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Around SBN: Knicks Beat Lakers With Familiar Strategy

Collins or Udoka?




Let me start by saying, what a nice problem to have.... two quality players, both with high character and talent, competing for the FINAL SPOT on the roster.  Wow...

Star-divide

 

But I also have to ask for your input on what you would do. 

Case for Ime Udoka:  He may be declining, but has flourished in the past here with McMillan.  Loves the Portland fans (his hometown) and will play hard no matter what.  Was our best defender just a few years ago, something this team is striving to improve at.  Steady at both ends of the floor, and can knock down open three's from the corner.  But I think he would bring DEFENSE more than we'd rely on him for offense. 

Case against Udoka:  He's declining, and as the recent O-live story stated, he's painfully redundant.  Do we need MORE small forwards? 

Case for Jarron Collins:  He's very smart, works hard, and would bring some size to back up our bigs.  Has veteran experience and would provide a great practice and lockerroom presence consistent with who this team is.  If Aldridge, Oden, or Joel get injured, wouldn't we be happy to have Collins?  Or, when Shaq or Duncan checks into the game, nice to have some fouls to spread around since Oden has been known to accumulate a few...


Case against Collins:  Missed much of last year due to injury, and has been un-spectacular. 

My Personal Opinion:  I personally think Ime is great, and would be happy to see him make the roster, but I actually think Collins would be the more strategic, long-term choice that could meet different needs for the team.  Thoughts?

Poll
Who do you go with?
Ime Udoka
99 votes
Jarron Collins
189 votes
Neither - keep the roster spot open
47 votes

335 votes | Poll has closed

Comment 49 comments  |  0 recs  | 

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they should sign me.

i’ll take sergio’s role of chucking up half-court heaves to end quarters.

"There are a few teams you have to watch out for in the fourth quarter."
"Yeah, but Portland definitely is not one of them."

-New Orleans Hornets broadcasters at the end of the third quarter with the Hornets leading 74-59. Portland later ends up winning 97-89.

"They don't mind him shooting that shot at all. Rudy Fernandez is not that great of a 3pt shooter."

-New Orleans Hornets broadcasters right after a Rudy Fernandez missed 3pter. Rudy Fernandez finished the game with three 3pters on six attempts.

by Tofu Anonymous on Oct 5, 2009 10:01 AM PDT reply actions  

Sign Collins

One of the most physical guys in the league, played under Sloan, on the borderline of being too rough. No offensive skills whatsoever, but it’s good to have guys like that.

by Hawthorne Wingo on Oct 5, 2009 10:06 AM PDT reply actions  

Doesn't matter too much

The chance they’ll play in more than a few games is virtually zero in any case.

"Good evening Blazer fans, wherever you may be!"-Bill Schonely

by skywaker9 on Oct 5, 2009 10:08 AM PDT reply actions  

Collins

i agree with the above two posters

Blazer Fan

by leeroyjenkins on Oct 5, 2009 10:09 AM PDT reply actions  

Steven Hill (just released from Chicago) or Chris Mihm if we want experience

I want a big man if we fill that last spot. Udoka is the better player, but as Ben said yesterday this is not about best player available but greatest need – if it should come to injuries. We have half a dozen players who can ably play SF, but potentially problems if one of the Big Big 3 goes down (Greg, LaMarcus, Joel) with Pendergraph already hurt and the rest just power forwards. Collins is a nice guy and a big body, but for his whole career he was a lousy rebounder (historically bad, though his brother is even worse) and an offensive non-factor.

"I think he can still play" - Kevin Pritchard on Juwan Howard

by Norsktroll on Oct 5, 2009 10:11 AM PDT reply actions  

This.

You can measure skill and talent with your eyes, but productivity is shown through statistics.

by austinpwnz on Oct 5, 2009 1:46 PM PDT up reply actions  

After fan fest, I've changed my mind.

Udoka can still play.

"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal

by timbo on Oct 5, 2009 10:15 AM PDT reply actions  

I'd be a bit surprised if Portland takes Udoka due to the decline issue...

Udoka knows he’ll get PT in the pre-season, and likely will be on a different roster quite soon -

by hotstuffdb22 on Oct 5, 2009 10:28 AM PDT reply actions  

Oden's going to need people to beat up in practice.

Przy will prolly want a break from that.

I say Collins.

I get the paper, so I don't care!

by Name's Ash on Oct 5, 2009 10:35 AM PDT reply actions  

Collins

If one of our SFs get injured, Ime STILL wouldn’t play. If two SFs got injured, Ime STILL wouldn’t play. We have too many wing players who can cover for other’s injuries, and Ime would be too far down the depth chart to matter… not even in practice.

Collins isn’t a very good player, but he is big and he has experience. I don’t WANT him to play, but if Oden or Joel get injured, we’d at least have another guy who knows how to play center.

Plus, he is more useful than Ime for PRACTICE even, giving Oden someone to bang against so Joel doesn’t have to take the brunt of it.

I think the team will pick Ime, but I think the better choice is Collins.

Mortimer

by Mortimer on Oct 5, 2009 10:35 AM PDT reply actions  

My theory;

If we sign Udoka then a trade is a foregone conclusion this season. He can definitely be a dependable 3rd string wing player. I just don’t see our EPIC logjam at the wing positions surviving with Udoka in the mix without a trade.

by dario argento on Oct 5, 2009 10:37 AM PDT reply actions  

Perhaps...

a lineup of all small forwards??

I wish I spent more time playing catch with you and less time training my body and mind to kill you...

by 1badbadger on Oct 5, 2009 10:51 AM PDT up reply actions  

if minnesota can do it with point guards

who knows.

"There are a few teams you have to watch out for in the fourth quarter."
"Yeah, but Portland definitely is not one of them."

-New Orleans Hornets broadcasters at the end of the third quarter with the Hornets leading 74-59. Portland later ends up winning 97-89.

"They don't mind him shooting that shot at all. Rudy Fernandez is not that great of a 3pt shooter."

-New Orleans Hornets broadcasters right after a Rudy Fernandez missed 3pter. Rudy Fernandez finished the game with three 3pters on six attempts.

by Tofu Anonymous on Oct 5, 2009 11:08 AM PDT up reply actions  

Closest we'd get

Rudy – SF/PG
Roy – SF/SG
Webster – SF/SF
Outlaw – SF/PF
Batum SF/C

"My shoulder is OK. And away we go." -- Nic Batum

by DonkeyShins on Oct 5, 2009 11:42 AM PDT up reply actions  

Funny thing is Nic is more of a guard than Travis or Martell

"I think he can still play" - Kevin Pritchard on Juwan Howard

by Norsktroll on Oct 5, 2009 11:47 AM PDT up reply actions  

Yeah

But he’s got those arms.

"My shoulder is OK. And away we go." -- Nic Batum

by DonkeyShins on Oct 5, 2009 3:15 PM PDT up reply actions  

Wikipedia's roster has Nico listed as a "F/G".......

Maybe they know something.

"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal

by timbo on Oct 5, 2009 3:55 PM PDT up reply actions  

With Udoka in their you can swap Rudy out.

Make Udoka the SF, Roy the PG, and Web. the SG.

Yeah, norsk, you are correct. But I agree with Donkey that he would make the best center out of the group.

*Unless KP has a secret plan that makes this statement incorrect.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
><> ><> ><> ><> ><> ><> ><> ><> ><> ><> ><> ><>

by staylost on Oct 5, 2009 12:16 PM PDT up reply actions  

It looks like the sentiment is to go with Collins...

We’ll see if that’s what happens. I kinda think it’s Ime’s to lose, but that things are so different now (obviously) than the last time he was here. In the end, I don’t think either one is the perfect 15th man… but that we can’t really go wrong with either one in the end.

I would say again that this is a nice problem to have. And barring major injuries, it’s unlikely that either one would get many minutes at all…so from that perspective, doesn’t Collins add a lot more as a practice player?

"whoever scores the most points is probably gonna win the game"

by kobestopper on Oct 5, 2009 12:32 PM PDT reply actions  

QUESTION - What's the case for keeping the roster spot open?

For the small percentage who voted to keep the roster spot open — what or who are you after with that strategy?

"whoever scores the most points is probably gonna win the game"

by kobestopper on Oct 5, 2009 12:33 PM PDT reply actions  

I voted keep it open

The 15th man won’t be suiting up on this stacked team unless there are 2-3 injuries. We’re better off leaving a spot so we can sign somebody if we need them to a 10 day contract. There will be plenty of big stiffs left if Oden or Pryz goes down.

This also gives us a chance should we need to, to do trades that involve us picking up extra pieces. (Not that we want to, but if the trade involves us taking a few pieces to get the one good one, we can). Finally, if Patty Mills heals and can’t find a Euro team we can always sign him and send him to the D-League.

by boppitywop on Oct 5, 2009 5:34 PM PDT up reply actions  

What he said

It’s not like Collins won’t be available if we didn’t sign him right now. Plus, some more interesting options might open up near/after the trade deadline in terms of guys that are released. For example, let’s say we figured out that another perimeter defender is needed. Bruce “Karate Kid” Bowen would likely be available to sign for the playoffs.

Most importantly, not carrying the salary for the 15th spot means extra room under the cap for a lopsided trade. I declare that you will see some unprecedented bargains available around the trade deadline this season due to the economy. Although lot of teams are “we’re doing fine financially” song and dance right now, it’s going to change in the hurry when people don’t show up to games. (I’m looking at you, Memphis, Charlotte, Sac, etc…)

by xedubx on Oct 5, 2009 9:01 PM PDT up reply actions  

Above two

"The match in Los Angeles is a good opportunity to begin to demonstrate that we want to make war." Rudy Fernández (translated)

by G_dubs on Oct 5, 2009 9:29 PM PDT up reply actions  

maybe then..

we could afford to televise pre-season games.. next year.

Portland Sports Performance provides elite mental and emotional training for athletes of all ages and in all sports.

www.portlandsportsperformance.com

by blazersunited on Oct 6, 2009 1:56 PM PDT up reply actions  

Can you believe Udoka was the starter 2 years ago?

The Blazers seriously upgraded their talent level.

"I'm at the thingamajig talking the yakety-yak" - Kenny Smith

by blzrfan on Oct 5, 2009 3:23 PM PDT reply actions  

Personally I'd rather have Udoka

But logically, it doesn’t make as much sense. One injury to either Przybilla or Oden and the remaining center takes on a big load – especially if the remaining center is Oden. Even with a reduction in fouls, it would be tough to get him 36 minutes a night without a viable backup. Howard could play center in spots, but we need an insurance policy for the twin towers.

"Ain't nothin' in this world for free."

by Arby on Oct 5, 2009 3:33 PM PDT reply actions  

Collins it will be

Sorry Ime, but we’re already more than set at SF. We need Collins, and Collins is a smart dude who went to Stanford with his brother. And he don’t talk like he’s from the hood. He is “articulate.”

The counsels of impatience and hatred can always be supported by the crudest and cheapest symbols. For the counsels of moderation, the reasons are often intricate, rather than emotional, and difficult to explain. And so the chauvinists of all times and places go their appointed way: plucking the easy fruits, reaping the little triumphs of the day at the expense of someone else tomorrow, deluging in noise and filth anyone who gets in their way, dancing their reckless dance on the prospects for human progress, drawing the shadow of a great doubt over the validity of democratic institutions. And until peoples learn to spot the fanning of mass emotions and the sowing of bitterness, suspicion, and intolerance as crimes in themselves - as perhaps the greatest disservice that can be done to the cause of popular government - this sort of thing will continue to occur.

by Love on Oct 5, 2009 4:22 PM PDT reply actions  

If we trade Outlaw

I’d think we’d be getting someone back that would need playing time. Not sure that’s what we need right now. But I like your thinking… Signing Ime and trading TLaw for our 3rd string C/PF and a pick would be better than signing Collins.

by In Walks Rudy on Oct 5, 2009 8:28 PM PDT up reply actions  

No matter how Anti-Travis you are...

Don’t you think we can get more for him than a 3rd C/F?!?.. That would be kind of like trading him for Collins and we can already have him for next to nothing… That just doesn’t follow to me. Even if you don’t like Travis you’d have to hope to get more than that for him.

by Ilikeemall on Oct 6, 2009 4:06 PM PDT up reply actions  

while I am anti-Travis... thats not what I said

It would be:

Travis for a 3rd String PF/C, and a pick. first round

I wouldn’t take Collins for next to nothing… or even nothing…. If we sign Jarron, he will be the worst player to ever play wear a Blazer jersey… its pointless.

I don't hate the Lakers, I hate their stupid fans.

by In Walks Rudy on Oct 12, 2009 5:48 PM PDT up reply actions  

Anti-Travis = Anti-Blazers

I’m cool with people thinking he no longer fits on the team, or that they like everyone else so he’s the only guy they are willing to trade. Heck, I’m even cool with people hating his defense and game and wanting him traded because they’re sick and tired of him getting minutes that should be going to someone else.

I question the fandom of anyone who is anti-anyone on the team.

by tominhawaii on Oct 13, 2009 3:58 AM PDT up reply actions  

do you question Norsk?

i’m pretty sure he is anit-Howard

I don't hate the Lakers, I hate their stupid fans.

by In Walks Rudy on Oct 13, 2009 5:41 PM PDT up reply actions  

Remember Ha Seung-Jinn?

Collins isn’t a bad 3rd/4th string center. He has his uses.

Any franchise that had Ha on their team can’t call a lifelong role player the worst player to ever play as a Blazer.

Mortimer

by Mortimer on Oct 13, 2009 4:03 AM PDT up reply actions  

Collin's lifelong role has been

“worst player to ever be on said team”. He is horrible! And he’s gotten worse every year. At the rate he’s going this year he’ll be half a ha!

I don't hate the Lakers, I hate their stupid fans.

by In Walks Rudy on Oct 13, 2009 6:22 PM PDT up reply actions  

With Batum's bum shoulder and Martell's bum foot

we might actually need Ime. If Ime makes the team I take it as a sign that a trade is in the works. Anyway, Cunningham’s too raw. The argument for a third center to chew up some fouls and minutes sounds pretty good. I’ll play homer and go with Ime.

by oregonslee on Oct 5, 2009 6:47 PM PDT reply actions  

Tough call

I would like to see Ime get another run here, but Collins makes more sense from a roster/needs perspective. If Ime stays, I’m with the other posters here – a trade is likely in the works. Of course, Nate could just have a good feel for Ime, and if Mihm/Hill types are available, you can call one of them in the event of an injury to a big man.

"My shoulder is OK. And away we go." -- Nic Batum

by blazeraddict on Oct 5, 2009 7:58 PM PDT reply actions  

Collins is terrible

He rebounds like a guard, plays defense like Channing Frye, and has the offensive game of Joel Pyrzbilla.

I’d rather we play Udoka at Center than Collins.

by ilserpente on Oct 6, 2009 2:22 PM PDT reply actions  

What I want

Trade Steve and Travis for Nick Collison – backup PF and C sorted
Sign Ime as a third string SF – becuase he can be trusted to play (defense and shoot open 3s) if Nic/Martell go down
Sign Patty Mills as 15th man – need a third string pg with Blake gone and Mills is going to be better than people think

In this scenario the minutes crunch at SF is reduced – Nic and Martell would divide the full 48 as their play dictated with no need to worry about Travis. There is progression at PG – committing to Miller and giving him the ability to play 35 minutes like he is used to plus giving Bayless significant enough minutes to determine whether he is worth investing more time in. Lastly, it prevents us from losing an asset in Patty Mills – who I believe would be unhappy in Europe and is more than capable of being a third string NBA PG. Not sure on what will happen with his rights if he goes unsigned but have read that he has the right to become a free agent according to AK1984.

Won’t happen because the organisation is in love with Blake and, to a lesser extent, Outlaw and would rather see them expire and leave than trade them for something useful.

by MadBlaze on Oct 6, 2009 5:56 PM PDT reply actions  

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