Andre Miller: Preliminary Thoughts
by Dave on Jul 25, 2009 1:12 AM PDT
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PrintSo...Andre Miller, eh? The Blazers needed an upgrade at point guard. We've been speculating about the direction since the season ended. As it turned out they went with offense instead of defense. At this point I don't have any problem with that.
As I said in a post earlier this summer Miller has a lot to recommend him. He's been a great passing point guard since he came out of college. He has more offense than either of his new position-mates. He gets inside and draws fouls, dimensions that have been missing from the point guard position. He shoots free throws incredibly well. He's experienced. He's won in this league. He's durable.
One of the main things to like about this signing is the contract. Two years with a third-year option is perfect for a guy like Miller. The Blazers haven't over-committed. They won't be paying him for longer than he's useful.
Miller also has a couple drawbacks. He's not a three-point shooter. He's not the kind of defender who will improve our backcourt or take pressure off of the centers defensively. Also, though the contract is short, it did take up most of Portland's cap space. It's hard to shake the impression that this was the big free agent move that wasn't a big free agent move. Almost any of the players discussed so far this summer would have made a bigger splash than Miller.
The best-case scenario for the Blazers is that Miller provides that veteran experience, some scoring punch, and takes the pressure off of Brandon Roy to make every play. It could well be he's one of those "the whole is more than the sum of its parts" guys. I could easily see the Blazers locking into place, feeling incredibly comfortable on the court, and raising their scoring average more than Miller's point total would account for.
The worst-case scenario is that Miller can't hit Steve Blake's outside shots causing the defense to collapse and clog the lane against Roy, turning Brandon into a distance shooter instead of a driver. The defense looks crappy, the centers foul out, nobody knows whether Roy or Miller should be directing the show, and the point guard position gets more crowded but not better.
Some intriguing points are still up in the air.
Ben and I were talking about Miller earlier today and he pointed out an interesting fact. Miller has never played with a 20-point scorer except for Carmelo Anthony (who is to 20-point guys what Britney Spears is to music stars). I pointed out that he's never played on a team that's been considered particularly bright either. Shawn Kemp's Cleveland squad, assorted youngsters in Clipperland...even this Philadelphia team is not exactly your classic basketball lineup. One wonders how he'll fare when he doesn't have to be the brains of the group and when he isn't counted upon to be the second option offensively. Hopefully this will be the kind of team he's always dreamed of playing with.
Ben already asked the question about what this move means to personnel. If nothing changes right now Blake is the second point guard and Jerryd Bayless is looking for scraps. But Miller isn't much more than a two-year solution and you don't want to be starting the point guard hunt from scratch in two years when you should be angling for a championship. At face value, that would prioritize Bayless' development. The tension is interesting.
My guess is that there's another move in store, though probably not during the summer. On 95.5 The Game a couple weeks ago I said it felt like the Blazers would pull the trigger on a Hinrich/Miller/Sessions-type deal if one was available but that any bigger splash would wait until the season or perhaps a couple months later. That's still my belief. Portland yet has too many small forwards of similar age and production potential. They now have a clearer pecking order at point guard but that same order makes either an expiring contract utility guy or a young prospect available for trade alongside their other assets.
I do think the Miller acquisition means that Joel Przybilla becomes even more important to the Blazers in the short term. You didn't take any of the defensive pressure off of the big men. You need two centers now.
In short, I'd say this was the definition of a "tweener" move. It was a good acquisition but not great. It has the potential to impact the team but not in an obvious or flashy way and probably not for more than a couple years. The team spent money but the contract was short. This was their guy but only after chasing a couple others. Some questions are answered, others arrive. This was a nice step but not the final step.
Overall I'm happy to have Miller here. I'm excited to see if the offense and continuity improve. I'm happy that Coach McMillan has another coach on the floor. I have no worries that the point guard position will be executed better this season than we've seen in recent years. I'm just not overwhelmed by this move nor do I feel like it's exactly what the Blazers had in mind when they entered the summer with cap space.
We'll see what happens.
--Dave (blazersub@yahoo.com)
P.S. Just thought of the perfect way to put it. This move has the potential to be great for the Blazers. It also has the potential to be so-so. But see, with the main move of the summer I was hoping for more than potential. I like Miller. I like his addition. But I'm not convinced that he is the definitive missing piece to put this team over the top. That's still a maybe.
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I'm sorry Dave
You’re pop culture references and analogies are usually so cogent, but this time you stumped me.
What do you mean by: “Carmelo Anthony (who is to 20-point guys what Britney Spears is to music stars)”.
"It all depends on where his growth will come and we think his growth will come within us" -- Kevin Pritchard on Jerryd Bayless
Looks good but little substance?
When I rule the world, everyone will know how to use Excel.
Lacks range
but makes up for it by keeping the attention on the rack?
by MadN on Jul 25, 2009 1:23 AM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
A big star but not a quality one?
Keep in mind that everything I know about basketball I learned on Blazers Edge.
And it might be an outdated one. Melo looked incredibly strong in the last playoffs. I would venture to say he is the second-strongest wing player in the NBA in terms of brute force after LeBron. Like LeBron he has the strength of a PF, but the speed and handles and outside shooting of a SF. The last season could be considered his breakout performance, for Britney it was the comeback year.
Oh, yeah. Melo sold me on Melo this last season... He's a legit superstar.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Melo played the best ball of his career in those playoffs
He was outstanding. Now, can he do it for a full season?
He also played pretty darn good in Beijing
The international game is definitely different, but he’s was a cold-blooded killer for Team USA.
What he meant was this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FPc1OsYMs8g
"Intent is prior to content, the question is, does this generation really want truth?"
"Cogito ergo sum" -Descartes
He already did last year
From the moment Carmelo cut the cornrows, he showed a rededicated game last year. He was as big a reason for Denver’s improvement as Chauncey, and he was doing it before that Iverson trade.
Anyone who looked at the numbers and saw a slight decline in his scoring average would get that wrong — and that’s the point.
oops sorry
don’t ban me please.
I think its a really strong piece overall, I just don’t understand the reference.
I think what he means is
He’s going to garner alot of fans (like Brittany) but in the end he’s really not all that good (like Brittany), he still looks good doing it though.
We didn't lose the games, we just ran out of time -- Bobby Layne
Generally, my sentiments agree
I love the contract, though.
He makes us better this year, almost certainly. Next year, he will probably still be an effective player, but is also effectively an expiring contract, so a valuable trade asset, if Jerryd progresses. If we keep him next year, too, he is an expiring contract the following year, as well. So KP has given himself quite a bit of trade flexibility with this move as well as improving the team this year.
I’m not thrilled with the move, I had hoped for more in an unbalanced trade, but it seems like a generally positive move. No one can say we got nothing of value for that cap space.
When I rule the world, everyone will know how to use Excel.
We still have some wiggle room for a trade
I believe. I’m guessing it became apparent that cap relief alone was not going to tip the scales for us in getting one of the players we truly coveted. So we used it and will try by other means.
—Dave
That's my thinking, as well
It doesn’t sound like KP went over the cap, just almost up against the ceiling. That keeps multi-player deals (2 for 1) in play and gives him more options if the right player shakes loose.
Backup 4/5 with experience in, Outlaw out. Then let’s play some ball and be the scourge of the NBA!
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
You're not gonna get a backup C nor do you need one if you're the Blazers...
Useful 6’9" rebounding PF man might be available.
I’m surprised Travis is still with us…
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
so you're guaranteeing perfect health for Greg and Joel next year?
Great, where do I sign up? Is there a flu shot for that?
And I don’t even want to hear that “if Greg or Joel can’t go we can just slide LMA over to center and play a small lineup with Outlaw at the 4” KP has the resources to pursue a veteran 4/5 like Jeff Foster, and I’ll take 10-12 mpg from a guy like that over anything that Travis has to offer in the same amount of minutes
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Pen
der
graph
"HA HA HA HA HA
I'm not laughing, I'm just listing the five ugliest Blazers ever."
- rockingharder
is
a rookie…
I have my P.h.D in unreliable hyperbole.
by Eat Politicians on Jul 25, 2009 3:28 PM PDT up reply actions
a rookie who isn't very good
I am sad that the new OLP album is wimpy, and not even in a peppy Fall Out Boy kind of way just a depressing way
He's horrible
That’s why Nate hasn’t played him in a regular season game yet.
by ninjasocks on Jul 25, 2009 9:57 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
André Miller will be great for the Blazers!
There is an article/blog SOMEWHERE…CANNOT FIND IT..that goes into great detail about why André will be a great acquistion for the Blazers. He is very healthy. Has only missed 5 games in his career. Though 33, has only played 815 games or so..compared to Kevin Garnett..who at the same age it beat up. Also his body has taken less of a beating with his style of play. André Miller is able to create plays. He will take pressure off of Brandon Roy to do so. He is also good at rebounding. He passes well. He is not good at 3 point shooting but doesn’t TAKE many 3 point shots. There are plenty of Blazers who can do this. I think André will be able to ally-oop to G.O. or Pryzbilla…I believe he is good at this. So where do you see pressure on the Centers? I think he will utilize them.
So where do you see pressure on the Centers?
I think he meant on the defensive end, MIller doesn’t have the latteral quickness to keep PGs out of the paint, so Joel/Greg will be at risk of foul trouble
team defense is the answer, that’s how Boston and the Spurs do it, overload the stong side and rotate back quickly to cover the 3 point shooters. Andre will help with communication and BBIQ in this area
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
No more durability talk
I don’t want to hear anymore bragging about how Andre Miller never gets injured. Do not tempt the gods!
"It all depends on where his growth will come and we think his growth will come within us" -- Kevin Pritchard on Jerryd Bayless
by Jumbo on Jul 25, 2009 9:13 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Przy plays the alley-oop pretty well
His hands have gotten noticeably better, along with his free throw shooting.
"HA HA HA HA HA
I'm not laughing, I'm just listing the five ugliest Blazers ever."
- rockingharder
My thoughts exactly
He’s been on horrible teams (Cavs, Clippers), Nuggets before they were really good, and Sixers were a decent team but had no great big men. This might be one of those right place at the right time situations. Of course I said the same about Shareef _;
The guy can’t shoot but still averages 16 ppg with a good percentage so at least shows he’s saavy and a hand full inside. I don’t think this diminishes Blake in the least, in fact might be better this way so we can switch between Blake and Miller depending on the situation.
The dude definitley has flaws, but the thing is he’d be out of our price range if he could do all he does AND shoot. I’m happy with this signing. I was meh on Kidd and Hinrich, was a little worried about a logjam with Lee or Millsap and I despise Turkolglu. So Miller is good. Sure he’s not overwhelming but honestly I wasn’t expecting some super awesome move this summer. Patience…
by neutroticblazerfan on Jul 25, 2009 1:30 AM PDT reply actions
I like the deal...
My biggest fear after the Hedo dealing was that KP would overpay or give too many years for Miller. I think he makes the team better and they didn’t hang a huge contract around their necks. Essentially trading Miller for Sergio and adding two possible back up PFs is a good summer in my book. If they trade an asset or two for an enforcer type or sign one to a reasonable contract, they should be in an even better position.
PTB Liberation Day - 2/10/04
Good point
I like your thought about Sergio. Before this trade we go into the new season with less talent than we had last year. Now we have swapped sergio for miller and have far improved the point position.
Life's short, Stunt it!!
by Irwin Fletcher on Jul 25, 2009 9:05 AM PDT up reply actions
Less talent than we had last year?
How do you figure? Sure, we lost Sergio, but everyone else is improving or at least staying the same.
"HA HA HA HA HA
I'm not laughing, I'm just listing the five ugliest Blazers ever."
- rockingharder
We lost Channing
He was extremely gifted in interesting ways.
When I rule the world, everyone will know how to use Excel.
Forgot about Channing
"HA HA HA HA HA
I'm not laughing, I'm just listing the five ugliest Blazers ever."
- rockingharder
"extremely gifted in interesting ways"
I want that on my tombstone.
by LicketyBrindle on Jul 26, 2009 7:33 PM PDT up reply actions
I'd much rather pay Miller $14 million than Hedo $50 million
And that 3rd season on Miller’s contract is great. It allows us to trade cap space without being under the cap.
Also
Miller could be used as a trade chip in the last year. With the option in his last year we could trade him to a team that’s looking to dump salary (7 million off the books). Like the Mavericks did with Stackhouse’s contract to get Marion.
by neutroticblazerfan on Jul 25, 2009 1:32 AM PDT reply actions
Since there is a team option
he could be a trade chip next year, too.
When I rule the world, everyone will know how to use Excel.
I like it dave.
I like the contract, I dig the player, I’ve yet to hear any real negative things about andre, I’ve heard he throws wonderful oops can get to the rim, isn’t dumb, doesn’t turn over the ball, and most importantly, he wants to play for this “team”…. per the post referencing the oregonian, I don’t jive all that much on his inability to play nose grinding D, but I’m also a firm believer that winning improves every aspect of whatever your trying to win at., while losing breeds defeat and half heartedness.
I think that this fresh start on a GREAT team with a need, will prove a easily accomplishable feat for andre. he’s still got the tools to play the D that we want, and he hasn’t ever really had a great team to help him play great D, so …. I dunno .. I don’t wanna make it sound like …. “why try if it’s going to be useless anyway” ….. but…
have you ever had a team that you didn’t want to be on becuase no matter what you did, no matter how hard you tried …. some or none of them would buy into the concept of “team” .
I have and I’m a piss poor example but if they ain’t gonna play…. it’s hard for me to play to my potential.
so … hopefully our winning attitude and WONDERFUL culture and fanbase ignites andre and launches him to a new level….
I want to see this work out so bad … andre, brandon, martell, aldridge, oden …. oh my.
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
"New Man Law: If you don't show up for the draft you don't get to come later if you're picked. If you believe in yourself, show up and sit there. If nobody else believes in you, take it and cry like a man...in front of the cameras."
-Dave
The one negative story I heard about Miller....
Well barely qualify it as negative, but when he was with the Clippers somebody asked him outside the parking lot to do something (some event) for the Clippers and he screamed “I aint doing [blank] for the Clippers!!” I think it was more about him hating the organiztion than aversment to doing team events.
by neutroticblazerfan on Jul 25, 2009 1:40 AM PDT up reply actions
ducks down head….
well.. ?? um.. cough, thinks a bit. lol… it is the clippers :) giggle
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
"New Man Law: If you don't show up for the draft you don't get to come later if you're picked. If you believe in yourself, show up and sit there. If nobody else believes in you, take it and cry like a man...in front of the cameras."
-Dave
this isn't exactly true.
yes it is the clippers. BUT that year the clippers had a solid core going and the miller trade was supposed to put them over the top. no joke. i was there. everyone was ready to go. andre miller tanked that whole year. even before it begain and killed the season. i could go find the latimes links but id rather not. those were sad memories, cuase that team had alot of young potential. much like portland.
One last thing
The worry would be that Miller is useless if Roy has the ball which is true I guess. But I always felt that Roy was one of those guys that didn’t need the ball all the time to be effective. He can mix it up, now instead of dribbling and driving every time he can play off the ball, come off some screens, do some cuts like Hamilton.
by neutroticblazerfan on Jul 25, 2009 1:43 AM PDT reply actions
Even if Miller plays with a running second team, it's not the end of the world, eh?
PG Miller, Thrower of Lobs™®
SG Rudy
SF Nic
PF Pendy
C Pick him
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
I know you don't like Travis
but he’s far more dangerous in that second unit than Pendergraph. Imagine Travis running the floor to throw down lobs from Miller or spotting up in the corner to nail that wing three.
The Michael Ruffin of BlazersEdge, cuz Amlmart said so.
by BlazersOrBust on Jul 25, 2009 9:40 AM PDT up reply actions
Yep
Depends on the opponent, of course.
But if we never have to give Travis the ball except at the end of alley-oops from Miller, or to shoot the open 3 from the corner, a lot of the things that frustrate people won’t matter so much.
If only he would box out on the boards, too….
When I rule the world, everyone will know how to use Excel.
I've got Travis thoroughly ensconced at #3 on the SF depth chart until he gets traded next month...
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
I know that's where YOU have Travis
But Nate has him at #2 on the PF chart for now.
When I rule the world, everyone will know how to use Excel.
Therein lies the greatest single problem with the current Blazer team. #1 with a bullet.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
When your greatest problem
is 12 mpg of backup PF, you’re actually in pretty good shape, I would say.
When I rule the world, everyone will know how to use Excel.
until the playoffs
or something “bad” happens to LMA, Joel or Greg
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
There are at least 25 other teams
who have bigger problems.
When I rule the world, everyone will know how to use Excel.
(I'm already on record that I think KP will try to fix this one, too)
When I rule the world, everyone will know how to use Excel.
I think that unit...
should have Web at SF for his shooting and I’m not sure “Pendy” is ready to be a second option at PF but I do think there is a possibility Miller will paly with the 2nd unit.
Not entirely
he is a good post player get him posting up a smaller PG and Roy waiting for the dish for the shot or drive
Bee, on tha loook. out fore !!!! tha grammar po-lease.
HELLO! DO YOU REMEMBER THE GAMES AGAINST THE 76ERS?
I am very happy André will be on our team!!! He’s smart, healthy, wants to be here and has skills that he can perhaps impart to our other point guards!!!
Welcome!!!!
I do remember the games against the Sixers -- they owned us!
Jan. 14, Phi 100, Por 79
Andre Miller 5-11, 12 pts, 6 ast, 5 reb, 3 to
March 24, Phi 114, Por 108
Andre Miller 9-20, 27 pts, 3 ast, 10 reb, 6 to
that second game was the game where Philly doubled Roy out top
and I remember coming on here and saying “the Blazers need another guy who can create off the dribble so when Brandon gets trapped that 2nd guy can break down the resulting 4 on 3 and get someone a dunk or an ‘and 1’…that will stop the other team from doubling BRoy”
Mission accomplished, it’s just too bad Miller wasn’t around for the Houston series
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Fortunately.
In those two games he has a 1:1 A:TO ratio. Eww.
I am curious
To see how this move affects roy’s production and how miller can help oden. Also our second team is stacked now.
I hope I can get a bunch of championships, like 15. " - Greg Oden
by mxpx5678 on Jul 25, 2009 1:50 AM PDT via mobile reply actions
My Initial response can be summed up in one "word"
That word happens to be “Meh”. I’m not impressed. I was pretty solidly against TurkeyGlue. I liked the Milsap signing and was disappointed Utah matched. I’m not really for or against Miller, instead I’m just taking a wait and see approach. He does bring an entirely new dynamic to the team with his court vision and toughness. It’ll be nice to see a drive and dish kind of PG opposed to a stand at the top of the arc type like Blake is. I like how he has the longest active streak of games played right now as well. That will be a very nice change up to see that kind of consistency night in and night out. I’m hoping for the best.
If I've said it once, I've said it a million times: I heart Portland!!!
Mentor for Bayless?
Can’t shoot from outside. Gets to the hole. Questionable defense. Maybe the play-making will rub off.
I’m optimistic though. Miller is a good player, especially as a playmaker. The Blazers team-offense IQ should go up several points and it will be an experience that will help the core even after Miller is gone. MIller will take some pressure off of Roy too. This will be especially good if Roy goes down for awhile, something people with a Roy-as-SG-&-PG preference seem to forget.
put a body on 'em
I don't get that either but everyone smokin the bayless so... I'll take the second hand smoke and enjoy it too.
I just don’t understand it thats all.
imo he’s not very good at playing point guard nor very good at interviews, and can if he gets better basketball wise, become a headache media wise.
but I think that Andre is perfect (aside from his atrocious 3pt shooting that I wanna blame on his previous crap-decent teams inability to get him open shots)
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
"New Man Law: If you don't show up for the draft you don't get to come later if you're picked. If you believe in yourself, show up and sit there. If nobody else believes in you, take it and cry like a man...in front of the cameras."
-Dave
All the kids used to do the Bayless, but now it just gives them headaches.
You asked earlier about some Miller 3 point stats… well here they are:
Andre Miller has played in the NBA for 11 years, a total of 815 games. Throughout his career he has attempted a total of 561 three-pointers and made 118 of them for a total of 21%. (Last year with Philadelphia he went 15 out of 53 while playing all 82 games.)
561/815 = an average of .68 Three Point ATTEMPTS per game
118/815 = an average of .008 Three Pointers MADE per game
Just to put that into perspective, Blake made 140 out of 328 last year alone. (an average of 4.75 attempts and 2.0 makes per). For his career, Blake is at 3.15 attempts per game and 2 makes per. (515 made out of 1,313 attempts while playing in 419 career games)
So, in other words… people may look at Miller’s career .20% 3pt percentage and cringe… but the guy only puts up a three pointer once every two games. Don’t let the percentages get in the way of the facts.
btw… not that it’s any of my business, but didn’t you say something about going to bed like an hour and a half ago?
Typo:
118/815 = an average of .008 Three Pointers MADE per game
Should be: 0.14 Three Pointers MADE per game
By way of contrast, Steve Blake is 515 made in 419 games = 1.3 Three Pointers MADE per game.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
yep, my bad
thank you for pointing out my two errors timbo. Would you also care to comment on the subject matter of the post? or did you just feel like showing off your math skills?
the difference between .008 and .14 is not trivial - and wasn't critical
unlike your response.
by blacknoiseNW on Jul 25, 2009 12:34 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
My Math skills at 3AM are obviously iffy
It was my mistake and I take full responsibility for my lack of proofreading. I was not trying to be critical to timbo whatsoever. I was just curious if he had a comment about the subject, which was not about the number of makes per game by Miller, or Blake, or anybody else, but rather the number of attempts. I’ve always respected timbo’s opinion and was curious if he had a take. Most people will simply look at the “20%” number and think that Andre Miller will hurt the Blazers by his lack of outside shooting prowess. I don’t see it that way at all. I believe that the fact that he does not rely on his outside shot to be productive is a blessing, not a curse.
I sort of figured out last year during the Late Sergio Era (shudder) that 3 point percentage is largely irrelevant...
If a drop dead killer 3 pt. shooter hits 50% of his shots (highly optimistic) and a clankaholic whining Spaniard type shoots at a 25% rate (highly pessimistic), that’s the same as one additional turnover for every 4 shots.
Actually, it’s not even that bad, since 3 balls come off the rim hard and often overfly the boxing defensive rebounder.
So in the big picture, that’s negligible stuff, SO LONG AS the number of chucks by a bad shooter is kept to a minimum.
Miller has proven that he has other ways to score, which is what it’s all about.
It remains to be seen whether he meshes better with Brandon and the starters or a running backup team.
I hope, FOR THE LOVE OF GOD that Miller acts as an extra coach and teaches his teammates how to run the break properly. I swear to god, Nic Batum is the only one in red and black that has a clue — and that’s because he obviously learned somewhere else.
I have high expectations for Miller’s impact, even though I don’t know and really don’t care if he’s the starter.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Depends
Good team and help defender for sure, but at this point of his career he’s much more likely to funnel a player into a big verus cutting off dribble penetration by himself … but let’s be clear here, there are precisous few good man-to-man defensive point guards in the league with the hand checking rules what they are.
Mentor for Bayless is a good point, but . . .
Bayless will barely ever get on the floor for two to three years. He’s going to have to be traded OR Blake, a decent, affordable guard with an expiring contract, will go. Blake is going to look really good to some team out there by midseason, and the team will have a pretty good idea, at least from practice, whether the trust in Bayless.
if Bayless can't get on the floor vs. Blake/Miller
then he isn’t the answer. The caveat is the need to get a legit opportunity to prove his ability…
by blacknoiseNW on Jul 25, 2009 12:35 PM PDT up reply actions
OT (sort of)
Derrick Rose sure looked good in those Team USA practice videos playing on the same team as Oden. Can we keep that combination for the regular season?
put a body on 'em
Good passing can sometimes infect an entire, or at least an entire starting 5
and whereas Blake is turnover-averse he’s also unadventurous. Andre Miller is someone who has led the league in assists and can score and draw fouls as well. As Dave mentions, Andre has pretty much always been on Low BBIQ teams. We’ll see what happens after these guys all spend some time together in the gym.
I’m hopeful. I certainly prefer this acquisition to Hedo Turkoglu.
The biggest unanswered question I have at this point is: What’s the status of Martell? It seems foolish to pencil him in for a big role.
ignacio
foolish
but I’ll cling to the faith that he makes a full recovery and paul allens brilliance will be realized.
martell > jordan+k*be
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
"New Man Law: If you don't show up for the draft you don't get to come later if you're picked. If you believe in yourself, show up and sit there. If nobody else believes in you, take it and cry like a man...in front of the cameras."
-Dave
What’s the status of Martell?
“Martell Webster comes back he’s like a free-agent acquisition” (13:00)
http://audio.1080thefan.com/m/audio/25440728/kevin-pritchard-7-23-09.htm
Would KP have made that comment if he’s not expecting Webster to return?
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
my thoughts exactly
martel is just coming of an injury and everyone assumes that he is going to be starting?? however, i disagree with blake being turnover averse. i do think that andre miller will be a great addition to the team but i think that his 3 point shot is going to hurt. blakes 3 point shot keeps the defense honest. with miller, other point guards will be able to lay off him a bit when he doesnt have the ball. i dont think that miller will be able to spread the defense as well as blake did. if someone sagged off him he would hit a 3 and make them pay. miller wont be able to do that. is that going to be problematic for the blazer style of play?
3 pt.shooting is essential when Blake is in the game, because it is the only way Blake scores.....
…..I think we will find that there are a variety of other ways to score the ball with Miller on the court.
Portland is going to be a lot less dependent on jump shooting with Miller in the line-up. There are easier and more reliable ways to score than shooting long distance jumpers.
We are also likely to see fewer Roy isolation plays, and Roy is going to find new and easier ways to score than hurling his body to the hardwood ten times a game.
by upper left corner on Jul 25, 2009 4:56 AM PDT up reply actions
even if he is 100%
I think it would be foolish to start Martell, and I am definitely in the “i like Martell” camp. Have him come off the bench behind Batum, at least to begin with and if he is clearly the superior SF (which I think he will be in a few months), then kick him to starter…
I have my P.h.D in unreliable hyperbole.
by Eat Politicians on Jul 25, 2009 3:35 PM PDT up reply actions
Why?
If he is healthy, and is clearly superior in training camp, why have him come off the bench?
Especially if Miller starts at PG, we could use Martell’s 3 point shooting in the starting lineup.
When I rule the world, everyone will know how to use Excel.
3pt shooting being ocer-emphasized?
Is his weakness in shooting threes really that big of a deal? I mean Blake took 4.8 3pt attempts per game, compared to around 80 shots a game for Portland… That’s roughly 6% of the team’s total attempts being threes by Blake… However Blake only went to the line 1.1 times per game, compared to 5.1 FT attempts per game by Miller, and being similar FT% shooters, then the missing points from behind the arc will be made up for by the aspect of the game that Blake lacks: driving to the basket…
Is it really that bad to have LaMarcus spread the floor at times (he has shown decent range when shooting the 3 from the corner, and I bet you it’s an aspect of his game that’s he’s further working on this summer)… We can also have Batum, Outlaw, Rudy or Webster spread the floor as all three of them are pretty good 3 pt shooters…
Basically, instead of having Oden and Aldridge on either side of the post, and Blake and Batum on the wings while Roy has the ball, we can have Aldridge and Batum/Rudy/Outlaw/Webster on the outside while Oden clogs the middle and Andre moving past screens to get free for a midrange jumper or drive to the basket…
McMillan will have to change his style of play slightly, and if he doesn’t, this signing might not live up to its potential, but if he can integrate Miller into the team, then I have no doubt that we can compete with the Lakers, Nuggets and Spurs of the West…
by The OT on Jul 25, 2009 2:40 AM PDT reply actions 2 recs
I don't think
The Blazers have ever played McMillan “style” ball. Maybe now…for better or worse.
There is no curse!
Rec'd. Three point shot is at best, a mixed blessing. When they don't fall.....
…..they are a trap.
Think about the Blazers losses on the road last season. Team comes out hoists a few threes, then goes cold. They get behind and the jump shooters get tense and start pressing. Suddenly, they have gone fifteen points down and can’t hit the broad side of a barn. Roy takes over and starts running isos while the team stands around and waits for him to bring them back. Too often on the road against good teams, it was too little too late.
I look forward to the team having a PG who can penetrate and get to the line and help our bigs score inside. I’m not saying that 3s aren’t important, or that we shouldn’t still use the as a significant part of our arsenal, but having easier options through transition baskets, lobs, penetration, and pick and rolls makes me very happy.
by upper left corner on Jul 25, 2009 5:06 AM PDT up reply actions
I prefer wide-open dunks
And if Greg has it in dunking range, that pretty much counts as wide open.
When I rule the world, everyone will know how to use Excel.
by jscot on Jul 25, 2009 12:21 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Wide open corner threes by small forwards and shooting guards GOOD... Contested threes from the top of the key by power forwards and centers BAD...
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Dunks by Greg Oden
With the opposing center hanging on his arm and getting his third foul in the first quarter BEST.
When I rule the world, everyone will know how to use Excel.
by jscot on Jul 26, 2009 1:07 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
with a screen name like that
you should comment in the junk drawer
"It’s a good ol’ fashioned Rip City beat down!"
by Magnum on Jul 25, 2009 2:46 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Why??
OT are the initials of my first and last name!
OT also stands for off topic
and the junk drawer is where your fellow BEdgers go to talk about everything but Blazer basketball. It’s just too perfect
"It’s a good ol’ fashioned Rip City beat down!"
Thanks for the clarification
I’m new to this site… I’m not really interested in non-blazer talk… So I’ll stick to posting here :)
I like what you've said so far, keep it up!
but maybe, just maybe, you’ll have to peek in on the Junk Drawer. It’s surprisingly addictive and you can get to know the community a bit. Plus, it’s a good way to pass the time during the off season when there’s a lack of Blazer news.
"It’s a good ol’ fashioned Rip City beat down!"
Trying...
to find the positives. From the little I’ve seen, and mostly what I’ve heard I think he can push our frontcourt scoring averages upward. I think he makes us an improved team. Most of my concern comes from the way we spent our money. People are worried about Miller’s 3 point %, but I’m hoping he will help points come within the first 10-15 seconds instead of waiting for our outside shooters to hit with 3 seconds left on the shot clock.
There is no curse!
There's definitely the possibility that with our strong defensive rebounding
the team will run more with Miller leading the break, Roy on one wing and Batum/Rudy on the other, Lamarcus in there as well. It might be quite an exciting attack.
ignacio
Another interesting point...
In the 2006-2007 season, Blake and Miller basically carried out the Denver Nuggets PG duties as starters (there was the mid-season trade that sent Miller to Philly and another that sent Blake from Milwaukee to Denver, so Blake took over from Miller)… To get to the point, during that season, the below are each player’s numbers with the Nuggets:
Miller (23 games, 36 mins): 13.0/4.5/9.1 + 1.6 steals and 0.2 blocks
Blake (49 games, 34 mins): 8.3/2.5/6.6 + 1.0 steals and 0.1 blocks
Miller also shot 48.7% 2pt and 25% 3pt while Blake shot 48.3% 2pt and 34% 3pt
It is very clear that under similar circumstances, Miller outperformed Blake quite clearly…
by The OT on Jul 25, 2009 2:55 AM PDT reply actions 10 recs
EXCELLENT POST!!!
Hear ye, Hear ye!!!!
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Thank you!!
I’m not smart enough to find these stats on my own but I have been getting a lot of crap for saying Miller is far better than Blake this is a great comparison. I think it completely answers the question.
Life's short, Stunt it!!
by Irwin Fletcher on Jul 25, 2009 9:35 AM PDT up reply actions
........assuming that Blake hasn't gotten better and Miller worse, which is theoretically possible...
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Wow
I did not realize that little nugget of information…rec
Reno, Nevada is west of Los Angeles.
by RenoBlazerFan on Jul 25, 2009 10:47 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
you said nugget
and it was about denver
I have my P.h.D in unreliable hyperbole.
by Eat Politicians on Jul 25, 2009 3:37 PM PDT up reply actions
Is it possible...
…that Denver receiving Iverson in the trade for Miller skews your numbers a bit?.. Numbers can be manipulated and presented many ways but they are not the whole story.
This is a very nice post though…Welcome to BEdge… Glad to have you.
by Ilikeemall on Jul 25, 2009 11:28 AM PDT up reply actions 2 recs
Yeah
It isn’t quite like for like, is it?
Iverson meant that there were fewer shots to go around, so the fact that Blake didn’t score as much doesn’t mean that much. Blake made the same percentage of 2 pointers and a higher percentage of 3 pointers than Andre. And since AI had the ball a lot, Blake’s assist numbers would have been held down some, too.
Another difference: Blake came in with chemistry disrupted after a mid-season trade. Miller didn’t have to labor under that handicap.
Nevertheless, as you said, a nice post. But a nice pickup on the Iverson factor on your part as well.
When I rule the world, everyone will know how to use Excel.
Fair point you mention regarding Iverson...
Thanks for the warm welcome!
This goes begging on one point (no pun intended)...
Miller had already been playing with these guys previous to the year noted. Blake came into a new situation and had to hit the ground running. I don’t think it’s entirely fair to compare the two…
Are you a Mexi-CAN or a Mexi-CAN'T?
...... also true.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
The starter is not always the best player
Look at the SF position last year…was Batum better statistically than Outlaw? No. But Nic started because he was a better “fit” with the other starters than Travis (and because Trout froze up when he was given the opportunity to start at SF, early in the season)
While he was coach In Seattle, Nate chose to start Luke Ridnour but finished the game with Antonio Daniels at PG. Could we see something similar with Blake starting and Miller running with the 2nd unit in Portland? The stats say “no!” but Nate will set up the rotations to give the team the best chance of winning every quarter, and that might not mean playing the 5 guys who have the best stats to start out each half
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Two things.
Outlaw’s stats that are better than Nic’s are basically scoring. And most of that can be traced back to shot attempts (Nic’s adjusted FG% aka points per possession is marginally higher). Also we all know that Nic is about a hundred times the defender that Travis is.
While I personally like Batum better (because he was only a rookie holy cow!), I think last season it was an offense/defense tradeoff more than a better/worse tradeoff. And that fits with what you’re saying, but I just wanted to point out that Outlaw’s stats besides FGA and PPG really aren’t any better.
Keep in mind
That was a while ago. Since then Blake has gotten better and Miller has gotten worse.
Keep in mind that everything I know about basketball I learned on Blazers Edge.
How exactly has Andre gotten worse?
He just posted 2 of his best statistical seasons with Philly, and his playoff series against Orlando was definitely his best postseason production…
The numbers back this up. Miller had a terrific year last year.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Ok I accept.
But even if he hasn’t gotten worse, he likely will soon. And I do believe his defense is already less than it used to be.
Keep in mind that everything I know about basketball I learned on Blazers Edge.
I can see great things happening...
No, I’m not a psychic. BUT…I am part Gypsy. Romani if we want to get technical. Anyways, Andre freakin’ Miller is our guy. He is our new leader. He’s going to help coach our guys! I’m excited. I don’t care what anybody says, this is good news. Great news, yeah I said it. “Great” news. Dre is gonna be throwing some nice lobs, finding the open man, runnin’ the break, and teaching B-rex how to lead our squad.
No, this wasn’t the best possible scenario. Cry me a freakin’ river people. Andre has solid numbers, he’s veteran status, and most importantly he wants to be here and help our team folks. Can you dig it? Yes you can. I knew that you could.
"The successful man will profit from his mistakes and try again in a different way." - Dale Carnegie --- Same goes for the Blazers. Thanks Houston.
by blazerbeliever on Jul 25, 2009 3:07 AM PDT reply actions 3 recs
Testify, brother!
Anybody that has been all “boo hoo hoo, we need a veteran, boo hoo hoo, we need a scorer, boo hoo hoo, we need a true Point Guard, boo hoo hoo, we need somebody that can run, boo hoo hoo, we need somebody that can feed the low post effectively…” (which is, conservatively, half of BE over the last year, needs to stop crying that KP couldn’t trade two Blazer Dances and a Best Buy gift card for Chris Paul and to SHUT THE HELL UP.
Your PG wishes have been answered, even if you had Hinrich or Devin Harris on the brain.
Now KP — about that low post rucker you promised me for Christmas…………………….
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
by timbo on Jul 25, 2009 8:15 AM PDT up reply actions 2 recs
You got two of those
Oden this year is going to be twice the low post rucker he was last year, so that’s one extra one. Pendergraph is another.
You are just greedy, as always.
I never thought I would say it, but I think backup PF is our only real weak spot on this team. And I wonder if the Pendergraph/Outlaw tandem will cover that base — Travis for the teams who don’t particularly have a strong backup PF, where his quickness and leaping can do some damage, and Pendergraph for the teams where Travis will just get pushed around.
So, I think I agree with you that I would like an upgrade there, but we may have a workable solution.
When I rule the world, everyone will know how to use Excel.
We have a workable solution on the surface
but there’s just no way that Outlaw is going to be happy with situational backup power forward minutes. If Martell is healthy, I think there has to be another move involving Travis, regardless of KP’s protestations to the contrary. You can’t have one of your most influential and longest-tenured players in the locker room becoming a malcontent, and there’s a decent chance that would happen if Outlaw starts playing 12 minutes a night.
The Michael Ruffin of BlazersEdge, cuz Amlmart said so.
by BlazersOrBust on Jul 25, 2009 12:43 PM PDT up reply actions
And if Martell isn't healthy?
We can slide Brandon to the 3 and play Rudy more, but I don’t think we want to go into the season with Nic, a suspect Martell, and Cunningham at the 3. So you don’t move Travis until you see it working out with Martell.
And then, who knows? Travis is in a contract year, so he may just say little knowing he is going to walk away. But it would make sense to trade him if we aren’t going to play him.
When I rule the world, everyone will know how to use Excel.
If Marty is healthy, Travis is gone. If Marty isn't healthy, Travis will play a lot of 3.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
there's no need to cry about it
but I agree the “low post rucker” is the last roster piece…but KP could wait until deadline to deal Travis, I suppose. By then everyone will see that Webster is back healthy, there will be a serious logjam at SF and Outlaw will probably be more than ready to find more PT on another team
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Agree.
Travis is still necessary until Martell plays a number of games. And hopefully he’ll raise his stock some more.
Good Summary, Dave
It is easy to go overboard on the positives and the drawbacks. I think that your article provided some sound and sober perspective. We do know less than we probably think we do regarding how Miller will fit it. Although I have extremely high hopes.
’77
veteran presence
is misunderstood and undervalued by a lot of BEdgers. Seems to me. While I don’t always like Nate’s judgement, I trust him on this.
Hedo has it. Miller has it. They’re men. And seasoned NBA journeymen at that.
Young men need a peer that they respect that can instill confidence. It’s the boys and men thing.
I’ve never been in the corporate world, but played in a few touring bands, where, I suspect, the dynamic is somewhat parallel to a sports team. The leadership and the mission and the know how. Ultimately, the dynamic of the pack is just as important as skills and performance on the floor. What do they say about humans being social creatures?
Last season I definitely noticed a leadership deficit on this team. I talked about it during the season. Brandon is designated leader, but he never seemed comfortable in the job. Too young. In the wolfpack sense, it wasn’t settled. You could just feel it with this team.
And that’s why Nate has been calling for a veteran.
As important as all the skills that Dave wrote about in his post is this: those boys need someone to learn from. How to be men.
the "sherpa" to lead them up the mountain
Dave wrote about this concept, following the season. Miller was the best “trail guide” that KP could find with his cap-space, I guess. But I don’t think this acquisition is in the same category as Billups going to Denver, because Chauncy had been to something like 4 conference finals in a row with Detroit. Miller will be “learning on the job” in the playoffs as well, assuming the Blazers advance past round 1. But it is an improvement in the veteran leadership area, and the Blazers were in need of someone older than 30 who could show the kids how to take advantage of what the defense gives them, when options A and B (Roy and Aldridge) have been taken away.
Now another veteran “enforcer” to backup LMA is needed, to provide some of the toughness that was missing against Houston. Don’t be afraid of adding another player on the “wrong” side of 30, KP, every contender needs a couple of grizzled vets, at least
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
No question,
Billups trade was the steal of the year. And I remember KP saying that it turned Denver in to an elite team. I’d like to think that KP made a play at Chauncey. RLEC couldn’t compete with AIEC. But as Hollinger was quoted in today’s media update from Ben, this was the last good opportunity on the table.
Another columnist from Ben’s column wrote of the “leadership burden”. And that really is a good way to describe it. I guess I am thinking more about the psychological aspects of a team. There’s a pack mentality in groups of young men. And this can be exhausting for the alphas/leaders. Subtle passive/aggressive challenges to the pecking order. A guy like Kevin Garnett shows up on a team, and this stuff disappears. I guess that was my point. A team has to have solid morale to be solid. I believe if the Miller trade works well, this will be the biggest benefit.
Great pick up
Brings veteran leadership and game running whilst being a mentor for the future PG Bayless.
I guess this makes Blake expendable.
Whoaaa...
If anything this makes Bayless expendable. Miller/Blake absolutely make us better at the position. Competitive, dare I say, with any team and also gives us a two pronged attack. 1. A true creator PG that can get to the rack…2. A trusted teammate who knows the system and can make defenses pay with the 3.
I think all three PG’s stay on the roster but having Miller/Bayless as our PG rotation does NOT improve the position as much. I’m not ready to say Rex will never be a PG in the league but I have to admit I’ve yet to see anything that leads me to believe he will be.
Dave captured this concept pretty well
this is the best case scenario for a more realistic Bayless development curve. Personally, I think Bayless and Miller are a wash but for one element – Miller has proven passing skills. Both suck at the 3-pointer, both draw/shoot fouls excellently, both rely on shooting close to the basket for offense, neither are considered superior defenders (although Bayless has potential). One is 11 years older than the other, and might be the perfect mentor.
by blacknoiseNW on Jul 25, 2009 12:56 PM PDT up reply actions
Bayless' developmental curve is important but...
Do you think he’s ready NOW to be 1st off the bench at PG?.. Believe me I’m all for building a team that will sustain and continue to grow but right now I am not comfortable with Bayless getting substantial minutes at the 1. I know that Miller is an iron man but he is also 33 years old. Do you really think we would be alright if he went down for 10-15 games if Rex was the guy starting those games? You could make some arguments that we’d be ok but I think there’s a lot more that we wouldn’t.
This year… right now… Blake and Miller should be our PG rotation (or Miller and Blake…whatever) because we are starting to see that window open and they are both capable, proven players with complimentary, if opposite, skill sets. I hope Rex will grow into the player many think he will but I’m not big on risking this season on it.
blake/miller does not make bayless expendable...this isn't an "either or" scenario
by blacknoiseNW on Jul 25, 2009 5:11 PM PDT up reply actions
If you read back to my original reply in this string to Ohpityme...
You will see that I believe all 3 players will be on the roster this year. That post said that Miller and Bayless made BLAKE expendable to which I STRONGLY disagree. That is what led to me asking if you wanted Bayless to be our 1st option off the bench at the PG… Which is a question I’d still be curious to know the answer to…do you?
Miller may very well be an excellent mentor to Rex but at this point he needs time at least to see if he can reach the lofty potential everyone seems to think he has. I would love to say I am wrong someday but right now he isn’t ready and I am not convinced he ever will be.
by Ilikeemall on Jul 25, 2009 5:27 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Blake is only expendable
if Bayless makes significant strides by midseason.
When I rule the world, everyone will know how to use Excel.
with Miller on board, we don't have to be convinced
we can rely on probabilities – The Blazer’s can take a chance. Bayless’ indisputable physical skills, work ethic and the fact that he knows where he needs to get to tell me the probability is not only worth taking the chance on – it would be a total surprise if he didn’t pan out.
by blacknoiseNW on Jul 26, 2009 10:40 AM PDT up reply actions
So we don't need a 2nd PG this season because we have Miller?..
I can’t agree with that…
At this point Bayless’ “indisputable skills” are not enough to gamble that we don’t need Steve Blake. The fact that the guy can put his head down and get to the hoop or get fouled doesn’t tell me that he will probably be an effective 2nd PG.
Just because a guy is fast, strong and works hard doesn’t mean he can be a successful guard in the NBA any more than if a guy can throw the heck out of a football he can be a successful NFL QB… imo.
the way i see our cap room after this, our possibilities, etc, we had the chance to have one superstar aquisition, and that falling through left us with more options, but less of the splash. we’re potentially left, at the end of the summer and through the trade deadline, with having not one superstar addition to our roster, but two above average players added to our roster. i’m fine with that, andre miller is a great point addition, if we follow this up with a trade for a backup power forward, i would consider the summer a success. and only with the hype surrounding our cap space would i consider it a bust. but in reality, all turkoglu aside, andre miller is a fantastic addition.
Baylessedge - A Site by Bayless fans, for Bayless fans
I'd like to know as well.
I think the words “star” and “superstar” get thrown around way too much. Our last chance at a “star” of any kind may have been someone like Gerald Wallace for Batum and RLEC back in February.
I'm happy to have Nic and Paul Allen is happy to have the money.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Oden's 2-year wait makes Miller the top choice now
The moment the ping pong ball gave us Oden, we all knew the Blazers needed a veteran point guard and a small forward to round out the team, and ideally we needed them right then and there. We missed completely on SF, letting Rashard Lewis, Gerald Wallace, and others go — but we really blew it at point guard. But now, two years later we are in precisely the same position. Oden is coming into his third season with expectations (and youth) that are nearly identical to that entering his rookie season. Miller will help make him the great center we all believe is possible.
And that is in addition to the scoring, assists, up-tempo, etc. advantages Miller brings to this team. Far outstripping Blake in virtually every category.
Yes, Blake can hit the three. But threes have become Blake’s specialty on this team, and threes should never be the top priority for your point guard. The reality is that beyond setting up the general offense (which Miller can do even better), Blake exerts his greatest value when he is getting open for, and hitting, shots … and that should never have been his number one job. (And even then Blake is hardpressed to score double digits.)
Miller won’t hit threes, but others will. And Miller will make Oden and Aldridge better in ways only the best point guards in the game would do. As for Brandon, he’s an All-Star and he will elevate his game with Miller alongside in ways he never imagined possible with Jarrett Jack and Steve Blake.
But most importantly, with Miller the biggest piece of the puzzle is now in place to enable Oden to rise quickly to become the center who will bring us the Championship
The biggest plus for this
is that Nate has so many different line-up choices w/o downgrading production. From what I read about Andre – he seems like a poor man’s Magic Johnson type player.
Would a Bayless+Travis+the TE and maybe a little candy get us David Lee?
how about
bayless+travis+a pick (or two) that might get us lee
You don't go into the season with 4.5 PFs and 2 PGs...
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Lee doesn't want to be a backup
Read Quick today
by kobisportsguy on Jul 25, 2009 8:23 AM PDT up reply actions
Yes, that was the big problem. If the Blazers didn't have Center depth, that's one thing — but they do. Which means nothing but backup time to LMA, who is young and strong...
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
if the blazers dont improve on their playoff run this year OR if
this happens
The worst-case scenario is that Miller can’t hit Steve Blake’s outside shots causing the defense to collapse and clog the lane against Roy, turning Brandon into a distance shooter instead of a driver. The defense looks crappy, the centers foul out, nobody knows whether Roy or Miller should be directing the show, and the point guard position gets more crowded but not better.
does nate mcmill get serious questioning, maybe even fired? Like u say hes got all the pieces now and you know how the nba is… the first to take the blame is the coach.
Nate has lots and lots of Coaching Capital chips...
Now if the Blazers miss the playoffs………………….
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
I'm consistently surprised to see everyone value shooting over play-making so much.
Check out point guards’ shooting percentages from three around the league. I’d say Miller is slightly below average in those regards, but his play making abilities are up with the best. I’m stoked he’s here. I’m stoked he wanted to be here so much he asked Mike and Mike for help (that part cracks me up) and then spent a dinner convincing McMillan he was the right fit. I’m stoked he’s a veteran and I look forward to less stupid turnovers in crunch time. I have to disagree—this is a great transaction. McMillan and KP will find ways to spread the floor with long-distance shooting from the 3 spot.
One question: how many times last year when scoring was not coming easily, were you screaming at the TV for them to drive the lane? That shouldn’t be a problem anymore.
Miller
is an excellent playmaker. I love his game and I am excited to have him here in Portland. Blake was dependable, he got the ball down the floor and started the offense. Andre is more than just dependable he is a threat anytime he has the ball.
Life's short, Stunt it!!
by Irwin Fletcher on Jul 25, 2009 9:28 AM PDT up reply actions
Rolling Stones
The Rolling Stones described it best (paraphrasing): When you can’t get what you want (Turkoglu, Hinrich, Milsap, Lee, etc.), you keep trying and you’ll find you get what you need (Miller). That about sums up the situation. Miller is a very good short term solution at PG. The long term solution will have to wait for another day.
by Turnout on Jul 25, 2009 7:30 AM PDT reply actions 1 recs
Miller fills a need — a quality veteran PG with court savvy for THE NEXT TWO OR THREE YEARS until The Rex is ready to emerge from the egg...
Turkoglu would have necessitated a restructuring of the SF position (bye bye both Travis and Marty).
Millsap would have been a terrific fit, but that one wasn’t happening from the get-go because Utah knows what they have in him and their offense is very PF-centric (their Center is a perimeter jumpshooter in the Sacramento style). They could NOT lose him, which makes that whole episode an exercise in whimsy, hoping to roll boxcars and that UT couldn’t come up with the up-front cash and had to make due with Boozer the mercenary.
Feels right, fits good, yaaaay for KP!!!
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
by timbo on Jul 25, 2009 8:22 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
good post. rec'd
Portland's PG of the Future - Meet John Wall
Treat people well because Karma can hit you at any second.
By that time Rex is a free agent and is totally out of here.
I don’t see him being very happy two or three years from now.
We shall see. He'll only be a RFA if they make the QO, so it's ultimately up to the Blazers, not Rex...
He needs to be patient this year.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Reaction from L*kerland
The initial reaction from the usual radio pundits and my L*ker friends was the same. Good move for the Blazers. A guy who gave the L*kers some trouble to a team who gave them some trouble is……well….. nothing but more trouble.
I am looking forward to seeing how this all fits together.
RoadBlazer
i mean do you really think this move puts them over the top of the lakers?
what else do you expect “l*ker friends” to say?
no
Assuming the lakers get Odom back I think they have to be the favorite to repeat. Artest is a Huge aquisition for them.
Life's short, Stunt it!!
by Irwin Fletcher on Jul 25, 2009 9:24 AM PDT up reply actions
I'm rooting hard for Miami
to win the Lamar sweepstakes…losing Odom would weaken L*A
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
I don't see any scenario whereby Miami can clear $10M in room for LO...
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Of course I don't...but
Anything that makes a L*ker fan say anything besides “Your an idiot if you don’t think Kobe is the best player ever” is a good thing.
The fact that L*kerland even NOTICED the acquisition is a small victory.
RoadBlazer
I don't care if they notice us in off season or not
I hope they notice losing scores every time we play them, though.
When I rule the world, everyone will know how to use Excel.
not what i heard
last night on the game, I am paraphrasing; okay move ,but they are not better than the lakers most definetly, or utah or denver
well...
we tied denver last year for the division and now we have improved our starting and back up guards, i do admit utah was injury ridden so they could challenge us if they stay healthy but i do think we will win the division.
The Laker True Believers overrate San Antonio. That's the team they see as the "real" competitor in the West.
Fine with me. Let them sleep.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Spurs are dangerous
if healthy.
I think Pops can figure out how to integrate the new guys, and if they stay healthy, they can beat anyone.
When I rule the world, everyone will know how to use Excel.
I'm curious about
how the Spurs will fare in the coming season too. It should be interesting.
They could be great
in the regular season, or they might win 54-55 and get a 4-5 seed. But I think they will be one of the legitimately dangerous contenders in the playoffs, as long as they stay healthy.
That is where they finished last year despite Manu missing huge chunks of the season and Parker missing a bunch of games at the start as well — 3rd seed. If they stay healthy and find their chemistry early, they’ll win 60.
When I rule the world, everyone will know how to use Excel.
That's a bonus.
I didn’t know that Miller was a thorn in the Laker’s side…
Miller Is What We Could Get - and Got.
Unlike some, I did not have “great expectations” for this summer. All you had to do is look at the “free agents”, vs the “restricted” free agents, to know that we were not going to pick up some superstar, nor someone even close. Miller and Hedo were the only free agents that were likely to be of any value to the Blazers that would be available without a sign and trade, or overpaying. Of the restricted agents, Odom is stuck on LA, Milsap was going to be matched, and Lee was not interested in playing a backup role – as the information out of Vegas demonstrated. Kidd had no interest in playing in Portland, and Nash was never really available. This left Sessions or Felton, but you’d have to overpay to pry Sessions away from Minnesota (which is why given all the talk, he has yet to get an offer), and Felton is not – even in his home town, thought to be worth more than $6 or $7 million a year. Indeed, many fans would be happy to see him go.
We improved the team over-all because we will get 48 minutes of better point guard play this year – than we got last. And being a young team, we’ll impove – because that’s what young teams do.
Unlike some, I also don’t think we’ll see any significant trades this year. Rather, I think we’ve baked the cake we want for the coming year, and that we’ll let our young players develop – which, in turn, will give them more value in a future trade. Once we’ve done that, then we’ll know if we actually need another SF, for example, or if we are fine with what we have.
Unlike some, I don’t believe we are in the hunt for a championship this year. Rather, we’re in the hunt to make the play-offs and go a little deeper. And Miller will help with that.
After this year, we’ll be able to better determine what we need to move on to the main stage.
Let it bake, have a good year, and then assess. That’s what I expect the Blazers are doing.
We took a good player off the table. But it’s not his job to get a championship. It’s his job to bake the cake.
by Eben Calder on Jul 25, 2009 7:49 AM PDT reply actions 3 recs
I was among those
thinking we could contend for a championship this year had the pieces fallen our way. Perhaps getting Turkoglu and Miller/Hinrich would have made that possible. Now it looks like another season of baking, but it could get very interesting toward playoff time if Greg finally breaks out. I think Martel and Nic will complement each other well at SF this season because they have different strengths. No Turkoglu means they’ll get decent minutes to develop their skills and find their groove. Having them on the floor is the only way to see who is best for us long term and to determine whether they should start or play a backup role. Playing Martel and Nic significant minutes will also help raise their trade value and help us acquire the last piece of the Blazer championship puzzle.
I hope we only use Travis at backup PF for 10-15 minutes per game. We really do need a backup PF who can rebound and play better low post defense. I’m excited to see what Cunningham might bring, but he probably won’t see very many minutes unless Travis winds up in a trade or we lose one of our forwards to injury (hope not).
I like our team going into this year. The potential is still there to make us contenders (trade combo or package of Bayless/Outlaw/Martel for a skilled, veteran SF), but it looks like KP is going to sit on Bayless for a while to see whether or not we need to upgrade at PG again in 2 years. If we make the second round of the playoffs with our current roster I think we’ll be sitting pretty for 2010-2011 because we’ll be a more experienced team with better bargaining power to make a difference-making trade.
Goals for this year
In no particular order:
1) Win 58+ games
2) GO becomes a force
3) Martell regains form
4) Home court advantage in the playoffs
5) Get deep into the second round
6) LA becomes All-Star
7) B-Roy continues climb to superstar status and stays injury free
8) Nate finds more minutes for Rudy – who stays happy and signs extention
9) Priz duplicates this past year, but plays less as Greg starts to dominate
10) Team chemistry stays the same
by Iluvdisteam on Jul 25, 2009 8:41 AM PDT reply actions 6 recs
Nate finds more minutes for Rudy – who stays happy and signs extention
Rudy is already signed through 2012-13, at an extremely affordable amount. Do you really expect Portland to rip up that deal and give him a better one?
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
I recced this, but you didn'
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
.....didn't say the words:
11. WIN A WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP.
That is the ultimate goal from now until Brandon retires.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
by timbo on Jul 25, 2009 6:53 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Was this the season?
I know fans are impatient. We’d like every season to be the potential championship season. But to be honest I was never looking at this season as being the season we went after the trophy. If this team is based around Brandon, LMA and Oden then I fully expect improvement from all 3, more so from LMA and Oden. Brandon, LMA and Oden are the wings that determine the altitude this team can fly. Sure, depth and talent and hopefully a positive suprise or two or three. Webster, Batum..when we win it will be as a team.
The addition of Turkoglu, would of helped The Blazers, concievably with more impact than the addition of Miller….but what IF Webster is ready to go? What IF Batum continues to develop and solidfy his skills?
This Miller addition just gives us more depth and talent, and what I like about it is that it gives us more depth and talent at a position we clearly needed more depth and talent. I’m going to feel good with Blake at the point, and I’m going to feel good with Miller at the point. Plus as Dave points out, worst case scenario Miller doesn’t fit in, and in that case his contract is very palatable.
If Hedo would of blown up in our faces, we would of been stuck for 50 Million plus, for 5 years.
Miller might not be as flashy, or as “big” a name but I could really see the tangible benefits being almost as impactful to the team. Plus his addition leaves the door open for Websters return and Batums continued development, I think Hedo would of hindered Batums opportunity.
The honest interview I would want right now would be Bayless. More or less being told you are being tested in summer league to see your PG skills, the exit of Sergio leaving Bayless as 2nd PG, and then suddenly, right after summer league ends The Blazers obtain Miller. I wonder where the young kids head is at now? Millers addition means probably less opportunity than Bayless was expecting. Historically, at some point during the season (knock on wood) but historically Blake misses some time due to injury. That would be the time Bayless could get some burn. But we’ve also seen that despite the lip service of open competition and earned playing time, 3rd string PG on The Blazers get’s very little time. Imagine the lack of opportunity when McMillan looks at 2 PG’s he likes with Blake and Miller? If you are 3rd on that depth chart I just don’t see you getting much regular game time. If Bayless was approaching this season thinking he was the Blazers 2nd PG, his psyche could be damaged. I’d want to know 2 things, how commited to Bayless are The Blazers? and 2, how is Bayless taking the news of Millers addition? Is Bayless cool with continuing to learn mostly behind the scenes and waiting another year or two to perhaps challenge the regular PG rotation? Or is he hopping mad and super disappointed?
"Mother Nature started this fight, I think it's about time we ended it!"
If Hedo would of blown up in our faces, we would of been stuck for 50 Million plus, for 5 years
. Agree. Hedo did the Blazers a favor. To sign him would have meant we basically threw in the towel on Martell and Batum – and as long as they continue to show improvement I’m just not ready to do that yet.
Portland's PG of the Future - Meet John Wall
Treat people well because Karma can hit you at any second.
Well said
I like the Miller addition as well. I really like it if Martell is ready to go. I think Bayless should be able to look and see that his performance this summer forced this trade. He just wasn’t ready to play the point on a regular basis. Personally I hope the Blazers aren’t too committed to Bayless but I don’t know. I think this trade gives them two to three years to either draft and develop a true point guard or aquire a young talent from another team.
Also, I didn’t know it was possible to say “depth and talent” three times in a sentence but you managed to do it. I’m not even mad…I’m impressed
Life's short, Stunt it!!
by Irwin Fletcher on Jul 25, 2009 9:21 AM PDT up reply actions
How committed are the Blazers to Bayless?
Well, precisely one year from now Miller’s contract becomes AMEC, if Bayless shows he’s ready to be a quality starting NBA PG.
The length of the contract may tell us something here. If we picked up Sessions, you might well ask how committed they are. They rented a PG for one or two years, with an option to extend the lease for another year. That doesn’t sound to me like giving up on the guy you said was your future.
When I rule the world, everyone will know how to use Excel.
If Bayless was approaching this season thinking he was the Blazers 2nd PG, his psyche could be damaged
If Bayless’ psyche is permanently damaged by this transaction, is he really the guy you want running your ballclub in the future?
I’ve said this before…if Jerryd isn’t good enough to beat out Steve Blake before his rookie contract expires, then he was a wasted draft choice and just another in a long line of PGs that Portland either “scouted wrong” or was unable to develop…and that list goes back at least to the end of Terry Porter’s career, so it’s not “all about Nate”
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
If Bayless' psyche is permanently damaged
then I’m glad to find out he has such a weak psyche now.
When I rule the world, everyone will know how to use Excel.
i see this move as really helping Oden and hurting LMA
Greg gets nice lob feeds and open moster cleaning ups at the rim off of missed finnishes by Dre.
BUT, Lma gets his iso oppurtunities limited by nate who will try to establish andre a little more early. since LMA has had pouting problems in the past when the pecking order isn’t clear he does so this year. i can really see this happening knowing LMA.
to me the move CAN make sense basketball wise (minus the three point shooting). but like dave said,
nobody knows whether Roy or Miller should be directing the show
it muddles the pecking order. whether you or i think lma is the 2nd option or shoudl be the 2nd option is irrelevant. if the pecking order doens’t get situated fast. watch out. bring on the pouts.
also, millers passing will not alleviate this problem. players like to the initiaters of offens not the recievers of it. THAT is having rank in the pecking order.
I think this oversimplifies basketball.
Basketball is not all about pecking order. Everytime down the court is an opportunity to run a different set. LMA was not the first or second option on every play last year and he didn’t pout about it. I think you have to give LMA a bit more credit than that. Nate is smart. He’s a good coach. I personally am not worried about his ability to work a nice offense involving everyone, and I’m not sure why we would go away from playing inside out (inside first to greg or LMA, outside pick and pop with LMA). And to be able to run the pick and roll/pop on both sides (Dre and Greg on one side and Brandon and LaMarcus on the other) is gonna be a huge strength for us. Watch out NBA.
Instead of Dre
he should be called Moth. Or, The Moth.
right, it's about the matchups
if LMA has his man sealed and has an advantage in the post, Miller will get him the ball
Same thing with Greg, Andre is going to help them both get easier baskets
The nice thing about LMA is that he can step out to 21 feet and knock down open jumpers, that will help open up the floor for Odem, Miller and Roy
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Good read Dave
The acquisition of ALM greatly improves Portland’s point guard IQ, leading to easier opportunities on the offensive end.
What player(s) do you guys see benefiting the most from him being out on the floor with them?
Portland's PG of the Future - Meet John Wall
Treat people well because Karma can hit you at any second.
BRoy benefits most I think
I hope that Andre will take some pressure of Brandon. Maybe next deason won’t be so hard on his body with another guy that can break down the D on the dribble. Andre is also big enough to defend a SG, his could relieve brando a bit as well.
If Martell returns I think he will benefit as well. Andre is a true threat on the drive so Martell should see more open 3’s.
Life's short, Stunt it!!
by Irwin Fletcher on Jul 25, 2009 9:15 AM PDT up reply actions
What player(s) do you guys see benefiting the most from him being out on the floor with them?
Greg and LMA, Andre will take them to dinner every night and serve them tasty dishes
and Joel will get his best P&R partner since the days of Nick van Exel
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
by two4larue on Jul 25, 2009 6:59 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Dave??
Why so glum? I know people kept saying lets go into the year with what we have but it just wasn’t possible . Bayless is not even reserve pg material now and we needed someone. CP3 wasn’t going to happen, Kidd is staying in Dallas, Sessions is good on a bad team, Heinrick was the guy but we didn’t get him before his stock rose. Who else is left. The Blazers we in a position where they had to make a move and they still got a quality guy for a great price. The option on the third year is nothing short of genius.
Life's short, Stunt it!!
Floor General to drive the team.
Brandon Roy is great. But he is also the reason we play more pick-and-pop than pick-and-roll. By no way is this a knock on Brandon. Brandon is fantastic at creating shots for himself and for others on the team. However, with Brandon’s creativity, he gets to the rim, and other’s get the ball when they are well set and its best that they take their shots (ie shoot from outside).
The point about a floor general is to get your bigs close to the rim. Get both Oden and LMA to be rolling to the rim and throwing the ball down. A good floor general, should take the wraps of the Blazers thunder game. Batum slashing to the rim and slamming it down.
Nate must absolutely love this move. He has a veteran on the floor that can teach the youngsters how to play as a team, during live game situations — especially as once te season starts there really is very little practice time. BEdgers have constantly complained that Nate’s offense was simple and predictable, This is the move. [Insist on 3PT shooting and you’ll get more of the same old stuff]. I’m eager to see what the new ear unfolds.
Sorry guys, I think this was a big move. Andre might not be Chauncey Billups, but for the Blazers he might have just as much impact. He could do for Blazers what Chauncey did for Denver. Here’s a guy whose game picks up in the playoffs. And what should be exciting to us, he knows how to run a break. Andre may not be lock down defense, but he is no slouch either. Over his career he has doubled down on Steve Blake’s steals. And Andre Miller’s steals lead to fast breaks!
I’m excited and hopeful. This move was enough for me KP. Anything else you do will be gravy.
by FromAfar on Jul 25, 2009 9:18 AM PDT reply actions 2 recs
Agreed
Miller will help the kids find “option C” in the playoffs when the tough defensive teams (like Houston, last year) shut down options A & B.
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
I totally and 100% agree...
I think those playing this down as a so-so move will look back and wonder how they were so blinded by his inability to shoot the three. This is everything I’ve been hoping for in a pg. Someone to challenge the defenders in the paint on a regular basis (along with BRoy) and to get the ball to our bigs. I CANNOT WAIT!
I think most people
despite the lack of a deep threat, are optimistic about Andre’s offensive talents. It is the fact that he isn’t a major defensive upgrade that disappoints some people.
When I rule the world, everyone will know how to use Excel.
assists
Perhaps the key thing to watch for with Miller: How many assists does he get.
In the prime of his career, he had awesome numbers, 6-7 per game type numbers.
In the last several years that number has dropped. How much of that is due to decline in his physical abilities due to age, and how much is due to the personnel he was playing with.
If he can boost his assist average up playing with the Blazers, that would bode very well.
Miller
FromAfar:
I like the move too. And one thing I like about it is it is not “too big” a move. They are not gambling 50 million over 5 years on a Turkoglu who might or might not pan out and who would proably be a liability to the team his last couple of years.
The Blazers are winning team with an awesome group of young talented players. In that situation, you don’t mess around making big moves that could backfire on you. You make smart surgical moves to incrementally improve the team.
Miller is such a move and it also uses up their cap space; now they are not in a position to make a big move that could backfire on them.
by lsjogren on Jul 25, 2009 9:37 AM PDT reply actions 4 recs
Well put. REC
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
option
“The option on the third year is nothing short of genius.”
Well, I think that is a bit overblown. The option is what any competent general manager would get into the contract when the team has a strong enough negotiating hand to do so.
sorry
didn’t realize you were such an expert on general managers and contracts. KP just tried to sign Hedo for way too much and someone gave Raef that pitiful contract so GM’s must not always get it right.
Life's short, Stunt it!!
by Irwin Fletcher on Jul 25, 2009 9:52 AM PDT up reply actions
The Sixers wanted to pay MLE for ONE season (and pulled THAT off the table), so one might as easily argue that getting 2 guaranteed years at over MLE for a 33 year old is "Agenting Genius."
Actually, it is a fair and reasonable deal for both parties.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
I would like to point out...
that someone (probably Portland) leaked to the press multiple times that they had absolutely no interest in Miller.
It’s possible that the Sixers were just playing hardball thinking the Blazers were out of the picture and no one else could pay Miller more than the MLE.
by Nick Van Excellent on Jul 25, 2009 11:15 PM PDT up reply actions
Yeah
those leaks tell us how much faith to put in the other leaks that “we could have had that guy” or “this guy is being shopped” or “they are going hard after this guy”.
Believe it when it happens.
When I rule the world, everyone will know how to use Excel.
You make smart surgical moves to incrementally improve the team.
. 100% agree.
And a big thing to me is that the young players will have learned a few things from Miller before his time is up here.
Portland's PG of the Future - Meet John Wall
Treat people well because Karma can hit you at any second.
The next step
I like the idea many have floated that the remaining step the Blazers need to do is trade Outlaw + Bayless for a backup PF.
I would say hold off on that until a couple months into the season though.
1). They should hang onto Outlaw until Martell puts some miles on the odometer so they can be sure his risk of re-injury is no greater than that any other player might get injured.
2). That will also give them some time to see whether Cunningham or Pendergraph exceed expectations and become a viable backup PF. If one of them really steps up and plays as well as someone they might want to acquire in a trade, then no need for a trade.
If so they won’t need to acquire any new player but they will have too many rotation players so they will need to thin the herd somehow.
true
I would like to see the trade in your option #1 but it would be better to wait on Martell.
Life's short, Stunt it!!
by Irwin Fletcher on Jul 25, 2009 9:50 AM PDT up reply actions
Rex is like a savings bond. You hold him until he matures.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
I said this a few weeks ago… let him cook for a few years. If he becomes even serviceable at running the offense, he’ll be an incredible weapon.
life is better as an optimist
Would he have been effective against Houston?
racking up fouls on Dr. Ming? Totally off topic sorry.
I'm starting to come around to this idea, as well
My main reasons for wanting to bid adios to Travis is because
1) I don’t think there will be enough minutes to keep him happy, unless there’s another injury
2) his game doesn’t translate well to post-season success, and Portland needs another veteran 4/5
By the time February rolls around, we should know if Webster is “all the way back” and if he is, Outlaw will be doing a slow burn because he’ll be playing about half the amount of minutes he’s been accustomed to, because his PT will be “gone” at the 3. Travis is a quiet kid and probably won’t “go public” with his discontent but someone like Quick will pick up on Trout’s body language and write an article about how #25 is appears “bummed” with his role. This will lead to radio hosts speculating about Outlaw’s future (like they aren’t already?) and they’ll be asking KP what he’s going to do about the SF logjam, etc. Then will come the “consolidation” deal and a lot of fans will probably think that KP got snookered but the truth is, a veteran PF/C (like Jeff Foster?) will be much more useful for Nate in the playoiffs than a skinny power forward like Travis.
So as long as TO is moved before the deadline I’m “OK” with him starting the season in Portland. I do not expect the rookie PFs to be major contributers in the post-season, though. Adding a veteran banger is still the top priority, it’s just not a “immediate” need unless one of Greg/Joel/LMA were to go down
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
this is highly presumptive
and I hope you are wrong. You might be right, but I hope not. – Elgin
Without you out there, we're nowhere here
Quotes from Barrett
Andre, when asked if he was hoping to become a Blazer – “Oh man, you’ve got to help me out if you can (not knowing who we were, obviously, and the fact that we have absolutely zero juice). I really want this. This is the perfect fit for me, and things are looking very good. I can help this team.”
Pritchard on his meeting with Andre – “He was so very impressive at that dinner,” said Pritchard. “He knew absolutely everything about our team, our guys, our offense, and got very specific. He told us he could make everyone better, and told us specific ways he could help. You can only get this kind of thing in a face-to-face meeting.”
I don’t believe that everything is so wonderful and perfect and glorious and majestic and Blazerland as Barrett and KP say but these are apparently direct quotes. Sounds like Miller really wanted to be here. And I for one want him here.
Life's short, Stunt it!!
by Irwin Fletcher on Jul 25, 2009 9:49 AM PDT reply actions 1 recs
Haha
Nice
Life's short, Stunt it!!
by Irwin Fletcher on Jul 26, 2009 11:51 AM PDT via mobile up reply actions
Miller
One other thought about Miller: There has been a lot of commetary about his leadership skills. Once his playing career is over, I wonder if he might make a good assistant coach?
Starting front court comparisons via Basketball-Referance.com
08-09
76ers:
A. Iguodala – 6’6"
T. Young – 6’8"
S. Dalembert – 6’11"
Blazers:
Batum – 6’8" / Outlaw 6’9"
Aldridge – 6’11"
Joel 7’1" / Greg 7’0"
Does this translate into more assists for Andre or no change?
Portland's PG of the Future - Meet John Wall
Treat people well because Karma can hit you at any second.
alley oops count as assists
so watch his assists go up…
I have my P.h.D in unreliable hyperbole.
by Eat Politicians on Jul 25, 2009 3:40 PM PDT up reply actions
contract
Fletcher your point is well taken. The contract looks to me like basic competence, but the fact is that managers all over the NBA frequently make boneheaded deals and the Blazers are no exception, so when they make a competent deal they do deserve credit.
Bayless on the block c/o Brother Maxey
at hoopsworld: “Even with a short free agency shopping list in the making, there remains question marks surrounding the role of sophomore point guard Jerryd Bayless who – according to multiple sources – is being heavily shopped by Portland.”
PWN3D
figured as much
but I’m still against it…
I have my P.h.D in unreliable hyperbole.
by Eat Politicians on Jul 25, 2009 3:41 PM PDT up reply actions
Clearly Blake is the PG of the future.
Miller was just brought in to groom him.
by Nick Van Excellent on Jul 25, 2009 11:17 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
2-3 years
To find our future pg.
Life's short, Stunt it!!
by Irwin Fletcher on Jul 26, 2009 11:42 AM PDT via mobile up reply actions
Nate should be happy.
He got what he wanted, another experienced half-court oriented PG.
Personally, I liked the contrast in styles that Sergio brought to the second unit. I guess I’m going to have to give up on this ever being a fast paced team ….. at least while Nate is here.
I’d still lay money that Blake will start. Brandon is outstanding at setting up the offensive, getting the defense to commit and making the right pass or play. Blake compliments his game very welll…..teams are reluctant to leave Blake to double on Roy because of the long ball threat. I doubt Miller’s man would have much hesitation to leave him to help on Roy.
I’m not complaining too much though. This is a much wiser, cheaper and shorter investment than Hedo or MIlsap who would likely have been problematic because of the log jams they would have created at their respective positions.
Brandon Roy just destroyed everything in his path. There's your rational analysis -- Dave
Also: COMCAST SUCKS!
Miller time is 33 years old
This is a good contract for a 33 year old point guard. I think its good for portland too. First, despite his age he seems to never get hurt, so it looks like he has something special in the fitness department. I also expect him to play his arse of. Here’s why, at the time of the contract extension he’ll be 35. I think he will be looking at that last 7 million dollars real hard for the next two years. Thats not guaranteed money.
He is basically on a two year 14 million dollar paid interview for the last 7 million. That is going to translate into good things for Portland. I’ll drink to that.
why does every video on youtube have him getting crossed?!?!?!
by elconquistador on Jul 25, 2009 10:52 AM PDT reply actions
This move is why I appreciate the blazers now...
Andre Miller isn’t the end all answer. He’s not the sure fire star and perfect fit who puts this team over the top.
However, he’s an improvement over Blake – give me the choice and I’ll take Andre over Blake every day of the week. And I would have taken Blake over Sergio any day of the week. The Blazers just got better – not by an amazing amount, but by a good amount and for minimal cost. This was a smart move, if not a sexy move.
The killer deal isn’t always there. You don’t always get the option to rape and pillage other NBA teams and make off like bandits. However, rather then panic and take a player who doesn’t fit or vastly overpay for a player they don’t really need…the Blazers made a solid move. They improved the team, increased their chances to win, gave themselves better trade pieces and more flexibility, and didn’t hurt themselves financially.
This is what it looks like to cheer for a well run team – celebrate the solid moves, not just the amazing ones.
Yep!
He is an improvement over Blake who a vast improvement over Sergio. And, he’s likes to lob the ball which will work really well with Rudy, Oden and Pryzbilla! I was actually a little worried because although I like Steve better than Sergio, Sergio was really good with lobbing the ball (let’s not ever forget the Spanish Armada) and I thought we wouldn’t see so much of that. He’s got experience, good #‘s and so he’s not good at the 3 pointer – he’s a point guard, get it to Brandon, Rudy or LMA and voila, 3 points!
The more I read about him the more excited I’m getting … maybe it’s not a killer deal, but it’s a solid deal and our team is solid enough to negate the need for a killer deal. Although I do wonder how “happy” Bayless is with this … and Rudy was worried about minutes!
Blake may not be as good at lobbing the ball as Sergio was.
But he sure did find Brandon a few times, especially at the end of the year.
μὴ φοβοῦ, μόνον πίστευε.
Never said he didn't ...
Blake works really well with Brandon and did seem to starting to sync with Rudy a bit better toward the end of the season but was meant more in reference to Bayless and not knowing how he was going to fit in.
This is the best post I've ever read here.
I completely agree with every statement. The Miller acquisition makes our team better, no question. How much better we’ll have to see. Excellent work, Dave.
Life is hilarious.
Does anyone know who has been renounced and un-renounced?
I did not hear this mentioned anywhere.
Some were renounced for Hedo thing. I don’t if that meant they were necessarily unrenounced afterwards.
Information please.
All the Euros were un-renounced
Post Hedo and post Millsap.
by Memphremagog on Jul 25, 2009 2:00 PM PDT up reply actions
Ok
So Pendergraph and Cunningham are the new Shav and Ruffin.
Who is the new Channing?
When I rule the world, everyone will know how to use Excel.
Called it
Miller was number two on my off season wish list. Now all we need is a trade for Gerlad Wallace and ill be a genius.
Bee, on tha loook. out fore !!!! tha grammar po-lease.
Word has it that the Blazers are now shopping Bayless hard...
If we don’t get a Battier or Wallace out of it, I’m not sure I like it. And I’m not even one of the Rex-flavored kool-aid connoisseurs around here…
Are you a Mexi-CAN or a Mexi-CAN'T?
Kid has a future in the leauge
See him as a Monta Ellis type player in the right system where he can log some minuets….would be sad to see him go….“OH hello Mr Gerald Wallace”…. “Bayless who ?”
Bee, on tha loook. out fore !!!! tha grammar po-lease.
Gavin Dawson's..........
jk
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
HoopsWorld, among others...
http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=13435
“It’s clear Portland is keeping their options open.
Even with a short free agency shopping list in the making, there remains question marks surrounding the role of sophomore point guard Jerryd Bayless who – according to multiple sources – is being heavily shopped by Portland."
Are you a Mexi-CAN or a Mexi-CAN'T?
So Bayless is being shopped now?
Wasn’t it the case that Hinrich was a Bayless away from wearing a Blazer uniform? I guess the Bulls changed their mind after seeing all those Bayless turnovers in the summer league
I like the move for Miller
But the question is still, what is the long term solution at PG? I don’t think Miller or Blake will be the starter in 2-3 years. We need to decide if Bayless is that answer, and if not, trade him and maybe Outlaw for a young point guard who can be that starting PG on our championship teams. Who is that PG? and can we get him for Outlaw, Bayless?
Can we get a PG for Outlaw & Bayless?
At least, I have to think one of this year’s rookie point guards might be available for an experienced big man. I wonder if KP has an eye for any of them.
I'd rather have a backup PF
And I don’t think we’re liable to get anyone better than Miller for Outlaw and change (or Bayless or whatever).
Look, piggy wiggy — YOU'VE ALREADY GOT YOUR DAMNED POINT GUARD.
Now GIMME MY LOW POST MASHER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Can we get a PG for Outlaw & Bayless?
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
I like it
it was better than doing nothing this summer.
I still think a mid season trade is still possible, because we have 2 expiring contracts and good young players. If the wizards stink we may be able to get Butler.
The team will improve, Roy will have the opportunity to work off the ball more often and we’ll have a way better fast break. Small PGs will continue to be a problem but now we can send MIller to the post to use his size advantage against the midgets.
Oden is still the key to the season but we improved by quite a margin with this trade.
I called it
I can see the team getting a crutch veteran point guard that is only good for 2-3 more years. I don’t know who that is, but I think it is a role that needs to be filled if Bayless or Sergio is traded. Baygio might get some free development minutes like Oden did this year, and at the same time, it would be nice to have a stopgap.
I think Bayless could be the guy just not for another year. If the team sticks with him, then they just need an old vet to crutch the Blazers until then.
The team needs to either commit to Bayless or Sergio, and I think the choice is Bayless. I said before last season that Sergio’s role was to help Rudy get acclimated. He did his job and he deserves to go to a team that has more playing time for him. If the Blazers can’t get a mid-twenties aged future of the organization point guard, then they need to get a crutch or patch point guard, who can fill in until Bayless is ready. It is a burden always being right, but it is a burden I can carry.
by tominhawaii on Jul 25, 2009 1:29 PM PDT reply actions 3 recs
You're like Nostradamus
it’s uncanny.
The Michael Ruffin of BlazersEdge, cuz Amlmart said so.
by BlazersOrBust on Jul 25, 2009 1:35 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
To let everyone know how brave I am
I just clicked on a TiH link.
And it was actually what he said it was.
And I even rec’d him for being right.
When I rule the world, everyone will know how to use Excel.
You need to use the word "Miller"
in order to have called it properly Mr. Tom.
proof that if you talk long enough
you will say something smart eventually. Love, – Elgin
Without you out there, we're nowhere here
Nobody was 'the missing piece to put this team over the top" maybe that's the problem
Like KP said, the pieces are already here.
Blazer Fan
Does anyone else think Andre Miller looks a lot like Channing Frye in that photo?
Or is it just me?
Tony Bennett reports that Minnesota and Portland are swapping draft picks -- Roy to Portland, Foye to Minnesota. That's it? That's the trade? None of the ESPN guys seem remotely fazed. I knew Kevin McHale couldn't just pick the best guy in the draft without somehow screwing it up. I would have bet my Ndudi Ebi rookie cards on it.
It makes sense
This is a good signing for the Blazers and for Andre Miller. He seems to me like a Portland type of guy. Low-key but effective. This is a team that won 54 games with Steve Blake starting last year. And don’t get me wrong. I love Steve Blake but I don’t think his game is that of a starting NBA point guard. With Andrew Miller starting and the rest of the team intact maybe we’re looking at a, do I dare say 60 win season. And that’s with a guy that got Philly into the playoffs the last two years. He’s not gonna come in and expect to be the guy but I think he makes the whole team better. I like this move even more than Turkoglu (who would’ve been overpaid for his couple years of usefullness). And Millsap never maid sense to me. He possibly could’ve been the next Channing Frye sitting at the end of the bench. Not only that but Miller doesn’t miss games. Unfortuneatly he does miss three’s though. That won’t be so important when we get Webster back. Overall, I dig it. Nice move
I'm excited about Miller
He’s a great addition and I love that he’s so excited to be a Blazer. That’s the kind of guy you want — he obviously sees championship potential and is going to work hard to help it happen. We got our experienced veteran who can get to the foul line (which, I feel will make up for losing Blake 3-pointers) and he’ll make everyone else on the team better. Blake is an incredible change-of-pace PG — We won 54 games with Sergio playing 15 MPG. Replaced by Blake, that’s going to add some wins.
And now we have 2-3 years to find our true PG of the future. I like Bayless’ energy and work ethic, but the guy just isn’t going to be a starting PG in the NBA. I hope we develop him into an awesome 2nd unit PG behind our awesome PG of the future that we now have the luxury to wait for.
by 2005TelfairJerseyForSale on Jul 25, 2009 3:51 PM PDT reply actions
Second Unit
I’m excited about this move, but Blake Vs. Miller as a starter has nothing to do with it. Doesn’t this give a huge boost to the organization of our second unit regardless of who starts? Sergio and Bayless had issues but I see either Blake or Miller running the second unit much better and more efficiently than last year.
I don’t know who will start but I think our numbers will go up just by having one of those guys come off the bench.
by JonathanPDX on Jul 25, 2009 3:56 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
Can't wait to see the Rambo offense
Roy
Aldridge
Miller
Batum
Oden
Tony Bennett reports that Minnesota and Portland are swapping draft picks -- Roy to Portland, Foye to Minnesota. That's it? That's the trade? None of the ESPN guys seem remotely fazed. I knew Kevin McHale couldn't just pick the best guy in the draft without somehow screwing it up. I would have bet my Ndudi Ebi rookie cards on it.
Boy
It sure looks like Sixers 2.0
Teams are going to pack it in with no real outside shooters.
Really?
Aldridge makes his living 19’ from the basket.
Brandon Roy is a solid 3pt shooter.
Batum is a solid 3pt shooter.
And the Blazers have 4 guys coming off the bench that are 40% 3pt shooters.
Miller does two things: (1) Gives Portland a second player who can penetrate and kick (which is good when 6 of his teammates are average or better 3pt shooters; and (2) He takes away the oppositions ability to play quick PG’s that always get into the lane.
I should clarify the second point. By no means am I saying that Andre Miller is a lock down defender… he is not. Quick guards will still be able to get by Miller. What Miller does give Portland is a greater mismatch on the other end of the ball. When Blake is in the game, quick guards take advantage of Blake’s difficulty fighting through screens. Unfortunately, since Blake generally stays around the perimeter on the offensive end, those small annoying PG’s are never taken advantage of as defenders. With Miller in the game, quick defenders will have to deal with being posted up all night. With two above average centers who can neutralize guard penetration, opposing coaches may bench their pesky PG’s in favor of a larger PG who can limit Miller’s ability to post up his man and then kick out to shooters.
Tony Bennett reports that Minnesota and Portland are swapping draft picks -- Roy to Portland, Foye to Minnesota. That's it? That's the trade? None of the ESPN guys seem remotely fazed. I knew Kevin McHale couldn't just pick the best guy in the draft without somehow screwing it up. I would have bet my Ndudi Ebi rookie cards on it.
by Salem Stephen on Jul 25, 2009 4:41 PM PDT up reply actions
good point
nobody can defend small, quick guard in this league(the exceptions might be Harris and Rondo). Not even Tony Parker can defend himself. So the only way to counter those guards is simply to attack back. Put pressure on them, punish them until the opposing team changes strategy. Miller’s size, savvy and one-on-one ability makes him a perfect PG to do that.
In my opinion Roy and Aldridge are proven real outside shooters.
I don’t think teams can pack it in on them and dare them to shoot.
Also, though he hasn’t shown it, I’m confident Batum will make people pay this year if they leave him alone on the outside. They will weep and rent their jerseys. They will start calling them Freedom Fries again because they’ll be so pissed off at being done by a Frenchman like that. The will shout out “sacrebleu, I’ve made the same mistake” every time they give him space out their.
Just wait and see.
by LaughingJon on Jul 25, 2009 4:41 PM PDT up reply actions 2 recs
"rend" their jerseys
But I love this comment anyway. Rec for making me smile.
Are you sure they won't rent their jerseys?
I’m just thinking about it.
When I rule the world, everyone will know how to use Excel.
Please
Batum is okay from range and Roy is decent at best. There are no real deep threats with that lineup, like Blake, Rudy and Webster.
Or Travis Outlaw
Fortunately all four of those guys are on this team with one or more generally in the lineup at any given time. Why do think that we will play with two distinct units again?
Tony Bennett reports that Minnesota and Portland are swapping draft picks -- Roy to Portland, Foye to Minnesota. That's it? That's the trade? None of the ESPN guys seem remotely fazed. I knew Kevin McHale couldn't just pick the best guy in the draft without somehow screwing it up. I would have bet my Ndudi Ebi rookie cards on it.
by Salem Stephen on Jul 25, 2009 5:26 PM PDT up reply actions
Hopefully Oden is working on his 3-pointers
Actually, are there are any centers who are a legitimate 3-point threat? I can only think of Brad Miller
by 2005TelfairJerseyForSale on Jul 25, 2009 6:26 PM PDT up reply actions
Sure there are
44.6% Okur
40.9% Bargnani
Two of the very best centers from 3pt range.
I think Okur and Hawes exhausts it. Bargnani isn't a Center. Actually, either are Okur or Hawes, ha ha.
You might actually consider Dirk Nowitzki a Center that can hit the 3. Sometimes he plays the 5 on defense…
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
I still would like to see
Oden shoot when he’s at the top of the key on the pick and roll. He’s wide open and you would think a two time Mr. Basketball could knock down that shot.
and that line up is what makes me think
that things aren’t done no matter what KP says publicly. I get that he has to say “we’re done with moves” so as to maintain the illusion (because tricks are what a whore does for money) we are standing pat to drive up the value of our assets.
If Marty is better and replaces Batum in the starting line up, there is the outside shooter.
Fine, the OLP album grew on me. It's defiantly change.
I Think
People are overlooking the fact that a point guard needs to be an effective outside shooter to have offensive balance for the entire team. Eventually, I think Andre Miller will be more effective coming off the bench with some outside shooting and fastbreaking with Rudy/Webster/Outlaw.
It would be pretty hard to overlook...
The fact that Miller struggles from the 3 has been beaten into the ground. I know it worried me at first. The facts are though that he shoots a very high percentage from the field, is a very good distributor, has the knowledge and savvy that only 11years of playing can bring and will gain back some of the missing 3’s by getting to the line far more than Steve… Besides I think the two guys (Blake and Miller) complement each other perfectly.
It seems ironic after all the concern last year about being a jumpshooting team that people would now worry about not having enough 3pt fire power… doesn’t it?
A poor move
In Dave’s post I sense a feeling of unease – it’s difficult indeed to defend this move, for a handful of reasons:
1) Overall: was the question we were trying to answer (a)“can we improve the team this season?” – because that’s the answer we received (and it’s “yes” for the record; of course Miller is an upgrade at PG). Or was it rather (b)“can we add that long term piece that addresses our weaknesses and helps putting us at the next level?”. I thought this was the real question and it surely hasn’t been addressed.
2) Age: a 33 year-old guy. Say no more. And there were those questioning Hedo’s utility two or three years down the road… that’s the time-span of an aging playoff team in win-now mode going for a quality addition… not the Blazers’
3) Questionable fit. This has been largely brought up. He addresses one need, effective passing/distributing other than BRoy, not the biggest one – defense. Not to mention we still need Blake as quality 3pt shooter (essential to Portland’s game. Will the game plan change with Miller? This creates more questions, and remember we were looking for answers).
4) Alternative Choices. I would understand this signing were there a lack of options… but:
- David Lee: even 8 mil per year can be very difficult to match for the Knicks as it is. You can go for a 3 man frontline, Przybilla ideally becomes a good trade asset, etc. (Dave wrote a great post on this scenario some days ago). Maybe the Knicks, being presented the offer sheet, decide to go for a sign and trade (Blake, Outlaw); you save some cap space for other trades.
- Kirk Hinrich: all this Millsap thing seemed a preliminar move to a three team trade… really there wasn’t any chance to get Hinrich with Blake, Outlaw, our cap space ? …you don’t give away Bayless to get Hinrich? Defense, 3pt shooting, unselfish distribution – not a superstar but exactly what we need? I don’t believe it.
- Ramon Sessions: I understand he was written off for probably being a bad fit, and next you sign basically the same player only ten years older? There’s not a chance the Bucks match a 7 mil offer, and you get a good player, with lots of upside and perfectly fitting our window.
- in the end, as many have written, you can just stay put and wait for the deadline: it’s still a better option.
5) Bayless has to be traded. No way he sits another year at 5 min per game, no way he gets any better not playing, no way his trade value is going anywhere but down. The good thing with the Turkoglu move was letting Batum grow until hopefully in a couple years he can manage the starting role. Something similar could have happened to Bayless if he stayed behind Hinrich… but not this way. Now you expect to trade him… what trade? until yesterday “lopsided” was the most used word on Blazersedge, but that word is now gone…
Remember: this was not your normal, seasonal free-agent signing.
This was your last-in-a-decade big shot to a key player.
Now you have a two year rental of Andre Miller.
by pato70 on Jul 25, 2009 5:19 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
miller
I disagree.
Yes, this was not a blockbuster signing of a free agent who is going to be a core member of the team for years to come.
But I don’t think that is the sort of move the Blazers should have made anyway. With a ton of very young players with huge potential, their long term problem is liable to be a logjam of talent.
What they really needed was someone to give the team a bit of a boost for a couple years as those younger guys are developing. And, the position they most needed someone in was point guard.
It seems to me they made the right deal going after Miller.
It is true that they still have a hole at PG for the long term, however. But they have a couple years to figure out what to do about that.
Hinrich
I read that Hinrich was never available in a trade, that it was a story “leaked” by a bitter Mark Warkentien. Anybody?
by Original Blazer Fan on Jul 25, 2009 5:42 PM PDT reply actions
What the hell...
does Warkentian have to be bitter about any more? They had a solid playoffs and he won Exec of the Year…let it go, man…let.it.go.
Are you a Mexi-CAN or a Mexi-CAN'T?
If you've got the time, I've got the beer.
Miller time.
Hallelujah! Miller was the guy I felt we should’ve targeted from the beginning. He makes the team better in so many ways and his playmaking will help preserve BRoy’s health, thereby extending his career.
If the Vulcans were balking at giving Brandon a 5th year because of injury concerns, those concerns should now be mitigated with Dre taking so much pressure and wear & tear off Brandon.
My expectations for next season are now 60 wins and WCF’s. If the Candyman takes his sugar addiction to Miami, the Blazers will be the team to beat in the West.
I am so stoked! Feels like I’m dreaming, I can’t believe this finally and actually happened!
"He's like a little mini-hulk type dude." - Channing Frye describing Steve Blake
I stated on July 5th that this would be P'Towns pick up
I’m excited about this deal. Passing the ball, when done right, is contagious and it makes the game easier (see Clyde, Terry, Jerome, Buck & Duck teams). Miller plays the perfect style for this team. Also, Norsktroll that vid is awesome, thanks. I love Walton’s jab at the Clips D.
"I figured we ought to hang around for a while and see if we can give 'em all a nice big shitburger to eat!" -Manager Lou Brown -Major League
Stronger PGs outnumbered faster PGs in playoffs last year
PG defense has been a weakness for the Blazers.
Subtracting Sixers, and Blazers; and looking at the other 14 playoff teams from last year, I would count:
- 8 teams with stronger/bigger PGs: L@kers/Fisher, Nuggets/Billups, Mavs/Kidd,
Jazz/DWill, Celtics/Rondo, Hawks/Bibby, Heat/Wade, Pistons/Stuckey
- 4 teams with faster PGs: Spurs/Parker, Rockets/Brooks, Hornets/CP3, Bulls/Rose
- and 2 teams as on par: Cavs/MoWill, Magic/Alston.
Andre Miller rates a defensive upgrade against the 8 stronger PGs. We shouldn’t have to worry about an opposing PG posting up Steve Blake, and creating potential foul trouble for our bigs. So, we’ve gotten better against (8/12) 66% of the PG weakness against playoff teams from last year. That seems like a pretty big jump.
Additionally, Andre Miller’s offensive game will certainly make the faster PGs work on defense a lot more than Blake’s game did. You might never shut down CP3 and Tony Parker, short of having one of them on your team, but you can certainly make them work at the other end. 6’2/200 Miller should have fun posting up 6’0/160 Brooks, especially if he can make the pass when the double team comes.
I would put forward that Andre Miller will indeed be a defensive upgrade over Steve Blake.
by FromAfar on Jul 25, 2009 6:25 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
You should expand this and write it up as a FanPost, with pictures.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Out of my depths, here.
Thanks for the suggestion/encouragement, but I’m a little limited in these skills.
Would be happy to cede the topic to the more skilled among us.
Rondo uses quickness more than he does power…. he fits more into the Ros group.
life is better as an optimist
You're right.
He’s 6’1/171. For some reason I had him as a bigger guard.
He must play like a giraffe :-)
he has massive arms and hands
So basically, yes.
Vinny Del Negro: Possibly the most unintentionally irritating last name in the history of last names [Hint: I can't for the life of me pronounce it correctly].
-Brandon Jennings: PG of the future!
kinda
chalmers was a rookie and when it counted wade brought the ball up with daequan cook as 2nd guard. Before that the heat had jason williams, which played out the same way, (and they even tried gary payton during their championship season).
As a 2nd round pick by minn and traded to miami, chalmers still needs to prove that he is a better option on the floor; than wade handling the ball with cook. Still from the primary point standpoint, dont think that chalmers is particularly speedy, and he is 20lbs heavier than blake.
Painfully etched in my memory
how Aaron Brooks carved up our defense in the first round. I don’t see that changing with our new line-up.
miller
I am comfortable with Millers poor oustide shooting.
The guy’s forte is distributing the ball. Blazers have plenty of outside shooters. So, when an outside shot is the right play, Miller distributes the ball to someone to take the outside shot.
End of story.
Miller's shot reminds me of Alex English
high release, more wrist snap, less elbow action
English didn’t have 3 point range either, but he lead the NBA in scoring for a decade making elbow jumpers on the move
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
One thing people have to remember
Is Miller played most of his 76er career under Mo Cheeks. The general consensus on Cheeks is, he is a great motivator, and he will get his players to perform day in and day out, but he knows next to nothing on the “Xs and Os” aspect of the game. He left most of this to Andre Miller. As a result, Andre was a coach on the floor to the rest of the young sixer squad. I think this will be perfect for Portland.
I remember in the First round of the 2007 playoffs, Miller torched us (and by us I mean Detroit) and pushed the contest to a 6 game series. He hung with Chauncey Billups point for point, assist for assist, defensive stop for defensive stop. The announcers couldn’t stop praising him. He was definitely the main reason Detroit was even pushed to 6 games. He is really one of the more underrated guys in the league. His 3pt shooting is a big detractment though, but he makes up for it with veteran savvy and toughness that he will instill in every Blazer’s player (maybe even Oden). Miller won’t steal the spotlight from Roy, he’ll get Roy in his spots and make him a better player. He possesses a warrior’s mentality and still has the ability to takeover a game. He’ll also score and get his own shots off. I only see positives with this signing, great one Blazers. Anytime you can get a guy that averaged 16.3 pts, 6.5 ast, and 4.5 rebs for a reasonable contract you have to be pleased.
We didn't lose the games, we just ran out of time -- Bobby Layne
by detpistons3 on Jul 25, 2009 9:41 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
Mo Cheeks!
I can use my old “4 plays on a napkin being the Blazers playbook under Cheeks” joke out again. Ahhh….missed you, old friend.
Division improvement for Portland
With Denver, Portland and Utah all fighting again next year for Northwest Division title lets look at the improvements and changes for each (from rotation):
Denver: lost Dahntay Jones and maybe Anthony Carter and Linas Kleiza. Added Ty Lawson and Arron Afflalo.
Utah: lost nobody yet but maybe Brevin Knight But through the Blazers use of the cap space had to pay starter money to Millsap and perhaps forced to trade Boozer.
Portland: lost Sergio and Channing and added Andre Miller, Jeff Pendergraph and Dante Cunningham (Cunningham is not likely in the rotation and maybe the same for Pendergraph). Portland has lots more room for internal growth in players than the others as well.
So with Miller does Portland gain some ground against Denver and Utah? It would seem so. Especially if Utah has to take back problems to trade Boozer but surely over Denver. Portland got better. Denver a push at best, Utah maybe worse. What do you think? Was the cap space effective against the Division?
miller is better
i think Miller is a very nice addition, despite his lack of range. In fact, I found it sometimes frustrating to watch the Blazers last year rely too much on the 3-ball. Miller won’t do that. He’s a great distributor who I predict will to quick to dump the ball into Greg when the blazers need some points.
Not just lack of range...lack of defense.
I still think he is a good player for what he does, but there is a reason he is a journeyman.
I don't believe Miller is an automatic starter ...
Imo, it’s going to be a battle,( just like at c and sf ) Blake won’t just give it away.
A second unit of Andre, Rudy, Nic, Travis and Greg, I like it.
I don’t care who starts, I care who wins.
Blake, in his best season ever
was a “neutral” player from a net production perspective. Miller was a positive player. Plus, they have radically different skill sets.
It’s the skill sets that will determine starter/backup. Miller takes over 40% of his shots at the basket, while Blake takes 96%(!!!) of his shots outside. Where do you want those 3 pointers, where do you want the FT’s and layins?
The national pundits have for years been critical of the Blazer capabilities for “easy” baskets. I tend to agree. “Easy” baskets are a transition phenomena, and the 1st unit needs more transition play. Miller is a transition PG, Blake is not.
I’ll be shocked if Miller doesn’t start.
by blacknoiseNW on Jul 26, 2009 11:02 AM PDT up reply actions
The Miller Edge
Statistically the Blazers won around 34 games when they scored 99 points or more last season and I think Miller gives the Blazers 4 – 6 more points a game without hurting Portland’s defense and that should translate into 4 to 6 more wins and make Portland a legitimate 55+ win team next year.
I just keep thinkin'
about that game where Martell had what…24 pts in a QUARTER! If he can keep a consistent shot from the outside and Andre can penetrate and kick it out….with LA and Greg to clean-up …Oh yea!
The other thing I want this year is another “streak” I went to the last 3 games of the win streak from 2 years ago and the RG was really rockin’ big time. So fun for the fans.
The Miller signing might open the door for a Rubio trade
Bayless and Outlaw for Rubio, Gomez and Bobby Brown. Throw in a 1st round draft pick. Let Rubio play one or two more years in Europe.
Portland gets a better fit for backup PF and a 3rd string PG nobody cares about plus the heir apparent that doesn’t need playing time right now. Minnesota gets a combo guard to replace Foye and a SF to balance a roster heavy of PF’s.
Rubio is the one guy that the fantasy campers aren't wasting their time on...
…………………… I think Minnesota has his position covered, and he’s not helping them sitting in Spain. There’s a deal to be done for him, but it’s an expensive proposition.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Miller
“As a result, Andre was a coach on the floor to the rest of the young sixer squad. I think this will be perfect for Portland.”
A hopeful scenario on Miller: Miller helps make the team very successful next couple of years. Maybe by then his game is petering out. Blazers don’t exercise the team option but instead offer him a job as an assistant coach. Miller, having LIVED the Blazers for two years, knowing the strengths and weaknesses of the players like the back of his hand, helps drive the Blazers to a championship.
Rubio
Geez, you think we could get Rubio for Bayless and Outlaw? Sounds like wishful thinking to me.
By the way, what about this Claver guy? I forget what position he plays. He doesn’t happen to be a PG does he?
Claver is a 6'10" PF
Skinny now but with good skills
by oldguyoldfan on Jul 26, 2009 3:08 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
Who can we beat in the WC now?
We can beat Houston – no Yoa or Ronron
We can beat Phoenix – they are done
Denver – probably… our newest rival
SA – They got better, but the mystic is gone and I think we can take them now
Dallas – They have our number and I hate them. Maybe this is where Greg puts the hurt on Dirk
Utah – Good, but not good enough. Never count them out.
Lakers – bring ‘em on – 8 straight Laker losses in P-town. I don’t think we will be starry-eyed in LA anymore either.
It's all about the playoffs now
Denver-home court super important
SA- agreed
Dallas- It might be LMA not Greg? Greg will own the paint (rebounds/ blocks/ deterrent).
Utah- There is nothing “Jazz” about SLC.
Lakers- Game 6.
This is the year the Blazers need to learn what the Lakers already know: home court really doesn't matter if you don't let it matter.
They’ve gotta win on the road in the west with consistency to take the next step.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Yes and no
If you can get an edge, you should take it. Home court advantage is an edge.
I guarantee that the L@kers want home court advantage very badly if they meet Portland in the playoffs.
When I rule the world, everyone will know how to use Excel.
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