Ford: Blazers turned down two first rounders and VC for RLEC
Ford: "One source told me the Nets agreed to send two future firsts (Dallas' and Golden State's) along with Carter to the Blazers for Raef LaFrentz. The Blazers, however, turned them down."
8 months ago
KP Corleone
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There is almost no way this is true. The reasons that KP wanted to make no trades was to keep the core group together and not get rid of young talent, he said all the deals involved young players they didn’t want to part with. I feel that if this deal were really offered Vince Carter would be a Blazer today.
I hope I can get a bunch of championships, like 15. " - Greg Oden
by mxpx5678 on Feb 24, 2009 9:41 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
That's what KP told everybody.
We don’t know that that’s true.
by MattyDread on Feb 24, 2009 12:22 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't believe this...
But if this is true than KP is complete fool, but that offer is way to good to be true.
Red Hot and Rolling
by BlazerFan88 on Feb 24, 2009 9:44 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Spread that rumor
Spread it far and wide. It’s good for people to be convinced just how much KP believes in our guys and doesn’t want to make a move.
Tell them Paul Allen is in financial trouble, too.
This is all good. Any future deals will be on the basis that KP doesn’t have much money to spend, and doesn’t want to trade any of our players.
Then, when people come calling, he can say, “Oh, I really don’t want to give up that much, you’re going to have to offer me more.” And more, and more, and more.
When I rule the world, everyone will know how to use Excel.
by jscot on Feb 24, 2009 9:45 AM PST reply actions 1 recs
but at some point PA has to give his blessing... and KP has to pull the trigger
What’s it going to take for both of those to happen?
Boomshakalaka
by jksnake99 on Feb 24, 2009 9:49 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Probably not Vince Carter
If this rumor is true, KP & co made an assessment that he wasn’t a good fit, and so the cost wasn’t worth it.
I don’t buy it, personally. They wanted something more back then RLEC, like Bayless or Rudy or Batum, or two of the three. And KP didn’t want to give up what they wanted.
When I rule the world, everyone will know how to use Excel.
by jscot on Feb 24, 2009 9:58 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
agreed
As a fan I would not want to see any one of our rookies included to make this deal go through. We don’t need carter. The draft picks would’ve been nice as KP seems to turn draft choices into gold. I expect this year we will end up with a lottery pick and get a good player out of it, but that player will be collecting DNPs because of the cohesion the rest of the team has formed and the value of their first year of experience. Who knows though, if martell stays injured, we could use a back up three to keep outlaw at the four. Batum will probably earn far more playing time based on how well he is playing right now at such a young age.
by lurtsman on Feb 24, 2009 12:56 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I disagree
Based on widespread reports, the Nets were ready to give up VC for RLEC, and the Blazers wanted a draft pick.
This Ford article takes it to another level by saying the Blazers actually rejected VC plus TWO first rounders.
But nobody has said that the Nets were ever hoping for Bayless or Rudy or Batum in exchange for VC’s crappy contract. That would’ve been a non-starter.
The scenario that makes the most sense to me would be that KP turned down VC for RLEC straight up, and demanded a first rounder as well to take the contract. The Nets are rebuilding, don’t have a huge payroll, and didn’t want to give up a first rounder.
Q: Is Greg favoring his knee?
Frye: He favors dunking on your head, that's what he favors.
by KP Corleone on Feb 24, 2009 1:27 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
the difference between the two scenarios is substantial
VC for RLEC straight across would have been a good deal.
VC and 2 picks for RLEC? It defies belief that KP turned that down. – Elgin
Since when do we need to ponder to froth? - jscot
by 22baylor on Feb 24, 2009 2:48 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Chad Ford
…said they agreed on the players on Wednesday night (RLEC + Frye for VC + Maurice Ager). Then Thursday, POR came back and said they wanted GS’s 1st rounder for 2011.
http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/insider/news/story?page=TradeTalkInsider-090218
“The same is true for their talks with the Nets. Last night it sounded like there was some agreement on players. The latest has the Nets wanting Raef LaFrentz and Channing Frye for Vince Carter and Maurice Ager. The outstanding issue is the Blazers’ insistence that the Nets include the Golden State Warriors’ 2011 first-round pick, owned by New Jersey.”
Sixty-percent of the time, it works one-hundred percent of the time.
by rudydrops3s on Feb 24, 2009 5:45 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Just to be clear
Chad Ford a week ago says the deal was RLEC + Frye for VC + Ager, and it died because Portland wanted the GS pick.
NOW, Chad Ford says it was RLEC for Carter + GS pick + Dallas pick and Portland said no.
So, Chad Ford was seriously wrong on one of these reports, or both of them. Book it.
I don’t care what “widespread reports” say, really. I find it very, very hard to believe that NJ would give up Carter plus both those picks only for cap relief. How do you sell that one to your fans? You don’t. Since people like Ford are obviously reporting self-contradictory rumors, you have to assume a very high likelihood that this isn’t the whole story.
Look at it this way. Some Portland fans were unhappy that KP didn’t make a move. Think any EC GMs might want to stir that pot a little bit, just for the fun of it, by reporting the phenomenal deal KP passed up?
When I rule the world, everyone will know how to use Excel.
by jscot on Feb 24, 2009 11:56 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
i agree
Though patience be a tired mare, yet she will plod. - William Shakespeare
Roses are red
violets in bloom
Sophia’s in love
with Nicholas Batum
-Bow4Meow
by BlazerFan1 on Feb 24, 2009 11:41 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
wow
If that’s true, and we can’t trust that it is, then Paul Allen is hurting worse than we thought.
Boomshakalaka
by jksnake99 on Feb 24, 2009 9:47 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
I really don't think it's true
I bet the Nets respond.
by rmcdougall on Feb 24, 2009 9:57 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Thats my thoughts too
Doubt it true, but if it is, yikes. PA/KP must be really worried about the next 5-10 years financially….
RUDY > MJ
by myemic23 on Feb 24, 2009 10:18 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
JUST POSTED THIS: MY BAD, YOU'RE QUICKER THAN ME.
GOOD WORK
by kobisportsguy on Feb 24, 2009 9:57 AM PST reply actions 1 recs
i think that rlec + some others
because i heard some ridiculous demands from nj
by Blazerland on Feb 24, 2009 9:58 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Mike Barret
was on Courtside last night and said that KP told him every big trade he tried to get done was turned down because every team wanted either Batum or Bayless and KP was unwilling to part with those guys
by SalemORguy on Feb 24, 2009 10:04 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
just as we don't know if Ford's source is telling the truth
we also don’t know for sure if Pritchard is.
Boomshakalaka
by jksnake99 on Feb 24, 2009 10:14 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
can't they both be true?
it’s possible the trade was something like VC + 2 1st rounders for RLEC + Batum and/or Bayless, and KP reasoned that two future first rounders (particularly Dallas, which is non-lottery) weren’t worth as much as the two draft picks that he already used on players that look to be panning out.
by abdelnaby on Feb 24, 2009 10:54 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
At least we can connect a face and name to what Pritchard says
Ford’s source is just a faceless nameless source. He can say the Nets offered Devin Harris and VC and first rounders and we still turned it down. There ain’t no consequence for that sort of stuff.
If KP says outlandish stuff, he suffers the penalty— lack of faith from the fanbase, damaged cred from media and even other GMs by saying stuff those in the know know that ain’t true. KP can’t go around saying others were asking for stuff they weren’t asking for without damaging his ability to be taken seriously.
I like Chad Ford, and his source could have said exactly what Ford says he said, but it’s also easy (TOO easy) for a nameless faceless source to say something kinda sorta true (but ommitting important details like the salary matching of Bayless or Batum) and to get it stated by Ford as fact.
I don’t think VC for RLEC alone works, it needs a Batum or a Bayless or an Outlaw. If they wanted a Bayless or Batum, it’s not too hard to say no— even if the Warriors lottery pick was on the table.
KP saying something himself should always be taken more seriously than a faceless nameless source. ANYONE (aside from known liars like Sam Smith or Vecsey) who is willing to attach their name and face and credibility to a statement should be taken more seriously than a nameless faceless void.
For the most part, anywho.
Mortimer
by Mortimer on Feb 24, 2009 11:28 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I can't take this seriously
because I’ve never seen your beautiful face and I think you’re real name is KP or something.
When I rule the world, everyone will know how to use Excel.
by jscot on Feb 24, 2009 11:58 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Happens every year
Teams GMs always start “commenting” on deals they offered after the deadline. Usually its to placate fans, but the only things this rumor could accomplish is to upset the Blazer fanbase, or to make it seem that the First National Bank of SPAM has officially closed.
I mean we kept hearing that the deal stalled because we had to have the GS pick, now NJ is saying they had that in AND a DAL pick? Odds are they offered (RLEC + LmA for Carter and picks) and we said “thanks but no thanks.” Maybe they even caved down to Rudy and RLEC, but that would have damaged KP IMO b/c he really sold Rudy on coming to Portland this offseason. Can’t bail on that after 50 games, he’d never land another international like Rudy again (i.e. one who is on the fence about the NBA).
"I don’t have the first clue who he is talking about, because all I worry about is Jerome." – Jerome James, on comments by coach Nate McMillan about Seattle SuperSonics players being selfish.
by Devenex on Feb 24, 2009 11:21 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
There is no way possible--
— that we were trading LMA and RLEC for VC. That solves nothing, and adds a HUGE problem to fix. Rudy would never be involved in a deal for a dude like VC either.
If you’re just saying the Nets were asking for outlandish deals for VC, well, that’s different of course, but I doubt it’s true. I bet they’d give VC away for ALMOST free— expiring deal, and some young pieces if possible, but they wouldn’t expect a non-project-player starter to come back for VC, I’d hope.
If so, they can be happy paying VC till he’s 40.
I’d say our breaking point was not giving up young players we like, AND not wanting to pay VC forever for 1 or 2 good years that might not (prolly not) even be what we want from our solid overpaid vet presence.
Guys like LMA, Rudy, weren’t even in discussions (except for maybe Amare).
Morty
by Mortimer on Feb 24, 2009 11:35 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
That doesn't work, does it?
If VC makes $15.2 million and Raef makes $12.7 million, doesn’t that leave $2.5 million that would need to be added to make the deal fly cap wise? And that doesn’t even take into account the picks, which I think count for some kind of $$$ amount (though I’m not positive on that). So someone else (Rudy, Batum, Bayless, Outlaw) would have had to be thrown in to make it work, correct? That may be insignificant to Ford, but obviously not to KP.
by Lance Uppercut on Feb 24, 2009 11:21 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
it would have worked as is as far as i can tell. they are within 25% of each other.
by Ben. on Feb 24, 2009 11:50 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
not that i have feelings one way or the other on this particular deal but i think it would have worked without other blazers added.
by Ben. on Feb 24, 2009 11:50 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
You unfeeling cad
How can you not have feelings one way or another about trading away RLEC, a long time key guy on this team? Don’t you care about chemistry?
Some fan. I bet you like players on other teams, too, like on the Thunder.
When I rule the world, everyone will know how to use Excel.
by jscot on Feb 25, 2009 12:01 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
We also had a trade exception
I’m not sure if the $3 million trade exception we got from Chicago kicked in, but if it was available we would have been fine.
by boppitywop on Feb 24, 2009 1:10 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
The Trade Exception
only works for a player making $3.2M or less. We could have used it to take back another player on NJ’s roster that made 3.2 or less. It could not be used in combination with another player’s salary for matching purposes.
Sixty-percent of the time, it works one-hundred percent of the time.
by rudydrops3s on Feb 24, 2009 6:31 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't get it
Carter’s been slacking for years now. He comes back with a good half year and people think he’s going to put us over the top. That’s nuts. Same with Jefferson. They just aren’t as good as people think they are.
They’re better than Batum. But for how long? If you’re shoving all in for this year, that’s still a terrible bet. I simply cannot understand why people thought a trade at the deadline for Carter or Jefferson would help us that much.
I wanted something to happen at the deadline as well, but Carter would never get it done for us. He’s 32!!!!!!! That’s OLD for a player.
Stop whining. Not trading for Carter was a great non-move.
I'm a really really ridiculously good looking orange mocha frappaccino drinking manhammer sandwich
by hobobob on Feb 24, 2009 11:53 AM PST reply actions 1 recs
Old especially
For a dude who relies on athleticism to make a living.
He’s not Half-Man, Half-a-Season anymore (he’s been very healthy compared to earlier in his career), but he just won’t be able to last much longer. It don’t work that way.
He’s smart enough of a player to get more out of his body and legs than maybe other all-athletic players (I fear for Outlaw later on in his career), but he isn’t a wily Steve Nash who never had that much athleticism to begin with… it’ll be a big drop off for a guy who was etremely dominant athletically.
And historically, those guys who went from most athletic in the league, to being old and rundown, don’t do that well.
He’s a good shooter, but for 15 million (or whatever it is) for a few years of spot up shooting don’t fly either.
Plus, does he wanna take a backseat to Oden/Roy/LMA? I dunno… maybe. I can’t say.
I’d love for us to get Gerald Wallace or Caron Butler, but I won’t lose any sleep over “missing out” on Richard Jefferson or VC.
More to the Mortimer
by Mortimer on Feb 24, 2009 12:04 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Vince Carters PERs is 19.82 and Batum's is 12.21
Although Vince Carter’s PER per $ is 1.30 compared to 11.74 for Batum. Now I’m not sure if 19.82 > 12.21 is > 1.30 < 11.74.
I da man!
by Dragline on Feb 25, 2009 2:15 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I just don't know how we expect to make the playoffs
Without having all the PERs that are possible to get.
More PERs, pleeze!
Morty, PERless.
by Mortimer on Feb 25, 2009 2:27 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm going to write a fanpost about your PER's per $
I da man!
by Dragline on Feb 25, 2009 2:54 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I wonder what my real life PER is
I feel like it’s around 20, 21, or so…
I got stuck in traffic and was late for a meeting today. That’s gotta give my PER a hit. My belly hurt after dinner too. I bet my PER is in the teens now :-(
Now that my PER is in the teens though, I find it to be more attractive. Dunno why.
The worst part is that my PER has steadily declined over the last few years. Now that I’m getting older, that isn’t a good sign for my real life trade value. My fiancee should move me during the summer and rebuild from scratch, because I’ve maxed out my potential.
It’s just how the business works, I can’t take it personally.
I’ll always wonder though, what coulda been…
Mortimer
by Mortimer on Feb 25, 2009 3:13 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Mortimer is so overrated that he is underrated
I da man!
by Dragline on Feb 25, 2009 3:35 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
They're not buying it in NJ either
"He made everybody's job easy," Aldridge said of Blake. "All we had to do was finish." 02/22/09
by jorga on Feb 24, 2009 12:57 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
thanks for pointing that out Jorga
You are right, the comments are almost unanimous that Rod Thorn would never do that kind of a deal. – Elgin
Since when do we need to ponder to froth? - jscot
by 22baylor on Feb 24, 2009 2:55 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I heard about the following VC deal from a source. Doesn't look that good, huh?
Carter, Dooling, Swift (6 million expiring) for RLEC, Travis, Sergio, Frye, Rights to Petteri, picks.
The hangup was supposed to be a) Swift missing in action with personal problems, and KP didn’t want Williams instead who is a headcase (Swift is too, but they could have asked him to stay away from the team and let him expire) and b) the Nets would have liked a first round pick while KP wanted to give them second rounders.
Then there were discussions about Chris Douglas-Roberts and Trenton Hassell being put in a deal with Vince. Several media people also had the rumor that KP wanted the “Golden State draft pick” mentioned in the linked article.
Probably they talked about all kinds of configurations, some better for the Blazers and some for the Nets, and Ford now just mentions the pieces the deal could have been centered around. It would be really surprising if the Nets didn’t at least request some player replacement for Carter.
Brandon is one of those quiet assassins. - Chris Paul
by Norsktroll on Feb 24, 2009 12:59 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Sorry guys
I was Ford’s source. I called him up to ask him a question and he saw my 503 area code number and answered the phone “Hey Kevin”
It was then I knew I had him hooked so I talked about my hot fiance ex blazers dancer and all that jazz.
I told him I felt like I just laid the ultimate Pritch-slap and he asked how.
It was because I got Rod to make me ridiculous offers even though I never wanted VC to begin with because the team psychic Ms. Cleo, is sure VC is going to get hurt and be forced to retire before the end of the season, so I was really just messing with Rod, turning him down and hearing his response was worth far more than a ring.
by pklym on Feb 24, 2009 3:21 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
That report is faulty
They also wanted two of Rudy,Batum,Outlaw or Webster
by Qyntel Woods on Feb 24, 2009 3:48 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
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