What is the next step in Trading? Part 1
by justAthought on Jul 25, 2009 5:28 PM PDT
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So we have improved that point guard position. so now what do we do? we have a lot of time until anything needs to be done, and we will probably not do anything until much later down the road. but lets hear the ideas now.
I have done this on other sites, so lets try it on this one. Everyone gives what they would consider the best trade possibility for Portland. you can use the obvious guys that we might trade such as Travis Outlaw and Bayless. Or if you think it Best helps the team, maybe some other guys more valuable to us, such as Batum, Rudy. The Best four or Five answers will be voted on to see who has the best trade idea. The author of the best idea will be announced along with his idea.
Ideas will be considered for their
- salary cap space: we dont have much with Andre joining us so you have to consider that when considering the trade.
- Plausable: Even if the cap space works out, trading half our guys for Lebron isn't going to happen. it needs to be believeable and needs to work with the other team/teams we are trading with
- Team needs: if you trade for a center, even a good one wont be as valueable a trade to us as opposed to getting a high quality back up 4 or maybe a solid SF. get what our guys need
- Explanation: why is this trade a good idea for each team. How will these guys help out the blazers specifically.
I want to see some Pritch slapping, some wheeling and dealing. Oh and i got some ideas ill submit too. Fair is Fair, though mine ofcourse wont make the final four. lets see whos got the best answer to bring in the championship we ve been missing the last 3 decades.
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Sign and trade for David Lee
Outlaw, Bayless, with Diago and Sergio’s trade exemptions. With Andre Miller and David Lee we would have a shot at a title right away.
I like it
But I don’t think Lee would go for it. He wants to be a starter and he would not be one.
"Good evening Blazer fans, wherever you may be!"-Bill Schonely
I don't think We have exceptions
as far as I remember from what Storyteller said you could choose to either use your exceptions (Mid-level, Bi-annual, Trade) or have Cap Space we chose the Cap Space to sign Miller
Draft Cole Aldrich 2010
That seems to make them useless to get unless you are over the cap.
That means KP acquired Diogu’s knowing they were going to have to forfit it at the end of the season. Something doesn’t seems correct. I did hear that exceptions, if the Blazers still have any left, can only be used by themselves. Rudy and James Jones were both trades from exceptions.
Not a bad idea, but three things to keep in mind
1) You cannot combine a trade exception with other players to get a higher salaried player.
2) You cannot combine two trade exceptions to form a larger exception
3) Portland does not have trade exceptions any longer because they are under the cap.
Understanding the salary cap is very simple – you cannot go over the cap by more than $100,000. That is the one and only rule regarding the cap. Very simple.
That being said, there are a myriad of exceptions to that rule. Understanding the exceptions is very complex, but they all have one basic component – they can only be used by teams over the cap. Their very name explains it – they are exceptions to the basic rule listed above.
For example – the basic rule on the interstate is that a car cannot exceed 65 miles per hour or else you will be ticketed. But there are exceptions to that rule. A police car with its lights flashing can exceed that speed limit. Now imagine a police car going 55 down the interstate with its lights flashing. The policeman notices that he is passing a highway patrolman and thinks to himself, “It’s a good thing I have my lights flashing or else I would get a ticket.” Doesn’t make sense, right? Because the policeman doesn’t need an exception to the law if he’s not breaking the law.
It’s the same with exceptions to the basic rule of the salary cap. If you’re not breaking the rule, you don’t need exceptions to the rule. In fact, by definition, it is impossible to have or use an exception to the rule if you are not breaking the rule. So a team like Portland, being under the cap, does not have trade exceptions or any other type of exceptions.
by Storyteller on Jul 27, 2009 10:30 AM PDT up reply actions
Udonis Haslem
We trade Travis and and Bayless for Udonis Haslem.
At his salary it comes out about right, and the heat already have a loaded front court with a huge contract in jermaine O neal 23 million. Ouch. and michael beasley who they drafted aas a PF. Udonis could be a solid backup PF. he averages 10 ppg and 8 rpg.
espn has him at 6-8 235. he can score get rebounds and adds the depth at that position. we keep martell for offense and have batum for defense at SF.
this also helps miami but some body they dont need to clear some space for wades up and coming contract, and gives them two other scorers for their second team.
maybe not the huge deal you were expecting, but i think it gives us the most solid front court in the NBA
I like this deal.
I’d also throw in PG Chris Quinn.
Miami sheds more money, we get a 3rd string PG.
" the project of Portland brings me good sensations..."
- Rudy Fernandez
translated by animart1
This would be excellent for us.
Especially if the Heat trade for Boozer (although I guess that’d likely mean Haslem going to Utah). Seems fairly plausible too.
You can measure skill and talent with your eyes, but productivity is shown through statistics.
Outlaw and Bayless for Jeff Foster
Before y’all shoot me, ask yourselves…what is the most important measuring stick of a contending team? (Answer: winning multiple playoff series’) Are Travis and Jerryd really going to help Portland win playoff series in the next few years? Are you sure? Would adding a veteran PF/C who can rebound and get under the skin of the L*kers (etc) help win playoff series? What if there’s foul trouble to Greg, Joel or LMA, is Trout going to get those key rebounds or defend the post? What about the rookies (“Pendergram”) will they really be ready after playing short minutes all year?
Trade “potential” gain experience and raise the BBIQ. Then, go out and win road games in May. It’s not pretty, but it would be effective. It’s also something San Antonio would do…
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
I'm all ears
Just remember, whoever you bring in has to make sense, and would have to be content playing a limited role on a contending team
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
I'd put Travis Diener in that deal as well
Nate could always use a 3rd PG, if Rex is dealt
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
or don't deal rex
and the problem is solved
roster as is works just fine for me
I like it.
It’d be slightly better if we could avoid giving up Bayless (aka using draft picks/cash) but worth it either way.
You can measure skill and talent with your eyes, but productivity is shown through statistics.
Craig smith
averages over 10 points a game thought only playing 19 minutes a game. has the same scoring average as haslem except haslem played a whole quarter of a game more than him. He s a back up who can score and is a banger at 6-7 250 and 25 years old he has experience but is still young so injuries not a problem. and at 2.5 mil we can trade straight up for him at 1/3 the price of haslem.
so there s my diamond in the rough. theres my idea i promised i d post, and im liking a lot of the ideas im hearing. though lets be honest kirk hinrich isnt gonna happen guys. sorry
Quinton Richardson has been traded 3 times since the draft
I think it depends on the contract.
Craig Smith can be traded by himself, but not with another player from his team.
Unless the Clippers are under the cap (I didn’t check, but I don’t think so) the 80% plus 100K rule applies to the amount of salary the Clippers can receive in trade.
by chemistrymajor on Jul 25, 2009 7:53 PM PDT up reply actions
Trade Travis Outlaw To Memphis for a 1st round Pick
Use the left over cap space (3.5 – 4.5 Mil after we sign Pendegraph an Dante) to sign a backup PF (Glen Davis, Joe Smith, Hakim Warick, Ike Diogu, Leon Powe, Etc…)
Draft Cole Aldrich 2010
Best idea yet.
I heard we had this deal in place (Outlaw for a #1 pick) in place if we signed Millsap. I still like the idea regardless, especially now that Hakim Warrick is available.
"The Edge... there is no honest way to explain it because the only people who really know where it is are the ones who have gone over."
by GonzoFan on Jul 26, 2009 11:01 AM PDT via mobile up reply actions
not a bad idea.
trading for picks could work. i like that idea depending on the pick, though we will probably be looking to shop around bayless and maybe blake as well. so a package deal may work better
If you traded Outlaw for a pick
You could also use that capspace for a lopsided trade using Bayless (then sign Pooh for the League Minimum for a 3rd string PG)
Draft Cole Aldrich 2010
Why give up two young players for a back-up PF?
How about Outlaw to Memphis for a future #1, creating capspace, then just sign a free agent PF with the capspace, or send a future #1 (not necessarily the same one) and capspace for a PF. Outlaw’s salary, give or take a million, ought to be plenty of money for a back-up PF. We don’t need to give up 2 young players for someone who’s going to average 10 minutes a game. Pooh is OK, but you don’t give up on a lottery pick after one year of not playing.
by chemistrymajor on Jul 25, 2009 8:08 PM PDT up reply actions
Its just another option of what to do with the Cap Space see my original post 4 up
Draft Cole Aldrich 2010
trade for carl landry
outlaw + cash for landry. i’m not sure the rockets would do this, but they have 5 PF’s so they might be willing to let one go. outlaw leaving frees up minutes for everyone, too.
I don't think houston would ever trade for Outlaw. They like players who are fundamentally sound, rebound, and defend.
Outlaw, while having a very valuable set of skills, doesn’t have what houston tends to like in their bigs.
by dario argento on Jul 25, 2009 8:27 PM PDT up reply actions
Get another sixer
Outlaw to Memphis for first rounder (top 10 protected)
Wait until capholds from overseas players lapse
Leaves us 6.9 million in capspace (assuming miller@ 7million per)
Trade Blake, Rudy plus rights to Claver to Philly for Iguodala
For Portland – Gain an all-star caliber player without sacrificing any of the big three. Elite wing defense plus another option in the fourth quarter (important if we are losing travis). Makes the Blazers a contender now.
For Philly – Cuts costs. They have poor attendence and profits number from what I have read and Iguodala is on a long term deal on big dollars. They have Young and Speights as young, somewhat proven guys to fill the void at the forward positions. Blake fills their need for a veteran pg to tide them over unti either Williams or Holiday is ready but with no long term financial commitment. Rudy would be a starter at sg for them with the potential to be an all-star player and is ridiculosly cheap for the next couple of years. Claver is a talented throw in to make the deal more palatable for the Philly fans and could be insurance incase Young or Speights don’t pan out.
If rumours about Philly’s financial situation are correct then I think this deal is fair for both sides.
This would be a Pritchslap for the ages.
I think Philly would have to be fools to do it; he’s their superstar/franchise player. I think you’re overvaluing Rudy somewhat, especially compared to Iguodala.
You can measure skill and talent with your eyes, but productivity is shown through statistics.
madblaze
thats the ballsiest trade i ve heard yet and i like the thinking, the only problem is that igoudala is a SG and we got Roy. even if he played the 3 im not sure how that d fit having roy igoudala and miller starting. it sounds good, but thats alot of scoring to go around once you mix in aldridge. i think someone would be left without much scoring to do. though i admit it d be interesting to see how that d work.
Iggy is a SF
They used Thad at PF even though he’s a SF. With Brand coming back, there is a ton of players with no time to give them. Kind of sounds like Portland. The only problem is Iggy and Miller are poor 3 pt shooters, but I’d be OK with it. Webster better be healthy at back-up SG though.
by parkinglotj on Jul 25, 2009 11:00 PM PDT up reply actions
We'll see how Webster does when he returns
If Nate needs inside strength, he can play twin towers.
If he wants speed, he can play Outlaw at the PF (which is where he’s most effective).
In other words, no more trades before the season starts.
If Nate needs inside strength, he can play twin towers
That all depends on Greg. If Oden can move his feet and stay out of foul trouble, and if he can knock down a little10-15’ baseline jumper (like Casey reported, last night?) then some of those backup PF minutes could be filled by Joel (I like the idea of Greg/Przy eventually getting > 48 mpg)
but that would mean even less PT for Travis, so I still think he’s the odd man out
and I want to see KP add another veteran 4/5 as insurance against injury, and for playoff depth and experience. But this deal could come at the trading deadline, if the right fit isn’t available before training camp
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
I like the sentiment of Joel becoming the back up 4/5 player
but I would be more comfortable with another strong power forward backing Aldridge up as well. Houston outmuscled us at that position in the playoffs. Aldridge is great, but he needs someone who can come in and pound on the opposing teams PF some behind him. The times when Nate had to take Aldridge out the Blazers had nothing in that position that proved useful in that setting. Aldridge looked beat down on a couple of occassions in that series.
Goodbye Deke. The NBA will miss Mt. Mutombo
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Do We Have to Trade
Why don’t we pickup Ime Udoka. The last I knew he was available; he knows the system, plays good defense and can shoot the 3. He probably wouldn’t cost much to sign.
I'd rather add Bruce Bowen
and it might happen, depending on what the Bucks do this week
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
There does have to be trading involved
even if its trading for a draft choice and cash, there has to be trading involved in the challenge.
Consolidation
Kick them a 1st round pick and $3mil, we add a 3rd string point and we’re good to go…
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=l9x7kc
Bayless + Trout for Nick Collison + 2010 draft pick
Joel is the best backup center in the league, but if we are going after a backup PF in a trade, I would like to get one who could also take over Joel’s minutes at center in case he opts out or we trade him later this season. Nick Collison seems to be an under-rated young big capable of a double double off the bench at PF/C… and OKC’s 2010 draft pick should be in the low teens.
OKC would be getting some good young guys in Trout & Bayless while also shedding salary this year and next…. which might make them financially comfortable to go after David Lee who would look sweet in their lineup.
I'd rather have Jeff Foster
While I like the idea of Collison, I think he’d have a tough time accepting a limited role. (Young veterans usualy do) Foster has more experience and might be more willing to play short minutes until the post season, and be available for an expended role in case of injury
and I don’t expect Przy to “opt out” or be traded, under any circumstances. That concept is totally contrary to Joel and KP’s past behavior
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
GET YOUR IDEAS IN
I WILL BE CHOOSING THE TOP IDEAS AT THE END OF THE DAY AND POSTING THEM ALONG WITH THE POLL FOR THE BEST IDEA. SO GET YOURS IN IF YOU D LIKE TO BE CONSIDERED. GOOD LUCK AND GOOD TRADING!
by blazingsince88 on Jul 26, 2009 12:53 PM PDT reply actions
Revised Trade Idea
I posted above the idea of Outlaw for Landry. I have a new spin on the trade, though, that involves a 3rd team and seems to make more sense.
1. Outlaw to Memphis – They’ve said they want Outlaw
2. Marc Gasol to Houston – Houston needs a center with Yao and Mutumbo out, plus Memphis now has Thabeet to play center for them.
3. Carl Landry to Portland – He would fit in great behind LA and Houston has 5 PF’s.
All 3 players have pretty equal salaries, so that’s not much of an issue.
Us Rockets fans
love landry … like gasol too but id rather have landry
by EveryHoustonTeamRox! on Jul 26, 2009 5:42 PM PDT up reply actions
maybe houston would throw another player in then
kyle lowry? memphis is looking for another pg, so that might make it more worth their while. at this point, though, do you think houston would do it?
Yet another Memphis - Portland deal
Does anybody know for sure what our new cap number is and whether or not we still have our Diogu trade exception? For purposes of this trade I assumed we still have $1m in cap space and can use the Diogu exception, but only by itself.
This is a two part deal:
Part 1 – Outlaw, Bayless, rights to Koponen, and $3m cash for
Rudy Gay
Part 2 – Diogu exception and $3m cash for
Marko Jaric
If the $1m cap space assumption is correct, this works (barely) within cap restrictions.
Why Portland does it: Consolidates the roster some and adds a clear cut 5-10yr starter at the 3 who fits precisely with the Brandon / LaMarcus / Greg etc timeline with Gay being 23 in August. It does create some logjams at 2/3 so could be a setup for another trade or…?
Why Memphis does it: It’s mostly financial but they still get some nice young talent with an ending contract if they want to save more money the year Outlaw expires. Storyteller has a nice post that puts the Memphis ‘09-’10 operating loss around $11m; this deal wipes that out and they save Jaric’s money the following and don’t pay big money to extend Gay. A 3 guard rotation of Conley, Bayless, and Mayo could be nice if Mayo is serious about playing point guard as he implies in the Team USA interviews.
"I'm a buffet of goodness."
I like this trade
and I actually came up with this same idea today, but didn’t figure out everything financially like you have. I think Rudy Gay is a fun player and if anyone was willing to do a trade like this, Memphis would. They love Outlaw and they are looking for another PG that can play back up to Conley.
However, with this trade, we wouldn’t have any cap space left over to sign another PF, which I think is still a pretty big priority. Also, don’t quote me on this, but I’m pretty sure we don’t have any trade exceptions left. I think we used them to sign Miller. Finally, I’m not sure if he’s the right fit. With the signing of Miller, we already have some extra scoring and I don’t know if there’d be enough to go around. If Martell comes back healthy, I think we’ll be pretty set with him and Batum at the 3. Rudy and Roy can play a little 3 if needed, too.
So, again, I like this idea, but I’m not sure we need it. I think it mostly depends on how healthy Martell is.
Do nothing.
Here is an idea.
We have a twelve man roster right now of
Pryzbilla/Oden, center minutes
Aldridge, Outlaw, Pendergraph. pf minutes
Batum, Webster, and Outlaw sf minutes with maybe some contribution from Cunningham
Rudy & Roy,
Miller & Blake pg with Bayless riding pine or perhaps beating out Blake for minutes. Miller will ultimately benefit Bayless.
A second unit hybrid of Oden, Outlaw, Miller, Rudy, and Batum could wreak all sorts of havoc by trapping and switching. Sub Roy for Rudy or Pryz for Oden or Lamarcus for any of the bigs according to situations without losing anything. Nate will have to come out of his shell and be creative. He could pull names from a hat and this team would do fine.
He has got the arsenal right now and for three or four years to come with the players on this years roster and Claver waiting in Spain.
A package to get a superstar crowds the already crowded superstar field. Roy, Lamarcus and ready or not Gred Oden are the pillars on which we hang out hat. A full tool belt is a good thing. A ring is a ring, no matter how many minutes a guy plays. Trades are always out there. Lets see how a making the playoffs and getting some seasoning translates into improving.
Nic Batum is playing the most important basketball of his career right now and if he makes the leap we are all betting he will, we will have a dominant team next year. If he can become the same kind of ball handler that Scottie Pippen or drive to the hole like a young Finley or Jefferson, than we have something special. Miller is limited, but on the floor with Outlaw, Rudy, Roy, Webster and Batum means there won’t ever be a dearth of three point shooting. Blake makes more sense in the Steve Kerr role and may end up a 14 minute starter but his minutes will be important and Roy and Lamarcus will benefit. Getting BRoy off early makes more sense if Oden and Lamarcus become consistent low post threats. Late, when fouls are important, having two post threats will make a difference.
We have a group that likes each other and wants to be here. Lets see how it all shakes out. I think this small signing was ideal. We are sitting pretty.
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