Pursuing H.O.F. Point Guards
In the chatter surrounding possible off-season acquisitions two names have come up repeatedly among fans and popular media as potential Portland targets: Steve Nash and Jason Kidd. I'm not sure either is feasible salary-wise but let's leave that aside for a moment and stretch credibility enough to say they're on the radar. Are they desirable?
On the one hand there's a fan-ish part of me that would be awestruck by seeing Nash or Kidd in a Blazer uniform. There's no doubt about these guys' credentials. You want defining point guards in the last decade? They are right at the top of the list. One has been league MVP. The other was a catalyst for his team getting to the Finals. Either of them would instantly become he best point guard the Blazers have had in a decade or more. They've seen it all and done it all, save winning a championship. You don't have to teach. You don't have to explain. You don't have to guess. You're buying blue-chip stock here.
On the other hand you're not getting all of what that fan part of you is celebrating. You may have dreamed of owning a Cadillac all your life. Would you be as happy if you ended up with a Cimmaron instead of an Escalade? It still says Cadillac on the nameplate. It's just not the same experience. The key here is taking the names off the back of the jerseys. Forget Steve Nash and Jason Kidd. If you were considering Harry Meatlock and Joe Schlubowski, two players who played exactly at the level of Nash and Kidd in 2008-09, would you be as excited about adding them to the Blazers?
Steve Nash is on the final year of his contract in 2009-10. He's owed a little over $13 million. He's also going to be 35 years old this season and will be looking to secure his future. He is an amazing passer and a sick, sick percentage scorer. His overall field goal percentage tops 50% (as a guard!) His three-point percentage last year was right at 44%. His effective field goal percentage was 56.6% and his true field goal percentage was 61.5%. He's a 93%+ free throw shooter too. And all of those stats besides the charity tosses were actually down from the season prior. He's better in his impending dotage than most people can dream of in their prime.
However Nash is also used to playing a certain way. Obviously he flourished in Mike D'Antoni's system. Part of his fall-off last year can be attributed to playing a slower, more controlled game. He doesn't have to go 92 miles per minute to succeed though. But he is best when given the ball, freedom, the occasional screen, and guys who will fill the wings for him. None of those things are in long supply in the current Portland setup. Naturally Nash's appearance would change that setup almost immediately, but it would be hard to get the kind of game going that would allow Steve to be the guy we'd all wish for. Brandon Roy likes the halfcourt and likes the ball. Nate McMillan likes percentage offense. The Blazer forwards will run as will Rudy. Oden not so much. Nash might be able to make Greg look better in the pick-and-roll sets however. Would Nash be content with the 70-80% he could get out of his game here? Would the Blazers be content, particularly Roy and Oden? Would the adjustment go smoothly?
Nash doesn't solve Portland's backcourt defense issues. He also makes a near impenetrable roadblock for Jerryd Bayless if you swing that way. Andre Miller, by contrast, would take starter's minutes but you could see Bayless eating away at them if he played well. Nobody behind Nash is going to see more than 12-15 minutes as long as he's on the team.
Jason Kidd is a free agent who just finished making over $21 million last year. Like Nash he's probably looking for the combination of job security and the chance to get a ring. He'll turn 36 in the coming campaign.
Kidd is still a great assist man at almost 9 per game. He's a better rebounder than Nash, averaging 6.2 last year. After a few years of yuckiness and then some more of mediocrity he has boosted his three-point shooting to a nifty 40.6% average. His overall field goal percentage is 41.3%. His effective field goal percentage is 52.2%. His true field goal percentage is 55.0%. These aren't up to Nash's standards but they're not bad. Kidd would also fit more naturally into Portland's halfcourt offensive system. He doesn't need to score. He's made a living making other people look good. The flip side of that is that he was only good for 9 points per game last year, which is not exactly the boost the Blazers are looking for. Historically he's been a much better defender than Nash but he's no longer all-world in that category. At 6'4" and 205lbs he has great size. Kidd is no more back-up friendly than Nash. You get him at 36 and you're going to be playing him until he's 40.
The critical question for both of these players is how much benefit you'd reap compared to the cost. Nash is not coming cheap even if the Suns are motivated to let him go in favor of rebuilding. He's their franchise player. We mentioned Jerryd Bayless playing behind him above but it might not be an issue, as the Suns might want him in return. They'd certainly want Rudy. They'd probably ask for LaMarcus too at first. Maybe they could be talked around but you're still going to pay a premium. On the flip side there's no way Jason Kidd signs in Portland for a small contract. There are teams closer to a title than the Blazers are, which would be his main motivation for taking less money. If he's going to play for $5 million a year why wouldn't he just go to L.A. or Cleveland? The Blazers would have to come up with some kind of sign-and-trade deal with Dallas to make it work. In this case it's not that the Mavericks would be asking a ton, rather that the salary match would be tricky. The Blazers don't have a ton of expendable players who add up to double-digit contracts. They'd need to use their cap space to make this happen...likely all of it.
Which brings up perhaps the greatest rub in all of this: You might be able to envision the Blazers manufacturing one of these deals. But what other moves could they then make? You've more than used up the available cap space and players in trade. You have to ask yourself, as headline-grabbing as these moves would be are they enough alone to make all the difference the Blazers will need in the next couple years? Do they grease the wheels for the years to come? Unless you believe that one of these two players is guaranteed to be the piece that brings rings to Portland you have to be worried about the cost, both real and opportunity, of a move like this.
What's your take? Do either of these guys float your boat, knowing that they don't come cheap? How much of your inner awestruck fan do these names bring out and how much of your inner skeptic?
Comment below...in between your "I just saw Hedo Turkoglu and Andre Miller having lunch with K.P. on S.E. Hawthorne!" comments, that is.
--Dave (blazersub@yahoo.com)
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43 comments
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Comments
there’s no way Jason Kidd signs in Portland for a small contract. There are teams closer to a title than the Blazers are, which would be his main motivation for taking less money. If he’s going to play for $5 million a year why wouldn’t he just go to L.A. or Cleveland?
co-sign 100%. why i don’t think kidd is an option this summer.
by Ben. on Jul 1, 2009 1:36 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
If Trevor Ariza leaves the Los Angeles Lakers and Jason Kidd decides the Dallas Mavericks don't ...
have a serious chance at winning the 2010 NBA Championship, I could envision him signing a one-year contract at the mid-level exception with the defending champions. With Kidd in the Triangle, however, he’d play the 3 on offense and defend one of the team’s opposing wing players. Basically, Kidd would go from being a point guard to a point forward.
by AK1984 on Jul 1, 2009 2:18 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, cost probably too high to justify for the Blazers
Just not worh it for us in the real world. Sounds like Cuban is motivated to keep him, so, too much to play in that game. No reason to think Kidd has some special love for the Blazers that he would pay millions to play here. Going to have to use a bit more finesse that that to get our PG fix.
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/basketball/nba/07/01/mavs.kidd.ap/index.html
by Berkeley on Jul 2, 2009 12:41 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Kidd will be 37 in March
Jason Kidd is a free agent who just finished making over $21 million last year. Like Nash he’s probably looking for the combination of job security and the chance to get a ring. He’ll turn 36 in the coming campaign.
Not that ancient versus ancient makes much difference.
by as11osu on Jul 1, 2009 1:38 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I like Kidd, not Nash as much
Because Kidd fits our offense so much better and will be cheaper.
Hey, idea! Sign-and-trade for Kidd and Bass!
by austinpwnz on Jul 1, 2009 1:45 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I think the Blazer front office
is going in a different direction.
Sorry for all the hard work gone to waste. We appreciate the effort
that is all
by two4larue on Jul 1, 2009 1:47 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Eh
If I had a nickel for every comment people made speculating about things the Blazers were never going to do I could retire and get TominHawaii to rub my feet every afternoon.
—Dave
by Dave on Jul 1, 2009 1:56 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Or, if you were a clearer thinker...
you could get Mrs. inHawaii to rub your feet while TIH brought your drinks.
Mod. Moderate. Moderation. Moderator.
by -ken on Jul 1, 2009 4:08 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think I'm going to like you.
However I have an even better plan.
With all that money, Dave can bring my wife and I over as well. She’s a massage therapist, who loves babies. Dave’s wife could get daily massages and have someone help her with Baby PG. And like Tom’s wife, she’s Korean. Think Korean BBQ out on the lanai. I’ll volunteer to keep Dave’s glass full while Tom gives him foot rubs (I think I’d pay to see that.) And Tom and I can swap sea stories and talk about all the misguided Blazer fans who want to trade half the team away in search of a championship.
hakkaa päälle !
by timg56 on Jul 1, 2009 7:54 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
well, that's easy money
I could speculate that the Blazer’s management isn’t going to take a side trip on Paul Allen’s spaceship, this month
you see, you’re .05 richer
but thanks for keeping the blog running so the rest of us can come in here and grouse
by two4larue on Jul 1, 2009 8:43 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I could lose many words over this, but the gist is: Do not want either of them
Both flourish in faster styles. Kidd is not a significant defensive upgrade anymore (Barea guards quick players like TP in Dallas, and a slower Billups still made Kidd look silly in the playoffs), Nash never was (his defense last year was comical at times). Both cost a lot of money to acquire, Nash probably even one or two valuable young pieces in a trade. Both are not setting the Blazers up for an instant championship in their current state, much less for a long-term plan. And in terms of character-fit and scoring I would only like Nash who is the more expensive one. No to both.
by Norsktroll on Jul 1, 2009 1:54 AM PDT reply actions 3 recs
Excellent points
And, if you want to show trust and faith in your young team, you don’t bring in a player paid more than your own “stars”.
by kacee on Jul 1, 2009 6:40 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
rec'd for mind reading
How did you do that? What am I wearing?
by LaColin on Jul 1, 2009 8:40 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Tacos!!!
How did you know!!
"You're welcome friend
I love you."
- Tom "Dragline" inHawaii
by 92wastheyear on Jul 1, 2009 10:19 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
What would attract either of these to me
would not really be what they bring in terms of numbers but rather what they could offer in terms of mentorship to our younger players. Is that mentorship, however, worth the buku bucks that either of these two would demand? Or more importantly, will we even have many mentorable players left after the dust is settled and one of these two are on our team? Not worth it in my opinion.
Maybe basketball just isn't your game. I know, let's have a spelling contest.
by Sea Bass on Jul 1, 2009 1:57 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
What is the greater need
Question we have to look at what is the greater need for next season. Is it a PG, SF or backup PF? With how the free agency period has started looks like the Blazers think SF is a greater priority.
Without thinking numbers there is an intrigue on my part having Kidd or Nash in a Blazer uniform, both have their pros and cons with regard to what they could bring to the Blazers. Ultimately I would think that kidd would fit better in the current system. Nash probably likes to have the ball in his hands to much for Brandon to do what he does.
Taking numbers ie: salaries into account I don’t think either of these will be in a Blazer uniform, but will it be so bad if Blake and Jerryd are our PG’s come opening night? I think no if we have made the right moves in other areas.
by Bairdy on Jul 1, 2009 2:21 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Jason Kidd would be a huge boost
If he would sign for our cap money. He has never had the wide range of athletes so deep as the Blazers and he is the conductor who makes it all sweet music. As for sign and trade – no thanks.
by lee3022 on Jul 1, 2009 2:23 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Kidd has been my favorite non-Blazer player for many years
But I’m not sure that at this point in his career and with what we have to work with (cap and contracts/talent-wise) he’s the answer. I still think Devin Harris (is he really available or are we all collectively dreaming here?) or Captain Kirk are much more realistic and attractive options. And who’s to count out Patty Mills? I seem to remember another 2nd-round foreigner that a lot of people wrote off last year after the draft who ended up making somewhat of an impact on our squad: his name may or may not rhyme with “KABOOM!”
As for Nash, I just don’t think it’s a good fit, let alone what we would have to give up in trade to get him.
All that aside, though, I would have a hard time containing my inner fanboy/5 year-old squeals the first time I’d lay eyes on a black-and-red Kidd jersey in the store, if that deal happened. Just sayin’.
I wanna be Brandon Roy when I grow up!
by dagraffman on Jul 1, 2009 2:55 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
In response to your Devin Harris query:
We are all collectively dreaming here.
"I take the little gummy bear Flintstones vitamins…I try not to eat the lady. I try not to eat the man. Just give me the car. I try to find the car. Yea, worst case scenario, I eat the lady." - Ron Artest, 2009
by rivetz on Jul 1, 2009 8:08 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Too expensive/Old
Sorry, not needed right now. We aren’t that desperate to win a championship in under 2 years with OLD FART MERCENARIES?
I LOVE Portland for one reason more than anything:
A young NUCLEUS of talent that can win together for years. I hate desperation trades the likes of Boston have done and now it seems rather envogue.
B.S. Liberal Studies OSU '06
Trade for Gerald Wallace!!
by TyboOSU on Jul 1, 2009 3:16 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Desperation trades
That led to an NBA title? I don’t think it was desperation.
by GMan83201 on Jul 1, 2009 9:05 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
"He doesn't have to go 92 miles per minute to succeed though"
I love you too, Dave
"You're welcome friend
I love you."
- Tom "Dragline" inHawaii
by 92wastheyear on Jul 1, 2009 6:23 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I've a question for you, Dave
(and it’s probably the topic of a main-page post to come, so maybe you don’t want to answer it in detail now). But what DO you want the Blazers to do, then? You’re lukewarm on Turkoglu and Miller; you don’t see Kidd or Nash as viable options because of the real and opportunity costs affiliated with bringing them to Portland. That’s a very large segment of Blazers-related trade or FA banter that you’ve damned with faint praise.
Is it safe to assume you’re in the “Trav and Blake for Hinrich, sign Bass or one of his analogues” camp then?
The Michael Ruffin of BlazersEdge, cuz Amlmart said so.
by BlazersOrBust on Jul 1, 2009 7:09 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
i believe you are right
there always is talk of wasting money and talent to get kirk hinrich, which is a 2x as expensive version of steve blake. BOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!
by retirecards51 on Jul 1, 2009 10:00 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Small Moves
Rather have a 30 year-old Hedo than these sunset guys, as good as they were. But really why go for any high-priced older vet?Just don’t have the cap space for big deals. Blazers just need a proven distributing guard who can D and 3, and defer to Roy. Then a vet back-up PF that bangs inside. From all I’ve read, and not just from bloggers, there is a consensus on this. If 1-2 of the current SFs need to go, so be it. This not only fits the budget, but the needs. Keep some cap room for next year.
trust all is well
by retrofuture on Jul 1, 2009 8:00 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Jason Kidd AKA Wife Beater
Forget about Kidd, he has lost a lot of foot speed.
A poor shooting PG guard who turns it over and has lost his first step… Hmmmm, will want $15 million per year.
Look at what happened to Dallas when they traded their young guard for Kidd, they went backwards.
I don’t feel like watching some of those games Kidd posts where he slops around for 6-7 turnovers. Stay away from the aging expensive point guard with bad Knees.
"Oh yeah? You can Derelique my balls."
"I can Shavlick my own balls."
by Terry Gamble on Jul 1, 2009 8:01 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
mike bibby
The new GM of the Detroit Pistons
bayless leaves over my dead body
sign mike bibby
by thomasikehara on Jul 1, 2009 8:20 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Steve Nash!
I doubt we would be able to get him…but if PHX is going through with their fire sale, I suppose anything is possible. His shooting ability (and ability to make nifty pass plays) would be great in Portland, though his preference for a non-halfcourt offense and lack of defense would obviously be problematic. Of course, in terms of performance/value/economics, I still don’t see why I would want to replace Steve Blake with any of the PG’s mentioned here, other the the “name-brand” kind of excitement.
by jigglyai on Jul 1, 2009 8:58 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I like Kidd
I like Nash better, but I don’t see how we could get him as he’s not a free agent.
To me, finding a way to court Kidd (if we could get Hedo for $10 million, why couldn’t we get Kidd for that?) would mark an excellent offseason. He’s experienced, he’s saavy, he can shoot better now than any point in his career, and he’s got size for his position. I’m not starstruck by him, I just think he’d be a good fit.
Dave, I’m confused by this statement:
The flip side of that is that he was only good for 9 points per game last year, which is not exactly the boost the Blazers are looking for.
Why are we looking for an ppg boost from our point guard? Blake only averaged 2 more points per game last year and our offense was among the most efficient in the league. Besides, I’m betting we’ll get at least 2 extra ppg from our center position this year.
by MavetheGreat on Jul 1, 2009 9:01 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
We Can Sign Ben Gordon!
Although he is a SG he played PG all throughout college so him switching to fit the system probably wouldn’t be so difficult. Plus his better then kidd and miller.
by hotsauce710 on Jul 1, 2009 9:03 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Ben Gordon
General Ben may have played PG but if you watched any games at Uconnn all he did was shoot. He’s a good shooter.
Ben Gordon is a good basketball player but he’s not a PG, he’s an undersized SG.
"Oh yeah? You can Derelique my balls."
"I can Shavlick my own balls."
by Terry Gamble on Jul 1, 2009 9:45 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ben Gordon played shooting guard for the UConn Huskies.
While Gordon was there, Taliek Brown was the starting point guard.
by AK1984 on Jul 1, 2009 11:37 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Detroit has locked up Gordon
So he’s off the market now regardless.
I wanna be Brandon Roy when I grow up!
by dagraffman on Jul 1, 2009 11:01 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Jasod Kidd for SS
Isn’t this guy eligible for Social Security, Just Kidding. I love Jason Kidd, But man he is getting up there in age. I have always wanted Kidd to be a Blazer, But now I’m not so sure. Will he really help us that much. The Teaching would be nice for Bayless and the Veteran Leadership is invaluable to a young squad. But the actual production on the court is somewhat questionable.
Like I said I love Kidd, But the money he will want for what he has left in the tank. Makes it tough for me to support it. If we can get him for cheap then great, But don’t waste money on something that aint there.
" When All else fails, Quit using all else "
by irishnick1980 on Jul 1, 2009 9:14 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
sign kidd to 2 or 3-yr contract
That way, as he declines, Bayless will be able to step in. We need a pg mentor for Bayless (if he’s our future) as much as we need short-term improvement (better defense, more assists) at the pg.
Kidd would be a great mentor for both Bayless and Mills (who I think has strong potential as a chaos-guard, a la Brooks in Houston).
by Jackalope 66 on Jul 1, 2009 9:49 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I can see that
But is bayless really going to be a fulltime PG or more a combo guard. Jerryd is going to have to work his tail off to get better at dribbling and shotting. As we have seen with his Work Ethic that shouldn’t be a problem. J-kidd would be great for Bayless, But How much money will get him here.
" When All else fails, Quit using all else "
by irishnick1980 on Jul 1, 2009 11:39 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
what, no poll?
Come on….
I have my P.h.D in unreliable hyperbole.
by Eat Politicians on Jul 1, 2009 5:29 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Regardless, we don't need either player
Kidd and Nash are good players, great in their heyday, but not what we are looking for. It’s more of a Whittsit move than a KP move. I think Claver will get moved in a deal to bring Hinrich to Portland…Hedo (hopefully) is just a smokescreen. I guess that move depends on where Martell is in his recovery (meaning is he ever going to recover)… If so, no need for Hedo, no desire to upset Rudy…we get Hinrich, possibly deal off Blake and away we go!
I have my P.h.D in unreliable hyperbole.
by Eat Politicians on Jul 1, 2009 5:37 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

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