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Blazers Edge Community Podcast -- Episode 005 (Ben & KP2)

Craziness! Episode 005 is here, and with it, some brilliance from two of the game's best--Ben Golliver and Kevin Pelton.


Topics included Nicolas Batum and his role on this team, draft theory, Tom Penn and whether or not Bill Simmons could run the T-Wolves, point guard talk, round 2 of the playoffs, and even a little Mark Cuban, just to keep things interesting.

We did talk very briefly about pre-draft workouts, but for the low-down on that, just read Ben's article.

Direct Stream

Stream of the show can be found by clicking here.

Episode Details -- 59:33, 40.28MB

Our podcast feed can be found at http://feeds2.feedburner.com/becommunity.

If you need help subscribing via iTunes or another podcast catcher, feel free to email me.

Still a Community Podcast!

This is definitely a community podcast--if you've emailed me about being on the show, I haven't forgotten about you! Part of it is just waiting till May 19 to go heavy on draft talk (when we know the lottery order)......but yeah, the more people we can have on the better.

If you don't want to be on the program but you have a topic you'd like us to address or a question you'd like us to answer, you can email/Twitter me and we'll get to that as well.

Discuss

Alright, feel free to fill it up. There was a lot of good stuff today, the obvious result of having KP2 and Ben together....which, by the way, it sounds like they g-chat way more than is healthy.

In seriousness, a BIG thanks goes out for them for coming on the show. Aside from KP2 using the podcast to get girls to email him, I thought they were both pretty solid.

So what'd you think? Bill Simmons a GM? How valuable is Batum? Thoughts on this year's playoffs? Fire away.

Comment 94 comments  |  11 recs  | 

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Big time

"The brownies,'' Fernandez said after the game. "The brownies are good for me to make three-points.''

by Sabonis4Ever on May 12, 2009 8:33 PM PDT reply actions  

simmons

can’t be worse then mchale, and would definitely bring them more media attention even if he fails miserably

"Howard, he know me" Rudy

by phillyduck23 on May 12, 2009 8:45 PM PDT reply actions  

They should hire him as a PR consultant

Penn, Hinkie, Lindsey, maybe even Kahn (as president) and the internal solution with Hoiberg could all work better.

"Officiating has to be a science, not an art" - Rick Carlisle

by Norsktroll on May 12, 2009 8:49 PM PDT up reply actions  

i wonder if

all those guys have turned them down. i would think they would already be signed if they wanted to go there

"Howard, he know me" Rudy

by phillyduck23 on May 12, 2009 8:52 PM PDT up reply actions  

The Minnesota T'wolves already have got a CEO (i.e., Rob Moor) and President (i.e., Chris Wringt).

It, therefore, makes sense why David Kahn didn’t get the Vice President of Basketball Operations gig.

by AK1984 on May 13, 2009 4:32 AM PDT up reply actions  

I sense Ben is a "go big or go home" guy ;-)

"Officiating has to be a science, not an art" - Rick Carlisle

by Norsktroll on May 12, 2009 9:01 PM PDT reply actions  

Mo Williams is a funny example

I don’t think KP was sold that he would be a “championship quality point guard”. What did the Cavs give up for him? A fairly useless player in Damon Jones and Joe Smith (who has since returned to the Cavs, historical irony), plus Ridnour from the Sonics in a three-team trade. Come on. The Blazers could easily have matched that in terms of personnel, not so much in terms of mutual attraction to Williams. And the Bucks wanted to get rid of his contract – that they had just signed him to.

Something like this could easily happen again if the right player hits the market. But the feeling that KP is a bit enamored with his players and hesitant to give up on young projects is probably also true, as also Bill Simmons insinuated.

"Officiating has to be a science, not an art" - Rick Carlisle

by Norsktroll on May 12, 2009 9:11 PM PDT reply actions  

it's just hard to know who the right piece is going to be. I might have gone with Iverson over Mo Williams if given the choice a year ago

and look how epically that experiment failed. I know they got cap room and all that, but dang. I never thought that Detroit would be better off without him until I saw it with my own eyes.

TheTinfoil: Prez, could we please get Fatty on one of these [podcasts]?
annthefan: Fatty would be awesome! Get him on there with Timbo. Now, that's entertainment.
pualo: Nah, Timbo would just talk to himself the whole time.

by prezofdeath on May 12, 2009 9:19 PM PDT up reply actions  

Steve Blake is really just a poor man's Mo Williams

Mo does almost nothing but shoot. His defense is only marginally better than Blake, the Cavs are just much better at masking it with a guy like Varejao behind him. Williams is much better at hitting open shots (both him and Blake’s strengths), but the only reason he’s an all star is because he gets to play alongside LeBron.

To be honest, if I’m going to take a player off Cleveland to play PG, I’d probably go with Delonte. He’s a worse shooter, but still passable, a little bit better at getting to the rack, and a much better defender. Although, sadly, it is downright painful listening to him in interviews.

by Royster on May 13, 2009 8:52 AM PDT up reply actions  

how about travis plus our pick

for a top 5 pick. if we could get the 6th for telfair and one less year of rlec then in this economy we could maybe get top 5 for trout and a pick

"Howard, he know me" Rudy

by phillyduck23 on May 12, 2009 9:22 PM PDT reply actions  

plus cash

(of course)

"Howard, he know me" Rudy

by phillyduck23 on May 12, 2009 9:23 PM PDT up reply actions  

Wow

prez becomes big time.

draft rodrigue beaubois

by Cablinasian on May 12, 2009 9:46 PM PDT reply actions  

i'm the same old goofball...btw gave you a shout out somewhere in there...

you should come on to talk draft and pimp dejuan blair and kirk

TheTinfoil: Prez, could we please get Fatty on one of these [podcasts]?
annthefan: Fatty would be awesome! Get him on there with Timbo. Now, that's entertainment.
pualo: Nah, Timbo would just talk to himself the whole time.

by prezofdeath on May 12, 2009 9:49 PM PDT up reply actions  

DeJuan Blair... the word has been spread.

I’ve moved onto Rodrigue Beaubois. I still love Blair, but people are now pretty aware of him.

draft rodrigue beaubois

by Cablinasian on May 12, 2009 10:42 PM PDT up reply actions  

I know why we show up on google for DeJuan Blair

i posted about 5000 comments with the name in my signature… can’t hurt.

draft rodrigue beaubois

by Cablinasian on May 12, 2009 11:07 PM PDT reply actions  

Ben thinks that some of the Blazers are less than interesting interviews?

"Aneurysm".

When Outlaw wins a game on a last-second shot, it’s called an "annthefaneurysm". QualityPie

by annthefan on May 12, 2009 11:59 PM PDT reply actions  

yeah i was curious about that too

It was almost like a throwaway comment right at the end of one his segments and I didn’t really process what he had actually said until we had moved on to something else…

the thing from KP2 that I let slip by that I wanted to ask him was what do we do when Nic is outmatched by weight. Ron Ron had like 50 pounds of weight on him. Do you bench your starting small forward if he’s just too small in that situation? Does he play through it? Do you encourage him to put on some pounds or would that change his game?

TheTinfoil: Prez, could we please get Fatty on one of these [podcasts]?
annthefan: Fatty would be awesome! Get him on there with Timbo. Now, that's entertainment.
pualo: Nah, Timbo would just talk to himself the whole time.

by prezofdeath on May 13, 2009 12:25 AM PDT up reply actions  

That's a good question.

Prince, who is obviously a great defender, has had a terrible time over the years trying to guard bigger guys like Lebron. I imagine it will be the same thing for Batum. He’s just not that type of player.

Roy is the best player in the world with the exception of Incarcerated Mike from Queensbridge .

by Nick Van Excellent on May 13, 2009 1:51 AM PDT up reply actions  

I like the idea of the Portland Trail Blazers third-string small forward spot being employed by ...

a annual rotating barrage of well-built lockdown perimeter defenders — such as Ime Udoka next season, Trenton Hassell in 2010-2011, et cetera — who are cheap, yet solid veteran signings off of the scrap heap to provide the team with an option when Nicolas Batum is overmatched against bigger opponents such as LeBron James, Ron Artest, et al.

Now, Batum would still start versus teams like the Cleveland Cavaliers; however, if he has trouble with containing James during the first 6 or so minutes, he’ll be benched for the rest of the game in lieu of someone like Udoka. Heck, it’s all about having a well-balanced roster.

by AK1984 on May 13, 2009 3:48 AM PDT up reply actions  

One maneuver critique independent of the great content: Did Ben become the host by default?

It felt like he was taking over the direction and asking most of the questions to KP2 and Prez unless I’m confusing voices. Of course it was a free-flowing conversation (thanks Bill) and it was very interesting, but the same thing happened to some degree when he was on Phoenix Stan’s podcast. Is it because Ben is so used to leading the interview :) Are the Oregonian’s articles in reality full of questions Ben asked — I think he once said he lets the guys on deadline go first to interview the players and Nate while he is just in the background? No offense Ben, just an observation.

"Officiating has to be a science, not an art" - Rick Carlisle

by Norsktroll on May 13, 2009 4:49 AM PDT reply actions  

I noticed the same thing

Might have been the plan all along though.

draft rodrigue beaubois

by Cablinasian on May 13, 2009 7:36 AM PDT up reply actions  

yeah, well Ben knows KP2 better than I do

so it made sense for him to ask some of the questions. We’re flexible….it doesn’t really matter to me who’s in what role…although I will say it did surprise me a little bit ;-) It actually was kind of nice to not have to think too hard about drumming up questions.

TheTinfoil: Prez, could we please get Fatty on one of these [podcasts]?
annthefan: Fatty would be awesome! Get him on there with Timbo. Now, that's entertainment.
pualo: Nah, Timbo would just talk to himself the whole time.

by prezofdeath on May 13, 2009 10:54 AM PDT up reply actions  

I agree with Ben on the PG situation

I just don’t know if there is an easy solution. The Blazers are kind of like the Vikings, who just need a quarterback. Simmons said they could have had a few all easy like, but all of his knowledge is based off of rumors. My self talk is that the Blazers are in the same situation. Do you commit to the young QB or replace him with someone who’ll be around for more than a year or two, and is there someone like that available? I think Bayless could be the guy just not for another year. If the team sticks with him, then they just need an old vet to crutch the Blazers until then.

I pretty much agree on the PF banger issue too. The Jazz had it the right way behind Boozer with a young guy like Milsap and an old guy like Harpring. I don’t want someone who is demanding minutes behind LA, I just want someone who is deserving and capable of the minutes. I don’t care if he gets them though and neither should an old guy or a young guy. I’m sure KP can get the banger late in the draft or from a trade or free agency. Either way, it’s not a priority.

So to me, there are no pressing off season moves. If KP can’t get a championship caliber point guard to lead the Blazers for the next 5-10 years, then he has to hitch his wagon to Bayless and get a crusty vet point guard. The back up PF situation is an easy patch. That just leave the SF situation, which is a wait and see what we have with Webster and how Batum improved over the off season. After training camp or by the trade deadline is when the Blazers should figure out what to do with all the guys who can play SF on the roster.

by tominhawaii on May 13, 2009 5:14 AM PDT reply actions  

I agree with you.

Although you should have used more sarcasm and possibly a sexual innuendo or two.

Roy is the best player in the world with the exception of Incarcerated Mike from Queensbridge .

by Nick Van Excellent on May 13, 2009 1:43 PM PDT up reply actions  

You're thinking of the other guy.

"Aneurysm".

When Outlaw wins a game on a last-second shot, it’s called an "annthefaneurysm". QualityPie

by annthefan on May 13, 2009 1:50 PM PDT up reply actions  

tominrehab? I thought they were the same person.

Roy is the best player in the world with the exception of Incarcerated Mike from Queensbridge .

by Nick Van Excellent on May 13, 2009 3:14 PM PDT up reply actions  

Haha. 8-{

"Aneurysm".

When Outlaw wins a game on a last-second shot, it’s called an "annthefaneurysm". QualityPie

by annthefan on May 13, 2009 3:32 PM PDT up reply actions  

What's a database?

Roy is the best player in the world with the exception of Incarcerated Mike from Queensbridge .

by Nick Van Excellent on May 13, 2009 3:47 PM PDT up reply actions  

I would love for the blazers to pull a PG or PF

From nowhere (D-League, Europe, Asia, etc.) on the cheap that turns out to be championship caliber. I’m looking for the cinderella story, more Batum’s please.

Must... ...not... ...like... ...the... ...Nuggets....

by appel82 on May 13, 2009 8:00 AM PDT reply actions  

take him out of your sig.

before he gets in trouble with one of his profs! :-)

Must... ...not... ...like... ...the... ...Nuggets....

by appel82 on May 13, 2009 8:23 AM PDT up reply actions  

the french connection

could be sexy

Must... ...not... ...like... ...the... ...Nuggets....

by appel82 on May 13, 2009 8:24 AM PDT up reply actions  

He is a nice second round pick (maybe with our 38) as a project, but probably not NBA ready in more than a deep bench role

A PER of 15 in the French league doesn’t exactly scream “championship” – neither in the NBA nor in France where they came out 9th of 16 this year. Nic was at a PER of 20 in his last year there.

"Officiating has to be a science, not an art" - Rick Carlisle

by Norsktroll on May 13, 2009 8:30 AM PDT up reply actions  

if you can't trade up for Blair or Rubio

sitting pat and taking Collison sounds awfully fine to me.

by as11osu on May 13, 2009 2:49 PM PDT up reply actions  

the next

aaron brooks, only with more defense

"Howard, he know me" Rudy

by phillyduck23 on May 14, 2009 11:53 AM PDT up reply actions  

Oh, I don't think he'll be an impact player any time soon

more a guy that we can talk about for the next two years as he develops in France.

draft rodrigue beaubois

by Cablinasian on May 13, 2009 12:27 PM PDT up reply actions  

I figured out the podcast I want to do

I want to be on with Mortimer and then have Prez ask basketball questions and then see how many times Mortimer and I can go off topic.

by tominhawaii on May 13, 2009 8:53 AM PDT reply actions  

rated NC-17

What ever happened to NC-17? It seems like they just don’t rate movies if they are a little worse than R now.

Must... ...not... ...like... ...the... ...Nuggets....

by appel82 on May 13, 2009 8:55 AM PDT up reply actions  

Oh, and for whatever it's worth, there's only one answer to the point guard quandry.

Image and video hosting by TinyPic

In fact, I’ve been talking up Kirk Hinrich like a crazed lunatic since SEPTEMBER of 2008!

“A lot of Jerryd Bayless’ stigma comes from his time at Arizona last season. While in college, Bayless was definitely a me-first combo guard who played hideous defense and couldn’t effectively facilitate the offense. Now, whether or not Bayless can develop by adusting his playing style to enhance his overall game is an unknown quantity, but I wouldn’t bet on it.

That’s not necessarily a negative, however, since Bayless’ sweet mid-range game and tenacity at driving to the basket reminds me of Monta Ellis — as well as Jay Williams, who was performing well prior to his career-ending motorcyle accident — which’ll make him a dangerous threat offensively.

On the whole, though, it’s doubtful to me that Bayless will ever become a true floor general, so he’ll be best suited playing off of the ball alongside a shooting guard who can handle the playmaking duties. Brandon Roy fits that description, although his one-on-one perimeter defense also isn’t stellar.

Indeed, a player like Bayless has deficiencies that must be masked by a well-rounded backcourt teammate — such as Andre Iguodala, who can both shut down his opponent, clog the passing lanes on defense, handle the rock, and unselfishly defer to his teammates — otherwise, he’ll be constantly exposed at the professional level.

Thankfully, though, Roy compensates for all but one of Bayless’ drawbacks. Yet, that notwithstanding, I’m still of the mindset that Kirk Hinrich would ultimately be the perfect complement to Roy. Because their strengths and weaknesses are the opposite of each other, they’d combine to form a well-balanced tandem."

http://www.blazersedge.com/2008/9/13/613680/steve-blake-is-starting-an#8756998

“Kirk Hinrich and Cedric Simmons — who, to the best of my knowledge, has an expiring contract — for Raef LaFrentz and Jerryd Bayless is a fair trade. Hinrich, unlike Bayless, would be an outstanding fit alongside Brandon Roy.

Hinrich plays top-notch defense, too, which is one of Bayless’ many weaknesses — although several folks around here wrongly claim that he’s good at it — thus, there’d be a huge upgrade on that end of the court."

http://www.blazersedge.com/2008/10/31/650905/bulls-blazers-trade#9742364

I was right about Hinrich — as well as Jerryd Bayless, who flamed out this year even worse than expected by a hater like me — and there’s no denying it.

by AK1984 on May 13, 2009 9:32 AM PDT reply actions  

how do shed the cap space gained w/ hinrich? or do you eat it?

Who then runs with the second unit? Bayless, Sergio, or new project PG?

Must... ...not... ...like... ...the... ...Nuggets....

by appel82 on May 13, 2009 9:36 AM PDT up reply actions  

or how do make room to make up for what you lost rather

Must... ...not... ...like... ...the... ...Nuggets....

by appel82 on May 13, 2009 9:37 AM PDT up reply actions  

Oh, that's an old trade proposal from September of 2008.

Right now, the deal on the table would be Steve Blake and Travis Outlaw to the Chicago Bulls for Kirk Hinrich. The hope afterward would be that the Bulls waive Blake — whose $4,000,000 salary is fully non-guaranteed for next season if he’s waived prior to or on 6/30/2009 — subsequently, the Portland Trail Blazers would sign him to a two-year, $4,139,200 contract (i.e., 2009-2010: $1,990,000 & 2010-2011: $2,149,200) with the bi-annual exceptionafter the July moratorium.

That’d leave the Trail Blazers with a point guard rotation of Hinrich for about 32 minutes per game and Blake for about 16 minutes per game, while Jerryd Bayless and Sergio Rodriguez would be put on the trading block.

by AK1984 on May 13, 2009 9:46 AM PDT up reply actions  

Shoot, that original trade proposal was actually from back in October of 2008.

It’s the old comments of mine about Jerryd Bayless that are from September of 2008.

by AK1984 on May 13, 2009 9:48 AM PDT up reply actions  

will the second unit be as effective with blake's apparent non ablity to control tempo?

or is ben wrong in his assessment of blake’s lack of tempo controlling ability?

Must... ...not... ...like... ...the... ...Nuggets....

by appel82 on May 13, 2009 9:56 AM PDT up reply actions  

Regarding the slow-paced, methodical tempo, if anyone wants to harp on that they ought ...

to look directly at head coach Nate McMillan love of the high/low zone offense in the half-court. There’s a reason McMillan played Antonio Daniels ahead of Luke Ridnour when coaching the Seattle SuperSonics — which, by the way, was the right decision — and had a downright failed relationship with Sergio Rodriguez in Portland. With McMillan at the helm, the Trail Blazes will never run a fast-paced, run-and-gun offensive system that some people yearn for around here.

As much as I rag on McMillan for being an overrated defensive coach and running a simplistic scheme on offense, I must give him credit for the efficiency of his basic sets. Now, while a part of that efficiency is due to the Trail Blazers proficiency on the offensive glass, that still doesn’t change how McMillan coached his squad well on offense throughout the 2008-2009 regular season.

by AK1984 on May 13, 2009 10:38 AM PDT up reply actions  

I think they'll run more next year

The Blazers will never be a running team since Nate is the coach. At the end of the season he kept yelling at the team to run, and the team always seemed to have this “oh yeah” response. Nate has always had the athletes to run, just not the players with court awareness and he didn’t trust them to pull it off. Sergio was the only player looking up court for someone to throw to after a defensive rebound, and now a good percentage of the players are either running or looking up court for a long pass.

Next year, Rudy, Bayless, Oden, and Batum will all be second year players. Regardless of any player moves that may or may not happen this year, everyone who stays, will be more familiar with the offense, Nate, and their teammates. Nate will trust them, and they will worry less about making Nate mad. It’s good old evolution of everything from the team to the coaching.

A lot of NCAA Championships are won by rosters full of senior players. Kansas is a good example. They won because they were experience and they were experienced playing with each other.

People judge and try to speculate about trades based on stats. They pigeonhole rookies based on their rookie season then argue that you can’t make comparisons of players without more data. I am an admitted homer, I know that trades can have a huge impact upon a team, and that they are a part of the game. They happen and probably will happen and that’s jiggy and whatnot. I get excited about trades too, after they happen. There is no “trade” or “stat” in “team.”

It seems my rant went off topic. I don’t feel like cutting that junk out so I’ll just wrap this up by saying the team will run more next year, because a lot of crucial players won’t be rookies, and everyone will have a year of experience with each other and Nate’s coaching.

P.S.

Boner

P.S.S.

Fart

P.S.S.S.

Live long and prosper.

by tominhawaii on May 13, 2009 4:19 PM PDT up reply actions  

yeh, i really liked that chauncy billups article in the fanshots

everyone labeled chauncy a “bust” before he even had a chance to get going. rookies can change, especially when they’ve only played one year of college like bayless.

TheTinfoil: Prez, could we please get Fatty on one of these [podcasts]?
annthefan: Fatty would be awesome! Get him on there with Timbo. Now, that's entertainment.
pualo: Nah, Timbo would just talk to himself the whole time.

by prezofdeath on May 13, 2009 4:35 PM PDT up reply actions  

there are plenty of answers to this question

Two years ago Harris, last year Conley Jr. Obviously if you can do something to get Rubio without moving the big 3… that’s in there too. You really need to broaden your horizons a bit. Having Brandon being the only guy that can penetrate on this team isn’t good for him long term, and Hinrich just can’t do that. Also, he’s a TON older than the other prospects we talk about and just doesn’t really fit our long term window. Should we be giving up assets for 2-3 years worth of return? I’m not liking that as a GM. Its not only that patience is a virtue, but there are better PG’s out there to be had if we pony up the right package.

by as11osu on May 13, 2009 2:58 PM PDT up reply actions  

Then keep Bayless.

Or… trade Bayless for Mike Conley Jr, I’m sure you could get that deal done somehow. Either way, neither Bayless or Conley is going to be ready for another couple years and Blake isn’t going to cut it for the short term. In two years you could just slide Hinrich to the second unit and everything would be fine.

Roy is the best player in the world with the exception of Incarcerated Mike from Queensbridge .

by Nick Van Excellent on May 13, 2009 3:46 PM PDT up reply actions  

To be honest, I wouldn't mind a Bayless-Conley trade at all

like you said, neither will be ready for a couple years, but Conley is a whole lot closer to being ready than Jerryd is now that Hollins got a lot of his growing pains floor time out of the way. Conley looked just as deadly penetrating, if not moreso, in college as Jerryd, and I love to be able to put the Indiana connection together here in Portland.

Maybe we could use some cap space to sweeten the deal by taking one or two bad contracts (Jaric or Darko?) off their hands to sweeten the deal for them.

by Royster on May 13, 2009 4:10 PM PDT up reply actions  

Do you think things have cooled enough with Memphis that they would be open to trade talks again? Honestly, for them getting Bayless is sort of like shooting the moon.

It’s more risky than keeping Conely, but if Bayless develops his entire skill set he will be a different kind of animal in this league. I think he’s a got a much higher ceiling than Conley, just maybe less of a chance of reaching it.

What do you think?

Roy is the best player in the world with the exception of Incarcerated Mike from Queensbridge .

by Nick Van Excellent on May 13, 2009 4:24 PM PDT up reply actions  

I think Portland would have to include somebody else in the deal

I don’t think the Miles situation would prevent a trade with Memphis, but I really have no idea.

by jksnake99 on May 13, 2009 4:34 PM PDT up reply actions  

I don't think Conley is ideal for either franchise - although he would be an upgrade for us

That Blake + Outlaw for Conley, Crittenton and Warrick (expiring) trade rumored last fall doesn’t look bad in hindsight.

Both Mayo and Roy are lead guards that need to handle the ball a lot in isos and picks to be effective on offense. Mayo might be a bit more of a point guard than Roy, so maybe they would be best off if they could acquire another top shooting guard in the future.

"Officiating has to be a science, not an art" - Rick Carlisle

by Norsktroll on May 13, 2009 4:54 PM PDT up reply actions  

I disagree.

I don’t think Roy needs to handle the ball a lot. It’s just been that way by default since we haven’t had a PG who could really create for others. Roy would probably be more effective playing next to a pure point guard, as much as people like to talk about Roy being perfect as the main facilitator I just don’t believe it.

I like the ball in Roy’s hands durring the fourth quarter, but ideally I would prefer a PG who could keep the ball movement going and occasionally throw a decent entry pass into the post. Roy can’t really do either at a championship level.

Roy is the best player in the world with the exception of Incarcerated Mike from Queensbridge .

by Nick Van Excellent on May 13, 2009 5:06 PM PDT up reply actions  

Agreed about the Conley-Bayless summary

As much as anyone rags on him for this year, Bayless has an absurdly high ceiling, I just think he has a pretty tiny chance to hit that theoretical ceiling, especially as a Blazer where he probably will never have that much of a leash, and we have three other guys (4 counting Rudy) who will need their fair share of offensive touches. It’s not like Parker in SA, where his first couple years, the only guy on the team who needed shots was Duncan.

I still love Conley, though, and think his ceiling is plenty high to the point of being in that Devin Harris/Jose Calderon tier of PGs. I don’t think the Miles situation would be too much to overcome, though. If anything, the animosity should be from us, and I think KP is too much of a professional to let that prevent him from making a move.

by Royster on May 13, 2009 5:07 PM PDT up reply actions  

Yeah, I agree.

Bayless has an absurdly weird skill set. He could end up being some crazy version of Rondo, only with a jump shot and better post defense.

I’m not sure who you could compare his best case scenario to. Gary Paton? A better version of Maurice Cheeks?

Roy is the best player in the world with the exception of Incarcerated Mike from Queensbridge .

by Nick Van Excellent on May 13, 2009 5:24 PM PDT up reply actions  

Chauncy?

TheTinfoil: Prez, could we please get Fatty on one of these [podcasts]?
annthefan: Fatty would be awesome! Get him on there with Timbo. Now, that's entertainment.
pualo: Nah, Timbo would just talk to himself the whole time.

by prezofdeath on May 13, 2009 5:29 PM PDT up reply actions  

Yeah.

He does remind me of him. I don’t think Billups drew fouls the way Bayless does at such a young age though.

Roy is the best player in the world with the exception of Incarcerated Mike from Queensbridge .

by Nick Van Excellent on May 13, 2009 5:34 PM PDT up reply actions  

I think Bayless at his theoretical "ceiling"

would have a much better ability to get to the rack than Chauncey ever did. I think some sort of uber athletic version of Kevin Johnson would be his ideal case, but like I said, I’m very skeptical of his ability to get there as a Blazer.

by Royster on May 13, 2009 5:35 PM PDT up reply actions  

His work ethic is encouraging though.

If he doesn’t get there it won’t be for lack of effort.

Roy is the best player in the world with the exception of Incarcerated Mike from Queensbridge .

by Nick Van Excellent on May 13, 2009 5:37 PM PDT up reply actions  

Kevin Johnson was an über-athletic player, so I don't get that remark.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/fc/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&p1=bayleje01&y1=2009&p2=johnske02&y2=1988

Yeah, let’s not disparage Johnson — who was a pure point guard — by comparing him to an undersized, overmatched shooting guard such as Bayless.

by AK1984 on May 13, 2009 5:48 PM PDT up reply actions  

We are talking about his ceiling.

Of course Bayless would have to learn how to play the point just like other successful combo guards like Billups, Parker, Harris, Rondo, etc.

uIf he learns how to run an offense then he wouldn’t be an undersized shooting guard anymore, would he? Hence the word “ceiling”, and the comparison to KJ.

Roy is the best player in the world with the exception of Incarcerated Mike from Queensbridge .

by Nick Van Excellent on May 13, 2009 5:55 PM PDT up reply actions  

Kevin Johnson wasn't exactly a guy who played above the rim

But he was very underrated for what history remembers.

And this is hardly what I believe Bayless will become, especially if he stays on the Blazers, but just like Stromile Swift’s ceiling was to become a transformative big man, and Darko had a monster ceiling, not everyone gets anywhere close to their ceilings. I agree with your assessment of the most likely cases below, but I’m talking about a situation in which absolutely everything goes right for Bayless, not what I expect to happen.

by Royster on May 13, 2009 5:57 PM PDT up reply actions  

I remember when he dunked on Hakeem.

It was awesome.

TheTinfoil: Prez, could we please get Fatty on one of these [podcasts]?
annthefan: Fatty would be awesome! Get him on there with Timbo. Now, that's entertainment.
pualo: Nah, Timbo would just talk to himself the whole time.

by prezofdeath on May 13, 2009 6:09 PM PDT up reply actions  

Let's not disparage Gary Payton's good name by comparing him to Bayless.

Bayless’ best-case scenario is Monta Ellis, likely scenario is Louis Williams, and worst-case scenario is someone like Dajuan Wagner, Shawn Respert, or Jay Williams. Indeed, Wagner, Respert, and Williams each had their respective health issues; yet, none of them were great shakes while healthy in the NBA .

by AK1984 on May 13, 2009 5:45 PM PDT up reply actions  

Nope.

For a guy who likes Hinrich you sure do ignore the fact that Bayless has a billion times more potential on the defensive end than either Ellis or Williams. Both those guys are aweful defenders and that makes them entirly different prospects. Half of what makes Bayless an exciting prospect is his dedication to defensive, which he executes poorly, but doesn’t struggle with physically. His mind hasn’t caught up to his body.

Those guys are two entirely different things.

Roy is the best player in the world with the exception of Incarcerated Mike from Queensbridge .

by Nick Van Excellent on May 13, 2009 5:51 PM PDT up reply actions  

I steadfastly assert that Jerryd Bayless in an overall poor defender.
“Bayless’ inability to fight through screens on pick-and-roll defense, overaggressive on-ball defense that leads to foul trouble, and relatively tiny wingspan that makes him useless at clogging the passing lanes are the three major reasons regarding why he flat-out sucks on that end of the court.”

http://www.blazersedge.com/2009/4/22/846784/in-defense-of-the-players#14569595

by AK1984 on May 13, 2009 6:09 PM PDT up reply actions  

I think you are way off base.

The Blazers coaching staff has already talked about how Bayless is the best man to man PG defender on the team. His team defense is spotty, but should change over time, and the fact that he can stay in front of his man is a good indication that he will be dynamite on that end of the floor for years to come.

Have you ever seen Monte Ellis try to fight through a screen? Good Lord, I’m not sure how you can compare the two. He is already MUCH better than either Williams or Ellis on defense. Assuming he only gets better, he will be miles ahead of those guys on the defensive end in a couple years.

Roy is the best player in the world with the exception of Incarcerated Mike from Queensbridge .

by Nick Van Excellent on May 13, 2009 6:19 PM PDT up reply actions  

Y'know, a Mike Conley, Jr. and Marko Jaric for Steve Blake, Travis Outlaw, and Jerryd ...

Bayless trade would probably be declined immediately by the Memphis Grizzlies. Regardless, I’m still fully buckled in on the Kirk Hinrich bandwagon and have no plans of giving up my seat.

by AK1984 on May 13, 2009 5:22 PM PDT up reply actions  

I doubt they would decline that offer.

And I doubt the Blazers would make that offer. I’m pretty sure the Grizzlies already offered Conley to the Blazers for Travis Outlaw straight up. It’s not like either player has significantly changed much during that time. They both just got a little better at shooting the three ball, that’s it.

I actually think Bayless might be a better prospect as far as project point guards go. He’s already incredibly promising in some ways and we haven’t even seen his jumper yet. (which by all accounts he has). The only reason I like Conley more for the Blazers is the fact that he has a good connection with Oden. If Conley makes Oden better then it shouldn’t matter to the Blazers that Bayless has a more promising future.

I agree with you about Hinrich. I’ve been on the Hinrich Bandwagon for a couple years now, it was a lonely ship at one time but it’s nice to see people coming around.

Roy is the best player in the world with the exception of Incarcerated Mike from Queensbridge .

by Nick Van Excellent on May 13, 2009 5:33 PM PDT up reply actions  

With Kyle Lowry and Javaris Crittenton having been both dealt elsewwhere, Mike ...

Conley, Jr. is the man in Memphis. So, unless the Grizzlies can somehow obtain Ricky Rubio, there’s flat-out no way that Chris Wallace — who isn’t even the shrewdest front office executive in the NBA — would downgrade his squad’s point guard situation that immensely by essentially swapping Conley, Jr. for Jerryd Bayless.

by AK1984 on May 13, 2009 5:51 PM PDT up reply actions  

I forgot about Lowry.

I guess things have changed.

Roy is the best player in the world with the exception of Incarcerated Mike from Queensbridge .

by Nick Van Excellent on May 13, 2009 5:56 PM PDT up reply actions  

That was a great hour of podcast guys

I agree that we should stop talking about Rudy as a possible PG as he just can’t do the basics that you need from that position. I also found it funny that when Rudy was discussed it was even mentioned that he could play the 3. What? When are we going to come around to the notion that playing Rudy as the 2 and Roy as the 3 doesn’t make Brandon Roy any less great. It actually makes him better and more versatile.

by as11osu on May 13, 2009 3:02 PM PDT reply actions  

woah

you are a genius.

Prez laughs kind of like Shane Battier: early and often. ;)

draft rodrigue beaubois

by Cablinasian on May 13, 2009 3:57 PM PDT up reply actions  

There you go.

Roy is the best player in the world with the exception of Incarcerated Mike from Queensbridge .

by Nick Van Excellent on May 13, 2009 9:31 PM PDT up reply actions  

Enjoyed this one a lot

Scariest moment: Ben suggests that visiting a website will equip someone to understand salaries enough to be an NBA GM…..

by Storyteller on May 15, 2009 5:48 PM PDT reply actions  

hahah your site is just that good

"Whatever...I heard Bayless uses a pillowcase as a wallet." --TiH

by prezofdeath on May 15, 2009 8:55 PM PDT up reply actions  

I started recording my own podcast

I make all my guests freestyle rap while discussing the Blazers.

;-o

by tominhawaii on May 17, 2009 4:47 PM PDT reply actions  

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