Media Row Report: Blazers 96 Grizzlies 106
by Ben Golliver on Nov 28, 2009 12:29 AM PST
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PrintThe Portland Trail Blazers' 106-96 home loss to the Memphis Grizzlies -- one that featured a remarkable 29 point deficit and a 31-2 first half run -- was bad. The post-game mixed messages -- sure, call it finger pointing -- were worse.
A visibly frustrated Nate McMillan put the loss on his team's lack of effort and pointed to Brandon Roy and LaMarcus Aldridge as the guys who could help remedy the disjointed play. Twice McMillan said "not that we're calling [Roy and Aldridge] out" and then immediately proceeded to do just that. First, "I think Brandon and LaMarcus are our captains and our leaders. We need to feed off of that. That emotion. Not allowing us to play this way. Not that we're calling them [out] -- they are the guys we feed off of, they are the guys that can do a lot, encouraging support. We need that. We need that. We're going to play off of them."
And then again, "In a situation, a game like this, we need that. Somebody to gather the troops and we ride them. It's not calling them out, those are our guys. Those are our go-to guys. Those are guys that have made it happen. That we're playing off of. We need them. We need them."
In the locker room after the game, Roy acknowledged that McMillan's message to the team had been the same as it had been to the media and he looked just slightly miffed that his coach had publicly challenged his captains. Roy deftly avoided giving any detailed response to McMillan's challenge but did admit that, "me and LaMarcus have got to make sure that guys are ready defensively."
Random Game Notes
- Kevin Pelton came away with the quote of the game: Grizzlies Coach Lionel Hollins on rookie center Hasheem Thabeet, "We're teaching him how to play the game of basketball like you would a 7th or 8th grader." Wow. Expecting a middle-schooler, KP2 and I were witness to what looked like a solid pro. Great energy, absurd length, some nice finishing at the rim, very, very respectable numbers: 9 points, 6 boards, 3 blocks in 18 minutes. Thabeet looked terrible in Vegas this summer and looked like a totally different player tonight. Up his minutes!
- Thabeet's performance was all the more impressive in light of his pregame warm-up routine which had courtside observers gawking at how misguided the drills he was participating in were. Thabeet was shooting 15 footers, 18 footers, turnaround 18 footers, 15 footers off the pick and roll, jab step 15 footers, 18 footers off the glass. It was a wonder he wasn't shooting three pointers. Please remember he's 7'3". The only time he practiced any shots at the rim came after he was instructed to pump-fake from the top of the free throw circle and dribble twice down the key before making a layup. You think I'm exaggerating; I'm not. The average height of the Grizzlies assistant coaching staff (which includes Damon Stoudamire, Henry Bibby and Johnny Davis) might have something to do with this. Who knows. I wanted to intervene. Had it been Greg Oden, I probably wouldn't have been able to resist.
- Pelton wants everyone to know that he was a fan of Marc Gasol "before being a fan of Marc Gasol was cool." I guess that means Pelton somehow saw him before that first Geico commercial. It is oh so cool to be a fan of a Marc Gasol that puts up 19 points, 15 rebonds and 5 assists and who is now a better ball-handler than countryman Sergio Rodriguez. I think it's fair to say that Greg Oden trails Gasol in the All Star balloting.
- Joel Przybilla is in some kind of funk. It's hard to remember him getting burned so bad defensively in consecutive games. Non-existent offense; he's not even touching the ball.
- The court needed to be wiped up a few times because Zach Randolph kept licking his chops when single-covered by LaMarcus Aldridge. 21 and 9 for Randolph. 16 and 5 for Aldridge. Teacher. Student. Schooled. After the game, Randolph was met in the back hallway by a large group of well-wishers and had a very big smile on his face (and a Yankees cap on his head...). I think he enjoyed the win more than everyone, except maybe Lionel Hollins, who looked like a man who couldn't believe his team had just done everything he had asked them to do.
- On second thought, maybe McMillan simply wanted to call out Aldridge, and Roy was inserted into his post-game speech as collateral damage so it didn't come off as a truly personal coach-to-player challenge? Thoughts?
Nate's Post-Game Comments
What did you think of your energy in the first half?
There was none. I mean, energy? There was no energy out there in the first half. That team comes in here and jumps on us like that. No energy. I thought for most of the game there was no energy and really no excuse for no energy.
What was the message after the game?
I think Brandon and LaMarcus are our captains and our leaders. We need to feed off of that. That emotion. Not allowing us to play this way. Not that we're calling them [out] -- they are the guys we feed off of, they are the guys that can do a lot, encouraging support. We need that. We need that. We're going to play off of them. Greg has done some good things. We brought Miller in here. Our guys, that we feed off of, are those two. And when they have a nice rhythm going those guys on that floor gain confidence.
Are you saying they didn't have it going?
I'm just saying we need that. We need that. In a situation, a game like this. We need that. Somebody to gather the troops and we ride them. It's not calling them out, those are our guys. Those are our go-to guys. Those are guys that have made it happen. That we're playing off of. We need them. We need them.
They dominated you on the interior.
They dominated the whole game. I just thought ... I think they had 32 points or something in paint (in the first half), defensively they pretty much got what they want. Not getting up and defending. Being down 29, that's all about mentally coming in here and playing. Tonight we just didn't. We didn't. We didn't come to play. I don't know whether we thought this would be easy or what. It just shows if we don't anybody can beat us.
Any concern about the loss to Golden State, the collapse against Detroit and this.
You've got to put those games behind you. You've got to put a win behind you and then you gotta play the next game. You've got to come and bring that effort to play the next game. We know what we need to do. We didn't do that tonight.
You don't see a pattern in some of those games?
Again, I've said this a few times this year. I didn't have to say this maybe once last year. Our effort is not where it needs to be to win some games. And to win. We've been able to win some games but our effort and scrappy and hunger and attitude is not where it needs to be for us to really win big. And I don't get that. We're missing some guys but tonight they outworked us. There have been some other games where teams have outworked us. That's not something we're known for.
Big first quarter run
Just outworking us. We couldn't score. We didn't score. That led to easy baskets. When we got back, offensively they were able to run their offense. It was mainly outworking us.
Worst performance of the season?
You know, it's a loss. That was a surprise.
Miller instead of Blake in the fourth quarter, was that upping the tempo or something else?
Andre had some things going. I thought that team he was in there with got us a rhythm and was able to make a run. I just stayed with them.
Did you like what you saw from the press in the fourth quarter?
You're gambling. You're down by so many so you maybe surprise a team a few possessions and we came up with a couple steals but being down that many eventually they'll get a read on your press and be able to execute against it, which they did.
-- Ben Golliver | (benjamin.golliver@gmail.com) | Twitter
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Comments
wow
is that friction i sense between roy and nate? I never thought that would happen.
i dont think its a bad thing
who knows it may not be friction…there is always disagreement even in the best of relationships. if anything i would think the seeds of frustration were planted when trying to incorporate Miller into the lineup.
Cloudy is Sergio. Makes other people look good, can’t score himself. -Cablinasian
by Philthyanimal on Nov 28, 2009 12:58 AM PST up reply actions
Ugh.
Too bad they didn’t play as hard in the first half as they did in the 4th quarter. I though they had a chance there towards the end.
by seanovan mcnoob on Nov 28, 2009 12:49 AM PST reply actions
Then they stopped going to Webster
just like in the first half. First guy out is your hottest shooter? really?
"Oh Yeah!" ~ Kool Aid Man
Think you're probably right about that last point
LA’s play so far this year has been a joke aside from the Chicago game. 45 minutes on the court, and he has fewer defensive boards than Steve Blake did in half the time while letting Z-Bo and Gasol run wild. When’s he going to start earning that $65 million?
I get your frustration with last night, but to be fair,
LMA has increased his Total Rebounding % this season form 12.5 to 13.9. It isn’t what it could be, but I think we should at least acknowledge the improvement.
by upper left corner on Nov 28, 2009 9:57 AM PST up reply actions
and that TRB, padded against the Taj Gibsons of the world, dropped .6% once he faced Zach.
i cry for nic
by Cablinasian on Nov 28, 2009 10:00 AM PST up reply actions
Point well taken.
I have no problem with LMA being taken to the woodshed for his performance last night. He got schooled. I just don’t want us to loose sight of the larger context when we are criticizing. Criticism is most effective when it is fair and accurate.
by upper left corner on Nov 28, 2009 10:05 AM PST up reply actions
There's not much to say in his defense
his scoring’s way down, his hearts not really there. There’s no sign of the Lamonster we saw at the end of the year last year.
Whether it’s that he got paid and checked out, whether it’s just adjusting to Oden, who knows? The simple fact is that: it’s laughable to think of him trying to get into the All Star game this year.
He may deserve it by the end of the year, but for now…. he’s weak.
He’ll be fine. I don’t mean to condemn him. But, there’s also no good way to defend him right now. We just need some time.
I'm a really really ridiculously good looking orange mocha frappaccino drinking manhammer sandwich
look through my comment history, I’ve noted LMA’s improvement quite a few times.
i cry for nic
by Cablinasian on Nov 28, 2009 11:18 AM PST up reply actions
His rebounding overall has been up
but based on observation, it doesn’t seem like he’s doing it fighting in traffic for boards. Obviously there might be some confirmation bias on my part, but the only times this year I remember LA having big rebounding nights are when the bounces off the rim cause him to get a bunch of easy uncontested boards. In crunch time of some key games (@ATL, DET), he’s given up some pretty key boards to Smith and Charlie V who he barely put a body on to box out.
More than that, though, his defensive effort these days has just been awful. If he were defending the post better, I’d understand this, but currently Webster is blocking shots at twice the per minute rate that LA is. His effort on that end has just been pretty dismal all year.
He is a terrible interior defender
'Cuse 88-Cornell 73. My Big Red failed to beat the spread by 2 points. Hence the new avatar.
Right now he is being worse than ever
Not even contributing the other defensive stuff he was doing before.
No hunger, no fire.
Makes me very disappointing in LMA.
M—
Right
if he was defending the post like Chuck Hayes, his lack of blocks and shot alterations would be forgivable, but if he’s going to continue defending like Carlos Boozer and rebounding like a PG, it’d be nice if he could block a shot or two.
As it is, Carl Landry is eating his lunch for a quarter of the price.
mcmillan was right to call them out
both of them played shamefully on defense. roy really stepped up his offensive game, particularly in the 4th quarter but he was atrocious on defense.
he is entirely to blame for oden’s 2nd exit with 4 fouls. he lazily gambled for a steel and left rudy gay one on one with oden right under the rim.
aldridge was just atrocious all around.
by colinmarsh on Nov 28, 2009 12:54 AM PST reply actions 1 recs
Yeah..the Aldridge Randolph matchup was just painful to watch
"Rudy is not everyday a shooter," Fernandez said. "He's defense. He's passes. He's assists."
What happened to the unselfish team that I loved over the past 3 years?
Tipping rebounds to teammates, making the extra pass to an even wider open shooter, andguys joking around on the bench/during interviews/and in the locker room?
Cloudy is Sergio. Makes other people look good, can’t score himself. -Cablinasian
Success happened...
You win a little, and then folks start looking for theirs.
Nate needs to freak out on these guys
get a “T” or something. BROY and LMA should take responsibility. LMA especially. Everyone knows ZBO can play, and beating his old teamis one of the few times he will put up extra effort. Did we have to much turkey yesterday or what? WHere is that tiger eyed look from last year? That Hunger?
No fires, no trades—-but something is rotten in denmark and we had better get to the bottom of it quick!
The Dude: Hey, careful, man, there's a beverage here!
by cavejunctionblazer on Nov 28, 2009 1:13 AM PST reply actions
Our press was not good
Really, we didn’t trap very well.
"Good evening Blazer fans, wherever you may be!"-Bill Schonely
Horrible game
I’m not really a finger pointer, but this was totally Roy and LMA’s fault. How often can we say that?
Both aren’t playing with any hunger or fire, and especially in Roy’s case it is troubling… I can live with LMA playing like a 3rd option or worse. I can’t live with Roy not being a leader. In fact this game made me die inside and it is Roy’s fault.
Not knowing who to go to or where to go… c’mon Roy, that’s cow crap. The ball goes to YOU, if guys aren’t defending well, YOU get on them. Now part of the problem is, our two leaders (LMA and Roy) are being incredibly lazy on defense. LMA was awful tonight. Roy’s stats were a lie.
Ugh, so awful. I can handle losing, but not the way we did it… with our beloved Roy and LMA playing like they don’t care. That isn’t them.
If they are put off by the emergence of Oden (Greg Oden is our best player this season, and it hasn’t even been close. Did any of us expect that this soon? I know I didn’t, and I’m a Oden homer), get over it. He’s why we will contend. If they are put off by having a 2nd good ballhandler, again— make it work and get over it. It’s not like they still aren’t getting the ball whenever they want. Roy… do what you’ve done a million times before and stop playing like we’re the Spurs and are allowed to coast through the regular season because we’ve won 4 titles.
Roy and LMA deserve to be called out, and I wouldn’t have minded if it was harsher. That was a ridiculous performance from them and inexcusable from these sort of players.
Oden had 8 shots. I know it’s been said, but him inside WORKS. Every time he touches the damn ball, he gets doubled. They HAVE to double him, it throws the defense into a scrambling panic, because he is so good at passing out of the double team and hitting the cutter or the open shooter. If Roy and LMA aren’t going to care, give the damn ball to Oden because he cares more than they do.
Again, who thought Greg “Does he even like basketball dur dur dur” Oden would be lapping LMA and Roy in the “cares about winning” stat already?
We have been winning on talent alone, but not winning as a team. Roy is the leader, and watching the game he seemed anything but. He needs to be the leader and not make excuses.
I trust Roy. I believe he will dwell on these matters and come to the right conclusions, like he has before. The petty egos and lazy crap needs to end. Oden has been our best player by far but he can’t be expected to have the weight to call out his fellow stars. Roy and LMA are old enough, experienced enough, and more than important enough to hold themselves accountable.
And what the hell has happened to Joel… me and Cabby talked after the game, and we agreed— he has no fire right now. Can you picture Joel getting in a fight during a game this season? He doesn’t seem to care as much anymore, he isn’t being a red ass like last season. No jawing with the enemy, no making them mad and wanting to deck him, no toughness. Just rebounding and a few good blocks. Lazy lazy defense tonight… no fire. Doesn’t look like he cares.
I can’t say why. I personally suspect it’s also because of the emergence of Oden, so Joel feels he isn’t as important to the team, and doesn’t take personal responsibility for the team’s success. Last year he was SOO important to the team, and played like he knew it, and this year he is playing like he knows he’s keeping the floor warm for Oden.
Well, dammit Joel, you are just keeping the floor warm. You are the backup. Greg Oden is going to be a superstar and you are a role player. You are a veteran who knows what to do, and you playing hard should be a given. We would not have won so many games last year without you, and we won’t win as many this year without you. We NEED you, even though you have a lesser role. The lack of fire has hurt us so much the last few games, as these young guys are chewing you up. Thabest was making you look lazy and weak, Joel.
Come on.
Blake has been Blake and can’t be expected to do good things whilst dribbling. Yeah, that’s kinda weird in a PG, but we’ve long known Blake’s strengths and weaknesses. More and more of his minutes need to go to Rudy (with Roy as the PG on offense), and Miller. All of his minutes need to go next to Roy, and if he isn’t in with Roy, it is likely hurting us.
I believe this is just a phase for the team, and I hope we snap out of it and this becomes one of those problems that seems so serious at the time but then fades away into a distant memory and we half forget we ever worried about it. Like LMA’s plantar flascitis, and Roy’s heel. It is a long season, November ain’t over yet, we got a good record, but we have some really bad performances centered around super poor effort.
I don’t think it is Nate. If Roy would play like we know he can (which he hasn’t all year— I ain’t reacting to just this game, though this game embodied the problems we’ve seen this year with our two leaders), and LMA have some fire, we wouldn’t have these horrible losses and Nate looks like a coaching maestro. This is the players, and specifically, this is on our leaders.
They need to take personal responsibility for their lack of effort, and letting a team that isn’t as good as us totally outwork and out execute us.
Horrible loss. Horrible game. Very discouraging. Give the damn ball to Oden one way or another or I will crack skulls— you give him the ball, good things happen. Every game. Going 4 for 8 tonight lowered his percentage. He found the open shooters repeatedly.
That critique is only a tweak, though. The lack of effort is serious and needs to be pointed out and the more shame LMA and Roy feel, the better.
They have no one but themselves to blame.
Mortimer
by Mortimer on Nov 28, 2009 1:42 AM PST reply actions 12 recs
I totoally agree...
Follow-up question: what’s Roy’s problem this year?
I don’t think it’s lack of effort, or not caring because he’s not getting to dominate the ball or shoot enough (those or more likely LA’s problems).
I see at least two things:
1. A BIG part of Roy’s game is orchestrating the offense. I don’t think he knows what roles the other guys are playing, or what the best way to run the offense is right now. The other guys may not know their roles, but he certainly seems to be at a loss as to what to expect of them. The great thing about Roy, when he’s on, is that he’s never really playing 1-on-1. He’s so good at using his drives to get other guys involved that the implicit threat of the pass makes the times he keeps it deadly. This year, he’s not clicking with the rest of the team, and it’s killing his own ability to score efficiently. I think Roy is a guy who needs to feel comfortable with the flow of the game. Right now, he doesn’t. And I think it has him over-thinking and worrying, and that’s why we’re seeing some inexplicable lapses from him.
2. I’m not sure Roy really knows how to lead, or perhaps more accurately, feels comfortable leading this teem when his game is off. I don’t think it’s about selfishness, but I don’t get the feeling that Roy is as comfortable demanding things when he’s not the center of the team. I think he’s truly conflicted as to whether it’s better have the ball in his hands, Miller’s hands, or somewhere else, rather than just being able to say—guys, give me the ball, I’ll do it.
I think this loss, and maybe a few more, will be really good for Roy and the team. The pressure will help iron the kinks out. Our easy early-season schedule has been a great disservice to us. I think that’s why we’ve gone so long without roles really being defined. I’m with Roy. Even when we’re winning, things are off. Pressure is going to force us to go to what works more, and have everything else flow from there. Hopefully we don’t just get a more heavy dose of Roy and LA. I want the team to really work to establish Greg too. But it may be too early for that.
Anyhow, go Blazers! Tonight is going to be a rough test, but a good one.
by DC Blazer on Nov 28, 2009 7:06 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Not to Beat a dead Blake
But you didn’t mention yo yo.Which is the nickname for Steves pattented in and out drives.It’s called a layin,YO YO.
by DowntownVinnie on Nov 28, 2009 11:24 AM PST up reply actions
I WANT TO PLAGERIZE THIS AND POST IT ON EVERY BLAZER BOARD ACROSS THE LAND...
MAKE THEM READ IT…. forgive my caps…
BEN,
Get on it!!!
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
Head Czar of Amerika <--- Mortimer said so so there!!!
some good points - some contradictory
you write about changes to the roles and scheme that would solve some of these problems – but still attribute most of the responsibility for this loss to laziness, competitive fire, and leaders that aren’t leading. Which is it?
Brandon wants to assert his leadership – and I believe he will find a way. However, it might not happen without changes to how the Blazers play – and that starts with McMillan.
I particularly disagree with the notion that there was a lack of effort in this game. The Blazers outscored Memphis significantly beginning late in the 2nd quarter and for the rest of the game.
It wasn’t enough, obviously – but to say the Blazers didn’t come to compete would be ignoring that what really went wrong in this game was sudden and catastrophic – but limited to a relatively short time frame. After that, the Blazers adjusted and were the better team. That doesn’t happen with a lack of effort, competitiveness or accountability.
by blacknoiseNW on Nov 28, 2009 12:33 PM PST up reply actions
you ever see a deer in your headlights?
that’s what happened.
and they should be used to it by now.
Elder Deer don’t get Elderish for standing there and staring.
….. I think the lack of effort is pointed mostly to the Defensive end.. and Lamarcus’s inability to take advantage of some squishy interior D on memphis’s part.
And the lack of know how about schemes and what not I think is ….. really just pride taking a toll and trust not being there…
gonna go all weird here, …..
Like when you’ve been cutting the turkey for thanksgiving for the past 15 years for dinner and suddenly, you’re asked to pass the knife to the brand spankin new electric knife….
sure you’re gonna get to eat but…. darn it you really loved carving that turkey…
brandon’s the guy who don’t wanna give up his knife.
I think that’s what morties tryin to get at.
k…. my 2 cents n I’m out… hope we fix it for tonight.
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
Head Czar of Amerika <--- Mortimer said so so there!!!
The Blazers went inside repeatedly
during the stretch where they lost the game.
However – and uncharacteristically – they were unable to finish. They were getting blocked, stripped, having shots altered, etc. It happened to anyone that went into the paint. Why? They were forcing it against a crowded paint. The problem is that this offense allowed Memphis to guard both the paint and get out to shooters.
Bad scheme.
by blacknoiseNW on Nov 28, 2009 12:42 PM PST up reply actions
check this out.
shot chart…. they did not go inside repeatedly.
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
Head Czar of Amerika <--- Mortimer said so so there!!!
you mean the shot chart that shows the Blazers taking more shots inside than Memphis?
by blacknoiseNW on Nov 28, 2009 1:06 PM PST up reply actions
no the one that show's our team hucking up shots on the perimeter rather than ...
going
inside repeatedly
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
Head Czar of Amerika <--- Mortimer said so so there!!!
the Blazers score fewer points in the paint than any other team in the league
so that’s nothing new. However, they took more than usual inside against Memphis – and took more shots at close range than Memphis.
The shot chart does show the Blazers going inside repeatedly. Your statement is simply incorrect. The Blazer took more outside than inside – but every team does.
by blacknoiseNW on Nov 28, 2009 1:17 PM PST up reply actions
lol...
ok then… :)
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
Head Czar of Amerika <--- Mortimer said so so there!!!
You can watch that... whatever it was, 34 to 3? run, and not think we had a lack of effort?
Or how slow and lazy Roy and LMA defended tonight when trying to get back in it? Especially LMA.
And then Roy doesn’t visibly do anything to change the situation for the team, and then says people aren’t sure what to do or where to go after the game… as if it isn’t up to him.
I don’t see any of my points as being contradictory. The minor tweaks I suggest aren’t new (involve Oden more, dammit). Those have been prevalent every single game. The reason for THIS loss was lack of effort and caring about the outcome.
I don’t care if we played harder after being down 30. That means nothing when we cared so little to get down 30, and even though we looked like we were playing hard eventually, our leaders weren’t defending like they cared.
The coaches can scheme and change how we play until the cows come home, preaching pushing the tempo and working it inside… if the players don’t play like they care, and especially if our LEADERS don’t play like they care… whose fault is that? The players play the game, and if they don’t play it well when we know what they can do… that’s the player’s fault.
It could be Nate isn’t addressing the problems with effort enough, but caring about winning and effort have never been problems with Roy and LMA. I don’t know what the problem is, but I doubt it’s coaching.
Mortimer
by Mortimer on Nov 28, 2009 1:51 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
You can watch that… whatever it was, 34 to 3? run, and not think we had a lack of effort?
Or how slow and lazy Roy and LMA defended tonight when trying to get back in it? Especially LMA.
Exactly. If we’re not going to acknowledge that then, it’s like discussing politics who some one that thinks a Jewish cabal orchestrated 9/11. It’s a conversation ender.
by PoliSam on Nov 28, 2009 2:02 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
No - I don't think it was an effort issue
I ranted on this below – and I’ll say it here again. The Blazers lost because they fail against pressure – and lack a freestyle component to their offensive game that would allow them to put up points against one of the worst defensive teams in the league.
Making personal attacks on players is easy to do and completely overused by fans looking for a reason why a team lost. Calling out players for lack of effort or heart constitute personal attacks with absolutely no basis other than “results-based analysis”. If we lose, must be lack of effort. If we win, must be adequate effort.
Hogwash. This team is still trying to find its identity. That identity has been and should start with Roy. However, Roy is being asked to be both a leader and defer his game. He hasn’t learned how to do that, yet – but it has nothing to do with his effort.
by blacknoiseNW on Nov 28, 2009 2:36 PM PST up reply actions
I am not making "personal attacks" on players
Roy hasn’t been playing the same all season— any statistic and eyeball test reveals this. This isn’t because we lost, and I think it’s funny to be accused of such. I’m as big an optimist and Homer as there is here. I am not being overly reactionary here, and my tendency is to shy away from quick reactions. But this was clear.
Roy and LMA haven’t been the same all season, it is as clear as day. We’ve also ALWAYS put up points against the worst (and often the best) defensive teams, so the “lack of a freestyle component” as the reason why we didn’t score well is weird to me.
How anyone could see Roy and LMA’s defensive effort and not see a lack thereof, I don’t know what to say. We just see it different, and that’s fine, but I don’t think I am critiquing anyone needlessly. They deserve the critiques of how they played last night, and most of us see it as a lack of effort— for whatever reason.
How we lost last night wasn’t a regular thing. We’ve always brought effort the last few years… tonight, and too often this season, we haven’t. We aren’t anywhere near accomplished enough to pull those sort of shenanigans.
Mortimer
by Mortimer on Nov 28, 2009 2:51 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
One interesting factoid is that Brandon leads the league in minutes by 26. That’s a lot of playing.
I dunno, no excuses.
i cry for nic
If he was rusty and sorta out of game-shape from a non-working summer
He could be tired.
I think he seemed especially rusty early on, and he will shake the rust off. I’ve never ever worried about Roy, and I don’t really worry about him now, but the lack of focus on offense and especially defense are disconcerting so that the least.
M—
Defering the ball and leading are not contradictory terms
I ain’t even saying he should defer more— take over, Roy! That’s what the best players do.
He should do all he can to get the team going the best he can… that’s all the deferring he needs to do. In my opinion, he should involve Oden more, but I believe it will come in time. Everything else, I am happy with him just being Roy.
He is our key offensive player, and as the leader of the team he also shares responsibility to make sure we’re together defensively and that he helps others play successfully as well. To say that he doesn’t know where to go or what to do… seems like passing the buck to me.
We’re lucky to have so much talent on this team, as we haven’t played like a team. I am sure we will pull it together over the long season, but it’s pretty discouraging to see Roy and LMA coast so much at home on a Friday night.
Morty
this discussion led me to a fanpost - finding out what is so different from Roy this year vs. last year
bottom line is that Roy’s scoring inside has dropped considerably, but his outside scoring is actually up, a little bit. Further, his eFG% is essentially the same on his outside shot this year vs. last.
That means that Roy isn’t happy because the spacing on the floor and the offensive sets aren’t letting him attack the paint. Roy is also playing off the ball a lot more than he did last year (his shots off assists are way up – 41% vs. 33% last year).
Roy is playing within the “team” concept now more than ever – but his efficiency and production are way down in the process.
by blacknoiseNW on Nov 28, 2009 4:43 PM PST up reply actions
the defense issue is a case in point
the Blazers have played excellent defense except at Houston, vs GS, and last night against Memphis.
15 games good defense, 3 games bad defense. If Roy and LMA were tanking on defense, they wouldn’t be dominating their opposites on the court (using Net PER as the metric) and the Blazers wouldn’t be a team leader in defensive efficiency.
Regarding the “freestyle component” – I made this argument strictly within the context of teams like GS and Memphis who play “playground” style basketball and womp on the Blazers in the process.
These were two of the worst defensive teams in the league, and the Blazers struggled to score against both. There is a reason for it.
by blacknoiseNW on Nov 28, 2009 4:53 PM PST up reply actions
Joel
was super aggressive and awesome in the Chicago and one other recent home game. I think he scored in double figures in both.
Then the last two games he’s been terrible. I don’t know what up with that.
even when good, though… last year he woulda put something flat on their back if they were throwing fancy alley oops on a 20-0 run. He would have started yelling at one of the guards, firing people up, screaming in the huddle.
He barely even changed expression last night. Hurt to see Joel be so un-Joel like.
i cry for nic
by Cablinasian on Nov 28, 2009 1:56 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
I wish I knew too
I don’t think it’s his body failing him as he ages; I don’t think he has physically regressed. He is still capable of being the Joel of last year, and he has physically shown that this season.
But that fire and physicality hasn’t been there. Maybe it’s because he’s been a foul magnet so he’s trying to be more careful, maybe it’s him knowing he is going to have a lesser role from here on out because of Oden… I dunno.
Just isn’t the same. And since I don’t think it is just him getting older (which is understandable) and is a question of effort and caring… it’s gotta be on Joel.
This malaise has been over Roy and LMA too, and I can’t explain it. Right now, without more information, I an inclined to wish they just get over it and accept the current situation— whether they are a backup, the team leader who needs to elevate his game to match the best in the league, or a highly paid 3rd option.
Lack of effort has never been a problem before, and maybe all 3 have coincidental personal problems. There is always more to it than we can see… all I know is, the play on the court ain’t the same, and I wish I knew why.
Mortimer
Ben, do you dare ask the hard questions that everyone is thinking?
Like, when will he start Blake? Why isn’t he playing Oden more? Why aren’t our guys attacking the paint? Why can’t we defend the pick-and-roll to save our lives?
These are the things we want to know, not McMillan’s opinion on the tempo of the game.
I’m not being critical, because I honestly don’t know how the post-game interviews work. I wouldn’t want you to get black-listed for asking the “taboo” questions.
"Ain't nothin' in this world for free."
by Arby on Nov 28, 2009 2:47 AM PST reply actions 1 recs
and by "when will he start Blake"
I obviously mean Miller. My bad.
"Ain't nothin' in this world for free."
That was uglier
Than Arizona fans on the sidelines.
I’m hope this is just a rough patch and not some larger issue because the players, coach, and game plan all look to be moving in different directions. A few times now I’ve seen Roy kick out to Andre who’s standing behind the arc and Roy looks annoyed when there’s no 3 going up. I don’t know if that’s on Andre, Roy, or the coach for putting them in that position but it sure isn’t playing off their strengths.
Sure, it’s a new lineup and there are guys out hurt but for eleventy kajillion dollars I expect this group to get out the duct tape and cobble together a system that can beat lottery teams. I’m not expecting the Blazers to sweep Boston or blow out LA but I don’t think asking for them to look like a middle-of-the-pack playoff team is too much.
I see Oden developing into a real weapon, and LMA is very talented, yet we shot 24 3’s and only put up 34 points in the paint. That’s backwards, and it’s on the coach for not installing a game plan to work the ball inside, or have his guards prepared to get the ball inside. The season is young but it’s only going to get harder, I never imagined we’d be this far in and hearing that key players don’t know their role or understand what the battle plan is.
I hope they have a team sleepover and get this thing fixed soon. Right now the Rose Bowl is a great distraction but if the Blazers keep this up going into next year I see a lot of time spent sighing loudly while playing with the ESPN trade machine.
on the bright side
it is a very good thing we are getting this out of our system now. i think back to last years playoffs when cleveland found out in the second round of the playoffs that their whole system doesn’t work (can’t start such short guards, even with lebron)…too late to adjust. early season funks are not good indicators of how a team will finish, especially one with our talent. this feels to me like something that will get cleaned up and all will be fine come january
by gotyourselfastew on Nov 28, 2009 3:09 AM PST reply actions
Nate finally admits he doesn't get something.
And I don’t get that.
Is it me or does Nate not a realistic with his observations or atleast when speaking of them in public. He’s always masking problems and/or too optimistic and overlooks issues rather than looking to improve through dissection.
I’m starting to get really annoyed at his interpretations of the game. This is by far the most honest he has been about addressing any player issues and that’s being nice but it always seems like he’s too stubborn to ever really admit any real issues. I almost prefer the antics of Phil Jackson.
It’s just really getting to me now. I hate this quote, it just really gets to me.
You’ve got to put those games behind you. You’ve got to put a win behind you and then you gotta play the next game. You’ve got to come and bring that effort to play the next game. We know what we need to do. We didn’t do that tonight.
It just screams that Nate is stuck with his line up and methods and that he doesn’t learn from defeat. Move on? Really? Any real logical person will know to address the problems and apply the adjustments to the next game. He seems a bit counter-intuitive here, trying to teach a lesson to Roy and LMA but says you need to put the games behind you. This isn’t the first time I’ve felt Nate be hypocritical.
UGGGHHHHH!!!!!
by dpnim on Nov 28, 2009 4:31 AM PST reply actions 1 recs
terrible grammar.
BTW, I believe our problems aren’t solely a Nate issue, it’s a team issue but I do believe it begins with the coach.
Faith to Roy...
, “GOTTA STAY HUMBLE”….
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
Head Czar of Amerika <--- Mortimer said so so there!!!
I noticed last night
You and Timmay were the positive ones tryin to keepin us uplifted ,Preciate that. UROCK
by DowntownVinnie on Nov 28, 2009 11:34 AM PST up reply actions
wellllllllllll.....
I’ve a general bad mood about me until we’re in the thick of it and that my friend is when my name shines… anyother time….. I’m not so upbeat about things, positive, just not upbeat.
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
Head Czar of Amerika <--- Mortimer said so so there!!!
Tell Kevin Pelton I was a fan of Marc Gasol latest after the 2006 world championships
When he played the Greek big men better than Chris Bosh, a still young Dwight Howard, Elton Brand (at the top of his game), Brad Miller, or Antawn Jamison. And at that time he was still visibly out of shape.
My theory on why the Blazers didn’t pick him in the second round of the following draft (twice, three times if you incl. Petteri as the last pick of the first round) is that either they feared that both him and Rudy could stay in Spain and then they got nothing to show for it, or that the US scouts wanted two of their guys too after the Blazers already had gone to Rudy and Petteri. And so we ended up with McBob and a draft day trade with Philly. While the Lakers took Gasol. After Sun Yue. He really got no respect in that draft.
Ceterum censeo Lakers esse delendam
Big men picked ahead of him include: Greg Oden (okay), Al Horford (okay), Yi Jianlian (lol), Joakim Noah (okay), Spencer Hawes (understandable), Sean Williams (lol), Jason Smith (lol), Tiago Splitter (okay, and probably what the Blazers feared might happen), Carl Landry (respectable), Nick Fazekas (lol), Glen Davis (respectable), Jermareo Davidson (lol), Josh McRoberts (semi-lol, at least we could move him for B-Rex), Kyrylo Fesenko (lol), Stanko Barac (lololol), Stephane Lasme (lol). At 42 the Blazers went with G/F Derrick Byars. Who? Exactly.
Ceterum censeo Lakers esse delendam
spencer hawes?
dude that clearly deserves a lol. gasol is much better than hawes.
yeah, but had we drafted him and got him to come over
he would just be playing 10 minutes a game off the bench, and likely never have developed like he has to this point.
On the other hand, a frontcourt rotation of Oden, Gasol, LMA would be a very nice one indeed.
How did you guys win that?
"We scored enough points. We scored 107, they scored 105.
-Nate McMillan Postgame, 3/4/2009
Oh I disagree. A 3 big rotation of Marc, Greg, and LMA would be difficult to deal with.
Also, we would have THAT much value for a trade if he didn’t work out. Gasol was an absolute golden pick.
by dario argento on Nov 28, 2009 11:53 AM PST up reply actions
yeah
You think Brook Lopez was a steal (and he was), but Marc was a way bigger steal for the Lakers. They were going to be scary good whether Memphis made that trade or not.
'Cuse 88-Cornell 73. My Big Red failed to beat the spread by 2 points. Hence the new avatar.
Lazy NBA basketball is unwatchable
As was this game.
Who is Roy kidding? It wasn’t about energy??? That comment makes me a little angry. I’ve seen more energy on defense out of 60 year old guys playing noon hoops.
You Are Wise...
Speak on and The truth Shall Be Read…..
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
Head Czar of Amerika <--- Mortimer said so so there!!!
A little more about defense
IMO, the young blazers have had so much success on the offensive end over the last year, that they think that is where the game starts and ends. Looking at Roy’s comments, he is still focused on the offense (not getting roles straight and so on). If you listen to championship teams, a loss like this is all on their defense.
Defense should always be a more consistent part of the game than offense. Sometimes you are not hitting your shots or the other team is defending very well. But on defense it only takes effort and staying with some basic schemes.
When a good team is losing, they ramp up the defense that feeds into the offense. A HUGE difference between Roy and the other elites (LBJ, Kobe, Wade) is that those guys get it done on the defensive end and lead their team defensively when things are not going well. Kobe and LeBron put in the work on the defensive end and the rest of their teams rally around them. It is hard for Roy to lead the team when he is getting eaten up on defense. Again, it starts and ends on defense. This team better learn that or there will be no future championships.
Thats where it starts
for CHAMPIONSHIP teams
by DowntownVinnie on Nov 28, 2009 11:30 AM PST up reply actions
we've been fine on defense most of the year
prior to this game we were 4th in defense (points per 100 possessions given up). this is remarkable considering we have lost our best perimeter defender for the entire year. for whatever reason we decided not to play defense yesterday…but that hasn’t been the case most of the year.
Cloudy is Sergio. Makes other people look good, can’t score himself. -Cablinasian
by Philthyanimal on Nov 28, 2009 11:56 AM PST up reply actions
I disagree
The statistics that you mention are mainly due to the weak offenses that the blazers have faced. Their two stars can’t play defense and neither can their point guards. This team really misses Batum. I think it’s funny hearing Roy’s comment: “Me and LaMarcus have got to make sure that guys are ready defensively.” Really? How about: “LaMarcus and I need to be ready defensively.”
It’s as if all the players have been coached on how to talk about defense but not how to play it. You always hear these types of statements after a loss: “We have to step up defensively”, “It starts with our defense”, etc. Well, I’m tired of hearing about it and would like to see some. Especially from Brandon and LaMarcus, they’re the captains.
You can tell that Brandon knows he’s supposed to talk about defense but is thinking about offense. At first when told about McMillan’s “call out” he said, “Me and LaMarcus have got to make sure guys are ready defensively.” But shortly after he mentions, “I think it’s guys a little bit [unsure] who we’re going to, how we’re going to go inside-out or outside-in. Whether we’re going to pick and roll. Because of that sometimes we’re going to go through stretches where we can’t score. I don’t think it’s anything like guys not playing hard , it’s guys still confused, trying to figure it out.” Now, does that sound like a defense problem or an offense problem?
Now, I agree that the offense needs some work but I guess I’m just starting to notice a seperation between the players and the coaches. The coaches keep talking about improving the defense and the players keep wondering why the offenses they run aren’t utilizing everyone’s talents. Sounds like an issue to me. Nate: listen to your players more. Brandon and LaMarcus: listen to your coaches more.
Have fun, play basketball, make lots of money.
regardless if you believe it or not
Oden, Przy, and Rudy were all in the top 10 in regards to points given up per 100 possessions prior to yesterdays game. We may have played against weak teams, however we haven’t had a soft schedule when you account all the number of games we have played in a short time frame.
Cloudy is Sergio. Makes other people look good, can’t score himself. -Cablinasian
by Philthyanimal on Nov 28, 2009 2:04 PM PST up reply actions
Roy's disappointing defense
Totally agree with your assessment about the difference between Roy and those other elite players. Roy’s poor defense has been one of my biggest disappointments this year. I assumed with all of their offensive fire power, he could expend less energy on that end and be able to give more focus and effort to defense. I was wrong.
Aldridge’s defense AND offense have been mediocre.
I think the Blazers have a problem on their hands…
Roy just signed a contract worthy of an elite player (at both ends) like Wade,Lebron, Kobe, but he’ hasn’t demonstrated that he can play at an elite level at both ends. Aldridge just signed a contract worthy of f a semi-elite player (very good #2 option), and is not playing anywhere close to that level (nor has he ever in his career beyond a few such games here and there).
Roy and Aldridge both need to improve a lot. Otherwise we need to pray that Paul Allen is willing to pay a lot of luxury tax dollars to get the players necessary to field a team that can contend for a title.
Roy has been accused of poor defense, but the Blazers have had only three bad defensive performances
and opposing SG’s and SF’s are producing at less than league average efficiency, against the Blazers.
by blacknoiseNW on Nov 28, 2009 4:46 PM PST up reply actions
Overthinking the game.....just play smart, aggressive basketball
From their comments, Brandon Roy and Coach McMillian are not on the same page. Coach wants Brandon and LaMarcus to play their game and the team will follow. Brandon is trying to play like how he thinks his coach wants him to play. Won’t work that way….indecision and passiveness are created and you have games like the Memphis game.
In my opinion these are some of the things that should be stressed.
1.) Andre Miller should start and be the primary ballhandler/playmaker when he is in the game. Brandon Roy should be a wing and the backup point/playmaker when Andre Miller is out. Rudy, Martell and Bayless should get the rest of the minutes at the 2 and 3. Blake should only play if when are in foul trouble.
2.) Play tough defense and then push the fast break every time. Look to attack the basket offensively with quick post ups or penetration. Stop trying to run the shot clock down before looking to score. Be aggressive towards the hoop.
3.) Your high low action should be Oden down low and Aldridge up high. Stop running the Pick and Roll with Oden…Oden should be by the basket. Aldridge can pick and pop or feed Greg down low.
4.) Shoot the jumper if your open in transition or on a kickout from a post up or dribble penetration. Do not run plays to set up a long jumper from a screen down.
5.) If you are going to run a zone defense, then extend your defense to a soft zone press to shorten the time clock and don’t give an open look to their main shooter. How about a diamond and one?
by hoopsource on Nov 28, 2009 11:09 AM PST reply actions 1 recs
Excellent assessment
Especially 1 and 2
by DowntownVinnie on Nov 28, 2009 11:27 AM PST up reply actions
#3
3.) Your high low action should be Oden down low and Aldridge up high. Stop running the Pick and Roll with Oden…Oden should be by the basket. Aldridge can pick and pop or feed Greg down low.
I love that assessment. I’ve never seen anything positive happen when Oden comes up for the high pick and roll. Last night he got the ball there, was completely uncovered, and looked at the basket longingly like he knew he shouldn’t shoot it but what other choice did he have. Oden should be near the basket at ALL times. Dunk, smash, dunk.
by blazingjim on Nov 28, 2009 11:49 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
All very good assessments,
especially about Oden not setting the picks. If he stays low, with Aldridge setting the pick, there will be plenty of plays where Aldridge leaks out when he rolls, causing Odens defender to rotate, which means Greg would get an easy dunk or two a game.
And I agree about shooting jumpers in transition. Set plays for jumpers are ridiculous to me, especially when it’s a set play for LMA to shoot that jumper JUST inside of the 3 point line.
by dario argento on Nov 28, 2009 11:51 AM PST up reply actions
good stuff - worthy of a rec
I was working on a more long-winded rant along the same lines. I especially like the down screen point – the Blazers waste more time on the shot clock trying to get into that set….bugs the hell out of me – especially when they need scoring volume to get back in a game. It’s like watching a football team down 21 points in the third quarter trying to get back into it by running dive plays for 3 yards and a cloud of dust, but they have an All Star quarterback and receivers that could give them the big strike and give them a legitimate chance.
by blacknoiseNW on Nov 28, 2009 12:22 PM PST up reply actions
Will this Be
a classic Blazer response to a bad game. Well, I think so.If not, it’s gonna be an ugly weekend.But I really do think we will get it goin.GO B’s
by DowntownVinnie on Nov 28, 2009 11:37 AM PST reply actions
Alright that's it. I'm officially sick of Brandons crap.
I am getting really tired of this " we just need to work out the kinks " crap. And, " we still have guys that are trying to find their role ". ANDRE MILLER IS ON THIS TEAM BRANDON! GET USED TO IT. You will not be able to play every single minute on the floor with Steve Blankey. God forbid Brandon, what if Blankey goes down with injury? What then. Will every loss be " We just need our guys healthy again." You wanna be a superstar? Start acting like it. Superstars play the same no matter who is playing next to them.
You are the freaking leader of this team. Step up and take responsibility when your team lays a turd on the floor. Get pissed. Get angry. You are paid BIG bucks now to be the leader, so lead. Call out players for blowing their defensive assignment. Say we just need to play our game, and we didn’t do it tonight. We will play harder and smarter next game.
Stop making excuses. The kumbaya seasons are over. It’s about winning now, not feeling good about this group. I don’t pay a grand a year in tickets to watch a bunch of guys become friends. I pay to watch a team WIN. You will not always have Steve Blankey and Travis Outlaw at your side for your whole career. This is the NBA, where changing rosters happen. Deal with it.
Now I’m done.
by dario argento on Nov 28, 2009 11:47 AM PST reply actions 1 recs
That'sa gross over-reaction
Bad game? Yes
Bad person? No
Get a grip. I understand that some people deal with disappointed with anger, but your position can’t sustain itself. Roy has a solid BBall mind, more likely than not, one that can run circles around ours. Regardless of some silly things he’s said, he still tries to do what’s best for the team.
This is far more likely and instance of double speak, couching his displeasure with Blake’s play and trying not to publicly criticize certain players.
While you may be sick of Roy’s “crap,” there are quite a few that get that nauseas feeling from knee-jerk, unthoughtful and misguided rants.
I'm a really really ridiculously good looking orange mocha frappaccino drinking manhammer sandwich
by hobobob on Nov 28, 2009 12:06 PM PST up reply actions 2 recs
no no now...
I agree with him, Theres some deep weirdness about how brandon plays now opposed to last season and this one, shoot 2 years ago, even seeing him complain to a ref was odd, now… it’s every posession.
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
Head Czar of Amerika <--- Mortimer said so so there!!!
I disagree with you
Brandon recognizes there is a problem – even if he isn’t particularly good at articulating the problem. He is a leader – but he only knows how to lead by taking control. If anything, Brandon needs to learn how to lead even when he isn’t in direct control of the game – but his recognition that all is not right with this team is spot on.
by blacknoiseNW on Nov 28, 2009 12:17 PM PST up reply actions
if I wern't as lazy as I am I'd dig out the preseason video's from brandons rookie season...
the one where he was calling out z-bo and companies effort on simple drills…
I want that guy back.
not this cry to the refs when he should be playing D guy….
not this guy who don’t play 100% d then don’t know why he lost….
I want Rookie Brandon back. Fearless, and Humble.
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
Head Czar of Amerika <--- Mortimer said so so there!!!
gosh ..... lol... i sound like I wanna put this alllllll on brandon...
this loss is not alllllllllllll his fault, I’m just saying, he’s … not the same.
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
Head Czar of Amerika <--- Mortimer said so so there!!!
No he is not the same.
He knows it. We know it.
by blacknoiseNW on Nov 28, 2009 12:40 PM PST up reply actions
Nauseous? Really?
That rant is not about one game. It’s about how Roy threw Andre under the bus before he even played ONE game with him. It’s about how Brandon’s effort has been noticeably lower is certain games this season, and then he blames it on " new players " ( who do you think he’s talking about, really ) not being used to the system. It’s about how he came out recently and said that the team feeds off him, and that it is important that HE plays well so the team can play well, then he makes excuses in post game interviews. It’s about how he said publicly that the 3 guard line-up didn’t work, and he needed to go back to what worked last season ( basically calling out Andre yet again ).
There is a pattern here of Roy behaving VERY differently than he has since coming to Portland. I think he is struggling to find his new role, and is being a little immature. This is not knee-jerk. It has been brewing in a lot of peoples minds all season. I think the #1 thing that is wrong with the Blazers right now is Brandon Roy.
by dario argento on Nov 28, 2009 12:23 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Brandon is the solution - not the problem.
Brandon was asked to completely change his role to accommodate Miller, this season. Brandon objected – and rightfully so. Miller is the one that started the drama by saying he should get more respect for his seniority and accomplishments, and shouldn’t have to defer to anyone. That didn’t sit well with Brandon, and I agree with him.
Miller and Roy should be on the court together – but it is Miller that needed to make the biggest adjustment – not Roy. Last night was another night where Brandon made a major effort to get Miller into the game. I haven’t seen nearly as much from Miller to get Roy into the game. This is ticking Roy off, but most would rather just call Roy a crybaby and call him out for being selfish. This is shortsighted and incorrect.
by blacknoiseNW on Nov 28, 2009 12:39 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Brandon didn't even give miller a chance yet.
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
Head Czar of Amerika <--- Mortimer said so so there!!!
Brandon, on the court, has given Miller every chance
the reverse has not been true.
Miller is a point guard; Roy a shooting guard. Roy has more assists to Miller than the other way around. It isn’t right, and cannot continue.
by blacknoiseNW on Nov 28, 2009 12:44 PM PST up reply actions
becuase brandon won't make his shots becuase he's pouting about miller being out there.....
….. it’s obvious to me that there’s something there between them…… and roy needs to get over it…. and start hitting his shots.
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
Head Czar of Amerika <--- Mortimer said so so there!!!
Your post is exactly why I take exception to the anti-Roy sentiment.
Now Roy is missing his shots because he is “pouting”?
Frankly, this kind of attitude on the part of fans is revolting.
by blacknoiseNW on Nov 28, 2009 1:01 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
I've always had this opinion.
I’ve never been heard until now.
Pouting = feeling uneasy and unsure about himself when he’s shooting when andre is on the floor…
I"m not smartenough to build a super cool graph to show it, but I’d bet money on roy missing ALOT more open shots when andre passed him the ball vs. blake….
and that is just weird … and I’ve no clue how to fix it but the only thing that is the same is roy so I figure the problem has to be in there somewhere.
sorry if I come off anti roy, I’m not … well… I’ve never reallllly 100% thought he’d be as dreamy as he is, and allllways felt he was the product of a system rather than physical stuff… but that’s neither here nor there, I just want the problem fixed… just like you I asume.
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
Head Czar of Amerika <--- Mortimer said so so there!!!
People are getting frustrated with Roy because he is not playing the same way,
and seems to be making excused for HIS decreased level of play. My point is that with or with Andre on the floor, Roy should still be Roy. It shouldn’t matter who is playing PG or whatever position. He needs to play his game and everyone else will fall in line. He also needs to stop making excused to the media, and needs to stop throwing Andre under the bus. He needs to go out, and play his game, with whomever Nate has him playing with.
I believe he will come around eventually, but think this story is not over. It’s gonna get uglier. Can he and Dre co-exist? We’ll see.
by dario argento on Nov 28, 2009 1:37 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
I won't throw Roy under the bus either, but I also do not think what you are suggesting is true
Roy has definitely not given every chance to Miller. In fact, it’s rather opposite.
Roy also most definitely not more assist to Miller than other way around. Roy doesn’t look to pass as much Miller, and while there is nothing wrong with that, it also doesn’t mean what you are claiming is true.
Roy is leading the team in assists
(although Miller’s per 48 assists are higher); Roy’s passer rating is up from 2008/2009, and Roy is almost always the one passing to Miller, rather than vice versa.
Based on what I have observed, and last night was no exception – Roy makes an effort to find Miller on the floor.
by blacknoiseNW on Nov 28, 2009 4:48 PM PST up reply actions
Perhaps, but...
Roy is averaging almost double the minutes…as you said, Miller’s per 48 is higher.
Also, Miller treats Roy differently as opposed to other players. I am guessing you haven’t noticed, but look at how Andre plays with Roy as opposed to without Roy. Andre will pass it to Roy early in the shot clock so that Roy can create his own shot half the time he brings up the ball. Without Roy, he’ll handle the ball himself more instead of letting someone else initiate the offense. That shows me the Andre knows how each player likes to operate and will provide as such.
I just want him to stop his Complaining to the Refs ....
like 100% just STOP doing it and get back on D…
give it out on that end 100% and stop leaving your team to play 4 on 5 becuase you WERE fouled …..
ya know. he used to be better than that. what and when did he change? I remember him saying he was going to do it more, … more is fine, but not almost every posession.
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
Head Czar of Amerika <--- Mortimer said so so there!!!
"Energy" is an easy scapegoat - and always a poor choice
I see “lazy” showing up in this discussion, a lot. I think that is just lazy on our parts.
Memphis showed up ready to compete – but the Blazers did to. The Blazers had the early lead – then suddenly couldn’t score – which made scoring for Memphis exceptionally easy.
Why? It didn’t have anything to do with effort. If there is any hallmark of this Blazer team, it is that they run sets in the halfcourt when they need a basket; they tend to miss shots in bunches because they are fragile, emotionally; their offensive execution gets offensive in the face of tight man to man defense.
As soon as Memphis got in the face of Blazers, the Blazers had no idea how to score.
I couldn’t disagree with Ben more on this point. I don’t care how far into the season we are – even though this is a team that has an identity – that identity can be destroyed by playground-style basketball. What happened against Memphis is exactly what happened against Golden State.
Once the Blazers got desperate for baskets, what did they do? They incorporated some freestyle into their game and tried to score in other than half-court sets. That is the only thing that made this game as close as it was. The problem is that the Blazers have the talent, but not the concept for freestyle basketball. The McMillan Blazers want to out-execute everyone on defense and offense – but they lose all ability for execution when pressure defense is applied.
Brandon Roy isn’t to be castigated for this game – he should be celebrated for recognizing that there is a flaw in the system. It isn’t as simple as roles – it is roles compounded by style.
Mark my words – any team loaded with athletic players is going to play the Blazers the same way, and until there is a change in philosophy and the throttle governor is removed from the offense, the Blazers will lose the exact same way. They will get down big to unworthy teams and struggle to find a way to compete.
OKC, Memphis, Golden State, Phoenix, Houston, et al are teams the Blazers are going to struggle with.
Maybe those things happened
But there was definitely a lot of lazy basketball being played as well… game would have looked a lot different if Aldridge, Przbilla and Oden would have managed to jump for a few rebounds.
by PoliSam on Nov 28, 2009 1:59 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
I don't think McMillan included Roy in his plea for leadership for a reason
Not just to avoid singling out L.A. It would be nice to see more leadership and attitude from L.A., we all know that. But to expect it just because he signed a big contract isn’t realistic. He’s been a follower (a very good one, but still) since he’s been in the league. Roy, on the other hand, has been very vocal about considering himself the leader of this team. And he’s not acting like one right now. It’s always been difficult to gauge Roy’s effort level. Even at his best, he’s played at his own speed, which sometimes looks to us (and coaches) like he’s coasting. Right now, though, he definitely seems to be in a funk. If it’s because he’s pouting about his role, how much he gets the ball, Miller being on the team, it’s simple: do what the coaches ask you to do and play as hard as you can. As much as he might feel he has McMillan’s ear, he doesn’t run the team. It’s odd to see such a young player, one who really hasn’t won anything yet, feel like he should be able to dictate how the team operates.
What’s really glaring, though, as other posters have mentioned, is how blase he seems to be about his team getting stomped on. He doesn’t gather the team around, he doesn’t speak up in timeouts. Nothing. Detroit almost makes up a 20 point deficit in one quarter. Nothing. Golden State annihilates us. Nothing. Memphis has a 29 point lead in our building. Nothing. That is NOT a leader. That’s somebody more caught up in their own touches, stats or whatever than winning. He wants to be in the conversation with Dwayne Wade, Kobe Bryant and guys like that? The thing that makes those guys special, and leaders, is their will, and how they impose it on both opponents and their own teammates. Every team has lulls, but it’s how they (especially their “leaders”) respond to them that defines them. Bryant or Wade would have been kicking some asses if their teams were showing that lack of effort.
by Corwin71 on Nov 28, 2009 1:34 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
Whoops
I screwed up my header there. I should read "I DO think McMillan, etc. I’m sure you could that from the contents of my post, but still, it’s annoying to make a mistake like that.
rec....
but…. giggle… don’t let the language barrier get awayfrom ya :) if ya catch my drift.
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
Head Czar of Amerika <--- Mortimer said so so there!!!
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