Blazer's Edge: An SB Nation Community

Navigation: Jump to content areas:



Around SBN: Recapping Granger's Desert Dagger Bar-right-arrows



Final piece candidates

With all these trade propositions lets get an idea of who we want to target first before we go throwing out wild trade proposals and we have 10 fanposts like "TRADE IDEAS ZACH BACK TO PDX??"

I say we use this fanpost to first debate what this team needs first and then how to get it later.

Our current  team as constructed is hopefully going to dominate the NBA soon. We have strength across the board and pieces that fit very well together. However as it currently stands, many feel that we need one final piece to complete this team and go from a good team to a great team. The great thing about our situation is that we do not need a player that can score 50ppg so he should be easier to acquire than a star as we have 3 already.

IMO, we are set at the C, PF, and SG positions as it stands and I have confidence that our PG situation will work itself out as well as we have the right mix of experience, scoring, defense and playmaking, and someone should rise to the occasion.

However it is at SF where I see the possibility of adding the final piece. Our current combo of Webster, TO and Batum show promise but I feel that they this is one area that we have the greatest need and therefore I feel that the most logical improvement to the team is to get a starting, defensive oriented, 3pt shooting SF to complete our team.

TO may never be the greatest on ball defender but I feel that what he will be able to bring to the 2nd team will be enough for him to carve out an important role on our team, ala the scorer/sparkplug off the bench with Rudy.

First off, let me say that, while starting is an honor, it is not indicative of talent, but rather of fit. We all know that Roy, LMA and Oden are going to start but it is who fits best around them and allows them to shine whi is going to get to start, however much like last year the starters are not nessicarily the best players on the team as Blake and Pryz were ofen pulled in tight games in the 4th Q.

I do not feel that TO will ever be the starter per say, but as stated above, I do not think it matters as much on this team as it does on other teams. TO will probably come off the bench but will still play important minutes at SF in the 4th Q and will be highly valued on the team. I just hope Travis sees it the same way.

Webster on the other hand is the current starting SF and I feel that he has the most to prove in this upcoming season. First off he needs to learn to get up and play hard at all times. Too mane times I have seen him drive on the offensive side and go up for a shot and coming down in a heap with no basket. Instead of sitting and pouting about the no call, he needs to get back and defend his man that is not on the opposite FT line and is attacking his hoop with him still on the baseline with the ref. Secondly, he needs to learn to lock down on his opposing player and defend him at all costs. Lastly, he needs to hit 40+% on his 3pt shot and creat a viable threat to open up the court for Roy, LMA and Oden to work in the paint.

I have gone on record many times in saying that on a per 36 min basis, only 3 younger players that were here in 06 did not improve markedly and those were Jack, Sergio, and Webster. Jack is gone, Sergio is on thin ice, yet Webster has not had much attention shown to his progression. Roy, LMA and TO all posted improvements in their per 36min stats and even though TO has been in the league for 2 more years, in terms of PT he has only about 700mins more in those 2 years, making them similar in NBA age.

I do not mean to be hard on Webster but rather will be watching him closely for signs of improvement.

With that said, for me the only logical final pieces that would work on this team would have to be a starting SF that would feel comfortable with allowing the big 3 to shine, while providing high efficency, outstanding D and outside shooting. To me the most logical players that should be our final piece are:

 

1. Tayshaun Prince

Prince_medium

via www.givemetherock.com

 

Overview: A ridiculously long wing, who has surprising athleticism and a fairly polished perimeter game. Owner of a 7-2 wingspan. Very much on the skinny side. Hasn’t gained much weight since entering the League, but it hasn’t hurt his play. Shows surprising quickness and speed in the open floor. Quickness, length and skill combination allow his to be an impact player on both ends. Shows great intensity on the defensive end. Named to the NBA All-Defensive Second team in 2005 and 2006. Has an unorthodox left-handed stroke, but has developed into a nice offensive weapon. Very durable and tough despite his frame. One of the most versatile talents in the game today. Has a winning attitude, which he fostered at Kentucky under Tubby Smith after winning two state titles at Dominguez HS in Compton, California. Helped the Pistons win the NBA Championship in 2004. Cousin JP Prince plays at Tennessee.

Offense: Extremely versatile offensive player due to his height and relative length for his position. Scores in numerous ways. Capable of spotting up on the outside, running the floor in transition, taking his man one-on-one, and working over smaller defenders in the post. Interesting shooting mechanics. Keeps his elbows extremely wide and lets the ball fly from his shoulder. Tough to argue with the results. Mechanics make his shot almost impossible to block. Great shot selection. Accurate from three point range. Capable shooter off the dribble. Likes to pull up going left. Tough to guard off the dribble due to his length and deceptive first step. Good ball handler. Nice post game. Turns right to the point that he’s very predictable. Will get some easy looks from in close by working off the ball. Very high basketball IQ on the offensive end. Has improved significantly over the last few years. Great complimentary offensive player.

Defense: Detroit’s best and most versatile perimeter defender. Perhaps the second most important player on the team defensively behind Rasheed Wallace. Draws the toughest perimeter assignment in most cases. Length allows him to contest absolutely every shot. Wingspan allows him play off his man and still get a hand up on everything. Deceptive quickness helps him deny penetration. Looks impossible to drive around when he gets in his defensive stance. Deflects a lot of passes. Can guard three positions. Not an ideal post defender due to his size, but he fights for position. Standing reach makes him tough to shoot over when he goes straight up. Decent rebounder. Great shot blocker who prefers to try and negate fast breaks and easy layups. Not a risk taker in the half court. Makes an impact on his physical assets alone.

 

One of the ultimate glue players, Prince would be the GREATEST addition to this team I could imagine. He could come in and provide us that veteran leadership along with Blake and Pryz and could defend the opposing teams best perimiter offensive threat. His age is by far the closest to what we are looking for and has just enough left in the tank so that he should be able to last for our championship runs. He is used to deferring scoring and individual accomplishment for team success.  How we would get him without giving up one of the big 3 I do not know, but if KP could somehow facilitate a trade to get him I will personally carve a statue of him in front of the Rose Garden out of a tree. The only way may be using a 3rd team as an intermediary using RLEC, Diogu, a few 1sts and Webster to move a star to Det and we get Prince in return.

 

2. Shane Battier

340x_medium

via cache.daylife.com

Overview: The ultimate role player who is capable of doing a little bit of everything. Plays the 3 and the 4 effectively. Has good size and strength, but lacks ideal quickness and explosiveness. Arguably the most fundamentally sound player in the League. Can score in a variety of ways, but functions primarily as a jump shooter. Isn’t a one-on-one player and tries to score by playing his role in an offense rather than asserting himself unnecessarily. Might be the best defensive forward in the NBA. Does the little things. Extremely high basketball IQ. A coach’s dream. Has been a winner since his youth, garnering the Naismith award as a senior at Detroit Country Day high school and the Wooden Award as a senior at Duke. Possesses great leadership skills. Comes through when it counts. Becomes an extremely valuable asset to the Rockets when he is knocking down his perimeter shots. Plays a ton of minutes.

Offense: Extremely sound and efficiency offensive player. Gets more than half of his offense as a spot up shooter. Very good in that role. Will hit shots from three point range with very good consistency—most of his shots come from behind the arc. Never takes a shot without his feet set. Very selective. Very predictable off the dribble. Tends to go to the rim when he drives right and pull up when he drives left. Won’t assert himself off the dribble very often. Great finisher at the rim despite his lack of athleticism. Knows how to use fakes and protect the ball with his body to finisher with contact. Could should a better percentage from the foul line, although he rarely gets there. Passable ball handler. Good offensive rebounder. Great passer. Not turnover prone. The ideal system role player. Scores all his points in the flow of the offense. Doesn’t do anything outside of himself.

Defense: Probably the most fundamentally sound defender in the game. Won’t reach unless he knows he’ll get enough of the ball to keep the play in front of him. Not afraid to get on the floor to grab loose balls. Gets in a good stance and moves his feet. Will block shots just by maintaining good position. Always gets his hands up on shooters. Understands the nuances of contesting shots. Great help side defender. Always knows his rotations and will slide over to protect the basket when his teammates get beat off the dribble. Loves to try and take charges. Calls don’t always go his way. Will commit smart fouls at the rim when he knows a player isn’t good from the line. Great defensive intangibles. Amazing awareness.

 

Battier would be a welcome addition to the Blazers lineup. A better shooter than Prince and Marion from 3 and a great defender as well. Prince and Battier ran neck and neck for the first position, but in the end the extra youth of Prince won out. Battier would hopefully be able to teach our young team even more veteran tricks and improve our team tremendously.

 

3. Shawn Marion

Suns23_resize_medium

via www.bballone.com


 

Overview: One of the most athletic players the NBA has to offer. Incredibly versatile. Rebounds, defends, scores points, is lethal in transition, and was an outstanding compliment to Steve Nash until he basically forced his way out of Phoenix. Possesses endless amounts of energy, and seemingly never leaves the floor. Most effective at the power forward position, despite standing just 6-7. Has a great wingspan. Struggles to come to copes with what he is—which is one of the best role players in the NBA. Extremely well compensated over the years, but has always transmitted a sense that he is getting the short end of the stick. Will his game hold up as his athleticism begins to decline?

Offense: Very adept at moving off the ball and finding spots to receive a pass and explode for a finish. Doesn’t miss around the basket. Runs the floor like a deer. A great target for lobs. Has one of the league’s most awkward shooting forms—flings the ball at the rim from well in front of his chest, but sees decent (although not incredible) results as a spot-up shooter. Somewhat limited offensively--needs a great point guard to create shots for him. Lacks the ball-handling skills needed to create his own shot or pull-up off the dribble. Doesn’t always seem to know his limitations. Relies very heavily on his athleticism to make plays, which worked extremely well for him playing next to Steve Nash. Decision making can be poor at times.

Defense: Extremely active and very effective thanks to his superb physical tools. Has excellent lateral quickness and recovery speed, but is also very strong for a player his size. Capable of defending multiple positions on the floor, either on the perimeter or battling inside. Very good at getting in the passing lanes and igniting fast breaks. Also an excellent shot-blocker thanks to his superb length, timing and explosiveness. A very good rebounder as well on both ends of the floor. Has a tendency to get lost at times, misplacing his man, rotating to the wrong spots, overextending himself, and gambling excessively. Will get beat at times, or even a take a play off.

 

Marion would be a wildcard, as there are some possible attitude problems, but Nates Beijing frind, D'Antoni will be able to tell him the indide goods on whether or not he would work with us. He is an amazing defender and rebounder and would fit in well backed up by LMA and Oden. Hopefully as he has aged, he will realize what he can and cannot do and will be more accepting of a lesser role. His age is of some concern, however he is quite possibly the best athlete in the  NBA right now and even if he tapers off, he has so far to fall, he should be performing at a level higher than most others by the time his contract is up with us and we can decide on him from there. He will also be the easiest to acquire as he is a UFA next year and we should have enough to sign him as well.

 

4. Ime Udoka

Udokapsu_medium

via blog.oregonlive.com


 

Overview: A quality backup small forward who does the little things to help his team. Solid size and strength on the wing. Owns a big wingspan. Runs the floor well, but is an average athlete overall. Has the skills to be a very good role player. Good shooting stroke from the outside. Rebounds pretty well on both ends. Takes care of the ball, which is key for a rotation player getting limited minutes on a good team. Plays tough defense. Plays under control, but always hustles. Spent time at Eastern Utah, San Francisco, and finally Portland State during his college career. Has played all over the world. A very good player in the NBADL. Needed quite a bit of time to polish his game. Turned a good season with the Trailblazers into a deal with the Spurs. Sister Mfon played in the WNBA.

Offense: A versatile offensive player who provides a nice situational presence. Gets more than half of his offensive in spot up situations. Displays a smooth jumper with decent range. Good catch and shooter player from the midrange. Knocks downs shots off the dribble at a good clip. Not a very good ball-handler. Almost exclusively drives right. Rarely gets to the free throw line. Moves well without the ball and does a good job rotating the ball on the perimeter. Not turnover prone. Finishes at the rim at a good clip. Does a good job getting out on the wing in transition and finishing when he receives lead passes. Not a dynamic presence on the floor, but an effective option in limited minutes.

Defense: A solid defender who makes an impact in his time on the floor. Won’t back down from any matchup. Will physically defend ball handlers make an effort to contest shots. Doesn’t have great lateral quickness at the 2 or great size at the 3, but makes hustle plays. Will get beat off the dribble at times, but is a very aware team defender. Will get on the floor to secure loose balls. Uses his length and athleticism to collect steals and deflect passes. Brings a lot to the table in limited minutes.

What else do I need to say? Its Ime and he is a UFA next year, so maybe KP knew what he was doing when he let him go, only to sign him later when we may need him.

To me those are the only players that would be wiling to go after as other players have too many problems or do not fit a need as well as those listed above. Those include:

Andrei Kirilenko: Would be great but his contract is as bad a Zach's, culminating with $17,822,187 in 2010-11. We would also be helping out a dreaded rival in unloading one of their most horrible contracts which they should have to pay every penny of for giving him that deal.

Josh Smith: Great D'er but is a bit of a head case and has NO outside shot to speak of 25% fro 3pt.

Danny Granger: Great on the offensive end, but too good IMO. He would not want to be 4th fiddle from what I have seen and he has the ability to be the #1 option. His D is OK but would not be as good as the above and he would be VERY expensive.

I am interested in who the populous thinks is the  final piece, perhaps when the year is done Webster has come on and has proved that he can be the final piece. Or Bayless becomes a complete bust and we are on the look out for a new PG when the year is over. Right now we have quite a few good assets available for trade that we can use at our disposal, RLEC, Diogu, Webster, Frye, TO and cap space next year. Hopefully a combo of these assets will lead us to one of the above listed players. I do not want to get into trade proposals in this fanpost, rather come to a general consensus on who we should go after.

 

So I pose this question to you fine BlazerEdge denziens:

 

Who do you think that final piece is?

Poll
Whi is that final piece?
Tayshaun Prince
187 votes
Shane Battier
63 votes
Shaun Marion
12 votes
Ime Udoka
26 votes
Other SF
32 votes
Other PG
17 votes
Just other player, coach etc.
14 votes

351 votes | Poll has closed

10 recs | Comment 122 comments

Story-email Email Printer Print

Comments

Display:

The Blazers are most in need of zero turnover

Keeping the players they have is the biggest problem (I wonder about Aldridge and Bayless).

Also, as for your 5 position breakdown, great teams have three top players, bad teams have more or less than 3 top players. Guys like Outlaw, Fernandez, and Bayless are tremendous luxuries. Frankly the Blazers roster from top to bottom is way too talented and the ship might burst at the seams.

by 0004248939 on Sep 8, 2008 8:39 PM PDT   0 recs

Well all of this is pretty much academic until about the trade deadline anyways.

Who knows maybe Webster can show enough this year that he can become that type of player. I’m not holding my breath too hard that he can but he may surprise me in the end and that would be the best and easiest thing in the long run, but I’ve said before, I’m hopefully pessimistic in that I do not think it will happen but I hope it will.

The next 40-45 games of Websters career will set him on a path that will lead to a championship or a ticket out of town. I will be watching to see which one he chooses.

The season cannot get here soon enough.

by SpyderRyder on Sep 8, 2008 10:47 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

This is why we can shed Outlaw

and possibly even Frye or Pryz. This frees up contract space and brings in a valuable piece in the form of a wing defender (I vote Prince)

--

by CaptainSexyJacob on Sep 9, 2008 3:02 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Tayshaun Prince

I would vote more if I could.

Prince fills nearly every need we have at small forward. Ideally, a 40% 3pt shooter would be preferred but a career and last season average of 36% isn’t too shabby considering all his other talents. He has been to the EC finals every year he has been in the league. I think everything else I could say has been covered in the main post.

Devil's Advocate or just argumentative?

by Magnum on Sep 8, 2008 9:08 PM PDT   0 recs

I tried my hand at the trade machine

Prince for Webster, Frye, Sergio=
Prince for Outlaw, Frye, Sergio=
Prince for Pryz and Webster=
Prince for Pryz and Outlaw=

I have a feeling that the trades that include Pryzbilla are probably more desirable for Detroit, because they’re going to need a center since Rasheed and McDyess are both over the hill. Also, Outlaw has more value than Martell trade-wise. So I would have to reluctantly say the deal that is most likely (of the 4 I made) to get the job done is the one we are least likely to want.

Devil's Advocate or just argumentative?

by Magnum on Sep 8, 2008 9:25 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I would probably go for the 3rd one.

As much as I like Joel, I see that using a 3 man rotation with Oden, Frye and LMA would be possibly better, keeping Frye more involved with 25-30mpg, Oden and LMA going 30-35mpg, with Hill or some scrub cleaning up the rest of the minutes.

It sucks because I like Joel but he may be a bit redundant and if we can move him and Webster for Prince and maybe like a highly protected 1st (top 25 in 09, top 20 in 10, top 20 in 11 and unprotected in 12) so that we could get a possible lotto down the road.

The season cannot get here soon enough.

by SpyderRyder on Sep 8, 2008 10:53 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Umm, what happens if Oden gets hurt?

We find our team has ZERO true centers – or were planning on keeping RLEC?

Pryz stays.

This is another exercise in solving a problem that might not exist.

LMA>LA!
LMA's reign as "LaMonster of the Low Post" has just begun!

by LaMarvelous on Sep 9, 2008 8:36 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Pryz may be the only

player that he wants in combo with Webster. Diogu, Webster and Sergio for Prince would get laughed out of the league. The only C Det has is Kwame and if we can use Pryz to get Prince than I may be for it.

You cannot use the “What is ____ gets injured” as injuries can happen at any time to anyone regardless. LMA and Frye would be suitable replacements until Oden returned and thinking that Oden will get hurt is a bit defeatist IMO.

But the time Pryz gets traded A) Oden will have at least 40-45 games under his belt to determine whether he can stay healthy and is ready to start to dominate B)it will be in the offseason when Joels future with the team is murky with the emergence of Oden, LMA and Frye as better offensive threats than Joel.

don;t get me wrong I love Joel but I think that he would be worth sacrificing to get Prince.

Let me ask you this, if Joe Dumars called you up and said “I will give you Prince and a 10 1st for Webster and Pryzbilla and a 09 2nd” would you turn that down? Nobody here would.

The season cannot get here soon enough.

by SpyderRyder on Sep 9, 2008 9:16 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Too bad you weren't running the lakers in 1999

When, despite having no centers other than Shaq and Elden Campbell (who was a center as much as Lamarcus is a center), they traded Campbell to the hornets for Glen Rice, who promptly went on to start for a championship winning Laker team.

Or the heat in 2004, who managed to trade away their only 2 guys who could play SF (Butler and Odom) to get a center. That also ended in a championship.

Or, the all-time best one, strangely enough also involving Shaq, Jerry West somehow summoning up the courage to trade Vlade Divac for the draft rights to Kobe Bryant, despite that leaving only Shaq as the only true center and Campbell as a tweener. Another one that has seemed to work out pretty well.

If you don’t want to trade Pryz because he’s a hard worker, high character guy, I’d understand that. Or maybe you think Webster/TO are about to explode would be another valid, but this Oden nonsense is ridiculousAt the end of the day, there’s no way that Pryzbila would contribute more than Prince would to a winning Blazer team. Good GMs understand that in the nba, you have to maximize your assets with regards to their ability to play together. I’d love if we kept him because I really like the guy, but Pryz is a luxury right now. We have potentially the most dominant center in at least a decade on the roster and people consider his backup untouchable?

With that logic, Vujacic, Gasol, Pargo (last year), Foyle, Devin Brown, Diaw, Antonio Daniels. and Brandon Bass should all fall under the untradeable blanket, too, since if Kobe, Bynum, CP, Howard, Lebron, Amare, Arenas, or Dirk get hurt, their team has no other “true” players at those positions.

Sounds a little more ridiculous when you look at it from another team’s point of view.

by Royster on Sep 9, 2008 10:27 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

with the one exception

that we don’t want to trade away Pryz until Oden shows us on the court that he is as good as we all hope. I’d hate to make that deal in December and have Oden, somehow, only be a 10 and 8 guy with a history of injuries.

Devil's Advocate or just argumentative?

by Magnum on Sep 9, 2008 11:45 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Yeah

Pryz isn’t going anywhere until AT LEAST the trade deadline.

1. We need him to allow Oden to grow into his position
2. He probably wont be moved during the season as why would Det give up their starting SF with tons of playoff experience when they are right in the midst of the EC playoff seeding race? Unless Det totally bombs and there is no hope of them getting in to the playoffs, Det will not move Prince during the season. I can see them wanting a D minded big like Pryz, but Sheed can hold the fort well enough for them @ C.

Of course if sheed is moved, all bets are off, but most likely, if there is a Prince trade it will be because Det got swept or bounced early and Dumars goes into full on firesale mode. Sheed is in the last year of his deal and who knows if he will be back and that bodes well for us, with them needing a big, Greg having a full year under his belt and with Det being blown up, Prince may be able to be had for Webs, Pryz and maybe a pick or 2. What we need is this:

1. Det to get bounced early
2. Have them not resign Sheed
3. Go into full on fire sale mode
4. Greg to stay healthy and dominate at the end of the year

Only if those things happen will we have a shot at Prince.

The season cannot get here soon enough.

by SpyderRyder on Sep 10, 2008 12:28 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

And then

we could pick up a backup center in the draft or by trade or by free agency. If Oden is all we hope him to be, we don’t need a great backup.

I’m not sure I want this to happen, but it could. No guarantees Joel will be with us long term.

The most amazing thing about my amazing ego is I have amazingly little about which to be egotistical.

by jscot on Sep 10, 2008 2:05 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I'd go any of them

Sure, number 1 and 2 are expensive, but our starting rotation would be set and we’d consolidate a bit of talent. We’d be better off in the long run, IMO.

Witty Unpredictable Talent and Natural Game

by iDea on Sep 9, 2008 6:59 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I think

You should try Outlaw,Sergio and Diogu I did and it worked for me

by billyjoejack on Sep 9, 2008 5:50 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

and..

plus what though? dumars isnt making that trade…

by danevan on Sep 9, 2008 7:24 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

its not like their are going out and shopping anyway

This was all just what ifs anyway. I Honestly like the team we have now and believe in two years the players we have can make a run for the title.

by billyjoejack on Sep 9, 2008 7:56 PM PDT to parent up   1 recs

+10

LMA>LA!
LMA's reign as "LaMonster of the Low Post" has just begun!

by LaMarvelous on Sep 9, 2008 8:37 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Also

You could offer Pat Riley Outlaw,Sergio and RLEC for Marion that trade also works on trade mach. And danevan no big deal if dumars don’t want to make that trade we keep our three players. and tell dumars see ya in the Finails in two years with what we have.

by billyjoejack on Sep 9, 2008 7:50 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Why do that when we can sign him next year as a FA?

Mia will not resign him as they woud rather go after Boozer and not spend $10-15mill on 5 more years of Marion when they can sign a big name FA in 09 and then will resign Wade in 10.

The season cannot get here soon enough.

by SpyderRyder on Sep 9, 2008 9:04 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

If we get Prince

for Pryz and Outlaw I say do that deal. I would only do your bottom two.

This team needs a top notch defender. Prince can raise havoc on the outside, against anyone you put him on. I love that guy. Battier, Udoka and Marion… Too old.

by lethaldose on Sep 8, 2008 9:44 PM PDT   0 recs

I went through these exact trades in my head

a few days ago! I’m glad I’m not crazy about my Tayshaun-Prince-to-Portland desires. Outlaw and Pryz seems reasonable to me IF we can secure a backup center in the case of Oden having an injury… (knock, knock, knock)…

--

by CaptainSexyJacob on Sep 8, 2008 10:17 PM PDT   0 recs

Childress

can opt out of euro contract next year, still RFA, but could likely be signed by the Blazers.

by BrailleTaser on Sep 8, 2008 10:19 PM PDT   0 recs

I was gonna put him like about 5th or so

but was feeling lazy. Hopefully he will come cheap as Atl will not want him after all he put them through and we can grab him for an expiring and maybe a 1st or something. Diogu and a ’10 1st?

The season cannot get here soon enough.

by SpyderRyder on Sep 8, 2008 10:30 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

have we gotten any word

on if they have renounced his rights so they can get cap relief at least?

Life is exhausting when you are this stupid.

by jonestr on Sep 9, 2008 12:48 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

No, they will make him a QO every year to keep his rights

Odenied: Asked whether he noticed Oden favoring his right knee, Frye dismissed it entirely. "He favors dunking on your head, that's what he favors."

by Norsktroll on Sep 9, 2008 2:38 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

is that speculation

or do you have a link?

Life is exhausting when you are this stupid.

by jonestr on Sep 9, 2008 7:55 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

A mix. Let's say a speculation you can take to the bank ;-)

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/columns/story?columnist=sheridan_chris&page=HawksChildress-080723

His agent, Lon Babby, said Childress will have the opportunity to opt out of his contract each of the next two summers without having to pay a buyout, though the Hawks can maintain his NBA rights and keep him a restricted free agent in perpetuity as long as they tender him a qualifying offer each summer.

There also was a report that the GM and ownership group of the Hawks intends to do exactly that. Why shouldn’t they? They wanted to have Childress at least as a sixth man, just not at this price. No need to let a #6 pick walk free to another NBA team. And they can: Atlanta will be far under the cap next year with the expiring Bibby contract and Josh Smith re-signed for pretty cheap. The cap hold for the Childress QO is no real problem for them.

NBA teams usually even keep the rights to players long retired to keep them from pulling a Brett Favre move and other things, until they really really need the cap space. Philly this year waived guys not needed anymore or even retired ten years ago to scratch together all the cap space they could get for Elton Brand. Similar with the Clippers.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?page=PlayerMovement-2008-09
Philadelphia, RENOUNCED: Louis Amundson, Micheal Bradley, Alan Henderson, Herbert Hill, Rick Mahorn, Derrick McKey, Kevin Ollie, Shavlik Randolph, Rodney Rogers
Clippers, RENOUNCED: Shaun Livingston, Dan Dickau, Boniface Ndong, Smush Parker, James Singleton, Marcus Williams, Quinton Ross, Nick Fazekas

Unless ATL plans a major major move next year or in 2010, they will keep Childress’ rights until he rusts in Europe or wants to come back. They won’t give him up for free.

Odenied: Asked whether he noticed Oden favoring his right knee, Frye dismissed it entirely. "He favors dunking on your head, that's what he favors."

by Norsktroll on Sep 9, 2008 8:23 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

maybe

he will still count at 300% of his last salary which would be well over 10 million.

Life is exhausting when you are this stupid.

by jonestr on Sep 9, 2008 5:09 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Great post by the way.

Superb, with great visuals.

--

by CaptainSexyJacob on Sep 8, 2008 10:20 PM PDT   0 recs

I have loved Tayshaun so much ever since he did

THIS to Reggie Miller in the playoffs that one year.

"I think that the team that wins game five will win the series. Unless we lose game five."
Who else? Charles Barkley

by prezofdeath on Sep 8, 2008 10:23 PM PDT   0 recs

Beautiful!

I like Prince’s little stutter-step as he times his leap appropriately. Sheer beauty.

by DonkeyShins on Sep 10, 2008 9:45 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Not sure if we're allowed to mention his name because

gasp he admitted to smoking reefer, but I’d throw Josh Howard in the mix. Versatile, real active defender, decent shooter, young, and a relatively upstanding guy (involved in politics, spoke out against the war). I don’t hold it against him that he has the courage to speak the truth about his choices (I do blame him for answering questions about it in the middle of the playoffs, but that’s not so much a character thing in my eyes).

That being said, Tayshaun is really the only choice here, maybe Childress. He literally fits every single need we’re looking for from the 3-spot. The other guys would be great in the short run, although at this point, I’m not sure Ime is even an upgrade over Webster, but, realistically, we’re probably not winning titles in the next couple years, so it’s probably worth sticking with Webster/TO and seeing if they can put it together unless we can get one of the three guys I mentioned above.

by Royster on Sep 8, 2008 10:40 PM PDT   0 recs

great clip....

What a key moment. Winning a game with defense (like Oden vs tennessee). That play says alot about his intensity and hustle. and what he could provide to the team……….Prince, Aldridge, Oden could be the best defensive backcourt in the league. Even just based off physical prowess. Tall quick guys are tough to score against…With that front line, I think everybody has about 9 foot reach. Oden and 9’4, aldridge 9’2. Pretty sure Prince is right up there also….
A line up like that, with Roy directing. Possibly with Rudy running around creating havoc, pressuring passing lanes, Or bayless using his death stare on quick guys like cp3/parker.. We could have the best defensive team in the league….The only extra piece beyond that might be a Lindsay Hunter type, you know when he was in his prime..man, that guy could pressure the hell out of point guards, I wish we had that…..but who knows maybe bayless evolves, hard to say….
..
Also, great post. Think you hit it on the head…But if Marion didnt have the ego issues, I’d move him to number two on that list….having oden and marion would be like having two of the top 4 athletic specimins in the game….that list in short order. Lebron, Oden, Amare, Marion….Tmac and Kobe used to be up there but are getting older…….

If Marion put all his effort into defense, a front court line up of Marion, Aldridge, Oden would demolish teams…it would be like 65-70point affairs. Like the pistons. Just absurd.

by BroyTheTruth on Sep 8, 2008 10:59 PM PDT   0 recs

The thing about Prince is

that he will probably be the hardest/most expensive to get as well. The list is kinda a decending order of difficulty to get as Ime will be the easiest and Prince should be the hardest.

I have dreamed of a Marion, LMA, Oden frontcourt many a time and are left wondering how any team would score on us at all, get by Marion, oh LMA is there, juke LMA and then you have to get by some guy named Oden. The basket would become like a vault with an increasing level of security through each step.

The season cannot get here soon enough.

by SpyderRyder on Sep 8, 2008 11:11 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

man....

that would be nuts…all those guys from a physical standpoint are incredible, and all, most of all oden, should be considered legit shot blocking presences…….Also, I agree on the order of your list decending starting with most diffficult to get….. I’m already decided I don’t want to give up Outlaw for Battier, (age/ edge in athleticism + he’s money in the 4th).

So as I look between, prince and marion, i see a fundemental difference in demeanor. Both hustle like heck..but while Prince changes games with his hustle and Bball IQ, Marion changes game with flat out intenstity…I’d love to have that on the blazers…Rudy brings intensity as well, just without the athletic package of Marion……but I admit, its fun dreaming of a Rudy, Marion, Aldridge fast break, maybe with Greg trailing and Brandon spotting up……………Marion, Aldridge, Oden make incredible targets for the alley oop.

also from a matchup standpoint, I might too prefer Marion….again, minus the head issues….Prince I dont think can guard Lebron as effectively as Marion given his lankiness. Marion is a little more built, so to speak…and in the next four years, I do see us potentially matching up with Lebron in the finals. Marion could bring an in your face intensity at the three spot probably better than anyone else not named Lebron……

Prince meanwhile, if we could land him, of the guys you’ve mentioned. He’d be our surest ticket to success. Theres no issues with him as a team player. He’s already a champion. He comes in right away and fits with what we’re doing…..He hustles back, prevents fast breaks, locks down on the perimeter, guards the rim, and knows when to shoot and pass.. So from a culture side, he’s golden…..I feel with Oden, Prince, Lamarcus, Roy, possibly Bayless/Rudy. Our defense could rival that of detroit of a few years back……………

again though. Prince doesnt bring that X-factor like Marion does..heck, pheonix even put Marion on cp3. He’s that versatile. He can guard from 1-4. Prince meanwhile guards 2-4. and while him being able to spend some time guarding the 1 shouldnt be an overwhelming factor, the versatility and intensity he brings is astonishing….He’s like a super roided out Bruce Bowen, with nasty finishes at the rim….I bring up him guarding the 1, again in reference to lebron. cuz on offense thats essentially Lebron’s position, and Marion could probably match up better….He’s maybe the only guy that you could put on Lebron, Kobe, and cp3 who would make all of them work to get what they wanted.

hope after next year, he forgets his ego and decides he wants to win championships. cuz he could most certainly do that here….and again, given our cap space. its not unreasonable that we could get him…..

by BroyTheTruth on Sep 9, 2008 12:20 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

wo....

sorry, didnt mean to write a book about it…….

by BroyTheTruth on Sep 9, 2008 12:23 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I'll put it this way:

Prince is a safe bet, you know what you will get and what he will bring to the table.

Marion is a high risk/reward type situation, he will probably cost more, I’m guessing $10-12mill/yr, may have some, I dont want to say character or attitude problems, but lets just say fit problems being a 4th wheel. I feel that he is a better player than Prince but may not fit i well. Like I said, high risk/reward situation.

Hopefully Nate became friends with D’Antoni in Beijing and he can give him the lowdown on what the deal was there in Phx. If we move quickly and sign him right away, we will know that Nate and KP have talked to D’Antoni and Kerr about him and feel comfortable that he would fit.

The season cannot get here soon enough.

by SpyderRyder on Sep 9, 2008 1:19 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

agreed..

i do know, between Oden and Marion, it would be a dunkfest. All that talk about us not getting easy buckets, no more. Rudy and Roy throwing lobs….the Rose Garden would go nuts.. We wouldnt give an inch defensively, than could come down and bam it on them. Right at the rim….with oden blocking all the shots, i see marion being the guy outhustling everyone down court.

by BroyTheTruth on Sep 9, 2008 1:39 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

That marion mix tape

is really just a Steve Nash mix tape.

"Jerryd is straight ahead at you. Rudy dips around. Jerryd is a rock. Rudy is the wind. Jerryd loves the ball in his hands. Rudy moves without it. Jerryd defends by getting up in your grill. Rudy plays the spaces in between. Jerryd has focused vision. Rudy sees all around him. Jerryd likes to score off of the dribble. Rudy can catch and shoot. Jerryd is aggressive. Rudy is sneaky. Jerryd will hit you hard. Rudy will annoy you until you hit him." -Dave

Word.

by joelor on Sep 9, 2008 10:38 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

What?

DId you watch the clips? When did Nash get traded to the Heat? Don’t make a comment when you aren’t even going to take the time to read or watch what someone is contributing.

Look at me, I'm crazy protractor face man... give me some candy!

by halfasiansensation on Sep 9, 2008 2:52 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Joelor

was referring to the first Marion clip that Broythetruth linked.

“Don’t make a comment when you aren’t even going to take the time to read or watch what someone is contributing.”

"... and with the thirteenth pick in the 2008 NBA draft, the Portland Trailblazers select: David Bowie, of space." Draft Bowie!

by Sarbonis on Sep 9, 2008 5:11 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

yeah how about we all relax here

thats coming from one sensation to another

by Croatian_Sensation on Sep 12, 2008 1:33 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Thanks guys, whew! feelin the heat there.

"Jerryd is straight ahead at you. Rudy dips around. Jerryd is a rock. Rudy is the wind. Jerryd loves the ball in his hands. Rudy moves without it. Jerryd defends by getting up in your grill. Rudy plays the spaces in between. Jerryd has focused vision. Rudy sees all around him. Jerryd likes to score off of the dribble. Rudy can catch and shoot. Jerryd is aggressive. Rudy is sneaky. Jerryd will hit you hard. Rudy will annoy you until you hit him." -Dave

Word.

by joelor on Sep 12, 2008 2:58 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Imagine back to back possessions

with back to back alley oops to Marion and Rudy off back screens. Those seem to be their favorite plays.

by Jiggamant on Sep 10, 2008 2:19 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

sorry for the typos...

meant to say frontcourt instead of backcourt……the possibilities just had me excited

by BroyTheTruth on Sep 8, 2008 11:00 PM PDT   0 recs

On Marion

if we could bring Stuart Smalley to start working with him then I would be all for it, but I just think he is doomed to be the first or second best player on terrible teams as that seems to be his desire.

As long as we ate thinking about getting guys like TPrince, then I definitely think that Caron Butler should be in the mix. He has a blue collar work ethic, like Prince, combined with some high level skill, but like Prince, it would take a lot to get him, but I can definitely see the Wiz pulling the plug on an experiment that seems doomed to failure outside of the beltway.

As for a darkhorse, I would be interested in Jamario Moon as he could be had cheap and seems to play hard. His outside shooting was nothing to write home about, but it could be serviceable if Oden has five guys wrapped around him in the post so that all shots outside of 10’ are basically uncontested.

Life is exhausting when you are this stupid.

by jonestr on Sep 9, 2008 12:58 AM PDT   0 recs

i'd like us to go for more of a 4/3

that could defend the 2. It makes us more imposing physically…..butler is like a 2/3…..
…i love how outlaw is a 4/3 who can pull up for the uncontestable jumper….if we give him up, we’re likely gonna be on the losing end of the deal and will want him back within the next four years….

by BroyTheTruth on Sep 9, 2008 1:10 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I dont see why

guarding 4’s is all that important when we have a deep front court already. I personally dont care if our next SF can play at the 4 or not as I just want a guy who will be hard nosed defensively and able to hit shots on the offensive end. I think Caron is really good about doing both of these things.

Outlaw is a 4/3 on offense and has problems with 2/3/4s on offense.

BTW I hate Travis pull up jumper as he shoots it at %40 and it causes him to think it is “wet” and then he decides it is a weapon no matter who is guarding him. This reliance on his go to move really makes his basketball IQ look low. Good players use their jumper to set up easier shots while Travis uses it to set up….his jumper.

Life is exhausting when you are this stupid.

by jonestr on Sep 9, 2008 1:22 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Yeah I gotta back jonestr here.

We need a 2/3 to defend the perimiter as with Oden, LMA and Pryz, most of our post D is taken care of. We need that one guy who can make it so hard on the opposing perimiter player to get into the lane, it will make LMA, Oden and Pryz’s job that much easier.

The season cannot get here soon enough.

by SpyderRyder on Sep 9, 2008 1:33 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

there's something to be said

about having a physical advantage on the perimeter….ask lebron and cleveland…..
It gives teams an edge….I dont think 2/3’s can guard Lebron. That’s more the job of a 3/4…think Posey, Perkins,…………guess im coming from the perspective of, looking at lebron as threat number 1 in our title window….If we get a 2/3 like the guys you are talking about, I hope he is good enough defensively to cover elite 1’s. Meaning, he’s gotta be able to give cp3 fits. Cuz thats who i see as threat number two to our title…We’re not gonna put Caron on cp3, and clearly he is not athletic enough to guard Lebron. Didnt the wizards usually have to put jamison on him…So which major threat does he nuetralize as our perimeter defender?Roy can already guard the 2…..Guys like Shawn Marion. Teyshawn Prince. Those guys would be difference makers…. Perhaps shawn Marion more so because of his versatility and athletic prowess.

by BroyTheTruth on Sep 9, 2008 1:53 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I think we may be making too much of the situation.

Brandon is a 2 for us and is 6’6 225lbs.

for comparison:

Marion: 6’7 230lbs
Prince: 6’9 215lbs
Butler: 6’7 228lbs
Sefolosha: 6’7 215lbs
Battier: 6’8 220lbs
Webster 6’7 229lbs

LeBron: 6’8 250lbs

In looking at LeBrons splits, he fared worst against the Mavs averaging only 17ppg, on .344FG, 5.5apg, 6.5 rpg in 2 games and against Det with 19.3ppg on .426FG, 4.7apg, 4rpg in 3 games. He lit up NY for 42.3ppg in 3 games, Mem for 38 in 2 games, Min for 37.5ppg in 2 games and surprisingly L*L for 37 i 2 games.

We held him to 30.5ppg, on .426 FG%, 7.5apg, and 12 RPG!!! Once Oden coes back we will drop that some and from the looks of it either Howard or Prince would be the best bets to stop LeBron.

The season cannot get here soon enough.

by SpyderRyder on Sep 9, 2008 2:10 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs