Who would Andre Miller Start?
Why ask Andre Miller who he would start? Miller is a veteran. He admittedly has as high a basketball IQ as any player on the team. He is a point guard who led a weak Philadelphia squad into the playoffs. And he led that team to a 2-and-0 record over the Blazers last season.
Andre Miller was asked if he expects to start. He said he has always started. I presume if asked whether he would start himself, he would say "Yes."
Miller would start by filling out the starting roster with our big pieces. At shooting guard, I have little doubt. He'd chose Roy. You start All-Star, Second Team NBA players. And do we have a viable option to starting LaMarcus Aldridge at power forward? (For those BEdgers who think KP's done, tell me what you do if LMA has to sit out a month.)
Miller has had a look at our small forwards. While Martell has more experience , Batum gave the Blazers equal stats last year in blocks, rebs, steals, and assists in half the minutes that Martell played in 07-08 when last he was healthy. Martell might get the nod from deep, but Nic shoots very well, too, has a game growing by leaps and bounds, and plays lock down D.
Some say that we need to stretch the court. "With Miller in there, you have got to surround him with shooters because he has trouble shooting from the outside and the opponent will clog the middle and double Roy."
I disagree. Miller is a creator on offense. Miller isn't paid because he's a lock-down defender. He's paid because he makes everyone around him a better scorer. In the starting line-up so far, you have Roy and LMA, both excellent scorers.
It's a guess, but I'm guessing Miller wants to start the overall better player here, and Miller thinks that's Batum.
"But if I start Nic, I gotta have another scorer."
And that answer is obvious. At center, Miller starts Oden. People want to blame our bigs for failing to get on the low blocks and hammer the middle. The same people probably blamed Z-Bo for being a black hole. (OK, everybody blamed Z-Bo for being a black hole.)
If I am Miller, I know I play better with Oden -- Pryzbilla can score but he will not be dominant. I know I make Oden better. I make everyone on the court a viable threat in the offense. And that is how I stretch the defense, by making every player a legitimate scorer. "If my offense is different, sorry. Will we have trouble scoring? If I thought that, I wouldn't have been pushing to come here."
Miller's Starters?
PG - Andre Miller
SG - B.Roy
SF - Batum
PF - LMA
C - Greg Oden
Why should we listen to Andre Miller? The starting lineup of Blake-Roy-Batum-LMA-Pryzbilla was one of the more efficient offense teams in the league last year. They played credible defense. And with Joel in the middle, they were a fine rebounding team. But they were the same starting five that put us in a hole coming out of the gates time and again last season. The same starting five that Nate stuck with until too late in the first round against Houston -- the team that had shooters. The Blazers had home court and were ousted in 6 -- because the first team couldn't create shot opportunities for those shooters.
Maybe we shouldn't listen to Andre Miller. The Blazers won 54 games last year without him.
But we got Miller for a reason. Because of his basketball IQ. Because he makes those around him better. I say, let him earn his money. Start these guys and see if he's right.
'77
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19 comments
Comments
The question isn't "Why should we listen to Andre Miller?"
It’s “why should we listen to LaoTzu pretending to know what Andre Miller prefers?”
And I have to admit, I’m at a loss.
by Marvin100 on Oct 3, 2009 6:22 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
What would David Stern think about LaoTzu projecting Andre Miller's personal opinions?
David Stern has been around the league a long time. David Stern has white hair, which creates the visual image of a wise, sage person. David Stern has been to a lot of basketball games in his life and even though he is an attorney by trade, David Stern has a pretty good feel for the game. David Stern probably has a taste for statistical analysis and he would think that LaoTzu has come up short in that department. If LaoTzu had projected the perceived opinions of Hollinger or even Ben Golliver, David Stern probably would have been okay with that.
But LaoTzu didn’t go there. David Stern would think this a mistake. Nope nope nope, David Stern would give the big thumbs down to LaoTzu pretending to know the first thing about what Andre Miller thinks about players that he has been around for all of two weeks.
In fact, David Stern probably likes very fine scotch whiskey. If he had a few, he probably would get a bit surly and heckle LaoTzu for his very inadequate effort of pretending to know the perceived preferences of Andre Miller. He would say, “Lao Tzu, tell us what Andre Miller would order at Burger King! You probably have more of a clue of guessing that than guessing who Andre Miller prefers to play with after two weeks on the team!!!”
Admittedly, this is not a catchy thing to scream when one is drunk, but remember, David Stern is an attorney by trade and you know how attorneys are. That is exactly what David Stern would well.
I am sure of it.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
by timbo on Oct 3, 2009 6:47 PM PDT up reply actions 7 recs
And here is a YELL for the WELL and I want an editable board and David Stern would complain about that, too, because I know everything he thinks.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
by timbo on Oct 3, 2009 6:49 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
from the pictures of miller at practice it is obvious that he is saying to himself,
“I better make better passes to travis and martell and jerryd so they get better looks, better shots . i can make the team better by making the players around me better so hopefully we can trade them for someone alot better, hopefully making the team better still.”
by riccc_l on Oct 3, 2009 7:03 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
andres D
he might be saying to himself " its not important whether i am better at guarding steve or whether stevo is better at guarding me, i would probably be better at guarding myself with my high bball iq and knowledge of how i would play the game."
by riccc_l on Oct 3, 2009 7:14 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
To the point:
Miller’s Starters?
PG – Andre Miller
SG – B.Roy
SF – Batum
PF – LMA
C – Greg Oden
This is probably an accurate description of the Blazers’ lineup after about 2 weeks of the season…
Miller and Oden are going to be a pair; if the Blazers are committed to starting Oden, then Miller will also start.
Nic is going to start no matter what, as with Roy and LMA.
There is a pretty high probability that Miller and Oden will both come off the bench though…
Can you imagine how crazy-good it would be running:
Miller / Rudy / Marty / Travis / Oden against the various second teams of the league? They would ANNIHILATE people and teams would be forced to either burn up all the fuel in the tanks of their starters trying to stay in the game or would find themselves 15 points down at the half… So you get killed in the first half or you can’t keep up in the second.
The FINISHING lineup is really the question, to my way of thinking. That will no doubt vary based on who has the hot hand, matchups, etc., but I don’t think this is too far-fetched for a typical finishing five…
Miller / Roy / Rudy / LMA / Oden
We need to be tracking who are the finishers more than the starters, I think.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
by timbo on Oct 4, 2009 4:29 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Perhaps
The FINISHING lineup is really the question, to my way of thinking.
Or perhaps, if Nate really uses our depth well, the finishing lineup isn’t going to be that important because we will have put the hurt on most teams long before the closing minutes.
But I agree on your likely finishing lineup. Roy and Rudy are both cold-blooded killers, and Andre is going to get guys the ball in the right place.
As author of Da BOM (Blazer Optimist Manifesto), I hereby certify that we will win 62 games in the regular season. Disagree at your peril.
by jscot on Oct 5, 2009 7:32 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Andre is not sure what Andre has been thinking...
but if Andre wants to surround Andre with shooters than Andre had better be picking Martell Webster to start.
"No disrespect to Jeff Blake"
by Eat Politicians on Oct 4, 2009 6:48 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
And can anyone remind me, who the shooter were that surrounded Miller last year?
For some reason I can’t think of a single shooter on that Philly team, hence the off-season trade for Kapono
by NWfan on Oct 4, 2009 1:34 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not to interupt the flow of good humor, but I agree that sticking with last season's starting five doesn't make much sense to me.
With a line-up of: Blake, Roy, Batum, LMA, Pryz. We essentially have two and one half scorers. Roy and LMA each count as one, Blake, who isn’t great at creating his own shot but is very good from outside, counts as a half.
As we learned in the series against Houston, a good defensive team can make life very difficult on a team that has two players who are not a real offensive threat. On nights when Blake, Rudy, and Travis were hitting their shots, this worked fine; but when they weren’t, we often got in a deep hole.
Seems to me that part of the idea of bringing in Miller is to make the team less reliant on jump shooting as it primary means of scoring. Obviously the team has a ton of shooters and that will always be important, but you want to have other ways to score on the nights the shots aren’t falling. Last year that meant Roy trying to take over using isos and setting up teammates off of isos.
This year, both Roy and Miller are capable of scoring on their own and capable of finding teammates. Miller is a tremendous low post scorer. Most PGs in the league, especially the little water-bugs that are currently in vogue, simply can’t stop him down low. Teams will be forced to bring help, and Miller is very good at finding the open man. Miller is much better at the pick-and-roll than Blake, and he is one of the best lob passers in the league.
I understand how important Blake’s shooting was to the team’s success last year, but over time, I just can’t see not having Oden and Miller in the starting lineup. with Oden and Miller in the starting line-up we go from two and one half offensive threats to at least having four threats on the floor. Whether of not we decide to go with Webster or Batum as the fifth starter remains to be seen.
Regarding the second unit, my hope is to see Rudy having some real success as a playmaker for this unit. If he does that opens up the possibility of Bayless getting significant time at PG, sharing the playmaking with Rudy but defending the opposing PG. Imagine Bayless, Rudy, Martell, Trout, and Pryz in the second unit. If Bayless has figured out his shot, he is going to be a huge load to defend. Bayless would have three excellent three point shooters that he could set up with his penetration. Pryz can clean the glass and patrol the middle.
We need some sort of long range plan at the point. Miller is short term. Blake is solid but limited both as a creator and a defender. Moving Andre into the starting line-up, and having Rudy take over some of the playmaking duties for the second team clears a path to develop Bayless and see if he can be the long term answer at the point. If it works, we can trade Blake and maybe Travis to get a stud back-up 4-5. That would be insurance in case Pryz decides to opt out next summer, give us full value for Blake and Travis’s expiring contracts, and clear room to develop Cunningham as a 3-4.
It makes a lot of sense to me, what do the rest of you think?
by upper left corner on Oct 4, 2009 9:39 AM PDT reply actions 1 recs
Thank you for the reasoned response
Everyone here, me included, is enchanted by statistics and empirical reasoning. But logical reasoning, using inference, can also be a powerful predictor. We don’t have numbers on our most efficient line-ups that include Miller yet. So we can’t run them. Miller did get a bunch of slashers and post up players into the playoffs last season, beating us 2-0 in the process. Thank you very much, ULC, for bringing Miller’s lob passing and post-up game to the foreground. I’d like to see what Miller could do starting for us.
I will say I’m not sold on Bayless yet. Love the kid’s intensity, but he has yet to translate that to efficiency on the court. If you’re right and he’s developing an NBA jumper, that brings him closer to being an effective back-up with “potential to start.” That would bring us a step closer to living the dream of having a fast, off-the-ball point guard to work alongside a primary creator like Roy or Rudy at the “SG” spot. That was the story Nate, KP, and even Roy gave us when the Blazers drafted Bayless.
What bothers me most about summer league, besides his shot, was that Bayless couldn’t stay with fast point guards many of whom were not going to make NBA rosters. I don’t know if it’s poor lateral quickness, footwork problems, savvy, or having way too much adrenaline. It’s like he should play on depressants — just play within his game for awhile rather than always pressing the edge.
What interested me as much is whether Nate will show flexibility at SF and start Batum or Martell depending on that night’s match-up. And of course whether one of them simply moves it to the next level and steals the show.
by LaoTzu on Oct 4, 2009 2:08 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
BATUM !!!!
I think you are underestimating Nic’s new found offensive game.
by silverfly7 on Oct 4, 2009 9:24 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's possible
I’m not discounting that possibility and I’m already enamored with his defense, so even a small increase in his offensive game would make him very likable…
But at this moment, I pick marty…
"No disrespect to Jeff Blake"
by Eat Politicians on Oct 4, 2009 10:22 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Counterpoints
1. It would be a big surprise if Nic isn’t more of an offensive threat this year.
2. Blake looks like he’s worked all summer on being more than a spot-up threat.
3. I’m not sure Greg and Andre are a package. I consider it about 90% probably that Greg is starting within a month of the season starting, and about 80% probable he starts opening night. That automatically adds an offensive threat to the starting lineup which lessens the case for starting Andre.
4. If you want either Andre or Brandon on the floor at all times (I do), you probably don’t want to start them together.
I expect Greg and Andre to play together quite a bit, and I expect both to be in the closing lineup in close games. I expect Blake to do enough to be able to hold onto his starting spot, though Andre will play more minutes.
I expect Jerryd to see very limited minutes early in the year. If Rudy is playmaking on the second unit, the way Roy does on the first, it perhaps frees Andre to start next to Brandon. In that case, I expect Blake to be the off-the-ball threat, not Bayless. But you are right that if Bayless is going to take minutes from anyone this year, it is probably Blake. And I won’t be all that surprised if it does happen at some point this year. Though I couldn’t watch it, it seems like he played nicely yesterday.
As author of Da BOM (Blazer Optimist Manifesto), I hereby certify that we will win 62 games in the regular season. Disagree at your peril.
by jscot on Oct 5, 2009 7:42 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
this is a good point
“4. If you want either Andre or Brandon on the floor at all times (I do), you probably don’t want to start them together.”
Yes, yes i do…hadn’t really thought of it that way, but now I will…
Yes, unless it’s a total blow out I want Andre or Brandon on the floor…
"No disrespect to Jeff Blake"
by Eat Politicians on Oct 6, 2009 1:53 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

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