Summer League Game 2 Recap: Blazers 74, Kings 75
by Dave on Jul 15, 2008 9:48 PM PDT
107 comments
Well…ugh. Tough game to watch folks. But all’s well that ends…oh wait. We lost, huh? Team-wise the Blazers started out extremely rough and then worked their way into shape. The last two points of emphasis in the shoot around today were “Don’t turn it over!” and “Everybody rebound!” The first quarter of this game the Blazers turned the ball over nine times and gave the Kings 8 second-chance points. “Wait, you said NOT to do that? Oh. Our bad.” However the guys must have listened to the pep talk between quarters because the final stats showed 24 turnovers total and 12 second chance points for the Kings. The defensive effort wasn’t bad. Sacramento shot 37.3% from the floor and turned the ball over 23 times themselves. The offense was another story. The Blazers made a furious late-game rally to bring their percentage up to 36%, having languished below 30% for most of the game. The three-point percentage was 14.3%. The only thing that went well offensively was the 34 free throw shots drawn. The caveat there is the Kings shot 37 themselves. It was a product of hyper-ref-activity as much as anything. However the Blazers did hit 76.5%, which was a good conversion rate. At least part of the offensive malaise can be attributed to the poor screen setting and using. Tonight that was made worse by the refs who called a ton of fouls on screens. The best way to describe the game was that it was long, drawn-out, and disjointed but the team fought hard despite not finding a rhythm. C’est la Summer League. Individual Notes: None of the three main guys had a radically different game compared to their first. Jerryd Bayless shot 16 free throws and scored 26 points. He opened up the game trying to set other people up instead of scoring so much himself. That lasted about ten minutes before we needed him. After that it was drive all night. He did grab 6 rebounds. He had 2 assists to 5 turnovers. We saw some of his leaping ability on the break tonight, which is considerable. He ended up taking both game-deciding shots, hitting the first and missing the second. He was the obvious choice, which say something about him. Petteri Koponen ended up with similar stats: 18 points, 3 assists, 4 turnovers. He shot only 1 for 6 from three-point range. You have to understand how the lack of big men scorers is affecting the team offense. It is forcing the guards to look for their own shot on a consistent basis. This is playing right into the hands of Jerryd Bayless. It’s putting Petteri in an uncomfortable position. If you look up the number of 20-shot games for Koponen in Finland I’d wager it would be pretty small. He just doesn’t look assured having to drive, pull up, and take a bunch of shots. He’s a set-up man with nobody to set up. (Keep in mind Bayless wants to receive passes and then create himself.) Nicolas Batum had another tough night. He shot 1 for 8, almost exclusively long jumpers, for 6 points, 4 rebounds, no assists, and 5 turnovers. His defense didn’t seem as crisp, but frankly that could have been the wretched flow of the game (thanks refs!) as much as his personal problems. (Koponen seemed to struggle more defensively as well.) Batum appears to be on a bad Martell Webster trip, fading to the weak side and standing still in case he’s passed the ball. This isn’t any more effective for him than it was for Martell. On a team that’s crying out for a third scorer Batum is AWOL. He needs to come out of his shell a little. We’ll let you know what the fallout is tomorrow. --Dave (blazer sub@yahoo.com)
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One thing we won't see this summer is how Bayless plays off the ball
The team is so bad offensively, we have no idea how effective Bayless will be without the ball. I’ll be looking forward to preseason.
I am still sticking to my default assertion that Batum and Koponen stay in Europe. So far, both players need more seasoning. Petko seriously needs to work on his handles and Batum is just so raw. I’m not sure the rest of the games will reveal much more.
BINGO, BANGO, BONGO
by blzrfan on Jul 15, 2008 9:57 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
If we do that
We lose them to Euro teams for 4 years probably. I think both of them will be signed this year because of that reason.
A Time For Heroes,
It's not right for young lungs to be coughing up blood
And it's all
It's all in my hands
And its all up the walls
Well the stale chips were up and the hopes stakes were down
Until Kp came into Town!
'Sing it Petey!
by Dheepan on Jul 15, 2008 10:08 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree with Dheepan of the overly-log signature...
"He shoots....................... he scores!!!"
by timbo on Jul 15, 2008 10:13 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
loNNNNNNNNNg
"He shoots....................... he scores!!!"
by timbo on Jul 15, 2008 10:13 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
They will be 23 and much improved hopefully....they are both projects who won't contribute until 4 years later anyways
BINGO, BANGO, BONGO
by blzrfan on Jul 15, 2008 10:17 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
If they are 23 and much improved
then Euro teams will be offering them huge amounts of money. And the most we can offer them is rookie scale, and the very low end of rookie scale.
By the time they are 23, they perhaps have nice homes, lots of friends, wives/fiancees, etc. And maybe by that time, they’ll say, “Forget it. You had your chance, I’ve got a great life here, and you can’t pay me a fraction of what I make here.”
There is significant risk in sending them back to Europe that they’ll never come, or that they come at the very end of their career, the way Sabonis did.
We have the roster spots, they won’t cost much money, we can send them to D-League for much of the year.
Unless KP makes another deal that takes up roster spots or significantly changes the balance of the team, I expect one, at least, of these guys to be signed, and probably both. If they can’t earn PT in Portland (which seems likely, especially Batum), expect to see some time in Idaho. PK might not go to Idaho, even if he can’t get PT in Portland, if they think he’s not that far away and they want him to be practicing with the big boys, learning the offense, etc. But if he just needs some burn, he’ll be in Idaho.
Other people don't have as much practice at being wrong as I do -- HT, timbo
by jscot on Jul 15, 2008 10:52 PM PDT up reply actions 4 recs
Excellent comments
KP is well aware that both of these guys would be grabbed by European teams if we let them go.
I wonder what Batum is like in practice. These 2 games in SL have been very hectic, sporadic and far from the more smooth flow of a regular NBA game. NBA games are quick but not generally this chaotic. Perhaps he has a bad case of stage fright with his first exposure to this rough and tumble SL where there are so many players with no chance in an NBA career which includes all but 2 of his teammates.
by OrygunRod on Jul 15, 2008 11:24 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
+1
LMA's reign as "LaMonster of the Low Post" has just begun!
by LaMarvelous on Jul 16, 2008 12:13 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Spot on.
I agree completely. We need to lock up Kopponen and Batum is worth grabbing as a project for perimeter lock down defender. The man has a 7 foot 4 inch wingspan! He has the tools he needs the training and confidence that come with practice and age. Kopponen needs work but has the skills and court vision to be a very special PG at 6 foot 4. Yes he needs to work on his handle but even that is VASTLY improved from last year. At the rate he is improving I can see him being a rotation player in 2 to 3 years.
He's Coming! Oden Slayer of Giants
by Idog1976 on Jul 16, 2008 12:31 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
You must be super high on them
I think you are overstating the risks of leaving them in Europe. Neither Petko or Batum has a track record of producing at a high level in a meaningful league. Petko has a strong desire to play in the NBA, and I think his competitiveness will drive to him to come over when the situation presents itself. Batum is so raw that leaving him in Europe to develop is better than keeping him on the roster and using a few years of his rookie contract. Watching him makes me think he’s like a Outlaw project, almost 5 years, that’s longer than his rookie contract.
BINGO, BANGO, BONGO
by blzrfan on Jul 16, 2008 1:00 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Costs nothing
As I answered you below, roster spots that we have available, and money that keeps falling out of Paul Allen’s pockets, and not very much of it at that.
It doesn’t even affect our cap space to sign them, because as first round picks, there’s a cap hold for the amount of their rookie salaries.
Batum might not be worth it at this point, except that I think he’s going to be a much faster learner than Travis. He was drafted to be a defensive stopper, and he might well be that in two years.
Other people don't have as much practice at being wrong as I do -- HT, timbo
by jscot on Jul 16, 2008 1:04 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree PK is more ready than Batum
Obviously the Blazer management is much higher on Batum than PK noting their desire to sign Batum and asking PK to prove it to them. Batum should definitely kept overseas, I don’t understand why management is so high on him this year to sign him. Batum won’t get something more than a 2 year contract in Europe anyways, he was a bench player in the French league.
BINGO, BANGO, BONGO
by blzrfan on Jul 16, 2008 1:12 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
they'll be signed for the reasons Dheepan lists
You don’t need 15 NBA ready players. 2 young guys who can learn and play mop up minutes is fine.
Boomshakalaka
by jksnake99 on Jul 15, 2008 11:22 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
"Either/or" vs. "both/and"
KP likes how Batum “balances” the roster (3rd small forward) while Koponen is a 4th point guard, assuming Sergio is still around. The “problem” for Petteri is Nate McMillian’s desire for at least one more veteran player on the roster, which is why KP wants to keep the 15th roster spot “open” so he can hypothetically sign a veteran FA who “slips through the cracks” this fall.
Basically, PetKo has to show that he’s more valuable to the roster going forward than Sergio, and if he can convince KP of this in Vegas, perhaps Sergio will be dealt for a draft choice (etc) to bring the roster back to 14 guaranteed contracts.
by two4larue on Jul 16, 2008 10:10 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Koponen Batum Quandry
I am still sticking to my default assertion that Batum and Koponen stay in Europe. So far, both players need more seasoning. Petko seriously needs to work on his handles and Batum is just so raw. I’m not sure the rest of the games will reveal much more.
We’ll lose both players essentially for good if we send them to Europe. The game over there is rising in popularity and in that time, they’ll be able to pay these guys mountains more than we could. The rookie scale, is a great thing, but it really hurts Europeans that aren’t ready to join the NBA right away.
We have the roster spots available as our team is currently constituted. These guys don’t have to be ready immediately to be on our 15. There will be an absolute plethora of players that should be getting more minutes than they will this year. Even with multiple injuries that’ll be the case. Batum and Koponen will play in the D-League, or they’ll simply watch from the bench. Money won’t be an issue, as both currently would make right around 1 Million per year. Worst case scenario is these guys being extra trade pieces. Some other teams might have better solutions than we do, or could play them right away if they’re not contenders.
Personally, I’m not a proponent of signing anymore FA’s this year. If we need an extra guy or two, they’ll be available during the trade deadline. Of the players that would be willing to accept a 1 year contract, I’m not to excited about their prospects in the first place.
This is how I see our 15 going into the year…
PG: Steve Blake / Jerryd Bayless / Sergio Rodriguez
SG: Brandon Roy / Rudy Fernandez / Petteri Koponen (PG)
SF: Travis Outlaw / Martell Webster / Nicolas Batum
PF: LaMarcus Aldridge / Channing Frye / Ike Diogu
C: Greg Oden / Joel Przybilla / Raef LaFrentz
by as11osu on Jul 15, 2008 11:23 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Hmm...
Good depth chart, but I think J-Bay will be our third-string 2 and PetKo will fight with Sergio for the 4th PG spot (behind Blake, Bayless and Roy).
"I think it’s going to be very beautiful game next year."
-Batuuuuuuuum!
by rockingharder on Jul 15, 2008 11:57 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
But ...
what about VON COOKIE???!! :)
In general, the art of government consists in taking as much money as possible from one party of the citizens to give to the other.
by TTRocks on Jul 16, 2008 8:21 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
He's running SL
with NY? Someone else, can’t remember who now.
Witty Unpredictable Talent and Natural Game
by iDea on Jul 16, 2008 9:14 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
But I was going to write a diary where we traded him for Mayo
"France is a place where the money falls apart in your hands but you can't tear the toilet paper" - Billy Wilder
by tominhawaii on Jul 16, 2008 2:20 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Kopenen doesn't need that much work - less than Bayless in many aspects
Everyone started poorly, but Kopenen started to get into the flow well before Bayless and looked like a better player for most of the game. In the third quarter, they absolutely stunk without him in there, and went on a run as soon as he came back. He’s young and raw, but played very well against some very quick and defensive oriented guards this year. I’d like to see what he is like with a chance to develop some chemistry and guys who really move without the ball. Give him a couple of months to adjust to the tempo and style and he’ll be contributing.
Bayless was terrible for much of the game, but did get more under control as it progressed. I hope he has an outside and midrange game because he isn’t going to get to the basket as easily, and won’t get the same calls in the regular league. He certainly doesn’t look like there is any hope at PG.
Batum definitely needs to go somewhere to learn to play for a few years, but he was a first rounder, so that is going to have to be on the practice squad and the D-league.
by hoopla-pdx on Jul 15, 2008 11:38 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Really?
Bayless won’t get to the rim? That’s the last of my concerns about his game…......the kid can fly up and down the court and is strong, especially his core (like a mini Roy).
Witty Unpredictable Talent and Natural Game
by iDea on Jul 16, 2008 9:16 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Bayless = Tim Hardaway
Very similar builds and game ( we hope).
( In his best seasons, Hardaway averaged 18 to 23 points and 8 to 10 assists per game. He reached 5,000 points and 2,500 assists faster than any NBA player, except Oscar Robertson. Hardaway has competed in five NBA All-Star Games. )
by ralphzillo on Jul 16, 2008 10:57 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Bayless = Tim Hardaway is most ridiculous thing i've read today.
by noaher on Jul 16, 2008 11:32 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
agreed
I don’t see the comparison.
Witty Unpredictable Talent and Natural Game
by iDea on Jul 16, 2008 12:06 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
It can't be this, can it?
That is just wrong, if he’s using this comparison. The Blazers are a team of love, trust, and understanding.
"France is a place where the money falls apart in your hands but you can't tear the toilet paper" - Billy Wilder
by tominhawaii on Jul 16, 2008 2:24 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
AND
He’s not playing point in these games. He’s getting very little usage at the pg spot. Why is EVERYONE ready to declare that it can’t be done. He’s our SG right now in SL, and he’s being directed to be aggressive and score.
Witty Unpredictable Talent and Natural Game
by iDea on Jul 16, 2008 9:18 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Koponen is already better than Sergio - so who should go?
Sergio had a whole hell of lot more to work with last year in the Summer League and pretty much sucked. Koponen has to create for himself and maybe find a big guy rolling to the hoop. With those limitations he is still getting the job done. Plus, Sergio was already signed with an NBA contract. Koponen is fighting for a contract so has a lot more pressure. And he is still getting the job done.
by ralphzillo on Jul 16, 2008 10:42 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
hmmmm
At least Sergio has shown that he can dribble the ball up court under pressure. Thats a pretty dang important pg skill if you ask me. Koponen has seriously struggled in that department against a couple of nba scrubs that might not even make a roster. I dont understand how people are so sold on a pg that has been picked several times simply trying to advance the ball and set up a play…
RUDY > MJ
by myemic23 on Jul 16, 2008 12:17 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yea...I don't get it either
You can’t play PG in the NBA if you struggle against pressure bringing up the ball. I think it’s wishful thinking talking about how if PK or Batum sign a Euro contract, their developmental trajectory will block any opportunity to jump to the NBA. PK and Batum may never good enough to crack the rotation. Not every player Pritchard drafts is going to make it, Taurean Green, Joel Freeland, Josh McRoberts, Sergio Rodriguez, these guys are all late 1st rounders/2nd. The point of drafting Euros was to allow them to develop overseas without the using our resources. In 3-4 years, Batum and PK will be more NBA ready, still 23-24 years old, and on a rookie contract.
BINGO, BANGO, BONGO
by blzrfan on Jul 16, 2008 12:46 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
You're missing the point
Two possibilities in 3-4 years, NBA ready or not NBA ready.
1. If NBA ready, they’ll be making big bucks, and all we can offer is peanuts. Possibly checkmate.
2. If not NBA ready, we won’t want them then, either.
So you evaluate talent and upside now, and decide whether it is worth the risk.
If you don’t bring them over, you run the risk of them being really good, and you can’t get them over.
If you do bring them over, you run the risk of tying up a roster spot and spending 1/4 of 1% of Paul Allen’s interest on one of his savings accounts for someone who turns out to be a bust.
Since we have the roster spots available, there’s little risk to using it.
The point of drafting Euros is NOT to allow them to develop overseas without using resources. The point of drafting Euros is that you think they will help your team now or in the future. Once you have drafted them, the point becomes to find the best way to get them to that point of helping your team. If that means bring them over, bring them over. We’re talking really small money here, and the roster spots are available.
Other people don't have as much practice at being wrong as I do -- HT, timbo
by jscot on Jul 16, 2008 12:56 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
This actually is the scenario we want.
When these Euro Players have developed and are 23-24 we want them to have the maturity to recognize that despite the pay cut this is the league to play in if you want competition. Just like the case with Rudy. Which is why he is a golden situation. We get a player who will lose 5 or 6 mil a year just to play at a higher more difficult stage. So, If Batum or PK are getting offered the big bucks in Europe, then that means they might be talented enough physically to play, but for a team like the Blazers with heart and culture, we also want mentally prepared players.. players that are willing to take a pay cut, because they love the game, not the money.
"The important thing is not to stop questioning. Curiosity has its own reason for existing. One cannot help but be in awe when he contemplates the mysteries of eternity, of life,(of the Blazers), (of KP's madness), of the marvelous structure of reality. It is enough if one tries merely to comprehend a little of this mystery every day. Never lose a holy curiosity." - Albert Einstein
by BlazerandBeaverBELIEVER on Jul 16, 2008 8:31 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes, but
When we picked Rudy, he was already committed over there, with a huge buyout in his contract. There was no possibility of him coming over last year.
If we send these guys away now, we’re creating another barrier—we’ve blown them off. That’s especially the case with Koponen now. He can legitimately claim, “Look, you saw my game, and I was ready. You didn’t want me, and now you want me to come over and play for peanuts?”
That’s less of an issue with Batum, because it doesn’t look like he is ready (though two summer games isn’t a lot to go on, maybe he has tonsillitis). But he could still end up saying, “I would have played for you for peanuts four years ago, no problem, but you weren’t interested. Well, I’m rich now, I’m one of the best SFs in the world, and I’m not interested in playing for you now.”
It’s one thing to say they love the game, and not the money. It’s another to say that a guy should ignore an opportunity to possibly take care of his extended family for several generations.
A guy who is willing to sacrifice money is one thing. To put him in a position where he has to sacrifice multi-millions because you weren’t willing to give him a cheap contract on the low end of the rookie scale is quite another.
If they think either of these guys will be NBA ready within a year or two, I expect them to sign him now before he gets tied up in Europe. It would be foolish to do otherwise.
Other people don't have as much practice at being wrong as I do -- HT, timbo
by jscot on Jul 16, 2008 11:45 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah
I’ve been really high on PK for a long time, but suddenly find everyone who was ignoring me (or mocking me) now agrees after 2(!!!!) Summer League games?
I think Koponen is better than Sergio, but it sure hasn’t been proven yet.
The only thing I’m convinced of based on those two games is that he can probably defend quite a bit better than Sergio. And that’s important. But that’s the only thing.
Other people don't have as much practice at being wrong as I do -- HT, timbo
by jscot on Jul 16, 2008 12:48 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
translate?
How do you say “Olay!” in Finish?
RipCity -- now, now ...
by Y5k on Jul 16, 2008 1:16 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Finns don't Ole'
They SISU!
“SISU” (pronounced – see’-soo) is a unique Finnish concept.
It is a word that cannot be fully translated. It defines the Finnish people and their character.
“SISU” stands for the philosophy that what must be done will be done,
regardless of cost….
One definition is: “Special strength and stubborn determination to continue
and overcome in the moment of adversity. It is a combination of stamina,
courage, and obstinacy held in reserve for hard times.”
by two4larue on Jul 16, 2008 4:03 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Who is this on my radio?
Oh…..it’s Dave. Hello Dave.
by Sabonis4Ever on Jul 15, 2008 9:58 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Score doesn't matter.
"He shoots....................... he scores!!!"
by timbo on Jul 15, 2008 10:11 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
NBA.COM
Was the feed 30min delay again? I’m going out of town for work the rest of the week and will have to watch online.
Punk Rock and Basketball aren't mutually exclusive.
by Underdogfan on Jul 15, 2008 10:25 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, I think so
I was watching on that other crappy feed and then swapped to the NBA.com one later.
by jamon51 on Jul 15, 2008 10:26 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes, it was a 30 minute delayed boadcast
"Lenny Suckerpunch Never bet on me" - Elizabeth "The Lizzard" Lowblow
by Lizzy Lowblow on Jul 16, 2008 7:04 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think Koponen
played very good D. He drew a charge or two and only got really burned one time.
by jamon51 on Jul 15, 2008 10:25 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Petko's stats
are actually pretty similar to what he has been averaging in the Finnish league. The biggest difference is probably that his seemingly modest assist rate in Finland (he has been getting 4 assists per game) is due to the scorekeepers there being very stingy about giving out assists, whereas his modest assist rate in summer league is because most of his teammates can’t make easy shots.
by trk on Jul 15, 2008 10:41 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
You esp'd my post trk
I strongly suspect that some of you didn’t watch the last 2 games and are commenting accordingly. Koponen has looked fantastic and has shown a more complete game than Bayless (so far). If we had ANY fire power whatsoever in the front court PetKo would be averaging 5+ assists. Bayless has been excellent, particularly in getting to the rim and drawing fouls, skills that are sooo needed on this jump-shooting squad.
Batum has stunk strongly thus far…sheesh, I’m looking for even a flash of why we took this guy over Randolph etc…I haven’t seen much yet, here’s hoping.
by Wotan on Jul 15, 2008 10:42 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Randolph was #14 to GS
D Arthur and Donte Green were available but by then KP had made the trade to get Batum it appears. Mike Rice was suggesting Luc Richard Mbah a Moute as a good defender. He went #37.
by OrygunRod on Jul 15, 2008 11:36 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
You're right OrygunRod...
Going back and looking at the draft, there wasn’t as much available at #25 as it seemed. That actually makes me feel a little better.
by Wotan on Jul 15, 2008 11:53 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I had a similar feeling
For a guy who played with much tougher competition than Petteri (both his home league and internationally) and many NCAA players Batum’s game looks raw.
We could have had Chalmers, but didn’t need another PG unless we e.g. had found a taker for Sergio. Darrell Arthur would have been nice, but nobody knew he could slip that far and Houston would have taken him unless we put the Batum deal in place. CDR might have helped us more on the position in the immediate future (despite his mediocre shooting), but two years younger and with more potential Batum is supposed to develop into a really nice player especially on defense. So thought the Spurs. And so think the Blazers.
Coach, I promise I wasn't running hard ...
by Norsktroll on Jul 16, 2008 7:13 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The future is the key
I think you’re right here Norsktroll. The Blazers need to see what they can do this year with their current roster, and then make adjustments. So KP is wisely planning for our future and developing talent that isn’t available immediately (Rudy, PetKo) or isn’t ready immediately (Batum, future picks). That approach gives me a lot more assurance that our team has a long term future of success.
by MavetheGreat on Jul 16, 2008 10:55 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The flashes are there
just not enough of them. Don’t you remember him streaking down the court to block the dunk/layup attempt last night? That was a great play, very good hustle and effort and timing. If the rest of his teammates showed the same effort, the kings might not have gotten the ball back and put it in as easily.
by usmcr3049 on Jul 16, 2008 9:25 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Bayless seems to be an order of magnitude
quicker than anyone else on the floor.
by raoulduke on Jul 15, 2008 11:09 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Only one more year of rights to Kopnent - right?
If I understand how things work, we’ve only got rights to Kopenen for 3 years. So, if he signs a 2 year deal with no out in Europe, we’ve lost him and he’d be a free agent in two years.
I’d like to see him starting and running a team to really develop, but he’s unlikely to get a good one year deal. If he did, he still might not get to start or play enough for a Euro team. I think the Blazers are going to have to sign him.
by hoopla-pdx on Jul 15, 2008 11:44 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
No
We get to hold on to his rights as long as he continues to play professionally in Europe. Remember that after we drafted Sabonis he continued to play in Europe for another 10 years or so, and we still held his rights when he finally decided to come over.
The problem for us is that a European team is likely to want to lock him in for 4-5 years, and if he plays well during that time he will start receiving offerers from European team for a lot more money than we are allowed to pay him. Sure he wants to play in the NBA, but will he still be so eager to do so if it means taking a big pay cut? So if we don’t bring him over now, we run the risk of not being able to get him to come over later due because we won’t be able to win a bidding war against the top European teams.
by trk on Jul 15, 2008 11:59 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm pretty sure...
... Bayless was given credit for making a FT that he actually missed at least once.
Boomshakalaka
by jksnake99 on Jul 15, 2008 11:47 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Yea,
we don’t want to put in the effort that we did for Rudy. We lucked out on being able to grab him in the draft.
by premthegrem on Jul 16, 2008 12:16 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
excuse me,
I meant sign him to a contract, not grab him in the draft (although that was pretty nice too.)
by premthegrem on Jul 16, 2008 12:16 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Did anyone see Bayless,PK or Batum give up tonight?
I did not
by coastrider on Jul 16, 2008 12:23 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I never seem
to notice Batum. Last night I even hit rewind a couple of times thinking “was that Batum?” but it never was. For me he just blends into the rest of the non-players. I keep reminding myself that he has been described as “very raw” ... sort of this year’s Freeland. If they do sign him I think he’ll be off to Boise soon enough, we need the coaches to spend their time with the guys who are further along.
"We will do nice things!" - Rudy, 07/01/08
by jorga on Jul 16, 2008 6:05 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Weaknesses from his DraftExpress profile
• Ball-handling skills improvable
• Streaky perimeter shot
• Lacks aggressiveness offensively
• Avoids contact/Soft?
• Confidence/intensity wavers
• Willingness to dominate opponents
• Gets extremely passive at times
• Not a go-to scorer
• Poor rebounder
• Still a work in progress
Yup, I think we have mostly seen the passive Batum in those two games. He should be more confident in his own abilities especially against Summer League competition and create more himself (can we take a little bit of B-Rex aggressiveness away and give it to him?). But as I tried to point out above, the Blazers knew that he is not be as NBA ready as some other guys taken around him yet seems to have great potential and is still very young.
(Don’t want to hide his observed strengths:)
• Size for wing player
• Freakish athleticism
• Outstanding wingspan
• Mid-range game
• Ability to create separation from defender
• Transition play
• Finishing ability
• Cuts to the basket
• Basketball IQ
• Court vision
• Unselfishness
• Terrific experience playing at highest level of European basketball
• Perimeter defense
• Stat-stuffing role-player potential
• Upside
Coach, I promise I wasn't running hard ...
by Norsktroll on Jul 16, 2008 7:22 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Questions for Dave
Since this is your third Summer League – how do you feel that the non-big-three compare to the supporting casts of previous years? Of course I’ve not seen previous summers on the big screen and maybe that makes a difference, but it feels like these guys are really lacking. Maybe I’m remembering training camp but it seems like Ellis and Pinnock are better than they are showing here.
Is it fair to judge rookie talent against this kind of backdrop? Would PeKo and Batum be invited to training camp if the intention was to let them stay in Europe?
How much does a year’s experience make in the NBA? I’m thinking particularly of Douby. I kept saying last night “but he’s played, he knows what to do”.
Why do these shorter games seem so much longer????
Impressions of Monty as a coach? I was sort of disturbed to see him poking Bayless and PeKo during that one time out.
And, BTW, I am so pleased that you are sitting with Lance and Quick and other “legitimate” media guys – it just shows the respect that you have garnered. I’ll bet there are some bloggers who are really really jealous. (I don’t know if you were assigned to sit there or if they invited you, but either way it’s cool.) Loved Casey’s comment “That’s a mean starting five, if any of us could actually ball.”
"We will do nice things!" - Rudy, 07/01/08
by jorga on Jul 16, 2008 6:33 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Good questions ....
but Lance a legitimate media guy?
by TwoDeep on Jul 16, 2008 11:09 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well, he works for the Blazers
as their official blogger so that makes him legitimate in my opinion.
"We will do nice things!" - Rudy, 07/01/08
by jorga on Jul 16, 2008 11:41 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Brief answers:
—Yes, the supporting cast does seem a little less involved, but I think part of this is illusion. This year both of our main players are guards, and guards who handle the ball at that. We’ve never had that kind of imbalance. Other guys just don’t get many touches. Yes we had Roy and Jack before, but there was always a Lamarcus or Martell to force us to spread the ball around.
—It’s fair to judge the talent against this backdrop as long as you don’t read too much into what they will actually do in the regular season. Bayless will not get 22 shot attempts per game. Batum and Koponen won’t play outside of blowouts. The Blazers would sign them before bringing them in to training camp.
—How much difference a year of experience makes probably depends on the player making use of that experience. Petteri looks far better this year than last. Some guys get three years and never change.
—These shorter games seem much longer when the refs blow 80+ fouls in four, 10-minute quarters.
—I haven’t been close enough to Monty yet to assess well. Maybe after practice today I’ll have a better answer.
—Hmmmm…the better way to put that last paragraph would be, “Lance and Quick are so privileged to sit next to you, Dave!” (C=
Seriously, though, everybody just sits where they want. I’ve been next to Barrett a fair amount the last couple years, but also next to scouts, other beat writers, etc. There’s not too much to read into it. You just sit where there are seats or where you see friends.
—Dave
by Dave on Jul 16, 2008 11:56 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Do you get to sit with Canzano?
"I think it’s going to be very beautiful game next year."
-Batuuuuuuuum!
by rockingharder on Jul 16, 2008 1:13 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
If so
punch him in the gonads for me.
Witty Unpredictable Talent and Natural Game
by iDea on Jul 16, 2008 2:22 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Dave
If you don’t have a Fart Machine, I can overnight you one.
"France is a place where the money falls apart in your hands but you can't tear the toilet paper" - Billy Wilder
by tominhawaii on Jul 16, 2008 2:42 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
John's voice sounds
like somebody beat you to it
(have you heard him on 955 the last few days?)
by two4larue on Jul 16, 2008 4:09 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Keep them
My attitude is you sign Koponen and Batum and then send them to the DLeaque for a year. After all, we have two spots available, and little or no playing time for anyone on the roster occupying those spots, so we might as well take a shot at these two rookies – as opposed to someone else’s. There’s no downside, after all. If Koponen keeps improving, and he has improved over the last year, then you plug him into Sergio’s spot and trade Sergio out completely. He isn’t, after all, going anywhere with this team either. He only picked up 5-10 minutes a game last year as the 4th guard in the rotation, and now he’s the 5th. It doesn’t matter what we think right now of Bayless and Fernandez. They’ll get the first call on minutes behind Roy and Blake.
by Eben Calder on Jul 16, 2008 7:09 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
PK
Having not watched either game, but read as much as I can on the performances - and judging by previous stats/statements about PetKo - I can’t help but think the guy’s a keeper. Take him, ditch Batum, and leave a spot open for that wildcard that may come our way once the season starts.
RipCity -- now, now ...
by Y5k on Jul 16, 2008 7:29 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Ditch Batum?
Dude has played a grand total of TWO summer league games and you’ve already condemned him as a stiff?
Look, if you hate the guy that much you should at least try and get something from the Spurs for him. They are reportedly very high on him as a prospect and would have no problem grooming him as the heir apparent to Bowen, who’s getting on in years. Remember: all of that convoluted draft day maneuvering by Pritchard at the bottom of the first round was done for the express purpose of snatching Batum from San Antone. If the Blazers were to “ditch” Batum, as you suggest, no doubt the Spurs would happily step in and nab him. Might as well see if they’ll give you something before you just hand him over to them pour rien.
by knickfan on Jul 16, 2008 8:12 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
C'est vrai, ca
"Shoot, I don't even have anything to put in my own sig"
These are the modest words of pualo, posted on June 20, 2008.
Yes, pualo, an extraordinarily discerning BEdger with a knack for subtle expression.
by CatMan2 on Jul 16, 2008 8:23 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think by ditch him ...
you may have meant to send him back to Europe and take our chances at bringing him over in a few years. And I’d be for that right now instead of tying up a roster spot for 2 or 3 years while he develops. I’d be more inclined to instead sign Kope—I’m sort of partial to big guards, especially one that is a true point guard and also because Bayless may not be the answer for that role.
by TwoDeep on Jul 16, 2008 11:18 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Dude
Kope looks way too much like K*be.
by pualo on Jul 16, 2008 12:30 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Whaa? Huh?
Please tell me that was sarcasm or silliness.
LMA's reign as "LaMonster of the Low Post" has just begun!
by LaMarvelous on Jul 16, 2008 12:38 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not his face
but abbreviating his name “Kope”
Other people don't have as much practice at being wrong as I do -- HT, timbo
by jscot on Jul 16, 2008 12:59 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
If you want to make excuses for racism, go ahead.
"France is a place where the money falls apart in your hands but you can't tear the toilet paper" - Billy Wilder
by tominhawaii on Jul 16, 2008 2:47 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm not the one
named after “Uncle Tom”.
Other people don't have as much practice at being wrong as I do -- HT, timbo
by jscot on Jul 16, 2008 11:46 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
A lone tear silently trailed down my left cheek after reading that.
"France is a place where the money falls apart in your hands but you can't tear the toilet paper" - Billy Wilder
by tominhawaii on Jul 17, 2008 4:28 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Bayless and J Jack
To me Bayless’ games looks strikingly similar to JJacks game. I imagine that JJack would be shooting just as many free throws and scoring just as many points if he were in summer league. I don’t point this out to imply that we shouldn’t have traded for Bayless or to imply that Bayless won’t be better than Jack, but merely just point out the obvious, in these first two summer league games Bayless plays exactly like Jack. And I really liked Jacks mean streak and ability to get to the rim, so in fact, I’m extatic at the way Bayless has looked in these two games and I think the trade is going to look very one sided in the Blazers favor in a year or two. I like Koponen’s game and I hope we sign him, but I don’t see him even getting off the bench in most games this next year. Batum, shades of an 19 year old Travis Outlaw that plays better D than Outlaw did at that age. Very raw. I can’t imagine giving him a roster spot over Kop.
by noaher on Jul 16, 2008 9:28 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Bayless > Jack as a rookie
Bayless is a younger rookie than Jack was, but even so he game as a rookie looks to be above that of Jacks, (during his rookie year). Bayless has good defensive presence, although he needs to improve, he seems to be able to react once he sees it happening, he just needs to see it quicker, and Bayless can play above the rim which Jack can not. Hopefully Bayless’s jumper will come around as that was Jack’s biggest weakness on offense and I was hoping we got rid of that on the Blazers.
by usmcr3049 on Jul 16, 2008 9:33 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Agreed
I didn’t remember JJ being aggressive as a rookie so I looked back in the Oregonian and found this from his rookie exhibition season (he was injured and didn’t play in summer league) : “Jack still has adjustments to make. McMillan was critical of Jack’s reluctance to shoot when he had open jump shots, something he needs to learn as he adjusts to the league’s 24-second shot clock.
"We will do nice things!" - Rudy, 07/01/08
by jorga on Jul 16, 2008 12:39 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
bum ankle
JJ is never going to have the hops of Bayless, but anyone who compares between Jarrett and Jerryd’s rookie seasons without mentioning Jack’s ankle injury would not be fair to JJ
by two4larue on Jul 16, 2008 4:18 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Jarrett's ankle
has possibly impacted his whole career.
But it is still a fair comparison in comparing what we have versus what we gave up to get it.
Other people don't have as much practice at being wrong as I do -- HT, timbo
by jscot on Jul 16, 2008 11:48 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I understand now...
...his ankle was so inflamed that he had to use clown shoes.
The Midnight Rambler
by amlmart1 on Jul 17, 2008 2:28 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Third Agree
IMHO Bayless will the perfect replacement for JJ1.
LMA's reign as "LaMonster of the Low Post" has just begun!
by LaMarvelous on Jul 16, 2008 12:41 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
petko vs batooooom
I don’t understand why the Blazers have seemingly given Batum a roster spot/contract already whey making Petko “earn” it. Batum is head of the cruve defensively, but he is completely lost on offense, even more so that Travis was his first year. I am not against signing him and letting him develop in practice or the D-league, but if the team really wants to keep roster flexability by carrying only 14 players into camp, why would they not sign Petko and let Batum return to europe to develop? Even if he signs a 3 or 4 year deal over there the Blazers would be ok as he has atleast that long to develop into a solid rotation player.
by usmcr3049 on Jul 16, 2008 9:30 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
possibly
because bringing in Batman creates a more balanced roster (at least in the front court), whereas we already have three point guards and it’s hard to justify adding a fourth when two of the three you already have are a rook and a project at this point… bringing in PetKo means taking on a third PG who may or may not develop into much. Since we didn’t have a project-type player at the SF before Batum (and we already have two solid SF’s at this point) bringing him in now does not create as much of a hardship or complexity to the overall roster as would bringing in that fourth PG. And, if you needed to trade or off-load one of those two project players, there has definitely been more interest in Batman, which makes him a better gamble as a project as well.
by Blindsteepler on Jul 16, 2008 11:29 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Defense review: Koponen Vs. Sergio
PK plays defense, as proof I offer the fact that he stayed in front of 2 NBA quality super quick PG’s in Dee Borwn and the Doobie’.
Sergio has never shown he can stay in front of anybody, let alone the cat quick guards. Sergio is a defensive liability, he showed this in last years SL games and then more of the same this past year. Koponen has already shown us in jsut 2 SL games that he is definately not cut out of that cloth. He was matched up with a couple real tough covers and he passed both tests.
PK could end up becoming a decent defender and that is very encouraging all by itself.
He plays like a true point guard, and he stays focused, intense, all the while appearing calm and collected.
Sergio Vs. Koponen, the debate between the two of them (IMO) is over. The one ting that Sergio has over him right now is the Rudy relationship.
The Oden Era, Day 385
by Heymoe on Jul 16, 2008 9:52 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
There's an obvious thing Sergio has over Petteri...
I’m surprised people are skimming over passing and ballhandling. Sergio doesn’t lose the ball from ballhandling; he loses the ball from risky passes, which is a positive rather than a negative as a whole. Petteri’s defense wasn’t pristine. He did let the quick SacTown guards by him a few times and had trouble getting through picks. Yeah, it was pretty decent overall and better than Sergio’s defense, but I wouldn’t say it’s a major strength right now.
The obvious edge Petteri has is the jumpshot and tear drop. Sergio needs to be able to score to stay in this league.
by poster on Jul 16, 2008 11:58 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sergio's ballhandling
It may be better than Kop’s, but I’ve seen Sergio lose the ball many times with his lazy dribbling up top.
Witty Unpredictable Talent and Natural Game
by iDea on Jul 16, 2008 12:10 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Good Video at Oregonlive
KP is like 3 inches taller than JP in the ESPN video and they called him the wrong first name.
http://www.oregonlive.com/blazers/
"France is a place where the money falls apart in your hands but you can't tear the toilet paper" - Billy Wilder
by tominhawaii on Jul 16, 2008 10:06 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
So I can't help feeling...
like this is a case of bad breeds bad. Have you ever played a pickup game with a few talented players but the majority of the squad played rushed forced ball? Every time I play games like that even the talented players games become forced, uncoordinated messes. This is the feeling I get with Bayless. Things were so sloppy there was no way for him to elevate his game.
On the flipside, When I play with really talented players, my game-not of the best caliber-elevates, and I am able to create opportunities for them to shine. Hopefully when Bayless starts playing games with the big boys he will be able to raise his game.
Just a theroy
We went like this, he went like that. I say to Hollywood: Where'd he go? Hollywood says: where'd who go?
by Black84GTI on Jul 16, 2008 10:47 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I like your theory
Looking forward to seeing him play with a real front line.
"We will do nice things!" - Rudy, 07/01/08
by jorga on Jul 16, 2008 11:44 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
What did Monty Williams say
that cracked up Kamla and Snapper? I rewound several times and could never catch it.
"We will do nice things!" - Rudy, 07/01/08
by jorga on Jul 16, 2008 11:47 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
He told the scorekeeper
who was being harangued by the Kings coach “don’t let him intimidate you, bro”
by raoulduke on Jul 16, 2008 11:54 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
What was that Golf reference
Does Jerryd’s father play golf with Reggie Theus, other NBA people?
Cave Canem!
by Caveowl on Jul 16, 2008 1:14 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes, Theus said
He had recently played golf with Jerryd’s dad
by two4larue on Jul 16, 2008 4:21 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Chuck "The Rifleman" Person
The scorekeeper had the score wrong (56) Chuck was telling him to add it up again. Turns out Person was “right” (58)
Which coincidentally turned out to be the margin of victory
by two4larue on Jul 16, 2008 4:21 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
european buyout
Maybe Paul buying a Euroleague team isn’t so crazy. He could sign these guys to contracts in Europe without buyout clauses and pay them well enough to compensate them when they move to the NBA. I wonder if there is an NBA rule that prohibits this?
by dogbert on Jul 18, 2008 11:11 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
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