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Trade Joel ;(

We should trade Joel. He's our most marketable commodity and a luxury we can't afford.

Star-divide

We need to trade Joel.

I didn't want to write this, I really didn't. But I haven't seen anyone mention it yet, so I thought it had to be said. I know what will follow... many posts saying that I'm nuts, saying that GO may be fragile and foul-prone so we're desperately going to need someone who can competently fill 20 minutes a game with defense and rebounding. But allow me to at least start the discussion....

The case for trading Joel:

  1. He has value. There's a lot of talk around here about trading some combination of Jack, Outlaw, Frye, a pick, LaFrentz, etc. to get back our PG of the future. But IMHO, we've got to be prepared to give up something of real value to fill that void. What do we have that other teams would REALLY want? So much so that they'd be willing to give us back a championship-caliber PG? Outlaw, Jack, Webster and Frye have promise, but have yet to develop fully. No-one's going to pay us for their promise. Mid-1st round pick and expiring contract? Sure, those are nice, but not enough. Packaging together a whole bunch of mediocre assets does not make for an attractive package.
  2. His value will diminish. Think there are GM's around the league salivating after Joel's 26 rebound performance? You bet. Think those same guys will be salivating after he's buried on the bench next year? Once Joel is a backup, he'll be forever downgraded goods. Right now he's a beast who would be in HIGH demand.
  3. A backup C is not our highest priority. Outside of our 3 stars, what do we need in order to win a title? A backup C, sure, but it's not the most important piece of the puzzle. Plenty of playoff teams get by without a legit C, let alone two! Our highest priority is a PG, our second is a SF who can play defense and hit the outside shot.
  4. He's a luxury we cannot afford. We have glaring holes in our starting lineup, yet we've got an above average STARTING center sitting on the bench? We can fill in our role players when it's time to win a title.
Alright, let the flaming begin. But if I'd also like to talk about what kind of player we could be talking about in return. Devin Harris, Jose Calderon? Seems like those guys would be well within reach. Can we strive to get somebody even better?

Oh, and if this has been discussed elsewhere and I just missed it, then feel free to ignore it and move on!

0 recs  |  Comment 58 comments

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Wow
Lets throw in LMA and The rights to rudy too
Smile, you're on a poster!

by RoysOurBoy on Mar 26, 2008 1:51 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Actually,
I don't want Frye as our backup center another year. Plain as that. Sure, Joel does have value. In fact, he may even be underpaid at his position for what he does. If Przybilla is willing to stick around and, from the sounds of it, fight Oden for the starting position, why get rid of a difficult-to-obtain commodity? Sure, a good PG would be nice, but I'm all for keeping the Pryz.
"I could see that, if not actually disgruntled, he was far from being gruntled." -P.G. Wodehouse

by T Darkstar on Mar 26, 2008 1:53 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Frye's not a center...
.......................... his game is only barely that of a power forward.

Gotta not only keep Joel, but should add a tough rebounding PF.

Trade Frye.

"You don't live by the jumpshot, you die by the jumpshot." ---Charles Barkley, 2/7/08

by timbo on Mar 26, 2008 2:29 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

get real
no way the team would trade Joel. Seems the plan in place is a good one- have Joel back up the leagues next thing. The team cant put all their eggs in Oden's basket next year, and Joel is not just going to be back-up, he's going to help enforce the 48 minute no lay-up rule for opposing teams.

You think the team should re-sign Lafrentz as Oden's back-up?

I heartily endorse this event or product-- Krusty

by bow4meow on Mar 26, 2008 1:54 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Keep Joel
Exactly right. We need to keep Joel for a solid back-up to Greg Oden.
BILL MCGEE

by BILLMCGEE on Mar 26, 2008 5:04 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Indeed
We haven't seen Oden play yet.  When he did play in summer league, he picked up 403 fouls in 7 minutes.  Plus, he is coming off of a serious operation.  Joel is our insurance policy.  It would be a bad idea to quit paying insurance, just to have the house burn down the next day.
I'm hip, I'm slick, and all the women want my phone number!

by silkybrown on Mar 26, 2008 7:42 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Sure
If we can get a really good player for Joel... a PG on Calderon's level or a SF on Danny Granger's level, you have to consider it.

None of our players are untouchable-- some of them (ie the big 3) just have really high prices.  Joel should be dealt if and only if we are in a position to get something really good for him.

by jksnake99 on Mar 26, 2008 1:54 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

you bring up a valid point
but there's no way this happens. We will need Joel in the first couple years of Oden's development while he's trying to block every shot and grab every rebound (meaning he will be in foul trouble a lot). You're right, by the time we don't need Joel maybe his value will have diminished, but by that time his contract will be up anyway. I think trading Joel would be retarded, it won't happen.

by mark twain on Mar 26, 2008 1:56 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

No way
He's relatively cheap to keep around and he's a perfect backup center......there's absolutely no reason to trade him when a lot of teams HIGHLY value promise and potential. We have to many duplicates at other positions (SF, PG) that need to be traded first. Why get rid of our only backup center? Makes no sense......

by iDea on Mar 26, 2008 1:58 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

I want Joel on the team
so he can push Greg Oden in practice, and so that the white unit can rebound.

by ranma on Mar 26, 2008 1:58 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

I see your points
I just don't agree with them.

  1. The NBA is a potential league, GM's will trade for star potential over avg talent any day of the week.

  2. The NBA knew about Joel before his 26 rebound game, the book has been out on him for awhile. He is having a great year that is for sure, but it will not make him the center piece of a deal that brings in Calderon or someone of similar talent.

  3. Backup C is not our highest prioity because we have Joel. If you watch this year, one of the biggest weaknesses of this team is that we do not have a rebounder in the 2nd unit. Joel will bring us that next year, if we trade him, then next year we will have the same problems with 2nd unit rebounding that we have this year.

  4. We can afford whoever we want, (within reason). Paul Allen has shown he will pay the lux tax for a winner, and while I don't know if we will have to do that or not, it is a luxury we have because of our owner. Disregarding that fact, Joel's contract is very very managable, (read: Cheap). If he plays like he has played this year, for the rest of his contract, then he will be underpaid by NBA standards.

I want to thank you for bringing up this topic as I think Joel is not "off limits" in trade discussions, so it is a possibility. I just think the Blazers will be hard pressed to give him up.

by usmcr3049 on Mar 26, 2008 1:58 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

I don't mean to be a jerk
and while your points 1-3 may be correct, you are severly misunderstanding what it means to be a Blazer with point number 4.

There is no way that we would turn around and slap him in the face after all he has done and worked for with this organization.

Also as a matter of positions, we are trading Raef this year, and Joel will be our (only) white unit center. Joel will fit into the white unit perfectly. You can't have Oden play 48 minutes. This is the 4th player (aside from our big 3) least likely player to even consider being traded.

TheOdenator

by TheOdenator on Mar 26, 2008 2:05 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

contract
Especially when you consider the value we have Joel at.

With the Ben Wallace's of the league demanding top dollar, we are very lucky to have Joel for the price he agreed to stay for.  

After reading the article in the Portland Tribune, as a blazer fan, how could you suggest trading this guy?  A solid center, a great person, and promising to play in all 82 games!  

Him teamed up with Oden for the next few years may be one of the best things going for this team.  Plus, he's saying he will challenge Greg for the starting role.  That's the position we want him taking.  Those guys will push each other and together provide that toughness we will really need.

Here's to no more layups.  G.O + Joel in '08!

"Stick a knife in 'em, their done!" ~ Mike Rice

by courtsideerrandboy on Mar 26, 2008 4:04 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't think KP is trading
Raef, because doing so would eliminate $12,722,500 of cap space in 2009. Raef and Francis take a combined $30,000,000 off the books that summer and there's no way KP will mess with that.

by t jay on Mar 26, 2008 4:13 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Joel's intangibles and tangibles
I couldn't find the video i was looking for but KG is trash talking LA, and Joel is trying to calm LA down, when KG says something and Joel's head whips around and starts walking down KG yelling at him "what the &^& did you say to me?" Awesome. But here is talking back to Boozer:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9vy1NKEA_D4&feature=related

And here are a few of his tangibles (this was made in 9/06, so needless to say with this season added would look even better):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZcOTqe51X8c

TheOdenator

by TheOdenator on Mar 26, 2008 2:25 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

A couple problems...
.................................... 1. Have you seen any YouTube video of Oden playing defense? The guy is an arm swinger. Do you think refs are going to put their whistles in their pockets? The same refs that we see night after night calling ticky tack fouls against the less aggressive LMA? The refs who whistle Pryz for leaning too hard or breathing wrong? Not a chance. Oden is going to be a 25 minute guy, mark my words. Whatcha gonna do for a center for the other 23 minutes?

2. Joel is officially PAID. He's not as easy to trade as you might think. How many ppg does he average again? How many GMs are going to get on THAT hook for THAT one dimensional of a player?

I don't just LIKE Joel, I ADORE Joel. But it would be both foolhardy and very difficult to move him. And I strongly doubt that it's gonna happen.

t

"You don't live by the jumpshot, you die by the jumpshot." ---Charles Barkley, 2/7/08

by timbo on Mar 26, 2008 2:26 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

I did a search of summer league video
on youtube and there is very little of Oden blocking shots.  It's mostly him dunking on offense.  What block they show, I don't see the arm waving you refer to.

I think it is unwise to try to predict Oden's performance next year based on a couple of summer league games.  By the time next season swings around he will have had a year of watching the league, a summer of working with his coaches, an entire summer league (not just a couple of games) and a training camp and pre-season.  Oden is not going to be some lumbering, wildly out of control giant committing fouls every 3 minutes.

by timg56 on Mar 26, 2008 3:00 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

yup yup
I agree 100% with this as well.  I've said it a million times, but Oden is not some dumb lumbering beast.  He is smart, athletic, and coming into the NBA already a well known star with a defensive reputation.  He'll automatically get more respect than Joel has ever gotten from the refs, combined with a lot more capability.

If Dwight Howard can average 30+ mins a game as a raw rookie, Oden can average that much as a slightly older, more physically imposing, smarter, more experienced rookie.  

The doomsayers thinking Oden will average near 20 minutes aren't realizing how little that amount of playing time is, and are somehow thinking Oden is a 7 foot 5 twelve year old African kid with zero coordination, used to dribbling a dried out zebra carcass as a basketball while using a former warlord's skull as a hoop (if he was like that, he woulda' been drafted by the Sonics every year for the past 5 years ZING!).  Oden is coordinated, smart, and very skilled in the arts of basketball.  When people saw he is "raw", it is only in relation to where he'll end up.

It doesn't mean Joel won't be very important, and Oden should have enough offensive skill to play alongside Joel as well.  There will be plenty of minutes for Joel even with a successful season for Oden.

Mortimer

by Mortimer on Mar 26, 2008 3:14 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

why do you sign your name?
we know who posted it. come up with something clever abd make it your signature... ONLY a suggestion, brother.
I heartily endorse this event or product-- Krusty

by bow4meow on Mar 26, 2008 8:17 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Same reason Dave does?
Who knows.  Who cares?

by timg56 on Mar 27, 2008 8:38 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Quick Chat Yo, Quick Chat!
Quick has said that GO is not going to be playing in the summer league.
The square on the hypotenuse is equal to the sum of the squares on the other two sides.

by tominhawaii on Mar 26, 2008 3:15 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Practicing, yes.
PLAYING, no.

I forget where I read that, but that was the deal: Oden WILL BE with the summer league team, but he won't be on the roster for games.
I mean, duh--how prospects can play with Oden is a major evaluation need for them.
So it makes sense for him to be part of that process of checking THEM out,
even though he needs no game time or judging himself.

Did you really put stuff on top of the eggs? Like, for real? He put . . . HE PUT THE LIGHT BULBS ON THE BOTTOM!

by QualityPie on Mar 26, 2008 3:40 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Pryz averages this year...
4.9 ppg.

8.2 rebounds.

Salary for next 3 years: $6.3, $6.86, player option for $7.4 million.

He's a rebounding specialist (and a good one) but this is not the guy that's gonna get GMs around the league all hot and bothered...

t

"You don't live by the jumpshot, you die by the jumpshot." ---Charles Barkley, 2/7/08

by timbo on Mar 26, 2008 2:33 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

I agree 100%
Joel is the sort of player you LOVE when he is on your team, but overlook when he is the enemy.  GMs do that as well; they know Joel is good, but he won't get anyone hot and bothered as the center of a trade deal.

Not to say GMs are dumb, Joel just isn't a type of player who gets us a Devin Harris.  Some combo of Joel and Outlaw and whoever, sure.  But then we got a whole new set of roster problems...

Jor-El's value as a TERRIFIC back up center, tough guy presence, rebounder/shot blocker, and veteran leader outweight any value he has on the trade market.  Joel is worth more to this Blazer team than he would be to most other teams.

Plus, he's a steal of a deal for a GOOD center.  We got Joel for about the MLE, while bums like Dampier and Ratliff make 10 million a year.  His contract might sound like a lot, but it's GREAT for a decent NBA center-- the most overpaid group around.

Mortimer

by Mortimer on Mar 26, 2008 2:55 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Expanding on Odenator's point
about not disparaging Joel's contribution to this team:

  1. Joel chose Portland while turning down Detroit and San Antonio for the same money. This was the turning point where the folks in the media and the league started to respect what is happening here.

  2. KP has said he wants to attract a quality player with the 09 cap room. The way we treat Joel and Steve will demonstrate our respect for free agent signings.

  3. The one championship Portland has was won, as much by the second unit as the first. My memory is that the 2nd unit came in (all 5) together and played as a unit. That meant little rest for the opposing starters. Anchor for both units was the center.

  4. As also noted by others here, Joel brings maturity and leadership to the team. A player spurned by several teams he can speak to new teammates about the opportunity here is be seen and earn fair playing time. He can (and will) also accept his role as defined by the Coach and not complain. Starter, backup, 10 minutes, 28 minutes, Joel gives all he has for that role. That is leadership that is earned.

by lee3022 on Mar 26, 2008 2:41 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

thank you
this is exactly the post I wanted to write, but could not write as well as this.
TheOdenator

by TheOdenator on Mar 26, 2008 2:48 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Championship second unit?
I would hardly say it was anchored by Robin Jones....

Lloyd Neal was really a PF, and he, Johnny Davis, and Larry Steele were the keys to the second unit.

I agree with the rest of your analysis (all four points).

I'm frequently right, but always certain

by jscot on Mar 27, 2008 1:37 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

All good points
Okay, that's about what I expected. Thanks for the civil and thoughtful discussion. My next piece will be entitled "Why we need to fire Kevin Pritchard" ;)

Seriously, though, I agree with all of the points that have been made. I LOVE Joel, I want Portland to be a place that treats players with respect, I agree that his value is good but not great, and we are sorely going to need him next year b/c of Oden's growing pains.

However, I think the point that needs to be made here is this... We can keep hoping that Jarret Jacket, Channing Frye plus three rusty old nails is going to net us a championship-caliber PG. But it ain't gonna happen.

Perhaps another way to start this discussion would be to ask the question "What current asset that you REALLY LIKE would you be willing to give up to get that PG?" For me, it's Joel. It'd pain me to give him up, but for the right deal, I'd do it in a heartbeat. And I'm not even talking about one of those crazy wishful-thinking type deals.

One other point to be made... Why do we assume that Joel is happy to play second fiddle to GO? If I were him and had just completed a successful season, and knew that GO was about to become the centerpiece of the team, I might want to go elsewhere and be a starter.

by kennetha on Mar 26, 2008 2:53 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Why do you think someone is going to
trade a "championship caliber" PG?  Those guys are almost as rare as "championship caliber" centers.  If you have a "championship caliber" PG, you are going to hang on to him.  The only reason you trade him is

a) you already have a better "championship caliber" PG

or

b) you are getting a "championship caliber" center in return.

by timg56 on Mar 26, 2008 3:06 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Here is what I'd give up
For a DEFENSIVE PG who can also hit a shot, like Devin Harris, I would glady give up:

--Our lottery pick this year (and any year, really)
--Jack
--Frye
--Sergio
--Joel Freeland
--Petteri Kopponen
--Von Wafer
--McBoberts
--Raef's contract
--Our 4 second round picks
--Our potential heaping spoonfull of cap space in 2009

The best is yet to come from Martell and Outlaw, so I am hesitant about losing them, and I like the solid steadiness Blake and Joel will offer our very young team.  Both are great back ups, serviceable starters.  If we get a good STARTING PG in return, I am fine losing any of our PG prospects as we will not need them anymore; Blake is more than good enough to be our backup PG for a million years.  

To a rebuilding team like the Nets will be soon, perhaps a lottery pick, a lot of 2nd round picks, and prospects with a lot of potential might be enough to steal a semi-expensive PG like Harris.  If I'm them, I wouldn't necessarily trade Harris because I like Harris so much, but I would be very open to any deal that cuts salary off the books and gets us tons of young players, draft picks, and cap space in the near future.

Basically, anything that helps the move to Brooklyn and making a run at Lebron.

I don't know what the Nets actual plans are, of course.  But I think we might have the pieces to get a nice deal done, without losing the big 3, Marty and Trouty, or our best white veterans.

Mortimer

by Mortimer on Mar 26, 2008 3:06 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

completely agree
and since Jay-Z is going to be looking for freeing up some cap space in time to get Lebron, LaFrentz's contract will look more valuable to teams like the Nets and the Knicks(if they realize how bad of a situation they are in, and how much they are going to have to revamp their team to turn it into a real team).
TheOdenator

by TheOdenator on Mar 26, 2008 3:11 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

If we give up Raef
to land a PG, there goes nearly $13,000,000 of 2009 cap space. I wouldn't do it. That kind of financial flexibility doesn't come along very often, and I'd be very careful and thoughtful with that rare amount of cap space. Plus, the rookie contracts of LMA and Roy expire the summer of 2010 and they won't be cheap to resign.

If KP is as wise and patient as I think he is, he'll let Raef, Francis and Miles all expire so he can have nearly $39,000,000 to work with in 2009-2010 (assuming the plan with Miles works out). That's when you go get championship caliber free agents.

by t jay on Mar 26, 2008 4:49 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I like cap space
But I find relying on free agency to get your championship caliber players to be dubious at best.  It usually ends up in overpaying players, not getting who you set your sights on, and disappointment.

Of course, I like the flexibility cap space gives us with trades, and signing a few role players, so I am all for getting big time cap space.  I just think the draft, and big trades are a much, much, much better way to get that key player.

I only support losing the cap space if we get a player who is better than we would be able to get in free agency.  I think Devin Harris fits that bill.  To get Paul or Deron, we gotta count on either one of those players REALLY souring on their respective teams, or those teams becoming so awful the star will actually accept like 20 million less to leave the team.  That isn't very likely, to say the least.

Cap space is overrated, because signing a big free agent is overrated.  Maybe because it supports my argument, I can't remember the last meaningful free agent splash that actually helped win games.  Cap space does make it easier to make a deal because you don't have to match contracts, so I like that aspect of it.

As far as the salary cap and having to pay Roy/LMA/Oden a lot, I'm sure Paul Allen will have no problem cutting the check if the team is awesome.  Whether we get trade for a great PG who eats up our future cap space, or we use that cap space in 2009, we're still using the cap space and paying Roy/LMA/Oden (near)max deals.  Allen can afford it, since it will still likely be less than what he had paid in the past for much less.

If no one is available that is worth losing cap space over, then of course you keep the plan of waiting for cap space.  But I think some players are more than worth losing the chance to overpay a free agent.

Mortimer

by Mortimer on Mar 26, 2008 5:10 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well said
I think every team has some under achievers whom they are over paying, and we don't need to go any further down that road.

Great points!

by t jay on Mar 26, 2008 11:22 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I hear you brah
Its a hard sell around here, but if it took Joel to get the right pg, I would be all for it.  I think we need a good pg before we need a great backup center...
Rudy > MJ

by myemic23 on Mar 26, 2008 11:15 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

NO Friggin WAY!!!
Joel Pryzbilla is a key to the Blazers future.  

1.)  Value!  So what, he gives Portland value by staying on the roster.  He give our Franchise Player (Greg Oden) a very high quality defender to practice his offense against.  Pryzbilla is our insurance policy if Oden ever has an injury or foul trouble.  For this reason alone, Pryz is so valuable where he could save a game, a season, or a playoff series.

2.)  So what if his "trade value" will diminish.  Joel is 31 years old and has 3 more seasons on his deal.  His bargain price tag and the fact that he likes playing in Portland with the Blazers are reasons to keep him.  The biggest factor in Joel having a decreasing value is that he is over 30 and that Oden will be playing double his minute.  That doesn't mean Joel impact while in a game or practicing will diminish at all.

3.) The reason Backup Center isn't one of our "priorities" is because we have Pryzbilla.  He will be the Blazers beast off the bench, an intimidation factor, and a rebounding machine.  Pryz is a legit 7-footer on our roster with great character and heart.

4.) Pryzbilla's roster spot isnt wasting anything for the Blazers franchise.  Roster space, cap room, nothing.  He does what he is paid to do, and does a great job doing it.  

Keep Pryz, he is a monster and, more importantly, he is our monster.

by Scotty the Mastermind on Mar 26, 2008 3:17 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

31 years old?
He was born on 10/10/79, making him 28 years old.  Do you mean he'll be 31 when his deal is up?

Mortimer

by Mortimer on Mar 26, 2008 3:24 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah... that's what I meant
Geez Mortimer, nothing gets by you.  Regardless, though, he isn't too old to where his skills are going to rapidly diminish and the reserve roll he will assume with Oden in the line-up should prolong his career as long as he stays a Blazer for life.

by Scotty the Mastermind on Mar 27, 2008 11:07 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I apologize
I wasn't trying to "getcha", it just made me worry that I was suddenly 31, because my b-day is about a month away from Jor-Els.  If he is suddenly 31, then so am I.  And I ain't plannin' on livin' that long!  Hard living, fast dyin', that's the Mortimer way...

Mortimer

by Mortimer on Mar 27, 2008 1:09 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Mortality Mort
I'm frequently right, but always certain

by jscot on Mar 28, 2008 1:52 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Live fast, die young
and you will make a beautiful corpse.
A gatherins of sheperds, and one dead sheep.

by amlmart1 on Mar 28, 2008 5:49 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

No kidding.
He looked unimpressive in summer league, can't get any playing time in Europe, and we simply don't have the roster spots. Even if we did, who is he taking minutes away from? LaFrentz? Channing?

Oh... you meant Joel PRYZBILLA?

HA!

Trade Freeland!

by rockingharder on Mar 26, 2008 3:38 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Well, all the responses seem to add up:
"You're NUTS to trade Joel for those reasons! But those ARE reasons to trade Frye, once Oden's back."

Hmmmm. Wonder what the response would be if the post ran again, except with Frye as the trade subject instead of Joel.
I just might try it . . .

Did you really put stuff on top of the eggs? Like, for real? He put . . . HE PUT THE LIGHT BULBS ON THE BOTTOM!

by QualityPie on Mar 26, 2008 3:42 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

go for it
I think most of the commentary will revolve around the same three-points though: Frye's a great back-up to Aldridge, We should see what he can do at PF, But completely completely tradeable since he doesn't have Joel's size, and the PF is a position where we already have a back-up in Outlaw.
TheOdenator

by TheOdenator on Mar 26, 2008 3:48 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Outlaw is no PF...
........................... whatever he is, he's not a 4, except in Nate's imagination.
"You don't live by the jumpshot, you die by the jumpshot." ---Charles Barkley, 2/7/08

by timbo on Mar 26, 2008 4:32 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Outlaw can guard a PF on 2nd team....
Especially if we keep Joel down in the paint.

Outlaw is a forward, PF/SF regardless, he is 6'9" and a shot blocker.  I think Outlaw would be a mismatch offensively against opposing teams 2nd team PF's and on defense be solid enough to "D" up.  

He may not technically be a prototype PF, but he surely can play the "4".

by Scotty the Mastermind on Mar 27, 2008 11:11 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Outside of Roy ...
Joel is the heart and soul of this team. We'll need his toughness and fire when the games get tougher.

Also, he's going to dominate second units for years to come. Why trade that away?

by bfan on Mar 26, 2008 4:26 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Worth thinking about.
Joel is a valuable trade piece, and for the right price he surely should be traded.  As a piece included for a top flight point guard or small forward trades are worth exploring.  

However I include Joel with Blake as players who are worth more than what we're paying them.  There's no reason not to keep them as excellent backups who love Portland, and are happy to play and win with us.  

If we can keep Joel we should.  If he's demanded as a part of a deal that would bring a, pass-first, top point guard or a defensive minded small forward who can shoot and penetrate, then we should trade even Joel.  

Extend NBA League Pass to Europe!

by Fryer4 on Mar 26, 2008 4:29 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Trade Joel? Not just NO, but @&%$*@ NO!!
As for thoughtful arguments, many have already written them, and done a fine job of it.
38:19 Min, 11-18 FG, +11 +/-, 5 Off, 12 Rebs, 7 Ast, 1 Stl, 1 Blk, 22 Pts - LMA vs Clips 3-21-08

by LaMarvelous on Mar 26, 2008 9:02 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Won't happen
before mid-season next year.

If Oden shines, and proves not to be the foul-plagued idiot that some people seem to think he'll be, and shows no ill effects of surgery, and shows he can play 35+ minutes a game, then maybe Joel might go before the trade deadline.

If we still have big problems at another position (PG or SF), and Joel is part of the price to fix it, then I could see Joel being traded.  But it won't happen this off-season.  Greg has to prove himself first.  By the time he does so, we may have solutions to these other problems, and not need to trade.

But I really want to see a White Unit anchored by Joel blocking shots and rebounding, and Sergio (or Blake, if we have another starting PG), Rudy, and Travis out on the break.  You don't give up that possibility lightly.

I'm frequently right, but always certain

by jscot on Mar 27, 2008 1:47 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

You're wrong
I have been reading Blazersedge a while now, and so I know that Oden will average 17 minutes, 6pts, and some rebounds, who has absolutely no offense to speak of, and will always be in foul trouble. Basically, he'll be Joel from 06-07, only worse.

by TimG on Mar 27, 2008 4:50 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Sorry, I forgot
"Received wisdom" is always right, of course.
I'm frequently right, but always certain

by jscot on Mar 28, 2008 1:53 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

He's being sarcastic...
........................ but ODEN HIMSELF predicted he'd be a 10-12 pt. guy ON THE AIR.

And ODEN HIMSELF said in a recent newspaper interview that he intends "going for every block," unlike Pryz, who is selective.

So you can laugh at me all you want and dream your dreams of Bill Russell and Wilt Chamberlin, but GOd's gonna be 25 minutes, 12 points next year. My source is GREG ODEN.

"You don't live by the jumpshot, you die by the jumpshot." ---Charles Barkley, 2/7/08

by timbo on Mar 30, 2008 9:18 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Telfair
Was gonna average 8 assists a game and over 10 points.  He said so so it must be true!  Players ain't no judge of what they gonna do, and you know that silly face.

If Oden plays only 25 mins a night, it's a huge disappointment.  Bottom line, it's a bad season.  I don't think he'll be a disappointment at all.

You also know he's just being facetious and addressing his need to still gain on the job experience at the NBA level.  That is no mystery.  He's not a brainless dolt who can't control himself though, and the fact he is smart enough to be sarcastic about such a thing shows he is smart enough to not do it every night.

He'll get into foul trouble a lot, maybe it'll seem like every game sometimes.  He'll still play 30 mins a game.

Mortimer  

by Mortimer on Mar 30, 2008 3:05 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Before we can ever entertain the thought
of trading Joel, we have to wait to find out if Greg is durable.

by TwoDeep on Mar 27, 2008 8:39 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

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