Jerryd Bayless Has Haters
In the post below this one, I wrote that the one trait that all 8 high school players featured in the new movie "Gunnin' For That #1 Spot" shared was a dogged determination to become the best. It just so happened that the newest Trail Blazer, Jerryd Bayless, was one of the 8 players featured.
With this kind of determination and the resulting success it creates, apparently, comes a jug full of haterade. Check out some of the comments in this recent AZCentral.com article regarding Mr. Bayless's selection in the NBA draft. Usually I'm not one to put too much stock into internet messageboard comments (except here on BE of course), but the ones posted on this article are fascinating, as the readers of this article are, presumably, his hometown fans. One would think they would be among his most ardent fans and would be happy for a local-boy made good.
Au contraire, here are a few of the most brutal ones...
I hate to say, he is so stuck on himself, the NBA is going to level him. His career probably wont last long at all, because it's all about Bayless and not the rest of the team. Team work doesnt mean anything to him at all. He made a very big mistake leaving college and he is going to find out real quick about that mistake. His media interview alone, proved that its all about him and know one else. I feel sorry for his future as other have been in this same situation and have failed hard. Bayless needs to learn that its not all about him and he needs to be a team player.
he's a headcase
Bayless definitely thinks way too much of himself. He'll never be a team leading point guard or star shooting guard in the NBA. He'll be a decent supportive player and that's it. And he won't be the best NBA player to come out of AZ either...
Whoa. Needless to say, my first reaction was worry.
Where did all this vitriol come from? I scoured the AZCentral.com archives looking for answers. And, in reading through a number of articles, it is clear that Bayless is supremely determined, supremely confident, and supremely talented. Perhaps that rubbed some people the wrong way? Here are a few links.
It had to be about 17 or 18 years ago when Jerryd Bayless started uttering his first words. After the usual "Mom" and "Dad," one of the first phrases he put together was this:
"I the boss of myself."
After his mother, Denise Bowman, gasped with amazement, she quickly figured she might be in trouble.
Expectations Haven't Hurt UA's Bayless
In February 2004, I visited St. Mary's High School to watch a basketball player who was receiving an uncomfortable amount of attention for a freshman.
Despite an impressive support system of family and coaches, I wondered what would become of him. The path to greatness is littered with causalities of high expectations, strewn with victims of emotional and physical burnout.
Four years. Let's revisit this story in four years.
It's four years, and Arizona freshman Jerryd Bayless is doing just fine, thank you very much.
Sean Elliott resisted the temptation of turning pro after his junior season.
But the former University of Arizona and Cholla High School basketball star doesn't begrudge freshman Wildcat Jerryd Bayless for jumping to the NBA.
...
Elliott believes Bayless "has the physical talent" to make the leap this early, whereas, "physically, I wasn't ready" after the junior season.
Perhaps even more interesting, though, are two articles that appear to directly contradict the most explosive of the commenters' charges: that he is a me-only player.
Freshman Bayless piles up numbers
Despite the numbers Bayless is piling up, O'Neill describes him as a "very unselfish player."
"To be honest, it is difficult for him at times to really understand what I am saying when I say, 'Just go.' His tendency is to move the ball and get everybody involved," O'Neill said.
Bayless looking to prove himself
But, on this day, the former Phoenix St. Mary's High star was passing out boxes of food to families in need.
"It's good to do something like this," he said. "It's a good cause."
The 6-foot-3 Bayless wants it known he can make an assist, whether it be in the community or on the basketball court.
Given the Trail Blazers' well-known thorough researching of draft prospects, I am fully confident they have done their homework on Bayless. And, in all his recent interviews and everything else I have read online, he seems like a perfect fit for our culture.
In reading through these articles, particularly the last two, I am still worried. But not about Bayless. I am worried about what's being put in Arizona drinking water. Let the man shine.
There's another thing I am not worried about: Portland's fans will surely appreciate, and embrace, Jerryd Bayless' dogged work ethic.
-- Ben (benjamin.golliver@gmail.com)
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I think maybe those Arizona residents are just bitter
I have a friend who went to the University of Arizona for two years, and he is a big supporter of their basketball team. They kind of underachieved this year without Lute Olson, and he frequently expressed frustration at the season. Residents of Arizona were probably far more frustrated, especially because Jerryd Bayless is from Phoenix. Just like how Kevin Love received death threats from Oregonians for choosing to attend an out-of-state school, I think people are just disappointed at not having a star player on their favorite team. Also, after the McDonald’s All-American game, I remember my friend coming into my dorm room with a huge smile on his face, because he had heard from some fellow Arizona fans that Bayless was seen socializing with Brandon Jennings and telling him that he would stay another year to play alongside him. The fact that this turned out to be the furthest thing from the truth probably stung a little.
"No, you're not imagining things: Black America is ecstatic." -Errin Haines, Associated Press writer
by Junior Del Norte on
Jun 29, 2008 6:39 PM PDT
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excellent point
the attacks seem very personal to me, too personal to write off like that….
i don’t think you can blame bayless for the team’s turmoil or lack of success this year… that is a terrible case of scapegoating…
the kevin love hate had a lot to do with comments made by his father, whereas to my knowledge the worst thing that bayless did to UA was go one and done…
enough time has passed since that announcement that you think people would have come to terms with it and be happy for a player who has been high profile in their state for five years…
i’m far from a bruin fan but i am incredibly happy for kevin love right now. he has made oregon proud.
"Honor Terry Porter." Email me with your TP stories and memories.
by Ben. on
Jun 29, 2008 7:01 PM PDT
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Yeah it seems that a lot of those posters were ASU fans and the whole
PHX kid going to Tucson kinda rubbed them the wrong way. I would imagine that if you went onto some of the OLive message boards, you would see all kinds of bad stuff about Love being an ass, cocky, steps on babies, eats puppies, horrible person type banter.
People that are closest sometimes criticise the most.
I think that EVERY NBA player in HS could be labeled as cocky, selfish and any # of other things.
I actually went onto a UA forum and asked some ??s about Bayless to the UA fans and this is what they have had to say:
http://pointguardu.com/cats/showthread.php?t=39464
In case you couldnt figure it our I logged on as RipCity21
by SpyderRyder on
Jun 29, 2008 7:05 PM PDT
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great link...
very interesting comments on there… both up and down… well done
"Honor Terry Porter." Email me with your TP stories and memories.
by Ben. on
Jun 29, 2008 7:08 PM PDT
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Ya know,
I went on there for the express purpose of trying to find dirt on Bayless, as fans such as us will know the weaknesses of our players at least if not better than some writer out there.
Some of us here live and breath the Blazers, much as those posters live and breath UA basketball. I figured that their opinion would be just as valuable as a talking head @ ESPN, or SI.
by SpyderRyder on
Jun 29, 2008 7:37 PM PDT
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Good feedback
The notion on that link that Bayless does not do well against good teams does not ring true with the one game I watched at KU. Against the #1 defense in the nation Bayless was 5 for 9 (2 for 2 3-pointers) and 7 for 7 at the line for 19 points. He did turn the ball over 7 times (Chalmers and Robinson and Kaun each had 3 steals) but that is close to KU’s average last year. But it is hard to shoot well on the road and even harder to do so in Allen Field House and Bayless made it look easy and Arizona only lost by 4.
Aldridge said. "We feel like we can beat any team. We feel like we can beat the Spurs, Suns, Lakers, Mavericks, whoever any night right now, and we'll still be here when those teams get old and their guys retire. We're going to be here for a long time."
by lee3022 on
Jun 29, 2008 8:47 PM PDT
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Ex-Roomie grew up in Tuscon
He’s a been a Cat’s fanantic most of his life. He played with Rodney Peete
as a Junior at Suawaro (sic-the cactus) High at PG. His comments on Bayless.
1. Great shooter, excellent elevation.
2. Very athletic and gets to the rim (primarily to the right hand)
3. Combo guard, but will find the open man.
4. When pressed on defense, my buddy said he’s average, but won’t get
embarrased. Below average rebounder.
5. Very smart. Good student and comes from great family. Well spoken.
6. Pretty good team guy, but looks to SCORE.
In addition, I have been to Phoenix/Tuscon nine out of the last 12 years for
Spring Training/Vacation. I can tell you that ASU fan hates UA and would be
extra BITTER when a Phoenix kid, ie Elliott, Frye,Bayless, etc left for Tuscon.
In addition, one poster can’t even spell, proving he’s a McCOY. (Know (sic)one else ?)
Don’t worry. BRoy/Oden/& the rest will lead him down the TEAM road, with Nate
emphasizing Defense and sharing the ball.
It's GO time !
by walkoff41 on
Jun 30, 2008 12:35 AM PDT
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This is a great link
Yeah, nothing better than going 11 or 13 for a little humble pie. I think he’s gonna be alright.
by obscuris on
Jul 1, 2008 1:59 AM PDT
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Typical for 1 and Done's
As a UW grad, we had this experience last year with Hawes. When a stud frosh comes in and doesn’t elevate the team beyond its current stature, than leaves as a lottery pick after just one disappointing season, the hometown fans get bitter and slam on the player. It is typical and it fades after a few months.
by Minny C on
Jul 1, 2008 1:56 PM PDT
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Everyone hates on Kanye West also
Yet he is one of the most talented and hard working artists in the music industry! You may not like his cockiness but you can’t deny, the dude makes hits! If a player knows he is ballin’ that doesn’t mean he is going to be selfish and not a team player, get over your selves and give credit where credit is due! Blazer fans will love him, he will be an important part in our successful future we will have! GO BAYLESSS!!
by Trail Ducker on
Jun 29, 2008 8:41 PM PDT
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yeah he fits the culture
I doubt there’s ever been a successfull person who wasn’t called arrogant at some point.
Winning is everything.
by MT Suit on
Jun 29, 2008 8:55 PM PDT
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I wouldn't want Kanye West on my team
His ego is too big.
BINGO, BANGO, BONGO
by blzrfan on
Jun 29, 2008 9:26 PM PDT
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Plus...
I hear he is a streaky shooter and he isn’t long enough to be a good defender in the NBA.
PTB Liberation Day - 2/10/04
by tssbro on
Jun 29, 2008 9:58 PM PDT
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............................. Not to mention his itty, bitty little raptor arms!
"You don't live by the jumpshot, you die by the jumpshot." ---Charles Barkley, 2/7/08
by timbo on
Jun 29, 2008 10:02 PM PDT
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I should read posts more carefully before I write the same jokes.
"You don't live by the jumpshot, you die by the jumpshot." ---Charles Barkley, 2/7/08
by timbo on
Jun 29, 2008 10:03 PM PDT
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*T-Rex arms
"I think it’s going to be very beautiful game next year."
-Batuuuuuuuum!
by rockingharder on
Jun 29, 2008 11:07 PM PDT
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Yikes
Lets not do that to poor Jerryd
I remember the good old days. The Rasta Monsta days.
by GreatOden'sRaven on
Jun 30, 2008 12:34 PM PDT
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I have learned to trust the staff
to get the character evaluation (as well as the talent evaluation) right. So Bayless should be fine.
After Darrell Arthur and Mario Chalmers declared for the NBA there were a few posts on the KUsports.com website that said similar things. North Carolina fans said similar things about Ty Lawson. Some college fans mistakenly believe they own a player for four years. They will get over it. It is too bad that Bayless got an abreviated time with Lute Olson last year.
Aldridge said. "We feel like we can beat any team. We feel like we can beat the Spurs, Suns, Lakers, Mavericks, whoever any night right now, and we'll still be here when those teams get old and their guys retire. We're going to be here for a long time."
by lee3022 on
Jun 29, 2008 8:52 PM PDT
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i hear you on the staff
the question then becomes, if we didn’t meet with him, is there the possibility that we missed something?
i’m not saying we did or didn’t, however it is a question that has come up via email and should probably be asked, given the fact we didn’t put him through the paces like we did oden and durant last year.
"Honor Terry Porter." Email me with your TP stories and memories.
by Ben. on
Jun 29, 2008 9:05 PM PDT
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Me trusty staff too
Especially since the staff includes a highly-regarded sports psychologist, who was in the war room on the night of the draft. Maybe I’m a sucker for fancy pants credentials, but I’ll bet the Blazers have a pretty good idea about whether we drafted a “headcase.”
It is interesting though - in the past KP has made such in issue of meeting a guy, looking him in the eye, and sharing a meal with him. Wha’ happened this time? And at one point, some in the league were pushing for a single psych evaluation, so the kids don’t have to go through the MMSI and other tests every time they work our for a team. Anybody know - are psych tests part of the Orlando camp?
(Mostly I take these internet comments with a giant grain of salt—Joel Pryzbilla is STILL considered a traitor in Minnesota for leaving collage early.)
"Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist." -- RIP George Carlin
by Corvid on
Jun 30, 2008 10:19 AM PDT
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In the past, KP has had the luxury of high draft picks...
...this time around, it was having to bluff and deceive his way to the player he wanted. I’d guess he had enough scouts around over the last year to give him a good feel for Bayless.
by DonkeyShins on
Jun 30, 2008 12:28 PM PDT
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Every player has haters
That’s just how it is… Even B-Roy has haters… Remember all the nasty stuff that the Indy kids say about McBob? All the nasty stuff that Portland kids say about K-Love? It’s all just a bunch of snotty little shts who have nothing good to say about themselves. Probably just a bunch of worthless Kbe loving L*kers fans.
by david1978pdx on
Jun 29, 2008 10:20 PM PDT
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A lot of this is Arizona vs. Arizona State
What do you think Beavers Fans would say about Jonathan Stewart’s potential in the NFL? I put a lot more weight on Channing Frye’s impressions of Jerryd Bayless than I do Arizona fans. Frye feels like Bayless is a great fit on and off the court. I don’t know why he would lie about something like that. Channing Frye is a great guy… and if he is exciting about playing with a guy of Bayless’ character, then I am happy to have him on the team.
by Salem Stephen on
Jun 29, 2008 11:10 PM PDT
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I forgot about the Buffet!
If Frye likes Jerryd, that’s endorsement enough. Perhaps they’ll hang out with the hippies together? (joke)
by DonkeyShins on
Jun 30, 2008 12:29 PM PDT
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Bottom line...
Bayless gets a chance to show who and what he is all about. No one player is bigger than the franchise or team. I don’t care what has been written or said about him by supporters or detractors. Clean slate. Welcome to Portland, welcome to the N.B.A. Plus who’s perfect? This is a young kid, there might be some room for professional and personal growth over the next few years. But am I going to worry? Hey, The Blazers have culture! Would take more than a cocky rookie to upset the foundation we’ve created.
"Mother Nature started this fight, I think it's about time we ended it!"
by Krang on
Jun 29, 2008 11:14 PM PDT
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Thats the best way
Nothing from College you bring with you (except injuries) and you get a clean slate. Besides I could care less if he is difficult to coach or has a big ego. Just as long as Nate can manage that ego and coach him..
I remember the good old days. The Rasta Monsta days.
by GreatOden'sRaven on
Jun 30, 2008 1:06 PM PDT
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I don't know.
Psychologists have found that first impressions are remarkably accurate. If that’s true then I don’t have super high hopes for Bayless. His game seems great, but when I look at him all I see is a cocky teenager with tiny arms. He’s type of guy who would give himself lame nicknames and has his initials embroidered onto his clothing.
Did you see the footage of people trying to get him to smile after he was drafted 11th? Darrell Arthur handled the draft better than Bayless did. At this point I would be up for a Jared Bayless for Mike Conley trade. I don’t think Conley possesses the same physical gifts, but he seems like a much better teammate and Memphis might go for it.
Sorry, that’s just the way I feel.
If somebody hits you with an object you should beat the hell out of them.-Charles Barkley
by Winchester on
Jun 29, 2008 11:38 PM PDT
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But... why?
Even though every article directly contradicts all of these deeply held beliefs of yours that were formed from watching a heavily edited for ‘flash n’ style’ online video of a kid celebrate getting ready for the draft and then being bummed he fell further than expected, and to a crappy team like Indiana as an extra kick in the nuts?
Any “first impression” you might have had of Bayless from his brief moments during the draft or the online videos posted are obviously filtered through editing choices and someone else’s point of view. Even considering that, I think the kid came across really well.
If you’re really comfortable reading something negative in Bayless that every article, interview, and personal testimony about the kid contradicts, well, that’s cool. A few random anonymous posters on some website shouldn’t mean much when you don’t know the people or why they are saying what they are saying. I guarantee you can find someone say the same or worse about Brandon Roy somewhere in Seattle, and it’s probably out of jealousy.
Bayless could be a douche or he could be the greatest kid ever. I don’t see how you’ve seen enough to have an accurate ‘first impression’, and the evidence that is out there for all to see definitely hasn’t pointed to supreme douchery like you seem to be vibing from the kid…
I’ll take Bayless’ obvious disappointment about going #11 to Indiana over Arthur’s robotic monotone cut n’ paste answers any day of the week.
The worst we’ve heard is that he’s very confident in himself, which I don’t find to be a bad thing. If he’s really bad in that regard, a few weeks getting schooled by Roy and yelled at by Nate will solve the problem.
Mortimer
by Mortimer on
Jun 30, 2008 12:24 AM PDT
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Maybe.
It’s not so much the videos, as highlight reels are inherently deceptive, it’s about the fact that attitude keeps coming up when people talk about him. I think Chad Ford said he liked to “Hot Dog” it. I don’t know the kid personally, so I have to glean what insight I can from people who know him better than I. Listen to what this fine fellow had to say about him.
I used to ball with this kid at Encanto Park Central/East Phoenix, He was blazing fast and leaped like a grasshoper.He didnt care for Defense like most his age, And when there was Physical play he lost his focus and became frustrated!! He has mad skills but, his arrogance is uncoachable. He will be ok in the NBA but he is no CHRIS PAUL nor will he be!! more of like a Sebastian Telfair(maybe) ?? -laxlutha
Bayless will probably turn out to be a nice kid, but don’t act like I’m crazy for having doubts about his attitude. I’m not against him, I just have some concerns. I’m not getting my hopes up. Ok, that’s a lie, I am getting my hopes up.
If somebody hits you with an object you should beat the hell out of them.-Charles Barkley
by Winchester on
Jun 30, 2008 1:50 AM PDT
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I didn't mean to sound so harsh
I just didn’t think we had any evidence that could lead to a negative first impression, especially when we haven’t had access to the kid to really gain an accurate first impression, and perhaps the first impression was being tainted by things one had heard about the kid.
Not that I am on expert on Bayless at ALL; I knew of him from the draft but didn’t think he was within our reach, but since we got him I’ve done my Blazer-fan-with-a-day-off duty and poured into all the videos and linked articles I could see. From all of that, I got an overly positive Brandon Roy-esque picture of the kid, though definitely more offensive minded. He seems smart, comes from a good family, and is more concerned with the big picture than just being a rich NBA player.
My first impression aside from the draft was seeing him wear that hat that said he won’t be defined by his cars and his house and whatever he owns (I am paraphrasing). I like that, and think it fits Portland.
I don’t think anyone plays REAL defense in a street ball game. Whenever I play real defense someone wants to fight. I’m just not sure laxlutha is a source I can take seriously, as I don’t know who he is or what he is about. The comparison to Telfair is odd as well, because one was an undersized scoring PG who couldn’t shoot, and one is a big PG with a deadly jumper and can dunk and all that stuff Telfair can’t do. Even how they came into the league isn’t the same; Bayless isn’t arriving in Portland on a wave of magazine covers and hype. Aside from both being drafted by Portland, I don’t see much in common…
Could be wrong, but I think it was David Thorpe who said Bayless was a highly confident kid who liked to hot dog it (hot dog sounds like a Thorpeian term to me, though Ford could have said it). He admitted he had never met the kid, and is just going by what he had heard.
Confidence by itself isn’t bad to me, and I’d expect there’d be ONE article saying what an egotistical prick the kid is if that was true. KP and Friends are known to dig deep on whoever we think about drafting, and even though Bayless didn’t come into Portland (though he was seen live in Oakland), I gotta imagine they’ve gone over and under and through any research about his attitude.
I mean, everything I’ve read has been so positive, I just found it strange your initial first impression was so negative. He does have short arms for an NBA player, but thus far that’s the only negative I can find. He’s 6’3” in shoes and his arms are 6’3.5”, but his other measurements and times are better or the same as Derrick Rose.
I’m not so attached to the kid or the idea of the kid to defend him at all costs; I just didn’t see the evidence to support your worry.
And I really can’t factor in some anonymous posts of people saying they ‘knew him back when’, even if it was a glowing review.
Mortimer
by Mortimer on
Jun 30, 2008 2:17 AM PDT
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OK
I trust your judgment. Thanks for talking me down. Anyone described as a “thinking man’s Monta Ellis” can’t be bad.
On another note, draft express lists Mario Chalmers best case scenario as Jarrett Jack?
If somebody hits you with an object you should beat the hell out of them.-Charles Barkley
by Winchester on
Jun 30, 2008 2:28 AM PDT
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Ooph, good thing we didn't draft Mario then
Though I take this as the NBA world outside of Blazer-dom actually has a pretty high opinion of Jarrett Jack, at least higher than the average Blazer fan’s opinion of Jack.
He seems to make an impact on other teams’ fans, and everyone notices him and usually like what they see.
Because of this, I can buy Larry Bird thinking Jack plus Rush is worth more than Bayless, because of what Jack offers now… plus, that franchise needs an image rehab like we did, and Jack is great for that because he works so hard and doesn’t get in trouble.
Hey, like I said in other threads, the things Jack does well are things other teams CRAVE, and are things we formerly craved ourselves but are now spoiled with: hard working, good heart, plays hard, doesn’t get in trouble, good FTs, and a natural leader. That’ll always have value, sideline stepouts or not.
Or, I am way off, and Draft Express thinks Mario either has to reach his best case scenario or play in Europe.
Mortimer
by Mortimer on
Jun 30, 2008 2:56 AM PDT
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I live in LA
And I can tell you that down here, people are saying that Pacers got a solid backup and insurance for TJ Ford and that Jarrett Jack is a clear starter for many teams in the league.. interesting to me..
As a Blazer fan I love Jarretts intensity but I am no where near as high on him as other teams seem to be.
I remember the good old days. The Rasta Monsta days.
by GreatOden'sRaven on
Jun 30, 2008 1:03 PM PDT
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Bayless and Roy
It’s funny, because I’ve been telling anyone who asks about Bayless, that I see a lot of Brandon Roy in his game. He’s a hard worker by all accounts, gets ridiculous lift on his pull up jumper just like Roy, has the killer crossover like Roy, has a really strong core like Roy, but is probably a little more explosive, quick and daring than Roy. I think they’ll make a GREAT duo…...
Witty Unpredictable Talent and Natural Game
by iDea on
Jun 30, 2008 11:08 AM PDT
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Seriously?
You’re posting internet vitriol from guys named laxlutha who claims to have played pickup ball on the playground with Bayless and claims from that experience that he’s “uncoachable” due to his cockiness?
Come on Winchester, you’re better than that. You can find these kinds of stupid comments about any player in the league. Give the kid a break and give him a chance. He’s an extremely hard worker (from actual people who know him) and is driven to win. He’s going to be a stud…....
Witty Unpredictable Talent and Natural Game
by iDea on
Jun 30, 2008 11:04 AM PDT
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Give me a break.
I’m actually not better than that. After all, I’m not a news journalist. I’m just a guy who ocasionaly posts on sports blogs.
I feel a better about Bayless now that I’ve had a chance to do some deeper research on the kid. Even so, Bayless is still the top candidate to win these awards.
1. Most likely to demand a max contract.
2. Most likley to demand a trade.
3. Most likley to complain about playing time.
4. Most likley to stare at his own reflextion for hours at a time.
If somebody hits you with an object you should beat the hell out of them.-Charles Barkley
by Winchester on
Jun 30, 2008 3:09 PM PDT
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he's a kid
Given that he is a 19 year old who has had people tell him how great he is all of his life, I think a little arrogance is just part of the package. I would imagine that the competitiveness and drive create personal goals for these athletes that can easily come across as arrogance. I wouldn’t think it wise to try to read too much into 2 min of TV time on possibly the most stressful day of his life, particularly since he fell around 7 picks from where he was originally projected. I haven’t had a sit down with him to look into his eyes to read his soul like Bush, but I wouldn’t stress over the limited exposure that us fans have had so far. Although as a caveat, I would like to say that it hurts discussion when fans immediately get behind players 10 seconds into their career as Blazers, an become unresponsive to any criticism.
by TFan on
Jun 30, 2008 10:59 AM PDT
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Think about it
If you were constantly worked hard your whole life at something, harder than anyone you’ve ever seen around you, wouldn’t you be pretty damn confident in your abilities? He knows he’s prepared…...
Witty Unpredictable Talent and Natural Game
by iDea on
Jun 30, 2008 11:10 AM PDT
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I saw the movie
And Bayless strikes me as having a lot of determination without a lot of ego. He seems to have a lot of inner calm and seems very ready to play team ball. I liked that. At the same time, there are hardly any highlights of him in the movie. He seems like a winner but not a human highlight reel. He’d make a good San Antonio Spur.
My review of the film, for anyone who’s interested, is posted here:
http://www.offoffoff.com/film/2008/gunnin_for_that_1_spot.php
by jtanzer on
Jun 30, 2008 12:13 AM PDT
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good article here..
It appears that Jerryd not only demands the best effort from himself but also his teammates, this is one quality I thought the blazers had been lacking, and found it not surprising in the least when our 13 game win streak coincided with the infamous ‘no dribble practice’ where Martell and Joel had some words…
Never did he bring up the 39 points he scored, addressing them only when asked by saying, simply, “I don’t care.”
“Jerryd just cares about winning,” O’Neill said. “He doesn’t care about other things in college life, or scoring 39 points. I’m not surprised at all he reacted that way.”
by contemnor on
Jun 30, 2008 4:53 AM PDT
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One view
KP calls Bayless Jack on steroids, and a gym rat. He’s serious about his game, and was raised in a good family. And don’t forget family – because it’s the family that grounds kids. And, he’s still a kid. Like all 19 year olds, he has strengths and weaknesses. You can take everyone of the seven guards chosen in the first 13 of this draft, and pick them apart as well. KP also takes strong character guys with intelligence. Always has. Bayless is no different. There has never been a hint of him having “problems”, whether partying or drugs or an unwillingness to practice and get better. Every one of the seven guards can, at times, be accused of, for example, “hot dogging”. After all, I’m sure they all had games where they were the principal scorer, or, at times, too enthusiastically dunked over someone, or threw a fist in the air after a score, or whatever. They’re under a microscope. And the press, the fans of the other team, and the like, all have opinions that they then put in print. And the story makes the rounds. What’s interesting, of course, is that no-one actually had a specific example of “hot dogging”. Only the rumor. And, his coaches never felt that he was selfish or unwilling to work – only outsiders.
In the end, we have a 6’3”, 205 lb, Mitch Richmond type of guard. Strong, athletic, a leaper, able to post up or go to the hole, sturdy enough to finish, and willing to work hard. Roy will guard the other two guard, and Bayless will guard the opposing PG – neutralizing the issue of height, as few PG’s are over 6’3”. In Portland, he’ll get the coaching without the confusion that happened in College when Olsen stepped back for a year, and he won’t be expected to move from the point to the two guard for the good of the team – as happened in Az – which left him learning two positions in his first year out of high school. He’ll get to focus.
He’ll get better. Just like Roy improved over his first two years, and Aldridge and the others have done the same.
by Eben Calder on
Jun 30, 2008 5:43 AM PDT
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Mitch Richmond
Was one of my favorite players ever. He was awesome.
That’s all. I agree with the rest obviously.
Sorry to waste your time :-(
Mortimer
by Mortimer on
Jun 30, 2008 11:36 AM PDT
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I watched an obscene amount of PAC-10 basketball this year
And I feel like I’m as qualified as anyone to evaluate Bayless.
I’ve wanted the Blazers to draft him since I first saw him play this year in pre-season. I watched nearly every UA game this year, and nothing I saw made me change my mind. He has an extremely complete scoring game, whether it be 3-pointers (he supposedly made 30 straight in a workout for the knicks), mid range jumpers, floaters, and lay ins with both hands. Watching his highlight real, you’ll be amazed by the body control he shows when driving and taking contact at the rim: very reminiscent of Roy. He has a dynamite first step, similar to what I see in B-Roy and OJ Mayo. Playing primarily SG this year, it will be interesting to see how he handles more of a PG role, but from what I saw he’s an able ball handler and passer. He’s been an able defender; not spectacular, but he has the athleticism to improve.
He will fit absolutely perfect with Roy in the backcourt. He has great size and quickness for defending points, can run the break, and can play off the ball in the half court set.
Incidentally, drafting Westbrook over Bayless is insane. I like Westbrook a lot, but you draft Westbrook hoping he can develop into the kind of player Bayless is. I watched them both a lot, and have no doubt that Bayless is the better pick, despite Westbrook’s superior defense.
As for Arizona fans being negative about Bayless, there are several reasons. Arizona basketball last year was disapointing, due to a rash of injuries, Lute’s hyatus, and overall mediocre performance (by Arizona standards). All the Arizona fans I know don’t consider last year to be a “real” Arizona year, due to Olsen being gone. Therefore, they were looking forward to returning Bayless, Budinger, Hill et al, and adding Jennings for a “real” Arizona team. Bayless leaving obviously ruins that.
Their impression, therefore, is of someone who took a lot of shots (he was their only real scorer for a while due to injuries), in a losing effort for an imposter Arizona team.
The equivalent would be Yankee fans disliking A-Rod, despite him being arguably the best and most productive player in baseball, because he has had the misfortune of playing for some sub-par yankee teams, thus making him “not a true Yankee.”
I was ecstatic about this pick. I didn’t think it was possible for KP to pull off, but I haven’t been this giddy about the Blazers since we won the Oden lottery. Next season can’t come soon enough.
by OregonDuckworth on
Jun 30, 2008 6:31 AM PDT
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Scumdevils?
I had not heard that one before. I liked your insight on Bayless. I have been trying to dig up information on him for days. I am now more excited about him and I am not overly concerned about his attitude. I am more concerned about his ability to be a solid defender and run plays. Thanks for the detail. I will look past the Scumdevil comment as a frustrated Nogales Tech comment. Go Blazers!
by AZBlazer on
Jun 30, 2008 2:14 PM PDT
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He didn't say that
I did a word search and only you and GreatOden’sRaven used that term. OregonDuckworth is most likely an Oregon Duck fan not a ASU fan.
<-;-)
by tominhawaii on
Jul 1, 2008 8:00 AM PDT
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Bayless like Kevin Love
Isn’t there some saying out there about not taking a person for granted? Meaning, Bayless grew up and played in state and often the people you grow up with have general impressions of you that are overly critical. Take for instance the hate UO fans and Oregon fans in general had against Kevin Love, I mean he can’t be that awful of a player can he – not and be picked where he was in the lottery. Yet, based on a lot of comments about him from Oregonians he sucks.
I can’t help but feel that is the case with Bayless to a certain extent.
by psu06830 on
Jun 30, 2008 11:31 AM PDT
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I agree with that
Plus Bayless went to the school that wasn’t in his hometown, kinda-but-not-exactly-like Love spurning the Oregon schools to go to UCLA…
I really cannot take seriously random anonymous people saying bad stuff about Bayless on various Arizona-themed message boards when every article and non-biased word about Bayless is overwhelmingly positive.
Like I wrote above, I’m sure we can find someone in Seattle who think Brandon Roy is a jerk. Maybe he rubbed someone the wrong way when working on the docks before he got accepted to UofW. I don’t know these random locals who dislike Bayless, but I do know I trust KP and his team, so I’ll trust the peoples who ain’t done n’ gone failed me yet.
Mortimer
by Mortimer on
Jun 30, 2008 11:44 AM PDT
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19 years old
I don’t have much to add to this discussion, but I can say that I would shudder to see what message boards would’ve said about me at 19 if I had been an elite athlete.
by clydeshairline on
Jun 30, 2008 12:01 PM PDT
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Yeah that would be horrid..
I was cocky as hell back then.. well.. as you get it older its called confidence.. im just confident now
I remember the good old days. The Rasta Monsta days.
by GreatOden'sRaven on
Jun 30, 2008 12:52 PM PDT
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Thanks for the link
I know its annoying when fans of other teams chime in, but you did link us to this page, or at least somebody did. Anyways I would have to agree with Clydeshairline, he just a kid. But I will say this, it was pretty awkward when the kid was seemingly pouting when he was interviewed during the draft about going from the Pacers to the Blazers in a trade… how couldn’t the kid be excited. Not to rub it in, but Brandon Rush, when he was told he was going there, was talking about how awesome it was going to be to play with Greg Oden, and Brandon Roy, and how he just wants to fit in and do what it takes to win and was pumped to be on a winning team. Jerryd Bayless on the other hand seemed to have a little bit of that Joe Johnson / Shawn Marion-itis, he wants All-Star appearances rather than rings, that was just my first impression, other than that hey, Stephen Jackson won a championship with the Spurs, so if you have talent, and are around talent in a good environment, which the Blazers have created, he will succeed. But keeping him long term might be the real worry, cause it sounds to me like he would rather be the starting PG for a team without stars, rather than second , actually 4th or 5th on your team, you guys are nasty! (still real jealous, but hey we are planning on getting Ricky Rubio, B.J. Mullens, or DeRozan, haha!, actually just picked up a Ricky Rubio DKV Joventut jersey this weekend from my parents when they were in Spain… might be an omen, apologies for too much Pacers stuff, my bad) Good luck, hope Greg stays healthy!
PS: Mike Conley is supposedly on the trading block, if I was the Blazers I would trade Bayless to the Grizzlies in a HEART BEAT for Mike Conley, hell I would even throw in a future 1st round pick. Living in Columbus at the time they were freshman at The Ohio State, they were partying/dating (well at least Mike was dating, Oden was playing the field) two girls from my High School and came to a few parties, those dudes are like two peas in a pod, and have been playing together since they were in Junior High… I would do anything possible to re-unite those two, and thats not a joke! And hell, if you do that, maybe D-COOK will jump aboard when he is a free agent!
Brent Jonathan Beck
by Brent Beck on
Jun 30, 2008 12:41 PM PDT
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Uhhh no thanks
You keep him… he couldnt crack the starting lineup in Memphis..
i will take bayless
and you WAY overvalue Conley. How about a lottery protected #1 next year and Sergio?
I remember the good old days. The Rasta Monsta days.
by GreatOden'sRaven on
Jun 30, 2008 12:52 PM PDT
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Conley was a starter
He ended the season really well, even shooting 40%+ from three point land over the last 1/3rd of the season or so. He did well, after he recovered from his injuries.
I am not as high on the kid as others were last year, but he’s still a pretty good prospect. I stick with Bayless because of his shooting, and cause we got Roy…
Mortimer
by Mortimer on
Jun 30, 2008 1:12 PM PDT
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And because he looks like Muttley?
I remember the good old days. The Rasta Monsta days.
by GreatOden'sRaven on
Jun 30, 2008 1:36 PM PDT
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Also
The impression I got about Jerryd wasn’t that he was upset he was going to the Blazers OR the Pacers, just that 10 teams had passed on him. He truly thought he was going anywhere from 4-7 and fell to 11. And that hurt his ego I think…whether that brings other questions I don’t know, but he didnt see to happy to even be picked that low by Indiana. And its not like he pulled a Steve Francis up there either..
I remember the good old days. The Rasta Monsta days.
by GreatOden'sRaven on
Jun 30, 2008 1:01 PM PDT
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I would do that trade
Boomshakalaka
by jksnake99 on
Jun 30, 2008 1:37 PM PDT
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I don't think Memphis would do it
They already have a combo guard in Mayo.
BINGO, BANGO, BONGO
by blzrfan on
Jun 30, 2008 1:43 PM PDT
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Also BTW Brent
Thanks for coming by. We love to have other teams viewpoints. Its nice to hear from someone who isnt a little biased (myself included)
I remember the good old days. The Rasta Monsta days.
by GreatOden'sRaven on
Jun 30, 2008 1:37 PM PDT
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I agree.
If somebody hits you with an object you should beat the hell out of them.-Charles Barkley
by Winchester on
Jun 30, 2008 3:11 PM PDT
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Ok so apparently I am the only one....
I am a Wildcat. Err at least used to be.. I am a Blazer fan. I watched every UA game this year. I paid for the freaking FSN Arizona feed to my satellite solely for the UA Basketball team (trust me, football is painful down there). I have been a fan for a long time and when I went there I had a few friends on the team who to this day are still cool people who I talk to on occasion (although NBA players grow out of casual friends faster than the rest of us.. hehe)
Here are my thoughts on Bayless from what I have seen on TV and what I have gleaned from my friends either at UA or former players who will play against him now:
Bayless is an excellent offensive player
He can shoot from all over the floor, jumps extra high when shooting his jumper and gets off the ground quickly which makes him difficult to block. He loves to go to the rim and got more and 1’s than anyone I can remember at UA outside of maybe Miles Simon. He also plays off the ball well and runs to the spot to receive the ball with effort every time. (Any one who has seen UA play knows the double post up play where the best shooter runs the baseline and pops out for jumpers ie Jefferson and Salim Stoudamire who while he is a ‘poke of a needle” was the best ever at that play)
While he may not be a pass first point guard by nature, he makes a concerted effort to pass whenever it is called for, and plays within the system (even if it sucks, Kevin ONeill i am looking at you!) until he has to take the shot. He certainly can if needed. He has excellent court vision although not necessarily the skill to make some passes. All of this can be learned with time.
From what I gather Bayless is cocky, quite a bit like every other college athlete, because its in their makeup to be that way. I imagine that he will have a hard time at first accepting a role as a secondary or third scorer (having been #1 his whole life) but its something that comes with time. I have no doubt he is a good kid, I have heard he did lots of extra charity stuff at UA, which gives me hope, and he has a drive to allow him to really become something.
While Jerryd does not possess long arms, lets not get it twisted here. The normal human (me and you) likely have between 1-2 inches difference between height and wingspan. If your 5’11, your wingspan is probably 70-72 inches. Jerryd has a wingspan of 6’5”.. while that is slightly above average he is no 6’9” guy with wingspan of 7’2” like Tayshaun Prince. But he certainly doesnt have tiny arms.
I think most of the posts you read are from Scumdevils who are jealous. Its very much like say Yankees and Mets in Arizona. For the longest (all though things are startin to come around) ASU has sucked at basketball, and UA has been a top 10 team. (Football is a different matter) So ASU has a tendency to hate on UA players more than they normally would. I think the UO/OSU football analogy is apt.
So thats my two cents.. take it as you will.
Also if you guys have any questions about games he played or how he looked feel free to ask. I know his good ones and his bad ones. I am a diehard Cats fan.
I remember the good old days. The Rasta Monsta days.
by GreatOden'sRaven on
Jun 30, 2008 12:51 PM PDT
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Thanks for the scouting report
That was really helpful. I watched a couple of Arizona games and it seemed like JB doesn’t run the pick and roll very well. Nick Wise seems to be a very good PG in that respect. I liked how Kevin O’Neil ran pro-sets like the NBA. It’ll give Bayless a sense of what the offensive schemes will be in the NBA. His tourney game against West Virgina was really passive, which was really surprising to me since all I heard about him was being a scorer. He made good decisions and didn’t try to force things on offense. The active defense did seem to take him out of the game.
One note though, he is possibly the worst rebounding guard I have ever seen. He doesn’t go for the ball or block out his man. He literally just turns and watches the ball without moving from his position.
BINGO, BANGO, BONGO
by blzrfan on
Jun 30, 2008 1:28 PM PDT
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pick and roll
wasnt really a major function of his game at UA. Most of the time, either he was SETTING the screen or coming off screens ala Rip Hamilton. Not that I think its something he can’t learn. I get the impression that it will Brandon running that most of the time regardless of which position (1 or 2) he happens to be playing at the time. He did struggle against some of the better defenders, but I can tell you that while I think this is something he really needs to work on, Budinger didnt come to play every night, Hill is REALLY raw and basically guys like OJ Mayo didnt have to play any help defense at all. Jerryd could blow by Mayo at will but would get stuck if he did. Its something that will be helped having a bunch of skilled offensive players around, but it truly is something he has to overcome. As well as the mentality of getting frustrated when its not his night.
As far as rebounding goes. youre right. He is Terrible with a capital T. I can only imagine that it has been coaching. Rebounding is all effort. There is some skill to it, but not much. It may be that he was never asked to rebound in college, and frankly no one on the team listened to KO anyways. Lets cross our fingers that the first time he pulls that shit, that Nate stops practice, calls him out and makes sure everyone knows that he has to rebound. Ego hits like that will make him rebound harder than ever. At least thats what I hope.
But again he is a 19 yr old kid. He has LOTS of time to learn
I remember the good old days. The Rasta Monsta days.
by GreatOden'sRaven on
Jun 30, 2008 1:35 PM PDT
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I think that is most underrated part of Jack's game
He always went for the ball and came up with crucial rebounds to help us win. Of course, next year with Oden playing, it might not be as big a deal. Hopefully Bayless can work on that. Guards who can rebound really help the team push the ball up the floor.
How’s his transition game? Finishing at the rim and most importantly leading a fast break?
BINGO, BANGO, BONGO
by blzrfan on
Jun 30, 2008 1:41 PM PDT
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Most don't follow the Wildcats
Most of the ASU grads I know don’t follow the Wildcats as much as you might think, so I doubt they are posting negative stuff on Bayless. It is depressing for ASU students to watch the Wilcats be great every year, so most avoid it.
by AZBlazer on
Jun 30, 2008 2:18 PM PDT
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This discussion is way, way premature.
Ignorance has not stopped many from having loudly voiced opinion.
Wait till you at least have seen some Summer League.
As for the yahoos posting on Arizona blogs, who knows who they are. Just like here, who really has even played basketball let alone coached or scouted it. All the negativeity starting off this thread is no way to welcome a new Blazer to the team. I have great confidence in KP and Nate will develop all the new players. Come on guys, wait till the season starts to throw the guy in the wastecan.
by OrygunRod on
Jun 30, 2008 11:17 PM PDT
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Projecting into the NBA
Let’s not forget that everyone of the 7 guards taken in the top 13, with the exception of Rose, had questions. 5, after all,were freshman with very little playing experience. The knock on Mayo was whether or not he could play the point and character, Gordon’s was a poorer last 1/2 of the season and the fact that he’s smaller than the typical NBA shooting guard and didn’t have long arms, Augustin’s was size leading to concerns on defense, Westbrook’s was scoring and questions as to whether or not be could be a true point guard, and Rush’s was he was an SG that had lower scoring stats, and his injury last year. And, with Bayless, it was the question as to whether or not he could play the point. At the same time, GM’s and scouts had to look at how they were being used in the context of their teams. Rush and Westbrook weren’t expected to be the teams go to scorer like Gordon, Bayless was switched from point to SG early because of injuries, so his knock is he’s a “combo” guard. The bottom line is that the 5 freshmen have very thin resumes and one year of college isn’t much to go on. And, the NBA no longer allows the teams to scout High School games. Every GM had to look at the basic athletic skills and project the player into the NBA, since none were perfect coming out of college. And that’s where your scouting comes into play. KP’s scouting staff all had Bayless as the 4th best player in the draft. Inconsistent at times? Sure. But all of them were. He was a freshman who was moved from PG to SG, and went through a confusing coaching change. In one year, his positioned changed because of injuries, and his coach and the system changed as well. He didn’t have the time to simply own one position. In Portland, he’ll have stability, be able to work within one system, be surrounded by better players, and be able to focus on the skill set Mac requires – and then practice with that skill set. And those skills he has are considerable. He’s been accused at times of being a streaky shooter, but he can fill it up as well from almost anywhere on the court, has a great first step and powerful legs, can almost always get his shot, and, at 205 lbs, he’s got the physique and quickness to get to the basket. Mac will be retooling the team this year. The system he used last year worked to get 41 wins. But next year, it will be a different system because the team is changing. Oden will give us a different inside game. The guards, as a result, will have different roles. With Oden, Aldridge, and Outlaw/Webster on the front line, we’ll have three go-to scorers and an ability to exploit mistmatches. The guards will be doing different things, because the other teams front line cannot sag off and double team anyone on our front line, nor sag off if the guard penetrates, without giving up easy baskets. Guards will likely drive inside to attract the defense, and then dish off a lot more. The fact that the other teams PG will be guarding Bayless giving him good matchups, his ability to score from outside, and his leaping ability and his first step will make him very effective at this. But, it will take awhile for Mac to implement the system needed to take advantage of the skills he now has.
by Eben Calder on
Jul 1, 2008 5:59 AM PDT
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Bayless has haters.
I’ve seen this kid play in person, and had a chance to see how he carries himself. This kid is determined to win with an arrogance that comes with a great player. He knows he’s good and he is determined to show everyone he is good too. He had to go through a transission period his freshman year when Lute took a leave of absence and let O’Neal take over as coach, that wasn’t easy for the kid. He has a attack the basket/score mentality, and it has been proven that we need that, and he is a scorer, his only down fall is his D. Lets give him a chance, I think he will complement B Roy nicely.
BLAZER 4 LIFE !!!!!!!!!
by blzerntucson on
Jul 1, 2008 8:01 AM PDT
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