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Quick, Mike Rice agree...Jose Calderon

I listened to Courtside on Thursday. 

Mike Rice thinks that Calderon would be a great addition to the team.

Jason Quick was a guest later on in the show and agreed.  Quick had said as much on 1080 the day before.  He stated that Pritchard went after Calderon at the trading deadline.  And he is convinced that Jose is Pritchard's #1 target this off-season, by way of a sign and trade.

They talked about how happy Rudy would be if Calderon and Rodriguez were in Portland.  They talked about his terrific assist to turnover rate. And how he is a player that doesn't need the ball to play well.

Then they got into a debate about what it would take to get Calderon.

"Travis Outlaw and the #13 pick...at least. "

(I know that that doesn't work if you look at matching contracts.)

I think Calderon is a nice player, but that seems like it's too much.  Am I wrong?

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I posted something similar to this after watching

him play against Detroit at the end of the season. His low turnover rate is nice, he seems to handle the ball well, initiates the offense ok…but man oh man his defense is WEAK. I watched him get burned time after by Lindsey Hunter. He seems to me like a drive and kick out guy to me with a nice shooting touch himself…he’s got a nice mid range jumper, shoot the 3 well and is a great free throw shooter. Giving up Outlaw and #13 would be a tough price to pay…I don’t know how similar Moon is to Outlaw, so I’m not sure if they do it. Also, at 27 years old, I’m not so sure Calderon is going to improve much. Maybe I’m wrong, but I think he’s just about hit his ceiling. He has a nice contract (2.5 mil), but it expires after next season so he’ll definitely want more if we intend on keeping him longer than a season. Also, I like the idea of a couple of international players, but 3 from just Spain on one NBA team…what are the odds of that?

by JasonT on Apr 26, 2008 12:39 AM PDT   0 recs

hmm

Jose was considered for the all star team as a back up…I don’t think Trout will be an all star playing for Portland. I’d say it’s worth the trade.

by Philthyanimal on Apr 26, 2008 1:17 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Calderon has been very very consistent

playing for the Spanish National team and for Toronto.
He will fit very well with our team because:
1.- Calderon will carry the ball to feed Roy in better situations, like going out of a block. Roy won´t start the team offense but look for advantage to start his offensive play.
2.- Calderon is a terrific three pointer threat when his defender tries a double team defense in the low post. So LMA and Oden will have one on one plays. That´s a part of Chris Bosh success in those situations, as he himself has explained.
3.- He isn´t a good defender but a weak one, but if our TO are seriously reduced we can take this one for another. A better inside defense (Toronto is not good in this) will help a lot too.
4.- He is a great teammate and a very good person.
If Calderon comes to Portland Sergio will be gone. Calderon can play 40 minutes per game all season if needed.

You own what you are.

by amlmart1 on Apr 26, 2008 1:18 AM PDT   0 recs

I've gone back and forth on Calderon.

The poor defense bothers me. Our bigs are going to get a lot of fouls plugging up that hole.

But the upside is everything else we want in a PG – distributing, 3 pt shooting, etc.

Only Travis and the #13? My apologies to Annthefan, but yes.

"Scholars have long known that fishing eventually turns men into philosophers. Unfortunately, it is almost impossible to buy decent tackle on a philosopher's salary." - Patrick McManus

by T Darkstar on Apr 26, 2008 1:42 AM PDT   0 recs

Me too

I really do like Calderon, and while I like Devin Harris better, the offensive upgrade a Calderon would bring might just be enough to do the deal (if Harris isn’t available, I mean). I go back and forth whether it is worth it or not, because we would still have our PG defensive problems and really have NO ONE who can guard a Chrissy Paula or a Deronimo or a Toni Tone Tony Parker—not that anyone can really stop Chris Paul, but you wanna make him work at least. We have no one who can make him work and come playoff time, Paul will throttle us.

But when you got Oden and Pryz always in the middle, plus LMA, and everyone will likely play smarter/better defense as they gain experience (as long as the effort is there)... so basically we’d have a better version of the status quo defensively, and a huge upgrade offensively. Hey, works for me.

If we can get Calderon for Outlaw/Webster and the #13 pick, that’s a steal of a deal that you have to do. I prefer to move Outlaw (sorry annthefan, as well) because I feel like Webster fits better. Then again, Outlaw will always be fine with coming off the bench… ohhh, thank goodness it ain’t my decision.

Calderon is a great passer (we’ll enjoy lotsa alley oops to Oden), great shooter, great teammate, and is a big moment type of player… he hits big shots, plays well in big games, and has had experience internationally in championship level competition. He’s a gamer for sure. If we can’t get Harris, and Calderon is available, for sure we should do it.

Our starting lineup would be set for the next million years if we do it.

Mortimer

by Mortimer on Apr 26, 2008 1:58 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Couldnt agree more.

Chris Paul and Deron Williams are going to be around a long, long, long time. We need to bring in someone to deal with those two pests, otherwise we will pay the consequences…..

RUDY > MJ

by myemic23 on Apr 26, 2008 3:55 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I went to the Raptors board

on RealGM and this trade was offered, all the Raptors fans said now way they’re doing that deal. They see Calderon as a top 5 PG.

Oden+Roy+Aldridge+Rudy=Dynasty. Believe

by OdenRoyLMA on Apr 26, 2008 3:00 AM PDT   0 recs

Part of the theory

Part of the puzzle of bringing Calderon to Portland is that Calderon won’t want to stay in Toronto, kinda forcing them to trade him. Most Raptor fans see that he is a lot better than TJ Ford, and a better FIT as well, but the Raptors are stuck with Ford and Ford expects to be a starter and a main dude. The theory is that Calderon won’t want to be a back up playing 20 minutes a night except when Ford has his injury scare every other season, and will want out of Toronto. Perhaps playing with Rudy will entice Calderon just as much as being the guaranteed starter.

I don’t expect Raptor fans to be happy about it, and they’ll be completely right. It’s up to the Raptor franchise to hand the PG spot over to Calderon though, not the fans, and I don’t think they’re gonna do it—if they haven’t yet, when will they?

Mortimer

by Mortimer on Apr 26, 2008 3:09 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Agreed

Calderon is in an unual situation as far as fans are concerned. He’s the best point gaurd on the team, but the other point gaurd is unwilling to give up his starting position. Further hampering the situation is that Ford is pretty close to untradeable, because of his contract and injuries.

Toronto, needs to either decide to let Ford rot, and just not play him, until his attitude improves, or deal Calderon, utilizing his high value in order to get something nice back.

by Gelvalst on Apr 26, 2008 7:50 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

OOPS!

I have uncovered the truth of this posting and I now realize what the true purpose was…

Mr. parkinglotj, you are not going to swindle our emotions so seemlessly, not with this type of effort at least.

Calderon for 13th pick, AND OUTLAW!? (why not 13th pick, and next years #1 w/ notoutlaw?)
hmmm…. Your trickery is high.

CHAOS TME:
if parkinglotj is manipulated using logic than the last letter represents the individual and the following sequence of letters backwards would explain the name of that individual.
so
tolgnikrap is the puzzle, and what I get is…
tolgnik = talking
rap = Raptors
Then there is that remaining letter J… Jose Calderon? Which would obviously mean that parkinglotj equates to “Talking Raptors Jose”...

No Thank You!
(tolgnikrap could also mean that Travis Outlaw looks good! – Knicks/Raptors 09’)

Everytime Raef checks into a game, an angel gets its wings.

by Outlaw is Rejector on Apr 26, 2008 7:47 AM PDT   1 recs

That is logic which I cannot deny.

At least he was talking and not tolling.

"Scholars have long known that fishing eventually turns men into philosophers. Unfortunately, it is almost impossible to buy decent tackle on a philosopher's salary." - Patrick McManus

by T Darkstar on Apr 26, 2008 8:03 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

This is what Rice and Quick said

I think that this is too much. Those two are very impressed with Calderon though.

I tried to do something with LaFrentz, because his expiring salary would be very coveted by NY.

Portland gets Calderon from Toronto (8.6 mil. sign and trade) and Jerome James (expiring contract: 5.8 mil.) from NY.

Toronto gets Crawford (7.9 mil.) from NY and Jack (1.2 mil.) from Portland.

NY gets LaFrentz, #13 and Portland’s #1 next year.

Portland gets a starting PG and a brute (who has played for Nate) to take LaFrentz place on the bench. Bad parts: Cap takes a hit in ‘09, but James’ contract expires in ‘09. Too many players, another trade needs to happen. (Blake, Jones, Surge?)

Toronto gets a real SG and a capable back up at PG/SG.

NY gets rid of salary and adds two picks. I believe that the new GM will do two things.

1) The owner will demand that the salaries need to come down.

2) Draft Mayo at #3 or #4. This seems like such a NY pick. Crawford will have to go if Mayo is the pick.

NY is then free to take Westbrook, or Budinger, or my favorite for them Syracuse’s Donte Greene.

by parkinglotj on Apr 26, 2008 11:12 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I'm just a sucker for outlandish conspiracy theories.

The logic is undeniable, because I cannot follow it, not because I agree with it. But that’s half the fun. The trade you proposed looks very good for us though. Does NY give up Crawford and James for a first round pick and cap relief? Hmm… I’m not sure on that one. And does Toronto give up Calderon for Crawford and Jack? I’m also not sure they bite on that one. But figuring all of this out is the fun of it. Trade-machine on!

"Scholars have long known that fishing eventually turns men into philosophers. Unfortunately, it is almost impossible to buy decent tackle on a philosopher's salary." - Patrick McManus

by T Darkstar on Apr 26, 2008 11:31 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Not a bad trade suggestion

Talent-wise we come out way ahead, but our cap space plan takes a hit. I could definitely see NY’s reasoning for doing this, but I think Toronto would balk—they’re all about teamwork and ball movement, and Crawford is a me-first gunner who’s never been a winner. I don’t think they’re getting enough back for Calderon.

Two problems with the trade as it’s set up: New York can’t receive consecutive first-round picks from us, and Calderon’s salary would be calculated as a BYC player: in this instance, for trade purposes his cap figure would be 50% of his new salary, or 4.3 million. That messes up all the numbers of the deal. The thinking is right on though, I feel like.

by BlazersOrBust on Apr 28, 2008 9:36 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Where are you AnnThe Fan?

Please put the kibosh on this idea. Outlaw is untouchable.

Nature bats last.

by fisheyes on Apr 26, 2008 8:22 AM PDT   0 recs

We are going to have to take a collection...

.................................................................. and buy Anne the Fan a nice bottle of scotch so she can drown her sorrows…

Travis is going bye-bye somewhere by next season.

t

"You don't live by the jumpshot, you die by the jumpshot." ---Charles Barkley, 2/7/08

by timbo on Apr 26, 2008 9:12 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

#25

"Oh my, there go the game!" Travis Outlaw

by annthefan on Apr 26, 2008 5:01 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

do you have some weird

hatred for the name Ann without an e?

by Section323 on Apr 27, 2008 12:36 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I meant add. Too much Dalwhinnie? I wish!

"Oh my, there go the game!" Travis Outlaw

by annthefan on Apr 27, 2008 1:49 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I drove through Dalwhinnie last year

It’s on the way to Loch Ness, if travelling from Edinburgh.

It’s rather a bleak place, actually.

Perhaps we could say it has a beauty all its own.

Perhaps we would be lying.

There are lots of sheep there. And deer, at the right time of day. But anyone who spends much time in the Highlands won’t get much thrill out of seeing a few hundred or thousand deer in the evenings. In general, nobody hunts them with anything but their cars.

There’s a petrol station, a post office, and a few houses. I don’t remember much else.

I can’t imagine consuming anything that would come from such a place. It probably has deer urine in it.

Other people don't have as much practice at being wrong as I do -- HT, timbo

by jscot on Apr 27, 2008 11:16 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I'm sure it's very bleak there. It probably contributes to their attention to

detail in making their scotch since it seems they have nothing else to do but frolic in the heather on the moors. But the scotch is very warm, smoky and smooth tasting without the really strong peat overtones that can be overpowering. Maybe the deer urine mellows it out. I can make a bottle last for a couple of years because, really, all you have to do is breathe in the aroma. If I could afford a bottle. I’m hoping to get a bottle from timbo without having to give up Travis.

"We comin along." Travis Outlaw

by annthefan on Apr 28, 2008 1:23 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Here I am! I sort of worked myself into a "Fatty" corner by saying

for the last time blah blah leave Travis alone blah blah you big bully you” type of thing. That is why I didn’t even comment on my fellow Travis fan Bow4meow’s diary about trading my boy. I’ll have to think of some other way to lodge my protests. I’ll start with a rejoinder to Timbo’s comment.

"Oh my, there go the game!" Travis Outlaw

by annthefan on Apr 26, 2008 4:57 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I love Calderon ...

but there is no way this is happening. There are VERY few untradeable players in this league as long as they can still play (and even if they can’t), and Ford is not one of them. Thinking of teams who need point guards, just off the top of my head:

-Ford to Cleveland for Joe Smith and Delonte West
-Ford to Indiana for Marquis Daniels and Travis Diener
-Ford to Miami for Udonis Haslem (if they pick Beasley)
-Ford to Minnesota for Buckner, Madsen, and Corey Brewer
-Ford to New York for Malik Rose and Nate Robinson
-Ford to Orlando for Jameer Nelson and JJ Redick
-Ford to Seattle for Donyell Marshall and Damien Wilkins

Those folks in Toronto are not stupid. They can see Calderon is the better player and the better fit for their team. They will keep him and trade the other one—for very little in return if they have to.

by bfan on Apr 26, 2008 8:41 AM PDT   0 recs

I certainly think that is the perception that Calderon

is a better player than Ford…however, when healthy (and that’s big) I feel Ford is the superior player. Watch the game today, and tell what you think. Although Orlando is not a fair assessment of the Toronto’s points guards, b/c their backcourt is very mediocre.

by JasonT on Apr 26, 2008 9:24 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Calderon for Rudy?

I wonder how the Raps would feel about a straight-up Spanish trade: Calderon for Rudy. To make the numbers work we could include some combination of Jack, Jones, Sergio, and cash (plus draft picks).

Could Rudy then theoretically be offered by Toronto more than the $1 million we can afford to pay him? Instead of Sergio, Rudy’s new Spanish-speaking buddies would be Jorge Garbajosa and Carlos Delfino.

If Rudy is not part of our picture, that’d open the door for us to draft Westbrook - our future defensive stopper and new backup to B. Roy! I haven’t given much thought as to the logistics of how this sequence of events could happen - it might require a third team to be involved for us to move up in the draft—but it doesn’t seem too farfetched. Who knows, Westbrook might drop down to the 13th pick as it is…man, I’d like to see that. Can you imagine:

Calderon / Blake
Roy / Westbrook
Webster / Outlaw
Aldridge / Frye
Oden / Pryzbilla

Just dreamin’.

by Sumito on Apr 26, 2008 8:58 AM PDT   0 recs

Trade for Calderon

I would keep Outlaw and see if a trade with J.Jack and J.Jones would work or J.Jack,Sergio,Wafer or Jack and #13 pick. But we need Outlaw comming off the bench. Przybilla,Frye,Outlaw,Rudy,Blake would be the white unit and the starters could be Calderon,Roy,Webster,Aldridge and Oden. I think the best deal for us (Blazers) would be J.Jack and J.Jones for Calderon. We could proably even give them Sergio which would just sweeten the deal for the Raptors. I think Oden/Aldridge/Webster/Roy/Calderon for the starters and Przybilla/Frye/Outlaw/Rudy/Blake. Would give the Blazers a very good and deep team.

by billyjoejack on Apr 26, 2008 9:05 AM PDT   0 recs

why would they want

Our role players that we are trying to give away for their potential all star

by raging WebTed on Apr 26, 2008 9:33 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

hmm

i cant possibly see why they would do that…that is almost on the level of the pau gasol fire sale….they also have jason kapono who is far more superior than jones.

by Philthyanimal on Apr 26, 2008 10:13 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

It might take more than #13 and Travis...

....................but I would still find a way to make it happen.

What’s the one thing that ALL the top playoff teams have? A first rate PG.

Calderón is one…

Toronto has two; one has to go.

t

"You don't live by the jumpshot, you die by the jumpshot." ---Charles Barkley, 2/7/08

by timbo on Apr 26, 2008 9:10 AM PDT   0 recs

Having suffered Howard

probably Toronto will ask for Pryz. Bargagni and Nesterovi are too soft defenders.

Diputado A: Su Señoría da una en clavo y cien en herradura.
Diputado B: porque su Señoría no se está quieto.

by amlmart1 on Apr 26, 2008 9:29 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

in recent years

yeah…they all do have a top 10 pg…but before that i’d say you could get away with a mediocre PG. i guess the only “elite” teams without great pgs are boston and the lakers.

by Philthyanimal on Apr 26, 2008 10:15 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Cleveland doesn't even have an average PG

It seems that as long as you have a transcendent player like LeBron, you don’t need much else.

by tingeyga on Apr 26, 2008 11:36 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

The difference is

Rondo and Fisher are actually great defensive point guards (even though Fisher’s a flopper), and everybody in the team can pass and create plays. Heck, with a Lakers line-up of Fisher, Bryant, Walton, Odom and Gasol, they practically have five point guards on the floor. The Blazers just… aren’t that yet.

by Eventine on Apr 26, 2008 11:40 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Getting something for something

It always cracks me up that fans want to trade someone at the end of the bench for someone of value on another team. Naturally we get attached to our players and hate to see them leave. That is a good thing. But if we are going to engage in a trade, we have to give value, especially if the other team knows we are looking for a certain player. Why would anybody trade us anything for Jack, Jones, Sergio and Wafter? Those kinds of players can be had in free agency for nothing. KP has to look at the roster and see who has value and who he can give up. The answer always comes back to Travis and the 13th pick. Yes, it would be hard to give them up, but does he want to face the same PG problems we’ve seen year after year. I don’t think so, I love Trout, but I think he and Jack will not be on the roster next year, and the Blazers will be a better team as a result.

by Spencer on Apr 26, 2008 9:33 AM PDT   0 recs

The trade has to make sense for both teams.

Absolutely agree.

As I’ve said elsewhere, Travis might, MIGHT be enough to get Toronto to bite for Calderon. Add the lottery pick (assuming we don’t get lucky, again), and I think it would be tempting. Maybe then we could start talking about cash, second-round picks, and role players with potential (Jack?, Webster?, Jones?) to finish the deal.

But just because Toronto is looking to clear up the TJ Ford/Calderon logjam does NOT mean they’re going to let Calderon go for scrubs. Not when there’s plenty of other teams with attractive pieces to offer for Jose.

As much as a love Travis, it’s probably time to sell high on him. We CANNOT get rid of our Big Three. Travis is the only other piece we have that other teams are likely to be very interested in.

On the flip side, this is one of the ONLY deals where it makes any sense for us to give up Travis. If this one doesn’t materialize, then we keep him as our sixth man long-term.

Maybe next February at the trade deadline Raef will become a valuable piece for us, as well, but during the summer, contract relief is just not as valuable.

Now, if we somehow got lucky and picked #1 again, I’d say go with Derrick Rose and forget making any meaningful trades. But I really doubt the basketball gods are going to smile on us quite THAT much.

Wherever you go, there you are.

by Majikj0n on Apr 26, 2008 2:17 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Who needs basketball gods?

the Number One pick will be ours without a doubt.

"Scholars have long known that fishing eventually turns men into philosophers. Unfortunately, it is almost impossible to buy decent tackle on a philosopher's salary." - Patrick McManus

by T Darkstar on Apr 26, 2008 2:23 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

All of Our Players

Our players are keepers. Keep them all for one more year at least Outlaw,Jack,Webster,Sergio you can go on. Our player are 24 or younger and most not all but most players it takes until they hit 25,26 or 27 before they start comming in to their own. So WTS I think in might just be better to keep our own players and let them develop.

by billyjoejack on Apr 27, 2008 12:01 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Calderon is 27 years old.

Not that 27 makes him ancient or anything. It’s just that he is relatively new on the NBA radar, and one would assume that he ’s a young point guard who is going to keep improving. Maybe he will improve a little, but I think he’s pretty close to his ceiling.

Also, his contract is up after next season, so we would have to offer him a new contract.

I implore you all to watch him play today. Hopefully, they will get to the next round so we can see how Calderon plays against Chauncy Billips (that is if they get past the 76ers). Nothing against Jameer Nelson and Keyon Dooling, I just don’t think they are much of a measuring stick.

by JasonT on Apr 26, 2008 9:35 AM PDT   0 recs

why is that bad?

in my eyes he would have been an all star had he started all year…so why is it bad if he is close to his ceiling? I’ll take his 50 to 1 or whatever assist to turnover ratio to finish the season anyday.

by Philthyanimal on Apr 26, 2008 10:17 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Go for D

I’d prefer that the Blazers go for a quick, defensive oriented PG. The model I’d use is Rajon Rondo. He was the 22nd pick of the 2006 draft. Obviously, he’s having a pretty good year for the Celtics. He’s certainly not a star or a great shooter, but he plays good defense and doesn’t turn the ball over much. The Blazers big three are a little different than the Celtics big three, but I think the Blazers can afford to put a role player in that spot…. AND, it can be done with the 13th pick in the draft or perhaps the 9th or tenth. Westbrook and Collinson might fit that mold.

by PoliSam on Apr 26, 2008 9:36 AM PDT   0 recs

Absolutely...

...what we need is a perimeter defender. Considering our low post defenders next year, more teams will try to get to us with the long ball. We will have enough offense next year. We need a disruptor on the perimeter.

by Dr Dave on Apr 26, 2008 11:22 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Nah

As much as I’m crazy about Calderon’s offensive game, no way would I give up out Trout for him. Oh, and the defense…

by Eventine on Apr 26, 2008 9:58 AM PDT   0 recs

Look at San Antonio

They do not have a great defensive Pg in Parker, but they are able to componsate because they have Tim Duncan

by raging WebTed on Apr 26, 2008 10:01 AM PDT   0 recs

could martell become that solid defender like bowen

I’m not saying he will, but if he does….

I used to play sports, then I realized you can buy trophies, now I'm good at everything, even checkers - Demetri Martin

by Zaron5551 on Apr 26, 2008 12:47 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

What I meant to say by this was

If the opposing team has a killer offensive PG like Nash, Parker doesn’t cover the guy, so the Spurs don’t really need that great of a defender in Parker to really excel. Besides, Parker’s actually a good defender.

by Eventine on Apr 26, 2008 1:00 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Too Much for Calderon...

No Way I would give up Travis and a first for Calderon.

Travis creates so many mismatches as the “star” or our second unit and showed so much game this year. Remember all those games where he had 20+ points? Outlaw is exciting and his energy (when he is ON, or mentally IN the game) is key to the Blazers success as his scoring often starts the momentum of scoring runs or his ability is what keeps our scoring momentum going during the NBA’s long season and playoff series.

Calderson is a great offensive talent, seemingly as effective as Devin Harris on offense, but not as good as defense. Filling the role of “great guard defender” is absolutely a need for Portland, more so than offensive skill. Heck, Jarrett Jack has considerable scoring skill and decent defense. Jack is much sloppier with handling the ball, but his defense is better than Calderon’s. It’s kind of a push since Calderon is not a complete upgrade over what we have.

We are still at least one year away from being a contender, and still one of the youngest teams in the league; this may be the last time for a while that the Blazers have a lottery pick (13th or better?). I still feel the Blazers best decision would be to draft our lottery selection. Bring in Rudy and Oden, the rookie, use the three second rounders (33,34 & 54) to manuever to get the top player or players KP wants. Either use all three 2nds to move up with the first, or use all the 2nds to draft Euro prospects that can gain experience in Europe.

Our teams experience with Rudy and Oden in the lineup will give KP a better idea of what we will need to do in free agency and the 2010 draft.

by Portland Dynasty on Apr 26, 2008 10:01 AM PDT   0 recs

wait a minute

Jose sniffed the all star team as a backup…and Jack or Blake weren’t even considered for the all star team…how is that not a sufficient upgrade?

by Philthyanimal on Apr 26, 2008 10:19 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

i remember

kp said he doesnt like to wait in an interview recently, its going down this summer!!

by raging WebTed on Apr 26, 2008 10:11 AM PDT   0 recs

I hope so

Calderon would boost our offense immensely, and the way our guard play is at the moment, I don’t think he’d pose too great a defensive liability… the points he would create and turnovers he would cut down on would more than compensate. Steve Nash will not make any NBA All Defensive Teams any time soon, but it’s his contributions in other areas that we can expect from Calderon. No disrespect to the Raptors, but I think Calderon will have more to work with in a Blazers uni without having to compete for major minutes with Ford.

by LMA on Apr 26, 2008 10:50 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

No disrespect to Nash or anything

But come playoffs time, having Tony Parker drop 33 points a game on us isn’t gonna be an option. Sure, Aldridge and Oden could end up being quicker and sturdier defenders than Shaq and Amare, but I still think Calderon’s defensive liability could backfire during the playoffs. The Raptors are lucky that the Magic don’t have elite point guards.

by Eventine on Apr 26, 2008 11:14 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Are you comparing Nash to Calderon?

I mean come on…Nash is a 2 time MVP…they’re not even close. Yeah, if Calderon could give us what Nash gives the Suns on offense, then his defense is not as big of an issue. But Calderon is nowhere near Nash on the offensive end.

by JasonT on Apr 26, 2008 9:06 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I think the numbers disagree

If you compare Calderon this season to Nash in the 04/05 season (his first MVP campaign) and Nash in the 05/06 season (his 2nd MVP campaign) the numbers are a lot closer than you would think at first. True Nash’s per 36 minutes number for scoring and assists are higher than Jose’s, but I think that the pace the Suns play at accounts for much of that difference. Looking at the advanced stats, they are virtually identical in terms of shooting%, and steals. Nash has a higher assist %, but was more turnover prone.

So in short Calderon appears to be in the same ballpark offensively as Nash.

by tingeyga on Apr 26, 2008 10:02 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I'll guess we'll have to agree to disagree then

I’m not saying anything about stats…I assume you’ve watched both of them play? If you watch the game, Steve Nash has a MUCH BIGGER impact on the offensive end then Calderon. Steve Nash has never been a huge scorer, but is capable of putting up 30 points on any given night. Also, Nash’s advantage in assists per (36 minutes) is a lot bigger than 2 or 3 points….see Jamaal Tinsley, Earl Watson, and TJ Ford. Nash creates havoc on the offensive end…and part of that is a result of the Phoenix style, but most of it because of Nash’s skills (watch the difference when Barbosa enters the game). Again, we’ll have to agree to disagree, but I think that Calderon is not even in the same league as Nash on the offensive end…and that is not based on just looking at the 2 players on paper, but actually watching the impact they have on the game.

by JasonT on Apr 27, 2008 9:17 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I guess we really will have to agree to disagree

You say trust your eyes. I say use statistics to help add meaning to what you are seeing with your eyes. Because the goal of the game isn’t to “create havoc on the offensive end”, but to score more points than the other team. Creating havoc on offense is a means to this end, but not the end itself. And the stats that attempt to quantify the impact that players are having that lead to scoring more points than the other (i.e. winning) indicate that Calderon is more or less Nash’s equal.

by tingeyga on Apr 28, 2008 12:37 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

If we got Calderon, who gets minutes?

Since Rudy is going to be everything advertised, our three guard rotation would be Calderon, Fernandez and Roy, with Blake taking Sergio’s minute(s). I would not complain about the offense of that rotation, but their defense is liable to be offensive. However, if we are able to plug up the middle effectively, it might not hurt as badly. I’d rather be beat with teams scoring jumpshots at will than layups. Still, good defense from every position matters, especially in the playoffs.

But minutes is a big deal. Sergio wanted to be used more often, and this situation would make him used even less. I think Blake is okay with an end-of- bench role, but will Jack be? Maybe, maybe not. This is also my argument for keeping Frye, Przybilla and even Jones. All are reasonable players who are willing to be backups, and that’s harder than one would think to get. Pritchard has to take all of this into account this off-season, and try to get the best he can out of the pieces he has, whether that means keeping them or trading them.

"Scholars have long known that fishing eventually turns men into philosophers. Unfortunately, it is almost impossible to buy decent tackle on a philosopher's salary." - Patrick McManus

by T Darkstar on Apr 26, 2008 11:21 AM PDT   0 recs

I suspect that Fernandez is going to play the 3...

................................................... and if not, Roy can.

I wouldn’t stress too much about too many guards for the minutes.

Also, I’m not so sure Rudy is coming at this point… The money REALLY doesn’t work for him…

t

"You don't live by the jumpshot, you die by the jumpshot." ---Charles Barkley, 2/7/08

by timbo on Apr 28, 2008 10:15 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

It is not about money but proud.

He wants to meet the challenge and he is very self-confident. I think he only worries about possible Nate´s bias and preferences and its effect in his playing time. Last week he said in TV that it would be nice to be the next Spanish player to go to the NBA.

Diputado A: Su Señoría da una en clavo y cien en herradura.
Diputado B: porque su Señoría no se está quieto.

by amlmart1 on Apr 28, 2008 10:58 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Exactly

Rudy wants to prove he’s the best! Around!
To do that, he has to come to the NBA.
Nothing’s gonna ever keep him down, except staying in Europe.
Nothing’s gonna ever keep Rudy dow-ow-ow-ho-how-ho-own.

INSPIRING GUITAR SOLO

"Greg Oden and Joel Przybilla are the next Yao Ming and Dikembe Mutombo." - Some guy on an elevator

by tominhawaii on Apr 28, 2008 12:29 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Inspiring guitar solos are the best!

Well, except for really high-tempo ones, those rock way more.

"Scholars have long known that fishing eventually turns men into philosophers. Unfortunately, it is almost impossible to buy decent tackle on a philosopher's salary." - Patrick McManus

by T Darkstar on Apr 28, 2008 8:04 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Tony Parker had an unstoppable game

Not even Bruce Bowen in a Phoenix jersey could stop him. But I get your point, we could very likely get torched by Parker, CP3, D-Will on any given night with Calderon’s matador defense.

But Calderon can and will increase everyone elses production, even Roy’s, to a significant degree that i think arguably will win us more ball games than his defense will lose games.

by LMA on Apr 26, 2008 11:29 AM PDT   0 recs

I see your point

But I just think that his matador defense will eventually bite the team in the ass, say… during a finals game or something. I’d rather have Westbrook shutting Rajon Rondo and contributing reasonable defense than Calderon getting Parkerized by Rondo and increasing everybody’s production. I guess what I’m trying to say is defense becomes more important as we work our way up the food chain. Calderon can win us regular season games, ala Nash, but I think that’s it.

by Eventine on Apr 26, 2008 11:37 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Giving up players

I would not give up Webster,Outlaw or Frye in any trade they all three are key back ups(bench) players that Championship teams need. And one or the other could be a starter or a starter if we have an injury. And thats something all teams need is someone who can step into a starting role when a starter goes down with an injury.

by billyjoejack on Apr 27, 2008 12:19 PM PDT   0 recs

Webster OR Outlaw is going to be part of a PG trade...

........................................... I don’t see any way around that.

I do agree with a post up above that Toronto might want Pryz as a condition of the deal.

Travis + Pryz + #13 for Calderón?

That’s a steep price, but that might be the deal right there…

t

"You don't live by the jumpshot, you die by the jumpshot." ---Charles Barkley, 2/7/08

by timbo on Apr 28, 2008 10:18 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Or Frye

We could keep Webster at SF and Outlaw at backup PF/SF, and include Channing in a trade for a PG. But his trade value probably isn’t as high, so it costs us more in other pieces.

Frye+Jack+Pryz+13 for Calderon? If he were a better defender, I’d feel happier about that.

Who knows?

Other people don't have as much practice at being wrong as I do -- HT, timbo

by jscot on Apr 28, 2008 10:33 PM PDT