Kevin Pritchard should go all-in and acquire this much-maligned star.
by AK1984 on Jul 3, 2008 3:14 AM PDT
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PrintSALARY
2008-2009: $14,724,125
2009-2010: $16,123,250
2011-2012: $17,522,375
2012-2013: $18,921,500 ($4,000,000 Guaranteed)
STATISTICS
Player Efficiency Rating: 18.8
True Shooting Percentage: 55.0%
Assists Per 48 Minutes: 6.3
Assists Per Turnovers: 2.15
Rebounds Per 48 Minutes: 7.3
Net Points Per 100 Possessions: +13.3
Net On-Court/Off-Court +/- Production: +12.2
A package of Raef LaFrentz's expiring contract and either Travis Outlaw or Martell Webster -- who are both highly overrated by countless fans around here, which is most likely due to blind homerism -- would need to be composed to acquire the abovementioned guy. That'd be worth it, though, as a high-risk/high-reward proposition is needed to vault the Portland Trail Blazers into title contention.
Yet, once y'all figure out who I'm referencing here, there'll definitely be several folks who'll foolishly dismiss the idea without even a second thought. The problem, however, is that their misguided perceptions of this player will cause them to disregard actual facts. Unfortunately, that's what oftentimes happens when people ignore statistical analysis in lieu of less substantive measurements (e.g., attitude).
All in all, a starting lineup of Greg Oden, LaMarcus Aldridge, [Mystery Star], Brandon Roy, and Steve Blake -- along with an undeniably solid second unit of Joel Przybilla, Channing Frye, Outlaw or Webster, Rudy Fernandez, and Jerryd Bayless -- could bring home a championship. Without an improvement at small forward, though, the Blazers will only be a so-so playoff team that's unable to reach the promise land.
It's not just about making the playoffs, but rather winning the whole thing!
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This is an ex-Sonics fan
Probably still recovering from shock. Be easy fellas.
Hint for player.
Half Man, Half Lazy
Tinman
BINGO, BANGO, BONGO
I'll concede that I'm biased toward certain types of players.
I like Joel Przybilla, who’s one of the greatest man-to-man interior defenders in the NBA. Jeff Foster, Jason Collins, Jarron Collins, DeSagana Diop, and Radoslav Nesterovic are other examples of reserve piovtmen who fit that description. Premier weakside help defenders also deserve props; however, those type of guys - such as Marcus Camby, Samuel Dalembert, Ben Wallace, et al. - don’t make the same impact, even though the average fan tends to overrate blocks and rebounds in lieu of more applicable stats like net points allowed per 100 possessions.
I’m a fan of efficient field-goal shooters at the wing positions, too, which explains my appreciation toward players like Manu Ginobili, Mike Miller, and Kevin Martin. Similarly, weakside cornerman who constantly draw fouls while shooting efficiently from both the field and the free-throw line - such as Ronnie Brewer, Josh Childress, and Corey Maggette - also have my respect. Outstanding one-on-one lockdown perimeter defenders (e.g., Andre Iguodala, Tayshaun Prince, et al.) and guys who create turnovers while clogging the passing lanes (e.g., Caron Butler, Shawn Marion, Gerald Wallace, et al.) are also amazing talents in my book.
That, by the way, explains my tentative feelings about Travis Outlaw and Martell Webster. According to peripheral statistics - which were cited in an earlier comparison of mine between them and Miller, who got an unfair rap by some folks here - they’re, uh, all-around mediocre players.
Anyhow, [Mystery Player] gets a ton of undue flack from ill-informed haters. Despite his alleged character issues and past indiscretions that were blown out of proportion, the dude performs at a top-notch level whenever he’s on the court. It’s a lot like the crap that Alex Rodriguez receieves from all sides, for it’s not his fault that those around him fail to carry their weight in crucial situations. Sometimes the star is heaped with an unfair amount of the blame, though, which is a part of the game.
I don't know the indiscretions...
But what he did to his old team hasn’t been blown out of proportion. If anything, he recieved redemption way too easily because he played well instantly for his new team.
He plays at a top notch level when he feels like it.
Alex Rodriguez is maybe the best all-round player in baseball and probably gets too much crap from the NY media (I don’t follow baseball closely). This guy is an all-world talent who puts up good numbers but doesn’t clearly contribute to his team winning and he has no fire or passion. He just ‘plays’, and he’s talented enough where his coasting puts up nice, better than B-Roy even numbers. But do his numbers help the team when?
A-Rod has played poorly in the post-season nearly every year, right? He hasn’t carried his own weight.
I’m willing to have my mind changed, I just don’t see how we’d be ill-informed about a guy whose laziness and attitude are well documented and really don’t get blown up as bad as a NY-area player would usually get.
Martell and Travis ARE mediocre right now. My opinion isn’t based on not wanting to lose them. It’s totally based upon having no need for this player and his headaches are REAL and have occured every season. He decides he isn’t getting the ball enough, starts slumping his shoulders and gets this “poor me” look on his face, and proceeds to waltz away on defense and shoot bad shots. He just ain’t a winner, and at this point in his career I don’t see how or why he would change.
And he doesn’t deserve a shot on a team that’s due for good things like Portland.
We could use an upgrade at SF, for sure. I’d rather stay the same with the role player-esque dudes we got now than get a known disruptive volume scorer when we don’t need scoring.
His rep is well earned for being a lazy, moody, selfish player. What he did to his old team… oooh, it burns my small market britches.
Mortimer
Mystery Player: RON ARTEST
Just what Portland wants…. Ron-Ron Cancer to come to our clubhouse.
Here are the options that are 18.8PER: Only one is a SF…. Mr. Artest…
http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/hollinger/statistics?sort=per&qual=true&pos=all&seasonType=2
Hollinger Stats: Player Efficiency Rating – All Positions
RNK Player GP Min FG% FT% TS% PER
41 Ron Artest, SAC 57 38.0 .453 .719 .535 18.89
42 Vince Carter, NJN 76 39.0 .456 .816 .550 18.87
Some people (naysayers) think that Martell Webster and Travis Outlaw are “highly over-rated… due to blind homerism”, but I think these two young stars are just IN-THE-MAKING stars who are already at a level to compete and succeed in the NBA at ages 21 and 23. Cutting-bait on these two preps-to-pros would fall under classical GM mistakes of developing a player and trading him right at the time they are going to explode so some other franchise and fanbase can reap all the rewards (see Jermaine O’Neal). Not on my watch bro.
Not for Ron-Ron Artest.
by Portland Dynasty on Jul 3, 2008 8:30 AM PDT up reply actions
Hollinger = no defense
And that’s at least half of what makes Artest special. I agree that the man does not belong in the Blazers clubhouse, but on talent alone he’s incredible.
Kevin Pritchard is a 4.0 Draft Day Student
Ron Artest is only on contract for 1 more year...
It cant be him, and in no way would I support getting him…
RUDY > MJ
Target Devin Harris from NJ
If Kiki is looking for salary relief, DH is all I want off of his roster
Half man--
—Half a season!
Yeah…. no. My post on this matter got ate by the post monster, but basically, it said it is foolish to NOT account for attitude. This mystery player is extremely talented but that talent has never amounted to anything but numbers. He LITERALLY, not figuratively, takes nights off and decides to play even less defense than normal and jack up nothing but long two’s and early three’s. He pouts when he doesn’t get his shots, has some of the worst body language in the league, and he depresses the hell out of me because he’s talented enough to NOT be a joke.
Plus, old management types were trying to trade for him back when he was trying to ruin his old team by faking injuries and refusing to play (as soon as he was traded his injuries somehow went away and he played great), and he REFUSED to come to Portland in a trade. Thus, screw him. His legacy will be as a coasting hack who was given all the talent in the world and never utilized it fully.
Like I said, he’s “good”. But he don’t play a lick of defense and hates when he doesn’t get to shoot and would not like a coach telling him to play within the offense and defer to Roy and Oden and LMA. Is he at the point in an old lame hack’s careers where they think of their legacy and want to win a championship? Ehhh, with this guy I don’t care. I hate “him” the player for what he did to his old team, and he doesn’t deserve a ring.
Do you really wanna use our last bit of cap space we’ll have for the next decade for the honor of paying this guy 17.5 when he is in his mid-30s and relies on his ever-dwindling athleticism? His main thing is scoring, and I don’t see how we need scoring…
At SF, we either need a star who is able to play within a system without causing trouble or a star role player who plays defense and can stretch the defense with his 3’s. We don’t need an offense only player, ya know?
Especially one who has a history of not wanting to play in Portland, for semi-destroying his previous team, for deciding to take nights off constantly, and for putting up some of the most meaningless stats since Dominique Wilkins.
I forgot what else I had wrote.
So, you might think some misguidedly will poo-poo this idea, but why is he a good option for this team? What does he do, that we need? This would be a Trader Bob type deal.
I understand your worry that most of us would dismiss him outright, but it’s presumptuous to hink there is no merit behind that reaction. How are my perceptions, for example, misguided? I think the reputation he has is fully earned. The best thing you can say for him is, he puts up good numbers and has been healthier than before.
Mortimer
You made some marvelous points about Vince Carter's ...
age, dwindling athleticism, enormous contract, tendency to linger beyond the arc and jack long-range bombs, and reported issues about not playing at a one-hundred percent clip. Carter, however, is actually a decent defender; that’s noted by his teams usually allowing less points per 100 possessions when he’s on the court. Now, with regards to Carter’s apparent disdain for the Pacific Northwest, that’s a dagger in the heart; it kills any potential deal.
By the way, I applaud the Bob Whitsitt reference.
I always thought that Mike Miller would be a wonderful fit on the Portland Trail Blazers - since his horrendous defense is offset by a beautiful stroke, amazings handles, and a willingness to distribute the rock - but he’s off of the market. Corey Maggette’s slashing and defense - which compensate his ineffectiveness from downtown and ball-hogging nature - would mesh nicely alongside Brandon Roy; however, he’s likely to sign at the mid-level exception with either the Orlando Magic or the San Antonio Spurs.
At any rate, an upgrade at small forward is the last huge step in this process led by Kevin Pritchard. Since Pritchard has done an impeccable job thus far in his reign, I’ll put my trust in him to make the right decisions.
Could the less points per possession
Be partially because he played with Jason Kidd, who while not as quick as before, is still a really good strong defender as long as he isn’t playing Chris Paul? (and now, he plays with Devin Harris, who I also consider a strong defender) I could be wrong, but I’ve never watched the Nets and come away with the impression that Carter was working on defense… he gets steals, but like you said in another post those aren’t a very good indicator of ‘good’ defense, just willingness to gamble normally (not in all cases, of course).
Maggette would be a great fit on a team that needs athleticism, but I’ve also never thought he was a good defender also. Dunleavy reportedly always complains about Maggette’s low BBIQ, but what he does well he does really well—slashing and getting to the line. The Raptors could really use him, the Spurs, the Magic like you say.
I don’t think he’d be a good fit next to Roy, however, because he needs the ball to slash and he’s not a good shooter. He’s not a ballhandler per se, but he doesn’t really play off the ball either. Our SF needs to be able to shoot, because with Oden, LMA, and Roy, the enemy is already gonna wanna pack the lane and cut off Roy’s penetration and our bigs inside game. A Maggette makes that a lot easier because he shoots a line drive shot—and then for what he does well, penetration and strong Jack-esque drives, the defense being able to pack the middle takes away his best attributes. In Toronto this would be compensated more gooder because everyone else in the lineup has 3 point range, from PG to C.
If we got a vet, I’d prefer a smart one that the players can learn from, not one known for being less brainy when it comes to basketballin’. Someone who has experienced big games, has learned tricks… that sorta’ old timer stuff.
I would prefer Mike Miller to VC, and my only real misgiving would be the defense like you mention. He’s a smart player, unselfish, beautiful jumper, and largely underrated. If we didn’t have big cap space coming up that we want to preserve and try to make a deal with, I’d be more in the corner of getting a solid, smart vet like Mike Miller, but getting him isn’t worth forgoing the potential of making a bigger trade or signing next summer.
The SF is the last position to be addressed with upgrading, and I’m going to guess it’s one that’ll either fix itself this season by the play of Marty or Trouty, or through a RLEC trade or the cap space. We can afford to do that, and really since those two are so young and full of potential, another halfseason won’t hurt to see what they are like now. Since we’re good everywhere else and at the very least they were a ‘solid’ tandem, I don’t mind waiting and seeing how much we really need to upgrade the spot—at least before we take on contracts that inhibit our flexibility.
And judging from all the various interviews with KP and what he says about Allen’s feelings on the matter, it seems like the cap space is important to them for the various reasons they have that I’m not even thinking of. There’s a lot they can do aside from sign a free agent, and it seems like they’re chomping at the bit to work with it.
I’d be fine losing it if the right player came along of course. I’m easy!
Mortimer
Corey Maggette would definitely complement ...
Hidayet Turkoglu with the Orlando Magic, Predrag Stojakovic with the New Orleans Hornets, Manu Ginobili with the San Antonio Spurs, or Anthony Parker with the Toronto Raptors for the reasons that you mentioned in your post. At the mid-level exception, Maggette will be an downright bargain for one of those ballclubs.
Conversely, Brandon Roy would benefit by playing alongside a stout on-the-ball defender who can spot up from the corner and drain three-pointers - which essentially describes Shane Battier, who’s unfortunately a mainstay with the Houston Rockets - thus, Maggette isn’t the best option. Battier is praised for his intangibles and character, too, but it’s extremely doubtful that Houston will move him.
Anyhow, after further thinking about Vince Carter and his personal circumstances, he should be dealt by the New Jersey Nets - which is obviously looking to cut future payroll in an attempt to lure LeBron James there during the summer of 2010 - to a big-market team wherein he’s not the first option. In that situation, Carter would garner heavy media attention without being hassled by lofty expectations.
Regarding the above scenario, the optimum location for Carter would ironically be the Portland Trail Blazers’ major rival down in California. With Lamar Odom - who’s got an expiring contract worth approximately $14 million in salary next season - reportedly on the block after a disappointing performace in the 2008 NBA Finals, a straight-up trade involving him going to New Jersey for Carter makes sense for everyone.
Plus, it’d be interesting to watch whether or not Carter and Kobe Bryant could manage to set aside their egos and work together as a tandem … or, perhaps, explode like a bundle of dynamite.
#25#25#25#25#25#25#25#25#25. Furthermore,
"Besides, AnntheFan will be here any minute to #25 you." T Darkstar
I hated on Sonics fans for their blinded homerism toward Kevin Durant, ...
so it’s not like I’m being a hypocrite here. They couldn’t see through Durant’s selfish play, horrendous defense - which makes Brandon Roy, who’s an average defender, look like Sidney Moncrief - and chucker mentality; however, I constantly pointed it out with brutal honesty much to their dismay.
Look, all things considered, fans tend to overrvalue their own assets; it’s a natural reaction. If I don’t account for the homerism that’s presented by run-of-the-mill fan(antic)s - regardless of their affiliation, for that is irrelevant no matter the situation - then I’m being dishonest to myself; that isn’t my style.
so your rude everywhear you go?
we dont overvalue outlaws current play, we simply value what he still has left to show the league. your asking for a trade that would net us someone that has topped out in favor of one that has not. the one that has not is by all accounts a good charictor guy, the one you want, well, lets just say some are sceptical.
pritch is so highly regard precicley becouse he is NOT a stat whore, and understand the nessesaty of moral and attitude. your effourts at self importance are impressive
"If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything at all"
Mom
he's even rude in his underwhear
precicley becouse thears nuthing thear
but still, hes a good charictor guy like Clay Bennett.
Where have all the flowers gone?
by bilingual octopus on Jul 3, 2008 8:39 AM PDT up reply actions
Good call, ATF
Plus, #25 might turn into Vince Carter in two years (minus the mental issues). His athleticism is just freakish.
"I think it’s going to be very beautiful game next year."
-Batuuuuuuuum!
by rockingharder on Jul 3, 2008 12:40 PM PDT up reply actions
True dat ATF
Also, being here for a day now it would be tough to pick up on the importance of the culture that has been created. As the slogan in kindergarten goes, “Attitude is contagious. Is yours worth catching?”
This is Vin-Sanity
He only plays hard during contract years. Remember his tankjob with the Raptors? Sulking on the bench until he got traded. Ughhh. Dick Chaney has more heart than half man, half lazy.
Didn't the Blazers...
almost acquire this “mystery” player for real about 5 years ago? Ugh, talk about a disaster. But to give credit where credit is due, Vince was one shot from almost singlehandedly beating AI and the Sixers in 2000. That was a great series. His slam dunk contest of that year is also stuff legendary.
That's partially why he bums me out
If he was committed and used all of his talent, he coulda’ been one of the best in the NBA. Baron Davis is like that too. They can be so AMAZING, but they don’t seem to mind not playing how we all know they can play most of the time…
I can’t stand him because of what he did to Toronto (and of course, Toronto’s horrible old GM, Babcock, got maybe the worst deal for anyone ever—much worse than Pau for Kwame. Babcock got 2 role players that I forget the names of but weren’t bad, and an Alonzo Mourning who refused to show up to Toronto and somehow he forced Toronto to buy him out—and he got all or most of his money! What the hell kind of deal was that, Babcock?!). I can only imagine how much a die hard Raptor fan would feel…
Has anyone like this betrayed the Blazers in this manner? We could say some of the bad Blazers who got in trouble ‘betrayed’ us, but have we had a franchise talent who just completely tanked on us and forced his way out? I don’t remember one in my lifetime… even Sheed didn’t tank his way out, he played well… in his own Sheed way.
Mortimer
In Babcock's defense
VC left him little choice but to trade him for $.25 on the dollar with the way he was poisoning the team and locker room. Mourning, on the other hand, deserves no defense for his actions. If I was the Raptors management at the time I would have refused to buy him out and then suspended him indefinitely when he didn’t show up to play.
Blazer betrayal
The closest we came to a guy tanking his way off the team: Derek (my tooth really hurts) Anderson. When the guy did play, you could bet he was going to clank any important shots. Mind you he was assisted by Cheeks, who decided that running a final play with DA was our best option. Scary to remember those times. Thanks god for the Alan Houston exception.
"DA sucks!"
I went to a Bobcats/Knicks game a couple years back and spent the entire game heckling DA every time he touched the ball.
"I think it’s going to be very beautiful game next year."
-Batuuuuuuuum!
by rockingharder on Jul 3, 2008 12:43 PM PDT up reply actions
Van Exel
But he may not count in this context since I never really considered him a tue Blazer.
"...and that loud noise you hear coming is the Portland Trailblazers." - Charles Barkley
Yeah...
I guess we have had plenty of players ‘give up’ for the end of a season (Ratliff, Van Exel, DA, uhhhhhhh, more), but none we had cheered for and loved and anointed as a franchise player, right?
Does the Bill Walton doctor injury wierd stuff count? I don’t even know that full story, just seen it hinted at around here. I never really saw Bill Walton play.
Mortimer
Yes
Best source of the Walton story is “Breaks of the Game” by the late David Halberstam
http://www.amazon.com/Breaks-Game-David-Halberstam/dp/0345296257/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1215118659&sr=8-4
I recently purchased
and that book is on the expensive side.
Only on the first chapter but plan to really get into it in the next few months.
Ford: Bill, you're claiming victory already? Have you had a "Mission Accomplished" banner printed yet?
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/draft2008/columns/story?page=DraftDebate-080624
hay rat, have you ever heard a rumer about aldridge being unhappy?
"If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything at all"
Mom
I advocated this last year
when he was a UFA. Then he signed that absurd contract.
Pass.
Last year, I expected that Vince Carter would sign with the ...
Charlotte Bobcats.
Michael Jordan, however, decided to blow the team’s salary cap space by trading the draft rights of Brandan Wright for Jason Richardson. I’m still baffled by Jordan’s choice to spend so much money - as well as part with a useful asset in Wright, who might’ve looked all right playing beside Emeka Okafor - on a decent, albeit overrated and overpaid swingman. That indirectly led to Jordan wasting more money by trading for the defensively inept Nazr Mohammed, too, who was acquired on a whim to cover for Sean May’s season-ending injury.
Anyone who wants proof that success on the court doesn’t always equate to front office savvy should check out the track record of ol’ Jordan … or Larry Bird … or Kevin McHale … or Isiah Thomas.
Anyhow, Carter ultimately re-signed with the New Jersey Nets; he must’ve hoped that Richard Jefferson, Jason Kidd, and him could’ve made some strides in the Eastern Conference. Yet, without any experienced post players to carry the load down low - as Josh Boone, Nenad Krstic, and Sean Williams were long-term projects rather than short-term answers - that perimeter-oriented trio was doomed to failure. Since Jefferson and Kidd have been shipped off elsewhere, Carter is the last one of them remaining who’s yet to get his ticket out of town.
I loved the J-Rich move....
MJ got a guy that played all 82 games and put up 22pts 5.5rpg and 3apg on 44%fg and 40%3pt, and he got it for Brandon Wright. Who only appeared in 38 games and put up a paltry 4ppg and 2rpg in 10mpg. I would say MJ got the best of that deal and then a whole lot more…
RUDY > MJ
MJ was smart
JRich was an excellent move. A lot of people didn’t see him and his absence prevented GS from getting to the playoffs. He also shot tremendously. At one point, he shot 45% at the 3 point arc with the second most made 3’s. This past season, he showed he still has game. His biggest problem is consistency and camping at the arc.
Wrong Timing, Too Expensive.
I’s premature to blow your cap space on a player who will be on the downside of his career in three years when the Blazers are serious title contenders. After all, he’ll have a five year contract, and will no longer have the market value to enable the Blazers to trade him out for a younger player that will be a key part of the Blazers when they are in there peak.
If the Blazers learned one thing, it is to not get tied up in huge contracts that restrict your future. The reason we have cap space, is because we’re finally getting rid of those types of contracts – but it took 3 years to do it. This player would consume 25% or more of our entire payroll. Yet, we will also have to pay front line players like Oden, Roy, Aldridge, and then players like Bayless, Fernandez, etc, as well as the othe players in the rotation. If you take this contract, it affects your ability to pay and keep the other players. And for what? Two or three prime time years? Maybe?
The need at wing is for a solid player that fits with the other players. He does not need to carry the team, and we do not need to pay $18 million a year just for that player. No champion any longer has 5 all-stars – because they can’t pay for 5 all-stars. The Spurs and Boston are classic examples of this. The Spurs do not have an $18 million player at wing. They compensate. Boston had Pierce, but compensated at Center and Point.
If you look at the free agent market this summer, you can clearly see that when players like Josh Howard, Magette, etc are available at $10 million to $12 million, and Barron and Elton Brand at $13 million to $16 million, that we can upgrade in the context of the entire team – but we don’t need to blow the entire cap on a player who is not Lebron or Kobe, and whose salary would cause us to underpay and eventually lose some of the other players that are equally important to winning a championship.
VC = Lame
"These are dreams that we have." --Rudolfo Fernandez
by bfan on Jul 3, 2008 6:45 AM PDT reply actions 1 recs
Interesting suggestion but not a good idea
Although I’m fairly new to BE, I’ve been a Blazer fan since the mid 70s and can remember seeing Walton, in person, asking the crowd for someone to bring his bycycle back and the hearing the chants of “Mighty Mo!”. Having said that, I applaud you for offering up your idea in spite of the heavy flak it’s inevitably going to receive from some people. Your point that hometown fans will overrate their own players is true facts. I have seen it happen for over 30 years with fans and Blazer players. Myself included. Let me also say that we’ve had some GREAT players here. Why Terry Porter’s jersey hasn’t been retired is beyond me. But I digress a little bit. If indeed Vince Carter is your ‘mystery star’, and even if he isn’t, this trade doesn’t make sense for me (baggage aside). There’s too much future potential in RLEC, Outlaw, and Webster to trade for someone soon to be on the downside of his career. This team needs to be let grow a little more. However, other than Roy, we HAVE been a little weak at the SG and SF positions. If indeed TO and MW are overrated, this next season should be telling. They can both be spectacular at times, but also they can both disappear. BTW, if you read other fan blogs and they talk about the Blazers, TO and MW usually aren’t on the ‘players to fear’ lists. Their inconsistancy may be attributed to their youth. TO, if he had gone to college for four years would have been a rookie this last season and MW is even younger. Can they both grow into solid players, perhaps even stars? Sure, absolutely. Will they? Well, maybe. Only time will tell and that’s why I think they should both be given at least another year to develope. We gave up on Jermaine O’Neal MUCH too early, for instance. I also think RLEC will get us much more value toward the trading deadline. Between Roy, Rudy, Travis, and Martell, there will be a logjam for playing time at the SG/SF positions eventually (I know TO also plays PF but that’s not his best position) which makes trading either TO or MW a likely possibility if one or both continue to progress. And if they become very marketable we would be better served if we had our eyes open for potentially high first round draft picks as our own are not likely to be.
But keep on coming up with ideas, that’s the whole entertainment value of this, anyway!
As far as the upcoming season goes, I think the first part will be difficult, but these guys should gel fairly quickly and make some noise if the playoffs this next year. Providing everyone stays healthy. And I don’t think they’ll need 3 or 4 years to become contenders as I keep reading – 2009-2010 is not an unreasonable estimate.
Now if we can trade for a play-by-play radio announcer that doesn’t go into ‘whine’ mode whenever the Blazers aren’t doing well, that would be really something. It just becomes unlistenable. “Bonzi Wells (when he was with Memphis) did a flop! And the refs bought it!” Like he never did that when he was with the Blazers.
We are supposed to use our valued assets
On someone you do not even have the courage to name? Probably not.
that guy was sweet.
it was the heat right? i had some old basketball game and i would put him in and bomb threes. those were the days.
Before Heat, it was Dallas
I remember him getting some minutes with Nelly coaching in Dallas. I remember him later being on the Heat and the Clippers. He was a 7’1 Chinese version of Antoine Walker if memory serves.
Gimmicks don't make dynasties
Who the heck are we talkin' about???
I’m confused- Ex- sonic? not VC or CM or MM….
who we talkin’ ‘bout here, Willis???
I feel dumber
for having read this thread.
Going all in when you’ve acquired a huge chipstack is only prudent in no-limit hold-em. This is a different game.
agreed
I got written up becouse I said to a customer, with a soup standing behind me, “and for call quality, would you like to place your order?”
"If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything at all"
Mom
That is classic.
You still have a job right?! If I was your supe I would have laughed and walked away. Which supe was it?
erika huh? who is the newest supe?
i thought i saw you post about him on here a while ago. something about him looking the part so they hired him.
it makes perfect sense actually.
there’s some old joke that describes crappy sales person that I can’t quite think of that seems applicable, he couldn’t sell a (whatever) to a (whatever).
messed up
you know how smart I am. you have to translate any thing that requires extra thought
"If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything at all"
Mom
that sux
I really meant it. for some reason I keep starring at the 414 and coming up blank
"If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything at all"
Mom
i'm going camping with my mom and step dad
my step dad left last night to get a spot. it should be fun. I’ve been working that six week challenge with my selectechs. i’m a 2 weeks in and starting to look different! it’s good stuff.
Ive been meening to start
a you tube account using my webcam, but I dont know how to use my cam, cause its built in. Oh want to hear something funny, I have a client. somebody listens to me. lol
"If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything at all"
Mom
yup
she is so excited, I spent about 20 to 30 minutes with her, and she is ready to go.
"If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything at all"
Mom
nope
in person and through email, I dont have my phone. haha. and she is not through my work. she is not a milf, but with the right effort could be
"If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything at all"
Mom
she found out whare I work
then said “I dont have any money…... Im doing her probono…HAAAHAhahaha… ooooohhh that was funny
"If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything at all"
Mom
is the rugged out door living
going to help at all?
"If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything at all"
Mom
the six weeki challenge.
infact I cant believe that nobodys came up with a show for the obese whear they have to go to survival camp, learn how to build leantoos, set traps, fish, all survivor style, the act of not like the show. I see a prize for the most weight lost. there will be gathering wood, long walks, no more rediculous gorging…
"If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything at all"
Mom
I think it's going to get in the way!
I won’t be able to work out until Sunday, which would be OK if I can get one in today before I leave. I’ll do pushups or something.
no way
are you just going to be drinking, eating mac and chease, staying completley imobil? wait a minute, your taking the comforts of home arnt you. your middle class camping, hah. in that case, eating whatever you want that was packaged, or could be put in a cooler, full of 2 doller perbag ice, sitting in folding chares and not doing in anything….. DONT DO IT
"If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything at all"
Mom
it's about strength training
i won’t be able to do that. sure i’ll be active, i’m generally active these days anyway.
you know its the lifestyle
hey you do you think that its becouse weve hijacked this thread or becouse I gave the guy an a$$hat? what do you think tipped him? and you know what that guy has corrected my grammer concerning your sooo many times. could he work a more useless angle? I gues Im going to get kicked off soon
"If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything at all"
Mom
DUUUUUUUDE!!!!!
fine, im going to the store to buy cigerretts. lol
"If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything at all"
Mom
she was trying to cash a 10,000 dollar check
and it wasn’t going through. it was a mess man. and nobody would help me help her. everybody is already on vacation. total bs. so many companys pay all this lip service to customer service, but when you get right down to it, it doesn’t mean a thing.
just enough to get by
its the american way. btw what was the big rush? did she have something planned for the money? better yet, whats her phone number? haha
"If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything at all"
Mom
it was settlement because she slipped
on stairs or some crap. my guess is that she’s been out spending the money already.
i got PD to kind of give me an apology
in his Fan Perspective: Over-rate vs. Under-rate fan post. actuall it’s not really an apology but it will have to do.
I saw his first lame attempt
asmitting when youve made a mistake is so hard to do
"If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything at all"
Mom
i've thought about that in the corner of my mind
but i haven’t really put any thought into what it should be. it’s gotta kick butt whatever it is.
you should use a picture of
sam bowie, that would be hilarious
"If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything at all"
Mom
its off the lame scale
seriously I havent seen readings like theeze since that one time at bandcamp….
"If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything at all"
Mom
Mt. Hood reflected in a lake.
Totally lame, but it will have to be until I think of something better.
do the picture of ha
the one ware he is holding the giant global basket ball, the one he is giving a giant bear hug to
"If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything at all"
Mom
God I remember that year.
Trying to get excited about Ha’s potential. Really like Khryapa’s hustle and defense. Thinking Outlaw could be great at some point. Thinking Martell was an awful draft pick. Those were the days. In the Steve Blake thread I linked to a Suns @ Blazers on Mar. 12th 2006 boxscore. If I remember right Z-Bo hit a halfcourt shot that game.
I was watching some highlights last night
and one was of zboe getting tripple teamed, not even looking for help, he jumps, fades and just miliseconds before he landsgets his shot off. the guy could play.
"If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything at all"
Mom
actually levi is running the floor right now
Im really happy for him, Ive always liked him and he certainly deserves it. he reads the bedge 2 sometimes, so in case he reads this, I’m still better then you Levi:)
"If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything at all"
Mom
that's nice. he's got a good heart.
even if he did bail on the blazers before last season when he foudn out Oden wasn’t going to be playing . . . :)
HAHAHAHAhahaha
at least he kept ..HAHAHAhahaha…ooohh at least he kept half his season….ooohh
"If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything at all"
Mom
Hay Levi
you know Im just kidding right? thaerry is cute and all, but what makes an allstar is consistanntly performing at a hihg leval, something we both know I just dont have the mental fortitude for. your mental perservirence is one of the traits i admire in you becouse it is so glarring in myself. and your girlfriend, shes hot. HAAAAhahaha. sorry, couldnt resist
"If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything at all"
Mom
I agree that Artest
would not be a good fit for our squad, but I have noticed that, perhaps more than any other player, Artest can shut down Brandon. I remember in the last game of the season against the Kings, Artest simply abused Brandon physically on defense, effectively shutting him down. It would be nice to prevent this….
...but still definitely not worth it.
doesnt artest
abuse everyone on defence?
"If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything at all"
Mom
why not.....
let RLEC expire, save the cap room and pay this core of blazers when the time comes to get paid? acquiring Ron-Ron or VC would make me vomit (VC especially).
hey now that's an idea!
a brilliant idea, I say. Let RLEC expire and use the $$ to sign the guys we have and keep them happy, keep them in a Blazer uniform forever. Wouldn’t it be cool to see all these guys play their entire careers in Portland? Maybe they could even pool their money and buy a WNBA franchise for Portland. It’d be cool to have chick hoops back in P-Town. I dig chick hoops, expecially Candace Parker style chick hoops. That chick got some serious game.
Where have all the flowers gone?
by bilingual octopus on Jul 3, 2008 10:04 AM PDT up reply actions
i cant tell
if you were serious with that post. The first half seemed genuine, but then you spoke of how cool the WNBA is…
by PippenAintEasy on Jul 3, 2008 10:07 AM PDT up reply actions
Hey! What's un-cool about the WNBA?
I mean, there’s a bunch of woman (Some of whom are actually quite pretty in a tall, lanky way ie. Candace Parker) running back and forth jumping and gyrating in fetching ways. Seriously, that’s cool in my book. Throw in a basketball – even better! Now, I think the WNBA needs a new uniform code, like something patterned after Baywatch. “Run, Pamela! Run!”
"...and that loud noise you hear coming is the Portland Trailblazers." - Charles Barkley
I'm not as worried about saving money
To sign our guys, because Paul Allen has and will again go all in to keep the team intact, and if they are proven to be the right players to go all in with, then Paul Allen will pay ‘em. After that, it’s up to the players to be okay getting paid more than they could elsewhere BUT you gotta win a lot of games BUT you’ll also have to share the ball BUT have big clunky rings weighing down your two fists.
The ‘cap room’ disappears after next summer because of the Roy and LMA re-signings. I’d rather get a good to great role player who fits us perfectly, and I won’t worry about re-signing everyone to what their market value is because Allen did it before, and probably paid MORE back then; especially considering the value he got back.
We don’t need to save money.
Mortimer
I disagree
obviously spending more money would only make the team better, but it may seem like buying a championship if the blazers went out and got some big name for a lot of cash. The blazers are in a position to be a very good team put together by savvy drafting, not buy the deep pockets.
by PippenAintEasy on Jul 3, 2008 1:07 PM PDT up reply actions
Vince=one of the biggest quitters ever.
We just got rid of all of our quitters and babies. This guy plays when he feels like it. He is not a team player, even when he was on Team USA. He always blames someone else.
Our whole team has been built around never quitting, giving it your all, and leaving it all on the court (cliche after cliche, but true nonetheless). It would be a horrific shattering of everything they’ve built to 180 on that stance now.
No, never, not in a million years.
by you'vegottomakeyourfreethrows on Jul 3, 2008 10:01 AM PDT reply actions
yeah but
the whole “i play when i wanna” was proven to be overcommable by a unified team (talking about randy moss and the patriots). If your team locker room is strong enough, bringing in a disgruntled superstar can become quite a bargain. Howeva, VC’s contract is a bit higher than Moss’ was.
That being said, I hate VC and I dont think he would help as much as James Jones would, and JJ can be had for a third of the price!
by PippenAintEasy on Jul 3, 2008 10:05 AM PDT up reply actions
You're right about that--
—unfortuntely, our main players are very young and VC won’t come in respectin’ them. HE is the top Dogg where he is from, and both teams he has been on this is true. Roy, Oden, LMA, they’re rookies too a guy like him. He won’t feel like he has to fit in with what’s going on, because he’ll be the experienced vet in this situation.
Know what I mean? If we were further along and the culture and attitude of the team was set in stone (like the Patriots I guess), then we could absorb a VC and by the sheer will of the team’s unified attitude (and the respect that comes from being consistently great players) force him to be more what we’re looking for.
You can’t change a zebra’s spots of course, and we’d probably still not get the full VC—but no one ever has.
Mortimer
Wow a site of Pritchard disciples......making VC trade proposals?
Wtf? One of the biggest prima donnas in the league, the guy openly admitted he didn’t try in Toronto and forced a trade to NJ.
The Blazers are better off just letting LaFrentz expire since you’ll have a crapload of contracts to extend in a few years anyways.
+1
You make a solid point about RLEC. I was starting to feel the same way, especially after we traded for Bayless. If even 3 out of our 4 incoming rookies work out, we will probably need almost all the cap relief RLEC would provide. However, KP has been almost as good with managing contracts as he is with draft business, so hopefully he’s already visualizing what the salary structure will look like in 4-5 years. That is the most worrisome thing about having a bunch of heralded rookies coming in at the same time…I hope we don’t lose our stars or critical role players to desperate teams through free agency because we didn’t have cap space.
Unfortunately it gets a bit more complicated once your elite players are due for extensions
Everyone says the same talk about wanting to play for a contender, but when it’s time for contract renewals, everyone is seeking the long-term financial security that NBA players so desire. I would hate to see the Blazers fall victim to that, and I do think guys like Roy and Aldridge would be willing to take paycuts in order to keep the team a contender.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 3, 2008 11:09 AM PDT up reply actions
Based on past Blazer salaries
Paul Allen can afford and has paid top dollar to keep the former Blazer teams together, especially in the late 90’s/early aughts.
If the guys we assemble are truly championship caliber, he’ll pay fair market value to keep them together. The MONEY is the last thing I worry about with a Paul Allen team.
All I worry about is someone like Bayless, Webster, whoever else, being too good to be a co-star with the Blazers, when they could be a Joe Johnson somewhere else. THE MAIN DIFFERENCE from that situation is, unlike PHX, Portland will pay them Joe Johnson money to keep them around if they are the right fit for the team. It would have to be a guy just purely wanting to be the main guy elsewhere, because if he’s that good he won’t get more money elsewhere…
After we have this capspace next summer, we gotta re-sign LMA and Roy the following summer. Upon that re-signing, we’ll likely be in luxury tax land for the next decade-plus. And that’s fine! Paul Allen has been in DEEP, beyond what the Knicks’ have paid, luxury tax hell for BAD teams.
Past history suggests Paul Allen will pay up, and KP hints at that when discussing the keeping of the good players.
It won’t be like other small-market teams, or even some of the big market teams like the Lakers, where the owner doesn’t hve all that much money in NBA owner terms.
Mortimer
paul allen
in the 90’s, when his fortune was being created, had a lot of cash to spend wherever he pleased. He has lost half his fortune since then. He is still spending money buying draft picks, but the pippen/randolph type spending days are over.
by PippenAintEasy on Jul 3, 2008 1:11 PM PDT up reply actions
I doubt that
If we got good players, he’ll pay ‘em. Always has. He ain’t exactly in the poor house, even amongst billionaires.
You don’t think Oden/Roy/LMA would get the max if they deserved it? If someone is good enough, they’ll lock ‘em up as long as they wanna stay in Portland and make the same (or more) they’d make elsewhere.
He’s still the richest owner in the NBA, by a large amount. His wealth is from before the 90’s, and he bought the Blazers in like 87/88 with the billions he had then. He’s “lost” a lot with the fluctuating Microsoft stock and bad business deals and the fun stuff he does with his cash (sci-fi museum, building the first privately created space ship), but he has billions and billions left to play with and play he shall till the end of his days.
Mortimer
I'm with Morty...
The Blazers are his first love. If he sees the chance to win his first (and several following) championship, he’ll fork over the dough.
This is his hobby… a real passion for the guy.
by you'vegottomakeyourfreethrows on Jul 3, 2008 3:08 PM PDT up reply actions
BIGGEST FRONT LINE EVER
Shaq at center, Oden at PF, LMA at SF, Outlaw at SG, and Roy at PG. Think of the length!!
Unfortunately, Shaq doesn’t get out of bed for less than 20+ million a year :-(
Mortimer
Anybody ever tried to field a starting lineup of five centers
You can’t teach height! You can’t teach height!
Such a team should be unstoppable according to the pundits (well, minus the free throw shooting and bringing the ball up court)
Coach, I promise I wasn't running hard ...
Make sure one is Dirk...
................................ I saw him carry the ball several times last year. He could play PG.
"You don't live by the jumpshot, you die by the jumpshot." ---Charles Barkley, 2/7/08
ok
trade webster for dirk, sergio for shaq, and blake for garnett, and the blazers have there starting 5.
1) dirk
2) LMA
3) Garnett
4) Oden
5) shaq
by PippenAintEasy on Jul 3, 2008 1:14 PM PDT up reply actions
The West-All Stars
had 5 7-footers a couple years back (Yao, Dirk, KG, Duncan, Shaq if I recall correctly), and the pre-game talk was that they would all be on the floor at the same time. However when push came to shove, the coach (D’Antoni i believe) chickened out and thus we lost the knowledge of what would happen with a lineup of 5 center-ish types
KP is gonna sit tight until the trade deadline.
"You don't live by the jumpshot, you die by the jumpshot." ---Charles Barkley, 2/7/08
If we learned anything last year...
............................. it’s that “much maligned stars” are not on the Blazers’ agenda.
"You don't live by the jumpshot, you die by the jumpshot." ---Charles Barkley, 2/7/08
This WOULD be going all-in.
As in, KP would be saying, “I’m all in! Take my job, my future championship rings, etc etc etc…”
"I think it’s going to be very beautiful game next year."
-Batuuuuuuuum!
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