but when you start listening to Van Gundy I start to lose intrest

Nuff said

Greg started the season having not played basketball for over a year and looked very very rusty; moreover his explosiveness and quickness, which he has relied on his whole life have not returned to pre-injury levels. Partly because of this his offensive game just isn’t at an NBA level, he needs to develop his post game and take his time on his moves. After having a summer to iron out the kinks, I expect to see a more polished Oden next season and more touches will come with his more developed offensive skill set.

Before your start saying we should trade him. Rookie big men almost always have a tough time getting adjusted to the league. This team will adjust to Oden, just as he will adjust to the team. Players know how to adjust, otherwise they’d be lost without their Mini-hoopers best friend out there on the court with them still.

Give it time my friend, I for one don’t want another Jermaine O’Neal.

but yeah, still want to keep him

his rookie contract is good value for the production he brings, hes got huge potential, and at worst i see him as a 12pts 8 boards 1 block per game big man.

who would trade that player who earns about 4-5 mil per year?

why don’t people give greg that time. this is crazy talk. flagged

He will be an All Star as soon as he leaves the Blazers and goes to a coach and to a team that knows how to use him and how to develop a franchise center. He will never realize his untapped potential under Nate which is clearly true.

It’s not that clear to me. I would actually say the opposite. How do you figure that he clearly won’t meat his potential?

Then tell me he should still leave?

Nate is handling Greg just fine. Greg’s not ready to carry the offensive load, so they don’t force him to. That does not mean that Greg’s not getting developed, it just means they are playing for something more than just his development.

I think this whole analysis is just here to incite people, as there’s no way that anyone can talk intelligently about how Greg is developing, either positively or negatively, until you can compare his first and second season.

Long as you can get Dwight or Amare in return.

This is not true.

Reasons why…

1. Greg had surgery, surgery = not the easiest thing to get over especially involving your knee.
2. When Greg returned if I remember correctly, it was 1 week before training camp, players usually improve/get comfortable when they have a sufficient amount of time to work with their team.
3. Greg gets rookie calls. Nuff Said
4. We wont win a championship without a big man down low with an offensive threat (or somewhat), Greg is capable of doing that and the team needs time to work with him.

I don’t agree with your reasons. But you’ve at least set this post up to be a decent discussion about the reasons why you believe what you do, and the reasons I don’t.

That said, I disagree.

He will never realize his untapped potential under Nate which is clearly true.

If it was clear, you wouldn’t have worried about people flaming you. If it were clearly true, there would be little disagreement at all. When someone says something is clearly true, I always get suspicious, unless they’re being Captain Obvious. The point has been made above that Oden is coming off of microfracture. That is huge. That is the reason he doesn’t look quite the same as college. Also, he’s a rookie in the NBA (another point made above) He’s got a lot of learning to do. Both those alone are enough of a reason not to give up on him now of all times.

McMillan has done a terrific job with this team. They are playing way better than they should. Four rookies playing in 50 games is unheard of, unless you’re the Grizzlies, and look at their record. So count me in with the people who disagree with your points.

Why would we want to give another team a franchise all-star center?

Let my put Greg’s trade value this way.

Right now the Blazers would be stupid to give up Greg for anything less than a franchise player.

Other teams would be stupid to give a franchise player for Oden as of right now.

For that reason, and the fact that Greg still has plenty of time as a Blazer to become the beast he’s going to be, he will not be traded.

Will not get him traded. The GM who listens to the fans, soon will sit with the fans. You listed two games against non-NBA centers. David Robinson didn’t play an NBA game until he was 24

/thread

Oden is an elite rebounder, even after taking a year off.

Not only that, but you have seen that athleticism come back (slowly) as the year has gone on.

It took Amare a couple years to regain that explosiveness as well.

Have you watched the playoffs?

Actually he looks very much like the exact same player only 20 lbs lighter and playing against players 4 inches shorter than he is. I don’t know where you got that Greg has “enormous offensive potential.” He never averaged more than 16 points a game in high school. If I was 7’1 playing in high school I’d probably average 50. He’s just not an offensive player and if you judge him on that you’ll always be disappointed. Look at how he affected the game with his defense tonight. if he averages 10-12-2 the next 3 years I’d be happy as a clam.

Oh- and he led the NBA in offensive rebound rate.

right now is the closest i have come to cursing on BE. Mark this moment in TheOdenator’s timeline, so so so close. Just know that you are completely and totally wrong. That is all.

The next trading period is THISAWAY -—————————————>

We are now in the playoffs.

Why is this a topic NOW?!?!?

been smoking a little something of what i smelled in the top of section 307 tonight.

1. Greg Oden will be an All-Star in the future
2. Greg Oden can’t be an All-Star under Nate

Then the drastic decision that has to be made is Nate leaving not Greg. This is the NBA, and you don’t hold back a potential All-Star to appease your coach. This is especially true of this potential All-Star and this coach.

vt is nowhere to be found since the Blazers win tonight. I respect your opinion but trade posts like this have no place while we are in the middle of the playoffs. I’m sure you have learned your lesson.

9 points 7 boards 1 block per game weak, and hardly a dark spot.

when his shot and offense become more reliable.

Greg is having to adjust to the NBA speed and physicality as all rookies do. As stated above by numerous people, he’s also having to do that while adjusting from microfracture surgery.

He doesn’t get as much time on the floor as he would on most other teams simply because we have another center who doesn’t commit the rookie fouls and is very solid on defense. That is why Nate doesn’t have to let Greg play through the foul trouble. Speaking of foul trouble, there is a trend with Greg’s playing with fouls towards the end of the season and also in this series. He’s learning and committing less fouls and staying in the game for longer periods of time for the most part. He’s had some good games lately and you because of this I find it very hard to say that it is a problem with Nate being unwilling to give him a chance. Rather he needs to earn the chance by playing at the level of the NBA consistently, which will come with time.

I think you need a little Bobby McFarin on the iPod.

Why did you say that this was your first time posting here, when your profile says that it isn’t?
http://www.sbnation.com/users/vt087

rec’d this?

But this time is hardly now after he just did the best job defending a 7’6’’ center I have seen in a long time. A center who routinely outplays everyone from athletic Dwight Howard to mobile Mehmet Okur. Better than Joel, who is still almost his usual strong self. Plus his trade value is not at any peak at the moment. If someone said “but we could have had Durant and maybe Brook Lopez instead of Oden and Bayless” then this is also a fair point, but now we have what we have.

And if you believe Greg will become an All-Star, then I really think he will become that under any decent coach. Nate is no hindrance to that. In fact, I think he prepares solid fundamentals that make him more foul-prone now but will help his development down the road. Such as jumping out to break up picks, then quickly retreating. Now he doesn’t do it very well and especially during the season was rotated on quick guards resulting in him falling behind the action and a foul. But he is learning that this is important. Nate often yells “quick feet Greg” into the action. The best defenders among big men in the league (e.g. Kevin Garnett, Tim Duncan) do this move amazingly well. Other quality centers never learned it or are just plain too slow, and just camp out in the lane.

He is already a great rebounder. Once his mobility and athleticism comes back (as early as this October if there are no more longer injuries) he will be ready to become a very good defender for his men and the helpside. Add some refinement of post moves and a better hook, then watch out what he can do next season. It’s not magic, and I doubt Nate holds him back.

offensively. No one wants to play only defense. Everyone plays better when they get the ball. Great point, that’s why I have said Nate is probably going to be fired.

Patience . There is a reason why it is called a virtue.

Practice it, learn it, and then live it as part of the PTB nation..

I get your post and I do respect your love of G.O.

Anyone who follows pro sports knows that when there is a choice between players and coaches more often than not coaches go before players. Look how long it took Nate to realize that Rudy was the best player to come of the bench first. Nate is like a Sergeant he likes everything to go according to his plan. In the regular season that worked because of the limited time teams have to prepare, but in the play-offs the opponent has days to put a plan together and make adjustments. Nate has done a great job in getting Portland to the base of the mountain but it will soon be time to find a new guide to take the Trail Blazer’s to the top. Who you might ask will that be…you only have to look at the other bench and see an excellent candidate who with these players could take the TB to the top of the promised land.

ODEN IS OUR MAN, BE GLAD! :-)

is that he wasn’t able or ready to be that player yet.

Here’s why: the team loses him for extended time after the first game of the season and has to build a different strategy. This altered strategy uses Roy and LMA as the focal points. This strategy won games. When Oden did come back, he fit best as a compliment to that strategy, not as one who the offense needed to be directed through.

I fully agree that if Oden will ever put up points like he’s been expected to, the team will need to run at least SOME plays through him (he gets very little right now, partially due to him not being able to stay out of foul trouble). I would be shocked if he doesn’t end up being a bigger contributer both in points and minutes played next year.

ABSOLUTELY, UNEQUIVOCALLY DO NOT TRADE ODEN.

i thought this was a TEAM sport, with 5 player on the court coached by, of all things a coach.
apparently, it’s more about coddling individual super stars to THEIR greatest destiny.

seriously, nate teaches old-school-quote-your-mama-told-you-to-do-your-best-basketball.
that, my ‘friend’ is a foundation for a career. how else did we shake the jail and get back on the trail in the last 3 years? hmmmmmn?

The first half of the game last night (Ididnt watch the second half) made it seem that he would rather be reading a book on philosophy by the fireplace, instead of playing in a win or go home Game 5.

He’ll be an all-star, but not till he leaves? what a ridiculous post, i want back the 2mins of my life you just took.

but I didn’t want to draw the wrath and ire of Dave and Ben over something so silly

Un-rec tho, -1

avoid the name-calling, please. We don’t operate that way here.

He is not far out enough from surgery. Plus the votes are 95% for keeping him because 95% of us are intelligent.

Much like you don’t bow out of investing in the stock market just because it has lost half it’s value, you don’t quit on 2nd year players who are just finishing up their first partial year. I have been critical of Oden, and I have wrestled with the idea that KD may have been the better pick. However, GO needs time to cook. He’s 21, and it shows. We won’t see him blossom into a prolific scorer, probably ever. That’s not what his job is. His job is to shut down the lane, draw double teams, and intimidate the hell out of any whimpy whispy guard who dares to come in the paint.

I respect your criteria, and your opinion. I just don’t agree with it.

I understand what you’re saying, but I do hope that you are only being facetious because if you think the team is better without Greg you’re crazy. Also, the thing I notice when watching those videos is that Greg physically could dominate just about anyone in college. He’s in the NBA now, and micro fracture or not, he’s having to adjust to players that are as big and strong as he is night in and night out.

He does look much more comfortable in college. A couple of really nice jump hooks that we haven’t seen him hit in Portland yet, but I have no doubt that that will come around. He will develop. Maybe not as fast as if he was on a terrible team and was the center of the offense, but he will develop and McMillan will develop him. They will go to him more and more as it goes along. I do agree that the team needs to not view him as Joel 2.0 because he has a better touch around the basket.

I would love to see a guy like David Robinson or Hakeem mentor Greg ala Kareem with Bynum to get that perspective on things.

I am not a fan of the big man by any means…he almost never finishes his shots and he can’t seem to ever make a basket that isn’t a dunk.

But I don’t want another Jermaine O’Neal either. As much as i HATE saying this: give him some time.

HOW CAN YOU SAY THAT HIS POTENTIAL WILL “CLEARLY” NEVER BE REALIZED UNDER NATE? HE’S ONLY PLAYED ONE SEASON!!!!! YOU’RE DRIVING ME INSANE!!!!! AAAAUUUUGGGGHHHH!!!!!

I don’t like the idea. It’d all be about circumstance.
1. where are we? Sitting on the verge of greatness as it is, so, low risk in waiting it out on #1 draft pick to mature.
2. Who are we? We’ve never been under any huge microscope as far as nationally news goes, so very little outside pressure to do what it is your sugesting, esspecially while we’re sittin as pretty as item 1 lay’s out.
3. What time are we in? R_E_C_E_S_S_I_O_N!!!! no team wants to take a chance on a #1 pick still carrying their rookie contract ESPECIALLY after micro, and all the scares greg has already put us through…so we wou.ldn’t get much back for him.

all and all I think this idea is deserving of no more thought than I’d give a moist gas passing, but…..

:) dave thought otherwise :) So here I type. :)

Posts like this make me wonder sometimes… and make me thankful we have a smart GM who doesn’t listen to idiot fans.