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I wondered if this might not be the case...

10 months ago Greg_oden_rally_dsc_2414_2007-06-29_-_version_3_square_tiny krollb 41 comments 0 recs  | 

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DOUBLE STANDARD
In denying the Blazers’ move to control Miles, NBA front-office sources say that league executives in New York denied the waiver claim because they believed the Blazers were merely trying to circumvent league salary cap rules.

How come Memphis is presumed to be acting in Good Faith when it comes to playing Darius for 2 or 5 minutes per game, but Portland is presumed to be messing with the salary cap rules!

That’s a bushleague double standard by the NBA. If Memphis or any other team can pick him off waivers, why can’t Portland say we need another SF in case Travis gets injured (since Martell is already down).

Now I hope there is a lawsuit by the Blazers for this bushleague crap.

by Bust a Bucket on Jan 13, 2009 12:07 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

lol

How come you assume the Blazers were acting in good faith when they had Darius medically retired, but Memphis is somehow just using him to hurt Portland’s cap space? Portland had more to gain from Darius being retired than Memphis had to gain from signing him.

That’s a double standard.

Maybe everyone is acting in good faith. Maybe everyone is acting in bad faith. At any rate, it’s impossible to determine motives (even if Paul Allen is a Vulcan) so there isn’t a whole lot anyone can do about it.

by Nick Van Excellent on Jan 13, 2009 12:14 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

exactly my point

since it’s impossible to determine motives, then the league shouldn’t allow Memphis to pick him up, but not Portland. Good faith? Bad faith? We can’t determine.

by Bust a Bucket on Jan 13, 2009 12:19 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

That's a good point.

But if Portland picked Miles off waivers and then never played him it would look soooooo bad. The league did the Blazers a favor.

by Nick Van Excellent on Jan 13, 2009 12:30 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Oh yeah, I agree

We are getting killed in the media war on this one. If we pick him up, and obviously don’t play him, we look like cheaters. If Memphis picks him up and plays him in a few games, they look like they might be cheating.

If we sue, we look like bullies. No matter what, it’s a no win situation for us.

by Bust a Bucket on Jan 13, 2009 12:47 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I completely agree.

I’m all for Larry Miller and the Trailblazers organization going after the NBA on this one. I won’t lie, I was a DMiles fan. I would love to see him play again but I’m also under the impression that his career is over. If not for injury because he’s way past his prime and he just can’t ball like he used to (unless he balloons up AKA Shawn Kemp and someone needs a big body). I can’t really believe that ANY team in the NBA would bring in Miles in order for him to make a difference this season. This isn’t Sam Cassell we’re talking about here. In fact, Boston tried this experiment and gave it the axe. I think that the rule in question (player getting in 10 games) should be for the SAME Team and not by playing in 5 minutes a game for 10 different teams. Overall, the league needs to take hard look at this before Paul Allen unleashes his team of lawyers against them and all the other owners in the league need to really take a look at their stash before trying to take on one of the worlds richest… Bottom line, Miles is most likely done, why make news out of this whole deal by dragging his name through the mud, just let him ride his bicycle into the sunset…

"I don't always know what I'm talking about but I know I'm right." - Muhammad Ali

by MoreJordan on Jan 13, 2009 12:16 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

You can tell it’s a fake.

He would of said, "I will slap you, then I will backhandedly slap you, then I will slap you again. And you will know that you were Pritch-Slapped."

GO
THE TEACHER ......come into my classroom "THE PAINT" for some tutelage.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"You could hurt somebody in the first row with a shot like that" -
Mike Rice, Portland at Denver 12/22/08

by Blazer1342 on Jan 13, 2009 12:23 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

My bad……….wrong thread.

GO
THE TEACHER ......come into my classroom "THE PAINT" for some tutelage.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"You could hurt somebody in the first row with a shot like that" -
Mike Rice, Portland at Denver 12/22/08

by Blazer1342 on Jan 13, 2009 12:30 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Wow, I must say that looks pretty desperate

The medical retirement looked like the right thing to do at this time, but front office and ownership seem not happy that they now lost the possibility to trade him AND the cap relief.

by Norsktroll on Jan 13, 2009 12:39 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

we won’t have huge cap space after this season, but possibly after next if we drop a bunch of guys and don’t replace them (Outlaw, Blake, etc.)

by Bust a Bucket on Jan 13, 2009 12:49 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

absolutely 100 percent incredible.

by Ben. on Jan 13, 2009 12:57 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

Get over it!

The Blazers were lucky just to get Miles declared medically retired. The Blazers signed him and if he can still play he should be on the books.

"Hightide was the only "Yes" vote" - parkinglotj

Joel Freeland=Stud

by hightide on Jan 13, 2009 1:22 AM PST reply actions   1 recs

but should he still be playing for the Blazers then???

Doctors, not Kevin Pritchard, decided he SHOULDN’T play anymore!

The Blazers get screwed in a way. If he was still our asset, we could trade him or play him. The Rules screwed us over.

by Bust a Bucket on Jan 13, 2009 1:31 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

To stay accurate, the Blazers filed for the retirement and started the evaluation process

No doctor approached the league and said “by the way, this Darius Miles guy can’t play anymore”.

by Norsktroll on Jan 13, 2009 1:35 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

If the Doctors were wrong

Then the right decision would have been to keep Darius or buy him out. Either way he is still on the books and not getting any PT… The only regret is KP can’t trade his contract.

"Hightide was the only "Yes" vote" - parkinglotj

Joel Freeland=Stud

by hightide on Jan 13, 2009 1:36 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

To be fair..

Doctors also decided he could play again. There were doctors from a number of teams who said they disagreed with his original diagnoses and cleared him to play, including the Boston Celtics medical staff.

by Nick Van Excellent on Jan 13, 2009 1:58 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Are you sure of this?

My understanding was Miles did not require any clearance and did not do so.

hakkaa päälle !

by timg56 on Jan 13, 2009 8:42 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I remember...

Doc Rivers talking about it on real training camp after he was asked what he thought about the league appointed Doctors decision. He responded by saying something like, well we had our Doctors look at Miles and they say he can play.

by Nick Van Excellent on Jan 13, 2009 12:53 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

The way I described it on the radio the other day

was that this was like getting a huge Christmas bonus based on a big sale you made. You were going to use it to pay off your debts and then maybe get a new motorcycle or something. Then it turns out before Christmas that the sale doesn’t actually go through even though it was agreed to. The purchasing company went insolvent or got driven out of business or something. You can’t very well expect that Christmas bonus still, can you?

It’s a bummer, it sucks, but stuff happens. You just have to go back to paying off your debts the regular way and then get the motorcycle later.

—Dave

by Dave on Jan 13, 2009 1:42 AM PST up reply actions   1 recs

I must have zoned out

and missed your analogy, Gavin Dawson and Casey Holdahl can do that to me.

"Hightide was the only "Yes" vote" - parkinglotj

Joel Freeland=Stud

by hightide on Jan 13, 2009 1:46 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

yeah its more like the company paid on net 30, went out of business before the month was up, liquidated your goods to a competitor, then your company didn’t get any of the compensation from the liquidation.

and you didn’t get your bonus.

maybe?

by Ben. on Jan 13, 2009 1:59 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

to be completely fair

The Blazers should be able to trade Miles’ contract. But the Blazers knew what they were getting into when they applied to get Miles declared medically retired and thought it was worth the risk.

"Hightide was the only "Yes" vote" - parkinglotj

Joel Freeland=Stud

by hightide on Jan 13, 2009 2:09 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

was just trying to extend the simile. wasnt saying thats my take on things.

by Ben. on Jan 13, 2009 2:13 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

wrong... the risk was assumed to be 0%

in the history of medical retirements, 0 players have come back from them.

the Blazers rightfully assumed that if the doctors said “medical retirement” then there was a 0% chance of the person coming back.

if they read the CBA rules, perhaps they could have found a risk in the rules, but there was no risk based on history and assumptions of the process.

by Bust a Bucket on Jan 13, 2009 2:16 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

not good at all

The most hated Blazer is like the least hottest supermodel - Sabonis4Ever

by Philthyanimal on Jan 13, 2009 6:03 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

It's a Duck. And, it's the NBA

The bottom line is that the league has a procedure to determine if a player is medically unfit to play. But they don’t enforce it. There’d be no issue here if they did. This is not a “Blazer” problem, but a problem with the NBA and the Players Association. It’s their job to follow through with the player – not the Blazers. What this poorly drafted rule does is put the team with the player in a no-win situation. Once that ruling is made, the entire issue falls into the twilight zone “if the player” refuses to accept the NBA and Players Association ruling, and still wants to play. – precisely because the NBA equivocates and offers a road back if other GM’s want to provide that road. Which in turn, enables them to control what happens to the cap space of the team that has the player. No wonder it’s become controversial. Of course, people’s motives will be questioned. What does the NBA expect?

The issue is, after all, “what are they doing permitting him to play?” It was their doctors and their ruling – and that ruling stated that he had suffered a career ending injury. From the outset, this debate has been focussed on the wrong issue.

The Blazers are simply a victim. Once that ruling was made, they had three options. One was to keep him – but Darius wanted to play – and the Blazers had to confront the ethical and possible legal ramifications of letting him play for the Blazers. At the same time, the ruling completely destroyed his trade value. No one was going to touch him – as we’ve seen. All they’ve done is given him minimum non guaranteed contracts and taken a look – nothing more. Further, they put clauses in that protected them from liability in the case he was reinjured.

So, the Blazers medically retired him and released him.

Now the bottom line from where I sit is that the league should not even have a “10 game ruling” related to the Blazers cap space. That’s positiviely silly. They say on the one hand that the player has suffered a career ending injury, but on the other, they leave the door open for the player to actually “suffer” that injury and refuse to close it. Further, that 10 day ruling sets up all the controversy with the other teams. This isn’t an issue of what “Darius” wants. It’s an issue of other GM’s being able to dance around the 10 day ruling whose end result will be to damage the Blazers – while pretending that they’re actually giving the poor kid another shot – which makes them the good guy.

It’s a bad rule, poorly thought out, and rarely tested. All we’re seeing today is the end result of what happens in this set of unique circumstances.

The Blazers should, in fact, challenge this ruling. It makes no rational sense. If the NBA determines that a player has suffered a career ending injury – then that player should come off the teams cap space – period. Further, they should never set up a condition where other GM’s can affect the Blazers cap space by manipulating their rosters.

If it looks like duck, walks like a duck, and acts like a ducks, it’s probably a duck. And that is exactly what’s happening with the other GM’s right now. They can hide behind the rule and damage the Blazers. Because its the rule.

by Eben Calder on Jan 13, 2009 6:28 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

exactly

There only two logical way to handle a medical retirement in terms of the salary cap:

1) the 10 day rule shluld never be in there. Once the league and PA doctor’s agree on the medical retiement (and they shud be darn sure, right?), then it should be case closed as far as the contract affecting the cap goes. The player is still free to try and return later (except with the same team), and the original team has the new capspace to replace said player

OR

2) There should be no provision for freeing up the capspace at all.

  1. obviously potentially sucks, but at least the team knows where it stands and can plan accordingly.

Rule #1 of nitpicking is to get it right.

by douglast on Jan 13, 2009 9:55 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

By the way, I happen to think that the Blazers attempt to claim Miles off of waivers was part of a legal stragegy. This move further backs the NBA into a corner. Watch an learn. This is in the very early stages – and the game is a little more subtle than you might think. Stern knows it. He’s got a poor rule, and the effect of the rule is to always damage the team that has the player that is ruled medically unfit to play. This rule has to be changed.

by Eben Calder on Jan 13, 2009 6:33 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

I absolutely agree
By the way, I happen to think that the Blazers attempt to claim Miles off of waivers was part of a legal stragegy.

I’ve posted this as well.

The email was part of this also.

The Blazers knew the league would block this on “intent” grounds.

They then sent an email warning against signing Miles for wrong purposes.

If Miles only plays 2-3 more games, they can claim that Memphis did this with bad “intent”, and appeal for salary cap relief. The league, by blocking the Blazers, cannot claim, “Oh, it’s not our place to judge Memphis’ intent.” That ship sailed when they blocked Portland because they judged Portland’s motives.

If the league ends up ruling that Darius is able to play, based on ten games, Portland can claim to have been damaged by an erroneous opinion from a league-appointed doctor. Portland no longer has the services of a player who is able to play after all, nor an expiring contract of high value next year, nor cap relief — all because the league-appointed doctor messed up. Portland has been damaged by that league-appointed doctor. (I’m not saying we wanted the services of that player or his expiring contract, but that will be the claim.)

This one still has a ways to run, I think.

I know you can put admiration in bags, because admiration is real, and tominhawaii says that everything that is real is measurable.

by jscot on Jan 13, 2009 8:09 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I'm thinking a key development will be not whether the rule gets changed ....

 … but whether the Blazer’s get a ruling on cap relief.

I can see the possibility of the rule being re-written. Whether or not that will benefit Portland after the fact is still undetermineable. I can see the league saying “Thanks a bunch for pointing out this poorly written rule.” “Too bad though we didn’t change it before you had to make use of it.”

hakkaa päälle !

by timg56 on Jan 13, 2009 9:02 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

"The game is a little more subtle than you might think"

Perfect. Do you have a legal background?

That’s what fascinates me about this situation. The game that is being played out in the press is nothing compared to the game that’s being played behind closed doors. It’s the old checkers/chess analogy, and then some.

by Corvid on Jan 13, 2009 11:36 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

One thing I am pretty sure of

The word has gotten around the NBA league office and various team offices to watch what you say in e-mails on a non e-mail back channel,as Bush found if they can come back to haunt you and are hard to hide

by southern oregon on Jan 13, 2009 1:23 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

 man, this is going to be made into a movie if portland comes out on top in all this!

by 2phattoplay on Jan 13, 2009 2:03 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

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