Positional Importance
A couple of questions for discussion today.
Everybody values certain things on the basketball court over others. These attributes are usually embodied in certain positions more than others. So...
For you, what is the most important position on an NBA team? Not I'm not asking the name of the most important player, but position (point guard, shooting guard, etc.). Another way to frame it would be: if you had to start your team with one player at one position, what would that position be?
Also what is the most important attribute a player at that position can have?
Just choose one of each if you can. Narrowing down (and thus having different people argue different things) is part of the fun.
--Dave (blazersub@yahoo.com)
0 recs |
57 comments
Comments
I have to go big
I say a center. A traditional back to the basket, lock down the paint kind of center is the first guy I want on a team I’m building. I think the rest of the team builds up well from the strengths and weaknesses of your particular center.
I want to say that the most important attribute is something intangible like passion or hustle but I think the best thing to start with is fundamentals. I’m basically describing Tim Duncan but I guess I could settle for Kareem or the Dream.
We shall not cease from exploration
And the end of all our exploring
Will be to arrive where we started
And know the place for the first time.
-T.S. Eliot
by Magnum on Jun 3, 2008 1:24 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Yes, build around a center if you can
We are in the fortunate position of being able to do so, but for some reason, great or even just really good centers have been quite rare over the last 10-20 years in the NBA. When I first started following pro basketball, it seemed that nearly every team had a big dominant player in the middle. But then there weren’t as many teams in those days, the early ‘60s. Also, it may be that rule changes over the years have led to a decline in the relative importance of a having first-rate center. I’m not enough of a student of the game to be able to argue that either way, though.
Basically, however, I think you have to build around the best talent you can get, so I would say that talent trumps position. If you have lemons, make lemonade, as they say.
I agree with your assessment of qualities to have in the big guy.
by CatMan2 on Jun 3, 2008 10:46 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The late Frank McGuire once said
you can’t win without an aircraft carrier!
Aldridge said. "We feel like we can beat any team. We feel like we can beat the Spurs, Suns, Lakers, Mavericks, whoever any night right now, and we'll still be here when those teams get old and their guys retire. We're going to be here for a long time."
by lee3022 on Jun 5, 2008 12:24 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Center and height.
"If OJ Mayo falls to the 2nd round We should risk one of our 3 second round picks on Mayo". Mortimer.
by amlmart1 on Jun 3, 2008 1:29 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
As in…tall even for a center type height?
We shall not cease from exploration
And the end of all our exploring
Will be to arrive where we started
And know the place for the first time.
-T.S. Eliot
by Magnum on Jun 3, 2008 1:33 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I go with coherence
If I can choose a position and only a quality, and position doesn´t involves qualities, the quality should be in agreement with the position.
"If OJ Mayo falls to the 2nd round We should risk one of our 3 second round picks on Mayo". Mortimer.
by amlmart1 on Jun 3, 2008 4:15 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The ability to play
Offence and defence as a part of a team.
by coastrider on Jun 3, 2008 1:33 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
A center. A healthy Bill Walton type who is focused on basketball, or a young Sabonis.
I can’t wait for the Oden era.
"Besides, AnntheFan will be here any minute to #25 you." T Darkstar
by annthefan on Jun 3, 2008 2:03 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Center
Athleticism; there are plenty of stiffs playing center, but the good ones can really move around (for someone their size, anyway).
by wepto on Jun 3, 2008 2:27 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
we have the best building block
actually we have two awesome building blocks in oden and roy. but if i had to choose one to build my team around…..
TROUT!!! #25 BABY! (just for you annthefan)
18 points, 9 rebounds, 5 assists, 1 steal, 1 block, 0 turnovers, 80% FG, 66% 3PT FG. Can my boy get some love?
by easybig73 on Jun 3, 2008 6:02 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
A Leader
You need a guy that can lead, who is charismatic enough, that the rest of the team want him to be their leader. I think he can play any position. Put Roy’s mind in anyone from 5’ 10” to 7’ and build around that guy.
Life is like a cherry tomato; it tastes like chicken.
by tominhawaii on Jun 3, 2008 6:06 AM PDT reply actions 1 recs
Wing
I am going to fudge a little bit here and say a wing player that is versatile enough to play PG, SG and SF. Here is why:
1) League rules. Currently, wing players are granted a ton of freedom in being able to create offense. I want my player to take full advantage of those rules.
2) Crunch time. I want my guy to have the ball in his hands when it matters. It is much more difficult to give the ball to a big down low in crunch time, than it is to give it to my wing player. Again, unless he is Brent Barry he probably will be able to create a decent shot, or get a foul at the end of the game.
3) I like Brandon Roy better than Oden right now. I am biased, I admit it. Fact is that I like what Roy has done for Portland and would probably take him in the top 5 of a franchise draft (LBJ, Howard, CP3 and K824 would also be in the top).
by da34shadow on Jun 3, 2008 6:12 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Wing, again
with team-player attributes.
by spencerbutte on Jun 3, 2008 6:53 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Seeing as how this is the game of basketball,
I’m going to go with size, skill and athleticism as the three most important attributes of a good player. Therefore it’s pretty obvious:
A dominant center who is above 7 feet, can move, and can play at both ends of the floor is the be-all end-all cornerstone of any team. That said, that combination is rare. It’s much easier to find a center who can play at one end of the floor, or a wing who can do both.
by ranma on Jun 3, 2008 7:16 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Point Guard
Most important attribute: Being Chris Paul.
"Honor Terry Porter." Email me with your TP stories and memories.
by Ben. on Jun 3, 2008 7:22 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Growing up, it always seemed like good teems had.... SG+PF
I know that is two positions. But teams with a post and scoring guard who could consistently work the inside outside game to set up the rest of the team had the pedigree I would want to follow.
by Portland Dynasty on Jun 3, 2008 7:46 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I've wanted to ask Nate this for a long time.
I would guess that the #1 answer from all coaches around the NBA would be a leader / floor general. I think that player could play any postion on the floor, so without further ado….....24thewho’s greatest of all time!
1. Magic
2. M.J.
3. Bird
4. Duncan
5. The Dream ( Darn 2 tailed coin! )
I know, they are pretty boreing picks. But man where they good!
2-4 the who
by 24thewho on Jun 3, 2008 7:48 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Revolves around the center?
It’s already been hit upon and everyone knows the rap, a great center. There’s a reason we drafted Oden over Durant and a big part of it was the idea that dominating centers are not only rare but can be pivotal (no pun intended) to a teams success. I guess I’ve had to believe that ever since I saw the difference in a Blazer team with a healthy Bill Walton and without. We were still a good, good team without Bill Walton but not a championship level team. So I’ll go along with “center” as my position of choice.
Since Dave used the word “attribute” and not “talent” or “skill”, I’m going to take a base of talent and skill from my big man as a given. The attribute I most like to have from any player at any position is Competitive Desire. That’s the attribute I want from my talented big center. Maybe I’m a sucker, but I love to hear it when I hear a player is working on his own to get better. Great players that have individually dominated the game at different times all have had different and diverse set’s of talents and skills but one thing they all share at the top is competitive desire. I think that is the difference maker. Honestly, IMO a lot of players have come into the league with similar physical gifts as a Jordan, Bird or Magic and that might get their foot in the door but ultimately what separates them? Competitive Desire and Focus. I’ll take that as my attribute…and assume this is a big man with good skills.
"Mother Nature started this fight, I think it's about time we ended it!"
by Krang on Jun 3, 2008 8:04 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
only one pg?
I’m a little surprised only Ben said pg. lots of leaders, etc. but only one pg.
i’m ahem, a little older than most of you and was a kid in the jerry west, walt frazier, earl the pearl era, so i lean to the pg.
most important attribute: fearlessness. no one is going to beat me or my team. this trophy is ours.
by rburg on Jun 3, 2008 8:25 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Wanted to say PG but...
I have to go w/ Center. No other position can impact both sides of the court more than a dominant BIG!
by dukedee on Jun 3, 2008 8:31 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Center
And I’m going with footwork for my skill. He’s got to be able to get good position on the block, box out for the boards, and be in a position to make plays on defense.
"My, that is a handsome fella. He must be the offspring of a Greek God!" - Bill Walton calling a Clipper's-Laker's game as Luke Walton checks in.
by JTDuck22 on Jun 3, 2008 9:06 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
What position is the most important?
I think this changes from era to era. Generally speaking, the place where you want to have your strongest player is where everyone else is weakest. That is why the Center position is often seen as valuable. Although, I remember back in the late 80’s early 90’s there were actually a lot of good centers in the league. Portland’s Center play was not particularly dominant in those years, but the team was, because we had strengths in the right places.
Today, after reading Prezofdeath’s SG diary I see how weak the league is currently at SG. Fortunately, we have a very dominant SG on the team already. Likewise, Center today is a position that does not have a lot of dominant players in it. It looks like we have that one filled already also. This is good news for us.
The one position that is overloaded in the league right now is PG. There are lots of very good point guards playing today, so I don’t see the need of having one ourselves. Let everyone else worry about that position, and simply have someone who can fill the role adequately. After all, how could we get mismatches consistently?
So after careful consideration, If I was going after a piece to build a team around today, I would build it from the SG position. That may change in a few years though.
One of Two Official Blazer's Edge Poets Laureate for the 2008-2009 Season
"Scholars have long known that fishing eventually turns men into philosophers. Unfortunately, it is almost impossible to buy decent tackle on a philosopher's salary." - Patrick McManus
by T Darkstar on Jun 3, 2008 9:18 AM PDT reply actions 2 recs
For the sake of being different. . .
I was going to say center, but I think that’s been echoed enough. My second choice would be a true point guard with a good outside shot like steve nash.
by sixth on Jun 3, 2008 9:39 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
The last true point guard to win a championship was....
who?
--Josh
by prezofdeath on Jun 3, 2008 5:02 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Tony Parker
"Honor Terry Porter." Email me with your TP stories and memories.
by Ben. on Jun 3, 2008 9:47 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Pish posh apple sauce
His finals MVP is silly juice to the squishiest extreme and Manu and Tony together never sniff a championship game. Duncan is why they win the titles.
The last ‘great PG’ to win the title as the main player is Isiah Thomas, and he did it without a dominant post player. That is a big exception, historically. Magic did it too, but only once without Kareem, right?
If you’re just saying Parker is the last ‘star’ PG to win a title, I sorry for poohing on your post. I think it’s a telling sign that the ‘best PGs of their day’ tend to not ever win a title. Nash, Kidd, Marbury, you know, the greats.
I’d be shocked to my core if the Hornets as is ever win a title, but Paul has many years in front of him and he’s certainly good enough to win a title. A good PG is great to have, but usually when your best/most dominant player is a PG it doesn’t bode well for your championship chances.
Morty-murr
by Mortimer on Jun 4, 2008 1:42 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Add in the Glove and Stockton.
Personally, I think the whole argument of who wins championships – bigs or smalls – is off the mark. Teams win championships. And even good teams need luck from time to time.
by timg56 on Jun 4, 2008 6:49 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I guess...not sure I would call Tony Parker a "true" point guard.
Personally, I think all this true point, combo guard, 1-2 guard, 2-1 guard stuff is silliness. Either they’re a guard that can handle the ball and pass or they can’t.
--JoshuWA
by prezofdeath on Jun 4, 2008 1:33 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
BACWGYASLDOOEAEYLATOE
Big-Athletic-Center-Who-Gives-You-A-Sack-Lunch-Dunk-On-One-End-And-Eats-Your-Lunch-At-The-Other-End.
by tweener on Jun 3, 2008 9:44 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
LOL well at least I like it!
Aldridge said. "We feel like we can beat any team. We feel like we can beat the Spurs, Suns, Lakers, Mavericks, whoever any night right now, and we'll still be here when those teams get old and their guys retire. We're going to be here for a long time."
by lee3022 on Jun 5, 2008 12:29 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
center
if you have greg, sg if you have Kobe, pg if you have CP3, pf if you have TD
by mark twain on Jun 3, 2008 10:32 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
any position and the ability to play basketball
To me, both positional importance and specific attributes are overrated. There are many ways to win basketball games and good players at any position can win.
Boomshakalaka
by jksnake99 on Jun 3, 2008 11:10 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
point guard
most important attribute: decision/playmaker
I was a little torn between my choice and a center that can lock down the paint. I ended up going with a point guard because I think centers can be rendered usless offensively if they dont have anyone to set up the plays and get them the ball. I have always thought of point guards as being the quarterback of basketball and centers(post players)as the runningback. A good QB needs to have a good running game to open things up for his part of the game, passing. The problem is there is limits to what a running back can do, on 3rd and 13 he is likely not going to touch the ball. The QB is a part of every play, even if it is just handing it off to the RB after the snap. The same is true of point guards, they touch the ball every single play and generally are the brains of the team…
RUDY > MJ
by myemic23 on Jun 3, 2008 11:36 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
position not important
I don’t think it matters that much which position your franchise player plays, but I think it is important that along with Hall-of-Fame basketball ablity you want someone with outstanding leadership, competitive spirit, and BB IQ to make all of his teamates better. Magic, Bird, MJ, Isiah fit this model. Although there were many centers that were pivotal to the success of championship teams, I can’t think of many who were the primary catalysts. Maybe Bill Russell.
Ideally it would be a point guard because that position is so important in dictating how a team plays. I can’t think of too many centers or PFs that fit this description, and I think it is because they are generally on the finishing end of offensive plays rather than as initiators. Defensive stars tend not to get as much credit for a championship team’s success as offensive. Bill Russell is the one exception I can think of.
by dogbert on Jun 3, 2008 11:38 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
what???
Shaq, Tim Duncan, Bill Walton… RIng a Bell?
by mark twain on Jun 3, 2008 12:37 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
It seems a majority likes center.. I thought PG from the first moment
Point Guards are so important. If you don’t have a man that can lead the team, handle the ball well and be able to make good decisions, you are going to have trouble. Turnovers, bad passing decisions, and overall sloppy play mostly derive from the main ball handler, being a point guard. We have a nice advantage of having combo guards like Brandon and Jarrett (at least for now), but still really need that guy that can drop assists and make smart decisions like its going out of style. The attribute a player like this needs is dedication. You don’t get good at what you do over night, it is all in the practice and being able to have great team chemistry. If it needs to be compared for some of you out there, it is a Chris Paul and Tyson Chandler duo, that consistently can find the other on the court for high percentage opportunities. Hopefully either the new point guard we get, or a current one, (Steve Blake showed interest in becoming an Oden Specialist..) can get a relationship built with our twin towers in LA and Oden. Point Guards with dedication for the win..
"The important thing is not to stop questioning. Curiosity has its own reason for existing. One cannot help but be in awe when he contemplates the mysteries of eternity, of life,(of the Blazers), of the marvelous structure of reality. It is enough if one tries merely to comprehend a little of this mystery every day. Never lose a holy curiosity." - Albert Einstein
by BlazerandBeaverBELIEVER on Jun 3, 2008 12:02 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
The reason I didn't say PG
is that they need the other players on the court to be good in order to reach their maximum potential. Sure, the great PG’s make their teammates look great even when they aren’t that good (see: Nash, Steve) but the PG still needs those other players. Any position benefits from better teammates but not in the same way the PG position does.
I say if you’re starting a team, start with the position that can dominate on both ends of the floor (almost) regardless of the teammates.
Furthermore, I like interior D now more than ever considering the hand check rules. A good slasher will be able to get into the paint on anyone. (see: Bowen switched to Peja in the playoffs) An intimidating, shot blocking center protects the rim and cleans up the paint.
We shall not cease from exploration
And the end of all our exploring
Will be to arrive where we started
And know the place for the first time.
-T.S. Eliot
by Magnum on Jun 3, 2008 1:16 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I agree with PG
A strong big man (center/PF) is important, and also harder to get than a quality guard, so maybe if you asked “highest priority” that would be the 4 or 5.
But since you ask about the “most important attribute,” at least on offense, I tend to think 1. is passing and 2. is outside shooting. So I’m going to say point guard, because he’s the key guy with skill #1 and it’s a big plus if he has #2 as well.
However, look at the 1980s Celtics, and they were all passers—I think that’s why they kept winning. Defenses just couldn’t keep up with the ball. And two of them were roughly the best shooters in the league. So, hey, if you have a Larry Bird, he’s amplifying the talents of your point guard, and if you have a starting 5 like they had, it’s like a 5-headed point guard.
But usually you’re talking about the point guard.
If you call Brandon Roy a 2 guard, but he’s handling the ball together with a conventional point guard, that’s twice the point guards. I’m happy with that.
by jtanzer on Jun 3, 2008 1:58 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Center
A top center is tougher to get than any other position. Also the gap between the top centers and the next level is much greater than any other position.
by NoStache on Jun 3, 2008 2:19 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
As a count of the responses show - it's center, beyond a doubt.
I agree with Farty that it is a team game and having a close knit, well functioning team is preferable to one all star at a position of your choise. That said, there is no other position that can dominate the game as well as a quality center.
by timg56 on Jun 3, 2008 3:25 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Center
The position has to be center even though neither of the two teams in the NBA Finals have great true centers. But the center position facilitates everything that the rest of the team does. But you need a dominant center that wants to win above all else…... sounds a lot like a 7-footer I know from Indianapolis.
by Mauricas Lou on Jun 3, 2008 4:57 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I don't think it's especially crucial,
but whoever it his, he has to be able to slash and score when the shot clock is winding down. I think PG or SG is usually that guy.
With that said, I don’t think it matters how many ballers you got—-you still have to have coherence. I think the Lakers All Star team of Shaq, Kobe, Malone, and Payton demonstrated that.
That’s why I luv the new Blazers. Roy is our slasher, we’ve got solid other players (very solid!), and we’ve got coherence.
That, in my opinion, equals future domination.
--Josh
by prezofdeath on Jun 3, 2008 5:00 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Defensive center
It forces the opponent to play on the perimeter, and god knows the shooting fundamentals in the league now are far less than they used to be. It helps if he has offense and can rebound for sure. Thats the kind of franchise player I want.
Most important attribute: Will to win.
MJ, Kobe have it, so do players like Cassell, Billups, Paul.. ( you will notice this tends to be a G attribute because they have the ball in their hands, but people like Hakeem DEMANDED the ball in the clutch. And refused to lose the game)
by RememberRastaMonsta! on Jun 3, 2008 5:46 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Center
hence build around the center, of a team, center.
atribute would have to be chemistry. i know they are profetionals, but if they dont get along with there team, it will show. So, in conclution, I think chemistry can make up for any lacking, ware bad chemistry can reduce other attributes and over expose weekness.
What did Oden say to the stork?. "Admit that you have got lost". amlmart
by ptwnblzr on Jun 3, 2008 6:11 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Inside Out Combo
I think a combination of a SG-PG and a PF-C is the best i would rather have two players who sit on the bench on the all-star team or barely miss out than i would have one dominant player, if you have consistency then you can spread the floor and take advantage of what other teams give you, if we upgrade Pg we will have 2 excellent guards and 2 excellent posts
by blackandwite323 on Jun 3, 2008 6:48 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
This raises a related question
blackandwite323 says: “i would rather have two players who sit on the bench on the all-star team or barely miss out than i would have one dominant player.”
I would raise this question next: Do you want top stars or an all-around team? Can you have both?
In terms of the Blazers, do you want to see Oden and Roy score 35 ppg and start All-Star games, or do you want to see it all spread around, maybe four players with stats like 15-6-3? It’s less dramatic, but what if it wins titles?
by jtanzer on Jun 3, 2008 9:06 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
It CAN work
The Pistons are an example of that, but they were also lucky to meet a talented Lakers team when they were imploding on themselves. The Pistons ‘all-round team’ is one of the exceptions.
Usually a championship team has 1 or 2 dominant players. Shaq, Wade, Magic, Duncan, Hakeem, Isiah, Kobe, Jordan… I might be forgetting someone, but who else has won a title that DIDN’T have a dominant player?
The Pistons did it with everyone having mid-range stats and no dominant (but all good) players, but I wouldn’t count on that happening much. Luckily for us, Roy can be dominant sometimes (and certainly in the 4th) and if Oden isn’t dominant eventually than it’ll be a disappointment.
I think you can have top stars and an all-round team, as long as the top stars are team players. I think that could describe our big 3, so we can have it both ways.
I agree an inside out combo is best, and someone who can regularly score in the post in the halfcourt. The Bulls didn’t have a good big man, but Jordan was a great post player and that’s what they went to in the halfcourt when they needed a bucket. You NEED the ability to get high percentage shots…
Mortimer
by Mortimer on Jun 4, 2008 1:48 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
SG
If you were to ask this question 20 years ago I think the answer would be Center. But the NBA is a offensive league now. Your ability to get to the free throw line and cause stress on the opposing defense is the biggest factor. Your 2 needs to not only be a facilitator on offense but also solid on defense to throw off the opposing guards effectiveness.
The most important attribute is leadership. You need that floor general to get you through rough patches and keep the offense constantly attacking.
by Stumptown Doug on Jun 3, 2008 7:09 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
SG - a closer
if you want to win a title, history says you need a SG who can close out games… i.e. Kobe, Manu, Wade, Hamilton, MJ, Clyde. All big time closers on the last 20 yrs+ of champions.
by ItsMrHarris2u on Jun 3, 2008 8:17 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Power Forward
Centers are clearly important, but it seems like the best power forwards have all of the skills needed to be a good center (rebounding ability, interior defense, post moves). However, in addition to those skills, the top PFs also are able to do a little ball-handling, hit a mid-range jumper, and play perimeter defense. Players like Tim Duncan, Kevin Garnett, Pau Gasol, and Rasheed Wallace are basically centers, except with more versatile skill sets which allow them to be extremely useful to their teams. I don’t think it is just a coincidence that all of the teams in the conference finals had very good power forwards.
by trk on Jun 3, 2008 8:57 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
shooting guard
Just like “ItsMrHarris2u” said – Roy, Kobe, Wade, MJ, Clyde…those are the guys you build a team around. Actually, offensively, those five would make a fun team.
by clonigro on Jun 4, 2008 9:29 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Dominance
A dominant center is much harder to find. There are a number of great point guards in the league but Oscar and Cousy were dominant (both still won only with dominant centers). There are a number of good shooting guards in the league but only Michael won successive titles without a center ( I suspect most of the rest cancel each other out). There are legendary forwards who dominated but needed a center to win. Wilt remains holding most of the records on offense and if blocks were recorded on defense as well. Russell has more than anyone. Hakeem has two and Kareem 6 (I think) and all needed other really good players with them to win. But those other players come to the teams with a dominant center because the game becomes so much easier for them with one. Leaders want the rings. Even Magic left Michigan State early because LA had the first pick and Kareem. Build your center and they will come.
Aldridge said. "We feel like we can beat any team. We feel like we can beat the Spurs, Suns, Lakers, Mavericks, whoever any night right now, and we'll still be here when those teams get old and their guys retire. We're going to be here for a long time."
by lee3022 on Jun 5, 2008 12:43 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

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