league?

 No thank you.

I could have sacrificed goin' out
To think my homies who did it, I used to joke about
From now on I'ma use self control instead of birth control
Cause $315 ain't worth your soul
$315 ain't worth your soul
$315 ain't worth it

by The Pirate on Jul 26, 2009 3:48 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Nah

This is Brandon Roy’s team. Not the Warriors.

by Sabonis4Ever on Jul 26, 2009 4:01 PM PDT reply actions   2 recs

Warrior fan here: What's that supposed to mean?

Seriously though. What’s that supposed to mean? Is it the style of play?

by ZaMzAm FiRe on Jul 27, 2009 1:58 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yes

Without you out there, we're nowhere here

by 22baylor on Jul 27, 2009 4:16 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

no dis

I actually enjoy warrior games and root for them if they aren’t play the blazers because they are fun to watch

by lurtsman on Jul 30, 2009 8:21 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'll put you down for (a) then...

Remember, it’s not who starts, but who finishes… And BRoy could still get 30 mpg, more, if we needed it. But the rest of the staters are fast break ready. Brandon isn’t. Rudy is.

by Visionary1 on Jul 26, 2009 4:32 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

This is a good point

What we saw with Batum last year. Just because Nate starts a player, doesn’t mean that player will get the most minutes at that position.

Still, putting Roy on the bench keeps us from dominating the first quarter, which I believe will be the hallmark of our team for years to come.

Blazers Prophecy.
3-5 championships in next decade.
You heard it here first.

by mjm6783 on Jul 26, 2009 6:49 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

What ever it is, I want some!

by Rep- on Jul 26, 2009 4:32 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

me too

with enough we could throw a crazy BE party

C*mcast sucks!

by Blazermaniac77 on Jul 26, 2009 8:26 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Max players don't ride the pine

There’s no reason this line-up couldn’t be used without BRoy coming off the bench. The starting 5 behind LMA and Roy are going to have to be earned in training camp and preseason like it should be. The Blazers don’t need to change what won 54 games. Addition was the best situation this offseason but that doesn’t meant the starting 5 needed to change. If Miller or Webster earn their starting position then there will be no worries for the blazers this year.

by BlazerKuttn on Jul 26, 2009 4:37 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Can I just say I really dislike this idea?

Since when has a team built around the fast break won the championship in recent years? All the teams that have fast break offenses always do well in the regular season and then choke in the playoffs. If the fast break offense were that great, then the Suns would have a Larry O’Brien trophy by now. Why throw the baby out with the bath water? Can’t we just get more fast break points while keeping our highly efficient offense intact? I don’t think we want to significantly change an offense that by most metrics was between #1 and #3 in the NBA last season. And personally, I want Roy on the court for as long as possible without him getting worn out or injured.

I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer.—Dune

by Muad'Dib on Jul 26, 2009 4:40 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Well

Most of the teams that run fast break offenses usually do it because they have no option but to outscore the opponent. I think if you can run an uptempo style and shut it down on defense you would win championships. The 89-92 Blazers did it pretty well but some of that was with Uncle Cliffy off the bench.

by DephlatorMouse on Jul 26, 2009 5:30 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Sorry...

I know you put alot of effort in this post but there is nothing about the idea that I like… and there is no way it could be done without completely alienating players and fans.

by Ilikeemall on Jul 26, 2009 4:58 PM PDT via mobile reply actions   0 recs

outside the box.....i pass on this one but keep them coming. good read

"show me a good loser and i'll show you a loser" - coach

by chikndnnr on Jul 26, 2009 5:26 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

as do I

Outside the box for sure. Keep ’em coming, for sure. – Elgin

Without you out there, we're nowhere here

by 22baylor on Jul 27, 2009 4:17 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

If the Blazers can't run with Brandon...

The Blazers ain’t running.

Luckiiy, that’s not the case. Just because Brandon doesn’t love to run doesn’t mean the only way for the Blazers to run is with their second-team all league guy on the bench.

I love the idea of Andre running with Rudy, Nic and LMA, but the odds that could or should happen with BRoy coming off the bench are zero.

It could happen with Roy in the game (not every player has to love the break – it only takes 2-4 guys to run) or when Brandon’s taking a breather (which I fully agree would be the ideal running squad – Nic, Rudy, Dre, LMA, and Greg is a NASTY breaking team).

This could be recast as an argument that Blake should continue starting – then you might get people to listen to you.

Q: Is Greg favoring his knee?
Frye: He favors dunking on your head, that's what he favors.

by KP Corleone on Jul 26, 2009 5:32 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

OK, would you believe...

OK, so we agree that Dre, Rudy, Nic, LMA, and GO are a fast break waiting to happen… OK, so let me try this:

Start: Steve Blake, Brandon Roy, Martell, LMA, and Joel.
Get the team into rhythm by establishing our half court offense down low, get Brandon a couple of drives to get him going. Get Martell and Blake a 3, Joel a putback…

Then, bring in: Dre, Rudy, Nic, Travis, and GO…

I just wanna see fast break easy points demoralizing hoop… As I’m actually OK with any 3, 4, or 5 on the break, maybe I just really want to see Andre and Rudy and Blake and Roy have more combined minutes than any other two-some…

by Visionary1 on Jul 26, 2009 6:20 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

First and foremost, I won't even touch the Brandon Roy part of this article. Thankfully, I'm in a calm mood.

Yet, with regards to a more fast-paced, up-tempo style, I’ll lay down my two cents on this issue ‘cause it looks to be a matter of concern for not only numerous fans, but also reportedly GM Kevin Pritchard. Y’know, if I recall correctly, Pritchard recently met with the coaching staff and stated his desire for the team to dial it up a notch, even though I think his pleas will ultimately fall on deaf ears.

For those who want to watch run-and-gun basketball in the Rose City, you should demand that Nate McMillan is fired and replaced with a coach who’ll institute such an offense. Above everything else, it’s the head coach who dictates the team’s pace.

Personally, I like a slow-paced, methodical offense, for it’s usually the most efficient way of smoothly running a ballclub. In fact, I’d gladly fire McMillan and hire a replacement who’s more plodding than even him — such as Jeff Van Gundy and his heavy staple of pick-and-roll or Mike Fratello and the old-fashioned Hawk offense — although the likelihood of that ever happening is next to nil. We’ve all got our pipe dreams, though.

At any rate, though, let me just sum it up here by saying that this upcoming season Roy will start every game he’s healthy and play approximately 36 to 40 minutes per contest, while McMillan will continue to lead a team that’s in the bottom fifth concerning pace.

Stupid people have stupid ideas.

by AK1984 on Jul 26, 2009 5:47 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Above everything else, it’s the head coach who dictates the team’s pace.

No, it’s the point guard

For the record, Nate was asking them to get into the offense earlier last year, but that wasn’t happening with Blake/Roy

And now we’ve learned from Quick that Miller was Nate’s #1 choice all along, and clearly Andre is more of an uptempo PG who can take the ball up the middle, dish it or finish himself. The Blazers haven’t a PG like that since the days of Rod Strickland

Finally, weren’t Nate’s Sonics an uptempo team? McMillian has had to take it “slow and steady” because that’s the tempo his best player prefers. I am really going to find it interesting to see how Miller affects Roy when the two are in the game together…will Andre actually put some “giddy-up” into Brandon’s game? We’ve seen Roy occasionally fill a lane and finish on the break in the past, but those highlights should increase exponentially with Miller pushing the tempo

When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!

by two4larue on Jul 26, 2009 9:37 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

No, it's the coach.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/MEM/2005.html
http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/MEM/2006.html

When Mike Fratello coached the Memphis Grizzlies earlier this decade, he did so with a wide variety of point guards — such as Jason Williams, Earl Watson, Damon Stoudamire, Chucky Atkins, and Bobby Jackson — at the helm. Regardless, the “Czar’s” team always played at a snail’s pace.

On the other end of the spectrum, coaches like Don Nelson and Mike D’Antoni will gladly run-and-gun no matter their personnel.

Finally, the Seattle SuperSonics were never a fast-paced team under the leadership of Nate McMillan. I’ve discussed this fallacy in the past here, too.

“This, by the way, will show how much Nate McMillan loves a slow-paced offense.

1999 Seattle SuperSonics (Coach Paul Westphal): 10th in Pace Factor.
1999-2000 Seattle SuperSonics (Coach Paul Westphal): 13th in Pace Factor.
2000-2001 Seattle SuperSonics (Coach Paul Westphal/Nate McMillan): 16th in Pace Factor.
2001-2002 Seattle SuperSonics (Coach Nate McMillan): 24th in Pace Factor.
2002-2003 Seattle SuperSonics (Coach Nate McMillan): 27th in Pace Factor.

If that doesn’t kill the dreams of those who want Portland to implement any semblance of an up-tempo, run-and-gun offense, then I don’t know what’ll do it."

http://www.blazersedge.com/2009/6/1/896006/ian-thomsens-comments-on-courtside#16461925

Pace is something that’s stringently controlled by one’s coaching philosophy. Despite how much fans — as well as even GM Kevin Pritchard — want McMillan to speed up the tempo, it’s a fool’s paradise.

Stupid people have stupid ideas.

by AK1984 on Jul 26, 2009 10:30 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'd rather see a team that can execute in the half court, anyway

because to win series’ in the post-season you’ve got to be able to defend, rebound and run your offense to the 3rd and 4th options, because your opponent has scouted your tendencies thoroughly and will take away options 1 & 2 (ref: Houston series)

Miller should help with the half court execution as well, but do you really think Nate would lobby hard to bring Andre in and then try to force him to play a slow-down game? Miller “is what he is” by now. I don’t see Nate trying to turn him into a plough horse…and if that was his intention Andre would’ve looked elsewhere for employment following their dinner date. Instead, Miller’s agent called his client a “perfect fit” for Portland and I expect to see Miller helping Nate and the kids get more easy baskets in transition.

(Like Iguodala said in Arnold’s article, he “shot less but scored more” when Miller was running the show)

Nate said he likes Miller because he plays similar to how McMillian ran the PG “back in the day” when he played for Seattle. Those were tough-minded Sonic’s teams that would defend well and get out and run, when it was there (at least that’s what I saw them doing when I watched that “Tacoma Dome game” replay the other night…)

I’m not saying the Blazers are suddenly going to be in the top 15 NBA teams re: pace, but they should run more with Miller than they have without him, and Andre will also have the ability to “pull it back out” and run the half-court offense if the opposing team gets back on D and shuts down the fast break. I’m looking forward to the change, it’s been awhile since Portland had a PG with a “feel for the game” like Miller. (FWIW, Rod Strickland didn’t shoot the 3-ball much, either…)

When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!

by two4larue on Jul 27, 2009 1:16 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I do see Portland's bench running less, however

With Blake in the game. Maybe that will drag the overall team pace factor back down?

How about Steve feeding Rudy and Martell, coming off “pin-down” screens? Shades of Jack Ramsay’s early ‘80s offense where Jim “fat guard” Paxson was the team’s #1 scoring option!

When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!

by two4larue on Jul 27, 2009 1:39 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

WAY more likely Blake starts than

roy comes off the bench. people assume miller is the starter, but im not sure if he will be, even though i do think he is a better player than blake.

by axel360 on Jul 26, 2009 6:30 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Somebody needs a new screen name

...refusing Coolio's sloppy seconds since 2001...
Now accessible for R rated comments at thetinfoil@gmail.com

by TheTinfoil on Jul 26, 2009 7:46 PM PDT reply actions   1 recs

Keep your best players on the floor as much as possible

Come on you gotta listen unto me,
lay off that whiskey and let that cocaine be. ~Johnny Cash

by HurraKane212 on Jul 26, 2009 8:53 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

What makes you think

Roy can’t shoot the 3 and run out on a fast break?

by SalemORguy on Jul 26, 2009 9:05 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

I agree wholeheartedly

Franchise players should always come off the bench. That’s why Bird, Magic, and Jordan were all 6th men on those dynasties.

The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.

by Ozzie Montana on Jul 26, 2009 10:03 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

I do like your observation that one of the key components to running the break is outlet passes + guys on each side that know what to do with them.

Currently, the Blazers try to run the break with a 4 foot pass to the Point Guard (ALWAYS the Point Guard), followed by a pass to a pack of 3 guys running straight down the middle of the floor, where one defender can cover all three.

It’s tragic, pathetic, and sad. It’s sickening and horrific. It’s annoying.

FIRST STEP: Hire an assistant coach (or listen to a 33 year old veteran PG) who has some clue how to do these things: 1. LONG outlet pass to 2. SPREAD runners.

"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal

by timbo on Jul 26, 2009 10:39 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

maybe bring in Dr. Jack

as a consultant during training camp?

He’d sure make those wing runners “touch the sidelines” on the 3 man weave

When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!

by two4larue on Jul 27, 2009 1:29 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Where

do people get the notion that Roy cant run or wont run on a fast-break? Also dont insult Roy by comparing him to Ginobli.

by BBG on Jul 26, 2009 11:54 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Roy cant run or wont run on a fast-break

Barndon can’t lead a fast break, he has been known to fill a lane (usually the left-hand side) from time to time. But after a teammate gets a defensive rebound and hands it to Roy, Brandon simply will not push the ball upcourt. It’s not in his basketball DNA.

OTOH, Miller is going to be much more willing to “run” off of turnovers and defensive “stops” and look for easy baskets in transition

When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!

by two4larue on Jul 27, 2009 1:27 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I disagree with that assessment of Roy

just as much as I disagree with bringing him off the bench.

“Brandon CAN’T can’t lead a fast break”! That’s an unbelievable statement as he has every tool necessary to not only lead a fast break but to excel at doing so.

AK has it right. It’s all about the coach not emphasizing and I suspect not even practicing fast break basketball.

Brandon Roy just destroyed everything in his path. There's your rational analysis -- Dave

Also: COMCAST SUCKS!

by TwoDeep on Aug 13, 2009 9:44 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

’cause we have so many of those players on our te

by jenstcy on Jul 27, 2009 8:57 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

What i meant to say was...

the only way BRoy is benched is if we have Chris Paul, Kobe Bryant, Lebron James, Dirk Nowitski and Dwight Howard as our starting team. So sure, let’s bench BRoy, a top 10 player in the league, because we have so many of those players on our team….

by jenstcy on Jul 27, 2009 9:01 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Good Post.. Entertainnig

…would never happen though

by The Dynasty on Jul 27, 2009 3:08 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

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