Trading Bayless would mean that KP has lost his mind!
by Idog1976 on Feb 4, 2009 4:13 PM PST
Email
PrintI'm sorry but I need to put to rest the absolutely absurd idea of trading Jerryd Bayless. Have you even WATCHED the last 10 games? This guy is precisely, exactly, down the quantum level, what we need alongside Roy. Bayless has shown every single tool we need for a starting combo guard alongside our other starting combo guard Brandon Roy.
Defensive Intensity?: Definite check!
Ability to distribute?: A work in progress but his decision making gets better every game. Witness his 6 assists to one turnover a couple of games ago.
Three point shooting?: He has gotten better at this after an ice cold start. Easily his biggest weakness currently this is also solvable if the player has the desire and work ethic to improve his mechanics. Gentleman we have the technology lets rebuild it. This is easily accomplished and will happen Sergio style over the summer. You break down his mechanics and rebuild his shot and have him take a few hundred shots from beyond the arc each day.
Ability to take it to the cup?: Are you kidding me? This guy is the 2nd best finisher at the rim on this team after Roy and Roy is one of the best in the league.
Drive?: UBER CHECK
Work ethic and commitment to improving his game?: UBER UBER UBER CHECK this guy shows up 3 hours before practice starts and locks up the facility when he leaves. His work ethic is Jordanesque.
Athleticism?: UBER CHECK (See also Baseline drive and dunk on the Nets.)
This guy needs one thing. Time. That's it. He has Tony Parker potential and is taller and stronger. He is just a hair less quick. Seeing as we are modeling our team after the Spurs Dynasty a scoring PG with some ability to distribute alongside a play making 2 guard is exactly what we want.
You might think I'm overstating it but I rank my current untouchables as follows:
#1. Roy
#2. Oden
#3. Bayless
#4. LMA
#5. Joel
Everyone else is on the table for the right deal but we would be fools, FOOLS to trade Bayless and I can't emphasize that enough. If KP trades Bayless he is going to get his GM genius card revoked unless the trade involves Rose, D.Will, Harris or CP3.
Some of you may say but what about Rudy? Well as it stands currently without him putting on muscle and getting conditioning I can't say he is an untouchable. I love the spectacular plays Rudy puts together but lately he has had as many SPECTACULARLY bad decisions witness the between the legs post entry pass into the hands of a Hornet on Monday. I for one pray that Rudy gets in shape and works out over the summer because I love Rudy. That said I would part with Rudy long before I would consider trading Bayless.
Unless Bayless has a lime pit behind his house filled with the bodies of guys who made fun of him in Highschool or, he is secretly the kingpin of a South American drug running operation, I can't think of a single reason you would want to trade this guy.
Included is a poll for purposes of humor only and the kind of iron clad scientific proof of what ever statistical point I'm trying to prove.
--EDIT I ADDED A SELF-DEPRECATING CHOICE TO THE POLL SO PEOPLE WOULDN'T THINK I WAS A TOTAL PUNK--
51 comments
|
4 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
Well
you aren’t really breaking any new ground here. I think anyone who’s wasted their time reading my posts over the past year and a half already knew that. But I appreciate the comment!
He's Coming! Oden Slayer of Giants
PLEASE SEE:
http://www.basketball-reference.com/fc/tiny.cgi?id=7eacA
their per36 stats are vrrrrrrrrrry interesting.
"Damn the Blazers. Damn them to hell. They are working the rest of the league like a speed bag." - Bill Simmons 6/26/08
by SpyderRyder on Feb 4, 2009 4:22 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
bad actually
it is the # of points that the team allows when he is on the court per 100 poss.
Strange though is it does seem that he is better on d than that. Didnt think that Parker was THAT good on D but the results show otherwise.
I love how JB has the most FTA/g and he has the least amount of minutes of the 3, THAT is great, not to mention his 83%, now if he ony could get some confidence in his 3. There have been times that he was wide open and he just stood there and you could see exactly what was flashing through his mind, “I’m open for a 3, but do I shoot it? pass it? drive? will I make the 3? will coach pull me if I shoot an airball?”
GOD I cannot wait until he has his 3 dialed in and on target.
"Damn the Blazers. Damn them to hell. They are working the rest of the league like a speed bag." - Bill Simmons 6/26/08
in addendum
by that measure Sergio is our best PG @ 110 and Blake is tied with JB @111
"Damn the Blazers. Damn them to hell. They are working the rest of the league like a speed bag." - Bill Simmons 6/26/08
the thing is
that even during summer league he was nailing threes. I think his form was broken at some point. He’s really drifting forward… not good technique.
I totally rec Mr. SpyderRyder's link. Click it and see.
The cilantro in your tapioca pudding since 2007.™
I can think of maybe 8 or 9 times when Rudy has tried a pass when he shouldn't have
You think he makes as many bad plays as good ones?
Karma
No
I wouldn’t go that far. I just think his decision making wars with his desire to make momentum shifting plays. I love Rudy let me be clear, however his shot selection and decision making has been very suspect for about 15 games now and he has rarely been a deciding factor in our wins. I think Rudy hit the rookie/euro wall. I’m praying like mad that he recovers and SOON.
He's Coming! Oden Slayer of Giants
you son is a total g
:)
Though patience be a tired mare, yet she will plod. - William Shakespeare
Roses are red
violets in bloom
Sophia’s in love
with Nicholas Batum
-Bow4Meow
by BlazerFan1 on Feb 4, 2009 4:38 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
Remember when Quick would talk about the future starting PG/SG scenario?
He said he thought it would be Roy and Rudy, with Roy being the de facto PG, but Rudy doing some time at the point, as well.
The Roy/Bayless combination is essentially the same thing Quick was envisioning, but with an upgrade. We are seeing the future forming right now.
yes, I argued with tominhawaii re: Roy-Rudy last spring
What can I say? Nate loves defense and Jerryd sticks his nose in there, regardless of his “per36”
(Rudy and Brandon are both 2 guards, nuff said)
The more PT Rex gets, the sooner he will develop into Roy’s #1 running mate
yeah both roy and rudy are full on two guards...
their just really skilled basketball players too. helps them be more than one-dimensional.
Say what you like about the tenets of National Socialism, Dude, at least it's an ethos.
Couldn't agree more
especially after the last few games. The Blazers NEED Bayless badly. They need someone who can penetrate. Look at what Dallas did tonight with some decent penetration. Now, if Rex can just keep his head up and concentrate a little more on finding open bigs near the rim.
All I have to do now is find a way to entice him into playing his second favorite game (table tennis) with me. If I can, then he’ll learn some necessary humility.
Open invitation: all you who are self-proclaimed ping pong experts. If you think you can beat me - or if you just want to see how it's really played: cdd37@yahoo.com. This means you, too, Jerryd.
tonight
he did surprise me on one play driving and recognizing that the layup was going to be contested and passed off to oden for the dunk. it was a good read.
The most hated Blazer is like the least hottest supermodel - Sabonis4Ever
by Philthyanimal on Feb 4, 2009 9:20 PM PST up reply actions
Yeah I loved that play
a thing of beauty. It might have technically been a jump pass but gorgeous drop off to Oden for the two handed flush!
He's Coming! Oden Slayer of Giants
He is improving in running the offense, even.
I’ve been really happy with his development. If he could just shoot…
Over the long run
Shooting can be improved by work-ethic and confidence, both of which he has in overabundance.
I’m not worried about his shooting, just his desire to distribute and desire to play second fiddle. Defer really isn’t a word that makes sense to Bayless yet.
But he’ll get it eventually, and we’ll look back at this time (with Bayless trade rumors abounding) and laugh. Repeatedly and loudly.
by TheThinWhiteDuke on Feb 5, 2009 12:23 AM PST up reply actions
Bayless is Just as Expendable as Raef LaFrentz
There are only three untradeable players, Roy, Oden, and LA.
I hate trade talk but I accept it as a nuisance I have to deal with on sports blogs. KP has already stated who he is building a team around and fans have to accept that one or more guys outside the big 3 will need to be shuffled. Jerryd’s mancrush following has exceeded Sergios, but just because he has more stalkers, it doesn’t mean he’s less expendable than anyone else outside the big 3. If KP can move him to improve the team then he should do it.
Boooo
I would trade LMA before Bayless, without question. Lamarcus is good, but his limitations (inefficiency and rebounding – two pretttttty important limitations) are well documented and it’s certainly possible another team out there could overrate him and sell the farm. (Bosh, anyone?)
Bayless, on the other hand, has unlimited potential. Whereas it’s doubtful LMA will ever draw fouls at a high rate (severely limiting his TS% i.e. efficiency) or rebound well (which you hope your “power” forward can at least sorta do), Bayless has no built in limitations. He’s not a good ball distributor right now, but he’s already improving and he’s less than 15 games in as a rotation player.
Bottom line – you don’t trade a guy with his athleticism, intelligence, skill, and work ethic. Not when he’s not yet old enough to walk into a bar and order a beer.
You just don’t.
Q: Is Greg favoring his knee?
Frye: He favors dunking on your head, that's what he favors.
You don't trade young bigs with plenty of potential as well
Bayless has the higher trade value and needs to go before everyone realizes he’s a one trick pony.
It's not offensive until someone reads it.
A one trick pony?
Considering how many of those we have on the team it simply blows my mind that you would say that about Bayless. He has had a couple of games where he had 5 to 6 assists and low turn overs. He also has started to hit the three although that needs improvement. He has a mid-range game that is improving and can hit floaters in the lane. His defense on the perimeter is exceeded only by Batum’s. His work ethic is legendary and energy is endless. One trick pony? I hope you are kidding.
He's Coming! Oden Slayer of Giants
Have you seen him play?
First off, Bayless DOES NOT have higher trade value than LMA. Toronto fans were saying the other day they would take and Bosh for LMA / complimentary players trade. You think Bayless could bring back that caliber of player? Second, Bayless is not a one trick pony. The scouting report on him is potential to be an all-nba defensive stopper, a durable / strong nba body ready for the rigors of the long nba season, abilty to run the break, get to the rim and finish, an unbelievable work ethic, and huge upside potential. Still very raw in his first nba season and with limited minutes he is producing W’s. If we trade Bayless it will be for a VERY good player IMHO.
by dario argento on Feb 5, 2009 12:49 PM PST up reply actions
I'd trade Bayless
as long as either Lebron or Chris Paul was a part of the returning players. I agree with others in that I’d be more willling to trade LMa especially if it was to net Bosh. But I would not trade Lma for Boozer or Amare.
i particularly loved it last night...
when the dallas announcer was like, “i dont wanna heap too much praise on this guy but that moved looks really chris paul-like” in reference to one of jerryd’s incredibly skilled drives to the rim.
Say what you like about the tenets of National Socialism, Dude, at least it's an ethos.
Not to Worry
Bayless isn’t going anywhere. When KP offered Lafrentz to Sac for Salmon, they also wanted Bayless, and KP said no.
And I’d make book on the fact that he’ll keep saying no as well. He said at the beginning of the year that Bayless would need 1/2 a season to get acclimated. Well, he’s had that 1/2 season, and we’re beginning to see the results.
The reason he’s not going anywhere is that I happen to believe that the Blazers are not going to be able to trade for nor draft a player to play opposite Roy that will – in the long run – have the same upside and skill set. Granted, there are names thrown around right now at the PG spot. But Hinrich, Felton, and Sessions seem to be the only ones that rise to the surface. Yet, does anyone think that – over time – that would be an upgrade? In the short term maybe – but overtime, I doubt it. And, I think KP and Mac doubt it also. And, it would take more than Bayless to get such a player now – and that would affect other slots.
Personally, I’m not worried about this.
When Bayless puts 23, 19, 14 etc on the board after playing only garbage time – or not at all during the first 1/2 of the season, it implies that he could – if given the minutes to develop consistency – do this every game. That puts him in the same category as Rudy or Travis. And, given he’s only 20, most likely above both in terms of upside. I like this team – so I’m not pushing a trade. But if you actually had a player to reach for in a trade, then if it were between Rudy and Bayless – it would be a very tough call.
We’re not going to be able to draft another Bayless for many years. And all that’s happening now is that as the rest of the league sees Bayless’s coming out party over the last 10 or 12 games – his value is climbing.
Summer league – in my book, wasn’t a fluke. But the Blazers are a better team than the one’s the rest of the draft is now playing for – and so the Blazers took the time to let him learn. But if he’d been on any number of those other teams, whether Minnesota, Milwaukie, New Jersey, Memphis, Sacramento, etc. – he’d have a lot more minutes – and his statistics would show it.
But he’s ours. And like KP, I happen to still believe that in terms of talent, he was always one of the top 5 – and you don’t trade that talent. And so we won’t.
In my opinion
he was definitely top 5.
The right draft order would have been:
Rose
Mayo
Lopez/Bayless
Beasley
He's Coming! Oden Slayer of Giants
Here's how I'd rank the guys you list...
1. Mayo (Gonna be a SUPERSTAR a la Kobe)
2. Lopez (Centers always are the premium commodity).
3. Rose (Grrrrrreat!)
and then a gap before we have:
4. Rex (Will be special)
5. Beasley (I don’t like his Jailblazer Vibe)
The cilantro in your tapioca pudding since 2007.™
I like to see Bay stay but
is he is PG? More importantly is Bayless a starting PG for a championship team? I don’t see it, so he can only be a backup combo guard on this team.
OMG
is roy a Two guard?
NO he is is tall PG who doesn’t like to defend PG’s or bring the ball up the court. We don’t want a PURE PG is this even a discussion anymore? Sorry no offense to you personally sungari I have just seen this argument so many times this season.
He's Coming! Oden Slayer of Giants
We don't need a PURE PG
just a guard speedy enough to defend/slow down the great group of point guards we have in the west. Nash, DWill, Parker and CP3, we will at least see two of them on the way to the final. And he has to be able the hit the 3 to play along Roy. Bayless does not have the range yet, maybe he will maybe he won’t in couple of years. If that guy is availible via trade, why not put him on our team now instead of wainting/hoping for Bayless to develop into the guard that we need.
Ok
feel free to list the players in the league that are available and can stop those three guys.
You might be able to come up with available players but I’m pretty sure you won’t be able to find ANYONE who can stop even one of those three guys. You can limit their effectiveness but stop CP3? Not a chance. Bayless is the only guy on our team and one of the few in the league who has the foot speed, tenacity, work ethic, strength and desire to have the POTENTIAL to do what you are describing. Simply put CP3 = Unstoppable. DWill and Parker are the next most horrifying PG’s in the league. Yes it would be great to get a mythical player who can stop CP3 but for now I will put my money on Bayless developing a long range shot. He’s 20 with less then 200 minutes of NBA game give the guy the one thing he needs…time. This time next year you will be convinced I promise.
He's Coming! Oden Slayer of Giants
Might be underestimating
his total time on the court still the guy has about 15 games of REAL game time action under his belt and I’ve seen improvement in his areas of weakness in every single game he has played.
He's Coming! Oden Slayer of Giants
I'd like to point out that Bayless' assists per minute
is identical to what Roy had his rookie season – 4.1 per 36 minutes. Their assist percentages are also close.
We have two dynamic combo guards, both with enough size to guard their counterparts on the defensive end. Sounds like a good match.
Exact-a-mundo
no more of this Bayless isn’t a PG talk. He’s a combo guard alongside our All-Star 6ft 6in. combo guard one Brandon Roy. A super traditional PG won’t cut it (ie someone who handles the ball constantly looking to set up his peers) because in Roy’s own words “A Guy like Chris Paul would take away from what I do.” Right now Bayless looking to push it up and then deferring to Roy who then operates and uses Bayless’ quickness to get to the rim as a panic button is perfect. Bayless just needs to look for Oden down low more often and work on his midrange jumper and 3pt shot. Other then that (in Star Wars Emperor voice) His training is now COMPLETE!
He's Coming! Oden Slayer of Giants
I don't think we'll see the real Bayless until he's 22, going into the '10-'11 season
He needs to develop three things:
1. Spot up/Pull up shooting. We need him to be at least a 36/37% three point shooter, as well as have the pull up aspect to his game. Judging from his college statistics, this is a very real possibility.
2. Run the offense, especially feeding the post. He’s already shown a great knack for feeding LMA good entry passes. Now, he needs to understand how it works better and figure out how to get the ball to Greg in the post. He will need to initate the offense; Roy can’t do it every time down the floor.
3. Defend. I actually think this is most important, as our offense is already second in the league. He has the body, commitment, and mentality to be a good defender, but he’ll need the next season and a half to learn how to play defense in the NBA. It’s not a thing that a player learns overnight.
If he combines these with his incredible athleticism, work ethic, and ability to get to the rim, he’ll be a special, special player.
by Cablinasian on Feb 5, 2009 12:23 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
I know I don't know basketball
as much as most of the guys here. But I don’t think Roy is a good one on one defender, yes he had ten steals in one game but they came from being in the passing lane or helping out on guys that his teammates were guarding.
Roy is an excellent on the ball defender
in the last minutes of games when he needs to be. He’s deficient in his team defense, in that he coasts a bit to save energy. I don’t really mind him on that end. He would pass out if he played intense defense on one end and ran the team on the other.
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
NBA Playoffs Content Module
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recommended FanPosts
Recent FanPosts
FanShots
Quick hits of video, photos, quotes, chats, links and lists that you find around the web.
Recommended FanShots
Recent FanShots
In Association With
Ball Don't Lie - NBA - Yahoo! Sport
- ‘Deep Thoughts’ and Cheap Thoughts: San Antonio Spurs vs. Oklahoma City Thunder
- C-a-C: This is probably as close to LeBron James working with John Waters as we’ll ever get
- Dwyane Wade’s hot pink pants: The kind of thing you can get away with when you drop 41
- Lamar Odom to New York? Dwight Howard on the move? For now, it’s all talk
- David West hilariously denies each and every one of his young fans a high-five (VIDEO)
