Ken Berger: Blazers Making "Strong Push" For Hedo
by Ben Golliver on Jun 30, 2009 10:49 PM PDT
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PrintFrom Ken Berger at CBSSports.com.
Determined to make the first splash of the NBA's free-agent negotiating period early Wednesday, the Portland Trail Blazers are making a strong push to sign Hedo Turkoglu, the prized free agent of the summer.
While negotiations across the league were in the early stages, a person with knowledge of the discussions said the Blazers are trying to lure Turkoglu with a deal in the $50-million range. Contracts cannot be signed until July 7, when the annual moratorium on signing and trading players is lifted.
Going solely off tonight's reports, it appears two of the brightest GMs in the league -- Daryl Morey and Kevin Pritchard -- have slightly different plans for the 2009 Free Agency period. While Morey has taken the novel approach of setting up a free gmail account to lure a potential free agent, Pritchard appears to be taking the tried and true route of ....... overpaying by 20%.
Only kidding. Still a long way to go.
Update (11:06PM): Jason Quick writes...
The Trail Blazers' summer agenda was revealed late Tuesday night at the minute the free agent market opened. That's when general manager Kevin Pritchard and assistant general manager Tom Penn called agent Lon Babby to begin the courtship of small forward Hedo Turkoglu.
"Kevin Pritchard and Tom Penn called me at the earliest possible moment and expressed enthusiasm for engaging in discussions about Hedo becoming a Trail Blazer," Babby said late Tuesday night. "We have begun that process."
As if there was any doubt before, now we know who Berger's source was.
Here's Mike Barrett's pre-emptive strike against agent-created hysteria.
Going off simply what I've heard from league sources (and from no one on our executive team, I assure you), it sounds like catch o' the day for the Blazers will be Hedo Turkoglu. This isn't news to you, I realize. And, we're about to find out if all we've heard has been even the least bit accurate.
When it comes to trade rumors, or rumors of a big signing in the NBA, it's often true, where there's smoke there's usually fire. But, this isn't always the case. Again, the agents have PR machines at their finger tips, and they've become masters at selling high. In short, the illusion they create often becomes real.
This is truly Contract Negotiation 2.0 we are witnessing.
Update (11:36 PM):
Bill Ingram from HoopsWorld.com writes about Dwight Howard's take on Hedo.
Magic center Dwight Howard put in his two cents on ESPN Radio in Orlando today.
"I really would love for Hedo to stay, I really do. I believe that we can believe a championship. We came so close and we're right here. I really want Hedo to stay. He's been a big part in my development as a player and I hope he stays around. I think that lineup would be great...Hopefully he stays around. He's been here since I've been here so it's a little bit of a sad day because you're losing so many people that you basically grew up with, that's how I look at it. Since I've played, I've grown up since I was 18 until now and seeing some of those guys leave, it hurts."
Update (11:47PM):
Brother Wendell Maxey from HoopsWorld.com weighs in.
Portland needs to solve their point guard dilemma. Portland needs to address how they are going to cope at power forward when Aldridge isn't on the floor. Portland needs veterans sprinkled about the other open roster spots. When the salary cap number is announced next week and General Manager Kevin Pritchard knows exactly (estimated at $8 million under the cap) what the organization can spend the need even then is to spend wisely.
Even if Portland wants Hedo, they don't necessarily need him.
More Brother Wendell Maxey on BeyondTheBeat.Net.
I'm hearing - regardless what occurs this offseason in free agency or trades - it's now about survival of the fittest for the Blazers. Portland is moving on from the rebuilding project from a couple seasons back and it's now time to separate the boys from the men.
So look for the Blazers to, "go after the best out there and let them fight it out" as one person in the know told me recently.
UPDATE (11:59PM):
Twitter reaction to this evening's news is out of control. [Follow BE on Twitter here] Here's a sampling:
@calebteaches: Hedo makes our logjam at the 3 worse and doesn't solve the 1 or 4. In KP we trust, I guess. He's a nice piece, but... eh.
@sit2988: KP's my boy and all but I'm saying... If Turk gets longer than a 3-year deal I'm just not sure if I'm feelin it.
@Rochi516: Portland will be a force if Hedo comes. Then Andre Miller will follow. Watch out for Portland in the west.
@wastro: Assuming PDX signs Hedo ... more small forwards in '09-10 - ATL or PDX?
@Sabonis4Ever: It will be worth signing hedo if we win game 7 of the finals on a bank shot 3.
@stevesandberg Is John Nash giving away free money again? SandbergOnSports.com
@pdxxxchange: Hedo=big matchup problems for all teams. match-up probs=rings... Ask Houston Dallas or Orlando.... they all went to the 2nd rnd
@adanies: 3x30 or 4x40 is cool with me. 5x50 screams albatross. Don't like the sound of "Hedo Turkoglu's Expiring Contract."
@dhawes: it's better to overpay than to do nothing
@clipperblog: Thoughts on Hedo: Will allow Nate the flexibility to do a lot of cool stuff. 4 guys who can handle the ball, each with a different look. (The esteemed Kevin Arnovitz of TrueHoop and Clipper Blog fame)
@thanathz: Hedo to Blazers, great news. Be a great association w/Roy. What about Webster and Outlaw ? Batum as a nice place as back-up
@benias: not a big fan of wasting all this cap space on him. I would rather have Lamar odom. Let's go D.Harris!
@teemunny: Hedo Turkoglu for $50 million?! Don't do it, Portland, it's not worth it.
@allthatamar: hedo on portland makes portland that much better -- but what will the fate of outlaw, rudy et al. be? only so much PT @ sg/sf All That Jazz.com
@kevinjbonn: I sure prefer Hedo over Miller.
@martinrickman: takes some of the heat off the young guns, will in turn make them better and more productive.
@talkhoops: Hedo's potential arrival in Portland isn't what will put them over the top. But with him and the progression of Brandon Roy...Greg Oden, and LaMarcus Aldridge this Blazers team all of a sudden becomes too dangerous for their own good. TalkHoops.Net
@cave17matt: Not in favor of it myself, rather go for Devin Harris and/or a backup 4. Cave17.com
@jrledoux: Don't think Blazer's fans will be able to stomach Hedo for $50 mil... Will take a lot to not see it as a Whitsit move.
@scooterhd2: funny how quick Quick shows up
@northwestjeff: if kidd can play til he's 34, why can't Turkoglu? value goes down with bigger contract, but he's a solid player
@philthyanimal: i like hedo as a player, but i can't picture him fitting in our system unless we adapt. hes great but is he the mising piece?
@justin_pdx: Berger hasn't broken a story in years. Turk's agent's been whispering $50M to lazy reporters for weeks. Smokescreen.
@ezra_ace: for $50 mil they better throw in Dwight Howard and a slightly used Lil Penny shirt.
-- Ben (benjamin.golliver@gmail.com)
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need another option: "God I hope so"
How did you guys win that?
"We scored enough points. We scored 107, they scored 105.
-Nate McMillan Postgame, 3/4/2009
by douglast on Jun 30, 2009 10:50 PM PDT reply actions 12 recs
Kitty Agrees with your considered opinion
Honor Alaa Abdelnaby.
First in the NBA. At least alphabetically
Offering Hedo $50 million when we're bidding against ourselves is TERRIBLE
There’s no way KP could manage to screw up that bad, is there?
by JordanLeDoux on Jun 30, 2009 10:51 PM PDT reply actions 2 recs
then tell me
who else is willing to pay Hedo 50 mil?
not Detroit, OKC or Memphis
sounds a heckuva lot like Paul Allen “bidding against himself” for Darius
Detroit could offer him big money
If they lose out on Gordan and Charlie V. I keep hearing Toronto as well. Also, NO ONE was interested in Darius. Plus Hedo can ball.
by blazer23-83 on Jun 30, 2009 11:57 PM PDT up reply actions
We already have players who can ball
and they are younger and cheaper. Hedo doesn’t play better D and he isn’t in a position that we need help at.
by KitIsh on Jul 1, 2009 12:08 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
completely fair comparison
reminds me of giving Zach way too much money a year too early.
I sure as heck hope this is a smokescreen. I can’t believe HT is that good for the team. PG is by far a bigger issue than SF, especially signing one that guards worse than TO.
put a body on 'em
Crushed my beautiful team in one fail swoop....
emphasis on beautiful part. uhhhhggghghh shudder…. who’s uglier, hedo or ha?
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
"New Man Law: If you don't show up for the draft you don't get to come later if you're picked. If you believe in yourself, show up and sit there. If nobody else believes in you, take it and cry like a man...in front of the cameras."
-Dave
Hahahahaaahahaa! Good one!
"Aneurysm".
When Outlaw wins a game on a last-second shot, it’s called an "annthefaneurysm". QualityPie
Long hair doesn't work wonders for everyone.
The best example of that was Chris “Hollywood” Kaman.
by AK1984 on Jul 1, 2009 12:53 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Ha with a Mullet
would melt mirrors
Come on you gotta listen unto me,
lay off that whiskey and let that cocaine be. ~Johnny Cash
The thought of Hedo @ 5x50 make me nauseated.
is there a : blazerfansdontwantkptooverpayforhedo@gmail.com ??? This deal would just scream of “big man on campus” syndrome – I’m going to make the deal because I can. I seriously hope KP doesn’t throw something like 5×50 out there to a 30yr old with declining production . Oh man, the more I think about it , the more freaked out I’m getting.
KP – It’s all Finals Hype!!!!!
if we use all our space for Hedo
I don’t like it at all, but I’ll give KP and team the next few weeks to show me what the follow up moves are. Because as illustrated in my post earlier today, this leaves a total logjam at the wing positions. 2 of rudy, batum outlaw, and martell have to be shipped out, with the assumption being a PG will be coming back
How did you guys win that?
"We scored enough points. We scored 107, they scored 105.
-Nate McMillan Postgame, 3/4/2009
total logjam at the wing positions. 2 of rudy, batum outlaw, and martell have to be shipped out
and it won’t be Martell, unless some other GM really owes KP a favor
With all of the cap-space gone, what kind of PG could you get for Travis, Blake and Rudy?
4,000,000
3,600,000
1,165,320
8,765,320
That’s pretty close to “Devin Harris territory” 8,400,000
by two4larue on Jun 30, 2009 10:57 PM PDT up reply actions 2 recs
CAN hedo play the 4... anything remotely close to what frye did?
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
"New Man Law: If you don't show up for the draft you don't get to come later if you're picked. If you believe in yourself, show up and sit there. If nobody else believes in you, take it and cry like a man...in front of the cameras."
-Dave
that's the sad part
Turk will play the 4 exactly like Frye did. He’ll just play more minutes than Channing ever dreamed
Hedo can't play the 4.
I'm the other guy at Third Quarter Collapse, with a Twitter account.
"Never hate your enemies. It affects your judgement." - Michael Corleone
Hedo will eat up most of the backup 4 minutes (about 14 per game)
for 2 reasons:
1) we have no other backup 4
2) we have to make 30 minutes of time at the 3 available for whichever two are left from Rudy, Travis, Batum, and Webster
How did you guys win that?
"We scored enough points. We scored 107, they scored 105.
-Nate McMillan Postgame, 3/4/2009
we drafted some back-ups
"Fernandez, to my eyes, is the Blazer who walks that walk most comfortably. A lot of Portland's fans (egged on, dare I say, by their local broadcasters) lament things like how Ron Artest or Yao Ming get to hit Brandon Roy's arms.
But I suspect Fernandez sees all that and thinks: We get to hit arms! Cool!"
http://myespn.go.com/blogs/truehoop/0-39-135/On-Playoff-Experience.html
who will sit the bench this year and suit up for practice
How did you guys win that?
"We scored enough points. We scored 107, they scored 105.
-Nate McMillan Postgame, 3/4/2009
Who started at the four for the Magic???
It was either Hedo or Lewis. Channing had no offensive skill but shooting stand still jumpers. Hedo is like Travis with handles.
by blazer23-83 on Jun 30, 2009 11:59 PM PDT up reply actions
How?
In a time machine? Do you have the game tapes?
by Nick Van Excellent on Jul 1, 2009 12:11 AM PDT up reply actions
I think the goal would to play Hedo at PF during short stretches when LA is not on the floor
There will be lineups where Hedo goes to 4 and batum comes in at 3.
Small ball is played with faster small players
Hedo doesn’t have the wheels to be a good small ball player with LMA
Devin Harris would cure all my pain.
They could sign Drew Gooden and Shaq to fifty year contracts and I wouldn’t care.
Plus, if they sign Hedu don’t they pretty much have to bring in a defensive minded PG?
by Nick Van Excellent on Jun 30, 2009 11:09 PM PDT up reply actions
This is exacty what I was thinking
Would love this move if you could keep Hedo under a 4 year contract (3×30)
If this contract is over 30 million
KP has lost his grace period with me.
by diskord on Jun 30, 2009 10:52 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
I would wait KP should be judged at End of Seasons and our number of wins.
Also how well we played in the playoffs.
"Knowledge will get you from A to B. Creativity will get you anywhere." Einstein
by Garden of ODEN on Jun 30, 2009 11:38 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
I'll give him a month
after this move goes down IF it goes down.
I’ll re-evaluate at the end of the year, but I’ll definitely judge a month after the move.
I remember when people were worried and excited that the blazers snagged Francis and my thought was that there was no way this guy would see the floor as a blazer. A week or so later he was gone.
"Fernandez, to my eyes, is the Blazer who walks that walk most comfortably. A lot of Portland's fans (egged on, dare I say, by their local broadcasters) lament things like how Ron Artest or Yao Ming get to hit Brandon Roy's arms.
But I suspect Fernandez sees all that and thinks: We get to hit arms! Cool!"
http://myespn.go.com/blogs/truehoop/0-39-135/On-Playoff-Experience.html
wait then
What the rush
"Knowledge will get you from A to B. Creativity will get you anywhere." Einstein
by Garden of ODEN on Jul 1, 2009 12:12 AM PDT up reply actions
ESPN, Hoopsworld, and CBSsports are all reporting this
I think the agent is the source. They are lying or telling the truth. Geez…agents are known to tell the truth right?
There is no way KP is offering $50 million to Hedo.
"I'm at the thingamajig talking the yakety-yak" - Kenny Smith
by blzrfan on Jun 30, 2009 10:52 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
i'm torn
i like turk. good player, great abilities, but it’s just a different system here. do we think his skills translate to our pace? if the honchos think so, i am for it. still want hinrich, is this possible with 50 million to turkoglu?
kiss Kirk goodbye
Sounds like Dumars wants Ben Gordon. Hinrich will be off the table if that happens
So…is everybody still glad that KP didn’t pull the trigger at the deadline, now?
its a wash really
so instead of hedo we would have Carter or Jefferson and not have Batum? not much difference really
How did you guys win that?
"We scored enough points. We scored 107, they scored 105.
-Nate McMillan Postgame, 3/4/2009
actually there is much difference
at least we still have batum
How did you guys win that?
"We scored enough points. We scored 107, they scored 105.
-Nate McMillan Postgame, 3/4/2009
glad?
I’m indifferent. I’m not a person who feels a pressing need because the team is still growing by ten wins a season. Doing nothing will still likely net us another 10 wins with just webster and Oden being healthy and a little clearing up of the SF position.
"Fernandez, to my eyes, is the Blazer who walks that walk most comfortably. A lot of Portland's fans (egged on, dare I say, by their local broadcasters) lament things like how Ron Artest or Yao Ming get to hit Brandon Roy's arms.
But I suspect Fernandez sees all that and thinks: We get to hit arms! Cool!"
http://myespn.go.com/blogs/truehoop/0-39-135/On-Playoff-Experience.html
unless we are about to say goodbye to rudy, travis or martell
by Tyler Durrden on Jun 30, 2009 10:55 PM PDT up reply actions
Bye to Travis or Martell, maybe blake to get hinrich
If this is true, that is what I would do. Get Hedo, then trade travis and/or blake for hinrich
Every time Outlaw fades away in a shot, a kitten dies. Save the Kittens, don't fade!
Travis yes
Martell hasn’t fully recovered from a broken foot, and has 4 years remaining on his contract
what other GM will agree to take on that risk?
Rudy or Batum are in jeopardy when Turk signs
Not buying this in any form
Smoke and sensationalism = ESPN. Perhaps correct that the agent is the one smoking,
I think the agent is starting rumors.
Driving up Hedo’s asking price. Don’t buy this at all.
"I'm at the thingamajig talking the yakety-yak" - Kenny Smith
who else is in the running?
Detroit is interested in Grodon and Charlie V
KP and Hedo are like the last boy and girl standing along the side at their first freshman dance
ESPN. CBS Sportsline. SI.com etc
could all be his agent though.
If we get Hedo
I will be very disappointed.
If we have to pay 50 million to get him, I will be supremely mortified.
All aboard the Kirkwagon!
the reason that it isn’t real is that we can’t offer him ten million a year. We don’t have the cap space.
We can start him at $8 million and offer max raises. And get to $50 million that way...
by JordanLeDoux on Jun 30, 2009 10:58 PM PDT up reply actions
I can’t see the Blazers giving max raises to an old Hedo. That’s usually for young guys.
by Cablinasian on Jun 30, 2009 10:59 PM PDT up reply actions
It's plausible if the contract comes with maximum yearly raises.
But I think this rumor is flat out untrue.
"I'm at the thingamajig talking the yakety-yak" - Kenny Smith
A five-year, $49,880,000 contract for Hedo Turkoglu could look like the following proposal.
2009-2010: $8,600,000
2010-2011: $9,288,000
2011-2012: $9,976,000
2012-2013: $10,664,000
2013-2014: $11,352,000
Wow, I about vomited on my keyboard looking at that sick amount of money that may go to Hedo Turkoglu.
8.6 to start
means we are dumping a Eurostash (koponen most likely) – assuming the 57.3 estimated cap is close to accurate
How did you guys win that?
"We scored enough points. We scored 107, they scored 105.
-Nate McMillan Postgame, 3/4/2009
isn't the deals average what you would be working with
About 10 million off our Cap? to make the deal in the first place?
"Knowledge will get you from A to B. Creativity will get you anywhere." Einstein
by Garden of ODEN on Jun 30, 2009 11:43 PM PDT up reply actions
All right, let's look at my earlier calculations and see how this would theoretically work here.
After the July moratorium, though, the Trail Blazers will […] clean house a bit by renouncing some cap holds and exceptions to get under the cap. So, in all likelihood, this is what the books will look like come 7/8/2009.
ACTIVE ROSTER
Joel Przybilla ($6,857,725)
LaMarcus Aldridge ($5,844,827)
Greg Oden ($5,361,240)
Martell Webster ($4,319,654)
Steve Blake ($4,000,000)
Brandon Roy ($3,910,816)
Travis Outlaw ($3,600,000)
Jerryd Bayless ($2,413,080)
Rudy Fernandez ($1,165,320)
Nicolas Batum ($1,118,760)
RELEASED
Darius Miles ($9,000,000)
CAP HOLDS
Victor Claver ($1,012,900) {22nd Pick @ Rookie Scale}
Joel Freeland ($824,200) {30th Pick @ Rookie Scale}
Petteri Koponen ($824,200) {30th Pick @ Rookie Scale}
Jeff Pendergraph ($0) {Second-Round Pick}
Dante Cunningham ($0) {Second-Round Pick}
Patty Mills ($0) {Second-Round Pick}
TOTAL
$49,982,722
Assuming the salary cap for next season is $57,300,000, the team could renounce the draft rights of both Joel Freeland and Petteri Koponen to get far enough under the cap to sign Hedo Turkoglu to a five-year, $50 million contract with a starting salary of $8.75 million and can include maximum annual raises of 8% (i.e., $700,000).
2009-2010: $8,750,000
2010-2011: $9,400,000
2011-2012: $10,000,000
2012-2013: $10,600,000
2013-2014: $11,250,000
If that happens in some way, shape, or form, then the Portland Trail Blazers front office will receive a F grade this off-season.
by AK1984 on Jun 30, 2009 11:52 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Couldn't we start
Using some letters lower down than F?
Just to show commensurate displeasure?
by TheThinWhiteDuke on Jul 1, 2009 8:21 AM PDT up reply actions
If KP wants us to believe that Turkglu is the best FA then I will play along
KP has not refuted the agents claim, so until then we all need to play along with the plan KP has what ever it may be. Get Detroit to over pay Turkuglu so they don’t acquire Gordan so we can get Hinrich cheaper. or what ever the "real" plan is.
"Knowledge will get you from A to B. Creativity will get you anywhere." Einstein
by Garden of ODEN on Jul 1, 2009 12:18 AM PDT up reply actions
I laugh whenever I see Magic fans defending this.
They say its fine because of how well he played. What they forget is that he would play just as good if they signed him for less.
In a couple of years
Howard + Lewis = $40 million.
They are screwed.
"I'm at the thingamajig talking the yakety-yak" - Kenny Smith
That's true, but most teams screw themselves to get to the Finals
That’s why they eventually have to blow it up.
The Blazers’ executive team is playing this very, very close to the vest, and all we’re left with are rumors and the usual sell jobs by agents.
by Cablinasian on Jun 30, 2009 11:00 PM PDT reply actions 3 recs
he also says we made an offer to SOMEONE at 9pm
by prezofdeath on Jun 30, 2009 11:02 PM PDT up reply actions
I'm positive its Brandon Roy
The easiest decision for KP to make and get it out of the way.
"I'm at the thingamajig talking the yakety-yak" - Kenny Smith
Roy takes the minimum for a one-year deal
Take one for the team baby
Honor Alaa Abdelnaby.
First in the NBA. At least alphabetically
I thought that Barrett was a big fan of getting Turk?
sounds like Mike is “backing away” from the Blazer’s GM after hearing this news
(can’t say that I blame him)
What is KP THINKING?
Hedo is not a good fit at all.
File this post under "FML"
thanks
s
The Princess of Blazersedge
by BlazerFan1 on Jun 30, 2009 11:01 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
family medical leave?
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
"New Man Law: If you don't show up for the draft you don't get to come later if you're picked. If you believe in yourself, show up and sit there. If nobody else believes in you, take it and cry like a man...in front of the cameras."
-Dave
exactly i'll need
that after i suffer a stroke from the stress of STUPID FREE AGENCY RUMORS
S
The Princess of Blazersedge
by BlazerFan1 on Jun 30, 2009 11:04 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
if the season starts with us on the hook for 50 mill and hedo starting
then you can say that.
and i’ll be saying it with you hahaha
by prezofdeath on Jun 30, 2009 11:02 PM PDT up reply actions
Don't even joke about that!
Llamas with single riders are dangerous enough.
Haven’t you seen “An Inconvenient Truth”? Yeah, neither have I, but I’m sure it’s about Llamas.
by TheThinWhiteDuke on Jul 1, 2009 8:24 AM PDT up reply actions
Hedo is awesome...didn't you see that bank shot against us?
according to my sources…KP was so pissed after that game, that he told Hedo if he makes it again post game, he signed him for $50 mil.
Go Blazers!!!!!!!!!! Wooooooooooot Wooooooooooooot!!!!!!!!!
if he wears the red and black, you know you will be dropping batman for the turkey's messy look
Go Blazers!!!!!!!!!! Wooooooooooot Wooooooooooooot!!!!!!!!!
Turkoglu will make me glad that I’ll be watching via NBALP stream.
by Cablinasian on Jun 30, 2009 11:07 PM PDT up reply actions
Hedo is the Michael Jordan of Turkey
$50 million is worth all the jerseys sold in Turkey. LOL.
"I'm at the thingamajig talking the yakety-yak" - Kenny Smith
The people who can afford NBA jerseys and are Turkish live mostly in the cities on the coast and abroad :)
Lots of Hedo jerseys in Germany then.
You have to see the brilliance of a Hedo on point forward in a starting lineup with Roy and Rudy
(We forget for a minute that this lineup plays next to no defense)
Joel would have about fifteen blocks and ten fouls.
by Cablinasian on Jun 30, 2009 11:04 PM PDT up reply actions
not likely
our stupid home statistician is the stingiest awarder of blocks in the league
How did you guys win that?
"We scored enough points. We scored 107, they scored 105.
-Nate McMillan Postgame, 3/4/2009
Hedo plays the point and Oden the 2
Roy mans the lane to emphasize his mammoth blocking skills and never gets called for blocking fouls
Honor Alaa Abdelnaby.
First in the NBA. At least alphabetically
ugh no no no no no no
this does not smell like a pritchard move!!! anyone think this reeks of paul allen going gagga for a player and overpaying? a la ZBO and D.miles? This is not a mcmillan or pritch deal its all allen all the way
by HurricaneDayne on Jun 30, 2009 11:02 PM PDT reply actions
it's cow pee in a pot is what it is... read untrue.
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
"New Man Law: If you don't show up for the draft you don't get to come later if you're picked. If you believe in yourself, show up and sit there. If nobody else believes in you, take it and cry like a man...in front of the cameras."
-Dave
plus if this is a 50 mil at 5 years thats 10 per year correct?
we only have 7-8 in cap space and 4 other roster spots to fill do we already have a trade lined up?
by HurricaneDayne on Jun 30, 2009 11:06 PM PDT up reply actions
This rumor is so hard to believe that I am tempted to pull "a fatty"
I’d just like to be able to put something on it being false.
I promise to ban myself for five minutes.
by Cablinasian on Jun 30, 2009 11:03 PM PDT up reply actions
ben is far cooler than u or i will ever b
lol i have 2 read his twitter 2 make sure i am up on all the cool kids lingo (wink wink)
s
The Princess of Blazersedge
I was thinking at least a week
But only if there was something to be gained if turned out to be false.
if this is true, Hedo is gonna rock for us....NBA Finals 2010
you guys are soooo dramatic
cheer up buttercups
Go Blazers!!!!!!!!!! Wooooooooooot Wooooooooooooot!!!!!!!!!
by broyposse on Jun 30, 2009 11:05 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
If Hinrich becomes a Blazer, this place will explode.
"I'm at the thingamajig talking the yakety-yak" - Kenny Smith
nah. I think most of the Hinrich people, like myself, view him as a good, not great option.
by Cablinasian on Jun 30, 2009 11:08 PM PDT up reply actions
Then I recommend
reading BE on a laptop in the bathtub.
Much easier to clean.
Honor Alaa Abdelnaby.
First in the NBA. At least alphabetically
yep, make sure it's nice and plugged in
makes for an exciting bath
Come on you gotta listen unto me,
lay off that whiskey and let that cocaine be. ~Johnny Cash
I usually do this
while waiting for my bagels to finish toasting there on the ledge of the tub.
Come on you gotta listen unto me,
lay off that whiskey and let that cocaine be. ~Johnny Cash
I agree
But 50 million is ridiculously large for Hedo. We need a point guard
Every time Outlaw fades away in a shot, a kitten dies. Save the Kittens, don't fade!
That's the only way this makes sense.
You would basically be replacing Rudy and Outlaw with an equal or greater offensive talent in Turk without losing anything on defense. Then you replace Blake with a legit all-star PG.
Turk+Harris>>>>>>Rudy, Outlaw, Blake
by Nick Van Excellent on Jul 1, 2009 12:15 AM PDT up reply actions
If Rudy goes it'll essentially be the end of good times for the Blazers
He’s a superior offensive player to Hedo right this second, and is 6 years younger. Why on earth are you trying to replace Rudy with an inferior wing player for 9-10 million dollars a season? It’s baffling.
?
replacing Rudy with Hedo alone would be amazingly stupid, and I’m anti-Hedo but I’m hard pressed to imagine a lineup of Harris, Roy, Hedo, Aldridge, Oden with Przy, Batum, et al off the bench wouldn’t provide for some good times.
but
you’re doing that to a 50+ win team and changing out two starters. To me, that’s drastic and it means that once AGAIN we’ll have a new team and a new learning cure because those new players will take up significant minutes. I’m tired of starting off the season crappy because the team needs to learn each other.
Additionally, Harris could be nice, but the loss of Rudy is not a positive for me. He brings off the ball movement… something the blazers still need to seriously work on. Batum looks to be an enormous defensive talent. I’m not interested in mixing up the 50+ win team (that was without a healthy mobile oden) if I have to give up Rudy or Batum.
"Fernandez, to my eyes, is the Blazer who walks that walk most comfortably. A lot of Portland's fans (egged on, dare I say, by their local broadcasters) lament things like how Ron Artest or Yao Ming get to hit Brandon Roy's arms.
But I suspect Fernandez sees all that and thinks: We get to hit arms! Cool!"
http://myespn.go.com/blogs/truehoop/0-39-135/On-Playoff-Experience.html
well, I'm not trying to shove Rudy out the door, but
but I think 5 will be a crowd at the wing positions
And Rudy would still be our 2nd best wing
by as11osu on Jul 1, 2009 12:30 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
ditto
rudy is younger and brings us a lot of the same things hedo brings and is often more efficient at doing so.
no hedo is ugly.
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
"New Man Law: If you don't show up for the draft you don't get to come later if you're picked. If you believe in yourself, show up and sit there. If nobody else believes in you, take it and cry like a man...in front of the cameras."
-Dave
hahaha if I ever come up with a comment
half as good as Dave’s in the open chat thread, I’ll consider my life a win.
by prezofdeath on Jun 30, 2009 11:14 PM PDT up reply actions
50 more minutes and it's a new day!!!
or 50 more minutes and 50 more million and it’s a new day fo’ sho
Go Blazers!!!!!!!!!! Wooooooooooot Wooooooooooooot!!!!!!!!!
yeah but he said greg wouldn't be there either.... pft...
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
"New Man Law: If you don't show up for the draft you don't get to come later if you're picked. If you believe in yourself, show up and sit there. If nobody else believes in you, take it and cry like a man...in front of the cameras."
-Dave
and never is heard, a discouraging word
If this is true, the dam is going to burst on KP
unless he can flip Outlaw, Blake and Rudy for…Devin Harris
(then all will be forgiven!)
the dream scenario
I might pee my pants if that trade went through.
I’ve thought since Roy year: 1 that Devin Harris would be Roy’s perfect counterpart (aside from CP3 of course).
We need to thin out our rotation. I have a hard time seeing Martell gone, injury status aside I think the team likes him. Batum isn’t going anywhere either. Travis and maybe even Rudy could be, maybe will be gone.
"Male sperm swim harder than female sperm."
this would totally rock
at which point, after ripping KP a new one for the next 8 days, we would all owe him a royally huge apology. if he gets us into next season with the following lineup, he is the God of GMs:
PG harris/bayless
SG roy/bayless/martell
SF hedo/batum/martell
PF lma/hedo/pend
C Greg/Joel
How did you guys win that?
"We scored enough points. We scored 107, they scored 105.
-Nate McMillan Postgame, 3/4/2009
more than likely in a Harris deal
you’d see something like:
Bayless, Rudy, Claver, Outlaw, Blake for Harris and Simmons
She Hate Me
"oh I served BRP all right
drained J-Kiddesque running floaters over him all night long last time we balled" - prezofdeath
lol
Harris/Mills(?)
Roy/Webs
[Sign Ariza]/Batum
LMA/Pendergraph
Oden/Joel
She Hate Me
"oh I served BRP all right
drained J-Kiddesque running floaters over him all night long last time we balled" - prezofdeath
this doesnt even come close to working
we cant take back simmons after we sign hedo – we will be way short of capspace.
as for the rest – works for me!
How did you guys win that?
"We scored enough points. We scored 107, they scored 105.
-Nate McMillan Postgame, 3/4/2009
forget hedo lol
She Hate Me
"oh I served BRP all right
drained J-Kiddesque running floaters over him all night long last time we balled" - prezofdeath
How bout
Turkyglue + Blake + Outlaw= Harris + cap killer guy
"Knowledge will get you from A to B. Creativity will get you anywhere." Einstein
by Garden of ODEN on Jul 1, 2009 12:02 AM PDT up reply actions
Well patience then
"Knowledge will get you from A to B. Creativity will get you anywhere." Einstein
by Garden of ODEN on Jul 1, 2009 1:36 AM PDT up reply actions
There is a live update page on Hoopsworld that does not include this story
So you might want to keep this page open tonight.
HEY
You read about the Jason Kidd scenarios there? LETS GET HIM!!!!!!!!
Every time Outlaw fades away in a shot, a kitten dies. Save the Kittens, don't fade!
maybe that's how KP is setting us up?
we’ll practically come crawling on our knees through broken glass to embrace JKidd
after hearing about the Hedo smokescreen
smoke screen not for others
but so the blazer fans can swallow a kidd deal…
too funny.
I don’t like Nash, kid for reasonable i like even though he’s no where near his prime.
"Fernandez, to my eyes, is the Blazer who walks that walk most comfortably. A lot of Portland's fans (egged on, dare I say, by their local broadcasters) lament things like how Ron Artest or Yao Ming get to hit Brandon Roy's arms.
But I suspect Fernandez sees all that and thinks: We get to hit arms! Cool!"
http://myespn.go.com/blogs/truehoop/0-39-135/On-Playoff-Experience.html
I took offense that 20% crack against Pritch, please be more civil to the minority opinion
Just kidding.
I don’t think there’s any way we pay 50 mil.
ESPN just had a report making the point that he won’t get close to that from anyone, but that the Blazers are in hot pursuit.
There’s no competition for Turk. But as you know, I think he’d be great for us.
Get used to it y’all. it may happen. And it may the best thing possible.
if they still lust after Steve Blake
then yeah Hedo , hee dew, is the next best bet.
The money is what has me screaming
S
The Princess of Blazersedge
man makes the money, money don't make the man
Go Blazers!!!!!!!!!! Wooooooooooot Wooooooooooooot!!!!!!!!!
Relax and embrace the inevitable, eh?
how very Bobby Knight-ish of you
As Woody said in Toy Story 1 “THIS IS A PERFECT TIME TO PANIC!”
Don't know if its true . . .
but honestly, can someone please tell me why they care? There are a couple of reasons why it doesn’t matter how much money KP offers him:
1. This is the ONLY time in the next 5 years that we will be under the salary cap. Aka, this is when we will be able to spend. With extensions coming for Roy, LMA, and Oden we will be above the salary cap for awhile, whether we give Hedo 5 million or 10 million a year.
2. Paul Allen has so much money, he clearly doesn’t mind paying the luxury tax.
Combining these two things = it doesn’t matter how much money we pay him as long as we get him. This is really the only time we will be able to add another good player to this team, so we better make sure we get him. Please tell me why you care about the number? I’d be more upset if we tried to lowball him, and didn’t get anyone.
seriously?
Dude just took his team to the finals. Is rated the number 1 free agent by ric bucher. How could he not help our team. A small forward who can create and score on his own. We only have one player who can do that now, and if you don’t think he’d instantly be the blazer’s third best player . . . wow.
Believe me, you will read many comments to the contrary
if you stick around here in the days to come, assuming Turk signs
Ric Bucher
has Channing Frye rated as his 18th best Free Agent this year.
Brandon Bass was unranked.
Oden is better than turk
Oden, even in limited minutes, is an absolute game changer. 18+ PER, ridiculous rebounding %, defense, etc. Especially with more time to recover his athleticism, Oden is superior to Turk. I would personally argue that Rudy is also a better player. I just wish Rudy was 6’8" 220lbs.
Come on you gotta listen unto me,
lay off that whiskey and let that cocaine be. ~Johnny Cash
"I just wish Rudy was 6’8" 220lbs"
Only 4 inches and a hundred pounds to go!
by TheThinWhiteDuke on Jul 1, 2009 9:13 AM PDT up reply actions
If we actally do sign Hedo for 50 mil, I would really like to see the numbers KP is looking at
The numbers readily available to folks like me make it look like a pretty terrible idea.
Yes
1. Kirk Hinrich
2. Brandon Bass
3. Jason Kidd
4. Andre Miller
5. Hedo
Based on how each of these players would help the team, roster makeup, and price issues (the main reason I have Hedo this low) I don’t see why the team would go so all in on another SF, even if he is an offensive upgrade
Team Bayless - The takeover begins in 2009
by blazeraddict on Jun 30, 2009 11:16 PM PDT up reply actions
I like Hedo
50 seems steep though.
Could be his agent trying to drive up the bidding war.
Yellow Mamba FTW!
Quick Reports KP pursuing Hedo
http://blog.oregonlive.com/behindblazersbeat/2009/06/blazers_pursue_hedo_turkoglu_a.html
"I'm at the thingamajig talking the yakety-yak" - Kenny Smith
The Trail Blazers’ summer agenda was revealed late Tuesday night at the minute the free agent market opened. That’s when general manager Kevin Pritchard and assistant general manager Tom Penn called agent Lon Babby to begin the courtship of small forward Hedo Turkoglu.
“Kevin Pritchard and Tom Penn called me at the earliest possible moment and expressed enthusiasm for engaging in discussions about Hedo becoming a Trail Blazer,” Babby said late Tuesday night. “We have begun that process.”
"I'm at the thingamajig talking the yakety-yak" - Kenny Smith
Oh god.
I just threw up in my mouth a little bit lot.
by dario argento on Jun 30, 2009 11:27 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
why? this means that the source is really Hedo’s agent, who is likely just trying to increase his client’s value
Communism is the very definition of failure.
by L-TrainFTW! on Jun 30, 2009 11:28 PM PDT up reply actions
Wow.
Did LMA get some new tats recently? I don’t recall his arm being that inked up.
All aboard the Kirkwagon!
What is this?!?!
Both Roy and Aldridge are expected to ask for maximum contracts, which figure to start in the ballpark of $13 million in the first year and inflate to around $18 million within four years.
But while Roy’s voluminous resume will produce a resounding thud on the bargaining table, Aldridge’s worth is more difficult to define.
Bad. Bad. Bad.
"I'm at the thingamajig talking the yakety-yak" - Kenny Smith
Him training with Bosh instead of Durant.
good. good. good.
by Cablinasian on Jun 30, 2009 11:18 PM PDT up reply actions
getting them locked up is good good good
LMA is darn close to a max player, and if you have to slightly overpay to keep him PA will be more than happy to do that (if he cares at all about Championships).
I don't think its even about the actual dollar amount.
It’s more about the cap space their sacrificing over the next 4-5 years.
All aboard the Kirkwagon!
we’ll have no cap space anyway. It’s purely Paul and how willing he is to keep LMA happy.
by Cablinasian on Jun 30, 2009 11:36 PM PDT up reply actions
we will have ZERO cap space for the next 4-5 years
if we throw LMA a couple extra million in his extension, it really only affects PA’s pocket.
How did you guys win that?
"We scored enough points. We scored 107, they scored 105.
-Nate McMillan Postgame, 3/4/2009
and the silver lining...
we’ll be able to use his salary in trade if he doesn’t work out (I can’t belive I just typed that), for a bigger fish.
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
"New Man Law: If you don't show up for the draft you don't get to come later if you're picked. If you believe in yourself, show up and sit there. If nobody else believes in you, take it and cry like a man...in front of the cameras."
-Dave
I care more about the salary cap implications
Allen can pay Roy and Alridge the maximum out of his pocket. But those few million a year in the Aldridge max contract hurt us down the line.
"I'm at the thingamajig talking the yakety-yak" - Kenny Smith
with LMA, Roy, Oden, Rudy, Batum, we’ll have no cap space anyway.
by Cablinasian on Jun 30, 2009 11:38 PM PDT up reply actions
not really
we will be over the cap anyway. if allen is willing to pay, and continues to be willing, it makes absolutely ZERO difference to any future moves
How did you guys win that?
"We scored enough points. We scored 107, they scored 105.
-Nate McMillan Postgame, 3/4/2009
Really?
I think it does make a difference for possible trades in the future if the Aldridge contract is worth much more than his production.
"I'm at the thingamajig talking the yakety-yak" - Kenny Smith
true, but we were talking capspace implications, not trade value
How did you guys win that?
"We scored enough points. We scored 107, they scored 105.
-Nate McMillan Postgame, 3/4/2009
I guess that's what I meant
But also that slim possibility of KP getting the team under the cap somehow.
"I'm at the thingamajig talking the yakety-yak" - Kenny Smith
LMA at 10, Brandon, at 13, Greg at 10+, Rudy, Batum… there isn’t really an easy way for us to get under the cap with those guys on the roster in four years. Add in the escalation of contracts..
by Cablinasian on Jun 30, 2009 11:45 PM PDT up reply actions
I'm just saying, leave that slim hope open
Maybe it matters, maybe it doesn’t. My rule of thumb is not to overpay your own free agent. Keep the deal fair. Make the salary commensurate with current and past production and not based on future potential.
"I'm at the thingamajig talking the yakety-yak" - Kenny Smith
Sign LMA >>>>>>>> Sign LMA to a fair deal
there’s only like 1-2 million difference anyway. PA should be willing to bite the bullet.
Hedo's agent...
“Babby said the Blazers were one of three teams that inquired about Turkoglu’s services, but that “the calls were still coming in.” It appeared the Blazers’ ability to get their call in first made an impression.
“They were enthusiastic and well received by us,” Babby said. “We are engaged in the process. We will see where that takes us in the next couple of days and take it from there.”"
What a salesman.
All aboard the Kirkwagon!
not a hedo fan, but... what if they want him as a point forward type PG
long time lurker. had to join to post this since I’m fiending for some free agents.
I don’t like Hedo’s fit, but if he is signed I think they’ll play him as a point forward. He and Roy would share ball-handling responsibilities on offense.
The only problem would be defense against smaller quicker point guards. If they sign Hedo, I think Nate and KP think Rudy can guard the PG position. IMHO he did better than Pretty Ricky in the Olympics guarding Paul and Williams. No one can really stop those guys anyway. Still don’t like Hedo because of the defensive matchup problems we’ll have.
Starting back court offense:
PG: Hedo
Wings: ROY & Rudy
Offensive assasins off the bench:
Martell, Bayless
Solid offensive backup PG: Blake
Starting back court defense:
PG: Rudy
Shooting guard: Roy
SF: Turkey Glue
Defensive backups:
Batum, Martell
I think Nate and KP think Rudy can guard the PG position
or not
Rudy could be on his way out of town. Turk will seriously cut into his minutes. No more Roy playing SF
Hmmmm
All the Hedo fans coming out of the woodwork now. Where were you before? :)
Welcome to the party.
Why would we want
Someone that would destroy all of our other options? Just say no to Hedo
If you have nothing constructive to say about someone, I prefer that you say nothing at all.
"If Jumping to conclusions, Kicking others when they do not do well and Launching into senseless tirades were Olympic Events, some people around here would be Medal Contenders". Me
Devin Harris
could still be had for Blake, Outlaw and Rudy
salaries match
by two4larue on Jun 30, 2009 11:36 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
or for a turky glue?
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
"New Man Law: If you don't show up for the draft you don't get to come later if you're picked. If you believe in yourself, show up and sit there. If nobody else believes in you, take it and cry like a man...in front of the cameras."
-Dave
mmm... that just is ... too long we'll revolt right? I mean? right?
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
"New Man Law: If you don't show up for the draft you don't get to come later if you're picked. If you believe in yourself, show up and sit there. If nobody else believes in you, take it and cry like a man...in front of the cameras."
-Dave
why?
I’ve seen people say that he has to stay and seen people propose sign-and-trades. What’s the rule?
3 guys that need the ball in their hands....
great
:(
Hedo is just all kinds of bad. He’s one of the best player available right this second, but fits about zero.
by as11osu on Jul 1, 2009 12:04 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
What now?
He’s a better PG than Steve Blake and a better SF than Travis Outlaw. Better 6th man than Rudy. Better PF than Frye.
Not the sexy choice, but an upgrade for sure.
by Nick Van Excellent on Jul 1, 2009 12:21 AM PDT up reply actions
He's not better than Rudy... especially next to Roy
He’s a worst defender than all these players except maybe Outlaw. And Outlaw at least has the mismatch he can create versus PF’s. Hedo can’t do that. Bad stuff.
by as11osu on Jul 1, 2009 12:32 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
He's not better than Rudy?
Not sure how that’s possible unless you figure in potential.
Fernandez is entering most overrated player ever territory.
by Nick Van Excellent on Jul 1, 2009 12:34 AM PDT up reply actions
Fernandez had a better PER his rookie year
and is at the very least equivalent to him defensively. He’s also our most efficient player and perfect match next to Roy.
by as11osu on Jul 1, 2009 12:48 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
perfect match next to Roy.
Good Lord man. Rudy is an awful defender which hardly compliments Roy’s weak defense. The fact that he isn’t a PG, can’t handle the ball, and can’t create for himself pretty much kills it.
Rudy= 6th man for life.
by Nick Van Excellent on Jul 1, 2009 12:51 AM PDT up reply actions
he can't create for himself on the ball, but he can get himself open
which next to Roy is by far the more important ability.
Not really true at all.
Getting yourself open is great, but being able to create for others as a PG is WAY more important.
by Nick Van Excellent on Jul 1, 2009 3:30 AM PDT up reply actions
not when the shots you're creating for yourself
have a 59 TS% at the SG position your rookie year. Also, Rudy has an assist rate of 17 compared to Hedo’s 21. It’s really not that drastic per 100 possessions. Given the type of player that Roy is and what he likes to do, Rudy is the better match offensively on the court. Harris and his lack of a decent jumper really wouldn’t help Hedo’s case in this regard. 3 guys that create without the high efficiency finisher really doesn’t help that much. It just mutes Roy’s game and our teams overall offensive efficiency playing off his strengths.
I couldn't disagree more.
But I can’t bring myself to talk about Hedu anymore. I’m pretty much done with this topic forever unless the Blazers actually sign him.
by Nick Van Excellent on Jul 1, 2009 4:24 AM PDT up reply actions
Uh....No...
Rudy is just plain terrible on D currently. Turk is at least average. I mean, I hate the move but let’s not go re-writing the last season here.
are you taking into account the fact he has Dwight Howard behind him?
and that Lee and Pietrus took on any even remotely skilled offensive player?
Turkoglu had a net positive PER (his offensive production and the one his opponents had) of +3.5 on SF and +3.2 on PF (his better position, but also the one where he allowed above average against him). Rudy had a +4.5 on SG and was negative on PG and especially SF.
Neither one is a terribly good defender, but Rudy is of course much younger.
I pretty much agree with Thorpe's take.
As a defender, Thorpe says Turkoglu is underrated. "He has length and feel. He’s a coordinated athlete. He’s also really tall and long. I don’t think of him as winning the battle on grit, but it’s not like there are a lot of times you watch a Magic game and think Turkoglu’s getting killed! When he’s engaged, I’d certainly say he’s a net positive for your defense.-ESPN
From what I’ve seen he seems much better than Rudy or Outlaw on defense. In my humble opinion it would be a net gain on both ends of the court, just not as much as I would have liked. I don’t love him, but certainly we would be a better team.
by Nick Van Excellent on Jul 1, 2009 1:14 AM PDT up reply actions
Hollinger
At the defensive end he has the size to bother shooters but isn’t particularly quick or tough; in general, not much is asked of him at that end.
They’re both bad defenders and are required to be disguised on that end. Rudy makes far more plays on that end though and is a good gambler. Hedo isn’t all that bright out there either, as I’m sure you remember him allowing James to take that game winning 3 in game 2. That’s the one shot in that situation you can’t let him take, and he did.
Hedo is an average defender because of his size
Credit for making him part of an elite defensive team goes to Stan Van Gundy.
The chances Nate McMillan can get Hedo in a position to succeed on defense? I’d say less than 10%.
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 1, 2009 8:48 AM PDT up reply actions
I disagree
Turkoglu is lots taller and height helps in basketball
"Knowledge will get you from A to B. Creativity will get you anywhere." Einstein
by Garden of ODEN on Jul 1, 2009 1:39 AM PDT up reply actions
But Rudy just makes plays love that kid.
"Knowledge will get you from A to B. Creativity will get you anywhere." Einstein
by Garden of ODEN on Jul 1, 2009 1:40 AM PDT up reply actions
height helps as far as rebounding is concerned...
the problem is Hedo doesn’t rebound well.
Rudy is 35th out of 75 in terms of boarding for SG’s.
Hedo is 37th out of 60 in terms of boarding for SF’s.
Rudy also gets a more steals and gives up less production despite not having Dwight Howard behind him.
Rudy barely gets more steals.
Not enough to actually matter.
by Nick Van Excellent on Jul 1, 2009 3:21 AM PDT up reply actions
I'm going to rec you...
every time you mention this.
by Nick Van Excellent on Jul 1, 2009 12:19 AM PDT up reply actions
The Jason Quick article and quotes from Hedo's agent show
That they (Hedo’s camp) are begging for some competition. The price may end up being relatively low for a nice addition for the Blazers.
So he wants more than that, doesn’t mean he’ll get any offers that are more than that.
by danielfarrell on Jul 1, 2009 4:27 AM PDT up reply actions
omg!! i cant sleep im wayyyy too exicted!
and i gota wake at 4 30 for work!! gawd im in trouble!! butterflies in my stomach.This is what happens when you live, bread and bleed blazers !!
Oden...Aldridge...Roy.....THE REAL BIG THREE
Comes with a trading card in Franz breads.
"I'm at the thingamajig talking the yakety-yak" - Kenny Smith
4:30 is wayy to early.
Communism is the very definition of failure.
by L-TrainFTW! on Jun 30, 2009 11:26 PM PDT up reply actions
yea traveling to salem with my dad and his work partner
Oden...Aldridge...Roy.....THE REAL BIG THREE
found this interesting from Barrett
There is one scenario sitting there for Portland that I haven’t heard talked about that much. Being they have cap room, they could actually sign a player basically for another team, and then trade him to that team, giving each team the player they actually want. It sounds basic, and it is. But, when kicking around options, I just haven’t heard many people mention it.
The more I’ve thought about this scenario being in play, the more it makes me think this is perhaps what Portland will do. In that case, the guy they end up will probably be someone we haven’t even talked about yet. Having this option does widen the pool a bit, no?
So, even though we’ve only been hearing about a handful of guys being possible future Trail Blazers, I’m telling you to think outside the box. That’s what KP always tells us he does, right? So, should we be set for Andre Miller, Turkoglu, Jason Kidd, or Brandon Bass? If we’re to believe what we’ve been reading, it should be one of those guys. Maybe I’m reaching here, but I don’t think it will be. Of course, I could be dead wrong.
http://mikebarrettsblog.blogspot.com/2009/06/waiting-game-starts.html
by PoliSam on Jun 30, 2009 11:23 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
sign and trade for Tayshaun or Calderon.
by Cablinasian on Jun 30, 2009 11:24 PM PDT up reply actions
not that Calderon is my first choice, just that it makes more sense iwth Toronto having been rumored to be interested in Hedo.
by Cablinasian on Jun 30, 2009 11:25 PM PDT up reply actions
Why would the Blazers do it instead of the team that has bird rights?
"I'm at the thingamajig talking the yakety-yak" - Kenny Smith
Orlando can’t add that much more salary, can they?
by Cablinasian on Jun 30, 2009 11:29 PM PDT up reply actions
Maybe its plausible if the Blazers add another player of their own.
But I think sign and trades can only be one player. Why wouldn’t Hedo go to the Grizzles, Pistons, or OKC to get a higher starting salary for a sign and trade?
"I'm at the thingamajig talking the yakety-yak" - Kenny Smith
I honestly don't get it
“they could actually sign a player basically for another team, and then trade him to that team, " it just sounds like a S&T for another team, then why would not that team just do it by themselves?
No time to think now, please somebody educate me!!
Team A has bird rights for free agent, Team B wants to get free agent, Team C has cap space
In this scenario, Team A can’t match, Team B has no space, and Team C agrees to sign the free agent for Team B, as long as they get a player off of team B.
by JordanLeDoux on Jun 30, 2009 11:34 PM PDT up reply actions
Interesting how Barrett doesn't know the rules
you can’t do this because you can’t sign free agents from other teams and trade them, until January or so. I’m surprised he doesn’t know this. Actually… I’m not.
a simultaneous 3-way S&T?
is there such thing?
ex. Magic signs Turkoglu to a 5yr and $50M deal, receive some cheap contracts
Team A send out a $9M player, receive Turkoglu
Blazers send out some cheap contracts, receive that $9M player.
Looks pretty resonable doesn’t it?
I saw that
But emails are hard to deposit in the bank
by lee3022 on Jun 30, 2009 11:27 PM PDT up reply actions 2 recs
If KP wants Hedo . . .
so do I. That man can evaluate talent, flat-out. Lets give him the benefit of the doubt. I mean, Roy, LMA, Rudy, and Batum . . . all steals in my opinion.
To be honest.
If Hedo ended up signed at $8 million for 4 years, that’s not a bad deal in any stretch of the imagination. I hate the fact he wants close to $10 million for 5 years.
If KP believes this is the best player available this offseason by free agent signing or trades, I will go along with it.
"I'm at the thingamajig talking the yakety-yak" - Kenny Smith
I don't think it's on the table
They already traded for Vince Carter.
"I'm at the thingamajig talking the yakety-yak" - Kenny Smith
back away from the kool aid
Hedo is the best UFA of this year’s class, but that’s like saying Blake Griffith was the best draft prospect in this year’s draft
people have expressed being uncomfortable with “koolaid” remarks in the past. I’m not, but others have, if I remember correctly.
by Cablinasian on Jun 30, 2009 11:41 PM PDT up reply actions
I want my Kool-Aid laced with cyanide, since it'll take away the pain,
Yes, there’s a bit of grim, macabre humor for y’all.
When it's all said and done, I'll handle it if Hedo Turkoglu ends up a Trail Blazer.
If it does come to fruition, though, then I don’t want to see people still deifying Kevin Prtichard. Yet, even if Pritchard avoids the Turkoglu trap, he’s still not a better front office executive than Daryl Morey, Mark Warkentien, R.C. Buford, Danny Ainge, Mitch Kupchak, et al.
drafting Powe and Rondo was luck?
While McHale’s stupidity helped Ainge a lot, Danny has made a lot of great moves. The Telfair/Roy trade was inane, but his record in general is quite good.
That so-called bad trade did indirectly lead to the Kevin Garnett deal.
The two years left on Raef LaFrentz’s deal back in the summer of 2007 wouldn’t’ve been as valuable as Theo Ratliff’s then expiring contract in such a deal.
so he planned it a year in advance?
that argument makes no sense IMO.
She Hate Me
"oh I served BRP all right
drained J-Kiddesque running floaters over him all night long last time we balled" - prezofdeath
but I think that was luck
I think Ainge made that trade actually believing Telfair could play.
Nevertheless, you and I are in agreement that Ainge has, in general, done a very solid job.
but better than KP?
Look how far this team has come in such a short time span since he took over (and depending on who you believe, that began in the 06 draft)
She Hate Me
"oh I served BRP all right
drained J-Kiddesque running floaters over him all night long last time we balled" - prezofdeath
but haven't all of Ainge's moves
been around the draft too?
She Hate Me
"oh I served BRP all right
drained J-Kiddesque running floaters over him all night long last time we balled" - prezofdeath
The KG trade had nothing to do with the draft
Yes, McHale is dumb, but Ainge still deserves credit for making the move. He also did a solid job getting role players— like Posey and House— to fill out the roster around the big 3.
my timeline on the KG deal is mixed up then
apparently.
She Hate Me
"oh I served BRP all right
drained J-Kiddesque running floaters over him all night long last time we balled" - prezofdeath
Yeah, it was the Ray Allen trade that had to ...
do with the 2007 NBA Draft. The Kevin Garnett trade happened in August of 2007.
Danny Ainge has made solid draft picks throughout his tenure in Boston.
The Ray Allen trade was a shrewd move, too, although I agree with you that he somewhat lucked into the Kevin Garnett deal.
Until this season
KP was easily ahead.
It’d be hard to justify a Hedo signing after the draft he just had and not move him down a couple spots.
Who, with regards to the 2009 NBA Draft, would you have taken ...
in lieu of Jeff Pendergraph and Dante Cunningham if DeJuan Blair wasn’t an option due to ownership/upper management saying no because of injury concerns?
I’d’ve still drafted Pendergraph, but would’ve taken Nick Calathes at #33 and stashed him over in Greece for three seasons. At #55, I’d’ve then taken Ahmad Nivins to be the third-string power forward.
First off there wouldn't be any doctor in the world telling me I couldn't pick him in the 2nd round
but aside from that these would’ve been my picks
- = Victor Claver (but I would’ve taken Blair had he been available)
- = Derrick Brown (unless Claver or Blair were still there)
- = Nick Calathes also (unless Pender Claver or Blair are still there)
- = Ahmad Nivins also (we are alike here)
- =
Calathes is too undefined in his position for me
And he gets compared to pretty bad players to show how great he was in Florida, the best one being Jason Williams. Maybe he improves in Greece, maybe he just guards the Gatorade like Jennings because he selected a team that is too good for his current level.
If we feel like comparing Nick Calathes to former Flordia ...
Gators, then the skills of Mike Miller in the body of Matt Walsh is the best comparison.
Ironically, however, the best all-around comparison for ...
Nick Calathes isn’t a former Florida Gator — regardless of whether its Mike Miller, Matt Walsh, Christian Drejer, et al. — but rather a former Florida State Seminole in Bobby Sura.
Anyway, I believe Calathes will be a satisfactory replacement for Sarunas Jasikevicius as Dimitris Diamantidis backup at point guard on Panathinaikos.
Ainge?
woo let’s trade away all of our best young talent to try and win one for Pierce!
She Hate Me
"oh I served BRP all right
drained J-Kiddesque running floaters over him all night long last time we balled" - prezofdeath
Maybe its kool aid
But it’s better than not drinking anything this offseason.
"I'm at the thingamajig talking the yakety-yak" - Kenny Smith
This makes me wonder...
are agents allowed to say ANYTHING? I mean, is there a point where an errant claim almost becomes slander, all for the sake of self interest?
If KP never actually called Hedo’s agent, are there any reprecussions for the agent saying KP did?
All aboard the Kirkwagon!
for agents its all about their reps around the league. the best ones manage a lot of clients and have open dialogue with all 30 teams. they bend the rules but don’t break them in most cases… or they fail
by Ben Golliver on Jun 30, 2009 11:32 PM PDT up reply actions
calm down guys...
Nobody mentioned KP offered $50 million. He just "expressed enthusiasm for engaging in discussions ". The number KP has in mind is probably much much lower than $50M.
Keep him and good...
What do you say that’s the opposite of riddance – when you never posessed it?
I know less than half of you half as well as I should like, and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve.
by haildablazer on Jun 30, 2009 11:36 PM PDT up reply actions
thanks lee, just update the post with this link… good stuff
by Ben Golliver on Jun 30, 2009 11:38 PM PDT up reply actions
This post scared me
But I think this is smokescreen.
I know less than half of you half as well as I should like, and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve.
By the poster Bill on the 2009 free agency update page on hoopsworld...
“As for Portland, we believe [KP has] gone to Philly. He wants to convince Andre Miller to come to Portland before the Sixers convince him to stay in Philly.”
I dont like this move
Every time Outlaw fades away in a shot, a kitten dies. Save the Kittens, don't fade!
WHEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
She Hate Me
"oh I served BRP all right
drained J-Kiddesque running floaters over him all night long last time we balled" - prezofdeath
by cloudydays on Jun 30, 2009 11:37 PM PDT reply actions 2 recs
I submit the following statistical comparison for your consideration:
JUMP SHOTS
3pt
Hedo Turkoglu 35.6%
Randy Foye 36.0%
2 pt
Hedo Turkoglu 38.1%
Randy Foye 38.4%
Inside
Hedo Turkoglu 53.0%
Randy Foye 49.1%
effective FG%
Hedo Turkoglu 45.8%
Randy Foye 45.3%
:(
"I take the little gummy bear Flintstones vitamins…I try not to eat the lady. I try not to eat the man. Just give me the car. I try to find the car. Yea, worst case scenario, I eat the lady." - Ron Artest, 2009
Exactly
My point being, the two offer roughly identical production from the perimeter, but you can’t tell me that Randy Foye warrants $10m per over four or five years. Obviously they play different positions and all that, but the message is that I’ve noted a tendency from some sources online to portray Hedo as this 20 ppg scoring dynamo who drains threes like mad and gets to the rim at will. Uhh, not really. Or at least, not notably better or more efficiently than some decidedly lower-profile players.
"I take the little gummy bear Flintstones vitamins…I try not to eat the lady. I try not to eat the man. Just give me the car. I try to find the car. Yea, worst case scenario, I eat the lady." - Ron Artest, 2009
Meanwhile, according to sources, other prominent free agents, like Houston forward Ron Artest, Philadelphia guard Andre Miller and Pistons forward Rasheed Wallace received some interest in the early morning hours Wednesday, but got no concrete proposals. Unlike previous years, when teams tried to get deals done quickly after the start of free agency, many teams appear this summer to be more patient, and less willing to throw big money around, especially if it gets them anywhere near the luxury tax threshhold.
I don't want Hedo for 24 million
50 Million??
"I been ridin' the midnight train, got ice water in my veins." -Bob Dylan
"Sasha? That's a sissy name." -Mike Rice
http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=13144
WOW
Every time Outlaw fades away in a shot, a kitten dies. Save the Kittens, don't fade!
I'll help you with that
Article: Do the Blazers need Hedo? - via hoopsworld
Communism is the very definition of failure.
by L-TrainFTW! on Jun 30, 2009 11:44 PM PDT up reply actions
bingo
Portland needs to solve their point guard dilemma. Portland needs to address how they are going to cope at power forward when Aldridge isn’t on the floor. Portland needs veterans sprinkled about the other open roster spots. When the salary cap number is announced next week and General Manager Kevin Pritchard knows exactly (estimated at $8 million under the cap) what the organization can spend the need even then is to spend wisely.
that is the bottom line, my friend.
by prezofdeath on Jun 30, 2009 11:49 PM PDT up reply actions
Pistons still want Ben Gordon, Charlie Villanueva
Chris McCosky / The Detroit News
The Pistons still were hoping to get commitments from two top-level free agents — Chicago guard Ben Gordon and Milwaukee power forward Charlie Villanueva. They also are hopeful of re-signing Antonio McDyess, though he is drawing interest from several contending teams — Cleveland, Boston and Houston, among them.
They also are hopeful of re-signing Antonio McDyess, though he is drawing interest from several contending teams — Cleveland, Boston and Houston, among them.
can you really call Houston a contender?
Communism is the very definition of failure.
by L-TrainFTW! on Jun 30, 2009 11:47 PM PDT up reply actions
I refuse to believe these rumors
He’d be a nice add, no question. There’s a ton of reasons to bring him to Portland. He’s not the kiss of death some folks are making him out to be. But a five-year commitment at that kind of money, no way. Let Detroit cripple their cap through 2014. Such a move goes so entirely against the grain of what KP and Penn have worked so hard to build here, I just find it awfully difficult to fathom.
The hoopsworld article above is accurate. Hedo represents a want, not a need. And in ref to the earlier BE piece, if we’re bringing on Hedo to get open shots from the 3, why in the world would we still have any faith or investment in Martell?
"I take the little gummy bear Flintstones vitamins…I try not to eat the lady. I try not to eat the man. Just give me the car. I try to find the car. Yea, worst case scenario, I eat the lady." - Ron Artest, 2009
I think he is smarter now
Darius was/is a punk. KP has it covered.
Every time Outlaw fades away in a shot, a kitten dies. Save the Kittens, don't fade!
If I've learned anything, it's that Paul Allen is fairly ignorant with regards to basketball analysis.
It’s Allen’s $10,500,000,000, though, so he’s got the right to do whatever the heck he wants with it.
Mark Cuban mentioned on his twitter that maybe this year's FA's should go for one year contracts
and go for big money next year when the 2010 bonanza is underway.
Maybe we should see if we could get Hedo for just one year. That gives Batum time to develop and puts us in contention this year potentially, but doesn’t lock is into an old dude forever.
wouldn’t he have just not exercised his ETO in that scenario?
by Cablinasian on Jun 30, 2009 11:47 PM PDT up reply actions
he was only going to make 7.7 i think
he could probably make 12 for a one year deal if he opts out.
by prezofdeath on Jun 30, 2009 11:50 PM PDT up reply actions
who can and will give him twelve million for one year?
by Cablinasian on Jun 30, 2009 11:50 PM PDT up reply actions
he'll make more than 7.7, that's for sure
by prezofdeath on Jun 30, 2009 11:51 PM PDT up reply actions
i dunno. Orlando was a good place for him to showcase his talent and get a big deal in 2010.
by Cablinasian on Jun 30, 2009 11:53 PM PDT up reply actions
I think Hedo is worth more to the Magic than the Blazers.
If that makes any sense.
"I'm at the thingamajig talking the yakety-yak" - Kenny Smith
He is, to them.
The is the MOST I hope the Blazers would offer him as well.
Though I hope its more like no offer…
Is this what your imaginary dog is saying to Hedo?
"I'm at the thingamajig talking the yakety-yak" - Kenny Smith
by blzrfan on Jun 30, 2009 11:51 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Here's what my imaginary dog is saying
"I take the little gummy bear Flintstones vitamins…I try not to eat the lady. I try not to eat the man. Just give me the car. I try to find the car. Yea, worst case scenario, I eat the lady." - Ron Artest, 2009
by rivetz on Jul 1, 2009 12:01 AM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
This will be the most reposted picture on Blazersedge if KP really decides to destroy the Blazers
with Hedo.
The irony is I’m personally not nearly as anti-Hedo as the picture suggests. But someone pulls the dog card, and you get a thought, and that’s pretty much that. Apologies, kinda.
"I take the little gummy bear Flintstones vitamins…I try not to eat the lady. I try not to eat the man. Just give me the car. I try to find the car. Yea, worst case scenario, I eat the lady." - Ron Artest, 2009
I was originally for this
But now I am not so sure. I still don’t like the 50 mil mark, but we are expected to be 8 million under the cap…
We need a point guard first. That is my belief. But I still like outlaw/blake for hinrich while bayless develops
Every time Outlaw fades away in a shot, a kitten dies. Save the Kittens, don't fade!
IF
""""""IF""""""""
Every time Outlaw fades away in a shot, a kitten dies. Save the Kittens, don't fade!
another problem
with Hedo eating up the cap-space, the Blazers would have to combine Outlaw, Blake and Bayless to match salaries for Hinrich
and these same reporters are saying that KP is going after Andre Miller, anyway
that's not true
I checked it
Outlaw plus Blake = Hinrich exactly
(3.6 + 4.0) X (1.25) = (9.5)
Seriously. Check it out. It’s exact. It’s creepily perfect.
Well, it's possible that the Dallas Mavericks could trade Jerry Stackhouse and ...
filler (e.g., Devean George) to the Chicago Bulls for Kirk Hinrich if Jason Kidd departs via free agency. After waiving Stackhosue and releasing George, the Bulls would only be on the hook for $3.6 million — with $2 million owed to Stackhouse and $1.6 million owed to George — in guaranteed salaries after the trade.
I dunno
That’s a pricy backup for your franchise player getting 35 minutes or more a game, especially when that backup’s a guy you could sign and trade into help at other positions.
"I take the little gummy bear Flintstones vitamins…I try not to eat the lady. I try not to eat the man. Just give me the car. I try to find the car. Yea, worst case scenario, I eat the lady." - Ron Artest, 2009
I would agree btw
That the chances of Hedo returning to Orlando in the wake of the Carter signing reside somewhere between slim and none.
"I take the little gummy bear Flintstones vitamins…I try not to eat the lady. I try not to eat the man. Just give me the car. I try to find the car. Yea, worst case scenario, I eat the lady." - Ron Artest, 2009
The problem is, playing alongside Carter is mostly the same problems as playing alongside Roy.
Money aside, it would make just as little sense to sign here. Though money aside doesn’t work when it’s about money, at least to Hedo.
im loosing hope in kp
dissapointing i feel as if were turning into the bulls
Oden...Aldridge...Roy.....THE REAL BIG THREE
Oh ye of little faith
You should point to one specific blunder that KP has made before reaching this conclusion. Not potential blunders or looming pitfalls, but straight-up mistakes. Be sure to weigh those against strokes of genius, as well, please.
"I take the little gummy bear Flintstones vitamins…I try not to eat the lady. I try not to eat the man. Just give me the car. I try to find the car. Yea, worst case scenario, I eat the lady." - Ron Artest, 2009
Hmm...
A guy who can run the pick and roll with Oden, take pressure off of Roy in close game situations, pull the ball off the rim and take it the length of the court and make a play…BOOOOOO.
Oh wait, those things all sound awesome. His shooting % isn’t amazing, but Turkoglu is better than any 3 we have on this team right now, and will be for the next couple years at least. We can’t count on Martell coming off that injury firing on all cylinders, and teams were sagging off Batum HARD last year. We need someone who poses a threat on offense to score or make a play for someone else and Hedo fits the bill. Get him if you can.
the problem is that he would cost A LOT of money and that he isn’t a back up PF or starting PG.
Communism is the very definition of failure.
and overrated and inefficient and turnover prone and a bad fit for our offense
Other than that, he’s perfect.
and has a liking
for biting poking small children with pointy sticks
Honor Alaa Abdelnaby.
First in the NBA. At least alphabetically
Get him if you can...
At a reasonable price, which KP will do…I am sure.
I agree with your post JK47 100%
Every time Outlaw fades away in a shot, a kitten dies. Save the Kittens, don't fade!
He's 30
so if his contract is more than 3 years, it will cover the twilight of his career, I’m guessing. Maybe he’ll retire a blazer!
That's what we need
another meaningless number to retire :)
Honor Alaa Abdelnaby.
First in the NBA. At least alphabetically
everyone
on here is overreacting. he wont get 50 million, and he would help our team. plain and simple, the guy is a great player. This is the biggest bunch of over analyzers ever!
- Sam
he's not a great player, he's a good player
He had a below average PER and he’s an average (at absolute best) defender.
He was pretty dynomite against the Cavs.
The Lakers series probably skews the numbers a bit. I think he was better overall then people are giving him credit for.
by Nick Van Excellent on Jul 1, 2009 12:32 AM PDT up reply actions
He had a couple good games versus the Cavs
but with the playoffs as long as they are, you better have a couple good games. He’s also on the decline, as his PER went down 3 points this year. He’s not even a 15 anymore (average player) which hurts even more when you realize that PER is essentially an offensive efficiency quotient and his defense is the worst part of his game. Trevor Ariza by 3 million miles and 3 million dollars would be the better fit and better player on this team. Bass too would’ve been another better option. Hedo would be on my top 10 list, but that still doesn’t excuse this move. This was your once chance and you blew it on 2 years of Hedo (or supposedly).
Rudy had a PER of 11.4 in the playoffs.... just saying.
The deal for Hedo only makes sense if another deal is coming.
Example:
The Blazers get an offer for Outlaw, Rudy and Blake for Devin Harris. In that case the Blazers need to find a 3/4 who can create off the dribble and shoot the three. Turk wouldn’t be the worst candidate in that situation, although yes I would prefer Ariza.
by Nick Van Excellent on Jul 1, 2009 12:46 AM PDT up reply actions
I don't think the deal for Hedo makes sense pretty much no matter what
since we have Roy.
But it would make a little more sense with Harris. Believe me, I’m all for that, but I don’t like the Hedo deal at all either way. I’d rather have Ariza or Bass and then do that Harris deal.
well
Rudy was a rookie in the playoffs, smaller sample size, didn’t get as much playing time, and we’re not considering giving him 8-10 mil a year.
Just sayin’.
Rudy was a 24 year old rookie.
At 24 you probably aren’t going to change a whole lot, although I’m sure he will improve off his rookie season.
He certainly did not get as much playing time. He received the 5th most minutes on the Blazers behind Outlaw and Blake. Which actually makes a lot of sense since Outlaw is a SF (something we need) and Blake is a PG (something we desperately need). Unfortunately Rudy is a shooting guard and only a shooting guard. Not really something we need. A luxury to be sure, but not a deal breaker by any means.
by Nick Van Excellent on Jul 1, 2009 3:27 AM PDT up reply actions
A rookie going from year 24 to 25 is going to substantially improve
a 30 year old coming off a 3 PER decline in the year prior, turning 31 before the playoffs is going to get even worse. Last year he didn’t even average what an average player at his position averaged (PER under 15). Rudy put up one of the highest shooting efficiencies in the entire league. He also, in his rookie year put up a PER above that of an average player. He’s also a much better fit playing next to Brandon Roy (best pair with Roy of anyone on the team). Turk’s skill overlap Roy’s, and it drastically decreases the efficiency of our very best crunch time plays. Rudy getting open looks >>>>> Hedo getting open looks. With Hedo teams will be more inclined to sag back, and that will hurt Roy inside. I don’t see how Hedo is a significant improvement on the wing except with Roy is off the court.
best pair with Roy of anyone on the team
That should probably read “best pair with Roy of anyone on the team when matchups allow it.”
If he was the best pair with Roy he would have been playing 36 minutes a game.
by Nick Van Excellent on Jul 1, 2009 3:48 AM PDT up reply actions
I think Rudy is best utilized off the bench...
he’s a great energy guy, and helps the offense from stalling when Roy is out.
He’s even better with Roy obviously, but you’ve got to cover all 48 minutes in a game, so you have to make some concessions here and there.
Rudy also isn’t someone that even plays a style where he can do it for 36 minutes per game. He’s all over the place, and probably is best served playing 28-30 minutes per game off the bench. And you’re right, when the matchups dictate Rudy/Roy is THE best combo we have to wipe the opponent off the court. Offensively I think you have to admit it’s pretty dynamic. Even in limited minutes (1000 minutes – is that really limited?) you’d have to concede that.
Rudy also isn’t someone that even plays a style where he can do it for 36 minutes per game.
I’ve never heard that one before. Rip Hamilton has averaged 40 minutes per game in the playoffs for the last seven years. (34.3 regular season) You can’t tell me Rudy somehow expends more energy than Rip did. That guy never stopped moving.
Yes I think Roy and Rudy make a terrific offensive force. That’s a big reason we had the most efficient offense in the league. Defensively it didn’t work so well. In the Playoffs it really stalled and long term I don’t think it really works, especially if we still have Blake.
by Nick Van Excellent on Jul 1, 2009 4:47 AM PDT up reply actions
I don't think anyone is going to accept Blake as a long term fit here
He’s not starter quality and his game just doesn’t mesh at all with our second unit. Eventually the position must be upgraded.
Rip may be the most well conditioned athlete in the NBA. Not that Rudy isn’t well conditioned, but asking him to go long minutes is not in the best interest of him or the team he plays for.
I don’t think Rudy is as bad as you’re making him out to be defensively (he’s not any worse than Turk). Bayless was far worse but plenty of people excuse that to being a rookie. Rudy should be improved on both ends of the floor next year, and should have a better whole season given that he doesn’t have to play in the Olympics.
Here’s something to consider when you’re looking at Hedo vs Rudy.
Hedo shot 46 eFG% on his jumpers and 53 eFG% on his inside shots.
Rudy shot 52 eFG% on his jumpers and 72 eFG% on his inside shots.
Overall Rudy’s offensive game is 55 eFG% and that beats Hedo getting inside, even if that was all he did. The shots he gets just aren’t good enough shots to be taking in bulk, especially when you consider Roy has much the same game and does it at a much higher level. He’s more of a quantity player as his usage rate suggests, than he is an efficient player.
They were 8 points worse defensively with him in games
and only 6 points better offensively… seriously the guy is not what we should be looking for.
by as11osu on Jul 1, 2009 12:27 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
That's what happens when you overrate 5 big shots over 24 actual games
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 1, 2009 12:28 AM PDT up reply actions 2 recs
He works a lot better in Orlando because they don't have a Brandon Roy.
If he plays alongside Roy, he is a weak defensive 3 point shooter. Don’t we already have like 17 of those?
his playoff stats is actually pretty bad
15.8 – 4.5 – 4.8 looks good but it’s under 38.9mpg, also the killer is 2.7 TO. Plus FG% 42.7, 3P% 38.6. PER is only 13.2
by iverigma2 on Jul 1, 2009 12:11 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
in the past 24 hours my thoughts on getting Hedo have run the gamut
I think I’m now settling into this thought:
How well I receive KP signing Hedo is almost entirely dependent on which PG he gets via trade using Blake, Outlaw, and whatever other young player we include in the deal
How did you guys win that?
"We scored enough points. We scored 107, they scored 105.
-Nate McMillan Postgame, 3/4/2009
I can see Roy and Hedo working offensively.
The PG situation is down to defense and outside shooting. This takes away the pressure to find a playmaker.
But a Roy-Hedo defensive wing tandem makes me cry.
"I'm at the thingamajig talking the yakety-yak" - Kenny Smith
I am just afraid no more trade is coming
and we will enter next season with serious logjam at SF and Blake still as starting PG…
BUT HE'S UGLY!!!! our team is PRETTY!!! hEDO is UGLY!!!
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
"New Man Law: If you don't show up for the draft you don't get to come later if you're picked. If you believe in yourself, show up and sit there. If nobody else believes in you, take it and cry like a man...in front of the cameras."
-Dave
Stud like George Clooney?
Old yet classic.
"I'm at the thingamajig talking the yakety-yak" - Kenny Smith
and stoic-ly beautiful.
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
"New Man Law: If you don't show up for the draft you don't get to come later if you're picked. If you believe in yourself, show up and sit there. If nobody else believes in you, take it and cry like a man...in front of the cameras."
-Dave
This seems like a last ditch sort of thing.
Can’t get Hinrich, Harris, Wallace, or Kidd.
So we gotta try something! Lets get Hedo! The kids on BEdge are demanding something big, maybe this will make them happy. 50mil ok? No? 55mil?
If we win a title, probobly
That’s not to say he’ll deserve it, but deserving it is hardly a criteria in Portland with the number of jerseys the Blazers have retired.
Blake's jersey will be retired if we win the title with him.
"I'm at the thingamajig talking the yakety-yak" - Kenny Smith
so if we have a guy that is pretty good at playing a point-forward
and a guy that plays point/Sg how important is it for us to have a real point guard
dunno is the guy ugly?
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
"New Man Law: If you don't show up for the draft you don't get to come later if you're picked. If you believe in yourself, show up and sit there. If nobody else believes in you, take it and cry like a man...in front of the cameras."
-Dave
He would make our team better...
The 3 is our biggest weakness right now. Getting a starting PG would be fine and dandy, and we need a back up for LA, but when you’re talking about our starting lineup, it really sags at the 3. Hedo’s sort of old, but he’s still got several years of solid play ahead of him, his D ain’t great, but it won’t hurt us. Clutch, veteran, playmaker. Yes please.
It's a weakness, yes
But it will get better with time. These young guys will improve, and Hedo’s offensive contributions more than cancel out his lack of D.
Our offense was the most efficient in the league last year
We don’t need a better offensive team. We need to get better on D.
Here's a random derail
Thoughts on the pros and cons of picking up Shawn Marion on the cheap? He rebounds well, runs the floor, is an average to above-average defender, and is only 30. I don’t see any sort of bidding way for him, but in the right scenario he could be a very nice add backing up the 4 and the 3. Thoughts? A guy that was an atrocious signing at $17M or whatever stupid amount could be nice value at a greatly reduced contract.
"I take the little gummy bear Flintstones vitamins…I try not to eat the lady. I try not to eat the man. Just give me the car. I try to find the car. Yea, worst case scenario, I eat the lady." - Ron Artest, 2009
We're too slow offensively
Marion needs to be on a running team to be effective.
Very worried about PG position right now
If this is true, I can’t figure out how we get an upgrade at the 1.
one more time just because Norsk likes it
Outlaw+Blake+Rudy = Devin Harris
yes, the salaries match
savvy?
that would make me happy
not going to happen, but it would make me happy.
ALRIGHT BENJAMIN!!!
Where’s our …sleuth, where’s our scoop, WHAT’S THE SCREEN FOR!!!!
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
"New Man Law: If you don't show up for the draft you don't get to come later if you're picked. If you believe in yourself, show up and sit there. If nobody else believes in you, take it and cry like a man...in front of the cameras."
-Dave
say this is true
i don’t really think the number is (come on 50 mil?). how are the FA dealing this summer going to affect possibly giving LA and brandon extensions??
Out of the box theory I just thought of.
Might we signing Turkoglu just to send him to Detroit ( if Detroit also wanted one of our young guards like Rudy or Bayless ) , and then ship back Prince, a player KP has known to be very high on. This might also lessen Gordon’s FA options, making it more likely he would resign with CHI, leaving the door open for us to do a trade for Hinrich.
This could be
the greatest idea in the long and storied history of great ideas
"I take the little gummy bear Flintstones vitamins…I try not to eat the lady. I try not to eat the man. Just give me the car. I try to find the car. Yea, worst case scenario, I eat the lady." - Ron Artest, 2009
You wouldn’t lose, say, Blake, Outlaw and Bayless for Prince and Hinrich?
"I take the little gummy bear Flintstones vitamins…I try not to eat the lady. I try not to eat the man. Just give me the car. I try to find the car. Yea, worst case scenario, I eat the lady." - Ron Artest, 2009
Good idea, but not at all likely
Babby basically confirmed that the Blazers were interested in Turkoglu for their own team.
december.. he won/'t be able to be traded until december...
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
"New Man Law: If you don't show up for the draft you don't get to come later if you're picked. If you believe in yourself, show up and sit there. If nobody else believes in you, take it and cry like a man...in front of the cameras."
-Dave
Ahhhh, I didn't know that. Is that always the case with FA signings?
by dario argento on Jul 1, 2009 12:15 AM PDT up reply actions
i dunno...
someone else should straighten me out here…
HELP ^^^^^^^^
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
"New Man Law: If you don't show up for the draft you don't get to come later if you're picked. If you believe in yourself, show up and sit there. If nobody else believes in you, take it and cry like a man...in front of the cameras."
-Dave
Yes, three month or December 15, whichever is later
Only draft picks can be traded after just one month
KP won't go for it
if Nate isn’t on board
Every time Outlaw fades away in a shot, a kitten dies. Save the Kittens, don't fade!
It seems....
it seems that all this info thats leaking could NOT be KP. When has he ever showed his hand this early? never. This sounds like he made an offer to SOMEONE, probably not Hedo. I think it was either Odom or Ariza. I read today that Ariza’s agent said they were not giving the lakers a hometown discount. We could be very competitive towards gettin him. Just some food for thought…
I think I might still boo him
For what he did to Rudy
Every time Outlaw fades away in a shot, a kitten dies. Save the Kittens, don't fade!
by Przy4Prez on Jul 1, 2009 12:17 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
I doubt we touch any Lakers.
Don’t see it happening.
Agree. He’s another guy who I think will hold out for more than he’s worth, then be stunned when things dry up and nobody wants to play a supporting cast member of the Kobe-Gasol show benefitting from playing alongside two All-Stars the $8-$10M a year he was holding out for.
"I take the little gummy bear Flintstones vitamins…I try not to eat the lady. I try not to eat the man. Just give me the car. I try to find the car. Yea, worst case scenario, I eat the lady." - Ron Artest, 2009
The only way
I would want Ariza is if he had to wrestle a bear, like on Semi Pro. His only compensation would be escaping the death trap with his life.
also...
Just to add to that. If KP takes Ariza from LA, it affects their championship aspirtations for next year, baring a trade. They will have no defensive stopper, and Odom only plays when he realizes he’s Lamar Odom, which is like..ever 3rd game.
if ariza
gave the bird to LA on his way north i would love him
by goblazers503 on Jul 1, 2009 12:20 AM PDT up reply actions
IF he did that.... I would love him too.
but he’d have to do exactly that, becuase as it is right now… I’m still upset at him ;)
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
"New Man Law: If you don't show up for the draft you don't get to come later if you're picked. If you believe in yourself, show up and sit there. If nobody else believes in you, take it and cry like a man...in front of the cameras."
-Dave
Rec this post if you feel like you could stay up all night speculating about NBA free agents
Seriously, it’s like time has stopped.
"I take the little gummy bear Flintstones vitamins…I try not to eat the lady. I try not to eat the man. Just give me the car. I try to find the car. Yea, worst case scenario, I eat the lady." - Ron Artest, 2009
by rivetz on Jul 1, 2009 12:22 AM PDT reply actions 4 recs
I WILL stay up all night speculating about NBA free agents, unfortunately. seriously does anybody have suggestions on how to fall asleep?
Communism is the very definition of failure.
Think about
Jason Kidd at the point guard….lobbing the ball to Rudy for the dunk… instant ZZZZzzzZZZ
Every time Outlaw fades away in a shot, a kitten dies. Save the Kittens, don't fade!
I would
LOVE IT
Every time Outlaw fades away in a shot, a kitten dies. Save the Kittens, don't fade!
Needs to happen
Adresses an area of need without stunting our growth as Hedo would CERTAINLY do to Batum and/or Webster
Beer...or whiskey...whichever you prefer. Masturbation works too...or some combination of the 3.
by dario argento on Jul 1, 2009 12:25 AM PDT up reply actions
You're young still
You’ll learn to block out “deal breakers” like Hedo’s face.
by TheThinWhiteDuke on Jul 1, 2009 9:31 AM PDT up reply actions
is anybody
giving mike bibby decent money. he’s probably over the hill but i’ve always been a bibby fan
Just us…I’d be very happy with a Bibby signing and think he’s being overlooked as a top FA target for the Blazers. He has playoff experience, doesn’t demand the ball, sticks the open three, and in my opinion still has several seasons of good ball ahead of him.
Also I think landing Devin Harris is a pipe dream. The Nets have been gutted and I see no way they give up their only All-Star for any sort of package we could put on the table.
"I take the little gummy bear Flintstones vitamins…I try not to eat the lady. I try not to eat the man. Just give me the car. I try to find the car. Yea, worst case scenario, I eat the lady." - Ron Artest, 2009
No thanks
I think he is about done, sorry to say. I remember when he used to be a threat on Sacramento….those were the days
Every time Outlaw fades away in a shot, a kitten dies. Save the Kittens, don't fade!
ehh if you say so
Check his stats: the only thing that dropped appreciably in 08-09 from his years with the Kings…were his turnovers. I wouldn’t put him on a D’Antoni team and expect fireworks, but there’s no way Atlanta makes the playoffs without him.
"I take the little gummy bear Flintstones vitamins…I try not to eat the lady. I try not to eat the man. Just give me the car. I try to find the car. Yea, worst case scenario, I eat the lady." - Ron Artest, 2009
I'm going to bed, but here are my thoughts.
We offered maybe 24mil over 3 years team options for 5,6th, it’s on the table, and… chillin. in the mean time… jason kidd is supose to be coming over to talk, ariza, bibby, PF galore, oh my, it’s aging backup paradise tonight, …. the 8th hu? so this is all just bidding and feeling out for 8 days? oh my… critical mass just may be met. NY with an unconditional pick given to who? what where? assets moving ….
ouch… n e one got a vicodin?
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
"New Man Law: If you don't show up for the draft you don't get to come later if you're picked. If you believe in yourself, show up and sit there. If nobody else believes in you, take it and cry like a man...in front of the cameras."
-Dave
Here's a question to all you naysayers (I include myself among you)
would you prefer the roster as it stands now instead of having Hedo? IE if somebody said to you that the only transaction we would make besides cutting scrubs, signing draft picks and extending Roy/Aldridge was to sign Hedo, would you prefer that we just kept our team as it stands?
"B-Roy is the best shooting guard I have played against"
-Ron Artest
I think Hedo could be a good addition...
if he didn’t kill our cap space, didn’t get a 5 year guaranteed contract, and didn’t make 10m a year. 3 years for 18-21m I could live with. I wouldn’t be stoked, but I wouldn’t need to drink either.
by dario argento on Jul 1, 2009 12:30 AM PDT up reply actions
but which upsets you less?
"B-Roy is the best shooting guard I have played against"
-Ron Artest
I agree with you
but only because Hedo costs too much. I would love him for this team if he was ‘signable’ at a midlevel exception type salary, because although going after him would actually be drifting away from the “defense first” philosophy we appear to be going after, his skills are unquestionable. I personally would rather not touch the 3 spot this offseason because I am completely drunk on the Webster kool aid.
"B-Roy is the best shooting guard I have played against"
-Ron Artest
if hedo was "free" i'd take him
i just think we can make our 9 mil in capspace go a LOT further
by prezofdeath on Jul 1, 2009 12:31 AM PDT up reply actions 2 recs
I don't answer "what if" questions
Ronald Reagan, RIP—we could sure use you, now
There never was a “stand pat” option on the table. That concept is so last February
absolutely
then we can make a move at the trade deadline or later.
Nooooo
This way lies madness
“let’s overpay for him, someone else will be just as stupid, I’m sure of it”
"I take the little gummy bear Flintstones vitamins…I try not to eat the lady. I try not to eat the man. Just give me the car. I try to find the car. Yea, worst case scenario, I eat the lady." - Ron Artest, 2009
I'm not saying that is the plan, just an option later. I'm scouring my brain for ways to make this seem positive.
by dario argento on Jul 1, 2009 12:35 AM PDT up reply actions
I feel ya
And it’s that brand of can-do creativity that will see us through these troubled times, sir.
"I take the little gummy bear Flintstones vitamins…I try not to eat the lady. I try not to eat the man. Just give me the car. I try to find the car. Yea, worst case scenario, I eat the lady." - Ron Artest, 2009
lets run the ship into the reef at full throttle
and maybe the impact will eject us all the way to an island paradise!
by two4larue on Jul 1, 2009 12:55 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
We do not need more SF's
We need a tough veteran backup big and a veteran backup PG.
Bill Parcells once said “you can’t stop progress” – referring to allowing your younger players to develop. With Nic and Martell we are maybe the deepest in the league on SF talent.
who?
are we saving our cap space for??? lebron or d wade in 2010? news flash none of those guys are coming to portland
haven't you heard?
we drafted Pendergraph and Cunningham in the second round! All of our backup PF problems is solved!
Just take deep breaths and go to your “happy Devin Harris place”
Not exactly
The Blazers made a point in their press release of mentioning how many games each player played in college. They seem to be thinking a “banger” 4 is not necessary and somewhat redundant when you have Oden/Pryzbilla at center. I wouldn’t be surprised if they view Hedo as able to play the 4 for 8-12 minutes a game while LMA rests and as a stopgap have mature rookies to step in if there is an injury.
Pendergraph is a garbageman though
Basically if he is strong enough he’ll be a banger. He rebounds and plays around the basket.
ps pg need = backup pf need >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sf need
If anybody answers The Birdman I will lobby for you to be banned from posting more or less forever
"I take the little gummy bear Flintstones vitamins…I try not to eat the lady. I try not to eat the man. Just give me the car. I try to find the car. Yea, worst case scenario, I eat the lady." - Ron Artest, 2009
He didn’t grow on me as a player and personality during the WCF. He didn’t! It. Did. Not. Happen.
"I take the little gummy bear Flintstones vitamins…I try not to eat the lady. I try not to eat the man. Just give me the car. I try to find the car. Yea, worst case scenario, I eat the lady." - Ron Artest, 2009
Besides, I’m just goofing around. He would make an outstanding frontcourt backup but there’s absolutely no way Denver doesn’t find a way to keep him, even at the expense of Jones, Kleiza etc.
"I take the little gummy bear Flintstones vitamins…I try not to eat the lady. I try not to eat the man. Just give me the car. I try to find the car. Yea, worst case scenario, I eat the lady." - Ron Artest, 2009
Yeah,
he’s staying in Denver. I think they might already have some sort of verbal agreement.
by Nick Van Excellent on Jul 1, 2009 12:47 AM PDT up reply actions
yep
too much of a fan favorite etc etc etc etc etc
Call me Crazy
…or not…but seeing as KP is cunning and sly, wouldn’t you expect the first free agent agent they called would be the last they would pick—that by driving the price up on their last option, they are keeping more available and cheaper their first, second, third options?
Buy low, sell high, baby.
Even if this weren’t a smokescreen, if I were the Blazers and wanted player X but couldn’t sign him for another week, I don’t think I would call him until the last moment.
Honor Alaa Abdelnaby.
First in the NBA. At least alphabetically
These deals have often been done the first 6 hours
Remember Nash leaving Dallas for Phoenix?
This year might be different.
I remember nothing
If KP really wants Hedo that badly, it’s because he think he can get him cheaply early, IMO. And still that doesn’t make sense because the agent can still listen to offers for seven days.
I still say because it’s happening so early, it ain’t happening; and since we’re hearing about it right away, it REALLY ain’t happening.
Honor Alaa Abdelnaby.
First in the NBA. At least alphabetically
I agree that this is likely smoke
but deals do happen early.
The owner, GM and coach all flew to Dallas to meet with Nash at 11:01 pm to make an offer that even exceeded Mark Cuban’s wallet. It got the job done.
I'll grant you
if some Nash-like point guard was available now that fit our needs in like fashion, I would do exactly as you describe and get him.
Cost no object.
Honor Alaa Abdelnaby.
First in the NBA. At least alphabetically
that reminds me of Pippen talking to Treebeard
“we need to go right by Isengard, it’ll be the last thing he expects. The closer we are to danger, the further we’ll be from harm”
I think I’d rather have an Ent to backup LMA than a Turk. How about you?
by two4larue on Jul 1, 2009 1:01 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
I think an Ent would start at center.
And even if he was available, people would say they didn’t want him because it would delay Oden’s development.
yeah i didn't want to watch
derek fisher hitting wide open three’s then having the announcers jocking his balls for not being worthless for once
by goblazers503 on Jul 1, 2009 12:44 AM PDT up reply actions
I saw it
was impressed. And now I’m ticked off that I am impressed.
BEAT LA! BEAT LA! BEAT LA!
There, I feel much better.
"B-Roy is the best shooting guard I have played against"
-Ron Artest
So much whining and bellyaching...
And I thought the audience here was better than other forums.
Say Hedo comes for $50m over 5 years. I bet all the complainers grow to love him within the first two months. Save the crying for three years from now?
You'd almost think...
That this deal was signed, sealed and delivered. Some pundit pulls a figure out of his posterior and all of a sudden we have Hedo for $50m and five years.
You’d also almost be tempted to think that there are no other players in the league getting paid big dollars at the end of their contracts with production that no longer justifies it.
Face it, even if the Blazers do go this route you’re figuring that this guy helps you go deeper into the playoffs right now. Even if he’s unable to continue to help you at the same level in three, four or five years you’ve had the chance for other youngsters to grow into their roles and take over that production.
As for alternatives, I’d like to hear them.
Hinrich: Probably my favorite choice. Still could be done after a deal for a Turkoglu or other SF via trade. Solid defense, runs the offense well, can create his own shot better than our incumbent, a smart and intelligent player.
Miller: Age even more of a concern than the player in question. Probably on the downside of his career. Great option to distribute for the team, can control the flow and pace of the game, tidy and efficient, poor distance shooter.
Nash/Kidd: Age even worse than above with even less guarantee of production in four or five years. Give you fantastic leadership and playmaking smarts. Huge intangibles and highly efficient. Will not be around for any glory run. Good mentors for youth on the team.
Prince: Seems too much like a Batum replacement now. Someone I was advocating before the season started, now priced out by our young Frenchman.
G. Wallace: Slashing, scoring, shot blocking, good defense. Would be awesome but… LARGE concerns over injuries. Prepared for the risk?
Ariza: Young and talented, my concerns are whether he fits the team culture. If so, not a bad option.
Battier: If Houston are dumping salary and rebuilding facing the loss of Yao, wouldn’t this guy be worth talking about?
Sessions: Stats are all over the place. Points up, assists down. Can he really shoot the three consistently? Want to mortgage the farm for him?
Millsap/Bass: Why do you want to spend large dollars on a 10-15 MPG backup for Aldridge? What makes you think that either of these guys would want to sign up for that limited duty?
Paul/Harris: Sure, while we’ve considering fantasy options, please come up with proposals that net either of these players without dismantling our team. Which name player do you give up? Aldridge? Oden?
Yes, there are options. Is Hedo Turkoglu right at the bottom of this sample of candidates? No, I don’t believe he is. Does Portland have to put dollars down to get the cream of the crop? Why yes, I believe they might have to.
by TheMadKiwi on Jul 1, 2009 8:59 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
"I take the little gummy bear Flintstones vitamins…I try not to eat the lady. I try not to eat the man. Just give me the car. I try to find the car. Yea, worst case scenario, I eat the lady." - Ron Artest, 2009
I think we've reached this part of the movie
Dr Ray Stantz: Fire and brimstone coming down from the skies! Rivers and seas boiling!
Dr. Egon Spengler: Forty years of darkness! Earthquakes, volcanoes…
Winston Zeddemore: The dead rising from the grave!
Dr. Peter Venkman: Human sacrifice, dogs and cats living together… mass hysteria!
Nice fellas
Fantastically quotable movie that reeks of brilliance.
With the current mass hysteria as you say, so apropos. :)
Besides Mass Hysteria can be fun
especially since entertainment opportunities are slim nearing 1:00 a.m.
At least the riot police have yet to be called.
Honor Alaa Abdelnaby.
First in the NBA. At least alphabetically
HTEC
Nothing to cry about in 4 years, 3 yes.
"Knowledge will get you from A to B. Creativity will get you anywhere." Einstein
by Garden of ODEN on Jul 1, 2009 1:51 AM PDT up reply actions
Agreed
Four years would be ideal. Not convinced the man and his agent are going to be excited by anything less than five though at his age. This is likely to be his last decent contract.
That has to be a major factor in determining how much he’s going to get paid and exactly where he ends up.
Maxey's quote
I’m hearing – regardless what occurs this offseason in free agency or trades – it’s now about survival of the fittest for the Blazers. Portland is moving on from the rebuilding project from a couple seasons back and it’s now time to separate the boys from the men.
So look for the Blazers to, “go after the best out there and let them fight it out” as one person in the know told me recently.
Adding Hedo to mix is like bringing a knife to a gunfight
Or being allies to the French in a World War
Or telling American soldiers to pull back in Viet Nam
(you get the picture)
And Vietnam was a tie
see A Fish Called Wanda
Honor Alaa Abdelnaby.
First in the NBA. At least alphabetically
Actually the French resistance was pretty instrumental in the early stages of WW2. Their guerilla warfare and insurgant intelligence was a big help to the allies.
by dario argento on Jul 1, 2009 1:01 AM PDT up reply actions
Well it sounds like we'll have the Frenchman and a Turk
I’m just not sure how long the Spaniard will stick around
Historical Precedent for Actual Terms Being Better than Reported
I have to call it a night, but I had one closing thought.
It seems to me that we’ve had similar concerns about the terms of contracts before. It seems like the early reports on both Martell and Outlaw’s contracts sounded outlandish.
But then we saw the terms included team options and other items that made it seem like a reasonable deal. This is the same general manager who struck those deals.
All of which makes me wonder if we’re not looking at $50 million where the 5th year is a team option that only has a certain percentage guaranteed.
If I use AK1984’s numbers from above, it could look something like:
Year 1 — 2009-2010: $8,750,000
Year 2 — 2010-2011: $9,400,000
Year 3 — 2011-2012: $10,000,000
Year 4 — 2012-2013: $10,600,000
Year 5 — 2013-2014: $11,250,000 Team Option w/ $4 million guaranteed.
That would be $42.75 million guaranteed. If Hedo performs, then he’ll be worth the full $50M for the fifth year.
A deal for $42.75 would likely still be a better offer than what he can find elsewhere. And the fact that Babby is babbling about the numbers likely indicates that he the deal isn’t quite as sweet as it is made out to be. He can’t seriously think there are a lot of $50M suitors out there.
So my reassuring thought for the night is that it may be $50M, but in a more acceptable way than we’re thinking.
hmmm....KP floats a number like 50 mil to Hedo's agent...but says we'll look at all our options
hedo’s agent immediately spills to the press, thinking that sets a good baseline for Hedo, and hopes bidding goes up even higher.
meanwhile, other teams cross hedo off their wish list and start pursuing other options, not wanting to fight Paul Allen and his mighty wallet.
When the smoke clears, no one is left with cap space besides us, and we say…PSYCH! and hedo has to sign with us for a couple bucks more than the MLE.
It’s brilliant.
by prezofdeath on Jul 1, 2009 12:54 AM PDT reply actions 1 recs
Any scenario wherein Hedo Turkoglu ends up with the Portland Trail Blazers is far, far from "brilliant."
by AK1984 on Jul 1, 2009 12:55 AM PDT up reply actions 3 recs
I'm going to bed
Tomorrow I’ll be having cereal for breakfast, but I’ll be substituting the milk with tears.
by LaColin on Jul 1, 2009 12:54 AM PDT reply actions 3 recs
That's the spirit
Live the dream baby
Honor Alaa Abdelnaby.
First in the NBA. At least alphabetically
No...
But not at the price of neglecting the point, or a banger in the frontcourt. That’s the beginning, middle, and end of this whole debate for me. I love Turkoglu on this team…in BizarroLand where we have $20 mil in cap space.
"I take the little gummy bear Flintstones vitamins…I try not to eat the lady. I try not to eat the man. Just give me the car. I try to find the car. Yea, worst case scenario, I eat the lady." - Ron Artest, 2009
im so tired or hearing about the
mythical creature that is the banger in the frontcourt. Here’s the deal its a position that will be occupied for what 10-15 minutes a game at most and is not going to be someone like bass. The fact is if bass leaves dallas then he leaves for a better job not the same job on a different team. If he wanted to remain a back up “banger” pf he would just stay in dallas but players are for the most part looking to be put in the best situation for themselves( aka players dont dream of being great back ups they dream of being starters) so either he leaves to become a starter somewhere, stays in dallas, or signs somewhere else for a lot more money. If u want a “banger” pf u draft them and hope they stay.
Good to know
Let’s not consider someone like Joe Smith, or Big Baby, or Leon Powe, all of whom can man PF for 15 minutes a game and have playoff experience. Or Sean May or Hakim Warrick, who are stuck on below-.500 teams in transition and might welcome a chance at a playoff run. Or the Baston kid from the Pacers, or Shelden Williams, young guys who may not have reached their ceiling or have never been paired with a physical tandem like Oden/Pryzbilla.
Just saying that our search doesn’t have to start with Lee and end with Millsap, and we don’t need someone who’ll draw a flagrant one every night en route to a double-double. I’m saying that throwing all our cap room at Hedo may restrict our flexibility when it comes to shoring up other areas. I don’t see what’s so unreasonable about that.
"I take the little gummy bear Flintstones vitamins…I try not to eat the lady. I try not to eat the man. Just give me the car. I try to find the car. Yea, worst case scenario, I eat the lady." - Ron Artest, 2009
i’m all for widening the lens… only thoughts: sounds like baby stays in boston… and powe is injured until the all star break… sean may has red flag questions about his work ethic…
i dig your logic and conclusions.
Thanks, and I agree that many of those names come with their own question marks (much like Turkoglu). Re: Big Baby, though, I don’t see it as a foregone conclusion that Sheed goes to the Spurs. If he winds up in Boston, Davis could be the odd man out.
Also I really wanted to put McDyess in that list but that’s just not realistic. I’ll throw out there, though, that in every free agent analysis I’m reading, there’s this pool of players where virtually everyone’s listing the Cavs, the Spurs, the Celtics, and the Magic as the likely suitors. Of the coveted veterans that want 20 minutes a game and a shot at a ring, a couple will be left on the outside. I’m talking about that pool of Varejao, Dice, Sheed, Bass, Odom, Grant Hill, the list goes on. Seems to be mainly vets on the downside who don’t have a ton of years left and want to go out with a good shot at a finals run (Bass is the exception in that minilist).
And between those teams, who do make logical fits and do have some money, there just won’t be enough to go around. And if I were a player in that mix, I’d rather take a shot at Portland and play with Roy and know I won’t get jacked around by the front office, rather than roll the bones with Chicago or, I dunno, the Bucks etc.
That’s why we need patience, and KP knows it. A month from now, Sheed will be signed and the Lakers will have picked between Odom and Ariza, and there will be guys whose agents will be saying, “Hey, bummer that Spurs offer didn’t come through for you….yeah, did everything we could. Listen, ever think about playing in Portland? Nice summers, pretty good lock for the playoffs, unselfish team, strong coach, good facilities, great fan support…” I just think we’ll look a lot better in 30-60 days than we look now. And honestly that’s as much due to the shallow pool of competing franchises with room to spend shrinking quickly as it’s due to anything else.
That’s it for me. Night y’all.
"I take the little gummy bear Flintstones vitamins…I try not to eat the lady. I try not to eat the man. Just give me the car. I try to find the car. Yea, worst case scenario, I eat the lady." - Ron Artest, 2009
ya but i just don't think
they are going to go after a back up pf in free agency, if they were they wouldn’t have drafted 2 pf’s in the draft. I think when all is said and done either pendergraph or outlaw will be the back up pf(i know really bold prediction)
also smith, big baby(way way overrated anyways) and powe all fit into the same situation as bass, why would they leave a good team for the same spot on another good team for similar money? and of those other guys the only one i would be at all interested in getting is warrick
either you're a glutton for punishment
or you really like controversy
oh wait, I forgot. You’re a BLAZER fan?
right
naw
i just think that so many ppl wanted the blazers to go get that final piece and i think turk on this team next year makes them legit championship contenders. he may not be the perfect fit but he makes the offense really scary.
No.
I would kinda like it. Think good thoughts.
“Hedo Turkoglu is the best pick and roll small forward in the league, after LeBron James. So the conversation starts there. His ability to handle, penetrate, shoot, change speeds, be crafty and unpredictable — all with excellent size and length — that’s a killer combination.”-Thorpe
I feel like that would be a pretty good player to stick next to Roy. Not my favorite choice, but it does make the team better. Our championship window would be cracked open immediately assuming they could trade Outlaw and some spare parts for a PG.
by Nick Van Excellent on Jul 1, 2009 1:18 AM PDT up reply actions
that's
exactly how i fell. although i think the championship window opens immediately whether or not we trade for a shiny new pg but that’s just me
I thought as11 and AK established that this is not possible?
"B-Roy is the best shooting guard I have played against"
-Ron Artest
sorry, i posted that wrong i guess. I think Turkoglu would not be included in the sign and trade. That it would be for different players.
by dario argento on Jul 1, 2009 1:15 AM PDT up reply actions
my bad.
I understand what you mean now.
"B-Roy is the best shooting guard I have played against"
-Ron Artest
I think he meant AND
as in…
Sign Turk
and then in a separate move that doesn’t include Turk
trade for Andre Milelr
why am I not surprised?
Holy canoli, Miller is making 15,500,000, how in the world is KP going commit roster hari-kari and do a sign and trade up to that amount?
That was last season
New contract time and no one is going to offer him anything close to that, though he’ll almost certainly command more than the MLE.
"I take the little gummy bear Flintstones vitamins…I try not to eat the lady. I try not to eat the man. Just give me the car. I try to find the car. Yea, worst case scenario, I eat the lady." - Ron Artest, 2009
If these are the big moves we make, we are going for it THIS YEAR, which is kind of exciting.
Assuming we give up Trout and Blake for Miller, and sign Turkoglu, our line-up would be
PG-Miller, Bayless, (3rd string vet cheap PG?, Mills? )
SG-Roy, Rudy, Marty
SF-Turkoglu, Marty, Batum
PF-LMA, ( vet PF? ), Pendergraph
C-Oden, LMA, Pendergraph
That’s a pretty ferocious starting 5 offensively. I worry about that line-ups ability to lock down on D in the half court in a 7 game series against a premier opponent.
by dario argento on Jul 1, 2009 1:39 AM PDT up reply actions
maybe we'll all wake up in the morning and find out this was only a dream
“there’s no place like home…there’s no place like home…”
New Jersey already has Terrence Williams and Courtney Lee
I don’t think they’d come calling about Rudy. They might want Batum though.
Hopefully this Hedo stuff goes away and Ariza or Bass can come play.
you're still in stage 1 -- denial
I can appreciate that
I wish I could tell you it’s all a smokescreen, but I’ve been down this road before
Different GM. Different coach. Different owner, even
same Blazer brain freeze…gotta love ‘em at least they’re predictable
Whoopee! We can lock Hedu up for FIVE YEARS!!!!
Honor Alaa Abdelnaby.
First in the NBA. At least alphabetically
The more I think about it, the less Hedo's age scares me
He’s never been a spectacular athlete. He is effective because of his unique combo of size, PG skills, craftyness and good shot. Plus, age is less important than mileage as we’ve seen in high school players breaking down completely in their late 20’s (T-Mac for example).
I don’t think a 34 year old Turk will be that much less effective than a 30 year old one.
Then you look at his drop off from just last year alone
and you start to get stared again, also the fact that he had a most improved year shows that before he has a long history of poor play.
"Knowledge will get you from A to B. Creativity will get you anywhere." Einstein
Hedo NOT play defense
For me it’s a prerequisite that a guy be a decent to very good defender if we’re going to add him with the intention of getting rings. The way Hedo closed out on shooters and rotated was downright embarassing and that was the NBA finals so that’s as good as it’s ever going to get folks.
My number one option is to trade for Rudy Gay. He’s extremely quick with freakish elite level athleticism and a good defender who rebounds well for his position, can handle the ball and create for himself or others, willing and good passer, has a nice slashing game, midrange game, and can shoot it from deep fairly well. His career shooting percentages are just a point or so under Brandon Roy’s for 3pt% and overall %. His bbiq seems to be pretty good but he’s stuck on a lousy team so it’s hard to tell but he definitely fits our timeline.
Barring the above, I’d love to see Grant Hill and Antonio McDyess come in and support the culture for the next few years mentoring the kids while still contributing at a pretty high level. Next step down would be Brandon Bass and Anthony Parker to fill in around the edges after whatever other trades KP has in mind. Can’t wait to find out what’s under the tree, is it July 8th yet?!
"I'm a buffet of goodness."
Did you just advocate us needing defense and mention getting Rudy Gay in the very same post?
Gay was THE worst player in the NBA statistically last year (he allowed 9.3 more points per 100 possessions).
Two years ago the Griz were 8 points better without him on the court defensively. He’s just about as bad a defender as there could possibly be. His athleticism allows him to remove himself from plays better than anyone I’ve seen in a while, and he’s exactly as good at rebounding as Travis Outlaw (9 per 100).
Rudy Gay is an inefficient ballhog who is worse on D than Turkoglu
at least Turk makes some effort on D and passes the ball occasionally.
I think
that this is a smokescreen to get someone (Detroit) to overpay for Hedo so we can pick up Ariza.
Come on you gotta listen unto me,
lay off that whiskey and let that cocaine be. ~Johnny Cash
KP opinion > Collective Bedge Board opinion
This board wants KP to NOT sign Hedo almost as much as it wanted him to draft Adam Morrison in 2006.
yeah, but this time we're right
and we ‘ve got Turk’s NBA stats to show what kind of player he is
as opposed to Gonzaga stats to guess at what kind of NBA player the ’stache would be
(not to mention the 2009 Blazer roster has some specific “holes” to fill, as opposed to the ’06 draft when selecting the “BPA” was the main consideration)
If KP signs Turk he’s not going to be able to justify the decision based on his past ability to make deals on draft day and come away with Roy and Aldridge. Signing FA’s to LTCs is like apples-oranges when compared to moving around on the draft board and selecting rookies.)
Ring...Ring...Ring
LMA: “Hello?”
KP: “Hey LaMarcus, this is Kevin”
LMA: “How ya doin, Kevin? What’s up”
KP: “I’ve got Brandon on the line, too. You still there Brandon?”
BR: “Yup; I’m still here.”
KP: “Say, I wanted to get together with you guys at the start of free agent season just to touch base for a moment. We’ve already gotten in touch with your agents to work on your extensions. Just wanted you to hear it from me first.”
LMA and BR: “Great! Thanks Kevin”
KP: “One more thing guys before I let you go”
LMA and BR: “What’s that?”
KP: “You know that pick-and-roll thing we’ve been talking about?”
LMA and KP, glumly: “yeahhhhh? What’s wrong with the pick-and-pop”
KP: "Your pick-and-pop is fine, but we’re talking pick-and-roll. We want it to be part of our offense. You guys really need to show some progress on this or I’ll be forced to take drastic action.
BR: “What do you mean?”
KP: “Well, you’re gonna hear in the media that we’re making an offer to Hedo Turkoglu. You know, he plays a really mean pick-and-roll.”
LMA and BR: “Hey, boss, we’re on it. Pick-and-roll. In fact, we’ll get into the gym tonight.”
KP: “That’s the spirit, guys. Great attitude. Hey, gotta run to call Hedo. You guys have a good one.”
Holy cow! 647 posts!
Anyhoo, I can understand why the Blazers would want Hedo. Take pressure off of b-roy, match up problems for other teams, pick and roll with GO….I’m kind of warming up to the idea of having him on the Blazers… but not for 5 years 50 mil. I would do more like, 3 years 25 mil. I guess Trout’s as good as gone if it does go this way. Oh Travis, how I will miss your awkward shots and your running around trying to get back on defense. Wherever you end up, try not to burn the Blazers too much with your clutch shooting (I will truly miss that).
Hey Guys!
What ever happened to “in KP we trust?” If KP believe that Hedo is our best option and will make the team better, I’m on board with him. He’s done enough for us that I want to at least see his newly acquired talent before calling it a bad move.
I also would be stunned if we actually give 5 years, 50 million. But, again, if KP thinks he’s worth it…I’m on board until he’s proven otherwise.
Continue to trust KP people!
If the free agent you’re about to sign is aware that he’s going to be traded immediately upon signing, this is legal. So, if a free-agent contract is specifically designed to be a sign-and-trade deal, it’s okay. Going this route would definitely give you a much larger pool or prospects, provided you could find a willing trade partner, and a willing free agent. If a team that’s over the cap has a free agent its targeting, it would just have to find a team that’s under the cap to help them, and then, of course, you’d have to find a trade that works.
I find this scenario from Mike Barrett intriguing, making Hedo available to a team without cap space in exchange for something that helps us out a little more.
Coon is pretty clear on this (#76).
Under no circumstances can a team sign and then trade another team’s free agent.
So either he or Barret is wrong.
Barrett's wrong
Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....
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