Thanksgiving Week Trade Drawer: What To Do With Andre Miller?
by AK1984 on Nov 22, 2009 5:40 AM PST
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PrintThe bulk of this fan post is from a comment of mine -- which follows this opening paragraph in block quotes -- that's located in a main page thread.
"The one thing the Grizzlies need more than anything is a steady presence at point guard who’s a willing distributor, calm floor general, and very reserved professional off the court.
As it is, Andre Miller fits that description.
As it stands, the Grizzlies could soon be ready to give up on Mike Conley, Jr. — who’s having a subpar season this year — and, even though I’m not a [really big] fan of his, he’s young, cheap, has three-point range on his shot, and possesses room to grow.
Yet, Conley, Jr. doesn’t earn enough salary to make the trade work within the CBA rules; thus, there’d have to be additions to any potential transaction. For the Grizzlies, moving Marko Jaric’s overpriced contract — which expires after the 2010-2011 season — would be essential to any deal. For the Portland Trail Blazers, Travis Outlaw’s on-court value is zilch; however, his off-court value is solid due to having an expiring contract. That, along with the Grizzlies reported interest in him earlier, makes him a prime candidate to also be included in such a trade come 12/15/2009.
FROM MEMPHIS & TO PORTLAND
SF/PG Marko Jaric ($7,100,000)
PG Mike Conley, Jr. ($3,883,800)FROM PORTLAND & TO MEMPHIS
PG Andre Miller ($6,730,800)
F Travis Outlaw ($3,600,000)
2010 Second-Round Draft Pick (More Favorable of Chicago’s Pick & Portland’s Pick)
$3,000,000 Cash Considerationshttp://www.realgm.com/src_checktrade.php?tradeid=5294307
ROTATION
FIRST QUARTER & THIRD QUARTER
6 Minutes
Pivotman: Greg Oden
High-Post Forward: LaMarcus Aldridge
Weakside Cornerman: Martell Webster
Ballside Wing: Brandon Roy
Off Guard: Steve Blake2 Minutes
Pivotman: Joel Przybilla
High-Post Forward: LaMarcus Aldridge
Weakside Cornerman: Martell Webster
Ballside Wing: Brandon Roy
Off Guard: Steve Blake4 Minutes
Pivotman: Joel Przybilla
High-Post Forward: Dante Cunningham
Weakside Cornerman: Rudy Fernandez
Ballside Wing: Brandon Roy
Off Guard: Mike Conley, Jr.SECOND QUARTER & FOURTH QUARTER
4 Minutes
Pivotman: Joel Przybilla
High-Post Forward: LaMarcus Aldridge
Weakside Cornerman: Martell Webster
Ballside Wing: Jerryd Bayless
Off Guard: Mike Conley, Jr.2 Minutes
Pivotman: Greg Oden
High-Post Forward: LaMarcus Aldridge
Weakside Cornerman: Rudy Fernandez
Ballside Wing: Brandon Roy
Off Guard: Mike Conley, Jr.6 Minutes
Pivotman: Greg Oden
High-Post Forward: LaMarcus Aldridge
Weakside Cornerman: Rudy Fernandez
Ballside Wing: Brandon Roy
Off Guard: Steve BlakeGoing forward, that’d be a solid rotation that could win roughly 55 games and reach the second round of this season’s playoffs."
http://www.blazersedge.com/2009/11/21/1168667/media-row-report-blazers-106#25973977
For Miller, I think it's only fair to him that he's moved elsewhere soon after 12/15/2009 -- which is the earliest he can be traded -- as this murky situation isn't all his fault. Rather, it's a collective miscommunication between the front office, the coaching staff, the hotshot superstar player (i.e., Brandon Roy), and also Miller himself. It's unfortunate that this group of individuals didn't have the foresight to recognize that this'd be a poor fit for all parties involved, but such is life. Now, though, it's only right to rectify this mess, as that'd be in everyone's best interest.
With that said, I'm curious as to why y'all think of my idea and, moreover, the ideas that each and every one of you brilliant folks have regarding a potential solution to the McMillan/Roy v. Miller conundrum.
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Andre Miller doesn't fit the triangle offense, while I fully expect Derek Fisher to retire a L.A. Laker after ...
this season. Now, with that said, the Lakers are a bit shoddy at the 1, although I expect Mitch Kupchak will solve that by offering Adam Morrison, Jordan Farmar, and Josh Powell — who’ve all got expiring contracts — to the Chicago Bulls for Kirk Hinrich. Yet, prior to such a transaction, the Lakers would need to add some warm bodies to its thin roster — such as scrap heap scrubs like Mickael Gelabale and Joe Crawford — but that’d be easy as pie.
Dear Paul Allen:
Fire Nate McMillan & hire Jeff Van Gundy.
Sincerely,
AK1984
You should know better than that
Real.fans write trade proposals with little or no regard to the other team involved in the trade. We only care about the players we get back.
you ever notice how most of your suggestions for adding players somehow involve ex-Sonics
not that your bias or anything.
...and that's a good thing
by In Walks Rudy on Nov 22, 2009 8:17 AM PST up reply actions
Meh, I thought of Mickael Gelabale since he went to training camp with the Los Angeles Lakers ...
this year. With Joe Crawford — who, unlike Gelabale, isn’t an ex-Sonic — I thought of him since he’s on the Los Angeles D-Fenders (i.e., the Lakers D-League squad).
Dear Paul Allen:
Fire Nate McMillan & hire Jeff Van Gundy.
Sincerely,
AK1984
I don't think Miller was acquired in order to get moved again
The PG situation will solve itself next offseason, when the Blazers will just let Blake walk a la Channing. If they have confidence in Jerryd (in a combo with Rudy) to lead the second unit that is. If not, all bets are off, and we’ll have a young guard demanding a trade.
Nate IS philosophizing about a mid-season move in his latest talk with Brian T Smith, but that seems to be about a change for a forward. And even that seems to be given a low possibility by both Smith and Nate thanks to “financial complications”. They don’t even seem willing to let Mills walk, much less eat a guaranteed contract.
My two cents on which very good PG seems remotely available in the minds of a surprisingly large number of the fanbase (no idea about the team): Jameer Nelson. Magic bloggers suggested talks about moving him have become much louder among their readers and among journalists. Which is surprising, since he is young, borderline all-star, and very adept at running picks with Howard. So I doubt the front office really thinks about moving him.
Ceterum censeo Lakers esse delendam
the Blazers will just let Blake walk a la Channing
I get a polar opposite impression when reading what Nate/KP/Brandon/etc have said about Steve, and when observing McMillian’s “preferential treatment” of #2 this season (and in the past)
Wishing won’t make the Blake “problem” go away, neither will hoping make Bayless a playoff-caliber backup PG
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
My initial post about this topic (which AK replied to)
Discussed going after Nelson. He would be perfect for our system and if we could somehow get both him and Bass for whatever necessary outside of the Big 3 then it would be a great move.
"What happened to Bayless anyway? Did he turn into a pumpkin? Most teams don’t just let #11 picks rot." - Xiane
Nelson and Bass are making 12 mil/year
Sure, Orlando has that trade exception but you have to ask yourself, what players would they want from the Blazers to complete their hoped-for championship run?
Andre Miller? Wrong fit for that offense
Joel Przybilla? They already have 2 centers
Steve Blake? Possibly, but this would happen over Nate and Brandon’s dead bodies
Travis Outlaw? Not while he’s in a boot (besides, the Magic don’t need his expiring contract because they’re way over the cap next July, regardless.)
Roy and LMA can’t be traded (because of their contract status) and Oden won’t be dealt
And no other Blazers make enough money to part of the discussion
Thanks for playing, and here’s some lovely consolation prizes…you get to watch Juwan Howard play and repeatedly hear about how the starting lineup won 54 games last year!
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Didn't give the specifics a lot of thought on this one as it is a bit of a pipe dream
However I would suggest that if you start with Rudy and Miller and add to that you might have a workable proposal for one reason – The Orlando Magic’s offense has changes, at least from what I’ve seen. They run far less through Howard and far more through Carter now, a much more traditional NBA offensive set. They still hoist up a lot of three’s for sure but these are coming more from Carter (who is at a career high in 3pt attempts @ 6 per game) than being distributed as they were in their inside-out offense last year. As a result, having a veteren PG capable of re-establishing Howards primary role on the team while also helping a young athletic team run the fast break (like he could have done here) surely wouldn’t be an unattractive proposition, despite his inability to hit the three.
Add Rudy, a long term solution at SG once Carter is done there and you at least have some talent worthy of opening a discussion for Nelson/Bass. The way I see it Nelson>Rudy but Miller>Bass so there might be a chance.
"Oden was a huge factor in that...thank goodness he got in foul trouble...nobody could guard Oden" Don Nelson
Jameer always thought he should've been drafted ahead of Sebastian Telfair
so if he was traded to Portland it would be poetic justice…sort of
The big question would still be “how are Nelson and Roy going to coexist?” as usual
I want “more” for Rudy, when it comes time to deal him…so unless Jameer somehow turns into “the next Terry Porter” in a Blazer uniform, I think I’ll pass
FWIW, Quick said that he thinks the Blazers are looking for a backup forward who can play the 4 and the 3, and that’s not Bass
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
On your first point: They would coexist just fine I reckon
On your second: Fair enough, you are entirely entitled to your own opinion
On the third: Oh. Bugger.
Chad Ford on Oden, "He's definitely a defensive force... I don't think he'll ever put up the big numbers that Shaq did. But he could be the best big man defender in the league... frankly, having a 7 footer that can do that will produce more rings than a 6-11 small forward who can score 30 ppg. That was the thinking all along why GMs preferred Oden to Durant. KD is the sexier player and as an offensive player there is just no comparison. KD is great. Oden is aspiring to average. But defensively, Oden could be dominant. KD ... not so much."
Could have said it better myself. Thanks Mr. Ford!
By the way AK, I find it ironic that you want to send Miller to the Grizzlies, a team where he would get in the same dilemma
They have O.J. Mayo as the primary ball handler, at least that will be more and more his role in crunch time. He is their Roy. That team might be the closest mirror to the Blazers, on a worse level.
They aren’t that happy with Conley at the moment, but that’s mainly because his defense and read-and-react skills seem to have taken a step back. Now if they had Miller instead, would that really make them better? Other than that the franchise screwed up colossally with the idea “hey, we have 3 young guys who need the ball, and Zach ‘Black Hole’ Randolph. We should really acquire another high-volume scoring guard”, what would be their motivation? Just getting rid of Jaric can be done cheaper.
Ceterum censeo Lakers esse delendam
Yeah, I highly doubt that the Orlando Magic brass would even consider trading Jameer Nelson. When ...
healthy, Nelson is the perfect fit at the point on offense within Stan Van Gundy’s 4-outside/1-inside spread offense. And, even if Nelson was on the trading block, Andre Miller inability to spread the floor would nix him as a realistic option for the Magic. For now, the Magic might as well weather the storm with Jason Williams and Anthony Johnson. Now, if Nelson’s injury woes continue later into the season, then the Magic using a portion of its sizeable trade exception — which was created via the Hedo Turkoglu sign-and-trade deal with the Toronto Raptors — and filler (e.g., the draft rights of Rashard Griffith) for someone cheap, yet useful like Earl Watson would be a shrewd move. In my opinion, Watson is a safer option than the wildly inconsistent Williams and washed-up Johnson.
Dear Paul Allen:
Fire Nate McMillan & hire Jeff Van Gundy.
Sincerely,
AK1984
Ugh, that should be in reply to your other comment.
Anyway, with regards to Andre Miller hypothetically being traded to the Memphis Grizzlies, I’d argue that for this season and next season the Grizzlies could badly use a pure point guard with experience to run its offense. The Grizzlies already have two pass-first backup point guards, Jamaal Tinsley and Marcus Williams, so Miller would fit right in as the leader of that crew.
For starters, O.J. Mayo shouldn’t be used as the primary ball handler. While Mayo can create for himself, he’s a lot like Gilbert Arenas in that he doesn’t effectively involve others in the offensive flow. I’ve argued for a long time that Arenas must be paired with a more team-oriented backcourt partner — which is why Mike Miller is a good fit on offense next to him — and now the same rationale applies to Mayo.
So, if you have Miller there to move Mayo off the ball and feed Marc Gasol in the post like he was doing with Greg Oden here, the next order of business is cleaning up at least one of the high usage forwards. Since Zach Randolph’s overpriced contract makes him immovable, Rudy Gay has got to head on out of Memphis—preferably for a shutdown perimeter defender at the 3.
FROM MEMPHIS & TO MINNESOTA
SF Rudy Gay
FROM MINNESOTA & TO MEMPHIS
SF Corey Brewer
Future First-Round Draft Pick (Via Charlotte Through Denver: Top-12 Protected In 2010, Top-10 Protected In 2011, Top-8 Protected in 2012, Top-3 Protected in 2013, & Unprotected In 2014)
Future Conditional First-Round Draft Pick (Via Utah Through Philadelphia: Top-15 Protected In 2010, Top-17 Protected In 2011, Top-16 Protected In 2012, Top-16 Protected In 2013, & Becomes Unprotected 2014 Second-Round Draft Pick If Not Yet Conveyed)
http://www.realgm.com/src_future_draftpicks.php
http://www.realgm.com/src_checktrade.php?tradeid=5294488
Anyway, that’s just the thought process on my end.
Dear Paul Allen:
Fire Nate McMillan & hire Jeff Van Gundy.
Sincerely,
AK1984
Orlando
If Orlando makes an in-season trade, they will most likely use Brandon Bass at their trading chip. With Rashard Lewis and Ryan Anderson taking up all the playing time at power forward, Bass has been getting DNPs lately, which is crazy. But Anderson’s ability to hit threes makes him fit better in Orlando’s scheme. Bass is good, but he can’t hit threes.
The most obvious trade with Portland is for Steve Blake, not Andre Miller. Blake’s salary is identical to Bass’s. Blake would give Orlando a temporary PG with experience and the ability to hit the three. Then he’d be gone at the end of the season. Portland might even be able to re-sign him.
www.blazerguy.com
While I agree Brandon Bass is a bad fit in Orlando due to Stan Van Gundy's 4-outside/1-inside ...
spread offense, you shouldn’t sleep on the Magic’s $6,864,200 trade exception from the sign-and-trade deal that sent Hedo Turkoglu to the Toronto Raptors. By using the trade exception, the Magic could absorb a medium-sized contract from a non-contending team that’s could look to cut salary around the trade deadline. That, of course, is why I suggested the Magic may someday target Earl Watson — who’s got three-point range and works hard on defense — of the Indiana Pacers.
On another note, I think we should all put to rest any trade proposals involving Steve Blake. Unless Kevin Pritchard wants to upset Nate McMillan and Brandon Roy in the middle of a season, then he won’t trade Blake. So, even though my opinion is that Blake — as well as McMillan — aren’t long-term answers at their respective jobs for the Portland Trail Blazers, this isn’t the proper time to deal with those issues.
Dear Paul Allen:
Fire Nate McMillan & hire Jeff Van Gundy.
Sincerely,
AK1984
They'd probably take Bayless too
Orlando would likely accept a Bayless for Bass swap too. Considering Bayless is not playing any meaningful minutes in our rotation, even with two guys injured, seems like a trade worth considering.
www.blazerguy.com
Jerryd Bayless isn't a floor spreader, but rather a gunner; thus, he wouldn't fit in Orlando.
Dear Paul Allen:
Fire Nate McMillan & hire Jeff Van Gundy.
Sincerely,
AK1984
I would trade Bayless in a deal for Conley though
Memphis love talent so would probably like to have him included in a deal for Conley. Miller+Outlaw+Bayless for Conley+Gay could work, even though I don’t really want Rudy Gay on this team. It solves out short term need at sf and long term need at pg while we can just let Gay go at the end of the year, much as we would have with Travis.
"What happened to Bayless anyway? Did he turn into a pumpkin? Most teams don’t just let #11 picks rot." - Xiane
I can't stand Rudy Gay, who should always play for bad teams that'll let him chuck.
Dear Paul Allen:
Fire Nate McMillan & hire Jeff Van Gundy.
Sincerely,
AK1984
Yes
but wouldn’t he serve the same role here as Travis? if he doesn’t like it then he can deal with it, he will be gone by the end of the year anyway.
I’m not looking for a ’ship this year so we can take some lumps along the way if it is better for next year and beyond.
"What happened to Bayless anyway? Did he turn into a pumpkin? Most teams don’t just let #11 picks rot." - Xiane
why would Memphis want Jerryd?
He’s basically a smaller, poor man’s version of OJ Mayo
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Since when
do Memphis make decisions based on logic and fit.
They like talent above all else and have proved that again and again.
"What happened to Bayless anyway? Did he turn into a pumpkin? Most teams don’t just let #11 picks rot." - Xiane
OK, I give up
KP should offer them Jeff Pendergraph for Sam Young
And Travis Outlaw for Rudy Gay
And Steve Blake for Marc Gasol
“Let’s make Mikey eat it…he hates everything”
(very old/obscure LIFE cereal commercial reference)
It’s too bad KP is still burning from the Mile’s debacle, he could be absolutely fleecing the Griz, left and right. The island of Manhattan could be his, for a mere handful of glass beads
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Ok then, I give up too
Lets not consider Memphis’ history of making dumb decisions and assume they will be intelligent and logical from now on….why not.
Just for fun, lets recount some recent decisions which surely back up your defense of the Grizzlies:
- Traded Battier for Gay and Swift – great for them, now they have a great fantasy player instead of a great piece for a championship team
- Drafted Conley 4th in 2007 – Love the guy but he is and was a role player who was drafted higher than expected because he played with a great big man in college.
- The Pau Gasol debacle
- Traded Kevin Love for OJ Mayo in the 2008 Draft despite having traded Pau Gasol and having no long term answer at the 4, gaining an inefficient gunner and Jaric’s ridiculous deal in the process, well done!
- Drafted Hasheem Thabeet despite one of their best three players being a young center, logical huh?
Memphis have proven that they make decisions based on little or no logic, unless they have some secret formula that no one else knows about. I’m skeptical, therefore I think you can trade talent to Memphis and get something decent in return, based on their history. That is simply logical….but I guess you’d rather belittle my point and continue your mission as the lone member of the Steve Blake appreciation club.
"Oden was a huge factor in that...thank goodness he got in foul trouble...nobody could guard Oden" Don Nelson
you've got me all wrong
I’m not in Steve’s corner, my lot in life is to explain the futility of others who wish to deal Steve away. Blake is like the broadsword that you’ll have to pry from Brandon and Nate’s cold, dead fingers
I don’t have a problem making trade proposals with Memphis. (I’ve suggested that Outlaw be dealt there, for at least a year.) I’m just pessimistic that Blake will be dealt, anywhere. I also suspect that relations are “frosty” between KP and Mike Wallace (due to the Mile’s situation) and that will likely poison any amicable trade discussions, for awhile
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Well if that the case
Then we agree entirely. I still think you see more of a role for Blake than some around here, perhaps more through a doubting Bayless’ potential as a PG?
As for Memphis, if there is a trade that we can make to improve our team then there should be no barriers due to the Miles thing. The animosity should come from our side only, therefore ripping them off would be in our best interests!
"Oden was a huge factor in that...thank goodness he got in foul trouble...nobody could guard Oden" Don Nelson
eh? Bayless is a guy that drives to the rim. A dribble-drive guard that attacks the basket and draws fouls.
Mayo is a jump shooter’s jump shooter.
They are very dissimilar.
i cry for nic
neither are PGs
and if they trade MCJ, they’ll need one
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
They seem to be convinced that Mayo is one
He is aswell so maybe they have their PGOTF whether he is one or not.
Bayless is a hybrid and so is Mayo so it could work – would certainly be a potent offensive combination.
"Oden was a huge factor in that...thank goodness he got in foul trouble...nobody could guard Oden" Don Nelson
But he could be
Bayless isn’t currently a floor spreader, but Orlando might want him on the hunch he will be. By all accounts Bayless is a good shooter in practice. And he was a good shooter in college. His motion looks good. He just hasn’t gotten enough sustained plaining time. He’s 20, though. Odds are he’ll be a decent 3-point shooter at some point.
www.blazerguy.com
Agreed
Blake isn’t going anywhere. He is starting despite his poor play at the behest of the coach and best player. That is not a guy that is a likely trade candidate, as much as I wish that weren’t true.
I believe that even if we acquired Conley, Nate would leave Blake in as starter for the remainder of the season as that is what is most convenient for him and Brandon, if not best for the team.
"What happened to Bayless anyway? Did he turn into a pumpkin? Most teams don’t just let #11 picks rot." - Xiane
It's Roy's team
They should trade everyone else and iso Roy all game long. They’ll lose every game but Roy will be ‘comfortable’
Blazer Fan
by leeroyjenkins on Nov 22, 2009 8:15 AM PST reply actions 1 recs
I need more coffee......and
I don’t really like talking trades this time of year….but it is so seldom I find myself agreeing with in principle with you AK… I am stunned to admit you are on to something. I think ’Dre will be traded and you have one there I would seriously consider.
RoadBlazer
Ok, I'll play for once...The Washington Wizards seem prime to implode their roster
I would take a stab at Antawn Jamison if we can swap him for Miller/Outlaw/xtras. (I know most of us would go after Caron but I don’t see anyone supplanting Nic’s role on this team and I rather have Nic as our starting 3).
Antawn is an efficient scorer and can fill that backup PF position. In our 2nd unit, he can help our lack of scoring options and should be satisfied with all his touches.
Antawn is a piss poor defender but with Joel anchoring the middle, this wouldn’t be a problem. I would do anything to sunset Juwan.
With a much younger Blatche playing well for the Wizards combined with Antawn’s age and the general suckiness of the Wizards with all their bloated contracts, this could be a remote possibility. They now realize that the makeup of their team sucks and it’s not because of the injuries. Of course, Antawn is like Miller in that he want starter minutes. I’m haven’t put much thought in how that would work out.
Miller can help Arenas go back to being a scorer that he naturally is and Miller would be a huge upgrade over Earl Boykins. Outlaw would be an upgrade for them over McGuire and help them sunset the minutes of the horrid DeShawn Stevenson.
I forgo chasing a PG. Roy needs the ball in his hands so instead of getting a roaming PG, get a low post scoring option we can rely on in the 4th that keeps the defense honest on Roy until GO/LMA get into their own. At Antawn’s age, it would be a decent if not great role.
Conley Jr. is not playing well this year. Is this an anomaly? I have no idea but I think he has a lower PER than Blake…and we all know how inconsistent Blake has been this year.
Anyways, that was fun.
Using Antawn Jamison in the role of a backup 4/3 left open by Travis Outlaw — which Jamison played ...
with the Dallas Mavericks during the 2003-2004 season — would be a travesty both on the court and from a long-term financial aspect. The Portland Trail Blazers need a banger 4/5 (e.g., Nick Collison) rather than a defensively weak 4/3 sixth man. With Jamison, Portland would just get an older — albeit somewhat better — as well as more expensive version of Outlaw, who himself should’ve been moved already due to glaring flaws like porous defense.
Dear Paul Allen:
Fire Nate McMillan & hire Jeff Van Gundy.
Sincerely,
AK1984
Antwan has only two years left on his contract right?
We definitely need roster balance but our 2nd unit can’t score. A backup banger like NIck Collison won’t help us in that scenario with how Nate currently coaches us.
The lineup of Pyz/Howard/Martell/Rudy/Blake is a travesty.
The difference between Outlaw and Jamison, is that Jamison works on the low blocks (of course he drifts to shoot a few mid range shots but not as much as LMA). GO is the only one that works on the blocks for us which creates spacing…
That 2003-4 Mavs team was pretty good albeit the one before was better. I would take into account Don Nelson if we are talking about utilizing of a PF/C.
I’m all for a backup banger that is not a viable scoring option if Nate changes his rotations
if Paul is looking to win this year, an Antawn move would make a lot of sense. He plays no defense, but in a sixth man that is looking to score, that’s not such a big deal. He fits Nate’s isolation offense, hits the three, and rebounds well. Put him next to Greg and his defensive inadequacies are suddenly in the same pit of forget as that of Rashard Lewis.
Despite Jamison having a bad rap, he was one of a few Wizards with a positive adjusted +/- last year.
I would not at all be surprised to see Paul get tired of waiting and go after Jamison.
That would give us
Blake/Bayless
Roy/Rudy
Marty(Nic when healthy)/Antawn
LMA/Antawn
Greg/Joel
That is pretty darn solid. Go with a lot of Roy/Rudy in the backcourt to give more minutes to Antawn and Nic at the three.
i cry for nic
Antawn Jamison's contract lasts through the 2011-2012 season, which'll be the first year that ...
Greg Oden is earning the big bucks. Thus, Jamison’s contract is prohibitive to the long-term goal of fiscal prudence. Anyway, with regards to that 2003-2004 Dallas Mavericks squad, I think the biggest problem was Antoine Walker and not Jamison. No matter who you blame, though, that squad was stuck starting Dirk Nowitzki at center — with the brittle Shawn Bradley as his backup — which was a recipe for the fourth worst defensive team in the NBA that season. So, with the Portland Trail Blazers, you could argue Greg Oden and Joel Przybilla would help mask Jamison’s defensive weaknesses, but I still figure that his massive contract is what’d ultimately block any possible deal involving him.
Dear Paul Allen:
Fire Nate McMillan & hire Jeff Van Gundy.
Sincerely,
AK1984
Would you do Miller and Rudy for Caron Butler?
and feel free to throw in any amount of “sweetner” short of Nic Batum?
Butler’s salary only extends to 2010-2011, so no problem, there. And besides, I think KP would be willing to “part” with Webster, before the time came to “make a decision” re: re-upping Caron.
I think I could “live with” a Blake-Roy-Butler-LMA-Oden starting lineup. Sure, the bench scoring would be pitiful, but you can’t fix everything with one deal ;^)
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
I'm not a Caron Butler fan, as his defense is below average and doesn't have any value ...
as a three-point shooter from the corner. With Butler, you’re combining his shoddy defense with the main reason why I’ve claimed that Gerald Wallace would be a bad fit here offensively in Nate McMillan’s system.
Dear Paul Allen:
Fire Nate McMillan & hire Jeff Van Gundy.
Sincerely,
AK1984
You know...
Gerald Wallace is a better rebounder and post defender than Aldridge.
Just play Wallace 15 minutes at PF when Aldridge is out of the game. When he’s on the floor as a SF you could have Aldridge space the floor and keep Wallace down low. He’s a better rebounder than Aldridge anyway, so it’s not going to hurt that much having LMA away from the basket. On defense you can stick him almost anywhere depending on matchups.
I’m not sure Nate is that creative, but a great coach could make it work.
by Nick Van Excellent on Nov 23, 2009 8:00 AM PST up reply actions
Oh, and with regards to Mike Conley, Jr., he's been playing like crap so far this season. As I've said ...
numerous times, I’m not a fan of Conley, Jr. and think he’s best suited as a backup. Yet, as it is, Conley, Jr. is young, cheap, and can fill the role of an off guard at the 1 — so long as his shot is falling from deep — which’d make him a solid fit stylistically in Portland.
Dear Paul Allen:
Fire Nate McMillan & hire Jeff Van Gundy.
Sincerely,
AK1984
I agree
Conley Jr. would focus/work more on his 3s if he is a Blazer and I can see his shooting % increase. If we get Conley Jr., I would expect Nate give Bayless a shot first at the backup PG position before Conley this season….It just seems Nate is pretty loyal to players who have been in his system and pay their “dues.”
Then you have a Conley Jr / Bayless lineup if they release Blake in the offseason. I really have a hard time seeing Blake leaving….Something has to happen between KP and Nate in order for a paradigm shift in thinking here.
And that paradigm shift will be Mr. Paul Allen.
If we factor everything in….Paul will push for a more aggressive timeline based on the mediocre ball we have been playing.
Bake the cake will turn into, give me the 3 best possible cake and I will pick one right now.
Agreed Conley has been playing like crap, which is why Memphis has gambled on Iverson and Tinsley, in rapid succession.
Why exactly do the Blazers want to roll the dice on him, though? He’s not the dead-eye perimeter shooter they need to replace Blake, nor is he a fancy-passer. Nor is he a terrific defender, nor does he have world-class quickness…
He’s just a sort of okay player that is buddies with Greg Oden.
What’s the point?
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
Yeah, I keep thinking of L.A. Clippers era Jeff McInnis as a comparison to Mike Conley, Jr. That ...
mostly has to do with the numerous flaws you mentioned above — which include Conley’s subpar shooting (TS%), passing (AST%), defense (Net Points Per 100 Possessions/Net eFG% Allowed), and rebounding (TRB%) — yet, he’s still young, cheap, and can play off the ball. All in all, it’d be a low-risk/high-reward transaction.
Dear Paul Allen:
Fire Nate McMillan & hire Jeff Van Gundy.
Sincerely,
AK1984
That should read as Net Points Allowed Per 100 Possessions, but that's only a slight error.
Dear Paul Allen:
Fire Nate McMillan & hire Jeff Van Gundy.
Sincerely,
AK1984
The point would be that we lose a player who has so far proven not to be a good fit with the starting unit
and gain one who would be a good fit, provided his play improves (as it should for a 22 year old pg).
I wouldn’t under rate the on-court chemistry Conley and Oden have obviously built during their time together in HS and College. They looked better together than they do apart and there is little reason to think that 2 years would have affected that relationship.
"What happened to Bayless anyway? Did he turn into a pumpkin? Most teams don’t just let #11 picks rot." - Xiane
My fantasy is......
that we trade Miller for Shane Battier straight up. Damn the reasons why Houston would not do this trade. Its my fantasy
by blazerbeliever97504 on Nov 22, 2009 9:33 AM PST reply actions
Why is it that every single one of your trade proposals contains $3MM in cash considerations?
"Ain't nothin' in this world for free."
AK likes to spend Paul Allen's money...
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
There's a lot I could do with $10,500,000,000.
Dear Paul Allen:
Fire Nate McMillan & hire Jeff Van Gundy.
Sincerely,
AK1984
Good Post
M 80- So what does Portland give up? Big D- Nothing, Pritchard is such a genius that teams just give him players for free. (Comments from Blog a Bull on July 9, 2009)
Not ready to give up on Miller in the mix
Nate’s comments in the paper today stressed his “need” for Miller to take over the second unit and make it his. If he can accept that role (this is the big question) and run a series of sets that gets Rudy going and Bayless involved, and he pushes the ball so LA can pick up some transition baskets, and he takes advantage of his mismatches on the block, this mix still might work.
Miller has looked great at times with Roy and also on a unit with Blake with Roy on the bench. It isn’t even December yet and they need time to figure out how all these strengths can work most effectively together. If they still look this out of sync in January and their record is hovering around .500, I will be more willing to call this experiment a failure. I am not saying it doesn’t hurt to watch at times, but they also have a fantastic mix of talents that could be deadly together if they can get the right combos going. I have at least a little bit of faith left that it can happen without a trade.
PTB Liberation Day - 2/10/04
Rec for doing a trade drawer, but I don't like this trade.
I think we could get more for Miller than just Conley jr. He is just not very good this year, and I want a defensive PG on this team for a change. I still think Hinrich is a possibility, but it is a pipe dream. Brandon would not be able to sleep at night, knowing his binky had to compete with Hinrich, who does everything he does but better. Cuz you know Blake ain’t going anywhere any time soon.
Hornets GM- “So KP, I heard you’re interested in Chris Paul. Well I wanna do you a favor just cuz I like you and want the Blazers to succeed. I’m going to Pau Gasol trade you into the finals this year. Blake, Outlaw, and a pack of gum for CP3.” “Sorry sir. No way am I trading Steve away right now. Brandon is just getting comfortable again.”
You absolutely nailed this post ak.
High fiber-Post Forward: LaMarcus Aldridge
Weakside Corner dealer: Martell Webster
Ballside Wingnut: Brandon Roy……
Yeah, you really nailed it.
How about this:
New Orleans is desparate to cut salary:
trade
We get a great power forward backup for two expiring contracts. It does mean we have faith in Bayless and Miller.
link broken?
All I got was TM.
*Unless KP has a secret plan that makes this statement incorrect.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
><> ><> ><> ><> ><> ><> ><> ><> ><> ><> ><> ><>
...
Andre Miller, Travis Outlaw, a 2nd round pick and money for Mike Conley Jr? huh?
We have a procedural matter to discuss
I read/heard this week that according to the CBA, injured NBA players cannot be traded
So, unless we can get an authoritative source to the contrary, there should be a moratorium on Outlaw trade proposals until Travis is cleared for active duty (which means, in effect, not until the “window” between the last game of the NBA finals and July 1st)
I doubt a team going nowhere (like Memphis) would be interested in acquiring a veteran
PG like Miller, but a contending team that has just lost it’s starting PG to serious injury might possibly inquire re: Andre’s availability, up until the deadlne in mid-Feb
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Injured players are traded all the time
the thing is that teams have the option to void a trade if the player doesn’t pass their physical (like Chandler’s toe with the Thunder last year). The only way Travis’s foot would prevent a trade from happening is if a team checked him out and concluded that it was worse than they thought, in which case they would have the option to rescind the trade.
For the most part, though, if a guy is hurt and the other team knows it, it’s no big deal.
get it done.
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
How about
Working a deal to get Sessions from Minnesota? The guy we should have gone after in the first place… Minn. clearly doesn’t know how to use him.
Or what about DJ Augustine from Charlotte? He seems to be underachieving this year, but showed some really great things last year when given playing time at the starting position. He has 3-point ability, and I’m sure LMA would welcome another Longhorn with open arms.
JMO but
Session has all the same problems as Miller as a floor spacer (ie. he can’t hit a 3 pointer to save himself) while Augustin was worse than Conley Jr last year when both were ‘showing what they had’ in the second half of the season.
"What happened to Bayless anyway? Did he turn into a pumpkin? Most teams don’t just let #11 picks rot." - Xiane
Yeah, Ramon Sessions wouldn't fit here.
Dear Paul Allen:
Fire Nate McMillan & hire Jeff Van Gundy.
Sincerely,
AK1984
The Blazers liked Augustine, pre-draft
DJ’s making Bayless-money, since they were picked pretty close to each other in the ’08 draft. I think DJA was “the” guy that Portland really wanted (once Westbrook was off the board) because Augustine could “get anywhere he wanted” on the floor and distributed the ball so well during the workouts
If the Bobcats want to “swap” guards I think KP would be all over that, but I suspect it will take “more” than Jerryd to pry DJ away from Larry Brown…maybe sweeten the pot with cash and/or a draft choice?
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
I like the idea but...
the 2nd team is really struggling to score without Travis. Take him and Miller out of the picture and add only Conley and I can’t see how that team only gets worse. You are relying on Bayless and Cunningham for regular minutes and it’s far from clear that either are up for it. Relying on Bayless for 4 4th quarter minutes every night scares the heck out of me.
you remind me of the black knight in Monty Python's Holy Grail who got all of his limbs cut off
“I’ll bite you to death, if it means getting Cap’n Kirk!”
When reached 40 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Man, it's a valiant effort.
Dear Paul Allen:
Fire Nate McMillan & hire Jeff Van Gundy.
Sincerely,
AK1984
I've even gone as far as thinking
Outlaw+Blake+Bayless for Hinrich and one of their rookies.
Or the go-big-or-go-home idea which I saw on BaB: Rudy Fernandez, Steve Blake, Travis Outlaw, Jeff Pendergraph, Andre Miller for Hinrich and Deng (Przy was included aswell in the initial deal but I think a 5 for 2 is consolidation enough!)
Or an alternate go-big-or-go-home deal: Rudy, Blake, Outlaw, Pendergraph, Miller for Hinrich, Deng, Gibson
Think both a questionable financially but hey, where’s the fun in all that CBA mumbo-jumbo!
"Oden was a huge factor in that...thank goodness he got in foul trouble...nobody could guard Oden" Don Nelson
Miller is a dead man walking.
Which is shame, because I’ve been a huge fan since he went to the 76’ers.
Wouldn’t the Bobcats want him? Larry Brown isn’t afraid of taking on veterans, even though his team should be getting younger. He also desperatly needs a PG and a steady dose of offensive output. Andre would fit terrifically playing in that system. That roster just screams for a guy like him to reign everyone in, throw lobs to Chandler, and make sure S-Jax doesn’t dominate the ball too much.
The problem would be who would we take back. Gerald Wallace is an interesting fit. He’s probably the best rebounding SF in the league and a top ten defender at his position.(At least) He’s already a better PF in my opinion than either Aldrige or Outlaw, but he would be fine as a SF too if need be. Not sure the Bobcats would do that deal, but hey, if they saved enough money maybe it could happen.
by Nick Van Excellent on Nov 23, 2009 2:44 AM PST reply actions
What I am reading is that you are willing to trade Miller, TO and $3M is cash considerations and a draft pick for a bottle of dated Cheez Whiz
While I want Miller to start and I am fine having a TO in the toolbox or as real trade bait for talent and for contract.
No. Keep Miller.
Don’t re-sign Nate.
Nate is a good man, but unfortunately, not the right coach for this team.
Not a good trade.
Assuming you do a trade to make your team better, I don’t see how trading two rotation guys for a middle of the road point guard with a suspect jump shot is a good move.
by Blaze of Glory on Nov 23, 2009 3:02 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
Regardless of who/what gets traded, the one thing I believe will be key to our overall success is...
…that if Brandon wants to be our point guard then let him be our point guard. It almost seems, this season, as if Brandon wants to have his cake and eat it too. Not good for our long term success.
....formerly GonzoFan. Now, this has been a message from "The People's Alliance to Continue to Encourage Greg Oden on his Path to Dominance"
Trade Andre + other assets for a starting SF...
…and let Roy start at point along with Rudy at the two-guard.
....formerly GonzoFan. Now, this has been a message from "The People's Alliance to Continue to Encourage Greg Oden on his Path to Dominance"
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