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To Heck With Seniority (Best Man Gets the Job)

Setting the Stage

After watching last night's game that we narrowly avoided dropping to the Grizzlies (and enjoying opening-threading with many of you for the first time in a while), it was painfully obvious that, in the second half, we lacked the offensive firepower to blow out the Grizzlies like we should have.

"What? Offensive firepower? We have that," one might argue.

The Problem

As blzrfan observed, the offense was "completely awful," with no movement and far too many jumpshots being taken.

Douglast astutely pointed out that,

"We play a predictable system that rarely generates easy looks, the result [being] that we are prone to cold stretches."

While it's true that we do go through cold stretches, I argued that, hey--we're the second best offense in the leage! Give 'em a break!

Douglast smacked me down by correctly stating that

"we have statistically the 2nd most efficient offense in the league, due largely to playing low risk, low turnover basketball and getting a lot of our own misses."

big difference

Clarification


 Now, let me clarify that my issue is not neccessarily with Nate or his offensive schemes. It's the personel he and the coaching staff choose to use.

In short, when jumpers aren't falling and the offense is stagnant, why would you continue to play a non-slashing guard like Sergio?

Star-divide

Solution 

Free Bayless.

The dude is custom-made to make us a more paint-oriented team. With his slashing and driving ways, he's able to get into the lane and either make layups or, if covered, drop of a pass to a relatively open Oden or Przybilla, or even hit LMA on the baseline.

What We Are Not

I feel that the coaching staff is trying to maintain some order of semblance in not constantly shaking the lineup up, just like you don't see championship teams like San Antonio and the Fakers shaking their lineups up. On those teams everyone knows their role and they do it. End of story.

The problem is we are not a championship team yet. We are a good team and a young team with a lot of promise, but roles are still being defined on this team. The growth process is still occurring everywhere. The Lakers are the Giant Redwoods of California--they've been there for a while and they're established as a championship contender. The leaves needles may change colors but the trunk remains. It's Kobe's team in a triangle offense. Pau is the sidekick, Lamar is the utility man, Jordan Farmar is the up-and-coming point guard, Fisher is the veteran point guard mentor, and Machine is there for comedy.

On our team however, no one quite knows what the roles will be. We're still the sapling that is growing and changing day-by-day. We don't know who our small forward is, who our point guard is.

Seniority FTL

To bottle up Bayless behind Sergio because we want to be like the Spurs or Lakers to maintain order and rank is silly. To heck with seniority! I have a friend who works on a concrete crew, and the owner said someone had to be laid off (call the owner Sarver if you will). My friend, 22, is hands-down the best worker on the crew. I talked to the crew-boss himself and he admitted that. And yet he was the youngest, so they dropped him, saying others in the crew had "more seniority."

More seniority? Come on! It's a business, just like basketball. Seniority? In business and basketball, if you want to succeed you have to do what's best for the organization. You utilize the best workers/players you have available.

To sit Bayless behind Sergio for seniority's sake is maybe the "safe thing" to do, but it's not helping this team, either in the short run or the long run. Ultimately, I would argue that Bayless is going to be a better player in the long run, and in the short run, there's already times where he's better suited than Sergio for a particular situation, like last night when we needed driving and slashing in the second half. I'm all for Sergio getting minutes, especially with the amazing things he can do on offense. I just don't want to see it at the expense of Jerryd's minutes in situations where he would be more effective.

In the Words of One Wiser than I

(of course, those kind of words aren't hard to find...)


I believe it was Coach Clair Bee who used to say, "Best man gets the job!", regardless of age, in an era of college basketball that was generally dominated by seniors.

I'm not advocating the trade of Sergio or that we Shavlik him to the bench. I just would like to see seniority put aside and make sure that the best man gets the job.

Comment 57 comments  |  11 recs  | 

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prettiest post ive ever seen

but bayles will not be the answer

Man, we should forfeit before roy’s hammy explodes, knocking him into LMA’s ear who loses his balance and hits Greg’s knee… - HurraKane212

http://www.nba.com/news/miles_10_080919.html

by maid tu rek on Feb 19, 2009 9:28 AM PST reply actions  

I hope he's not The Answer

That guy does not help you win ball games at all.

In all seriousness, Bayless may not be THE answer to our point guard issue, but I would like to see

A) More slashing and driving when our jumpers are cold and
B) The best man getting the job.

I think in that instance last night Bayless was better suited to the situation.

Want more aggressiveness? Try less Baylesslessness.

by prezofdeath on Feb 19, 2009 9:32 AM PST up reply actions  

I wrote a long rambaling bit about just this topic,

when I get back from my running arround, I’ll proof and post it. sorry for the unexplain disagreement when you’ve obviously put alot into this. It really is the best looking fanpost i’ve ever seen

Man, we should forfeit before roy’s hammy explodes, knocking him into LMA’s ear who loses his balance and hits Greg’s knee… - HurraKane212

http://www.nba.com/news/miles_10_080919.html

by maid tu rek on Feb 19, 2009 9:45 AM PST up reply actions  

disagreements are good.

it fuels discussion and you get to hear lots of different opinions and ultimately become more roundly-informed.

Want more aggressiveness? Try less Baylesslessness.

by prezofdeath on Feb 19, 2009 9:56 AM PST up reply actions  

Wrong.

Bayless just doesn’t work as well as Sergio does with the second unit and he doesn’t work as well as Blake does with the first unit. It’s just an unlucky situation for him. Maybe a trade could free him.

by robrun2 on Feb 19, 2009 9:39 AM PST reply actions  

I agree, Sergio is a good fit with the second unit

but when Blake needs a breather, bring Bayless in with the first unit, not Sergio. Bayless works his best with B-Roy at his side, not Rudy. Let Sergio and Rudy run together, but don’t ever have Sergio and B-Roy in at the same time.

Want more aggressiveness? Try less Baylesslessness.

by prezofdeath on Feb 19, 2009 9:43 AM PST up reply actions  

Yah Really

We went 0-10 when Sergio started with Roy. We also want Roy to create 100% of his own shots, people getting him the ball for easy buckets is silly!

by Zaig on Feb 19, 2009 1:07 PM PST up reply actions  

I think i completely agree

aside from the great formatting, I have to say that Nate is full of it when it comes to this issue. During camp he says “best player gets the job”. Then, Sergio throws a hissy fit and starts getting minutes. Things are OK , and just OK for a while but Sergio’s style of play simply does not conform to Nate ’s offense. We are too slow for Sergio to be effective in a way that I think he could be.

 I don’t really know what to think about Sergio. Sure, his shot now has an arch, and it goes in about 4% more of the time but he still dribbles all over the place like a 6 year old on the YMCA team. It’s very frustrating. At the same time, he has excellent chemistry with the 2nd unit. However, the 2nd unit was out of sorts last night with Channing “playing” and LA sharing the front court for the majority of the time. Sergio was struggling, clearly, and I do agree that in this specific instance , Sergio should have been benched and Bayless inserted to penetrate, Channing stretches the D like he should be doing, Bayless could dish to LMA who would ideally be low and so on and so forth.

At the end of the day, I think Sergio isn’t with this team for long. That’s why Bayless was selected. Sure KP says he picks the best player in the draft possible, but I still contend Bayless was selected for a reason. Sergio doesn’t fit w/ this teams offense, the Blazers play too slow.

Sophia

Though patience be a tired mare, yet she will plod. - William Shakespeare

Roses are red
violets in bloom
Sophia’s in love
with Nicholas Batum
-Bow4Meow

by BlazerFan1 on Feb 19, 2009 9:45 AM PST reply actions   1 recs

I'm with you

I also think the 2nd point guard spot is for Bayless to take. He hasn’t taken it yet so he can’t have it.

"I determined early in my career, the only important statistic in basketball is the final score." Bill Russell

by Dragline on Feb 19, 2009 11:19 AM PST up reply actions  

Bayless DNP last night

I hope this has nothing to do with trade talks. Unfortunately the rumors running around kind of make Bayless an odd man out scenario.

by keepfryealive on Feb 19, 2009 9:46 AM PST reply actions  

Sergio's playing significantly better on both ends than Bayless.

If you want to argue Bayless is more important to the blazers future and therefore should be getting development minutes, I’m down with that (ironically, that’s the argument we used to use to argue that Sergio should get minutes over Jack).

But arguing Bayless is better now for offensive flow tells me you only pay attention to individual scoring and can’t be trusted to evaluate the whole game.

by howlingfantods on Feb 19, 2009 9:47 AM PST reply actions  

Beg to differ

Sergio can have great sparks, but so does Bayless. I watch every game. While Sergio tries hard on D he simply is not “significantly better”.

Sergio and Bayless bring too differing styles on the other side of the ball to even argue. Who’s “significantly better”.

One thing is for sure. Bayless’ vision is highly under rated and he brings a spark to this offense that Sergio can’t. When the offense is stagnant Sergio does not help. What’s his game? Feeding jump shooters that are cold? The only way to change that is to go to the paint…….which is where Bayless thrives. In that respect I completely agree with the OP.

by keepfryealive on Feb 19, 2009 9:53 AM PST up reply actions  

Sergio gets a lot more dunks and layups for our guys

than Bayless does. By a pretty significant margin.

I think it’s kind of amusing when the two Mikes start complaining that we’re taking too many jump shots when they’re missing, and cheers about how great our jumpers are when we’re hitting. This is our offense. With the personnel that Sergio plays with, his role is to feed Outlaw, LMA, and Rudy for jumpers. Or do you think he should be focusing more on feeding Thrilla?

by howlingfantods on Feb 19, 2009 10:20 AM PST up reply actions  

You just re iterated...

what the OP was basically saying. During times like last night Sergio can’t make anyone better. Bayless would be the guy who would actually change the way the offense is playing.

No fault to Sergio, but Bayless sometimes is a better fit for the team at certain times.

As far as the dunks and layups go. Bayless gets a lot more put backs because he can actually get the ball to the rim. I didn’t see any dunks or lay ups last night while they were struggling.

by keepfryealive on Feb 19, 2009 10:27 AM PST up reply actions  

Bayless is much better at crashing at the rim himself.

But Sergio gets the team touches. Our team wins more when LMA/Rudy/Travis get their touches than when Bayless goes teen wolf and starts shooting every time he touches the ball.

by howlingfantods on Feb 19, 2009 10:29 AM PST up reply actions  

Our team wins more when Bayless is playing instead of Sergio

Teams actually have to guard Bayless. Most of the time teams don’t have to guard Sergio and are free to double team other players. That makes scoring more difficult for players like Roy or LMA.

by trk on Feb 19, 2009 11:18 AM PST up reply actions  

Last I checked,

when blakey was out, they both had positive +/- but Sergio’s was better than Bayless’s. I think that was around game 8 of the non-blakey games.

It’s a legitimate argument, but Sergio adds significantly more value to the offense with his vision and his passing compared to Bayless than Bayless adds with his individual scoring. If Sergio’s scoring woes were such a major impediment to his teammates’ ability to score, then why is he averaging so many more assists per minute than any other player on the team?

by howlingfantods on Feb 19, 2009 11:22 AM PST up reply actions  

Anyone who handles the ball a lot and doesn't take many shots is going to get a lot of assists

When you get an assist it just means that you passed to someone and then they scored. It doesn’t necessarily mean that you are creating easy shots for your teammates.

Sergio handles the ball a lot. The reason why he handles the ball a lot is because whenever he doesn’t have the ball in his hands he becomes the most useless player on the team. We run plays to try to generate open shots, but if that fails (and it often does) Sergio will pass to someone who is forced to take a difficult shot without much time left on the shot clock. If the shot goes in it is still counted as an assist even if it was a difficult shot. The Blazers score 8 points less per 100 possessions when Sergio is on the court than when he is not.

by trk on Feb 19, 2009 12:36 PM PST up reply actions  

And yet he has a +

That must mean he defense improves too!

by Zaig on Feb 19, 2009 1:12 PM PST up reply actions  

Do you have some sort of proof?

"I determined early in my career, the only important statistic in basketball is the final score." Bill Russell

by Dragline on Feb 19, 2009 12:22 PM PST up reply actions  

Where are you getting your info?

Sergio is shooting 33% from behind the arc WHILE leading the team in half court shots at the buzzer. If you think teams don’t have to guard Sergio, you’re not watching the game.

by Zaig on Feb 19, 2009 1:11 PM PST up reply actions  

And if you honestly think hitting shooters

with perfect chest high passes right into their shooting hands in rhythm for them to take open shots in the fractions of seconds that they’ve got their feet set and are temporarily open isn’t something that helps a team full of jump shooters, I think you’re undervaluing half of good point guard play.

by howlingfantods on Feb 19, 2009 10:32 AM PST up reply actions  

Not underestimating Sergio at all

But when the jump shooters can’t make a shot with a perfect chest high pass with the typical NBA split second chance they get…….then maybe Bayless is a good switch up

Again, not underestimating Sergio. He’s a good fit, but when the team is ice cold………then the OP has an excellent point that I agree with. I love to watch sergio infact purchased season tickets after he was drafted. However; that doesn’t mean that he’s always the answer. Especially when you have a talented freak on the bench like Bayless waiting to kill the rim and change the pace.

Don’t let your Sergio brolove blind the fact that he was not effective last night.

I think Nate has done a great job playing the hot/helping hand while Blake has been out. Last night. Unfortunately, he went to his old ways and played Sergio even though the crowd was aching for some Brex.

This debate isn’t about who’s the better player or “significantly better” player. It’s about who is better at what time. Last night was a time for Brex…not Sergio.

by keepfryealive on Feb 19, 2009 10:45 AM PST up reply actions  

Shooters miss.

The answer to shooters missing is usually for them to keep shooting.

Hey, I’m not a big fan of this offense either, but that’s an issue for you to take up with Nate, not something to blame Sergio for. He’s running Nate’s offense, which is basically, if shooters be missing, keep shootin!

by howlingfantods on Feb 19, 2009 11:10 AM PST up reply actions  

Take the sheild off

No one is blaming Sergio. Your comments are much like the rose colored Bayless lovers. Admitting Bayless could’ve been a big jult to a team that needed it last night is not putting Sergio down. The fact that you can’t admit that and still argue every point made shows that the rose colored glasses are in full tint for you.

by keepfryealive on Feb 19, 2009 11:14 AM PST up reply actions  

Could he have been?

We held Memphis to no points for the points we were putting up.

AND

For every game Bayless put up quick points for us, there were 2-3 where he did absolutely nothing for us. You said that Sergio is useless when he doesn’t have the ball… apparently you’ve never watch Bayless when Roy has the ball. He just stands there, doing nothing, and his 3 points shot isn’t anywhere near as efficient as Sergio’s.

by Zaig on Feb 19, 2009 1:15 PM PST up reply actions  

and I'm far from sergio Brolove.

Like I said, the argument for playing Bayless instead of Sergio is that JB is our future, and Sergio is dead man walking. Not their current play, where Sergio is just flat out much better. JB is having a pretty terrible season that only homer blinders are preventing folks in PDX from noticing.

by howlingfantods on Feb 19, 2009 11:12 AM PST up reply actions  

Uh, PER of 10.8,

guy who loses track of where he’s supposed to be on the defensive end constantly, point guard who doesn’t involve his teammates in the offense? That’s a terrible season. Maybe not earl watson terrible but pretty damn close.

Still think he’s the future and I would give him development minutes, but the only people who think he’s playing better than sergio are folks who are too in love with espn highlights.

by howlingfantods on Feb 19, 2009 11:17 AM PST up reply actions  

Bayless was terrible at the beginning of the season

Since Blake got injured and he started getting consistent playing time he has been decent, or at least better than Sergio.

by trk on Feb 19, 2009 11:21 AM PST up reply actions  

For 2 games

Let’s ignore the rest of them for the sake of Bayless hype.

by Zaig on Feb 19, 2009 1:16 PM PST up reply actions  

Agreed

It must be tough to be Nate.

by keepfryealive on Feb 19, 2009 11:22 AM PST up reply actions  

Batum

I believe that is almost the exact PER Batum has and I don’t think anyone is saying he is having a bad season for a rookie. PER is not the end all stat that everyone thinks it is. it has value but dosen’t always show someones true worth. this is getting stupid! Both sergio and bayless help the team in diff. situations. I agree with Sergio being the backup but I have to say last night I expect Brex to comin for a quick run when everything went stagnant. I don’t care how great sergio is at getting everyone involved (he is good) It simply didn’t matter at that point. You send bayless in on attack mode and wake everyone up. His intensity catches on with the others and then you can pull him back out and put sergio or balke back in.

by jcoop85 on Feb 19, 2009 11:58 AM PST up reply actions  

Batum vs Bayless

Batum starts and was a late pick. Bayless plays against the bench and was a mid/early pick.

Expectations and opponents are very different.

by colganc on Feb 19, 2009 4:15 PM PST up reply actions  

I ahev high expectations of both and i think they both have done well. Batum should have been a mid/early pick just like bayless if not for some phantom heart condition.

by jcoop85 on Feb 19, 2009 8:17 PM PST up reply actions  

You must have missed the first half.

I’m pretty sure Sergio was on the floor during our 10-0 run. Apparently Nate should have magically known that Outlaw/Frye would miss 12,000 wide open jumpers in the second half and played Bayless.

by Zaig on Feb 19, 2009 1:14 PM PST up reply actions  

when the jump shooters can’t make a shot with a perfect chest high pass with the typical NBA split second chance they get…….then maybe Bayless is a good switch up

This is exactly how Nate feels about it. Most games, when things aren’t working with Sergio, Bayless gets some run. Don’t forget how many ineffective games Rex has had (poor shooting, high turnovers, broken ankles on D…).

I’m with you—Rex is the future, high ceiling, stare of death blah blah, but right now he’s RAW. And raw has its downsides.

by Marvin100 on Feb 19, 2009 5:55 PM PST up reply actions  

yeah, Sergio's the better bet right now

I think Bayless should get situational minutes, and last night was one of those situations, but Sergio’s the better overall player right now.

Boomshakalaka

by jksnake99 on Feb 19, 2009 10:02 AM PST up reply actions  

In case no said it yet....

…Redwoods are evergreens…..no leaves

"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."
- Albert Einstein (1879-1955)

by 92wastheyear on Feb 19, 2009 9:57 AM PST reply actions  

D'oh! I thought about that when I wrote that.

But I liked relating the lakers to the home-state redwoods. Maybe I should say needles instead of leaves?

Want more aggressiveness? Try less Baylesslessness.

by prezofdeath on Feb 19, 2009 9:59 AM PST up reply actions  

Needles don't change colors

Mighty Oaks have leaves that change color…maybe that would work

"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."
- Albert Einstein (1879-1955)

by 92wastheyear on Feb 19, 2009 11:59 AM PST up reply actions  

Good post P.O.D.! I agree with you

Sergio had a couple of good shifts last night, but in the second half we coulda really used B-Rex.

by tweener on Feb 19, 2009 10:20 AM PST reply actions  

and by extension, our dynasty

phew! glad we pulled that game out of the fire.

Want more aggressiveness? Try less Baylesslessness.

by prezofdeath on Feb 19, 2009 12:14 PM PST up reply actions  

No, the failure was trading Ike

We coulda played him instead of Frye in the second unit and gotten some buckets down low.

by Zaig on Feb 19, 2009 1:18 PM PST up reply actions  

Sergio played reasonably well last night,

but there was a stretch in the 3rd and 4th quarters where Bayless should have been put in the game. Mabey they didnt play him because the game was shown on “Cannal Blus” in Espana.

by tevisthe4th on Feb 19, 2009 10:38 AM PST reply actions  

I think 33-20 is pretty great

Canal Plus, oh wait, “Cannal Blus” is a joke right? I don’t get it , but I want to.
Bayless will get his time, right now there are games where he is great, and others where he is a detriment, like any rookie point guard. The passion of his fans is crazy, you would think he is better than Rose. Like Sergio’s fans in his rookie year. It just sometimes sounds like people think that if we played bayless more we would go 29-1 over the rest of the season. I was psyched to see him try that alley oop to Rudy a couple of games back though. I hope he can be a great passer.

by twggyy on Feb 19, 2009 10:45 AM PST reply actions  

33-20 is frickin awesome

Knowing what we know now. Who would’ve thought this team would be 33-20 with GO averaging the #’s he does, Martell being out all season and Blake missing his time.

by keepfryealive on Feb 19, 2009 10:51 AM PST up reply actions  

We were staling

Bayless should have gotten some burn.

Karma

by Sabonis4Ever on Feb 19, 2009 11:28 AM PST reply actions  

I vote for Bayless over Sergio and

I vote for Vince Carter over not doing anything. I get so tired of watching us live and die by our outside shooting. We need some more players that aren’t afraid to slash.

by Roycity on Feb 19, 2009 11:44 AM PST reply actions  

Seniority has nothing to do with it

Sergio is the better player right now. There isn’t really much debate about this for the time being. Next year if Portland still has Sergio it might be a different story.

by Zaig on Feb 19, 2009 1:43 PM PST reply actions  

FREE BAYLESS

Bayless or Sergio… Bayless or Sergio.. Does anyone think that Sergio career in Portland has legs? Really.. Does anyone think that Nate see Sergio in the long term picture? I don’t think so. Bayless is a rookie, he will not complain about sitting.. Sergio will.. I agree, best man for the job. Bayless may have to take one for the team and wait til next year but that really sucks.

BAYLESS AND ROY IS THE FUTURE AND THE SOLUTION TO BRINGING CHAMPIONSHIPS TO PORTLAND… AND KP KNOWS THIS.

by JRRIDER on Feb 19, 2009 2:10 PM PST reply actions   1 recs

thank you Isiah

Want more aggressiveness? Try less Baylesslessness.

by prezofdeath on Feb 19, 2009 3:21 PM PST up reply actions  

I don't know what to think...

I’m not a huge Sergio fan, but they both serve their purpose. They both have up’s and down’s. I think once Bayless is let loose we’ll be seeing the Blazers in the top ten play’s on espn every night. But I don’t think his time has quite arrived. But by the time it comes he is going to be out for blood like the last time he was unleashed. Which should be fun for us Blazer fans.

by RIP on Feb 19, 2009 3:49 PM PST reply actions  

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