Team USA
by Dave on Jun 24, 2008 1:17 AM PDT
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PrintIn case you missed it, the team that will represent the U.S. in Beijing this summer is now set. Here is a list of the players:
LeBron James
Dwyane Wade
Michael Redd
Dwight Howard
Carmelo Anthony
Tayshaun Prince
Carlos Boozer
Chris Bosh
Chris Paul
Deron Williams
Jason Kidd
You have to admit that team looks powerful. But then again we’ve sent several powerful-looking teams into international competition lately and it hasn’t turned out so well. If you pressed me, I’d say that team has to be favored to win the gold. But on the other hand it’s not really a team and that always makes me suspicious.
The first thing you have to ask is whose squad this is. With only a couple exceptions each of these players is The Man on their own teams. Everybody knows it. That’s how roles are determined and order kept. You don’t need that kind of hierarchy every night but when the chips are down (or sometimes even just when you practice) it helps you have enough discipline to fly straight. Who fills that designation here? Probably none of them. The team isn’t set up that way. Similarly, few of these guys are used to sacrificing themselves to dive on the floor or set a hard pick that doesn’t ever lead to a scoring opportunity for them. How long has it been since these guys played a game where they got three shots? How long has it been since they’ve played a game without the ball being in their hands most of the time? Who’s the back-up point guard here and why? Does the point guard even matter that much, and if not what are those two PG superstars doing there? Does adding Michael Redd for shooting matter either if you’re going to play Bryant and Wade in front of him? And will he be the same deadeye shooter coming in cold as a situational player that he is when he’s the centerpiece? Will Dwight Howard get enough chance to shine? And what the sam heck is Jason Kidd doing on this team?
In short, I dislike this whole All-Star approach that we keep taking. I guess I’m not advocating we take lesser players just because they’re lesser. I’m saying that lineups like this are the equivalent of putting Captain Kirk, Captain Picard, and Captain Janeway on the bridge. We don’t need another captain, we need Mr. Sulu, dangit! And we need Mr. Laforge somewhere. And we need a red-shirted security dude to beam down and get killed so the main guys don’t have to. I don’t see those people on this team…or to the extent that I do they’re unlikely to get a lot of playing time.
I wish we could arrange it that the Finals winners go over and play. Or the Finals losers. Or even the two Finals teams combined together and sorted down to twelve. That way you could have a coach pick his vital utility guys along with the superstars. You’d also have guys who were used to playing together instead of a multi-million dollar fantasy version of Summer League scrimmage going up against the best international squads.
In the end we can’t resist the temptation to value name over cohesion. Put in that position maybe I wouldn’t be able to either. I wouldn’t be surprised if we win the gold, but then again I wouldn’t be surprised if we didn’t either.
--Dave (blazersub@yahoo.com)
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I agree
talent wise it’s hard to fathom that this team could get anything less than gold. However it depends on whether they can work as a team or not. I see a few superstars there I would rather replace with modest all-stars or role players that I know would do a better job working as a team.
The finals winner team is a good idea but I think there is too much stopping that from happening. (management not wanting to risk an entire team and such)
To say nothing of the fact
that our finals-winning teams will have one or two Spaniards, a Finn, and perhaps a Frenchman or Brazilian or something.
Other people don't have as much practice at being wrong as I do -- HT, timbo
With respect, Who cares ?
Yes. I know it’s the Olympics, but I’m only interested in basketball when the
BLAZERS are playing. I don’t like the ALL -Star game or the whole team full of
All-Stars that everyone keeps proposing for the Blazers. Remember the late
90’s -2000 teams ? That proves that TEAM is more important then how many
All-Stars or former All-Stars you have on your squad. Give me our current cast and
a year to gel and I’ll be feeling good, championship or not !!!!!!!!!!!!
JUST GIVE ME BACK MY BLAZERS !!!! I’M SICK OF COINCAST’S GREED !!!!!!!
It's GO time !
Answer:
Dave is obviously [Shaq-rap-on-Kobe]ing with us.
There are only two ways to interpret this viciously (and uncharacteristically) OT posting from him:
1) There are no Blazers on this roster.
But considering the Blazers’ youth and bright future, we all know that will change in 2012.
So, we Blazer fans (and yes, Dave is one, if you need a reminder) prefer that the 2008 team
be not quite as good as the Blazer-heavy one that is destined to win goldGoldGOLD in London.
2) Basically, Dave is ripping the Oly squad (a.k.a. “The Stubbies” or “Sessions”)
for being less of a team than our dearly beloved Blazers: Fair enough.
All of his criticisms of the ‘08 Oly Squad (the Stubby Sessions) run directly opposite to the ‘07-’27 Blazers.
Who needs Team USA? We got the Portland Trail Blazers!
W00T!
Blazers have a five-on-three...and they pull it back and wait for help.
It's not off topic if it involves the NBA
I can write a diary about a trade between Miami and Memphis and it is still on topic.
"You boys sure found a way to make the time pass up there. Twist, you guys wasn't gettin' paid to leave the dogs babysittin' the sheep while you stem the rose." - Joe Aguirre from Brokeback Mountain
The Potential Line Up for The Spanish Team
Looks lika an All Star Team of Players that haven’t been playing together their Regular Seasons also;
Pau Gasol, F, Los Angeles Lakers (NBA)
Juan Carlos Navarro, G, Memphis Grizzlies (NBA)
Marc Gasol, C, Akasvayu Girona (Spain)
Jose Calderon, G, Toronto Raptors (NBA)
Jorge Garbajosa, F, Toronto Raptors (NBA)
Rudy Fernandez, G, DKV Joventut Badalona (Spain)
Felipe Reyes, F, Real Madrid
Carlos Jimenez, F, Unicaja Malaga
Ricky Rubio, G, DKV Joventut
Sergio Rodriguez, G, Portland Trail Blazers (NBA)
Fran Vazquez, C, F.C. Barcelona (Spain)
Maybe it is the competition and Olympic format that makes it so hard to bring home The Gold.
GO TEAM USA !
GO BLAZERS !
"Always Willing, Ever Able" - rivbike.com
"If you don't want to get banged. Don't go in there" - Van Gundy
I don't think
Rodriguez is on the spanish team this year, thanks McMillan (I’m not saying he should have played more, just that if he was still in Spain or in another NBA club he may be on the squad…)
I doubt it
Just a quick jaunt OT, but: Sergio wouldn’t get a spot ahead of Calderon or Juan Carlos Navarro, and Ricky Rubio is seriously good—even if he’s a notch below Sergio now (and he may not be), the Olympic experience this year will season him for ‘12, when he’ll really be hitting his stride. I guess you could argue that his limited playing time in the US cost him a spot as the 12th man, but I don’t know that you’d want four point guards on the roster anyway. Besides, I remember seeing stats that showed his Spanish coach played Sergio even fewer minutes in the ‘07 FIBA tournaments than he was getting under Nate last season.
The difference is...
that they’ve been playing National Ball together for years, unlike our guys.
We don't NEED the draft. -Mortimer 6/18
by you'vegottomakeyourfreethrows on Jun 24, 2008 10:59 AM PDT up reply actions
Speaking of Pau and Marc . . .
. . . with the Olympics behind them, how hard do you think Marc and Pau are gonna bang
whenever the La-La L[xxx]rs and the Teddy Bears’ Picnic meet next season?
Remember, ownership of Marc Gasol is one of two prime rewards (cap space from KBEC being the other)
that Memphis acquired from L.A. in the Pau Gasol trade.
Subtext: Memphis sez, “We’d rather have Marc than Pau. Yeah, he’s cheaper – but we think he’s not just younger, but BETTER.”
Big-time bragging rights are at stake on so many levels (family/younger-bro-vs-older-bro/western-conference/best-in-Spain)
whenever these two boys clash – the younger brother in the older brother’s uni, the two traded for each other.
Along with the L[xxx]rs-vs-Trail Blazers season opener and Phoenix@PDX for Terry Porter’s jersey retirement,
I think any and every MEMvsLAL game on the 08-09 sked is a must-watch, especially the games in Memphis.
If the Grizz can just competently manage their #5 pick (BTW: They can’t), they could be a sick young team next year.
Blazers have a five-on-three...and they pull it back and wait for help.
Too Small!
There are only three true big men in this squad – Howard, Boozer and Bosh. Yet we have 3 PGs and 3 SGs. I know they got burnt last Olympics for not having shooters, but now Team USA has overcompensated on shooters at the expense of size in the frontcourt!
When will Team USA start respecting the international game of basketball?
Players have bad games, injuries, even foul trouble… yet we have no contingencies for any of these occurring with Howard, Boozer and Bosh. Surely we could have done without a 3rd string PG (Wade could play point as well, making that 4 elibible PGs) and instead have another centre like Chandler or Miller to backup Howard.
Yes, please! Another big man.
I think the scorers will be able to play “team” ball, though what happens at stress time, I have no idea. But having one real center is a big man mistake.
I've been surpised by the very same thing...
Only three interiors ? With Boozer being one of the three ? Of course he’s very strong, but he’s one of the shortest interiors in the league…
Now of course players like LBJ or even Kobe could play PF if needed on international competitions, but Team USA comitee didn’t do a very good job…
While I personally like the ‘select the best player available’ approach, it could have been done in a better way…
I think they'll start the same five as pre-Olympics
KIdd, Kobe, Lebron, Melo, and Howard.
Melo at PF?? That shows so much disrespect for strong teams like Argentina (Scola), Spain (Gasol), and Russia (Kirilenko). There will be alot of teams with big bangers at the 4 and 5 who will force Team USA to body them on defence.
Team USA only have 3 legit bigs. There are only 5 fouls in international rules. Europeans are smart. As experts at the art of flopping (don’t hate, we’re getting the biggest flopper in Rudy Fernandez!), they will exploit Team USA’s apparent deficiencies up front. The game plan will be to get Howard in foul trouble in the first quarter, then low post scoring and offensive boards are to be had all day.
Yeah
Nate McMillan said on 95.5 today the starting lineup is those five. It’s solid as far as I can see.
by bleedingblackandred on Jun 24, 2008 10:10 PM PDT up reply actions
In 4 years
Greg Oden will be the starting center for the Olympic team.
I like the idea of sending the NBA Champ
over to compete.
I would then be able to look forward to watching Portland add a couple of Olympic gold medals to their three or four NBA titles.
That wouldn't be much of an offseason
You really want the team playing through mid-June then another couple of weeks in August? Especially if anyone already has any nagging injuries coming out of the finals.
If nothing else, taking Rose will at least piss off Pat Riley.
About the winners/loosers
it would definitely have to be a mix of the two teams, because if you take the Lakers for instance, at least Gasol, Radmanovic, Vujacic and Turiaf couldn’t play for the USA, now imagine if you go with the Spurs…
I'm surprised
I don’t see Garnet, or pierce. Carmelo prince boozer and kidd don’t really deserve to be on there in my mind.
I like a starting line up of Paul, Kobe, Lebron, bosh, Howard. I’d have preferred KG at PF.
Williams Redd and Prince I can like off the bench. I don’t like how week the center position is as I’m not that impressed with Howard and we definitely don’t have a back-up. Again KG might have worked well.
The remainder of those players seem like trash to me. i’m not a fan of boozer, anthony or kidd. I don’t think they add to the chemistry of the team and I believe Anthony is a POOR choice to represent this country.
Actually, I would have liked Aldridge in there as back up at PF and Center. In the olympics I think he’d do rather well particularly because he could post up or hit the long shot.
"We play for one thing and one thing only, and that's championships." - The Devil Spawned
Carmelo is a shooter...
I don’t like him, but, Carmelo Anthony is pretty solid fit in my mind because he is a great shooter. He is long at 6’8” and pretty tough. I think Melo is a good addition, but they didn’t do enough to deal with all the downfalls of the last team.
by Portland Dynasty on Jun 24, 2008 12:32 PM PDT up reply actions
that and the fact
that anthony has killed in international competition.
Jaws were hitting the floor as Greg repeatedly attempted to tear the rim off the backboard...
by TheOdenator on Jun 24, 2008 12:41 PM PDT up reply actions
Euromelo
Carmelo is actually terrific in international play—better than he is in the NBA, in my opinion. His ability to score from anywhere makes him a one-man zone-buster, and the lower level of physicality among small forwards makes him a beast in the post. His defensive shortcomings were covered nicely by a motivated Lebron and Kobe, who were free to expend more energy on the defensive end because Carmelo easily picked up the slack. Whether or not you like him as an NBA player, he’s a great international player, and easily one of the cornerstones of our team and key to a gold medal.
He's a poor choice
due to his “record” off the court.
Ford: Bill, you're claiming victory already? Have you had a "Mission Accomplished" banner printed yet?
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/draft2008/columns/story?page=DraftDebate-080624
There is that
So I’ll be thankful this year. I would want to see him out there in the next Olympics. Playing with Elite talent could do a LOT to improve his game.
"We play for one thing and one thing only, and that's championships." - The Devil Spawned
Its all about NIKE
Tell me which players don’t have Nike contracts….sad but true.
I didn't mean to turn you on
Isn't kobe Adidas?
or did he switch?
"We play for one thing and one thing only, and that's championships." - The Devil Spawned
Definately
NIKE….I’ve got a pair of NIKE air r*pists last year on the cheap….lasted me about 6 months.
I didn't mean to turn you on
Yeah, I think this USA team is lacking...
The moves I would make are to Remove:
PG Jason Kidd: Doesn’t fit/belong with young guards, weak shooter, okay defender and I don’t think has the heart to lead this team. I would replace Kidd with a banger like Minnesota’s Al Jefferson or Boston’s Kevin Garnett. Obviously we can’t have Paul Pierce because he is going to have to rehab his knee, but Garnett would be a great addition. P.Pierce proved to be the type of dead eye shooter that USA Basketball would need. It would be great if Pierce could replace Redd or D.Wade, but not gonna happen. I’d actually like both Jefferson and Garnett over Boozer. So I am adding Jefferson and Garnett and removing Boozer. C’mon Garnett, don’t you want a Gold Medal to go with your Ring?
Dynasty’s USA Roster Breakdown:
PG Chris Paul: Exciting ball-handling specialist, great facilitator
PG Deron Williams: Tough PG, big frame great 1-2 punch with CP3.
SG Kobe Bryant: USA top-tier player is a must
SG Dwayne Wade: Handles the ball, 46% FG, solid game overall.
SG Michael Redd: Shooting Specialist, but not a defender (Caron Butler anyone?)
SF LeBron James: USA top-tier player is a must
SF Carmelo Anthony: Shooting Specialist and big body
SF Tayshaun Prince: Versatile baller whose body and game are very Int’l.
PF Kevin Garnett: Heart of a champion and all sorts of skills for a 6’11” post player
PF Chris Bosh: 6’10 lean and crafty post player
FC Al Jefferson: This kid is a 20-10 tough post player, 6’10” 255lbs.
C: Dwight Howard: Best USA center right now, but only center is a problem.
by Portland Dynasty on Jun 24, 2008 9:10 AM PDT reply actions
KG gone gold
He already has a gold medal from 2000.
I would drop Redd and Kidd and add Battier and another Center or large PF (Al Jefferson does sound good)
I like the idea of trading Redd for Battier as well...
It would improve USA teams size and add another defensive threat to Kobe and Tayshaun. And, since Garnett would in all reality to be too tired to do this now, LaMarcus Aldridge would be a great replacement there. Who would be a better fit for this team: Boozer or LMA? Or would a guy like David Lee be better?
by Portland Dynasty on Jun 24, 2008 12:37 PM PDT up reply actions
I'll also chime in with
our need for another center.
If we sent the NBA champs, they’d be one tired team by the time the next NBA season started. The Celts this year played I believe 109 games (not counting pre-season). If they then had to immediately jump into Olympic training, then play in the Olympics …. it would take it’s toll – although they wouldn’t require as much training since they were already a trained team.
Kobe’s in that situation now, having just recently completed his NBA season. BTW, I thought he was going to have that broken finger operated on this off season. If done after the Olympics I wonder if there would be enough time for it to heal before the next NBA season gets underway?
Jump on the Lakers early next season if Kobe is still recuperating.
Yeah
I understand that we couldn’t really send the champs, but sending some team or small combination of teams would be nicer than this. Maybe the conference finals losers or something. Still wouldn’t work really, but it would be nicer.
—Dave
the trouble with this
is that the NBA is too international for this to work these days. What if Dallas was the conference final loser? Could that team even qualify for the Olympics without Dirk?
I think the pseudo-team approach we’ve been taking (picking from the same pool of guys over a three-year period) is probably the best we can do, given the NBA schedule and the internationalization of team rosters. The majority of this year’s team played together last year, and looked pretty sharp doing so—in theory, they should be an even tighter unit now. That being said, we kind of undermined the “three-year commitment thing” by selecting the Olympic squad without tryouts, like we held in ‘06 and ‘07, not to mention the way Dwyane Wade was kind of shoehorned onto the roster. Oh well.
Thanks Dave
We don't NEED the draft. -Mortimer 6/18
by you'vegottomakeyourfreethrows on Jun 24, 2008 11:03 AM PDT reply actions
This group...
... or a very similar group worked fine in the tournament of the americas- we blew out Brazil and Argentina. I’d give them a chance before saying it won’t work. This is Kobe’s team- he’ll be taking the crunch time shots.
Boomshakalaka
Q+A
Q. “Who’s the back-up point guard here and why?”
A. Jason Kidd. Cuz he’s old and Chris Paul is better.
Hopefully DWill...
... is ahead of Kidd on the depth chart also. Kidd has no business being on this team. Is it to late to swap him for an extra big?
Boomshakalaka
supposedly
Kidd was an important locker room and chemistry factor on last year’s squad. I guess I don’t mind him tagging along as a cheerleader, but there’s no way at this point in his career that he should be taking time away from CP3 or DWill.
His reputation is too strong...
People continue to talk about Kidd’s perfect record in International play. However, that’s a thing of the past. He’s older and worse now, the rest of the world’s leagues are older and better now.
Chances are that any point guard would be fine in the starting lineup. Kidd has a ton of options to pass to with this team.
I heard the Fox Sports guys
on 95.5 saying that Brandon Roy would have been a better fit on the team than Jason Kidd or even one of the other SGs.
I totally agree…he can play selflessly but if he gets the ball in a crunchtime situation he can get it done too.
Roy would indeed be a nice fit...
in the ASG he showed he can play with other stars (he looked great alongside CP3). I think most of us agree that a lot of people would be a better choice than JKidd- and Roy is certainly one of them.
Boomshakalaka
AGreed
He’s about team and about winning.
We all know this, but he’s not flashy and so will most likely be unnoticed in a lot of areas. Luckily he seems to be a guy who’s okay with that, which is awesome. We’re going to do a lot of winning in the future and a HUGE part of that will be Roy. i think most TB fans will see that, but the world at large probably won’t.
Ford: Bill, you're claiming victory already? Have you had a "Mission Accomplished" banner printed yet?
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/draft2008/columns/story?page=DraftDebate-080624
no Battier?
I remember him being a pretty key role player last year, and as an ex-Devil, isn’t he a Coach K favorite? I’d take Battier over Boozer or Kidd any day.
I’m also not sure where Wade fits into the mix. Kobe, Lebron, and Carmelo had a great balance of scoring, defense, and passing ability that really made the team go, and I remember Chris Paul having a good run too. But I don’t know how many more ballhandling playmakers you can add before things bog down—especially one who hasn’t played in however long.
I was surprised to see wade too
My thought was “he’s healthy?”
I mean… how much b-ball has he really played??? I’d also think that you’d want a perimeter shooter in there, but whatever. I’m not impressed with this team and Wade only hit the number 5 or 6 reason why.
Ford: Bill, you're claiming victory already? Have you had a "Mission Accomplished" banner printed yet?
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/draft2008/columns/story?page=DraftDebate-080624
Remember, in the name of tanking/nothing-to-play-for . . .
. . . they pulled him really early.
If the Miami Lukewarmth were even halfway competitive at the trade deadline last season
(good for a six-seed in the East), there’s no WAY Dwyayne Wyayde would’ve been shelved.
If the 07-08 season were a basketball game, then the Lukewarmth
would’ve been in garbage time halfway through the second quarter.
You know – like game 6 of the 2008 finals.
You don’t play Wade in garbage time, and everything after Game Twelve was garbage time for them last season.
The impending Olympics only exacerbate (one of my favorite words) that scenario.
Wade wasn’t THAT hurt.
Blazers have a five-on-three...and they pull it back and wait for help.
AND MIGHT I JUST ADD
They do have the #2 draft pick to show for it.
A few more wins (which Dwyayne Wyayde could’ve given them), and they’d be in the #5 Memphis slot.
That means getting Mayo WITHOUT the added trade bait (Read: “Khryapa”).
Blazers have a five-on-three...and they pull it back and wait for help.
Frankly, I think we should go back to college players
The Dream Team (and there’s only been one, if you know what i mean) was great and all that, but the sequels became less and less interesting. Honestly, the US team is like the L*kers of the Olympics.
Go back to picking the best college players. A lot of them aren’t going to make the Association, and after earning millions of bucks for their respective schools at least give them the opportunity to perform on the world’s biggest court.
Not likely
Our college talent pools could put together a competitive team and i think the style of play and chemistry would be a better fit for the international game. I’d be for it. And honestly, when this new Dream Team wins, is it really that great? The only thing our NBA Olympic teams can do is dissapoint us from here on out. They win it’s considered expected. I mean look at the line ups we put together. They lose and we want their heads. At least with a college team we would have something to truly watch and get into every four years.
On , i won’t be surprised if the coaching staff for this year’s team is working on establishing role players as best as possible. There is enough maturity on that team that i wouldn’t be surprised if they’re putting themselves in role player positions themselves. In defense of Jason Kidd, he’s a perfect veteran fit for a team that needs someone with all-star talent and experience, but willing to take a back seat and facilitate. Someone a little humble.
How would a team of college players beat a stong national team like Spain's?
You are putting college players up against a mix of NBA and elite ACB/Euroleague players. The college players might have descent chemistry, but the Spanish team would have better chemistry due to playing together for years. The college style of play might be somewhat similar to the international style of play, but Spain’s players have all spent many years playing professionally using the international style of play. I also doubt you will be able to find any big men in college that are better than Pau Gasol, and you might not be able to find any wing players that are better than Rudy Fernandez either.
A team made up of college players just wouldn’t be good enough.
Made it most enjoyable
"Lenny Suckerpunch Never bet on me" - Elizabeth "The Lizzard" Lowblow
by Lizzy Lowblow on Jun 25, 2008 7:19 PM PDT up reply actions
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