Miller - The Reality
by Sec122 on Dec 5, 2009 1:41 AM PST
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Team Records of Andre Miller's Career
1999-00 32-50 Cavs
2000-01 30-52 Cavs
2001-02 29-53 Cavs
2002-03 17-65 Cavs
2003-04 27-55 Clippers
2004-05 49-33 Nuggets
2005-06 44-38 Nuggets
2006-07 35-47 Nuggets/76ers
2007-08 40-42 76ers
2008-09 41-41 76ers
Two - count 'em two winning seasons . . . barely. His entire NBA career has been spent with underachievers. A couple of those team have been to Conference Finals - since he left. Not a single playoff game in his career. Sixers didn't want to resign him. His average assists per game is down nearly 30% in the past 4 seasons (not including Portland) while his turnovers have remained fairly consistent at nearly 3 per game. I just don't get the fascination with Miller. Get what you can for him and move on -
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Now there's some truth
Enough with how great Andre is, this league is about winning consistently(as any sports league is) and Andre hasn’t. ’nough said
No... No... No... oh, nice Travis
by DribbleDriveDish on Dec 5, 2009 1:45 AM PST reply actions
Reality - Miller off the bench isn't working at least try starting him
Also I wouldnt call his Nuggets and Sixers teams underachievers they were just average teams which he led to the playoffs 5 out of the last 6 seasons. Granted he has never won a playoff series but he has been there multiple times. What other Blazer can say that, maybe Howard?
by greg6582 on Dec 5, 2009 2:02 AM PST reply actions 2 recs
not only that
but he deserves a hot to prove if he can pull it together for THIS team.
"Oh Yeah!" ~ Kool Aid Man
There are a lot of good players
that never got the chance to play on playoff quality teams. Does that make them him any less of a point guard or a veteran ? Lets face the true reality which is our team’s situation:
Injuries left and right, inconsistent play by everyone on this team except Oden…change is needed immediately and instead of looking for it on the ouside of this team, how about letting one of our players be himself for a while ? Let Miller be our starting point guard with over 30 mpg and lets see the outcome. At this point I truly believe we have nothing to lose.
na nothin at all....
just our word and our balls….basketballs that is… eke.
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
Head Czar of Amerika <--- Mortimer said so so there!!!
What do you mean "our word"? I believe André was under the impression he would start!
He could not possibly play worse than Steve Blake has been playing this year. I like Blake but he is NOT a starting point guard.
It just
boggles the mind how fans can be so fascinated by a guy who is indirectly killing your team and on top of it to blame roy for trying to right this massive fail of a signing.
by BBG on Dec 5, 2009 4:46 AM PST reply actions 1 recs
im more fascinated by how
Roy has been deified and turned into a righteous paladin whose every single action are selfless and team-oriented and Miller has been demonized and blamed for causing our losses without even beeing a starter or playing a decent amount of time
by jbm01 on Dec 5, 2009 5:01 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Just look at the Blazer's recent history
Roy has never been a cancer. The locker room chemistry was fantastic before this season. They played well, as a team. Now all of the sudden, you’re telling us Roy is the problem?
Get a grip…
Witty Unpredictable Talent and Natural Game
by iDea on Dec 5, 2009 12:33 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
If you excuse Roy's actions this year, then that's pretty biased.
Also, he’s never been a max contract player before. I still have plenty of hope in Roy, but big contracts have changed players before.
If only we had Sergio back.
Miller is not “indirectly killing” our team. He’s averaging the least amount of shot attempts in his entire career. He’s bending over backwards to try and fit in and he still has a PER that’s better than Rudy, Blake, or Webster.
He has nothing to do with our crappy starts. He’s not in the starting lineup. The blame lies elsewhere.
by Nick Van Excellent on Dec 5, 2009 5:34 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
It boggles my mind just how incredibly biased and without basis that opinion is.
"She turned me into a newt!
A newt?
...I got better."
Miller didn't play for the 03-04 Clippers.
So I guess that’s not “The Reality”. Nice try though.
by Nick Van Excellent on Dec 5, 2009 5:20 AM PST reply actions
Not much is reality in this post.
Like how Miller “has never played in a playoff game.” What a joke.
by Coastie07 on Dec 5, 2009 4:13 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Miller is only good on bad teams
He can’t play with players who are better than him. They should have the ball instead of Miller. He’s good at making bad players better and bringing down the play of good players.
Start Andre Miller NOW to showcase him for a trade.
The 76'ers didn't even want him.
Which is why they brought back Allen Iverson. They are basically trying to pretend the Miller trade never happened. It was that painful. Iguodala is sooooo much better now that Miller is gone.
by Nick Van Excellent on Dec 5, 2009 6:28 AM PST up reply actions
Yup
Basically Miller on the Blazers is Sergio without a jump shot.
Start Andre Miller NOW to showcase him for a trade.
And without lobs to Rudy
Mark my words... Dante Cunningham will be an all star
by roynfernandez on Dec 5, 2009 12:45 PM PST up reply actions
Excellent point
I heard he gets the ball to Oden though.
Start Andre Miller NOW to showcase him for a trade.
Please
After the Iverson trade, the Sixers played much better that year with Miller than they did with Iverson.
Miller’s a solid player who has played on a lot of mediocre teams. His teams have generally been over-achievers, not under-achievers. Blaming Miller for the current state of the Blazers is silly. We’re not playing well because a lot of our key players from last year are either 1) injured, or 2) producing much less. That latter category includes both Roy and Blake, whose production numbers are WAY down. People are blaming Miller because he’s new. It’s not his fault.
www.blazerguy.com
I'm just joking.
I am a Sixers fan. I know how good Miller is. I would argue that he’s probably the third most talented player on the team behind Roy and Oden.
by Nick Van Excellent on Dec 5, 2009 7:47 AM PST up reply actions
His foot is broken.
Miller’s feet are indestructible.
by Nick Van Excellent on Dec 5, 2009 8:08 AM PST up reply actions
what if some guy was going to shoot you in the butt with a high powered BB gun inless a Blazer made 7 out of 10 3 point shots
Would you pick Miller or Outlaw?
Start Andre Miller NOW to showcase him for a trade.
That's a trick question.
If I make Miller and Outlaw compete in a meaningless exhibition of shooting skills then the terrorists win. Instead I would call homeland security and tell them “some guy” named Tom was threatening to shoot me in my privates.
by Nick Van Excellent on Dec 5, 2009 8:18 AM PST up reply actions
You're right it's a "trick question," but wrong about the trick--
WHAT IS “INLESS”?
I’ve been trickedzorzed.
Would Miller be required to jump while shooting?
"Woulda, Coulda, Mighta and Shoulda – the Four Horsemen of the Procrastocalypse" - Red-5
How could we tell if he did?
by BlazerFanSince1970 on Dec 5, 2009 8:31 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Sorry, dumb question
"Woulda, Coulda, Mighta and Shoulda – the Four Horsemen of the Procrastocalypse" - Red-5
by jscot on Dec 5, 2009 1:00 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
I hope not
I hear satyr is frowned upon on this website. Too much lewdness.
;)
"One of the bright spots of the young season has been rookie point guard Jonny Flynn, whose name sounds like he should be the lead character in a Broadway Musical. "What are you doing here, Jonny Flynn?" "Why I'm here to court trouble, and woo a girl, and build the most fantastical contraption the world has ever seen!" -- Dave, Game 7 Blazers versus Timberwolves preview
by BlazersOrBust on Dec 5, 2009 4:29 PM PST up reply actions
The 76ers want ALLAN IVERSON...NOW HE'S ONE THAT HAS EXCELLED
at team chemistry…right. Iguadala has said how much he misses Miller. Did you SEE how Miller played against us last year?!
my bad
It’s early and apparently my sarcasm detecters are not functioning. Need more coffee.
www.blazerguy.com
"Not a single playoff game in his career"?
Then how do you explain this?
In fact he has 27 playoff games in his career.
Andre's 08-09 playoff stats
PPG 21.2
RPG 6.3
APG 5.3
What a loser…
When the Blazers play bad I don't like them less... I like Blazers Edge less.
by In Walks Rudy on Dec 5, 2009 8:18 AM PST reply actions 1 recs
Basketball is more than stats
The ability to destroy a planet is insignificant next to the power of Greg Oden.
The point is this post stated "he's never played in a playoff game."
Which makes anything else in this post a joke.
Mixing sports
Barry Sanders spent his entire career leading the Detroit Lions to a total win loss record over his ten year career of 78 and 82. That included one good season at 12 wins and two decent at 10 wins.
by jiminut on Dec 5, 2009 8:28 AM PST via mobile reply actions
Miller has a whole lot of seasons with more than 12 wins
"Woulda, Coulda, Mighta and Shoulda – the Four Horsemen of the Procrastocalypse" - Red-5
Barry Sanders played football. Hence the win discrepancy.
Interestingly 12 NFL wins is about equal to 62 NBA wins while 10 comes out closer to 51.
If the Blazers were a football team, they would have won just over 10 and a half football games last year which would round up to 11.
The ability to destroy a planet is insignificant next to the power of Greg Oden.
"His entire NBA career has been spent with underachievers."
Really? How many of those teams were expected to be better than that?
Yes, this is a particularly unfair post...
1. A player has no control of the team he was drafted by. An excellent player is gonna be drafted by a crappy team.
2. Andre forced a trade to the Clips, where he played out the last year of his rookie contract.
3. Andre signed as a free agent with THE WORST TEAM IN THE NBA.
4. Andre and Marcus Camby, primarily, with Melo, secondarily, turned Denver around.
5. Denver traded him to Philadelphia for A.I.
6. Miller helped Philadelphia a playoff team.
WHAT MORE CAN YOU ASK???
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
by timbo on Dec 5, 2009 8:59 AM PST up reply actions 4 recs
those Bios were AWESOME Timbo!
When the Blazers play bad I don't like them less... I like Blazers Edge less.
by In Walks Rudy on Dec 5, 2009 9:08 AM PST up reply actions
Miller is good but I can’t look away from the fact that he was part of the chemistry meltdown that was the 2002-2003 LA Clippers.
They were a bunch of young guys. But he was young too.. Maybe he’s just cursed.
The ability to destroy a planet is insignificant next to the power of Greg Oden.
maybe some people are just overreacting
When the Blazers play bad I don't like them less... I like Blazers Edge less.
by In Walks Rudy on Dec 5, 2009 5:02 PM PST up reply actions
Number 4
“Andre and Marcus Camby, primarily, with Melo, secondarily, turned Denver around.”
They were probably just as talented as they are now, except that now Billups is steering the ship and Miller is no Billups.
"I been ridin' the midnight train, got ice water in my veins." -Bob Dylan
"Sasha? That's a sissy name." -Mike Rice
They were not nearly as talented.
Not even close.
by Nick Van Excellent on Dec 5, 2009 7:00 PM PST up reply actions
I stand corrected - but the point is still . . .
1999-00 32-50 Cavs
2000-01 30-52 Cavs
2001-02 29-53 Cavs
2002-03 27-55 Clippers (corrrected)
2003-04 43-39 Nuggets (corrected)
2004-05 49-33 Nuggets
2005-06 44-38 Nuggets
2006-07 35-47 Nuggets/76ers
2007-08 40-42 76ers
2008-09 41-41 76ers
3 winning seasons (yet not a 50-win season among them)
Should have read “hasn’t won a single playoff series” not game .
MILLER: 27 playoffs games played (7-21 record)
Here is the recap of his career in the postseason:
* 2004 (Denver Nuggets), lost 1-4 in the first round to Minnesota
* 2005 (Denver Nuggets), lost 1-4 in the first round to Spurs
* 2006 (Denver Nuggets), lost 1-4 in the first round to the LA Clippers
* 2008 (Philadelphia Sixers), lost 2-4 in the first round to the Pistons
* 2009 (Philadelphia Sixers), lost 2-4 in the first round to the Magic
Wow
Carmelo Anthony must be a terrible player. Look at all those Nugget losses!
by Jeffe Portland on Dec 5, 2009 12:42 PM PST up reply actions
Disregarding last season, look at Melo’s postseason success.
The ability to destroy a planet is insignificant next to the power of Greg Oden.
And?
It obviously takes a whole team. One can can still be a great player and the team not win.
Yes he is no Billups. The whole puzzle pieces thing is quite complicated. Billups is the right fit there. Is Andre the right fit here? I don’t know. I can’t see how anyone could possibly know that at this time.
by Jeffe Portland on Dec 5, 2009 4:47 PM PST up reply actions
So, if Roy was put with a bunch of players with inferior talent...
Would he have ever been an All-Star?
Would he have ever had a winning season?
How about a little perspective. You can’t rationally argue that a team’s success or failure rides on one player’s shoulders alone. However you can look at Miler’s career stats and look at his capabilities from that perspective. In that light, your premise is wrong.
"She turned me into a newt!
A newt?
...I got better."
Brandon was R.O.Y.
drafted onto a very bad 21 win team. People need to step back from the Brandon Hater-aide. I doubt we win 30 games last year without him.
This too shall pass. Hopefully, Miller is going to be fine. He was a winner in college and provides skills and experience that the Blazers need. Yet memories of Rod Strickland come to mind and that didn’t work out so well.
Really? Only 30?
Not only advanced stats disagree, you are disagreeing with lot of experts and Blazer fans in having one of the deepest and most talented team in the league last year.
Roy is good and he was top 15 player last year, but you are also selling the rest of our team very shots. We probably would be a .500 team last year without Roy, but Roy is no MJ or LeBron and I sincerely doubt we’d lose 24 more games without him.
Really?
I disagree. Roy wasn’t just the Blazers best player last year. He is/was also the reason that a lot of the guys had such great years. Do you think Travis, Steve, Joel, and Nic play as well without Brandon? I don’t.
"I been ridin' the midnight train, got ice water in my veins." -Bob Dylan
"Sasha? That's a sissy name." -Mike Rice
I'm just sayin' . . .
No one seems to be disputing the fact(s) that;
1)The teams he has been on prior to Portland have mostly had losing records
2) His assists per game are down significantly the past 4 seasons
3) He has never played on a team that has won a playoff series
4) He turns the ball over nearly 3 times a game – still.
He is not without skills, but if we’re being honest, lock down defense and knock-down jump-shooting aren’t among them.
Bottomline – He’s no Chauncey Billups, but neither is Blake or Bayless.
I’m tired of experimenting with line ups. Nate – make a freakin’ decision and stick with it. If it’s Miller, fine, just quick jerking all the PGs around. Put your best 5 guys on the floor – and then, perhaps, draw up offensive and defensive schemes that take advantage of our obvious strengths and minimizes our weaknesses – soon.
Stats tell a story so you can't just pick the ones you like
fact… portland is scoring more and allowing less scoring with Miller in there. IS he a lock down defender? Nope. Is he a better defender than Blake? As a team defender I say yes. No one looks like a GREAT one on one point guard defender unless they are defending a significantly less capable player. The no touch rules on the perimeter insure that. Blake as good as he is as a face up shooter is leaving too much of a talent gap against other PG’s to start for a team as good as portland is. Come playoff time this gap widens . Can we really expect to win starting a point guard who can neither defend other PG’s OR take them off the dribble on the offensive end?
O.R.
Miller is good
I just don’t think he fits with our team. He may be able to set up Greg, but I’d attribute Greg’s recent success at the offensive end to his confidence rather than to Miller. This team needs a solid defender at point guard and a shooter. I wanted Hinrich even though I don’t think he is necessarily a better player than Miller, he just can do the things we need from our point guard. Miller can’t.
"I been ridin' the midnight train, got ice water in my veins." -Bob Dylan
"Sasha? That's a sissy name." -Mike Rice
But he can do them better than Blake
Or I’ve seen no convincing argument to the contrary. Look, if Roy decided he played better with Przy, because you know they have more history, Greg is still the better option on this team. Because once the season starts the game dictates that you play the most talented players. If Miller was being disruptive off the court like AI or getting arrested then you could make an exception to sacrifice wins for the betterment of the team. This is a clear case of bad decision making.
by jiminut on Dec 5, 2009 4:01 PM PST via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
I'll admit that Miller might be better at Blake
at a lot of things that make a team successful, but the team has been built around Roy for the most part and we’re at a point where the most important objective is to figure out how to get Brandon, Lamarcus, and Greg all comfortable playing together. Miller doesn’t seem to be helping with that. Miller will be gone in a year or two, doesn’t matter if he starts for the rest of the season, the future is Roy, Aldridge, and Oden.
"I been ridin' the midnight train, got ice water in my veins." -Bob Dylan
"Sasha? That's a sissy name." -Mike Rice
"Not a single playoff game in his career."
I can’t take this post seriously after reading this. Did you not even watch last years playoffs? They took Orlando further than any other team in the east. If you’re going to make an extreme opinionated post like this, at least a simple fact like this right.
Thats like me saying I can’t take you seriously because Boston actually took Orlando further than Philly last year.
The ability to destroy a planet is insignificant next to the power of Greg Oden.
Ummm...
When you say that a player hasn’t played in a SINGLE playoff game his whole career, when he’s actually played in 27, it kind of hurts the validity of your argument.
Some people here are new and hasty in their fact checking.
It doesn’t mean they don’t have a valid argument if they can’t be 100% correct. The validity of Sec122’s point is proven in the conversation that has followed it no matter what the right answer is.
The ability to destroy a planet is insignificant next to the power of Greg Oden.
100% correct is one thing.
Saying someone’s never been in the playoffs when they’ve started in 27 playoff games is completely different. I can completely make up supporting facts that couldn’t be further from the truth too. It’s like me coming back and saying Andre will win us championships and saying he has 3 NBA Finals MVP trophies to prove it.
Corrected this several hours ago - lighten up.
Should have read "hasn’t won a single playoff series" not game .
MILLER: 27 playoffs games played (7-21 record)
Here is the recap of his career in the postseason:
* 2004 (Denver Nuggets), lost 1-4 in the first round to Minnesota
* 2005 (Denver Nuggets), lost 1-4 in the first round to Spurs
* 2006 (Denver Nuggets), lost 1-4 in the first round to the LA Clippers
* 2008 (Philadelphia Sixers), lost 2-4 in the first round to the Pistons
* 2009 (Philadelphia Sixers), lost 2-4 in the first round to the Magic
And out of those series, how many were Dre's team the favored?
If we are using that type of criteria, Roy is a failure since we were favored against Houston and yet, they cleaned our clock.
Thank you for writing this post. Though I don’t think it’s fair to put too much blame on Miller for all those losing seasons, I haven’t understood why people have gotten so mad at Roy, our all star, and been so defensive of Miller, when he hasn’t even played that well. He really isn’t as good as some people think he is at this point in his career, and he doesn’t mesh with the team well. He would probably play better in a system better suited for him.
by keepportlandstrange on Dec 5, 2009 4:22 PM PST reply actions
I am so sick of reading Miller vs. Roy posts
FACT: We signed Brandon Roy as our franchise player. The team is currently being built around Brandon Roy.
If a player doesn’t compliment Brandon Roy’s play, or siad player doesn’t perform better than Brandon Roy they either need to adapt or they are a negative to the team.
Sorry, you can say what you want about Miller being great — blah blah blah — but whoever he is/was/will be does not matter.
This is Brandon Roy’s team, and if he cannot operate in a way that takes advantage of his specific abilities THAT is what needs to fixed. Miller is not complimenting Brandon Roy, and he’s not better than Brandon Roy. Miller needs to adapt or be ready to get sent packing.
The problem could be bigger than Miller though.
It’s one thing if Roy’s game doesn’t work with Miller and then Miller goes, but what if Miller isn’t the only one who doesn’t work so well with Roy. Roy might be our star as of now, but a championship would be easier built around Oden in the future. Roy will have to adapt too if we want to win it all. Roy 1-on-4 isos won’t bring a championship to Portland.
The best part of all these comments
Someone thinks Sergio has a jumpshot.
OMG I just jizzed in my France
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