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Around SBN: How The Kings Beat The Coyotes: Lather, Rinse, Repeat

Rudy vs. Jerryd?

With two highly-anticipated new reserve guards coming onto the roster this fall it’s pretty natural for people to pick a favorite and ride along on the bandwagon.  When that happens it’s also pretty natural to view the other bandwagon with suspicion.  With each bandwagon led by a back-up, backcourt player we’ve already started to hear the rumblings.  How much are these two guys in competition?  Will they end up taking minutes from each other?  Will both get a fair shake?  Before we get too far down that road we should take a closer look.

Before I even start let me answer a question I’m sometimes asked:  Which one is my favorite?  I can answer that pretty easily.  It’s the one who helps us win most.  Unfortunately we don’t know which one that will be yet, if either.  As far as personal favorites, really they’re all my guys as long as they wear the uniform (and some for long after).  I try to be as realistic as I can about our players’ shortcomings and whether they fit in with the team’s plans, but the truth is I get regret pangs every time I consider any of them being traded.  If you asked I could come up with at least half a page of assets each player brings to the team (and that includes both Rudy and Jerryd).  If I were the GM we’d need a 52-man roster and Buck Williams would probably still be on it.

In any case, with Jerryd being a combo guard with scoring skills and Rudy being a scoring guard with passing skills it would seem both would be fighting each other for minutes in our backcourt.  In a sense this is true in that either alone could eventually end up meriting the entirety of the reserve backcourt minutes and obviously that can’t happen with both of them on the team.  But really that’s a concern for the future, if ever.  We don’t know what this team will look like next year even.  It may be the same, we may make deals, or one of these two reserves could become a starter himself.  It’s safe to say that neither one will be ready to come in and take 30+ guard minutes all by themselves this year.  This season there will be enough minutes to go around.  Right off the bat the tension is eased somewhat.

As far as the minutes that are up for grabs, there are two major ways players can overlap and thus compete for the same time:  position and skills.

Considering position, both players have the capacity to swing around a little bit.  The key word there, though, is “little”. I am pretty comfortable saying Rudy is not going to be able to guard NBA point guards for extended minutes in his first year.  I am also comfortable saying Jerryd is not going to match up well defensively against taller shooting guards, especially early on.  Either might be able to do it situationally, for a play or two, but as a matter of course I believe that defense will dictate Jerryd mostly guard ones and Rudy twos.  That will keep the overlap to a minimum and thus keep them out of direct competition with each other.

While both players are primarily offensive guards, their skills are quite different.  Jerryd’s main physical asset is his body.  It’s not so much that he’s huge and bulky, he’s just stacked like a brick wall.  Rudy, on the other hand, is surprisingly fleet.  Jerryd is straight ahead at you.  Rudy dips around.  Jerryd is a rock.  Rudy is the wind.  Jerryd loves the ball in his hands.  Rudy moves without it.  Jerryd defends by getting up in your grill.  Rudy plays the spaces in between.  Jerryd has focused vision.  Rudy sees all around him.  Jerryd likes to score off of the dribble.  Rudy can catch and shoot.  Jerryd is aggressive.  Rudy is sneaky.  Jerryd will hit you hard.  Rudy will annoy you until you hit him.  These are two guards with a lot of weapons, neither one much like the other.  The guy who gets the call will be the guy whose skills best fit the situation.  Need some more offensive flow?  You go with Rudy.  Fourth quarter is here and the team isn’t getting to the cup aggressively enough?  Hello Jerryd.  Three pointer?  Probably Rudy.  Lock down for one possession?  Go with Jerryd.  There doesn’t seem to be a lot of gray area there.  You either need a standard screwdriver or a Phillips.  The two don’t directly compete even though they’re both screwdrivers.  Hopefully soon Jerryd and Rudy will both be Swiss Army Knives and more interchangeable, but by the time that happens one or both might be starting or might be traded.  For now I don’t think Nate will have a lot of trouble figuring out which one to call in a given situation.

The elephant in the closet here is Brandon Roy.  Where does he play and how much is he willing to move?  If he’s a full-time shooting guard then expect Jerryd to get more minutes.  If Roy is willing to move around to point or small forward or if Nate goes with a three-guard lineup expect Rudy to be on the floor.  Either way the rotation depends far more on Brandon than on either of the rookies.  Their playing time may not be as much a matter of who shines brighter as who fits in better with the All-Star.  Again, though, that’s not real competition between the two.  If one has a game that blends seamlessly while the other doesn’t then that second one is going to get fewer minutes even if he’s darn good.

The long and short of it is as long as both play well they should both see minutes…maybe not as much as their supporters would like, but they’ll play.  If one isn’t playing it almost certainly means he’s not performing adequately.  But if that happens it’s not like the other guy is going to eat all of those minutes.  If Jerryd bites the big banana you’re not going to see Rudy suddenly made the back-up point for 15 extra minutes.  Maybe Jerryd could absorb some of Rudy’s minutes should the latter sink like a stone, but it’d be more likely that Roy would get less rest and Nate would grumble to KP about needing another veteran in the backcourt.

In other words, at least as far as it looks right now, Rudy fans would be wasting their time hating on Jerryd and vice versa.  The two are not interchangeable enough to make it matter.

--Dave (blazersub@yahoo.com)

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What a downer

After all the Jarrett-hating by Sergio nuts and Sergio-hating by Jarrett maniacs, are you saying internecine warfare isn’t going to be justified this year? What a drag.

We’ll have to go to Travis fans hating on Martell and vice versa. Otherwise, Blazers Edge is just going to be boring.

Other people don't have as much practice at being wrong as I do -- HT, timbo

by jscot on Aug 21, 2008 1:41 AM PDT reply actions  

Let's start a Monty versus Dean rivalry

Monty is such a better assistant coach than Dean. He’s longer, more athletic, can adjust to different situations… and who did the team choose to coach the summer league team, and who was stuck picking splinters out of his bum in the stands? That’s right.

If Nate didn’t love the Greek concept of Eros so much Dean wouldn’t even be in the NBA, let alone on the Blazers.

I don’t think Dean will be happy on a team he can’t be the top dogg on. He is selfish, spiteful, and doesn’t brush his teeth. He makes jokes about 9/11. He claims his bar-b-que recipe is inspired by the Battle of Hastings (I dunno what that means but it makes him sound like an uppity jerk). He just does NOT fit the culture KP and Nate have so lovingly crafted for the Trail Blazers franchise.

On the other hand, there is Monty. When not coaching magnificently, he is volunteering at the local Boys and Girls club and participates in the Big Brother program, being a role model to dozens of needy children each week. One time a baby bird fell out of its nest in front of Monty’s humble home (he can afford a mansion, but unlike Dean does not feel the need to flaunt his wealth) and he nursed it back to health with just the gentle warmth of his breath.

Monty built a castle for his mother and dotes on her lovingly. Dean’s mother went into the hospital for a flu shot and Dean managed to have her euthanized so he could reap the dinner plate collection she was planning on leaving him in her will. He now uses the plates as target practice for his BB-Gun, and he’s a horrible shot.

Dean is a terrible tipper, often just leaving a note saying “HERE’S MY TIP: GET A BETTER JOB SWEETCHEEKS”. Monty gives 20, 15 percent if the service was subpar. Ok, once he gave 9% but that is because the restaurant didn’t take credit or debit and he didn’t have that much cash on him. Plus, the waiter was slow with the waters and his friend asked for no croutons and the peppers on the side and both came mixed into the salad and meal and the replacement dish took, like, FOREVER to come out and it was all a big mess. It was especially frustrating because Dean had recommended this restaurant, but Monty later learned Dean only told him it was good because an Ebola outbreak had just been traced to the eatery and Dean was trying to murder Monty (he does this a lot). So, considering all that, 9% was generous but all the media talks about is the 15-20% tipping standard that Monty didn’t adhere to ONE TIME.

Dean is all that is wrong in the world.

Monty 4EVR, Dean 4NVR.

Mortimer

by Mortimer on Aug 21, 2008 3:04 AM PDT up reply actions   2 recs

You've got to be kidding me.

Monty built that castle on virgin rainforest that Dean had been funding to protect with all his salary since day one. And the worst part is, Monty knew it!
Monty struts around with that “Born Here” attitude, while Dean brings a worldliness and humility that comes from seeing life from another perspective.
If Dean seems a little stand-offish, it’s because he is concerned with the overall welfare of the team, his community, and the greater world. Monty, on the otherhand, just wants the coaching minutes, wants the attention from Nate (just watch him spring to his feet with that clip-board while Dean carefully reflects on the broader situation).
I’m no Monty hater, but Dean is the far superior fit on the court and off.
Start Dean at Asst. Coach and let Monty pick up minutes in garbage time until he learns his role a little better.

-Mat
(Y5k)

http://www.myspace.com/y5k

by Y5k on Aug 21, 2008 6:25 AM PDT up reply actions  

I know. I’m bad.

http://www.myspace.com/y5k

by Y5k on Aug 21, 2008 9:37 AM PDT up reply actions  

Drag racing?

Josh Howard is interested.

Odenied: Asked whether he noticed Oden favoring his right knee, Frye dismissed it entirely. "He favors dunking on your head, that's what he favors."

by Norsktroll on Aug 21, 2008 11:21 AM PDT up reply actions  

I have a joke...

Knock, Knock

"Jerryd is straight ahead at you. Rudy dips around. Jerryd is a rock. Rudy is the wind. Jerryd loves the ball in his hands. Rudy moves without it. Jerryd defends by getting up in your grill. Rudy plays the spaces in between. Jerryd has focused vision. Rudy sees all around him. Jerryd likes to score off of the dribble. Rudy can catch and shoot. Jerryd is aggressive. Rudy is sneaky. Jerryd will hit you hard. Rudy will annoy you until you hit him." -Dave

by joelor on Aug 21, 2008 10:17 AM PDT up reply actions  

9/11

"Jerryd is straight ahead at you. Rudy dips around. Jerryd is a rock. Rudy is the wind. Jerryd loves the ball in his hands. Rudy moves without it. Jerryd defends by getting up in your grill. Rudy plays the spaces in between. Jerryd has focused vision. Rudy sees all around him. Jerryd likes to score off of the dribble. Rudy can catch and shoot. Jerryd is aggressive. Rudy is sneaky. Jerryd will hit you hard. Rudy will annoy you until you hit him." -Dave

by joelor on Aug 21, 2008 10:50 AM PDT up reply actions  

Oh come on, is no one going to help me finish the joke?

It’s light hearted i promise

"Jerryd is straight ahead at you. Rudy dips around. Jerryd is a rock. Rudy is the wind. Jerryd loves the ball in his hands. Rudy moves without it. Jerryd defends by getting up in your grill. Rudy plays the spaces in between. Jerryd has focused vision. Rudy sees all around him. Jerryd likes to score off of the dribble. Rudy can catch and shoot. Jerryd is aggressive. Rudy is sneaky. Jerryd will hit you hard. Rudy will annoy you until you hit him." -Dave

by joelor on Aug 21, 2008 11:04 AM PDT up reply actions  

YOU SAID YOU'D NEVER FORGET!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

"Jerryd is straight ahead at you. Rudy dips around. Jerryd is a rock. Rudy is the wind. Jerryd loves the ball in his hands. Rudy moves without it. Jerryd defends by getting up in your grill. Rudy plays the spaces in between. Jerryd has focused vision. Rudy sees all around him. Jerryd likes to score off of the dribble. Rudy can catch and shoot. Jerryd is aggressive. Rudy is sneaky. Jerryd will hit you hard. Rudy will annoy you until you hit him." -Dave

by joelor on Aug 21, 2008 11:15 AM PDT up reply actions  

That's just terrible

so, why do I like it?

The street lights is on.

by Magnum on Aug 21, 2008 11:24 AM PDT up reply actions  

got me an

irregular trucker hat: says “Remember 9/111”

http://www.myspace.com/y5k

by Y5k on Aug 21, 2008 1:23 PM PDT up reply actions  

Y5k, you've confused me.

If you actually have a hat that says “Remember 9/111” then that is hilarious.

I remember in high school, a year or so after 9/11 a girl was giving an impromptu speech (which we were required to do for state standardized testing or something). Anyway, she referred to it as “November 11th” at least three times during her speech. It was painful.

"Jerryd is straight ahead at you. Rudy dips around. Jerryd is a rock. Rudy is the wind. Jerryd loves the ball in his hands. Rudy moves without it. Jerryd defends by getting up in your grill. Rudy plays the spaces in between. Jerryd has focused vision. Rudy sees all around him. Jerryd likes to score off of the dribble. Rudy can catch and shoot. Jerryd is aggressive. Rudy is sneaky. Jerryd will hit you hard. Rudy will annoy you until you hit him." -Dave

by joelor on Aug 21, 2008 2:53 PM PDT up reply actions  

well

http://www.myspace.com/y5k

by Y5k on Aug 22, 2008 7:52 AM PDT up reply actions  

funny

November 11 is Veterans Day, originally known as Armistice Day. It was originally a holiday to commemorate the eleventh hour armistice that ended WWI.

The perfect is the enemy of the good.

by vavoom on Aug 23, 2008 10:27 AM PDT up reply actions  

Will this be a victory parade with 15 bandwagons (plus one for the management)?

Odenied: Asked whether he noticed Oden favoring his right knee, Frye dismissed it entirely. "He favors dunking on your head, that's what he favors."

by Norsktroll on Aug 21, 2008 2:31 AM PDT reply actions  

Typo?
meriting the entirely of the reserve backcourt minutes

Is that supposed to be “entirety” or am I just confused?

"Well, Travis just showed us that we can go to Travis Outlaw." - Nate McMillan

by 12sharks on Aug 21, 2008 2:47 AM PDT reply actions  

I think if Bayless can guard the quicker point guards in the league which I believe he can he would be able

to defend shooting guards more than just on occasion. Hopefully he stays at the point guard position though because we don’t need Roy running all around chasing Chris Paul on every possession.

by BRoyInThe4th on Aug 21, 2008 5:11 AM PDT reply actions  

Can we plug Buck Williams in there somewhere too?

Can Buck have a long chat with LMA and Channing?
 Really, I’m not worried about the guard minutes (for the exact reasons Dave aptly outlines here) so much as the “Power” in Power Forward. LMA/Trout/Channing need to start working out with Greg … everyday, twice a day. I’m not talking Charles Oakly or Charles Atlas here, but not Charlie Brown. These guys have been in the league long enough that their bodies should no longer be “developing.” They should be NBA sculptures. Demi-gods, not spindly jump shooters.
(Sorry LaMarcus, Channing and Travis. I only say this because I care.)

http://www.myspace.com/y5k

by Y5k on Aug 21, 2008 6:34 AM PDT reply actions  

Did anyone hear

If Buck Williams accepted an assistant coaching job with Terry Porter at Phoenix? (I heard TP called #52 after he was hired…)

by two4larue on Aug 21, 2008 10:43 AM PDT up reply actions  

Ike's got some power

You think he’s stealing any minutes at PF?

by OURVYDAS on Aug 21, 2008 12:04 PM PDT up reply actions  

Maybe...

…If they cover those minutes in bacon grease, he could see 30+ minutes a night.

The dude has talent but I dunno where he fits in. I think Frye will have a tough enough time getting out on the court… Diogu could be interesting though. He’s a big body to throw around in there. Last year mighta’ been the better year for him to be a Blazer, but now with Oden and the subsequent Oden-ripple-effect that goes through the rotation… I dunno.

I hope for Diogu’s sake he gets into a good situation since this is a contract year for the poor lil’ fella.

Mortimer

by Mortimer on Aug 21, 2008 2:01 PM PDT up reply actions  

BUCK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Ever since I read this thread, I hear this voice inside my head… it sounds like Schonely… he keeps screaming… “BUCK!!!!!!!! Williams with the rebound”….“rebound, BUCK!!!!!!!! Williams”. Man, I loved that guy (Schonz… OK, and BUCK!!!!!!!!!! too).

MLB2PDX!!! (someday...)

by The Cactus Leaguer on Aug 21, 2008 4:21 PM PDT up reply actions  

It would be great of both succeed...that's what I'm hoping for

That being said, this season, I see Bayless playing more, because defensively he’s a better fit with Roy on the floor. Plus, Bayless can bring the ball up the floor.

I don’t see Roy playing a lot of small forward. Which means most of Rudy’s minutes will come when Roy is not on the floor…and god willing…Roy will be on the floor most of the time. But, if Rudy shows he can the play the small forward, he could see more minutes.

by JasonT on Aug 21, 2008 6:47 AM PDT reply actions  

Observations

The pertinent observation is Roy. Both Mac and Roy seem to be telling us that when Roy is on the floor, they expect the other guard to bring the ball up, guard the other teams point, and give the ball to Roy much of the time to execute a play. Then, of course, the other guard will go in motion to get into the flow of the play. And this creates several interensting observations. Both Jerryd and Rudy seem to be pretty good with the ball, meaning both could bring it up. Jerryd may have an edge in guarding points. However, Rudy may have an edge in moving without the ball to get open for a pass from Roy. Jerryd may be stronger going to the basket, whereas Rudy may be a little better from outside. Interesting options. Both should be able to run a few plays as well.

And, we must also keep in mind the fact that Rudy, at 23, is simply more experienced and more mature. His league is often compared to the better NCAA leagues like the ACC. Jerryd has only one year of college. We all call him a combo, but in fact, we don’t actually know how his game will evolve. Because he was the most skilled scorer for his college team and the summer league team, and both needed his scoring, this was emphasized as they both had another guard who was adequate at point, but not remotely as good a scorer as Jerryd.

He could well evolve into a better PG than we anticipate, simply because he hasn’t played much of it since high school. Jerryd has had the disadvantage of being asked to essentially play two positions, whereas Rudy has principally played the 2 guard. And given only 1 year of experience out of high school, Jerryd has had little game time to develop or improve his PG skills. Let’s face it. It takes game time and practices to become a good PG, and Jerryd has had very little of that since high school.

by Eben Calder on Aug 21, 2008 7:01 AM PDT reply actions   1 recs

his high school

career was over just over a year ago. Good points, but I remember in the summer league when they tried to run him at point and it looked like he had never played the role of a distributor in his entire life. Granted he may be one of those guys who doesent shift gears quickly from scorer to distributor, but his few plays at pg left serious doubts in my mind if he would even be effective at bringing the ball up against pressure in the nba let alone initiate an offense.

Life is exhausting when you are this stupid.

by jonestr on Aug 21, 2008 8:17 AM PDT up reply actions  

+1

I don’t think that we have seen everything that Bayless can do. But I think that what we see out of Rudy is exactly what he will be when he gets to Portland.

by parkinglotj on Aug 21, 2008 9:31 AM PDT up reply actions  

The elephant in the closet?

Is that different than the elephant in the corner or the elephant in the middle of the room? If so, how? Any citations on usage?

by PoliSam on Aug 21, 2008 7:44 AM PDT reply actions  

HA!

"Jerryd is straight ahead at you. Rudy dips around. Jerryd is a rock. Rudy is the wind. Jerryd loves the ball in his hands. Rudy moves without it. Jerryd defends by getting up in your grill. Rudy plays the spaces in between. Jerryd has focused vision. Rudy sees all around him. Jerryd likes to score off of the dribble. Rudy can catch and shoot. Jerryd is aggressive. Rudy is sneaky. Jerryd will hit you hard. Rudy will annoy you until you hit him." -Dave

by joelor on Aug 21, 2008 10:18 AM PDT up reply actions  

I don't know...

But that’s a big friggin closet. Like Oprah sized.

by OURVYDAS on Aug 21, 2008 12:06 PM PDT up reply actions  

One place or the other

If you are going to have elephants in the house you are going to have to get used to the smell

by southern oregon on Aug 21, 2008 9:22 PM PDT up reply actions  

they have a special organization for elephants who have emerged from the closet

It’s called the Log Cabin Republicans.

The perfect is the enemy of the good.

by vavoom on Aug 23, 2008 10:30 AM PDT up reply actions  

I expect to see Blake and Roy get the bulk of the minutes

in the backcourt. How much playing time Bayless, Fernandez and Rodriguez get will depend on how well the perform. It’s pretty simple. If you show you can play your position at the NBA level, you’ll get minutes. If you struggle or have serious holes in your game, you should expect to be watching the games, not playing.

And should any of these three struggle, Nate always has the option of swinging Martell over to the two. Having Webster and Outlaw on the court at the same time, paired with either Blake or Roy, does not seem like a bad option.

BTW – I loved the line " If I were the GM we’d need a 52-man roster and Buck Williams would probably still be on it." That’s me to a T. Add to that I’d probably have a 20 man coaching staff, which would include Terry Porter, Rick Adelman and Rick Carlisle, among others.

"Don't draw fire; it irritates the people around you." - Your Buddies

by timg56 on Aug 21, 2008 7:53 AM PDT reply actions  

I agree that Blake/Roy will be the basic tandem, at least up to the All Star break...

………………………… I will add that rather than competence (or lack thereof) being the pivotal determinant of who plays how much at what, the question of injuries is often decisive in the NBA. It’s a long season and a very hard grind and it seems almost axiomatic that there WILL be a STRING of injuries during the course of the year. So instead of an attitude of “oh, no, we have too many guards,” a more correct phrasing is: “oh, good, we have enough guards.”

As for Martell at the 2. Hmmm, dunno about that. I know he saw some very limited minutes at that position last year, I don’t think he was effective at that, and there are PLENTY of scoring guards on the roster to keep Marty at the wing. Of course, you note this as an emergency option in case Rex or Rudy wash out, and that may well be — which I don’t see as a particularly urgent possibility.

Odd man out is Sergio, who is still on the roster by the grace of his economical contract, I reckon. I look for him to be unhappy and shipped.

"TominHawaii's real name is Hubert and he's a rancher in Burns."

by timbo on Aug 21, 2008 8:12 AM PDT up reply actions  

Re/ Sergio,

that’s what was going to say: he’s the odd man out. One suspects that his value as Rudy’s fellow Spaniard is the only reason he’s still here. And as he becomes frustrated and bitter with his role on the team, that value will disappear in a hurry.

As for Rudy, Bayless, & Blake, there might prove to be enough minutes to go around. Remember, there’s always foul trouble.

"We don't back down to nobody." --Joel Przybilla

by hurryup09 on Aug 21, 2008 10:36 AM PDT up reply actions  

what is

Rick Carlisle’s connection to the Blazers?

Life is exhausting when you are this stupid.

by jonestr on Aug 21, 2008 8:18 AM PDT up reply actions  

you are

totally correct

Thanks

Life is exhausting when you are this stupid.

by jonestr on Aug 21, 2008 11:14 AM PDT up reply actions  

I've said it many times before...

…and I guess I’ll say it many times in the future. Martell isn’t a two, he’s a three. Martell just doesn’t have the handle to play guard at the NBA level. Wishful thinking won’t make it otherwise. No worries: Martell has the potential to be a fine three.

"We don't back down to nobody." --Joel Przybilla

by hurryup09 on Aug 21, 2008 10:31 AM PDT up reply actions  

except he's built like a strong 2

that’s what we thought when we drafted him….he was going to be our Brandon Roy…..but then Brandon Roy came along……..

It’s funny, martell skips going UW cuz Brandon is already the man up there….then Brandon gets to the league and is still the man…………both washington products, martell is just in brandons footsteps

by BroyTheTruth on Aug 21, 2008 12:06 PM PDT up reply actions  

Actually, Martell is built like a three

He’s listed at 6-8, he’s strong, and he can jump out of the building. Brandon’s a big two at 6-6. Granted, we tend to be too rigid in categorizing players. Back in the day, you had guards and frontcourt players, basically.

Having said that: if you can’t dribble, you’re not an NBA guard, period. Fortunately, Martell has many of the tools needed to be a good small forward.

"We don't back down to nobody." --Joel Przybilla

by hurryup09 on Aug 21, 2008 1:11 PM PDT up reply actions  

he's not 6'8...........im tired of players being listed taller than they are

maybe thats what he’s listed at in two inch heeled shoes……….

on the floor, he looks 6’6

look at him stand next to lebron………..Lebron looks about an inch taller….and he’s listed at 6’7…

and im not convinced martell cant dribble, he just doesnt do it often cuz A:he knows his role, and B: he still needs to develope confidence taking nba defenders off the dribble….back in high school he dribbled fairly well

by BroyTheTruth on Aug 21, 2008 1:28 PM PDT up reply actions  

Lebron is 6'9", or so

Lebron is taller than 6’7". Look at him next to Dwight Howard, who himself is 6’10". Not too much shorter.

I believe both Webster and Lebron have grown since entering the NBA (not unusual for 18 year olds to grow an inch or three between 18 and 23), so their rookie measurements aren’t likely to be accurate.

Webster is taller than Roy, and in shoes Roy is a for-sure 6’6".

Mortimer

by Mortimer on Aug 21, 2008 2:03 PM PDT up reply actions  

lebron is listed at 6'8

really though he’s 6’7……….

he even said so in an interview

by BroyTheTruth on Aug 21, 2008 4:03 PM PDT up reply actions  

Here ya go

http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-pre-draft-measurements/?page=&year=2003&sort2=DESC&draft=0&pos=0&sort=

Before he entered the NBA Lebron was 6’7.25" WITHOUT shoes. 6’8" with shoes. He has maybe grown since then, which isn’t outside the realm of possibility for a 19 year old man-child who is already 6’7". I personally grew another inch after I was 20 years old, Pippen grew like 7 inches in college, and both Lebron and Martell each look taller to my eye.

Perhaps they haven’t grown, but they could have, and Lebron 5 years ago was 6’8" in shoes. Next to guys like Dwight Howard or Ben Wallace or Chris Bosh, Lebron does not look much shorter (if shorter at all).

I can’t remember what started this… Oh, Martell being a SG.

If he can dribble, he has terrific size for a SG. If he can’t dribble he still has good size for a SF. It’s up to Martell what position he ends up being, but I think in the long run he’ll play both depending on his team.

Looking at the 2005 results, it says Rudy Fernandez is only 6’4.75" without shoes. He looks taller than that to me as well, but obviously the measurements were taken 3 years ago so he could have grown. I would like teams to measure the young players who are still growing before the season starts so we REALLY know because everything depends on Rudy being 6’5.5" over 6’4.75"…

Mortimer

Mortimer

by Mortimer on Aug 21, 2008 4:43 PM PDT up reply actions  

Interesting.

“Before he entered the NBA Lebron was 6’7.25” WITHOUT shoes. 6’8" with shoes. He has maybe grown since then, which isn’t outside the realm of possibility for a 19 year old man-child . . . "

And so when was the last time anyone measured Greg Oden’s height?
His weight has been the source of speculation whilst injured,
but has HE gotten an altimeter reading since the draft?

=(_8c(|)

by QualityPie on Aug 22, 2008 1:33 PM PDT up reply actions  

He's been working on his handle

all summer. It can come together, as I experienced
in my own game at 21-22. Be patient !

It's GO time !

by walkoff41 on Aug 22, 2008 2:21 PM PDT up reply actions  

Where's the Minutes?

Whenever I have this conversation with my main Blazer man, he always admonishes me not to forget that Rudy can pick up some of James Jones’ minutes. Here’s the thing though: 5 positions * 48mpg=240mpg. If Roy, Aldridge, Blake, and let’s go ahead and say Webster all get roughly the minutes they got last year (131) that leaves 109 minutes to divide amongst Oden, Przy, Travis, Frye, Rudy, Jerryd, and let’s say Sergio. That’s an average of 16mpg and you know darn well that Greg, Travis, and probably Joel are going to be playing more minutes than that. Those three will likely average closer to 25mpg apiece, which leaves around 34mpg to divide up between Frye, Rudy, Jerryd, and let’s say Sergio, for an average of 8.5mpg.

I only see Frye picking up minutes if Joel is out, we’re down in the 4th and Oden is out, or he continues to play like he did last April and Travis ISN’T playing as well as he did last year. Frye averaged 17.2 last year so let’s split the difference and say he gets 13mpg. That leaves 21.

Let’s say Sergio is still in Nate’s doghouse, and he doesn’t make his last season average of 8.8mpg. We’ll give him 6mpg, which is what he averaged last January and February when he got the least amount of PT. That leaves 15.

15 minutes for Rudy AND Jerryd.

Now, you can say that Martell and maybe Travis won’t get their last season average. Realistically, if they drop to 20mpg apiece, that frees up an additional 15. Which puts us at 30. So between 15-30mpg to divide between our two hot, young acquisitions.

All that, and as has been mentioned, it’s an 8 man rotation you want to set for the post-season.

Somebody’s getting traded this year. I’m gonna say that Frye, Outlaw, Webster and Rodriguez are all on notice.

Standing in Chicago, eyes looking west.

by jnstarbird on Aug 21, 2008 7:56 AM PDT reply actions  

Barring injury, Frye will play the 4 and only the 4 this year...

………………………………….. and I think Nate will be rather less inclined to play small ball with Travis at the 4 in the coming year. Ironically, the thing that drives me crazy about Frye — his playing like a jumpshooter and consequently being out of rebounding position — is the thing that just might make him invaluable this season. This presumes that Oden is an offensive beast that draws double teams or at least “a guy and a pair of eyes.” A slashing rebounder (a la Fernandez) on the floor at the same time as Oden and Frye still gives you two bodies and two sets of hands for offensive rebounds; and Frye could be lofting his (pretty open) 16 footers without penalty.

t

"TominHawaii's real name is Hubert and he's a rancher in Burns."

by timbo on Aug 21, 2008 8:18 AM PDT up reply actions  

More minutes for Frye

Leaves even fewer minutes for Jerryd and Rudy. If we say that Frye gets 17(last season’s avg.)-20mpg, then lop off another 5 available mpg, leaving 10-20 available minutes for both of our new guards.

What player/position do we target in a 2-for-1 trade?

Standing in Chicago, eyes looking west.

by jnstarbird on Aug 21, 2008 8:37 AM PDT up reply actions  

Also

Is playing Travis at the 4 still considered small ball in today’s NBA? There are plenty of marquee 6’9 PF’s at this point, although most of those guys have about 15 lb.’s on him….

Standing in Chicago, eyes looking west.

by jnstarbird on Aug 21, 2008 9:41 AM PDT up reply actions  

Agreed, except...

…again, there’s the foul trouble factor. Pryz has always been prone to pick up fouls, because the Blazer backcourt is porous and Joel defends the basket. GO will have the same problem, compounded by the fact that he’s a rookie. So Frye will end up playing quite a few minutes at center.

"We don't back down to nobody." --Joel Przybilla

by hurryup09 on Aug 21, 2008 10:41 AM PDT up reply actions  

Worrying about minutes ....

…. from the standpoint of a fan, is one of the more useless exercises to engage in.

"Don't draw fire; it irritates the people around you." - Your Buddies

by timg56 on Aug 21, 2008 12:20 PM PDT up reply actions  

Very well put.
Jerryd’s main physical asset is his body. It’s not so much that he’s huge and bulky, he’s just stacked like a brick wall. Rudy, on the other hand, is surprisingly fleet. Jerryd is straight ahead at you. Rudy dips around. Jerryd is a rock. Rudy is the wind. Jerryd loves the ball in his hands. Rudy moves without it. Jerryd defends by getting up in your grill. Rudy plays the spaces in between. Jerryd has focused vision. Rudy sees all around him. Jerryd likes to score off of the dribble. Rudy can catch and shoot. Jerryd is aggressive. Rudy is sneaky. Jerryd will hit you hard. Rudy will annoy you until you hit him.

These are two guards with a lot of weapons, neither one much like the other. The guy who gets the call will be the guy whose skills best fit the situation. Need some more offensive flow? You go with Rudy. Fourth quarter is here and the team isn’t getting to the cup aggressively enough? Hello Jerryd. Three pointer? Probably Rudy. Lock down for one possession? Go with Jerryd. There doesn’t seem to be a lot of gray area there. You either need a standard screwdriver or a Phillips. The two don’t directly compete even though they’re both screwdrivers.

"TominHawaii's real name is Hubert and he's a rancher in Burns."

by timbo on Aug 21, 2008 8:04 AM PDT reply actions  

I also liked the

rock and the wind metaphor.

This post got me to thinking, do you suppose (tongue tilted toward cheek) these two might one day make a perfectly matched backcourt of their own?

As far as who’s going to do what, I think I’ll hld off a bit until we start getting reports from camp.

Free Joel Freeland! (with the purchase of 1 Wafer)

by LaughingJon on Aug 21, 2008 8:18 AM PDT up reply actions  

I was thinking the same thing.

I think the attributes of these two would make a perfect backcourt for the second unit. You have a fiery floor leader in Jerryd, a crafty scorer who’s an athlete (Rudy), a freak athlete who can get his shot off against anyone (Trout), a jumpshooting big man (The Buffet), and a defensive-minded tough guy center (Vanilla Gorrilla). Sounds like a crack squad to me.

by OURVYDAS on Aug 21, 2008 12:12 PM PDT up reply actions  

I forsee

in 3 years, a 3 guard rotation, Bayless and Roy start, and Rudy off the bench. Blake will be around for insurance but won’t play much.

by usmcr3049 on Aug 21, 2008 8:06 AM PDT reply actions  

Everyone is Missing the Point!

I think everyone is missing the point here. The point is to keep Roy’s minutes low (under 30) for all regular season games for his career. The less catilage in your knee the quicker it will wear out and the more prone you are to long term arthritis. We need a 3 or 4 gaurd rotation during the regular season. Plus if we can keep Roy’s minutes down he will be fresh at the end of the season…. I think he looked tired at the end of last season. I am hoping for big rookie years from Rudy and Jerryd to take the pressure off of Roy.

by Escrote on Aug 21, 2008 8:46 AM PDT reply actions   1 recs

Exactly

Roy playing 38 minutes a game is almost guaranteed to shorten his career, He’s already had three knee surguries. His minutes and the amount of contact he takes will need to be managed.

by raoulduke on Aug 21, 2008 9:44 AM PDT up reply actions  

And more to the point, we won't find out.

With his injury record, our depth in non-point guards, and that now (unlike the past few seasons)
we won’t be able to sit players for the season if they get minor injuries with a dozen games togo.

We’re gonna trim Roy’s minutes on a per-night, EVERY night basis,
and we’ll never see the results of playing him 38 minutes a game over the regular season ever again.

In the playoffs, yes.
Regular season, NO.

=(_8c(|)

by QualityPie on Aug 21, 2008 10:00 AM PDT up reply actions  

Agreed...

I think the main situations where Roy will find more rest is somewhere in the first three quarters where he would prefer to just coast and give it up to his teammates anyway.

by ranma on Aug 21, 2008 10:05 AM PDT up reply actions  

Agreed

I noticed that last season, Roy would often catch rests while in the game by handing the ball to Jack. Roy would move to the weak side as a decoy while Jack drove into the lane and drew fouls. That gave Roy some nice breathers without having to go to the bench. Bayless should be able to do the same thing Jack did, only better.

"We don't back down to nobody." --Joel Przybilla

by hurryup09 on Aug 21, 2008 10:44 AM PDT up reply actions  

I agree

that he looked so tired at the end of last year.

--

by CaptainSexyJacob on Aug 21, 2008 11:55 AM PDT up reply actions  

The forgotten man:

Don’t discount Sergio being the first guard off the bench to replace Blake. The other two being discussed here are rookies with Bayless being a green rookie. Rookies often sit.

Understand, I’m not taking this position because I’m an over- the-top Sergio fan. I like Sergio but was always more anti-Jack than pro-Sergio. I’ll admit to having a lot of misgivings about Bayless (not so Rudy).

I remember telling him how impressed I was with a player during summer league. In Avery's unique voice, he replied, "Marc, it's summer league." I

by TwoDeep on Aug 21, 2008 9:09 AM PDT reply actions  

I expect Bayless to glare once at Sergio in training camp

And the competition for backup point guard minutes will be essentially over

by two4larue on Aug 21, 2008 11:18 AM PDT up reply actions  

Yeah

Sergio can’t handle the Bayless face.

--

by CaptainSexyJacob on Aug 21, 2008 11:56 AM PDT up reply actions  

Rudy will sit with Sergio for a while. Jerryd will be the man.

“If I were the GM we’d need a 52-man roster and Buck Williams would probably still be on it.”
That is the best line of the year!!!
IMO, Rudy is going to need some time to adjust to the speed of the NBA. If you watched the USA vs. Spain game….. Rudy has not competed with that mush speed and athletisism in Europe.
Jerryd, however will be the back up Point and he will also play with Brandon often as the point (Jerryd that is). I see Brandon and Jerryd being able to alternate ball handling responsibilities as the defense adjusts. Brandon can still be No. 1 with Jerryd always watching to get the ball to Roy.

by theglide22 on Aug 21, 2008 10:08 AM PDT reply actions  

No one has competed against that much speed and athletisism..

The Redeem Team are a bunch of Thoroughbreds running against ponies. I think the fact Rudy scored 8 points is an achievement.

by OURVYDAS on Aug 21, 2008 12:17 PM PDT up reply actions  

Yessir

Formerly known as 'Junior Del Norte' until I deleted my openID. It wasn't really an accident, but it wasn't really on purpose. Salaam

by JamesOn on Aug 21, 2008 3:11 PM PDT up reply actions  

Great, great post Dave

I have resisted getting a signature, but this eloquent paragraph was too tempting.

"Jerryd is straight ahead at you. Rudy dips around. Jerryd is a rock. Rudy is the wind. Jerryd loves the ball in his hands. Rudy moves without it. Jerryd defends by getting up in your grill. Rudy plays the spaces in between. Jerryd has focused vision. Rudy sees all around him. Jerryd likes to score off of the dribble. Rudy can catch and shoot. Jerryd is aggressive. Rudy is sneaky. Jerryd will hit you hard. Rudy will annoy you until you hit him." -Dave

by joelor on Aug 21, 2008 10:19 AM PDT reply actions  

One of your best, Dave

"We don't back down to nobody." --Joel Przybilla

by hurryup09 on Aug 21, 2008 10:46 AM PDT reply actions  

You can't love them both

It just like with your kids— one is awesome and one sucks, and the sucky one only remains one of your kids because Nate McMillan harbours a homoerotic crush on the kid.

THAT’S JUST HOW THE WORLD WORKS AND WE ALL MUST AGREE.

Mortimer

by Mortimer on Aug 21, 2008 11:09 AM PDT up reply actions  

You must not have any.

"Don't draw fire; it irritates the people around you." - Your Buddies

by timg56 on Aug 21, 2008 12:39 PM PDT up reply actions  

I have, like, 80

And I split them off into warring factions to battle for my love.

And then Nate comes in and ruins all of it, irrationally falling into love with the kids that are beefy 6’3" PGs. It’s so frustrating. He stays up late at night with them on road trips, plays them before my more flair-filled kids; enough is enough.

My parents had 4 kids. I’m the one who lost the battle for their love :-(

The system works though, and who am I to change it.

Mortimer

by Mortimer on Aug 21, 2008 2:07 PM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

I sort of envision

Blake + Roy start

Bayless + Rudy come off the bench

Bayless + Roy finish the 4th

I say this because I think that all the guards are good players, and as stated above a 4 guard rotation would benefit Roy by lowering his playing time and reducing risk for injury.

Blake and Roy have shown they have good chemistry together, but I think that the skills of Bayless and Roy will even better complement each other. Jerryd will be able to better defend the point guards in the 4th quarter than Rudy or Blake would be able to, and he also offers that relentless attack-and-draw-the-foul playing style that Jack brought when he was the 4th quarter PG.

--

by CaptainSexyJacob on Aug 21, 2008 12:03 PM PDT reply actions  

Bayless + Rudy come off the bench

I don’t expect Nate to trust this combo unless the game is decided (read: garbage time) Especially in the first 1/2 of the season. Either Blake or Roy will be on the floor 90% of the time during the minutes that “count”

by two4larue on Aug 21, 2008 12:37 PM PDT reply actions  

Come on Dave

You can’t possibly be 100% neutral on this. Everyone has seen tidbits of both players, and you’ve seen more than most: based on your observations and even just your gut, who do you think will help the team more, Bayless or Fernandez? Bear in mind that it’s unlikely that either of them will ever read, or care about, your opinion of them, so the risk you run of offending someone is negligible.

by blazero on Aug 21, 2008 1:01 PM PDT reply actions  

I have said before

that I think Bayless will have the greater impact in his first year simply because of how the team is built but that Rudy may well be the player who makes the long-term impact. Which one is likely to score more and play more key minutes this year? Bayless. Which one is more likely to be traded eventually? Also Bayless.

I never refrain from commenting for fear of offending people, even the players. But on this matter I truly am rooting for both because obviously it would be good for the team if each could contribute. That doesn’t mean I’m neutral, though. I just don’t see any legitimate sides here to be neutral between.

—Dave

by Dave on Aug 21, 2008 1:28 PM PDT up reply actions  

Well said.
Which one is likely to score more and play more key minutes this year? Bayless.
Which one is more likely to be traded eventually? Also Bayless.

Glad you squeezed that one into the replies.

=(_8c(|)

by QualityPie on Aug 22, 2008 1:36 PM PDT up reply actions  

Dave vs. Ben?
With two highly-acclaimed bloggers on the roster this fall it’s pretty natural for people to pick a favorite and ride along on the bandwagon. When that happens it’s also pretty natural to view the other bandwagon with suspicion. With each bandwagon led by a front-line blogger we’ve already started to hear the rumblings. How much are these two guys in competition? Will they end up taking front-page posts from each other? Will both get a fair shake? Before we get too far down that road we should take a closer look.

Before I even start let me answer a question I’m sometimes asked: Which one is my favorite? I can answer that pretty easily.

If I were ruling the world we’d need a 2-man blog roster and they would both still be on it.

Other people don't have as much practice at being wrong as I do -- HT, timbo

by jscot on Aug 21, 2008 1:46 PM PDT reply actions  

Dave’s main asset is his knowledge. Ben, on the other hand, is surprisingly cunning. Dave is straight ahead at you. Ben dips around. Dave is a rock. Ben is the wind. Dave loves the info in his hands. Ben moves without it. Dave defends by getting up in your grill. Ben plays the spaces in between. Dave has focused vision. Ben sees all around him. Dave likes to score off of the dribble. Ben can catch and shoot. Dave is aggressive. Ben is sneaky. Dave will hit you hard. Ben will annoy you until you hit him. These are two bloggers with a lot of weapons, neither one much like the other.

"Jerryd is straight ahead at you. Rudy dips around. Jerryd is a rock. Rudy is the wind. Jerryd loves the ball in his hands. Rudy moves without it. Jerryd defends by getting up in your grill. Rudy plays the spaces in between. Jerryd has focused vision. Rudy sees all around him. Jerryd likes to score off of the dribble. Rudy can catch and shoot. Jerryd is aggressive. Rudy is sneaky. Jerryd will hit you hard. Rudy will annoy you until you hit him." -Dave

by joelor on Aug 21, 2008 2:57 PM PDT up reply actions  

Hmmm

Ben moves without the info? I’m not sure he’ll thank you for that one….

Other people don't have as much practice at being wrong as I do -- HT, timbo

by jscot on Aug 22, 2008 12:52 AM PDT up reply actions  

even keel and level headed as always

“Jerryd will hit you hard. Rudy will annoy you until you hit him”

I just loved that quote. The visuals that provides me are stunning. This is why Dave is a world renowned Blogger and I’m just an avid reader and promoter of said Blog.

written by the Blazer Thoughts artist formely known as "Scott R"

by saregister on Aug 21, 2008 8:08 PM PDT reply actions  

Hard to bring originality to this after 80+ posts

Especially after you so totally nailed it. Ben must be staying up late working on getting his momentum back for a 3rd quarter run.

Rudy, Roy, Bayless, Blake, and Sergio bring a wealth of potential, diverse skills and complimentary uses to the backcourt. I like them all and know that Coach Nate’s promise that they will sort themselves out on the court will be fulfilled. It reminds me of the time I endeavored to read the whole Thesaurus. So many wonderful words, so little paper and time. Do you think other fan blogs are contemplating how their arsenal will be used and develop without choosing sides? Eat you heart out suckers! Even the national media are paying attention. Where do they come to get their material? Right here – tell them Henry – this is the promised land every pilgrim dreams of.

Aldridge said. "We feel like we can beat any team. We feel like we can beat the Spurs, Suns, Lakers, Mavericks, whoever any night right now, and we'll still be here when those teams get old and their guys retire. We're going to be here for a long time."

by lee3022 on Aug 22, 2008 12:28 AM PDT reply actions  

Blake and Roy will get the lion's share of the minutes

Rudy and Bayless will be brought along slowly.

Heck, Bayless might get fewer minutes than Sergio for the first 20 games or so.

But what do I know? I’m just a casual fan.

The perfect is the enemy of the good.

by vavoom on Aug 23, 2008 10:53 AM PDT reply actions  

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