Chips? What Chips?
When does Kevin Pritchard use his chips? And what chips does he really have to use?
First off, let’s pose a threshold question: Does KP truly want to add a veteran presence? He says he does, but the facts and the passage of time are starting to argue against this proposition. James Jones, one of the top 3-point artists in the league, was a vet, and a good guy, to boot, and he is now gone to a team that gave him just $1.5 million a year more than the Blazers were paying (and keep in mind that KP pays $3 million in cash every year just to take a chance on a low-first-round draft choice).
The more time that goes by, the more one gets the feeling Pritchard just might believe we are gradually evolving our own veteran presence in the form of Roy and Aldridge. (Plus, there are Pryzbilla – a hard-nosed vet if ever there was one - and Blake.) And another vet, a really good one, would be expensive. Passing the threshold, then – and perhaps we shouldn’t, perhaps the whole story really ends right here – what chips are available for Pritchard to acquire a championship missing link?
Behind Door #1 sits Raef LaFrentz’s $13-million contract expiring next Spring. I can’t count high enough to tabulate the number of times Blazers Edge bloggers have cavalierly placed this asset onto the hypothetical trading block. But is this really a usable trading chip? Again, facts and time say no. Once one of the most financially extravagant teams in the league, the Blazers have put a lot of effort into restructuring player salary. There is an overriding goal: Generate enough money and “cap space” to give Roy, Aldridge, and Oden big raises in the next 2 to 3 years, and hopefully significant salary increases, as well, to one or two other young guys that turn out great. For R-A-O alone, you’ll probably (again, we can only hope!) have to give them raises totaling about $30 million a year (I’m rounding here) above the amounts in the final years of their rookie contracts.
Which brings us to the crucial number in this whole analysis. It is NOT the salary cap (about $59 million); it’s the LUXURY TAX threshold of about $70 million. You have to believe Allen, Pritchard and Partners, LLC, don’t want to go above that level again and start paying 2-for-1 on marginal salaries. And this, in turn, brings us to the root of the problem: Assuming the LaFrentz, Francis and Miles contracts ALL come off the books next spring, all of the other existing player contracts project out to about $40 million (also rounded). Quite clearly, $40 existing + $30 raises take us right to the $70 luxury tax level. In other words, we need Raef’s money for the guys in house. We can’t spend it twice, so that means Raef’s contract can’t be dealt. If not, what else can?
Obviously, this brings us to Door #2: Existing talent to trade. Oops! We’re told R-A-O are off limits. Well, that leaves all the “riff raff” (pardon the expression) future-potential guys, who probably aren’t valued as highly around the league as we Blazer bloggers think they are. Oh, yes! There’s a couple of vets – the kind of guys KP says we need to get, not trade away. So, yeah, we could deal Pryzbilla. But Pryz is a vet, and even more important, he’s a vet with a mean streak (in addition to being an all around worthy fellow – i.e., a person of “great character”.) True, a lot of teams need a decent veteran center. But we don’t yet really know for sure if Oden will avoid further injury or, if he does, whether he will foul out of half the games he plays. So you can’t let Pryz go. (For that matter, you can’t let Raef go for the same reasons – to commit fouls #13 to 18 next year at the 5 post, and to back up two injury-prone centers.)
That leaves Door #3 -- draft picks. Sorry, there’s very little left behind Door #3 because we’re about to run out of worthy draft picks. For starters, you can ignore second-round picks for big-time trading – about all they’re good for is more second rounders. So now to the crux of Door #3. First, we have the B team that we just drafted, Bayless and Batoum; now, that’s a thought – although we then lose our “point guard of the future”. Second, the 2009 draft is likely to be (at least, one can hope) the last one in which the Blazers will have any kind of a reasonable, though depreciating, first-round selection – meaning it’s the last one KP can deal that has anything close to decent value.
But we all know KP LOVES to wheel and deal in the draft. The question is, Can he bring himself to give up next year’s wheeling and dealing to, instead, use our last semi-valuable #1 pick to help us acquire a good player -- hopefully sooner rather than later -- knowing he won’t then have any draft-day fun for the rest of his life? This will be a wonderful test of Pritchard’s flexibility – to give up the favorite part of his job resume (and a creative task at which he is exceedingly brilliant) to finish off the rebuilding of this team. If he doesn’t, well, come next summer you can take draft picks off the trade market, too, for Door #3 will then conceal . . . nothing.
Conclusion: With positions #2, 4, and 5 covered, our obvious “holes” (such as they are) are at point and small forward. Alas, there isn’t much quality in the available point-guard market around the league these days. There is, however, a number of very talented – and available - forwards that can slot in at the 3, especially if you’re willing to make some “culture” and “character” allowances. Examples include Marion and Artest, plus Josh Smith in the restricted free agent sector, just for starters. The best assets we have to deal are our “overvalued” young guys, the BB ’08 draft twins, the fading ‘09 #1 pick, and anything else we can find via a three-way deal. Alas, as we saw with Jared Jack on draft day ‘08, one of our top young guys was barely able to move us from #13 to #11 in the draft – not exactly a quantum leap. In the balance, then, while the value of our draft picks is rapidly dwindling, the good news is that for a very short window of time there is still some value here, and there is a modest amount, although not a great deal, of trade value in our young players.
All of which means time and money is running out for Pritchard to make a major trade to help this team. Will KP use his dwindling stockpile of tradable assets to get a needed vet? Or is the whole “we’d like to get some veteran presence” thing now a myth? One thought: Despite his draft-day brilliance, KP has yet to make a trade move, salary dumping aside, of any significance in his three-year GM reign. Here’s hoping he can find his new groove. He’ll need it, because the old groove is running out of time.
9 recs |
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comments
Comments
This sentence puzzles me:
Despite his draft-day brilliance, KP has yet to make a trade move, salary dumping aside, of any significance in his three-year GM reign.
????
Winning is everything.
by MT Suit on Jul 14, 2008 10:59 PM PDT 0 recs
To clarify
I am referring to the absence of any trade that brings a major veteran player to the team. Thank you for the comment.
by blazerwizard on
Jul 14, 2008 11:14 PM PDT
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Why?
Why would we need a veteran? Veterans are for when you’re challenging for a title. When you’re trying to get back into the running, you need young talent. If you want to trade for someone who’s going to be gone or ineffective in a few years, be my guest.
I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer.—Dune
by Muad'Dib on
Jul 14, 2008 11:36 PM PDT
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Well..
I think veterans are of use on younger teams as far as leadership, example-setting, tricks-of-the-trade, etc., are concerned.
"Well, Travis just showed us that we can go to Travis Outlaw." - Nate McMillan
by 12sharks on
Jul 15, 2008 12:14 AM PDT
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Isn't that why you have coaches?
I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer.—Dune
by Muad'Dib on
Jul 15, 2008 12:19 AM PDT
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Eh..
Are you really suggesting that the qualities of having an older, wiser player to show the young’ns the ropes should be transferred to a coach? I don’t think Rajon benefited nearly as much from Doc’s inspiration as he did from KG & co.’s, for instance.
"Well, Travis just showed us that we can go to Travis Outlaw." - Nate McMillan
by 12sharks on
Jul 15, 2008 12:29 AM PDT
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Well, the qualities that you listed.
Are all covered by coaches too.
I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer.—Dune
by Muad'Dib on
Jul 15, 2008 12:39 AM PDT
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Eh.. (again)
I’m the oldest in my family, but I know a LOT of people who looked up to their older brothers and found confidence and guidance from them that their relationship with their father didn’t really approach (for obvious reasons, like think of a ‘sex talk’ with one’s father as opposed to one’s brother).
I know professional teams often compare themselves to families, and I can see some social similarities there. I think of the coaches as kind of the fathers of the family, and you’d be hard-pressed to convince me that, with the huge change in lifestyle, living situations, professionalism, media responsibilities, fame, fortune, etc., etc., that teenager (!) Jerryd Bayless would be equally comfortable looking to Larry Brown for advice on what his new identity means as he would be seeking it from, say, Chauncey Billups?
"Well, Travis just showed us that we can go to Travis Outlaw." - Nate McMillan
by 12sharks on
Jul 15, 2008 1:02 AM PDT
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Yes, but
our coach isn’t Larry Brown, it’s Nate McMillan, a top class PG.
And we also have Maurice Lucas.
When you’ve got those guys, the need for vets on the team is lessened.
Other people don't have as much practice at being wrong as I do -- HT, timbo
by jscot on
Jul 15, 2008 3:41 AM PDT
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Disagree
It’s the difference (as 12sharks intoned above) between having an awesome dad and an awesome older brother. One will guide you, but the other will show you how to smoke a cigarette so you don’t screw up and cough in front of all your friends.
Maybe that was a bad example, but the point remains the same.
BLZRS FRVR
by nightbluefruit on
Jul 15, 2008 10:59 AM PDT
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You don't wanna talk to Dad bout everything
You get one of the Blazer dancers knocked up, who do you talk to? Nate? KP? Hell no.
You go to Raef, who runs a free clinic out of his basement.
OR, when you have a question, a problem, it’s not good to go to Dad most of the time. You go to a trusted friend or older brother. Vets have lots of benefits that aren’t found in the stats, and coaches will most likely be seperate from the team in those personal-life type stuffs. Not all, but most.
Even though Nate has taken part in the personal lives of his players in a good way, you still probably can’t go to him about EVERYTHING. You want playing time from him and his respect, and that inhibits what you would talk about with the guy.
Do you go to your BOSS about your personal life?
Not to say Vets are only good for personal life stuff, but they offer many varied points of view only NBA experience can teach ya, and the advice won’t be coming from a ‘authority figure’ like KP or Nate. The Vet would be one of you, only older.
That said, I don’t think there was a vet who would unselfishly accept a role on the team and sit on the bench while giving sage advice who was available for free (who would we wanna trade for this type of dude, if this dude existed?).
But it’d be nice if we could get one.
Mortimer
by Mortimer on
Jul 15, 2008 11:25 AM PDT
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+1
and we haven’t even touched on all the disgustingly good things a crafty vet like Bruce Bown could teach these kids.. great stuff like situation your foot under a jump-shooter’s landing spot, lying on the floor, the finer points of kicking your opponent in the gonads, etc. There’s that whole side of it, as well.
I wouldn’t want to trade for Bill Russell (though I’m sure he’d have some great stories to tell), but to pull in an experienced, approachable dude who can show these kids the ropes both on and off the court would be a benefit, I’m pretty sure.
"Well, Travis just showed us that we can go to Travis Outlaw." - Nate McMillan
by 12sharks on
Jul 15, 2008 1:02 PM PDT
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Morty's on fire !
Raef is a nice insurance plan for an injury to
either C and an all around good guy. When he came in
last year, he worked hard, rebounded and blocked some
shots. We know he can shoot and score, but it’s always
RLEC ! Remember vets help the CULTURE !
It's GO time !
by walkoff41 on
Jul 16, 2008 2:14 AM PDT
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But...but...
What about COINCAST?? DOES it still SUCK !!
"I think it’s going to be very beautiful game next year."
-Batuuuuuuuum!
by rockingharder on
Jul 16, 2008 7:29 AM PDT
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Yeah, well
I didn’t say we don’t need vets at all, I said having those two coaches covers some of it.
We have Raef, Joel, and Steve. And Brandon is almost like a vet, now.
Other people don't have as much practice at being wrong as I do -- HT, timbo
by jscot on
Jul 17, 2008 2:36 AM PDT
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All in all, and in hindsight, I think it would have been
better if I had followed my father’s advice rather than my brother’s.
"Besides, AnntheFan will be here any minute to #25 you." T Darkstar
by annthefan on
Jul 17, 2008 5:46 AM PDT
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Ah the Myth of Veteran Tricks
Age does not equal wisdom. There are good veterans who offer leadership and set a good example. There are just as many veterans who do not. Similarly, there are many young players who are immature and need leadership. And then there just as many who do not. The Blazers already have a great NBA point guard who’s been in the league for years and knows all the veteran tricks of the trade and has demonstrated great leadership skills and mentoring ability. His name is Nate McMillan.
by Jumbo on
Jul 16, 2008 11:29 AM PDT
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Yup
They always talk about the “calming influence.” Talk about junk! Vets with no championship experience go to championship teams to fill roles. Vets with championship experience retire.
When the Blazers make the playoffs, everyone is going to be nervous as hell. They are freaking seven game series, so they have time to adjust. The whole vet thing is overrated. There are vets on the team now, and you’re not going to find an available vet that is better than the big three.
Seriously, what did Michel Jordan’s veteran experience do for the Wizards?
"France is a place where the money falls apart in your hands but you can't tear the toilet paper" - Billy Wilder
by tominhawaii on
Jul 16, 2008 1:24 PM PDT
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Tom is absolutely right, as usual..
...................................................... Heck, I had to repeat my wedding night three times before I got it right.
"He shoots....................... he scores!!!"
by timbo on
Jul 16, 2008 10:27 PM PDT
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................................... If only I had a grizzled veteran to consult!
"He shoots....................... he scores!!!"
by timbo on
Jul 16, 2008 10:29 PM PDT
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Got 'em to redecorate the locker room?
Seriously, what did Michel Jordan’s veteran experience do for the Wizards?
"He shoots....................... he scores!!!"
by timbo on
Jul 16, 2008 10:28 PM PDT
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How about getting rid of crappy vets?
That’s just as important. You can’t do “out with the old, in with the new” without dropping the old.
"I think it’s going to be very beautiful game next year."
-Batuuuuuuuum!
by rockingharder on
Jul 14, 2008 11:40 PM PDT
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I tried making that point a while ago. Doesn't go well.
I'm a really really ridiculously good looking orange mocha frappaccino drinking manhammer sandwich
by hobobob on
Jul 16, 2008 11:09 AM PDT
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It's all in the marketing...
POPPIN’ FRESH IS ALL THE “VETERAN LEADERSHIP” THIS CREW NEEDS.
That and the fear of Bayless going postal…
"He shoots....................... he scores!!!"
by timbo on
Jul 16, 2008 10:31 PM PDT
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Veterans are not needed yet
Hungry veterans who can ball might be but I agree that it takes another year before that is likely. However, there is plenty of time before February to still pull out a trade if the team’s progress warrants that then.
Aldridge said. "We feel like we can beat any team. We feel like we can beat the Spurs, Suns, Lakers, Mavericks, whoever any night right now, and we'll still be here when those teams get old and their guys retire. We're going to be here for a long time."
by lee3022 on
Jul 16, 2008 12:46 PM PDT
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draft day trades don't count as trades?
Boomshakalaka
by jksnake99 on Jul 14, 2008 11:05 PM PDT 0 recs
Ummm
But…. I think your entire premise is completely and totally wrong.
You are saying we don’t have assets? Even to say they are decreasing in value? Wow. That’s pretty much the exact opposite of what every media pundit, beat writer and basement blogger have said about the Blazers.
Your theory about the RLEC piece isn’t valuable because we need to pay Oden, LMA, and Roy doesn’t make much sense. First off, I don’t think that 40mil is accurate, it’s closer to 35 without taking Frye, Blake, Martell, Sergio, or Diogu. LMA and Brandon aren’t even paid until 2010, and Oden in 2011. Secondly, we are already paying 75mil, and next year 80mil. We don’t pay our entire salary back in taxes. We pay the amount over the luxury tax in double. This year since the cap is 70mil we had to pay 10million for being 5million over the luxury tax. That’s not much. Paul Allen bought out Steve Francis’ contract for 35mil, just so he wouldn’t be near the team. You are telling me he wouldn’t pay 20 or 30 million in luxury tax dollars a year, while we are winning championships, and while he his raking in money from team? His team is a toy, not necessarily an engine for financial success. He does what Mark Cuban does, as in cut the checks to win basketball games. This whole argument doesn’t make much sense to me.
Also,
Just because we are going to trade RLEC or sign someone with the cap space doesn’t mean we are going to pay 13million, or even more. In fact we probably won’t. We have a lot of players who look like they might be able to fill in our “holes”. So the 2009 free agent will probably just be a minor piece. With our cap situation in 2009 we will be able to take on a huge contract off another team without needing to match salary. Think back to the 2007 draft and the Jason Richardson trade.
Oh and young players on cheap contracts are hot commodities in the league. A Martell Webster, a Travis Outlaw, a Channing Frye, these are all players that other teams want because they are cheap and have room to improve. Your comment about the Jack trade isn’t very solid either. Don’t think about the draft picks involved, think about the players involved. We gave up a career backup (former 22nd pick), a scrub(2007, 37th pick), the 13th draft pick and got a point guard with the potential to be an all star, who was mocked to go at #4 right until a few days before draft day. Not to mention that Ike is already a lot better than McBob. When people look back on this they will go they gave up who and who for Jarryd Bayless? We undoubtedly got the best player in the trade.
If the Blazers aren’t in a highly favorable position to make a move, then no other team in the NBA can say the same.
PS. How can you say KP hasn’t made any major moves??? Of the team from 2005-2006, who is still here? Martell, Pryzbilla, and Travis. That’s it. That alone should tell you that we have made major moves.
A Time For Heroes,
It's not right for young lungs to be coughing up blood
And it's all
It's all in my hands
And its all up the walls
Well the stale chips were up and the hopes stakes were down
Until Kp came into Town!
'Sing it Petey!
by Dheepan on Jul 14, 2008 11:08 PM PDT 10 recs
Rec'd
Totally agree
I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer.—Dune
by Muad'Dib on
Jul 15, 2008 12:15 AM PDT
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+1
You’re first sentence was exactly what I was thinking
Rule #1 of nitpicking is to get it right.
by douglast on
Jul 15, 2008 7:10 AM PDT
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Correction
We were not over the tax cap this year, we were under it by about 2 million and will recieve a check from the league as a thank you. I don’t have the link, but ESPN reported the 3 or 4 teams that had to pay the tax and the Blazers were not one of them.
by usmcr3049 on
Jul 15, 2008 8:02 AM PDT
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D
Perfectly said my friend.
That which prematurely arrives at perfection soon perishes. - Marcus Fabius Quintilian (35-95AD) Roman Rhetorician, Critic
by BlazerFan1 on
Jul 15, 2008 9:35 AM PDT
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I love rebuttals
Tom told me he just likes the butt part of it.
How do I set my laser printer to stun?
by prezofdeath on
Jul 15, 2008 9:49 AM PDT
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rec
"France is a place where the money falls apart in your hands but you can't tear the toilet paper" - Billy Wilder
by tominhawaii on
Jul 15, 2008 9:58 AM PDT
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rec
"Well, Travis just showed us that we can go to Travis Outlaw." - Nate McMillan
by 12sharks on
Jul 15, 2008 11:21 AM PDT
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If you trade RLEC
don’t you have to take back the same amount in salary? So trading Reaf seems like a non starter unless some unbelievable opportunity comes along – some Pau Gasol for nothing deal – comes along.
by raoulduke on
Jul 15, 2008 10:51 AM PDT
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You package RLEC
With, say, a Bayless or a Sergio or a PetKop or an Outlaw or a Webster, WHOEVER, and you got the salary to get a good player back and offer youth plus expiring deal for the other team.
Not sure what specific player or team this would work for, but stuff pops up during the season all the time.
If we’re lucky enough to get a Pau Gasol type for free, just RLEC, then that’s great… but it’ll likely be part of a package, if at all.
Mortimer
by Mortimer on
Jul 15, 2008 11:27 AM PDT
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Right, but
you are still taking back equivalent salary. So unless it’s a complete deal of a lifetime, I have a hard time imaginging taking on that salary this year, when it can just be dumped in the spring.
by raoulduke on
Jul 15, 2008 12:20 PM PDT
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What if it's a good player?
Unless you’re worried about the salary cap and luxury tax (which we shouldn’t be), getting an actual missing piece type player (if possible) is plan A for the RLEC-plus-good-youth situation, I would think.
Obviously it has to be a really sweet deal, because it eats up most of our cap space, but we’re looking at maybe 25 million depending on who we renounce, so we could still play in free agency even if we get back equal salary in a RLEC deal.
Not saying that is LIKELY, or even that I think it will happen, but it’s possible.
I mean, yeah, we take back equivalent salary, but a Pau Gasol type deal happens almost every year. There is not much chance it’ll be a dude who fits us (Allen Iverson was the previous year’s Gasol type deal), but it could, and that’s more gooder than cap savings depending on what we could get next offseason.
But yeah, it’d have to be a sweet deal, because the flexibility RLEC’s expiring deal offers for trades (both in-season and off) is something they wanna hold on to. But I think ultimately, one way or another, we’re filling in his contract hole with someone who isn’t on our roster currently and it won’t simply be used to be able to better afford our current players.
Plan A is to pay SOMEONE that money, as long as it’s the right player. It’s our last window to add someone ‘for free’ who can really help us, as afterwards we’re paying out the ear for our current players and would have to trade one of them to get someone who is GREAT.
So equivalent salary is fine, and just taking the cap savings is prolly plan C. I’m not sure if that’s what you’re advocating really, but I doubt we don’t do SUMTHIN’ with the RLEC, or take back/take on equal salary next summer. We’re gonna be paying someone that money.
Mortimer
by Mortimer on
Jul 15, 2008 12:36 PM PDT
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Sure, I'm not really advocating either position, really
Just saying that I think it more likely that his contract will be allowed to expire than a trade will be made, but I’m not the GM…
by raoulduke on
Jul 15, 2008 2:36 PM PDT
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KP has said he has a specific player in mind
and he has also said the cap space can be used to take a veteran for nothing (ala Marcus Camby) from a team that needs to start over. Either way we hold Raef until the draft or free agency next year. Or, as you say, an unbelievable deal comes through.
Aldridge said. "We feel like we can beat any team. We feel like we can beat the Spurs, Suns, Lakers, Mavericks, whoever any night right now, and we'll still be here when those teams get old and their guys retire. We're going to be here for a long time."
by lee3022 on
Jul 16, 2008 12:55 PM PDT
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Yeah, a specific player
and if we do get someone, he’ll say, “This was the guy I wanted all along.”
Even if there are 15 specific players that he’s considering.
Just like if Charlotte had taken Bayless, and DJ had fallen to Indiana, he would have said, “DJ is the best pure PG, the guy we had our eyes on all along.”
Other people don't have as much practice at being wrong as I do -- HT, timbo
by jscot on
Jul 17, 2008 2:41 AM PDT
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Everything I was going to say
Only said a lot more clearly and eloquently.
by sixth on
Jul 15, 2008 3:07 PM PDT
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yeah
KP traded Z-Bo. Now he cant even be traded for a 2nd rounder.
by RipCity on
Jul 15, 2008 11:00 PM PDT
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I'd have to agree with Dheepan
The post did make me think though.
But Paul Allen is not your average owner. I don’t think that the Lux tax concerns him much. If the team wasn’t showing progress, maybe. I think that he sees and agrees with Pritchard’s plan, and will pay plenty to make it happen.
by parkinglotj on Jul 15, 2008 12:00 AM PDT 0 recs
Paul Allen is on record re: luxury tax
He will pay it if we are in the final four of the conference and not if not. Remember the “broken economic model” statements as well. Paul does not need the money but the competition among the big guys (billionaires) tends to be who can increase or who can get fame and attention or both. Nobody likes to hemorrhage money.
Aldridge said. "We feel like we can beat any team. We feel like we can beat the Spurs, Suns, Lakers, Mavericks, whoever any night right now, and we'll still be here when those teams get old and their guys retire. We're going to be here for a long time."
by lee3022 on
Jul 16, 2008 12:59 PM PDT
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Don't quote him from the time when he and the team were getting pummeled...
............................................ he’s having big fun now. Things have changed.
"He shoots....................... he scores!!!"
by timbo on
Jul 16, 2008 10:35 PM PDT
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Maybe right but we were still in the playoffs then
Aldridge said. "We feel like we can beat any team. We feel like we can beat the Spurs, Suns, Lakers, Mavericks, whoever any night right now, and we'll still be here when those teams get old and their guys retire. We're going to be here for a long time."
by lee3022 on
Jul 16, 2008 11:24 PM PDT
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Why you're wrong
1. The RLEC
The current Blazers position on RLEC is that we’ll trade Raef if we get something good enough out of it, but if not, we’ll take the cap space. It’s a win-win situation. The reason why we’re not likely to trade the contract is that there aren’t a lot of players who are on the trading block who would be a good fit. In addition, the luxury tax is almost a necessity if you want to compete in the league. Both of the teams that made it to the finals this year were over the tax. You have to choose between luxury tax and winning. And trust me, Paul Allen has enough money to weather the luxury tax.
2. Of course, RAO are off limits. But almost everyone else can be traded. And I think you’re underestimating the value of some of our players on the trade market. Outlaw, Webster, Fernández, and Frye are all likely to be very good assets in a trade, especially to teams looking for young talent. Whether we would trade those players is a different matter. (And Raef isn’t needed as a third-string center. Both Pryz and GO will not foul out at the same time. Not possible. And Aldridge and Frye are both capable of filling in when Pryz and GO are out.)
3. KP has a lot of second round picks to package together along with a first rounder and some bench players to do something in the draft if he wants to. And he’s not just trading just to trade; he has consistently improved our roster through his trades.
4. As far as the 1 goes, we just improved at least at the backup with Bayless. And the one isn’t that important for winning championships. Boston won with Rondo, who can’t make a shot to save his life.
5. Your examples at the three for who we could trade for are awful. None of the players are good fits with our character or “culture.” What’s more, Marion is too old and Artest is getting there. All of them would take away too many shots from RAO. And, most importantly, they’d all too overpayed to make sense. We’re fine with Travis and Martell, who both are looking like they’ll be at least suitable SF’s.
6. Jarrett Jack wasn’t the exchange. Essentially we used the #13 pick to upgrade Jarrett and McBob.
7. Actually, a quantum leap isn’t very large. It’s rather insignificant.
8. KP’s made tons of trades for what we needed: young talent.
Sorry if that was overly critical but people like you get under my skin.
I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer.—Dune
by Muad'Dib on Jul 15, 2008 12:15 AM PDT 1 recs
"people like you get under my skin."
"I think it’s going to be very beautiful game next year."
-Batuuuuuuuum!
by rockingharder on
Jul 15, 2008 12:19 AM PDT
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What I mean to say is
posts like these get under my skin. Posts that only say negative things.
Obviously I just made things worse by trying to apologize.
I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer.—Dune
by Muad'Dib on
Jul 15, 2008 12:29 AM PDT
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In Response to #1 and #5..
Doesn’t this seem like kind of an ‘ivory tower’ mindset? I think having Josh Smith would give us a VERY strong set of four out of five starters, for instance. Considering how often I hear people people shoot down potential trade and free agency targets for not “fitting in with our culture” (and personally, I think those statements should include the words “my”, “take” and “on” between “with” and “our”), I believe I’ve yet to see a single response in the positive, a “yeah, he’d be great for our culture”. Granted, I’m not advocating bringing Sheed back and having a Ben Wallace/Ron Artest cage match at halftime, but I think that when BEdgers nix a player for not making the grade personality-wise it can border on xenophobia, or at least come off looking as a mighty tall judgment of someone’s character one’s probably never met.
Also, when people talk about RLEC and cap space, etc., they always seem to say that, of those currently available, “no one’s a good fit”, or everyone’s “awful” (I know, you were just talking about those listed above, but check some comments here to see what I’m talking about). When do you see this changing? One year? Two? Supposing the aforementioned Josh Smith fell into our laps, who are we really targeting in the next couple years who will be such a better “fit”? I’m really not trying to talk tough, I’m really interested in your opinion.
It seems like everyone’s been very grouchy re: trade talk lately (and understandably so), but taking it out on this year’s crop of available players isn’t really accomplishing much. I suppose I’m just complaining about complaining, but here it is, anyway, for what it’s worth.
"Well, Travis just showed us that we can go to Travis Outlaw." - Nate McMillan
by 12sharks on
Jul 15, 2008 12:50 AM PDT
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Rec'd
This is great stuff. Blazer fans seem really down on players from other teams. It seems like David Lee, Tayshaun Prince, and Devin Harris (sometimes) are the only players people get excited about.
If somebody hits you with an object you should beat the hell out of them.-Charles Barkley
by Winchester on
Jul 15, 2008 2:00 AM PDT
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A big reason for that
is that a lot of players from other teams either don’t seem to have the potential we hope and think our guys have, they have characther issues, or they are way overpaid.
When you are looking for a good player, who has high character, is coachable, and has a very reasonable contract, they are hard to come by. We are very fortunate to be in the situation we are in, because we currently have several.
RLEC is a nice chip to have because it is in fact a win-win. You saw what a few draft picks and Kwame Brown brought the losers in Purple and Gold. Not that people are going to give away their players like that on a regular basis, but it does give us some options.
I must comment on your Jarrett Jack comment. KP did what he needed to do to get the guy he wanted to get. Many people on this site gave Jack more credit than I thought he deserved…they praised his heart, they praised his hustle, they praised his locker room presence. In the meantime, they forgot to examine his point gurad play. That being said though, Jack still had some value. Indiana did good for themselves by getting who they wanted all along in Rush, and picked up two assets along the way. However you want to look at it, I say it doesn’t really matter at this point. Bayless is going to make people forget about Jarrett Jack real quick. We got a top 5 pick talent for our #13 and a couple of very average players. I’d do that deal 7 days a week.
Can I buy you a fish sandwich?
by silkybrown on
Jul 15, 2008 4:41 AM PDT
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I don't think anyone gave Jack that much credit
He wasn’t a good fit here and it seems to be unanimous that we got the better end of the deal, or at least the better player, and he hasn’t even played a game. That doesn’t say much for Jack.
by einman77 on
Jul 16, 2008 5:34 AM PDT
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Perhaps we are homers?
I am not sure Indiana did not get the better end of the deal. It will take three years to assess better how this really worked out but people like to think we are dominating every trade. To the contrary, KP has a gift for understanding other teams and their needs and providing the pieces to help them meet those needs while making our team better.
So it does not make Jack a bad player. The perception of Jerryd is all good so far but he has not played a game and while we all hope we got the better player we simply don’t know yet. Indiana got a strong backup point guard who will double as a SG at times and can match up with Billups in their division. They also got Rush who is more ready to play NBA ball than anyone in the draft (imo). Indiana needed to jump forward and traded potential for production. The also escaped Diogu’s contract as he was under-utilized there. Would they make that trade today? Yes, I believe they would indeed. Jack will do well in Indiana.
Aldridge said. "We feel like we can beat any team. We feel like we can beat the Spurs, Suns, Lakers, Mavericks, whoever any night right now, and we'll still be here when those teams get old and their guys retire. We're going to be here for a long time."
by lee3022 on
Jul 16, 2008 1:12 PM PDT
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Yup
Not every team has time to develop 19 year old point guard, especially when they just traded for a young point guard. The whole point in drafting the best player available is so that you make someone give you something to get that player and still get a player in the draft or trade to fill your needs.
If New Orleans had the second pick in the draft and Michael Beasley was the first pick, who do you think New Orleans would have drafted?
"France is a place where the money falls apart in your hands but you can't tear the toilet paper" - Billy Wilder
by tominhawaii on
Jul 16, 2008 1:31 PM PDT
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I think in a few years
Once we KNOW, and the league KNOWS, that this is ROY/ODEN/LMA’s team, then we can handle trading for a guy who has been a headcase in the past, like Josh Smith.
And since you used Josh as an example, he has had quite a few instances in his short career of battling with coaches, teammates, flipped off fans, shows up late, and while on the court he is a help-side monster and is maybe the most athletic player in the league, but he takes a lot of bad shots and kinda plays for himself.
He wants to be a star. Will he be able to be a star in Portland, with R/A/O?
I know Blazer fans are w


