make Martell vulnerable. To play them and Roy, Roy has to slide to the 3 and he’s a big upgrade over Martell in all facets of the game except height. That unit suffers a bit defensively on the perimeter, but should be really explosive on o.

This doesn’t make Martell vulnerable at all. To make him vulnerable you’d need to be able to play those two at the same time for large minutes with Roy at the three which would be ill-advised. Martell is not vulnerable until you can find someone who can guard the opposing team’s best wing player for the majority of the game otherwise you’re going to leave that to Roy; which means Roy will have no energy at the end of the game.

If anything they could eventually make Travis vulnerable. Batum could eventually make Martell expendable, but not Bayless and Fernandez. They will however take shots from Travis on the second unit, and then we will start noticing how much or little of an impact Travis makes outside of getting a free selection of shots with the second unit.

I’m with everyone else who thinks this should be posted before the trading deadline.

“wait till the trade deadline”, it’s important to point out that martell will have almost no trade value then. He’ll only be about 30 games away from being a restricted free agent so teams will view him as having negative value except as a possible expiring contract. Then the trouble is his contract would be rather small, so even the expiring value is limited.

Here’s the simple logic: if KP is serious about cap-space next summer, and martell’s contract isn’t extended THIS summer, Martell’s days as a blazer will be over by no later then next summer. The blazers will renounce their rights to him.

Martell is one of the best spot up shooters in the NBA, right now. We’ve seen Rudy play 2 games, come on! Let’s see them all play together for a year before we annoint Rudy and get rid of Martell. We will need a plethra of great shooters with all the double teams Oden and Roy will draw. GO BLAZERS!

I think Martell’s improved defense last year was a step in the right direction, if he continues that improvement, he makes Rudy more valuable as a member of the second unit. Since Rudy play’s no D, we will need a decent defender or two in the second unit to cover for him. I’m imagining a second unit of Bayless, Rudy, Martell, Frye, and Prz. Out of those 5, only Martell and Pryz are going to play solid D next year. And yes, in this scenario Outlaw moves into the starting 3 spot, and Blake is the starting 1.

The organization has waited and developed outlaw and Martell both straight out of high school. We all know Outlaw had a breakout season and Martell improved but not as drastically, but don’t forget Outlaw was drafted 2 years before Webster. Martell wouldn’t even be out of a four year college yet and we’ve seen how much a player can improve in 1 yr at this age (Aaron brooks).
Webster has the potential to be a good all-around NBA player. He’s got the height, athleticism, and range. Trading him now would be a waste and I think we’d regret it within the next two years.

Right now, we are talking about Webster, Outlaw, and Batum. Forget Batum since clearly he is at least a year or two away from playing meaningful minutes in the NBA.

So, you have Martell and Outlaw! Webster has done nothing in the off season to lose his position to Outlaw yet! So, why trade him?

This will be the year we find out who we keep, Martell or Outlaw! They won’t trade either unless and unbelievable upgrade drops in the lap before the trade deadline. At the end of the season, the numbers will speak for themselves, and we will find out which guy stays and which guy gets moved!

Honestly, I like what both guys bring but with the way this team is set up down low with Oden and Aldridge, I think a dead-eye 3-point shooter (Webster) is more valuable than a slasher/scorer (Outlaw). Also, keeping in mind that Batum has many of the same skills of a young Outlaw and has been compared to him by Pritchard after the draft.

As far as Fernandez goes, he’s a two and there is no way he can defend the SF position in the NBA. This season, he will be Brandon’s back up and get some additional PT when Nate likes to use the three guard line up for extra scoring!

There is no way Fernandez jeopardizes Martells roster spot. The guy he needs to worry about this year is Outlaw. In the future, Batum (if he develops) or don’t be surprised if Frye of even LA could end up at that position a few years down the road (that’s a different subject).

It’s because he’s not that good yet. There were a half dozen free agents loads better than Martell on the market this year, and there will be just as many next year. Heck, James Jones is loads better than Martell and Miami got him for part of a mid-level.

I don’t believe that Martel is threatened by Rudy all that much for the following reasons. Let’s assume for the moment that both Bayless and Fernandez are talents that will develop sufficiently to merit starting in the NBA. If you do that, you then have to recognize first that Mac will use a three guard rotation. In this scenerio, Roy will average some 36 minutes a game, and Bayless and Fernandez will each average 30 minutes a game. Further, keep in mind that the Blazers have said repeatedly that they think that both Bayless and Fernandez can play some point (not most of the time mind you, but some of the time). Meaning, that Bayless and Fernandez will bring the ball up and give it up to Roy and then go in motion at the 2 spot when Roy’s on the floor, but that for 12 minutes or so, they would split a little PG by running the play themselves. Also, given how these three guards play, you don’t want any of them playing more than 30 minutes or so a game because they’ll have the routine injuries that fearless players who constantly drive to the basket get. We saw that with Roy last year, we saw that Bayless had to pack himself in ice at summer league, and Rudy’s frame indicates the same issues will arise. In sum, in Mac’s system, you can have three starters at guard because of the three guard rotation.

Now, does this mean the Blazers may not a times play “small ball” given they have two sets of twin towers and that there might be some matchups to justify it? Not at all. But it general, we have plenty of playing time at guard for three guards. Blake, in turn, will be the 4th guard. He’ll be critical for the next several years as Bayless and Fernandez mature, and he’ll continue to be critical because of the injury factor due to long seasons and the way Bayless and Fernandez play.

As far as Martel and TO, let’s all keep a little perspective. Initially, they are both slated at SF this year. If you put their combined production into that position, then we can expect 24 pts per game from the SF spot, and that’s about all anyone expects from that single position. Granted, they both played 54 minutes – and there’s only 48 at SF, meaning tht if neither improve, it would drop to 22 ppg, but that’s still good production. After all, Roy’s a scorer, Fernandez and Bayless are scorers, Aldridge is a scorer, and Oden will be a scorer. (not to include Frye and Pryz).

Now, some of you are right to identify Martel as needing to step up his game this year – if he wants the big bucks. Initially, at his current level of production of 10.7 ppg, he’s not going to get more than $5 million or so per year from anyone. To get that $9 to 10 million or so like Josh Smith got and or Gordon wants, he has to consistently get 17-18 or so ppg. After all, if you want 20 – 25 ppg from your wing position, and you have a starter, then that starter needs to be picking up a majority of those points. Otherwise, he forces a team to carry a second relatively equivalent player – as we are doing this year with Travis. The option is pay both $5 million to $6 million and use two players, or pay one $9 million and a backup $3 million or so (ie Jones). That’s the way it’s done.

The bottom line is that premium SF’s play 36+mpg, are solid defenders, and score 18+ppg. Webster simply isn’t there yet. He needs to pick up his points, and he needs to improve in other areas.

Now, keep in mind that Frye, Webster and Diogu will put $37 million in cap holds on the Blazers if we don’t resign and or trade them. However, let’s also not forget that the reason Travis is currently a pretty good deal is that he resigned with the Blazers for approximately 1/2 of what we’d normally allocate for the SF spot. Now, if Webster doesn’t move up to that 18 ppg or so level, and given he’a 21, then if he is willing to work another three years for a mid-level salary Ilike Travis was to try to get there – then there’s nothing that says we won’t use a two player rotation at the SF spot for another three years or so, and do nothing else. After all, if you do try to get a “starter” who will play 35-36 mpg, then you’re actually getting rid of both Webster and Travis, because both are worth more than 12 mpg – which is all they’d play, and you don’t pay someone $5 or $6 million per year just to play 12 mpg.

And let’s not delude ourselves – there isn’t any other time at any other position for Travis or Martel. PF is history given Aldridge, Frye and Diogu, and Center is history given Oden/Pryz, and they certainly aren’t going to get time at SG, given Bayless and Fernandez.

So, they either both split the time and the money at the SF spot – or we’ll proably end up trading both downstream and substituting a true 36 mpg starter and then getting a $3 – $4 million backup like Jones, while developing Batum.

Rather than discussing our opinions about the answer to Ben’s question, perhaps we need to discuss the question itself.

There is absolutely no indication that Rudy can defend the 3 in the NBA. The guy weighs 185. He is liable to have defensive problems guarding 2s. He would be completely out muscled by most NBA 3s. Therefore, Rudy is not going to play significant minutes at the 3. He may be OK for some minutes against certain match-ups, but I think it is extremely unlikely that he has the physical tools to ever play extended minutes at the 3.

This is not to say that Nate shouldn’t do some serious experimenting with a three guard line-up. Roy, Rudy and JBay may be a great line-up that packs a ton of speed, penetration, passing ability, and strong outside shooting. However, this almost certainly means that Roy would need to defend the 3. I am curious to hear others opinions about how well this lineup would work. Dave, are you listening?

Regarding Martell as our starting 3. IMHO, no one is more likely to benefit from the arrival of Oden than Martell. GO and LA are going to stress the interior defense of every team we face. The most likely source of help for the other teams interior defenders is their SF. Martell is going to get a lot more open looks. This suits his game perfectly. He has a great body and a beautiful stroke. All he really needs is a better sense of spacing, an ability to keep his defender honest by threatening to drive, and above all confidence in his own abilities. His inconsistency and occasional hesitation are a sign that he still struggles with his confidence. I think there is a fairly high probability that Martell is going to show significant improvement this year.

On the defensive end, I think Martell is the best perimeter defender we have. He is far from “lock-down”, but he is far superior to TO and to Rudy. Roy is above average, but he is not dominant. Outlaw lacks lateral quickness and is frequently late on his rotations. Rudy lacks strength and familiarity with the league.

Bottom Line: Martell is certainly our best option at SF. With continued improvement on defense and improved confidence and consistency on offense, he may be just what the PTB needs at the 3. TO is a great spark plug off the bench, but he is less skilled as a three point threat and unlikely to ever turn into a defensive force. A three guard line-up may be a great option for significant minutes against certain teams, but we need a conventional option at the three. Martell has all the physical skills to become precisely the type of player the team needs. He should be given the chance. If he fails to develop, we may need to trade for a proven veteran three, but the cost of a trade will be much higher than if Martell can become the guy we need.

So far this summer season we’ve got Bayless making everybody forget Rudy, Rudy making everybody forget Martell…

Martell’s been working hard over the summer. I’m excited to see what progress HE’S made (if any). I’m at least willing to give him until January.

Give them all 42 games to at least learn to play together. Let’s face it, this team is very different from last years. Granted, we start with 4 of the same players starting, but we have five players this year we didn’t have last year, and everyone (wth the possible exception of Batum) is an improvement. Oden, Bayless, Fernandez, Diogu and Batum.

We’ll simply have to grow with them. We may need nothing at all other than time.

I think KP Corleone is right. The starting 3G/SF is Martell. He gets plenty of minutes because his conditioning is phenomenal and his skills are always improving. My prediction is this year everyone on the BEDGE will see the value of Martell (and Steve Blake). Rudy will have a role behind the starters and Tominhawaii will wish he was on the mainland again.