Game Report: Blazers vs. Clippers
[Bumped to Front Page]
Since the game wasn't televised, here's another fantastic account of Blazers/Clippers down in LA from BE legend Mortimer.
-- Ben (benjamin.golliver@gmail.com)
My amateur game report from the Battle of Sopping Up Pre-Season Minutes '09, PDX vs LAX's JV squadron of basketeers.
Now, I'm not a fanpostin' type of guy, and I'm not really allowed to make fanposts. Not after what happened last time, I wrote as I looked off mournfully to the distance...
But, I'll make an exception. Here, reposted from the Junk Drawer AND Ben's post-game report, is my big dumb long game report.
I left home early, and traffic wasn’t too bad at all. Got there in less than half an hour, before they opened the doors to the Staples Center even. They let us in just over an hour before tip-off, which I didn’t suspect… I planned on getting there like 2 hours early and seeing who is getting some pre-game work in.
My seats were very nice— to the right of the halfcourt line, 7 rows up from courtside. I find my seat and watch the Blazers side get some work in with the assistant coaches and each other. Joel was working on post moves, Collins was as well (he is only 6’10", but has really long arms and a thick body). Bayno and Bayless were doing a few different things towards the end of the pre-warming up warm up, with Bayno being pretty physical with Bayless. LMA was working on post moves, soft floaters, that sort of thing. Roy was working with a coach, taking the ball from past the 3 point line to the circle and taking a jumper. He was missing more than I expected even in warmups (foreshadowing the night’s events).
Oh, and Bayless was working on a post game with Bayno, which I liked to see. He has such a big body for a PG; he sometimes has an optical illusion from seeing him on TV that makes him look like a normal sized PG, but he’s nice and big. Bayless and Andre talked for a bit on some of the courtside seats before Bayless started this workout with Bayno, and before Andre did his own warm up thing… lotsa stretching, running backwards from sideline to sideline, doing twists, he didn’t shoot or practice game moves.
I did not see Oden, Blake, or Dante at this pre-warm up warm up session. Maybe they already had a workout, were still getting taped/treated, I dunno. Just noting it is all.
The Blazers were out there much longer than the Clippers players were, and seemed to have more of a goal with what they were doing… practicing moves, drills, etc. The Clippers seemed more like they were goofing off.
The regular warm up/shoot around thing came later, and that’s pretty standard. Oden worked on post moves, doing them slow and methodically to get the footwork and moves down. One time while rebounding a hook that missed, two other made jumpers (didn’t see who shot them) bonked him on the head twice in a row— bop bop. It was funny. Him and Martell smiled. Gosh, guys, they all like each other!
(Martell didn’t play I don’t think, but he was bouncing around everywhere during both warm up sessions. Being a body for Collins or Joel to post up, taking jumpers, guarding perimeter players, all over. He is a bundle of energy).
Ok, onto the game…
The debut of RAMBO. It didn’t work tonight. However, I definitely think it will work. Look… I like Steve Blake. He is great in his Blakeness. But it is so mind blowingly obviously that Andre Miller is a much, much, much better player. Miller didn’t have a great game (while Blake played awful), but his passing, how damn CRAFTY he is, his penetration… we haven’t had a GOOD point guard like him in ever. In EVER.
No one was on their game tonight really, and I don’t think it’s because that lineup won’t gel. It’s because everyone was off. Roy was especially off… sloppy turnovers, bad shots, interspersed with normal Roy dishes and smart plays. Overall, it looked like he was trying to get into the game and do well (not really coasting), but he didn’t have his rhythm that he always says he needs to get.
The last player I worry about is Brandon Roy, and neither should you. I also think he and Andre will work well together. They need to play together to establish that chemistry though, as they are both that sort of player… and really, that’s a good way to describe Miller on offense. He is Roy-esque. Terrific ballhandler, he never feels hurried with the ball (some younger PGs start pressing when they get doubled or don’t have the handles to get out of it), and he had a few really nice drives… I think most don’t see what he is doing out there, how smart it is.
Andre Miller is a much, much better point guard than Steve Blake. It is as simple as that. He should be playing most of the minutes, and I believe he should start. Hands down.
Blake REALLY pressed tonight… it may just be me, but it felt like Blake was trying to show he can do the things Miller does— split double teams, behind the back dribble and penetrate and dish— but it doesn’t work when Blake tries it. That isn’t Blake’s game and it never will be and it SHOULDN’T be his game. We love Steve Blake’s game, and I want him to stick with it: no risk passes, no turnovers, hitting the open shot. Don’t push things. He didn’t look good.
LMA had a few points in a row in the 3rd, as we made our mini-comeback, but he’s still in coast mode. When he was trying he looks just as good as post-allstar break LMA, which is what we all want to see. Had his nice trademark running hook that goes in 90+% of the time, hit some jumpers, normal LMA. Not aggressive enough though, which was what made him special post allstar break. Very few rebounds. I attribute this almost 100% to it being pre-season, not wanting to get hurt, and wanting a deal without getting hurt. He is definitely not going all out right now.
Normally I don’t blame him for that, but right now, we’re getting used to a brand spanking new GOOD point guard, and a still-raw big man who will have a bigger role than previously. We still got several games left, but I’d like to see LMA and Roy going full speed along with Dre and Oden so they can establish that chemistry we all want to see.
Batum picked up two quick fouls, played his normal good defense, had a nice Batum-esque dunk, and otherwise didn’t do nuthin’. That has been his pre-season thus far, since we got other people we wanna see and he played all summer. We haven’t seen his offensive game that he sometimes showed during the Eurobasket, but I also get the sense that we don’t worry about what Batum will bring. The offense is just gravy. He will be a better version of what he was last year.
The Clippers feature the best frontline we’ve faced yet, which we all looked forward to as a good Oden-ometer to see where he is at. Kaman brought it physical to Oden right away, and Camby is always there to add meaningless defensive stats.
Now the best thing about New Oden, is his defense. No dumb fouls! Moving his feet! Guys, he had 1 foul all night, and Kaman was trying to take it to him. It was good news. He couldn’t score anything inside on Oden and all of his points came from jumpers. He’d try to make a move, get position, and pass out. One time he decided to take it HARD right at Oden, starting at about 13 feet away. Kaman drives, goes up with his left, and Oden stays in front of him the whole way and blocks the crap out of his shot. It was impressive.
After that block, Oden kept trying to block more shots, and altered a bunch but I don’t think he got anymore. Oden was physical without being overly so, was in good position, and if I have anything to critique it’s that he is playing it too safe. He has foul worries so seared into his brain now, that he is now likely playing it too conservative. BUT, he isn’t playing it soft or giving up points without trying, he is playing good defense. GREAT news.
I just think he’ll be able to block more shots once he isn’t worried about foul problems. I kept waiting for Oden-esque fouls to happen from Baron’s penetration, or Kaman bumping him, but he seemed much more comfortable and experienced out there. Viva la Bayno.
Oden’s offense was off tonight. He was trying his moves, getting good position, but was missing pretty bad, or forcing it when doubled. Here’s the thing we HAVE to remember: Oden is still very raw. He has much refinement left in him. This might sound bad, but it’s great news. He’s still going to get a lot better offensively. He will have his gangly and awkward moments still, and tonight was that sort of night. I do not think it was anything Kaman was doing, it was Oden being raw.
Like Ben said the other night, it’s like a baby elephant learning to walk. His moves are good, his position wonderful, and I think he has a great touch around the basket. Nights like this will happen while he is developing (and we can’t forget that he is still developing as a 21 year old raw big man), where he makes the wrong reads on the move, forces a shot, etc.
It is a lot different from last year. You don’t notice any huffing and puffing, no heavy breathing, he didn’t seem like he was having an asthma attack like last year. He wasn’t having a great game on offense, yet was still pretty effective. He got two quick fouls called on Kaman right away (within the first few minutes), continuing that pre-season trend. I believe it will last all season long. He’s too big, his still-burgeoning moves make you have to foul him.
I believe he only scored on dunks tonight, so no finesse like in the Kings games. There will be nights like this along the way. One rebound dunk was pretty awesome and everyone went OOOOOH. LMA (I believe) missed a baseline jumper, and Oden was on the other side of the basket, catches it in mid-air and hammers it home.
Oden did a really nice spin move on Kaman and scored, but he got called for the travel. I don’t think he traveled, but those quick spin moves can go either way. I’d need to see the replay to know for sure. It was a very quick and impressive move though.
I got my ticket from Ticketmaster’s ticket exchange on the Clipper’s website, and the season ticket holder who put the ticket up for sale sat next to me and we talked a lot during the game. He was an older fellow, big NBA fan, hates the Lakers with a passion (they are arrogant jerks, and their fans are stupid, he brilliantly states). He got really into our team and loved what he saw, especially from Oden and Miller. He remembers Oden from last year; how big he was and how he moved, and whistled appreciatively over and over.
Especially from his rebounding… I believe Oden will lead the league in offensive rebounding this year, unless his lack of foul problems these first 3 games is a fluke. His hands are just so STICKY. He gets them on almost every miss, either grabbing it himself or tipping it out for someone else to get. He has really good hands for being so raw, and his big fingers can almost grab the ball themselves. I don’t know how else to describe it besides saying they’re like Spiderman fingers. My new olde tymey friend was impressed.
Overall, he was quite jealous of our Ricky Davis-less team.
Speaking of Davis’s, Baron looks lots better this year. I believe he has the talent and ability to be a top 3 PG any year, and sometimes even the best one overall. But, he’s lazy, he gets fat, he coasts, and he loves to shoot 3’s even though he has never ever been a good 3 point shooter. I worried that now that he has his last deal (his last big contract, anyways) he was going to coast the rest of the way. Last year that was certainly true. From now on, he’s just playing for pride, and I’m happy to say he looked more like Baron Davis of old. He has lost weight (last year he always played like he just ate a big plate of meaty cheesy lasagna before heading out on the court), was much lighter on his feet, and was dishin’ and drivin’. That made me happy for Clipper fans.
Clipper fans are a special bunch, and I admire them greatly. I know we all hate the Lakers, but be honest with yourself… let’s say you were born and raised in LA. It would be TOTALLY FINE to be a Laker fan, if you are from LA. I am sure most of us would be Laker fans, were we born in LA. It is but for a twist of fate that we were born in Oregon and "chose" to be Blazer fans.
So to be Clipper fans, most born and raised in LA, with the hugely successful Lakers franchise staring down at you from all angles, and it being totally fine to be a Laker fan… to still choose the Clippers means they are special people. God’s people. I doubt I would be that strong. Us Blazer fans are a crazy bunch, but Clipper fans are perhaps the most admirable fans around. I do not mean that condescendingly at all, and I wish I knew a better word than "admirable" to describe it.
Back to the game…
Ime Udoka has been getting a lot more minutes than Collins, but I still heavily vote for Collins to get the last roster spot. Ime is still Ime— incredibly awkward when dribbling the ball, bad decision maker, good defender, can hit the corner 3. We would never play him.
Collins is Collins— a role playing big man who is a good physical defender. He would not be in the NBA if he wasn’t as big as he is, but since he IS as big as he is it is a pointless critique. He will not score, won’t get rebounds out of his area, but he has size and thickness and experience and smarts and 6 fouls. He has much more use to us in games (if Joel or Oden go down) and at least in practice.
Even in practice, Ime would be superfluous.
I suspect Ime will get the roster spot because it is a heartwarming story and he is a great guy, and I can’t argue against those points. I just think it would be the wrong move, considering how many good perimeter guys we have and the tendency for big men to get hurt. He’s certainly getting a grip more minutes than Collins, so either we’re favoring him for the last spot OR letting him show other teams what he can do because we’re favoring Collins. I really don’t know, and both make sense to me.
Ime was great for the 06-07 team. We have grown far past him, though.
Juwan Howard continues to relatively impress me, especially with all the negative brouhaha that surrounded his signing. He is solid, plays tougher than I expected, and looks to be in great shape. He makes smart passes, talks with the guys a lot, and ya don’t worry when he’s out there like we would with Frye. I never expected him to be better for us than Frye was, but I think he is.
Dante is a rookie. Hesitant passes, shots, he’s feeling his way. He is bigger than I expected, and won’t be all that undersized for a role playing PF.
Clipper fans were most excited for Blake Griffin, of course, and he gave them a few reasons to cheer. He, too, showed his rookieness though, and only scored on transition dunks. If the Clippers get out and run more, he’ll score a lot this way— he is good at running up and down the court and finishing. He took a few clanky jumpers (one time it was just him and ol’ man Juwan, and instead of taking it at him he took a long jumper… he will learn to recognize that mismatch in time), had a bad turnover on a almost-fastbreak trying to be too fancy, and is Outlaw’s height but much thicker.
If the Clippers play the normal Dunleavy way of lots of called plays and isos, I don’t think it will get the most out of Griffin. If Dunleavy lets Baron improvise and push the tempo, Griffin will get quite a few buckets that way and lots of nice gorilla dunks.
Otherwise, to make up for his lack of height and wingspan, Blake needs to add a lot more skill to his game. He’s strong, physical on offense, and runs the floor very well, so he’ll have lots of good moments and get Clipper fans excited. I don’t think he’s a franchise changer, though.
Outlaw had a normal Outlaw game. You should not ever let him dribble the ball in the open court… neither him or Ime are ever allowed to do that and I hate when someone lets them. It is a no no. Nothing good ever comes of it. Neither of them handle limitless options well. They need defined roles and set plays.
Trout had a nice drive and dunk, though. Very nice to see. He also ripped a rebound away from Oden, clearly recognizing that he is being judged for defensive rebounding.
Joel was Joel. Great defense, some nice blocks, lots of rebounds.
Bayless went into Bayless mode towards the end of the game, racking up fouls on his defender. He still overthinks when to attack and when to pass, and needs more development. He defended Telfair well (they were mostly matched up on each other, and Bayless dwarfs tiny framed Telfair), staying in front of the lil’ water bug easily, but had one dumb classic over aggressive foul that he did a lot last year. He’ll learn.
His free throw shooting was awful and he went 1 for 2 every time. He also couldn’t hit a jumper, and his one basket was a nice dipsy doo finish inside. Typical Bayless, I tell ya.
He impressed my new Clipper friend, who was also jealous we had a big young athletic talent like him sitting at the end of the bench. I think most of us forget how lucky we are to be Blazer fans, and that there is no rush for Bayless to get on the floor. He will get over any frustration he experiences right now, and he has more development to go through anyways.
Rudy didn’t do much; ran around screens like normal, hit some 3’s, still isn’t a strong dribbler. Did a nice pick and roll with Joel that Joel tried to throw down hard but he got fouled. I still like Rudy in the pick and roll, but in the open court or without a screen set for him, he simply isn’t a good enough ballhandler. He also needs time with Miller for them to develop some chemistry, so we can see them complete the famous backdoor-cut-alley-oop Rudy is beloved the world over for.
That’s another thing in Miller’s favor— he is so good, so much better than Blake, that I just want everyone to play with him. To develop chemistry with him. He will make everyone better.
Telfair actually had a decent game, and checking the boxscore I see he had 10 assists. His highlight was a nice drive and no look to (I believe) DeAndre Jordan for the monster dunk. Good to see him finding a role.
He still can’t shoot or defend, but he’s quick and can pass.
Rasual Butler (I like pronouncing Rasual like you’d pronounce "Casual") tried to make it the Rasual Butler show, with fancy pants dribbling and forced shots. He made a few of them too, so it wasn’t as bad as it seemed like it was going to be. Not a bad pickup for the Clippers.
Craig Smith should be the hippo, not the rhino. He is a tub of a man.
I seriously question whether DeAndre Jordan works out enough… he’s got a great frame and body to work with, but he’s still so soft and out of shape looking. I know work ethic and commitment was always a question for him, but he could develop into a good center someday. He can dunk and rebound decent enough, can’t shoot FTs to save his life, and is an inexperienced defender. I still just don’t think he has committed to staying in shape and it will inhibit his progress.
KAREEM RUSH SIGHTING. Yup, Kareem Rush was there. Fun for all.
The Clippers should be better than last year simply by Baron being in better shape. If Kaman can stay healthy, it’ll be all the better. He’s played well when healthy, but there’s just always been something keeping him off the court. I can see them winning 40+ games if they stay healthy and motivated. I question their motivation for a lot of the guys on the roster, and still whether it all fits together. The West is gonna be tough again, and the Clippers won’t be an easy out, but I don’t think they’ll make the playoffs. They got talent, though.
I hope they sell high on Al Thornton. He is what he is. Doesn’t play defense, shoots lots of so-so jumpers. Sell high, Dunleavy!
We are clearly a much better team, even though we were pretty bad tonight. The Clippers want ed to win this game, and they got the talent to beat anyone on any given night— but we’re just a lot better from top to bottom. I’d hope if this was a real game, Roy wouldn’t be so uncharacteristically off, LMA wouldn’t be coasting, Miller and Oden would be playing full minutes, and we wouldn’t have Ime and Juwan and Bayless play so much.
There is absolutely nothing to worry about from this game, and the score and end result was meaningless. Unless you think Roy’s last 3 years were a fluke, there are a lot of positives to take away from it, mostly centering around Oden’s conditioning and defense.
It should be a very good year.
I may have forgotten some points (I meant to bring a notepad so this is all off the top of my head), and if anyone has any questions I’ll be happy to answer them. I had a good time, even though we seem to never ever play good in LA when we play the Clippers. Always an ugly win, or a game like this. Oh well.
Thanks for reading all, sorry it’s so long. There’s a lot to talk about these days!
Mortimer
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SIDE NOTE:
Oden’s movements are still quite gangly. Think Outlaw, in his first 3 seasons. Inefficient movements, awkward-yet-very-athletic… he has lots of refinement left in those lanky buff limbs.
So, to be as effective as he has been, while still being so raw, is a good thing.
But, expect gangly. Because Oden still is.
Morty
by Mortimer on Oct 10, 2009 1:59 AM PDT reply actions 5 recs
Nate "The Great" Thurmond was gangly--but great
GO will be great too. We jest need a little more patience. Enjoy the process…
"We don't back down to nobody." --Joel Przybilla
by hurryup09 on Oct 10, 2009 3:52 AM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
Agree strongly with your impressions of Oden's defense.
I thought his ability to move and avoid fouls while contesting shots was excellent. It was probably the single most encouraging thing that I have seen all preseason. Oden being able to play 30 minutes a game is huuuuuuge.
by PoliSam on Oct 10, 2009 9:08 AM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
The biggest concern for me is whether or not we can get Andre integrated into the main lineup…. hearing that you are confident is encouragin. It just seems to be very rough at this point, Roy’s having a hard time adjusting.
I like Oden. Didya hear what ClipperSteve said about him? He said that his offensive game is just turrible. I don’t think it’s that bad… he’s shown some nice moves.
I like our team.
"If the Lakers are Hollywood, then we are South Central." - Clipper fan.
by Cablinasian on Oct 10, 2009 2:03 AM PDT reply actions 6 recs
oh, and great fanpost, natch. Big recaroo.
"If the Lakers are Hollywood, then we are South Central." - Clipper fan.
by Cablinasian on Oct 10, 2009 2:04 AM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
Oden looked very awkward on his moves that looked smooth the first 2 games
All part of being raw.
The whole team was hesitant and off though. I don’t think Roy’s problems are because of Miller, I think Roy woulda’ been that bad next to Blake as well. Roy’s problems are Roy himself, meaning he doesn’t have a rhythm yet and was taking it easy the first two games and then was just totally off. To me, it’s nothing based upon their supposed lack of chemistry.
m—
by Mortimer on Oct 10, 2009 2:29 AM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
More important to me
2nd game on a road trip, 3rd game in 4 days, Oden never once looked tired or out of breath. That problem seems totally gone.
Awkward moves pale in comparison to how good that news is. I think it directly correlates to his better defense and lack of silly fouls.
—m
by Mortimer on Oct 10, 2009 2:36 AM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
in general, did the team seem sluggish,
that’s what I was wondering before the game started tonight.
I see the Clippers had 4 days off and it was there 2nd game. Certainly there must have been a little freshness verses tired legs in this game.
I keep thinking Telfair will actually turn into a point guard some day, he made some awesome passes early on in his career.
Romance me with that Roy rainbow shot which took flight from way beyond the arc and sailed so high that before it came back down to earth sealing the victory, it kissed the rafters and said "You're mine baby."
by Blazer1342 on Oct 10, 2009 5:34 AM PDT up reply actions 6 recs
Morty...
Is optimistic about Miller and Roy together because he’s an optimist and he’s smart… not because of anything he saw from the game. They were bad together… but he could be right that Roy was simply off. I will say, however, that Baron Davis was able to sag of off Miller and strip Roy on at least two occasions. Baron could have done the same thing if Blake were in the game, but maybe not.
The second unit with Blake as the PG was very ugly. Blake, Rudy, Outlaw, Aldridge, Pryzbilla is not a dynamic offensive unit. They really struggled. I think that’s a significant deal… at least in the regular season. If Miller starts, he should probably be the first to sit down, so that Blake plays with Roy for most of his minutes. Blake might be a “back-up” point guard in most people’s eyes, but he’s ill-suited to be the Blazers back-up point guard.
Only thing I’m sure of having seen fanfest and this game is that Miller and Oden are a superb pairing. They need to play together. Everything else is up in the air.
by PoliSam on Oct 10, 2009 9:16 AM PDT up reply actions 7 recs
Yeah, I'm optimistic about the pairing based on their respective talent levels.
Blake’s man would always leave Blake to double Roy before, like Baron did last night, which is how Blake got those wide open 3 pointers so often. Baron was being extra aggressive (for Baron) this game as well, and Roy was being extra sloppy.
I just didn’t see them stepping on each other’s toes, like we might worry about with two slasher/playmakers. Roy’s turnovers were from Roy looking off, to me, though it will take an adjustment for Roy to not have a dead-eye 3 point shooter like Blake waiting for a pass.
I agree about sitting Miller first, bringing Blake in with Roy, and bringing Miller back with the 2nd unit. I love Rudy’s passing and off the ball game, but his ballhandling still needs lots of work, and we’ve long known that Blake’s strength isn’t dynamic playmaking.
Also, even though I strongly favor starting the better PG (which, to me, is Miller), I do understand the advantages of separating our two best playmakers and I don’t think Nate would be wrong to continue starting Blake. I just think it is more to our advantage to pair up Roy/Miller/Oden/LMA in the beginning of the game, try to get the opposing bigs in foul trouble, establish the inside game (like we normally try to do with LMA), and then do our sub-Miller-out-at-6-minutes-bring-him-back-with-Rudy-et-al-idea’r.
Both Miller and Roy are unselfish playmakers who make others better, but Roy is out heart and soul and best player. We gotta do whatever gets the most out of him. I think they could be a very good pairing; our starters just gotta get used to a actual playmaking PG, and not a solid off-guard shooter like Blake has been.
Mortimer
by Mortimer on Oct 10, 2009 10:42 AM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
Also Roy was off with Blake in Game 1 per reports
So it may be just as you describe it – Roy needing to find his rhythm. The real concern is Blake with the 2nd unit. That not clicking takes away a major team strength. I am hoping for Bayless to develop quickly and press for 2nd point guard with Blake being used as a shooter in appropriate situations. I am not a Bayless needs to play now guy. I am just concerned that the White team be as effective as the talent dictates.
"Either way we have two phenomenal units. I'm excited to play with either one." - Martell Webster
by lee3022 on Oct 10, 2009 5:05 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Rudy needs to step his game up
if Miller starts and Blake plays with Rudy more, then Fernandez needs to take the bull by the horns (Spanish pun, no charge) and run the PnR with Przy, or something
(or, Nate can send Rudy and Martell curling off of screens and tell Steve to pass them the ball in rhythm for quick jumpers, as I’ve suggested in the past)
They’re going to have to try to make this work, because Miller and Oden need to stick together, and Greg isn’t going to come off the bench
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
by two4larue on Oct 10, 2009 10:49 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Roy will start slow...
And, especially if Dre starts, people will say they have bad chemistry, too many ballhandlers in the kitchen, etc. But that won’t be the issue.
If Brandon starts slow, and unfortunately I think he will… it will be because HE DID NOT TOUCH A BASKETBALL ALL SUMMER.
I was worried about that when I first read it, and though the preseason means nothing and shows us nothing, I am a teensy little bit more worried now that Roy is playing like a crappola sandwich so far.
A few people have said all that means is that Roy didn’t play 5 on 5 all summer, and it doesn’t mean he didn’t work individually on his game. I am hoping that’s right.
But if Roy struggles to get things going in his fourth season, the most logical explanation will have nothing to do with Miller. The most logical explanation will be that Brandon took it easy all summer, and did a lot of biking and swimming, instead of working on his game like the other elite players were doing.
This is all premature, very very premature, and obviously I hope there’s nothing to it and it becomes funny how wrong I was to even consider it after Roy proves he is still Roy once the regular season kicks off.
Q: Is Greg favoring his knee?
Frye: He favors dunking on your head, that's what he favors.
by KP Corleone on Oct 10, 2009 1:10 PM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
Besides his rookie year
I don’t remember Roy ever doing that well in pre-season. He always takes a few games to get his rhythm.
I’m not saying you might not be right, but I’ll be shocked of Roy has regressed in any way or continues his struggles into the regular season.
Even during the regular season, he usually doesn’t do much in the 1st quarter and the 1st half, and that’s all he’s been playing, so it’s hard to say what the deal is. We got several games left, and since it is Roy I think it’ll be ok.
Mortimer
by Mortimer on Oct 10, 2009 1:14 PM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
Wouldn't think twice about it, but...
Quick makes it sound like Roy himself is a little concerned and he “feels like a rookie again.”
That, combined with the “haven’t touched a basketball” comments, make me a little bit worried.
But probably Roy will have a PER of 40 by mid-November and I will never again question his offseason biking program.
Q: Is Greg favoring his knee?
Frye: He favors dunking on your head, that's what he favors.
by KP Corleone on Oct 10, 2009 1:39 PM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
Great players often doubt themselves
…right before they go out and score 50. It’s kind of a half-conscious game they play with themselves. All great performers are probably fueled to some degree by fear. Bill Russell says he used to throw up before nearly every game. A friend of mine who played with Van Morrison says he did the same thing.
If Roy says he’s concerned about his game and “feels like a rookie again,” I don’t think he’s lying. But I wouldn’t take it seriously. That’s probably just part of the gearing up process for him.
"We don't back down to nobody." --Joel Przybilla
by hurryup09 on Oct 10, 2009 2:04 PM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
If Roy starts slow...
it won’t be because he “didn’t touch a basketball all summer” he stayed in shape, and even improved his conditioning, and he’s touching a basketball all day every day all preseason. The problem will be with Miller, no matter how much you want to wish away the fact that he plays a style that Roy isn’t used to, and will have to adjust to.
It’s not a big deal, they will figure it out, quickly enough, but the new style of play will be the biggest hurdle Roy will have to deal with. I’m not worried about Roy. He can play, and will. Whether he scores 25 a night or 15 to start the season isn’t a big deal if we are winning. Andre and Oden are going to take over some of the scoring on the team without a doubt, so that may take away from Roy and Aldridge’s averages, or maybe from the guys at the SF position. Miller being a guy who takes the ball to the hole, and is very assertive in doing so, will take away some touches from Roy, which will reduce Roy’s role a bit if they are on the floor together. Roy usually needs the ball in his hands to do what he does. If Miller can make up for taking away some of Roy’s opportunities to create a shot for himself, by creating shots for Roy, it may even out, but then we are in fact asking Roy to change his game. If Roy isn’t happy with the way it’s going after this season, expect Miller to be traded this Summer. If they can co-exist, expect the Blazers to have a big advantage in number of free-throws this year, and win some games.
In other words, we know what Roy can do, when he is the center of the offense, no matter how he spent his Summer. We don’t know what he will do if he is no longer the center of the offense. A player like Andre Miller becomes the center of the offense when he is on the floor. That is what you sign up for with a guy like him. That is what the Blazers have signed up for. Miller brings a style of play with him, whereas Blake is a very good complimentary player, (or role-player). There is a huge difference. Roy does not strike me as a “complimentary player”, so we will see how it goes. The people so enamored of Miller right now may realize at some point that the results are just a different way of achieving the same result.
Seeing as there are so many areas the team as a whole can and should improve this year, such as defense, toughness, experience, post presence, inbounding the ball, free throw shooting, rebounding, etc, it may be hard to really quantify the Miller effect. In other words, the team was going to get better anyway, with Nic, Greg and Rudy all having an NBA season under their belts, and the whole team having a learning experience in the playoffs last year. If we start blowing teams out by 30pts regularly, and win 65 games, we can say Andre really put the pieces together for us, but if we continue to have similar, or only slightly more success, let’s say 54-60 wins, similar margin of victory to last year, and a first round exit, or even a second round exit, where we aren’t competitive with a quality team, you could easily make the case that the last year’s roster would have achieved a similar result, with just the year of experience and growth. By trying to acquire Turkoglu and then Miller, the Blazers were definitely ready to gamble by altering the style of play, figuring Roy could adapt, or benefit from having another scorer with him. It is a gamble that carries possible risk and reward. The first half of the season should let us know what we need to know about how it’s working.
Of course there is another option; play Andre with the second unit. I honestly haven’t seen Miller do a whole lot for Greg’s game. Most of the best assists to Greg have come from other players like Howard, Roy, and Rudy. I think Greg has got himself in shape, and has sharpened up his skills. He can play with Roy and Blake and do well with his improved game/skills. I see no reason why AM and GO must be paired. AM and JP might be effective if AM can hit Pryz so well as to make it easy for him to score. We have a lot of good players. That is the only thing we can say definitively this early.
by wingzeta on Oct 11, 2009 12:20 AM PDT up reply actions 2 recs
I thought it was determinted that "not touching a basketball" wasn't the same as "not touching a basketball"
I remember Roy saying he worked on his 3 point shot and something else this summer so he obviously touched a ball. Some said that when an NBA guy says the “didn’t touch a basketball” it just means no pick up games.
"The lineup that has cleverly been referred to as R-A-M-B-O (Roy, Aldridge, Miller, Batum, Oden) was more like Bambi." - Jason Quick regarding the lamest acronym in the history of the world
by tominhawaii on Oct 11, 2009 9:13 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Damn Morty...
And you even sacrificed your astonishing post to comment ratio…
Rec’d
by Rudiculous on Oct 10, 2009 2:06 AM PDT reply actions 5 recs
Dave, this guy is spamming the site
He’s putting the same thing in junk drawers, front page articles, and the sidebar.
FLAG.
I can tell you how to make an Excel spreadsheet that proves Portland wins 62 games this year.
by jscot on Oct 10, 2009 2:08 AM PDT reply actions 9 recs
damn great fanpost
encouraged by what you said about Oden (he will lead the league in O rebounding). what is crazy is that he still looks, as you and Ben have remarked, like a baby elephant out there. he still has a ton of untapped potential (IT’S NOT OVER, DURANT!!).
not worried about B Roy or LMA, or the end result of this game, for that matter.
It seems like once Miller and Roy get it figured out, look out NBA…
(SIDE NOTE: I trust Morty’s observations over anyone else’s so this sacrifice was well worth it)
"Early to bed, early to rise, makes a woman healthy, wealthy, and wise. That's why you all are wiser than me. It's cloudydays."
by cloudydays on Oct 10, 2009 2:08 AM PDT reply actions 5 recs
In case anybody was wondering...
3,874 words, and I read everyone….
Only the mortimer could pull this off….
by Rudiculous on Oct 10, 2009 2:25 AM PDT reply actions 5 recs
Hey cool, I was wondering
I promised Ben 3,001 words, so I should cut 873 of them.
Morty
by Mortimer on Oct 10, 2009 2:30 AM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
I take this as a challenge, by the way
My next fanpost will be 3,875 words, and no one will read any of them.
I can tell you how to make an Excel spreadsheet that proves Portland wins 62 games this year.
by jscot on Oct 10, 2009 3:18 AM PDT up reply actions 6 recs
I'll read the last word for you.
I get the paper, so I don't care!
by Name's Ash on Oct 10, 2009 7:58 AM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
I always read every one of them (Morty's as well and others)
"Either way we have two phenomenal units. I'm excited to play with either one." - Martell Webster
by lee3022 on Oct 10, 2009 5:08 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
You've read ALL of my fanposts?
I have so many, I don’t see how one could read ’em. I think I have the record for most fanposts by anyone ever.
Morty
by Mortimer on Oct 11, 2009 12:51 AM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
rec
I can tell you how to make an Excel spreadsheet that proves Portland wins 62 games this year.
I made a green one, I made a green one!
Morty’s green, Morty’s green!
I can tell you how to make an Excel spreadsheet that proves Portland wins 62 games this year.
rec!!
"The difference between a democracy and a dictatorship is that in a democracy you vote first and take orders later; in a dictatorship you don't have to waste your time voting"
"I don't like jail, they got the wrong kind of bars in there"
Charles Bukowski
by jpaulson on Oct 10, 2009 2:31 AM PDT reply actions 5 recs
Everyones comments in here have a rec..
except mortimers lol. and all i wrote was rec.
"The difference between a democracy and a dictatorship is that in a democracy you vote first and take orders later; in a dictatorship you don't have to waste your time voting"
"I don't like jail, they got the wrong kind of bars in there"
Charles Bukowski
by jpaulson on Oct 10, 2009 3:05 AM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
Explanation... Mort is rec-ing lol
"The difference between a democracy and a dictatorship is that in a democracy you vote first and take orders later; in a dictatorship you don't have to waste your time voting"
"I don't like jail, they got the wrong kind of bars in there"
Charles Bukowski
by jpaulson on Oct 10, 2009 3:06 AM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
Someone just doesn't like me is all
And they are underlining it by reccing everyone except me.
Signed,
Mortimer
by Mortimer on Oct 10, 2009 3:12 AM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
I bet it is jscot..
"The difference between a democracy and a dictatorship is that in a democracy you vote first and take orders later; in a dictatorship you don't have to waste your time voting"
"I don't like jail, they got the wrong kind of bars in there"
Charles Bukowski
by jpaulson on Oct 10, 2009 3:13 AM PDT up reply actions 6 recs
rec for supreme wrongness
I can tell you how to make an Excel spreadsheet that proves Portland wins 62 games this year.
by jscot on Oct 10, 2009 3:14 AM PDT up reply actions 6 recs
2 in one day?!?!
I’m speechless!
"The difference between a democracy and a dictatorship is that in a democracy you vote first and take orders later; in a dictatorship you don't have to waste your time voting"
"I don't like jail, they got the wrong kind of bars in there"
Charles Bukowski
by jpaulson on Oct 10, 2009 8:42 AM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
If that were the reason
everyone’s comments would be green.
BURN!
I can tell you how to make an Excel spreadsheet that proves Portland wins 62 games this year.
by jscot on Oct 10, 2009 3:14 AM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
lol
"The difference between a democracy and a dictatorship is that in a democracy you vote first and take orders later; in a dictatorship you don't have to waste your time voting"
"I don't like jail, they got the wrong kind of bars in there"
Charles Bukowski
by jpaulson on Oct 10, 2009 3:14 AM PDT up reply actions 6 recs
My first green comment
First of all, I would like to thank God for giving me the ability to say something so profound and meaningful while only using 3 letters.. lol
"The difference between a democracy and a dictatorship is that in a democracy you vote first and take orders later; in a dictatorship you don't have to waste your time voting"
"I don't like jail, they got the wrong kind of bars in there"
Charles Bukowski
by jpaulson on Oct 10, 2009 8:40 AM PDT up reply actions 6 recs
I will first read Ben's executive summary, and then come back to the long report
"I think he can still play" - Kevin Pritchard on Juwan Howard
by Norsktroll on Oct 10, 2009 2:41 AM PDT reply actions 5 recs
I'm especially encouraged that you say Oden was able to keep Kaman away from the basket
Kaman is an underrated center who has a soft touch and way above-average post moves to either side. If Oden can make him into a mid-range shooter, less skilled centers will have nightmares trying to get their usual scoring and rebounding numbers against him.
Not so good that the Miller has yet to be worked into the game, but that could be expected. I predicted some off nights where Roy and Miller don’t work well together until around Christmas early on and still do. Plus Miller admitted to really coasting this year in the offseason, and he was always a slow starter into the year.
"I think he can still play" - Kevin Pritchard on Juwan Howard
by Norsktroll on Oct 10, 2009 3:15 AM PDT reply actions 5 recs
germannationalteam.fanboy.
"If the Lakers are Hollywood, then we are South Central." - Clipper fan.
by Cablinasian on Oct 10, 2009 10:06 AM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
Hey, he might look dumb, but he plays smart
"I think he can still play" - Kevin Pritchard on Juwan Howard
by Norsktroll on Oct 10, 2009 10:50 AM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
Kaman's a good player
I hope he can stay healthy, he did really well that 2nd season after his big contract. He’s young, big, and skilled.
Morty
by Mortimer on Oct 10, 2009 11:07 AM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
ANOTHER SIDE NOTE
For any Clipper fans reading…
By saying you are the JV team, I mean the JV team of LA, when compared to the Lakers.
Not that you’re so inferior compared to us, for example.
I thought about changing the title to not look uppity and lame after we lost to them, but they are the JV team of Los Angeles, so I’ll keep it.
Morty, again.
by Mortimer on Oct 10, 2009 3:25 AM PDT reply actions 6 recs
You're entertaining even in long-form, Mort
Nice job—thanks.
"We don't back down to nobody." --Joel Przybilla
by hurryup09 on Oct 10, 2009 3:53 AM PDT reply actions 5 recs
So I guess I did my ad hominemy in the wrong drawer.
redunkulous post and a REC for uncle mort.
Romance me with that Roy rainbow shot which took flight from way beyond the arc and sailed so high that before it came back down to earth sealing the victory, it kissed the rafters and said "You're mine baby."
by Blazer1342 on Oct 10, 2009 5:15 AM PDT reply actions 6 recs
Very good fun report Mortimer.
Tell us again how you feel about Blake vs. Miller and this time don’t hold back ( :
Brandon Roy just destroyed everything in his path. There's your rational analysis -- Dave
Also: COMCAST SUCKS!
by TwoDeep on Oct 10, 2009 6:54 AM PDT reply actions 5 recs
Haha, I wasn't trying to be too negative with Blake
He’s done a great job for us and I don’t want to lose him.
I just think Miller is clearly a much better player, moreso when you see his craftiness live (or on TV, someday).
Roy and Miller still gotta figure out how it’ll all work, since he’s so different from Blake. Miller has played with a wing who does his share of playmaking in Andre Iguodala, but he needs to learn Roy’s tendencies and when Roy should have the ball and when he needs Miller to take over and all that chemistry junk.
48 minutes of good PG play will be as important to our success as getting 48 minutes of good center play was last year.
Mortimer
by Mortimer on Oct 10, 2009 11:06 AM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
mortimer you have an excellent character and I appreciate your game recap.
by 50backflips on Oct 10, 2009 7:01 AM PDT reply actions 5 recs
Excellent character indeed
He’s a mass murderer, child pornographer, racist, arms smuggler, pimp, and drug dealer. But he isn’t a L@ker fan.
And it was a good recap.
I can tell you how to make an Excel spreadsheet that proves Portland wins 62 games this year.
by jscot on Oct 10, 2009 7:07 AM PDT up reply actions 7 recs
because you wrote those things...
they are probably facts.
"The difference between a democracy and a dictatorship is that in a democracy you vote first and take orders later; in a dictatorship you don't have to waste your time voting"
"I don't like jail, they got the wrong kind of bars in there"
Charles Bukowski
by jpaulson on Oct 10, 2009 7:10 AM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
Yeah
Double confirmation.
1. You read it on the Internet. It must be true.
2. I wrote it.
I’m not sure which of those bears the most weight, of course.
I can tell you how to make an Excel spreadsheet that proves Portland wins 62 games this year.
by jscot on Oct 10, 2009 11:02 AM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
Thank you!
I appreciate you sludging through the 10,000 words describing Oden’s gangliness!
Morty
by Mortimer on Oct 10, 2009 10:43 AM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
Thanks Mortimer!
All I had was the radio to tell me the story last night. It is good to hear it from your perspective. Great writing as usual!
I am glad to hear a real description of Oden. Based on what media members have been saying, my expectations may have been getting too high again. I am not talking about his play, potential or is actual production, but I was expecting to see smooth motion. Without your description, I might have been surprised the first time I saw him live. It is good to have a truer picture in my mind before seeing it in person. I am not worried about his gangliness, but I am glad that I know what to expect now.
I get the paper, so I don't care!
by Name's Ash on Oct 10, 2009 8:07 AM PDT reply actions 5 recs
There is lots to be happy about
But especially last night, he was awkward and raw on offense. He isn’t Hakeem out there.
He also still suffers from hesitation when he should strike fast, but that’ll come as he continues to become comfortable with his moves. At least now he HAS moves, and they should work most nights, combined with his power game.
Last year, at the Clippers game at the end of the season, there was nothing but taunts and jeers and jokes about Oden during the game. He didn’t do much at all in it; nothing to shut anyone up. No one was making fun of him last night. He’s a player.
A good example of him looking effective-but-gangly is that first block he had against the Kings, the one that NBA.com made a stand-along highlight out of. His limbs and body is still so loosey-goosey.
Mo—
by Mortimer on Oct 10, 2009 10:48 AM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
It'll come in time
I wish the hype machine would let it happen organically.
I get the paper, so I don't care!
by Name's Ash on Oct 10, 2009 11:45 AM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
We have found the enemy and he is us.
by MiledAnimal on Oct 10, 2009 12:32 PM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
tru dat!
I get the paper, so I don't care!
by Name's Ash on Oct 10, 2009 1:31 PM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
SMOOCH SMOOCH MORTIMER
"Lighten up, Francis" - Sergeant Hulka
by Sexual Tyrannosaurus on Oct 10, 2009 8:17 AM PDT reply actions 7 recs
VIDEOTAPE
You can measure skill and talent with your eyes, but productivity is shown through statistics.
by austinpwnz on Oct 10, 2009 5:03 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Thanks Morty!!!
Just a few questions:
1. Even though we didn’t seem to play any defense tonight, did you see Dre hurting or helping us from that standpoint compared to last year?
2. In the first pre-season game, I noticed ALL our perimeter guys were chasing the boards versus blocking out, was this the reason, excluding turnovers, for the fast breaks? Or did guys just not get back on D?
3. I noticed in the 1st preseason game in the 2nd half when they started together, Dre still gave BRoy the ball once he pass mid court. Was this the case also? It would make sense for both of them to switch off until Broy is a little more familiar with Dre.
I was disappointed that you didn’t get to do any post game interviews but I will settle with this more than thorough report.
You are still my friend.
by broyposse on Oct 10, 2009 8:19 AM PDT reply actions 5 recs
According to Wheels, the biggest issue with transition D was where the turnovers were occurring
As he pointed out, when the guards are coughing it up out high, it’s near impossible to stop the opponent from running it back down your throat.
"We don't back down to nobody." --Joel Przybilla
by hurryup09 on Oct 10, 2009 9:09 AM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
I think Miller will help our defense
He is not a lockdown defender, but he knows where to go and what to do. I imagine Chris Paul and other speed demons will hurt him just like the hurt Blake (and everyone, really).
But he’ll help in his experience, his TALKING, his better ability to get deflections and steals, and his bigger body. I only see him helping our defense, but our perimeter PG defense isn’t getting a huge upgrade like if we got, say, this Hinrich guy no one has heard about (I think he’s a Euro).
HurryUp2009 is correct about the transition D and where the turnovers were being coughed up… usually by the PGs, top of the key, no chance in stopping them. Sloppy sloppy.
I got a good interview with your mother after the game but she insisted that it remain all off the record, for our own private blog.
Mortimer
by Mortimer on Oct 10, 2009 10:52 AM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
Good morning, Mort,
Thanks for that.
One quick question… You said Steve “is great in his Blakeness.” Just curious, in that regard, how do you think Griffin stacks up?
by OregOden on Oct 10, 2009 8:39 AM PDT reply actions 5 recs
Griffin has a long ways to go to be as Blakey as Steve is.
But I gotta imagine that Griffin will be the best new Blake this season, easily winning the NBOY.
M—
by Mortimer on Oct 10, 2009 10:53 AM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
Should have been a dissertation
Disclaimer: everything I know about basketball I learned on Blazersedge.
by pualo on Oct 10, 2009 8:45 AM PDT reply actions 5 recs
Yaay, Morty.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
by timbo on Oct 10, 2009 9:41 AM PDT reply actions 5 recs
should have been a comment...
oh… wait…
"The difference between a democracy and a dictatorship is that in a democracy you vote first and take orders later; in a dictatorship you don't have to waste your time voting"
"I don't like jail, they got the wrong kind of bars in there"
Charles Bukowski
by jpaulson on Oct 10, 2009 9:52 AM PDT reply actions 5 recs
we haven’t had a GOOD point guard like him in ever
It’s been awhile, but Andre’s PG game is similar to Rod Strickland
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
by two4larue on Oct 10, 2009 10:22 AM PDT reply actions 5 recs
it felt like Blake was trying to show he can do the things Miller does— split double teams, behind the back dribble and penetrate and dish
If you watch the latest video on O-live (“what I want to improve this year” etc) you’ll hear Blake say he’s working on his penetration skills. Now is the time for Steve (and all the players) to try to do new things and break out new skills, when the games don’t count. If it’s not successful, I expect Blake will go back to being the reliable/conservative A/TO-minded PG that we’re familar with
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
by two4larue on Oct 10, 2009 10:28 AM PDT reply actions 6 recs
That's true as well
Steve is a fighter and likely really wants to retain his starting spot. If he is simply trying out new things, then pre-season is the time for it.
M—
by Mortimer on Oct 10, 2009 11:28 AM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
thanks mortimer. you hit every topic of interest. oden analysis was great.
by Ben Golliver on Oct 10, 2009 10:36 AM PDT reply actions 5 recs
and if you thought it was spammed before you’re up on the mainpage now lol
by Ben Golliver on Oct 10, 2009 10:36 AM PDT reply actions 5 recs
Thanks Ben
It is an honor!
Good ol’ Morty
by Mortimer on Oct 10, 2009 10:54 AM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
you do have the soul of an old man...
Whatever
thetinfoil@gmail.com
by TheTinfoil on Oct 10, 2009 12:36 PM PDT up reply actions 6 recs
Let's not forget
If Oden had simply made one more of those shots he’d have shot ~57% from the field. Hardly something to sneeze at. Instead he missed one more. If this is an off night for him and he goes 3/7, I’m excited (although of course I realize that this doesn’t mean he can’t go 0/58 next game, but still).
by Seven06Renault on Oct 10, 2009 10:40 AM PDT reply actions 5 recs
True, the percentage was good
And that is a thing I was trying to portray— it was an off game offensively for him, but he still was effective in getting the other bigs in foul trouble quickly and in doing his standard dunk game.
The worst part was that his moves just weren’t as good as the ones we’d been seeing in highlights. He was forcing it, but it’s good to remember where he’s at in his development and there will be nights he looks smooth and is making all the right reads, and others where he’s thinking he’s gonna get a foul call and chucks up an ugly brick.
He had at least 2 shots where I went “ooph”.
M—
by Mortimer on Oct 10, 2009 10:57 AM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
According to the NBA.com stats Oden was blocked in 2 shots so there are only 2 "misses"?
5 for 7 would have kept the raves coming. I do appreciate the observations. Stats do not tell the whole picture by far but do add another perspective.
"Either way we have two phenomenal units. I'm excited to play with either one." - Martell Webster
by lee3022 on Oct 10, 2009 5:18 PM PDT up reply actions 2 recs
T'anks my friend
As usual, that was pure pleasure to read. You’ve given me several things to be on the lookout for. Assuming, of course, the Blazers start appearing (like magic!) on my TV screen.
by Corvid on Oct 10, 2009 10:40 AM PDT reply actions 5 recs
It's all part of the "Spirit of '69-70" marketing campaign
The next step is for the papers to pretend they’re on the East coast and don’t get the scores in time for the next morning’s paper, so we don’t find out for a day whether the Blazers won or not.
—Mortus Operandi
by Mortimer on Oct 10, 2009 10:58 AM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
A Few Thoughts From a Clipper Fan
This is an excellent general assessment, and the respect for Clipsfans is of course appreciated. It’s always funny to see a different fanbase point of view. We’re all mostly optimists, and that means giving our own team’s players the benefit of the doubt, while we perhaps sell short the other team. It’s natural.
And there’s also the preseason. When your team wins a good game, you look at the positive factors and call it a nice win. When your team loses it’s always hey, it’s the preseason, our main guys barely played 20 minutes, it doesn’t matter, let’s move on. As eager and hopeful Clipfans we did that at the beginning of the week, losing to GSW when Camby, Griffin, and Telfair were unavailable. And we were obviously very much looking forward to seeing a healthy lineup in a home debut, and really wanted to see Blake Griffin.
As Clipsfans (at ClipsNation), we’re pretty pro-Portland—I think a majority of us picked the Blazers as our honorary playoff team last year, and maybe we jinxed you. We’re big fans of Brandon Roy. Clipfans are extremely geeked about the underrated Eric Gordon, who scored 12 points on 8 shots in 23 minutes last night, and we always are hoping that he might turn out to be almost as good as Brandon Roy. If Gordon can neutralize a player like Roy—and people know that Gordon can shoot, but don’t realize how athletic he is, and how well he defends—or the other elite SGs, it’s a big help for the Clips. But I would advise Western Conference fans to study Gordon a bit more carefully, his TSP%, his defense… after having to wait 20 games to be a starter last year, he averaged 19.8 ppg and compares very favorably to OJ Mayo and Russell Westbrook. And if he’s lucky, he might be almost as good as Brandon Roy.
That being said, if we love Roy, we really hate Andre Miller. He’s a good basketball player, and a strange, weirdly anti-social person. His vaunted arrival crushed a rising Clipper tide back before he went to Denver and Philly. He does his job and he’s good at it. He seems to be much better than Steve Blake, and that makes Blake a very solid backup. But Miller if funky and he seems to take the fun out of the game. He’s good on 2nd rate teams, even better on 3rd rate teams, and it should be interesting to see what he does on the Blazers. You should hope that the Roy factor outweighs and cancels out the Miller factor. At any rate, from the Clipfan POV, it’s pretty nice to see Baron Davis excited, in shape, and tearing Miller down.
Nothing here you guys don’t know, but the thing that prompted me to post was an impression of the game last night with regards to the big men. As I read about the victories over Sactown and the lighter, improved Oden, it was a bit scary. Did he make a huge leap? Will he provide the edge that will make the Blazers a truly elite team? The Clips radio guys were talking all about it, and everybody seems to be raising their expectations. And I think the Clips provided a great test for him. Again, if you don’t follow the Clips, you wouldn’t know that their corps of big men is their greatest strength, especially with the addition of Blake Griffin. Kaman v. Oden and Camby v. LMA is a nice enough matchup. Oden seems to be involved in the opening minute, and soon after Kaman has picked up his second foul. Uh-oh.
Say hello to DeAndre Jordan. There was an interesting choice here, as the Clips could have brought in Griffin for his debut, and gone with Camby v. Oden and BGriff v. LMA. But Jordan got to play a lot of extra minutes in last year’s debacle, and he has become the crazy work ethic Griffin’s best friend (always tweeting their activities), and he’s making amazingly quick progress. Jordan is a physical freak who measures out the same as Thabeet, only more athletic and stronger. And it was Jordan, unless I’m mistaken, who stemmed the Oden tide. Kaman came back strong in the 3rd quarter, answering the run by LMA. It looks as if Oden is definitely going to make a big step forward this season, but he’s not going to be playing Sacramento every night.
We like Griffin. He was rusty after sitting out for the first week of camp after bumping his knee, and the Clips are just starting to figure out the rotation. Those were his first official minutes, but we saw all we needed to see in summer league (which provided a sick series of highlights, with a couple of dozen DJordan dunks). The guy can play.
So yeah, if I’m a Blazers fan that was just a hohum, unimportant loss. Lots of great talent on the team, a superb leader, and they’ll get it together. As a Clipsfan however, it was an exciting victory, showing lots of promise and weapons and a nice ability to defend the home floor. Looking forward to the season.
by citizen zhiv on Oct 10, 2009 10:43 AM PDT reply actions 10 recs
Nice comment
This year, I hope you get the eighth seed and we get the first. Then, we won’t be your honorary playoff team until after we clean your clocks.
I think most of us would like to see you guys do better. The problem is, we don’t want to see your owner’s team do better, he seems to deserve a loser. But you’ve got a nice collection of talent that could click and do quite a bit better this year. Good luck.
I can tell you how to make an Excel spreadsheet that proves Portland wins 62 games this year.
Our owner is 1 guy
vs the other…. 100 Clipper fans worldwide (lol). Surely you would rather have 101 happy (even if that 101 includes the 1 you don’t want happy) than the other way around?
by Newton Pham on Oct 10, 2009 12:10 PM PDT up reply actions
Well
Since the main reason I want him unhappy is because he’s done such a consistent job of making you guys unhappy, I guess I can go along with that.
I still wonder if the best thing would be for you guys to lose, and him get fed up and sell the team to someone who would actually be worthwhile as an owner.
Except, I don’t want you guys to get TOO good. Just pretty good every once in a while.
I can tell you how to make an Excel spreadsheet that proves Portland wins 62 games this year.
I think because of the LA market
The Clippers have shown that you can be bad there for a long time and still make your owner money. That’s why he hasn’t sold and won’t likely sell anytime soon. His bad ownership has still made him money, sadly.
Clipper fans deserve a great team one of these days.
M—
You guys should be a LOT better this season
Thanks for stopping by and for your great post… were ya happy with Baron last night? He just seemed much more energized and in shape. I hope it lasts.
Jordan hooking up with workaholic Griffin will be a good thing.
I got a question for ya… what did ya think of the guys who started the FIRE DUNLEAVY chants DURING the start up of the national anthem?
Morty
Pretty much happy with everything...
But that’s what a good preseason win against a good team will do.
Baron is a big key to the team and its fortunes. He was saying at midseason, when everything was in a shambles, that he had a rocky first year at GSW but they were able to make some noise the second year. It looks as if he was serious about that commitment.
But winning the lottery in a 1-player draft changed everything. The real beneficiary, aside from the beleguered fans, was Dunleavy. I kind of had to bend over backwards in the initial comment not to mention Dunleavy, knowing that he’s probably a rich Blazer topic. He was a deeply problematic figure last season, and dug the hole deeper every week. He had fairly good injury excuses, first Brand’s 0708 injury, then a ridiculous flurry of injuries last season. My own theory is that he is a sub-horrible coach when faced with that kind of adversity. He needs a solid, healthy, even stacked (as in his Portland days) lineup to succeed. It looks good right now because he has a lot of horses, but who knows what will happen.
And that being said, he has transformed the Clippers culture and has successfully neutralized the wacky, creepy Donald Sterling. The Clips have a sparkling training facility, they have local boy Baron Davis, and now they seem to have a special player in Blake Griffin, and Dunleavy gets to oversee the operation. He made it by the skin of his teeth (and Sterling being too cheap to pay him out), but we’ll see how it plays out. At this point I would settle for him getting the Clips into the playoffs and playing great, and then making one of his bonehead end of the game moves to break our hearts. I say that now, but it would of course kill at the time. Don’t need to hear from the FireDunleavy gang right now, but we’ll see.
by citizen zhiv on Oct 10, 2009 11:17 AM PDT up reply actions
I was really worried when Dunleavy started talking about making Griffin a small forward before the draft where he would be as wrong as Durant on SG. Then through the miracle of finding an even worse GM he managed to pass on Z-Bo, and that idea went away as quickly as it was ill-conceived.
"I think he can still play" - Kevin Pritchard on Juwan Howard
Like I said before...
…if Dunleavy let’s Baron handle the reins more this year and they get out on the break, Griffin will be great at running the floor and finishing. He’s also a good ballhandler for a PF.
He seems like he should be a PF, but with his size I could see hoping he’d be a very physical and buff SF. His game is more like a PF right now, but he’s really young and could definitely develop more skill.
I just know I like him running the floor and finishing, and didn’t like him as much in the halfcourt (in college as well).
Because of their offensive style and two veteran bigs at PF/C (or really, they’re both C’s, but Dunleavy might like playing them together), I see one of the rookie guards winning ROY, but Griffin will be an offensive force.
Mortimer
Eh, I'd call Marcus Camby a 4. Camby, who's a good mid-range jump shooter and help ...
defender from the weakside, would probably work better alongside a true center like Chris Kaman. Offensively, though, Camby and Blake Griffin would be a fine pairing, although I’d worry about the porous interior defense in one-on-one situations against low-post scoring bigs.
Stupid people have stupid ideas.
He played some 3 last night.
Actually within the course of a 6 minute span he managed to play PF, then shift to C, then shift to SF.
LMAO
smh
The Princess of Blazersedge
It just takes an iron fist to keep the riff raff under control and her princess hand is mad strong- Idoltime
I’m not sure if anyone stemmed the Oden tide. As pointed out, he was rebounding well and shot 3-7. If any one of those shots goes in, it’s a magically good game. The hook for him is inconsistent – he either has it or he doesn’t.
I do like DJ, I just think that Oden was pretty consistent in his output.
"If the Lakers are Hollywood, then we are South Central." - Clipper fan.
by Cablinasian on Oct 10, 2009 11:05 AM PDT up reply actions
oh, and what Gordon needs to do is become a better playmaker. He’s a fantastic scorer, but he turns the ball over more, assists less, and has an incomprehensibly bad rebound rate.
Seriously, Steve Blake outrebounded him by percentage last year. By .6%.
I think that’s why his PER is below 15. He scores so well but needs to work on the other parts of his game to play winning basketball.
"If the Lakers are Hollywood, then we are South Central." - Clipper fan.
by Cablinasian on Oct 10, 2009 11:08 AM PDT up reply actions
Gordon
He’s more of a pure SG, maybe because of his catch-and-shoot skills and complementary ability to get to the rim. It would be nice if his assists were better and he saw the floor a little better. It would be especially nice if he were 3 inches taller, but that’s the way it goes.
The rebounding thing is interesting, something that we’ve studied pretty carefully. Obviously, he needs to rebound much better. His 5 rebounds last night were obviously excellent, even amazing, and that shouldn’t be so surprising.
My own theory is that he plays great defense and he’s also a surprisingly good shot-blocker—to a fault. He had 200 rebounds last year and an amazing 35 blocks. By contrast, BRoy had 370 rebounds and 22 blocks. OJ Mayo had 308 rebounds and 13 blocks, Ray Allen had 278 rebs and 13 blocks, and RWestbrook had 221 rebs and 16 blocks. (Of course, Gordon played sparingly in the first 20 games, as did Westbrook.) The moral of the story here is that he’s contesting a whole lot of shots and actually blocking a small percentage of them. He needs to continue to play good D, but emphasize rebounding rather than shot-blocking. Last night was a good start.
by citizen zhiv on Oct 10, 2009 11:40 AM PDT up reply actions
If your theory is right
is it hurting anything? Is the guy he’s guarding getting any of those rebounds? If not, I’d personally rather have the contested shots. I mean, he’s a guard. As long as he’s not letting his man loose to get a lot of offensive rebounds, it’s not really a problem, is it? And if shots are being contested, then there are more missed shots, which your own big men are most likely to get, aren’t they?
Well, maybe not if your own big men are injured or not very good, but in normal circumstances.
For me, great defense is better in a guard than rebounding. If a guy is a good rebounder, it’s kind of a bonus, but the other is more important.
The occasional offensive rebound from your guards is nice, but it should be your center and forwards who own the defensive boards.
I can tell you how to make an Excel spreadsheet that proves Portland wins 62 games this year.
This is true...but a rebounding guard
…can help lead to a lot of breaks. It helps the running game when a guard can grab a long rebound and push it.
As in Andre Miller?
"Either way we have two phenomenal units. I'm excited to play with either one." - Martell Webster
Good question
I would say yes, it’s hurting something. But I’m no expert. It just seems to be a statistical anomaly. An athletic, even undersized SG has a whole bunch of extra blocks, and yet his rebounding totals are low, almost proportionally so.
He needs to have respectable rebounding numbers. Rebounding from the guards seems minor, but it’s important, and rebounding from the wing is even more important. It’s about positioning and opportunities.
Yes, of course you want to contest shots. But there’s also a big difference between contesting shots and blocking shots (and there’s also fouling, of course). Gordon seems to be extra active at contesting shots, to the extent that he’s getting some blocks. There’s a way to contest a shot and stay in position, but it seems like actually trying to get a block is the extra mile. Going for those blocks, and at the same time not thinking about your own rebounding responsibilities and potential, seems to make up the discrepancy. Obviously he can continue to play strong defense either way. He needs to rebound better, and last night was a nice start. I’d hope that his rebounds will go up to a more respectable level, and we’ll see if his blocks go down at the same time.
by citizen zhiv on Oct 10, 2009 4:05 PM PDT up reply actions
Gordon has excellent wingspan and great leaping ability
So that may contibute to his blocks. I would think he is not heavy enough (nor do you want him to be) to bang down low except against other guards. I see you point, since you are an eyewitness, that he is out of position to get long rebounds because of the blocks. It is part of maturing as a player to know when to do each.
"Either way we have two phenomenal units. I'm excited to play with either one." - Martell Webster
Still didn't answer my question, really
Is his man getting the rebounds?
A guard’s “rebounding responsibility” is not to actually get the ball. It is to make sure his man is blocked off the boards. Blocking the shot and keeping rebounding position are sometimes mutually exclusive, but not always.
If he’s jumping out at guys trying to block the shot, and they are going around him to follow it and get the rebound, your point is sound. If not, then take it as a bonus that he blocks some shots, and assume the rebounds is one of those things that was probably just a statistical anomaly last year.
I can tell you how to make an Excel spreadsheet that proves Portland wins 62 games this year.
im gonna have to disagree with ya on this one boss.
“A guard’s "rebounding responsibility" is not to actually get the ball. It is to make sure his man is blocked off the boards.”
Every players job on the floor is to get rebounds. Block out, go get it. The teams that do that the best consistently are the best teams.
by GreatOden'sRaven on Oct 12, 2009 1:06 PM PDT up reply actions
Depends on your big men
Sometimes, the guard’s responsibility is to put a body on his man for half a second, then position for the outlet, or leak out on the break.
It also depends on where you are on the court. Yeah, if you’ve been posted up, you commit to rebounding until it is in someone’s hands.
But no, the job is not always “go get it”. Obviously, if it’s a 3, you watch for the long rebound, and that may mean go get it. But most of the time, all you want your guards on the perimeter to do is to make sure their man isn’t getting inside to steal it.
I can tell you how to make an Excel spreadsheet that proves Portland wins 62 games this year.
OK, who hijacked jscot's account...
I know the mighty Excel based future ruler would never have made a post indicating a statistical anomoly, when these are the actual stats:
Year Team Reb
1999-00 CLE 3.4
2000-01 CLE 4.4
2001-02 CLE 4.7
2002-03 LAC 4
2003-04 DEN 4.5
2004-05 DEN 4.1
2005-06 DEN 4.3
2006-07 DEN 4.5
2006-07 PHI 4.4
2007-08 PHI 4
2008-09 PHI 4.5
Career 4.2
You don’t GET a higher correlation for a series of stats, anywhere!
So I suggest the mods block this imposter jscot account from future posts, to protect the real future leader’s integrity…
I’m sure he wouldn’t mind creating a new moniker, and starting over in his post totals…
Blazers: RUN away with the title!
KP: Please don't trade the next decade's Scottie Pippen (Batum), Spanish Larry Bird (Rudy), Bill Russell (GO) or Captain BRoy - at least until they 3-peat..
Perhaps our Visionary One
didn’t see that we were talking about a rookie who has never played for Cleveland, Denver, or Philadelphia, and assuredly did not get 4 rpg in his only year with LAC.
I don’t know whether Gordon’s low rebounding last year means he’s a bad rebounder, or just one of those weird things that happens in a statistical category that is not someone’s primary responsibility.
It happens, a guard has a year with really low or really high rebounding numbers, or a center has a year with a lot of steals, and then the next year has hardly any, and neither really means much at all, except in fantasy teams.
I can tell you how to make an Excel spreadsheet that proves Portland wins 62 games this year.
Doh!
Yes, that is the problem with always looking to the future… ignoring the past… Yes, I assumed we were talking about Dre…
Blazers: RUN away with the title!
KP: Please don't trade the next decade's Scottie Pippen (Batum), Spanish Larry Bird (Rudy), Bill Russell (GO) or Captain BRoy - at least until they 3-peat..
I would say the same thing
…if I was a Blazer fan. Let’s just say he didn’t get 20-10 like he did against Sacramento. My point was that he had a ton of momentum going into the game, and he started well and Kaman was called for the fouls. At that point you don’t know—is he going to destroy people every night, will he start rebounding like Dwight Howard? On some nights, against certain teams, Oden will get 15-18 rebounds or more. As a Clipfan, we’ve seen it with Kaman before. Last night Oden didn’t have a bad game, but he wasn’t scary, and on the ClipsNation board they’re saying that he can get his putbacks, but “he has no offensive game whatsoever.” I doubt that’s true, but our impression was that the tide was stemmed, though not stopped. Obviously, for us, if 35th pick DJordan (4-6, 5 rebs, 2 blocks, but 1-5 FT) is in the same conversation with Oden, we’re happy, especially when you add Kaman (6-8, 4 rebs, 4 blocks).
by citizen zhiv on Oct 10, 2009 11:27 AM PDT up reply actions
If 7 and 8 in 20 minutes is not scary, then I’m okay with not scary. He didn’t hit any of hte post moves he’s been hitting thus far, was called for an iffy travel on a spin move, and still had 10.5-12 per 36.
If he can’t hit a shot on a given night and puts up those type of numbers, then great.
He’s been showcasing moves throughout training camp and the preseason, so I’m not going to put too much stock into a game in which the entire team was out of sync and not clicking correctly.
I don’t want to sound too negative toward the Clips. I love Baron and co. and I’ll be rooting for you guys this year.
"If the Lakers are Hollywood, then we are South Central." - Clipper fan.
by Cablinasian on Oct 10, 2009 12:00 PM PDT up reply actions
Oden, on offense, looked more like last year's Oden than what we'd seen thus far, Cabby
So I can’t blame someone thinking he has a lot left to show there. And he does, really.
On defense and his conditioning is where he really shined last night. And for a “bad” offensive night from Oden (which I think we’ll see this sort of game where his offense isn’t clicking, but he still ends up in double digits points wise), it’s still effective, but he really really really didn’t show any non-Blazer fans that he has developed an offensive game.
Not like we’ve seen in practice, and in the first two pre-season game highlights. So, don’t judge them not going overboard on Oden’s o-game too harshly :-) We’d say the same thing.
Morty
he does have a long way to go. It’s just frustrating to see others judge him based on one game (as ClipperSteve did).
"If the Lakers are Hollywood, then we are South Central." - Clipper fan.
by Cablinasian on Oct 10, 2009 12:22 PM PDT up reply actions
to be fair....
we kind of judge his awesomeness from 2 games….
"The difference between a democracy and a dictatorship is that in a democracy you vote first and take orders later; in a dictatorship you don't have to waste your time voting"
"I don't like jail, they got the wrong kind of bars in there"
Charles Bukowski
*judged*
"The difference between a democracy and a dictatorship is that in a democracy you vote first and take orders later; in a dictatorship you don't have to waste your time voting"
"I don't like jail, they got the wrong kind of bars in there"
Charles Bukowski
lol
"The difference between a democracy and a dictatorship is that in a democracy you vote first and take orders later; in a dictatorship you don't have to waste your time voting"
"I don't like jail, they got the wrong kind of bars in there"
Charles Bukowski
I knew a guy who drove one of those in high school
green, with a spoiler in the back
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
My best bud in HS had a 72.
Metallic orange-ish with a white racing stripe…I locked the keys in it once out at that little race car track by washington square when he let me borrow it…it was running…
"The match in Los Angeles is a good opportunity to begin to demonstrate that we want to make war." Rudy Fernández (translated)
I never said his post game was awesome or even good. Just that it is coming along somewhat.
"If the Lakers are Hollywood, then we are South Central." - Clipper fan.
by Cablinasian on Oct 10, 2009 12:27 PM PDT up reply actions
As has been stated before
We are basing it on more than one game. We are just looking at it through a different viewfinder.
It’s less “judging” and more “my impressions were”…. a subbbtle difference haha.
by Newton Pham on Oct 10, 2009 12:25 PM PDT up reply actions
I got a lil’ upset at the “(dear FSM his offensive game is terrible)” line.
I feel like a lot of people have preconceived notions and allow that to shape what they see with Oden. For example, he was bad on defense last year a lot of the time and yet he sitll got credit for being a good defender. He played 61 games and lots of people think he missed half the season.
"If the Lakers are Hollywood, then we are South Central." - Clipper fan.
by Cablinasian on Oct 10, 2009 12:31 PM PDT up reply actions
Yeah, he has a ways to go, which is also encouraging since he's probably going to still be very effective along the way
I believe Oden will show a lot of goodness this year, because he fixed his biggest problem: conditioning.
M—
which will lead to less fouls and more time on the court to develop his game
"The difference between a democracy and a dictatorship is that in a democracy you vote first and take orders later; in a dictatorship you don't have to waste your time voting"
"I don't like jail, they got the wrong kind of bars in there"
Charles Bukowski
Zhiv is much more articulate than I...
…but I am going to have to agree that DJ took away some of Oden’s oomph. Trust me many of us fans follow the Blazers too.
by Newton Pham on Oct 10, 2009 12:11 PM PDT up reply actions
It’s hard to say as I wasn’t there. That being said, Oden still had 7 and 8 “without oomph.” I’m okay with that as a low end of his ability.
"If the Lakers are Hollywood, then we are South Central." - Clipper fan.
by Cablinasian on Oct 10, 2009 12:18 PM PDT up reply actions
I take it too, but we have to accept that he won't dominate every game and the Clippers front court is likely better than the Kings
Last year he had 15 and 15, 16 and 6, and 4 and 6 against the Clipshow. While playing 42 (his most I think), 26 and 17 minutes. So last night was along those lines.
"I think he can still play" - Kevin Pritchard on Juwan Howard
You are correct except that with all the LAC weapons he had 1.7PF per 36 minutes
He does not need to get 20 points but with Brandon and LMA doing little they could concentrate on Greg last night and it worked. It is not unlike a team with a great running back and a backup QB – the defense keys on stopping the run and usually does. I would happily settle for 15 and 15 every night.
Now I was not there so that may not have been what happened. It is only surmised from the comments of those who were and the box.
"Either way we have two phenomenal units. I'm excited to play with either one." - Martell Webster
Yeah, the fouls and defense were the best things about the game
And the least WOW-worthy on a stat sheet, of course.
If he had played 30+ minutes (which he certainly would have in a real game), I am sure he would have ended up with a double/double, which is always a good game, plus good defense.
If he isn’t fouling, then he’s doing good.
And again, even with his super-awkward offensive game last night, he was getting doubled and drawing attention. Miller was able to drive and get to the bucket because they played him for the dump off dunk to Oden. He just draws attention like a black hole (in a non Z-Bo way of course).
I predict plenty of 20/15 games, mixed in with 8/10 games, and every once in a while a foul plagued game that hopefully becomes less and less. Even me, a Oden homer, doesn’t expect his foul troubles to have gone away, but hey… if they have I’ll take it. Because people were attacking him and he was doing the right thing almost every time, aside from being as aggressive as he’ll eventually be.
We can’t claim he’s a world beater after every great game, and can’t worry he’s a fluke from his bad ones. He’ll likely be very erratic (but efficiently erratic) offensively this year, but his defense appears consistent. We know what we need more of.
Morty
He also didn't foul a lot against them last year, otherwise he couldn't have played 42 with OT
"I think he can still play" - Kevin Pritchard on Juwan Howard
Kaman was out then already, wasn't he?
Oden got in quick foul trouble and didn’t do much in the late season game in LA against the Clippers. Was an uninspired win.
M—
I spent some time earlier in the year on Clips Nation
and can underscore that they are probably the nicest group of fans in the SBN world. I wrote a few weeks ago that I thought the Clippers could make the playoffs and got shot down, so I hope they come through this season and present me with bragging rights, which I will use liberally upon the naysayers.
Other than that, my only other request of the Clippers is that they beat the Lakers like a rented mule at least once this season.
by MiledAnimal on Oct 10, 2009 12:19 PM PDT up reply actions
Congrats on shedding Z-bo. Seriously, congratulations.
Whatever
thetinfoil@gmail.com
by TheTinfoil on Oct 10, 2009 12:39 PM PDT up reply actions 2 recs
poor memphis..
"The difference between a democracy and a dictatorship is that in a democracy you vote first and take orders later; in a dictatorship you don't have to waste your time voting"
"I don't like jail, they got the wrong kind of bars in there"
Charles Bukowski
Good post
Like you say, hoops-watching is all a matter of one’s perspective, isn’t it? But while acknowledging that, if healthy, the Clips are legit playoff contenders this season, last night wasn’t a true indicator of how the Clips & Blazers stack up. The Clips were rested, at home, and raring to go, and they came out with regular season intensity. The Blazers simply didn’t. They treated this one as a meaningless preseason game—an opportunity to fiddle with rotations, matchups, defensive schemes, etc.
By contrast, the Clips seriously wanted to notch a win on their belt. Nothing wrong with that; had the Blazers dropped their preseason opener, they likely would have had a little edge in Game 2 also.
"We don't back down to nobody." --Joel Przybilla
25
bayless leaves over my dead body
andre miller>hedo
real.baller
by thomasikehara on Oct 10, 2009 10:43 AM PDT reply actions 1 recs
Meh
The Princess of Blazersedge
It just takes an iron fist to keep the riff raff under control and her princess hand is mad strong- Idoltime
too much green and mortimer, i stopped reading after u started talking about yourself
… in the first sentence. Youre selfish.
You"re Brandon Roy in real Life
S
The Princess of Blazersedge
It just takes an iron fist to keep the riff raff under control and her princess hand is mad strong- Idoltime
Supposition
Morty might be Paul Allen in pseudonym.
"Either way we have two phenomenal units. I'm excited to play with either one." - Martell Webster
couldn't be
PA prefers the baseline seats, not 7 rows up at midcourt
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Yeah, and I always wonder why
I sat in the Paul Allen type area last year for this same pre-season game against the Clippers, and the angle really cut down on my enjoyment.
You can’t tell how the spacing is, players block the view (plus the basket does), I don’t know what Paul Allen’s problem is. What a jerk to like to sit there.
M—
Top Ten Reasons Why Paul Allen Sits Courtside
10. He’s not tall, but he has really long legs.
9. See those Coke-bottle glasses?
8. Hoping Jack Nicholson will see him.
7. Caviar vendors don’t climb steps.
6. Scared of “those lunatics in section 323.”
5. Better cell phone reception.
4. He’d really like to sit behind the bench like Mark Cuban, but he’s not that weird.
3. Hates the “cheap, hard, uncomfortable chairs” that ordinary fans sit in.
2. Flashes secret “gangsta” sign to Nate to tell him when to put Jerryd in.
1. Ready to throw-down in the next Blazers-Lakers brawl.
by MiledAnimal on Oct 11, 2009 9:38 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
And as a real businessman, knows that someone else will pay more for those expensive seats
Blazers have to make a profit one way or another some time.
"I think he can still play" - Kevin Pritchard on Juwan Howard
Morty, acing it.
Thanks for injecting the human element into your very cogent breakdown of the game and the players of both teams.
Love,
Annie
"Aneurysm".
When Outlaw wins a game on a last-second shot, it’s called an "annthefaneurysm". QualityPie
Highlights are up at NBA.com. Nasty block by Oden when Kaman tried to come into the lane.
"If the Lakers are Hollywood, then we are South Central." - Clipper fan.
also, note that it was Greg who enabled the Batum dunk by keeping Kaman from contesting the shot.
"If the Lakers are Hollywood, then we are South Central." - Clipper fan.
by Cablinasian on Oct 10, 2009 11:26 AM PDT up reply actions
if nic wanted to pass
greg sealed a hell of a spot and would have dunked
by GreatOden'sRaven on Oct 12, 2009 1:12 PM PDT up reply actions
A win/win either way.
And Oden can get that position on most anyone this side of Shaq… Kaman ain’t no slouch in the big-dude category.
M—
Clipper Fan's Take...
Great post Morty
I’d like to add some perspective from a Clipper fan that was in attendance…sometimes we are so focused on our own team we don’t see what the other team is doing, especially when people have the automatic “it’s the Clippers” discount in their heads.
First and foremost – it’s preseason and everyone is shaking off some rust and tweaking their game.
RAMBO – did not look smooth at all, but I think it broke down mostly to Roy not being completely in tune this game. Andre Miller did his thing, drove, penetrated, dished or finished. I think once Roy clicks and fires on all cylinders RAMBO will be beastly. (btw Aldridge looks like an All-Star).
I think RAMBO needs Oden to develop some post moves. He doesn’t have any. He looked horrible and clunky down low. Don’t get me wrong though, Kaman is no slouch. I believe you didn’t notice DJ as much because he’s not high profile. I think DeAndre played great interior D and held it down. I think he matched up to Oden very well actually.
Despite the gripes everyone has with Dunleavy he is a good defensive coach. Players were on their rotations and where they needed to be. I believe in this game at least, when everyone was rusty it was the Clipper defense that really held it down and created issues for RAMBO.
Telfair vs Bayless…I don’t necessarily agree with your take on this. I think Bassy clearly had more impact than Bayless. He got everywhere he wanted to and the ball to everyone he wanted to get it to.
Blazers are the better team, but I wouldn’t say I was jealous.
I’m pretty hopeful for this years cast of Clippers.
I find it funny that Clipper fans are judging Oden’s post game off of one poor outing. The sample size is pretty small on three hook shots.
He’s shown moves, he’s just wildly inconsistent and still getting used to using them.
The thing is that Roy is really out of sync and the Blazers were not putting forth the effort the Clips were (Griffin’s first game, natch) so it’s hard to judge the starting lineup. We might get a better idea next Wednesday.
"If the Lakers are Hollywood, then we are South Central." - Clipper fan.
by Cablinasian on Oct 10, 2009 11:54 AM PDT up reply actions
It's always easy to discount the other team when watching your team...
That’s just the way it goes. We don’t have many chances to watch the other team so don’t know the little intricacies. This is why it’s just my observation and not necessarily entirely true.
However Portland is a high profile team which many of us in ClipsNation had dubbed the official playoff choice last season. I’ve seen Oden play nearly every time he has been on the floor since he came into the league (which is not many times) and he’s always looked clunky to me. He’s raw, I doubt many other Bedge fans will disagree.
It’s easy to say, “oh I wasn’t trying” when you lose. I was a bit closer in the PR section and the body language described by many on here as oh they weren’t putting effort didn’t register with me. It just looked like, “we’re a little out of sync and not fully in our groove yet.” Roy didn’t touch a basketball at all during the off season.
Once the team clicks, the Blazers will be beastly, that is easy to see. This is preseason, it doesn’t count and teams are just trying to put it together.
by Newton Pham on Oct 10, 2009 12:04 PM PDT up reply actions
he’s extremely raw, which makes the nice averages very cool. There is hope for improvement.
I think he looked clunky last year but he’s lookin’ pretty spry thus far. That block on Kaman was pretty agile.
"If the Lakers are Hollywood, then we are South Central." - Clipper fan.
by Cablinasian on Oct 10, 2009 12:13 PM PDT up reply actions
There's no doubt he will continue to progress
As said he’s displayed it on weaker interior defenses the past two games. He just needs to keep banging at it during the season and “level it up” to the point where he can do it on the premier bigs on the league.
by Newton Pham on Oct 10, 2009 12:17 PM PDT up reply actions
he had fantastic games against Jermaine, Okafor, Chandler, Perkins, etc.
"If the Lakers are Hollywood, then we are South Central." - Clipper fan.
by Cablinasian on Oct 10, 2009 12:19 PM PDT up reply actions
Ok you win
All hail Greg Oden!
Hahah just messing. No really, I think he’s going to be a beast as does most of everyone out there. But as observers and not true fans, we need a little more nudging to believe.
Group hug?
by Newton Pham on Oct 10, 2009 12:20 PM PDT up reply actions
Hahaha
I like that response.
Across other team’s fan blogs and even on our own, I think we don’t need to stand up for Oden so much. The season will start soon and now that he’s in good shape and seems to be able to stay on the court without foul problems, he’ll show what he can do.
Oden’s extenuatong circumstances make evaluation of his first season tricky, so we point out all of the various advanced stats that show what he did while he was on the floor. This year, however, I don’t think we’ll need to do that. His raw numbers will be good, and he’ll be able to stay on the floor most nights.
Oden will do all the proving himself! I don’t blame you for not thinking much of his offensive game last night in particular…
Mortimer
I’ve seen so much unfair bashing of both Greg Oden the player and the person that it’s a defense mechanism to defend him.
"If the Lakers are Hollywood, then we are South Central." - Clipper fan.
by Cablinasian on Oct 10, 2009 12:26 PM PDT up reply actions
I do it too
His per-36 was good, his PER, his rebounding percentages, etc etc, so just take solace in the belief that as long as he’s on the court, he’ll put up numbers.
The season starts soon, he’s healthy and in shape, the rest will come naturally.
Whenever I try to tell someone in person about Oden’s great rebounding percentages, how often he is fouled, his PER, etc etc, I get looked at like I am making up stats. While I 100% believe the advanced stats are very important tools to judge a player’s impact, I can’t expect most fans to care about them.
This year, Oden will be able to stay on the floor long enough to make his per game numbers match his per-minute impact.
Mortimer
I agree with that. The league will see this season, over the course of 82 games that he is an absolute beast.
"If the Lakers are Hollywood, then we are South Central." - Clipper fan.
by Cablinasian on Oct 10, 2009 12:25 PM PDT up reply actions
I thought I said Telfair did well! :)
In comparison to Telfair, all I said was Bayless was quite a bit bigger.
Oh, I guess I said he defended him well, and he did. Telfair did some nice passes and got some assists on the break.
Oden definitely had an off game, but from the first two pre-season’s game’s highlights, we’ve seen nice hook shots, spin moves, short power drives, drop steps, and even a jumper. None of it was on display last night, however, but he was able to get great position on whoever defended him. His shots were awkward and forced, however.
He still gets doubled almost every time down low, even being so raw. Last night was an example of how he can still be effective, without having a ‘good’ offensive game. I don’t blame you for thinking he doesn’t have any post moves, they were not on display last night.
Last year he scored efficiently inside with his power game and his clean-up game, and his ability to draw numerous fouls on opposing bigs and (usually) make a decent percentage of his hook shots should be a good weapon this year. The main thing that limited him last season was foul troubles due to conditioning, so now that he’s in good shape he should be able to stay on the floor.
Last night, for Blazer fans, him not getting in any foul trouble will guarding an allstar-caliber big man (when healthy) in Kaman and Baron penetrating is the best sign. It means he will stay on the court this year.
Morty
I appreciate your thoughts
And I respect the Clippers. Last year they were among the few teams who won in the Rose Garden. This year’s edition looks better on paper. I do share the hope that you push for a playoff team – just not against the Blazers. The more losses you can pin on your cellmates the better for the Blazers!
Sebastian has been such an enigma to me. He had such promise when he was drafted. He has always had good court vision and good passing. What made him a liability in Portland, Boston and Minnesota was his defense and his inability to shoot. Teams clog the middle preventing him from driving and cheat the passing lanes to pick him off.
Rather than compare Telfair to Bayless (6th year against 2nd year) perhaps Jameer Nelson is a more fair match. Taken 7 places lower in the same draft Nelson has earned All-Star recognition and sported a 20.6 PER last year. Telfair’s 10.8 PER last year was also about his career average. He does not seem to be improving. much. In fairness his cast of teammates has been much poorer than he has this year so he will likely be a serviceable backup. Bayless will either become much better and start in a few years or be traded to Boston for the next Brandon Roy. Portland owes Telfair our deepest appreciation for that trade (and subsequent drafting/trade for Roy with the pick).
"Either way we have two phenomenal units. I'm excited to play with either one." - Martell Webster
I remember Nelson used to punk Bassy when they played against each other
maybe he still does? Jameer thought he should’ve been drafted higher than the HS kid, etc
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
nice work Flavius Mortimus
I still think your too high on Bayless, especially with thinking he’ll learn to over-come his instinctual style of play. Guarding Telfair is not the NBA’s greatest challenge. When given opps to show what he’s got, Bayless marginalizes his game. I really wish you would see things my way on this issue. (joke)
Great work, I hope you had fun and got that big collectible soda cup.
I did not say this. I am not here.
Good thing Bayless is 3rd on your depth chart...
Can you say deep?
by Newton Pham on Oct 10, 2009 12:06 PM PDT up reply actions
Well, to me, Bayless doesn't need to overcome his instinctual style
Remember, The Bayless Theory isn’t based on him being a true PG, it’s based on him being a scoring off-guard next to Roy, while guarding true PGs.
Telfair is very quick, he’s a tough guy to stay in front of. He doesn’t punish slower guys by finishing well inside (that didn’t translate from HS to the pros), and you can force him to shoot a jumper by backing off of him, but Bayless was defending him straight up and staying in front of him.
I remember Telfair his rookie year, and he made many great passes. I haven’t seen him play like that since. He had some nice ones last night.
OH you reminded me Bow! This was maybe the greatest thing last night— THE SODA HAD FREE REFILLS. You heard me right. The collector’s cup (like 5 bucks, standard for a game) of soda had UNLIMITED FREE REFILLS. I had died and gone to heaven. I drank like 5 cups to get my money’s worth.
I hope that becomes standard in Portland as well.
Mortimer
Soda at a sporting event??
"The difference between a democracy and a dictatorship is that in a democracy you vote first and take orders later; in a dictatorship you don't have to waste your time voting"
"I don't like jail, they got the wrong kind of bars in there"
Charles Bukowski
I agree Bayless will never be a point guard
He’s a scorer which means he plays the 2. He’s got defensive skills that allow him to guard PG’s. I think what’s going on with Bayless is we see the sculpture and it’s pretty rigid and inflexible. I don’t see his style of play as complimentary unless he’s matched with Roy, but that could be said for anybody in the league.
I’m also thinking Bayless just isn’t going to develop on the PTB behind Blake and Miller. He may not be a PG, but that’s the only place he’ll see minutes, at least during the regular season.
I did not say this. I am not here.
Are there enough urinals in the building?
Small wonder you were pumped!
"Either way we have two phenomenal units. I'm excited to play with either one." - Martell Webster
right
I was going to ask Morty how many times did he have to pull over, on the way home?
like those “continence commercials”…or how about when Forrest Gump drank all of the free Dr. Pepper?
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Section 101 was right next to the boy's powder room
I only had to go twice. real.ballers.bladder.
—M
hey morty mortinstien
Excellent recap, you’re a fart smeller. my only ? is who are our good perimeter defenders besides batum? LMA is okay, even though he is not a wing, but I don’t see why, with Juwan, Collins is more likely to get the spot as Ime, is it more just the fact that there are more SFs on the team than PFs/bigs, not necessarily the D?
14736251
Martell ain't bad
Roy CAN be good but often has lost focus on the defensive end.
But even if Ime is our 2nd best defender, if we need perimeter defense we’ll put Batum out there; we’d never have both Batum AND Ime out there, and we just got too many good players who need minutes. Trout, Rudy, Martell, Batum, all trying to squeeze every last drop of playing time out of the SF minutes.
Even if Martell and Batum get injured, Trout and Rudy and Roy would all play the SF for 48 minutes.
I like what I see from Juwan as our backup PF (I didn’t expect it, but I like it), but I don’t like him as a backup center. Collins is the only other true center on the roster, after Joel and Oden, and if only one of them go down he would play. It would take horribleness for Ime to get regular minutes.
I like Ime, he’s tough and a good defender, but the rest of his game isn’t very good and we got too many good players at his position. In my opinion.
Morty
I had forgotten how bad he was when he's in the open court
He’s a very bad decision maker with the ball in his hands. I have no idea how he played PG for the Nigerian national team, he’s abysmal at it.
M—
This thread has an extreme case Gang Green!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I think it should BE amputated!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Blazer's Edge Ambassador to The Dream Shake Blog
LMA Rocks!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I <3 LMA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
LMA - Putting the POWER in POWER FORWARD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
The concussion must have jarred him into "Destroy All Opposition Terminator Mode!" - BlazersOrBust
by LaMarvelous on Oct 10, 2009 12:31 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
Well played Mortimer.
My team went to the playoffs in my first year.
by pxilpooshr on Oct 10, 2009 12:35 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
at first, I thought I had logged in
to a Ducks blog by mistake…lot’s of yellow and green
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Thank you Mortie Pie.
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out, burns out farms, and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
"New Man Law: If you don't show up for the draft you don't get to come later if you're picked. If you believe in yourself, show up and sit there. If nobody else believes in you, take it and cry like a man...in front of the cameras."
-Dave
I remember Bayless as a good free throw shooter.
Not a good jumpshooter, but shooting around 50% from the stripe is out of character. He shot 80% last year and shot better than that in last year’s preseason.
Great stuff as always, Morty.
We’re lucky you never sleep so you were able to write this epic recap! Thanks, pal.
everyone has an off nite
but we tend to have them when the other teams flat out kill us on defense. yeah it was a preseason game but it reminded me of houston last year and a lack of toughness
Great material and all, a little dry though. Also, I didn't see the sweat wiper upper recap section
Kobe is my profile pic because of this beatdown I received.
Blake > Andre
The bank of superlatives for this thread has run dry so I will simply say mmmmmm
The assessments were very timely and appreciated. I was most encouraged by your assessment of Collins. Many of us agree that Portland needs another center in reserve. Some may not think Collins is as good as we could get but I am hopeful he provides that insurance. It is worth noting on Collins that for the last two years he played much better in the playoffs than the regular season – opposite of most players.
Thornton, for not playing defense, had an unusual line with 3 blocks, 2 steals and 6 rebounds (4 DRB). One more case in which the box score is trumped by personal observation.
I am also curious over Kamen’s 6-8 shooting. With the block you describe that is only one other miss. Could you square that with Greg and Joel’s defense?
Also curious is the abysmal 58% 2FG% allowed by the defense. Without the 28 fast break points that becomes only 42% so it is not poor team defense in the half court but? Lack of effort to get back or tired legs for Portland? Any thoughts?
"Either way we have two phenomenal units. I'm excited to play with either one." - Martell Webster
Some may not think Collins is as good as we could get but I am hopeful he provides that insurance.
A lot of folks thought that Steven Hill was going to make the roster last year at this time, but Shav had that big game down in ATL and snuck in ahead of him
I think Nate and Ime have an “understanding” re: the 15th roster spot. It doesn’t mean we have to like it…but if somebody tweaks something before the season starts then maybe Collins will get the nod
When reached 39 years of following Portland basketball you have, be as passionate of the Trail Blazers you will not!
Kaman was hitting jumpers
I don’t recall anything inside, and every time he took it to Greg inside he ended up passing it out instead of forcing a shot. Oden was forcing his up, on the other end, for a comparison.
Like in the highlights, that fadeaway jumper that Oden defends well but Kaman hits… he had his jumper going.
Hard to do much if a guy is hitting, and Kaman is a good player so I didn’t find it to be too bad. Oden was challenging, often after recovering from helping on a Baron penetration, and Kaman had the outside stroke down.
Joel was playing more aggressive defense, doing his nice blocks and what not.
Thornton’s length enables him to get his arms on crap, but he’s a dude who doesn’t use his body to impede anyone’s forward progress on defense, and since he hasn’t played for a good Clipper’s team, defense hasn’t been a requirement. He’s sorta their Outlaw, but less loveable. And 3-4 inches shorter. Lotsa jumpers, the occasional nice dunk, good athlete.
He’s already pretty old though. He came out in 2007 and was older than 4 year college player Roy, who came out the year before. Thornton is what he is, but his reputation is likely higher than his actual ability… plus he is mostly perceived as a young dude with potential, because it’s only his 3rd season.
Mortimer
I appreciate the effort you put into this Mort but Im not going to sugar coat it for you
It was a crappy report,Timbo could have done better
by southern oregon on Oct 10, 2009 11:46 PM PDT reply actions
I was trying to write the report how you would have done it
It looks like I was successful if it sucks.
It was all a Southern Oregon impersonation!
Morty
by Mortimer on Oct 11, 2009 1:05 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Mort, as I chow down on my Harvest Cheddar sun chips, I wonder… when will this team click? Will it click? Will there be an amazing optimization of talent where Andre is lobbing, Brandon is driving, Greg is o-reebing, LMA is beasting in the paint, and Nico is filling in all the gaps?
I think this is the fun of basketball. When it works, it’s so, so, so beautiful.
Why is it not October 27th yet?
"If the Lakers are Hollywood, then we are South Central." - Clipper fan.
Outstanding Piece Mr. Mort.
The 2 biggest stories of the pre season are Oden & Dre’
IMO you nailed the story on them both I tell ya! Andre IS such a big upgrade I don’t think most Bzer fans even realize it yet. Seriously, you have to see it to belive it. Same goes for Greg’s improvment over last year. No TV means no one really sees what you and I and just a few thousand others have seen up close and personal in the preseason.
Pryz and Blake are perfect fits on a chamionship team bench. That would our team’s bench.
Great stuff.
The Oden Era, Day 846
Thanks Morty!
Always like to hear what’s up when I cannot get it on the tube. At least I heard part of it on the radio. :)
your post was solid
your non-invite was LAME
by GreatOden'sRaven on Oct 12, 2009 1:12 PM PDT reply actions
I invited in the Junk Drawer!
Besides, ya don’t wanna hang around me right now. I’m a silly goose who is a Capt. Bringdown these days.
We’ll go to the next one, if you actually do wanna go to a game with me. Ah’ight, pardner?
Morty
Ha Ha
I was going to take my rec back because this post had too many recs. I couldn’t take it back because I didn’t rec it.
Mortimer=Stephen A. Smith

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