Understanding Blazer's Eurofans
by DaniBCN on Nov 11, 2008 9:35 AM PST
Email
Print
Hello everybody!
I'm another spanish blazer fan.
I'm an NBA fan since I was a kid, and don't hate me but I was a L*ker fan, it's not my fault, I was raised with the showtime.
Anyway, I've been watching Blazers games since Sergio arrived in Portland, and now I'm officially a Blazer Fan , as much as I'm a Rudy fan, and he's simply my favorite player.
After the introduction I'm going to try to explain the main differences you will notice when european fans post here, things that we see as normal and things that seem weird to us, so you can better understand us.
1. Brains and skill vs Physical tools
We, the people who usually watch european basketball are used to players who rely more on their brains and skill rather than big, strong bodies. You should already know just by taking a look at most european imports, our bigs usually are avobe average shooters, fast and most of them very skilled perimeter-oriented players who usually lack some toughness on defense (see Okur, Biedrins, Gasol, Stojakovic...) and our guards and wing players are usually fast skinny guys with above average passing skills and good at creating offense who usually have different ways of defending as they are more used to team defense, gambling for steals (which isn't usually seen as a good skill, but I see it just as a different way, putting much more pressure on the ball handler when not on a iso play). I don't know if there is a way to check it, but I'm pretty sure that european players average more assists than most of the players at their positions and they also draw more charges.
2. Coaching (psychology and team concept)
European coaches usually take a different aproach to the game, imagine Gregg Popovich (even his name sounds like he's from Serbia) during the last five minutes of the last game of a playoff series. Got it? So now you know how european coaches work. Looking for mismatches, trying to take defenders out of position, lots of picks everywhere, trying to change the pace of the game every now and then so they make the other team uncomfortable. It's more of a chess game where every piece is involved. Of course some players get more shots than others, but the difference isn't that big.
Also, the fact that most players play between 10 and 30 minutes forces players to stay 100% focused and ready to get on the court while they are rested. There are no sacred cows, if someone has a bad day he won't stay for long on the court, and this makes everybody feel valuable to the team, and they know that if they play well they'll stay on the court until they can't keep it at a 100%. This also makes the team more unpredictable, everyone can start and schemes change continuosly. European teams don't use much pick'n'rolls.
And by the way this makes much sense to the Blazers given their deep.
3. Positions
In europe we usually look at a team as PG-Wings-Inside players instead of Guards-Forwards-Center. We look at point guards more as facilitators of the offense, their duties are more focused to controlling the pace of the offense, involve everybody so all the team stays focused and alert, everybody is looking for chances of scoring because they know they'll get their chances to score if they beat their defenders. That's why most european guards are usually more offensive-minded. Sergio is a good example: He may be a defensive hole sometimes, but his team usually outscores the opposing team when he's on the floor.
We're really open-minded for lineups (I've seen Pau Gasol playing some PG in Spain).
------------------------------------------------------------------
I hope after reading this you can understand some statement from eurofans that may sound weird for american fans
So don't get mad if someone says Roy shouldn't play more tan 30 minutes, because he will probably mean that Nate should rotate more in order to get everyone involved and ready to contribute at any moment.
Don't go crazy when someone says a star should come off the bench because he won't mean to disrespect him, but to give a great spark after a few minutes of play.
And don't bash eurofans who say that Sergio-Rudy-Batum(or Martell)-Travis-LaMarcus is the best Blazer lineup, because he'll probably mean that is the lineup that makes the biggest difference during a game.
127 comments
|
11 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
Point taken
we like u guys here
"All our holes," says shooting guard Brandon Roy, a surprise All-Star last year in his second season, "are holes that Greg is going to plug."
I like these guys too
especially that KarlMarxs guy. Don’t like his politics, but he sure lit a fire with that post about Rudy/Roy.
by Bust a Bucket on Nov 11, 2008 7:08 PM PST up reply actions
lol its kartemax
that comment cracked me up man….
Rip City Baby...People have no idea what is coming.
Follow my twitter www.twitter.com/PDXBlazersFTW, @PDXBlazersFTW. Lots of random Blazer Posts from links I find around the blogosphere.
JK im racist
lol im badass
Im the original G hustla
"All our holes," says shooting guard Brandon Roy, a surprise All-Star last year in his second season, "are holes that Greg is going to plug."
Interesting, and I see your point.
However, that doesn’t mean that when a Eurofan (or any fan for that matter) comes in questioning Roy’s minutes or decision-making they are necessarily right either.
I want to see Rudy heavily involved in the offense as much as the next guy, but what I really DON’T want is him forcing his shots. I would much rather have Rudy take 5 or 6 open looks that come as a result of ball movement than take 10 looks when he is trying to create on his own.
Rudy moves great without the ball and gets open beautifully. He and Roy have only played 7 games together, and they will build that connection. Let the recipe bake, folks.
"For the past two seasons it's been like, 'They're young, they're going to need some time,"' Roy said. "It doesn't feel like that this season."
by joelor on Nov 11, 2008 9:49 AM PST reply actions 1 recs
I understand
but what I meant before is that you shouldn’t take some comments too literaly.
None of us know when Roy is acting by himself or when is following Nate’s orders and I don’t think there are Roy haters, but system haters because sometimes it’s a fact that Roy disrupts the offense by holding to the ball for too long.
I honestly believe that Blazers have more chances of winning games moving the ball, cutting and using screens than letting Roy create for himself during three or four straight possessions and I think this guys share the same concern but express it on a different way, just don’t take it badly, they just need someone to blame and it’s always easier to look a the guy on the spotlight.
Were you able to see the 1st and 4th quarters last night?
Both systems you’re talking about worked very well. It’s because Roy’s so effective in an iso that the movement works so well. Defenders have to focus on him, leaving Rudy’s running as a secondary priority.
I love the international flavor, but you’re post indicates that you’re much more familiar with the international game. That’s cool. I’m not super smart or anything. It’s just that when Euros other World-os come on here and start arguing for changes that make little sense in the NBA without considering the difference, it’s a sour pill. I certainly wouldn’t tell you how to change the Spanish national team to be more effective. I’d ask questions. So, it might be a little less strife-alicious, if instead of saying Rudy should get Roy’s minutes (I don’t know if you said that, but one spaniard did), they instead asked, “Why is Roy getting so many minutes, taking those Isos, and etc?”
I'm a really really ridiculously good looking orange mocha frappaccino drinking manhammer sandwich
I couldn’t get a stream last night so I couldn’t watch the game at all, but I’ve seen most of the games, and I’m not saying that Roy isn’t effective, what I say is that I think that involving everybody could work better because using too much Roy’s isos can make the team predictable and this team has enough talent to get everybody involved and clicking on offense.
By the way, I played under FIBA rules for 7 years, but for the last 5 I’ve been watching like 80 NBA games per season so I understand quite well the NBA game, I just have a more open mind because I also watch some ACB and Euroleague games.
This post was intended to help you guys adapt to spanish fans coming to BE so you can understand them better. Yes, there are guys who think Rudy should play 40 minutes, but there are also some people who think Bayless should play 20 min. Here in Spain there is an old saying: Opinions are like asses, everyone has his own but noone wants to smell the others’.
I woudn’t play anyone more than 30 minutes because I think we’re deep and talented enough to play that way, I prefer Outlaw playing PF, I would give Sergio some of Blake minutes and I wouldn’t play Roy and Rudy so much time together. Some people will agree and some won’t but it’s just what I think and it’s as respectable as anyone else’s opinion. I just wouldn’t guarantee any minutes, just follow the flow of the game and have everybody fresh, focused, ready and involved, I think that’s best way for the Blazers to grow and win games, but I know Nate will never do that.
We have similar saying here
Opinions are like a-holes…everyone has one and they all stink
"Fez, the foundation of any good relationship is three little words: I-don't-know.
What're you doing? I don't know.
What're you thinking about? I don't know.
Who's that under you? I don't know. "
-Michael Kelso
by 92wastheyear on Nov 11, 2008 3:04 PM PST up reply actions
It's a pretty dumb saying though
because it shuts down debate and generally the best solution is a little sampling from everything so that the whole is greater than the parts.
hehehe whole.
We haven't done anything yet... but don't blink.
he-he he-he
"Fez, the foundation of any good relationship is three little words: I-don't-know.
What're you doing? I don't know.
What're you thinking about? I don't know.
Who's that under you? I don't know. "
-Michael Kelso
by 92wastheyear on Nov 12, 2008 11:04 AM PST up reply actions
I'm not necessarily talking about you
and the isos do involve other people. It doesn’t sound as if they would, but here we are.
Minutes: You can want whatever you want, but and NBA coach has to figure out the best way to win. Right now, Roy’s that.
I'm a really really ridiculously good looking orange mocha frappaccino drinking manhammer sandwich
I can't figure out why you seem to have a nasty tone throughout this discussion.
maybe you don’t mean it, but that’s how you come across.
I think
it’s because the tone is “you” in the sense of finger pointing, and it’s also a little defensive in that “this is how we do it and you don’t know anything because the basketball worlds are different.”
that’s the read I get whether it’s intentional or not.
I think the isolation call and noticing that Roy slows things down a little is a good point. I think the statement that you have to slow it down a little so that the opposition doubles up on Roy and then the other parts can work and flow is also a good point.
Frankly, I think there’s a lot of good points in these comments and I’m enjoying the different perspectives. I think it’s just important to recognize that we’re all looking at the same cat from different angles and instead of defending our angles we should relish the other perspective and try to learn about them. I’m going to have a VERY different opinion of that cat if i’m looking at it’s cute face or facing it’s butt. Let me tell you!
We haven't done anything yet... but don't blink.
This can become another whole topic
but I think the problem there is that KP was thinking about something else when he brought most of the players. Maybe I’m wrong or maybe there’s some miscomunication between management and coach, but I think Nate’s system just takes advantage of 70% of the skills this team has, and given that style he’s overachieving (despite making the team grow at a slower pace).
I don’t think the blazers can win a championship out of Roy and LaMarcus’s pick’n’rolls. It may work for some games, but we don’t have a chance against the top teams.
On the other hand I think Nate’s a good coach for this growing stage, but in the end I think (and hope for the good of the team) he’ll be out of the team before we get a championship.
Nate needs time for:
1.- Integrate and develop 4 new young players to a core of young players.
2.- Teach the new players the old systems that worked out before and that the “old” players yet know.
3.- Make changes at a pace the team can absorb. The idea is to use players and team at their best abilities.
Nate only has had two months coaching this team.
Sergio + Rudy = 16
Sergio + Bayless = 16
Batum 8+8=16
by amlmart1 on Nov 11, 2008 11:54 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
I agree
But I’d love to see the team grow faster and Nate to keep using schemes that have worked fine, like Batum guarding opposing PG’s like he did against San Antonio. He should do fine against Wade tonight.
Good news are that if we keep this winning rate Nate still has over 70 games to figure it out
I agree...but they need to learn faster.
Contradiction?
Oden and LaMarcus and Roy, oh my!
by Quik_Baller on Nov 12, 2008 11:38 AM PST up reply actions
The Blazers are young
and have many players who need to learn fundamentals. Roy and Rudy are two players who are far along in their development. But players like Outlaw, Webster, Rodriguez, Oden, Frye, Bayless…these guys are just beginning to learn how to play NBA basketball. That makes development slow. The Blazers are still breaking down entirely multiple times per game. It’s a testament to Portland’s talent (and to Rudy, Roy, and Lamarcus Aldridge) that we’re still winning even while learning.
I think you’re going to see Portland acquire a couple of veterans in the next year. Progress will speed up when we don’t have to deal with 80% of the team learning on the job.
—Dave
yeah
I was resistant to a vet, but I can really see the value now. I just thought our team could do it without one. We have enough talent we probably could, but I think a vet will save me money on computer monitors.
We haven't done anything yet... but don't blink.
A vet with great attitude and willing to adapt to make the team better?
That’s Shane Battier’s definition
Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition!
I was hoping more for a vet PG
Also, a vet that could teach.
Robert Horry would be extremely ideal, in my mind. His teams win too. It’d be good voodoo
Greg Oden, where posters happen.
What about...
Bruce Bowen?
He will be like 40 by the time current Blazer team will be on its prime but he’ll be a heck of a defensive coach
Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition!
i agree with KP vs Nate
its pretty obvious that KP has a different direction in mind than Nate for the team as far as offense goes.
Honor Terry Porter
by Philthyanimal on Nov 12, 2008 11:12 AM PST up reply actions
No problem here
You are very welcome to say any opinion about the spanish n. team
acctually some of you here, in this fantastic forum, was sayng that Spain should change the coach because he wasn’t using properly Rudy (for exemple he wasn`t starting in the olympic final)
this opinon is very respectable and dont hurts to anybody… btw…. like danibcn said, be starter is not so important in Europe like is in the NBA
I would argue that being a starter for the Blazers is not important
Nic Batum starts, but only plays around 18 minutes.
Rudy and Travis come off the bench and play 30+ minutes. Those guys are vital to our success right now.
Look at the end of the Orland game. Rudy and Travis in playing Brandon, Blake and Aldridge. It’s not who starts the game that’s important, it’s who ends the game. Of course, the Blazers are somewhat unique and on most teams the non-starters are not as important as Rudy and Travis are to the Blazers.
by Bust a Bucket on Nov 11, 2008 10:02 PM PST up reply actions
good point
you are right
however… from my eurpean point of view looks like there are alot of “no writed” rules about the players rules in the Nba: for exemple the starters start again in the 3th quarter and the nba award best 6th man makes no much sense in Europe.
im not sayng this is good or bad just a remark
Oh definitely...
Rudy and guys like Manu Ginobli are the exceptions that prove the rule.
“no writed” … close but no cigar on that translation… it’s “unwritten” rules I think you were trying to say.
Yeah, it’s very strange indeed that the starters always start the third quarter (99.9% of the time, barring an injury in the first half).
Why do the Blazers need to start the most balanced unit (true postion players at every position) instead of the best 5 players? And why then is it OK to have 5 totally different players in at the end of the game? Why does Batum start ahead of Outlaw, when Outlaw will eventually play twice as many minutes?
All I can guess is that Nate is trying to put the best 48 minute performance together, and that means mixing and matching as the game goes along. He’s not simply trying to win the first 6 minutes.
It’s definitely more of an art than a science (if that phrase has a Spanish equivalent and meaning to you).
You could write many volumes of books on the philosphy and strategy of NBA basketball. Do you have some extra time on your hand?
by Bust a Bucket on Nov 12, 2008 11:45 PM PST up reply actions
I like the euro-futball taype play that Rudy brings
He’s playing a different style ball than most others.
Rudyculize: The act of Rudy making others look slow, dim and generally oafish.
http://www.myspace.com/y5k
Welcome to the Blazersedge community, monstruo!
Pedazo of comentario ;-)
Sergio + Rudy = 16
Sergio + Bayless = 16
Batum 8+8=16
Good post, and to address some of your points
1) I believe the brains and skill thing vs. strength has more to do with how the game is called here vs. in Europe. The refs here allow a little more leeway to guys in terms of travels (as anyone who remembers the Euro teams complaining about it in the Olympics) and in terms of carries. It is MUCH easier to score one on one when you can take an extra half step (or steps in LBJ’s case). This takes the imperative off getting guys the ball in better positions to score since it’s easier for them to get a shot off the dribble here.
As far as whether this is good basketball or not, probably not, and it’s certainly less entertaining, but in terms of winning in the NBA, we’ve only seen two teams win titles with European players as major contributors (Kukoc on the Bulls, Manu and Tony on the spurs), so it hasn’t been shown to be a super success here yet. Witness Boston, who I believe were the only team with no Europeans under contract last year. All the teams in between, though, like the Heat, Pistons, Lakers, ‘99 Spurs, have had almost no European presence. I’m hoping we can change this and continue what the spurs started, but the past is the past.
2) I’d argue Pop is way more in the Nate mold than you think. The Spurs by and large have their offense and stick to it. No matter how much of a stiff might be guarding Finley or whoever, 90% of their possessions will be some form of an iso or a 2-man game with a couple of their big 3, none of which are really physical mismatches for anyone. Simply put, he puts the ball in the hands of those guys and lets them go to work. They just happen to be three of the best in the league at what they do. Pop’s best attributes are his ability to motivate and then also to find solutions to opponents’ gimmicks, I’d say
It makes sense because he’s a Euro guy, but D’Antoni is a much better example. Witness the Spurs series last year when their offense ran primarily through Diaw because he knew Finley couldn’t guard him. They went long stretches without Nash or Amare touching the ball and just letting Boris post Finley up. I can’t imagine the Hornets running the offense through Peja, or LA through Radmanavic for more than a possession or two at a time, no matter how bad the mismatch is.
3. I agree about positions being more of a PG-Wing-Wing-Post-Post set up. Certainly, it seems like the NBA game is moving towards a more interchangeable C/PF role out there. Nothing wrong with lineup flexibilty, but it takes time for players to adapt. When a guy has camped in the corner waiting for a kickout his entire career, he’s not going to start making backdoor cuts and slashing to the hoop after two weeks of the season. These things take time.
Any Blazer Fans in London? or Manchester?
I’ll be there for the x-mas season, it would be cool to meet up if any one’s around! Joel Freeland?
The pictures kinda small, but Im giving the C's a big thumbs down
by Blazermaniac77 on Nov 11, 2008 10:52 AM PST reply actions
awesome
we should grab a beer and talk about our loved Blazers
The pictures kinda small, but Im giving the C's a big thumbs down
by Blazermaniac77 on Nov 11, 2008 9:04 PM PST up reply actions
For future Englsh reference
(yours is fabulous, of course)
In English the phrase we use is “sacred cow”
Holy cow! = milder version of Holy $&(^&
Joder
it’s not like you need to improve it. Very impressive showing, caballero.
by BlazersOrBust on Nov 11, 2008 3:55 PM PST up reply actions
Jajaja!
It’s barely even profanity in Andalucia. :) I had professors who routinely said “joder” in class…it raised my eyebrows sky-high the first time I heard it (can you imagine professors in English using the equivalent in the middle of a lecture?) but I rapidly started to enjoy it.
by BlazersOrBust on Nov 11, 2008 5:45 PM PST up reply actions
DaniBCN - Official welcome
If no one’s done it already, I put a post for you and all the spanish speaking Blazer fans to feel welcome on the forum. ¡bienvenidos!
Welcome to Blazers Edge!
Roy and Rudy are going to be a great pair someday soon, and we’re already doing well with them.
I have no doubt that they will complement each other very well, and even though we’re winning right now their partnership is only beginning. They are both unselfish, competitive, and clutch players. It’s perfect.
A healthy Oden will help their games even more… a defensive presence to help them on the perimeter, a guy for Rudy and Roy to dish off/lob to as they penetrate, or to get wide open jumpers as he is double teamed. It is perfect as well.
I think some (even American) fans just like Rudy so much they want all else out of his way so he can be the star, not taking into account that Roy is a better player AND that Rudy shouldn’t necessarily be THE star. He seems to work better fitting in and taking advantage of the defense concentrating on someone else, not being the entire focal point of the offense or defense.
They are also impatient, since Rudy and Roy haven’t even played 10 games together. True chemistry takes time, but when you got two unselfish great players, they can’t help but develop chemistry. It is science.
Just takes time, and thankfully they’re talented enough to make it work (to win) in the meantime.
Mortimer
"It is science"
So true. Once they become fluid together, it’s going to be a beautiful thing.
Rudy for ROY
Campaign 08-09
"Rudy is not everyday a shooter." ~Rudy Fernandez
um
this is NOT a fetish board… i think we should drop this conversation of players and fluids because it’s just like… you know… weird.
We haven't done anything yet... but don't blink.
I LOVE that lineup (Sergio/Rudy/Batum/Outlaw/Aldridge)
People paying attention to the numbers have noticed that our two best offensive units this year have been:
- (eFG% = .632)
PG Sergio
SG Rudy
SF Outlaw
PF Aldridge
C Frye
and
- (eFG% = .615)
PG Sergio
SG Rudy
SF Batum
PF Outlaw
C Frye
If you surround Sergio and Rudy with a bunch of guys that can shoot from anywhere, and move well, its not only a great offensive set, but they’re deadly on the break. Unlike Blake, Roy and Przy who all thrive in a half court offense, it seems the rest of our players would actually play their best basketball in an uptempo style of game. Its unfortunate that Nate McMillan is the coach of this team, because his micromanagement of this teams offense gets in the way of what a lot of our players do best.
I seriously hope no blazers are reading BE
It’s very unlikely they could learn anything from us. What they’d likely learn here would probably do more harm than good. Not that people aren’t smart here, but….. those guys are getting paid (literally) millions of dollars to do nothing but think about and play basketball. True Einstein was a patent clerk, but he was still Einstein.
I'm a really really ridiculously good looking orange mocha frappaccino drinking manhammer sandwich
Who are they playing against?
For how long? What’s their total point tally versus the starting lineup? Are you suggesting these lineups go up against the other teams starters?
It’s like Twain said, “There are three kind of lies: lies, damn lies, and statistics.”
I'm a really really ridiculously good looking orange mocha frappaccino drinking manhammer sandwich
I wasn't suggesting they be the starters
but having that unit go out there versus who they’re going out there versus now is WORKING. Not only is it working, but its working at an EXTREMELY high level. Usually teams offensive efficiency goes down when their bench comes into the game, on our team, our offensive efficiency goes through the roof when our 2nd unit is in the game.
Ideally, minus the potential starters (Aldridge and Oden would also fit perfectly) this would be the 2nd unit:
Sergio
Rudy
Batum
Outlaw
Frye
Observation mainly,
but that we are counting on a high offensive unit to finish games and not our less offensive efficient starting five.
True...
but our “finishing 5” also doesn’t come remotely close in terms of offensive efficiency to our 2nd unit.
"offensive efficiency" is a loose term
I would argue that Brandon, Rudy, Travis, LMA, and Oden would be our most efficient offensive unit.
That group may also be in at the end of a lot of games.
by Bust a Bucket on Nov 11, 2008 10:05 PM PST up reply actions
Brandon, Rudy, Travis, LMA and Oden:
Get used to that closing line-up as that’s what we will be seeing (if Oden can get and stay healthy). That will be one tough line-up to defend at crunch time.
ps. People who think our second unit can hold a candle to starters on playoff caliber teams
are overly homerish.
Defensive effeciency + Offensive effeciency = what matters at the end of a game
by Bust a Bucket on Nov 11, 2008 10:06 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Depends on which teams you're looking at
Lakers usually don’t have Radman on the floor at the end of games. Celts almost never had Perk on the floor at the ends of games last year with Posey in instead. Finley and Oberto almost never finish Spurs games. Stack has usually been a crunch time guy for the Mavs the past couple years. I haven’t watched too many NO games this year, but I think that Posey has been finishing games over Mo Pete this year. The Hawks usually had Chilldress in during crunch time in the playoffs last year.
That’s only the decent to good teams. It’s pretty split on whether starters are finishing games now. We’re not really an exception to any unwritten rule or anything.
My sons have both traveled in Europe
And have been to a number of game in various places,they tell me that tickets are much less and the game more fun to watch than the NBA,they also agree that Spain is the most fun and bang for the buck in that part of the world.
by southern oregon on Nov 11, 2008 3:10 PM PST reply actions
Bienvenido y gracias
It’s always nice to read a different perspective and I’m sorry that some of our readers seemed more interested in saying why something wouldn’t work here rather than appreciating your explanation of what Euro fans are used to seeing.
I hope that Rudy is happy here and that you will be happy visiting BlazersEdge.
Welcome DaniBCN
excellent posting but I disagree this comment “We’re really open-minded for lineups (I’ve seen Pau Gasol playing some PG in Spain).” Ok the lineup here in Europe are moreflexible but I have never watched Pau Gasol playing PG. I know Aito is a genious but even a genius can’t allow Pau Gasol Playing PG. I see him bring the ball from the defensive end to the offensive but this was in a fast transition.
It wasn't exactly playing PG
but he was the main ballhandler in Barça during some short periods of time. He grew up playing PG until he was too big to not to play him inside, that explains his passing skills somehow
Rudy
They are Rudy fans more than blazer fans, and that I do understand. There is nothing wrong with it, but it helps keep things in perspective.
This is Jack burton from the PorkChop Express and I'm talkin to whoever's out there.....
Not everyone believes that Roy has a stronger game than Rudy
I would take Rudy’s game over Roy’s any day. I doubt that Roy will have the impact on the NBA that Rudy has in five years. Go Blazers!
Sure there are always a few people in the world
who believe that aliens are running the government from their space ship. That doesn’t make it so. But they will continue to wear aluminum foil on their head waiting for the mothership to pick them up.
What can you do, but laugh at them?
Ouch, that was harsh. You should hear the things I think before posting.
I’m so lucky there’s a cancel button. I actually logged in only to reply to the comment you replied to. Now, there’s no need.
Lu, I’d love to somehow bet on that with you. Rudy’s awesome, but he can’t compare with Roy’s capabilities. He may grow into that player, but his general style wouldn’t suggest it.
I'm a really really ridiculously good looking orange mocha frappaccino drinking manhammer sandwich
Thank the good lord....
that Lu is not the General Manager!
The Hippies are protesting the new cell phone tower
and aluminium foil hats are back as a fashion statement
by southern oregon on Nov 11, 2008 7:05 PM PST up reply actions
I'd like to bet you on that too....
Rudy is an amazing player and I’m glad he’s on the team but I don’t think he’ll ever be a leader of a team the way Roy is, Aldridge almost is and Oden could be. In fact, I don’t think he’ll ever make an all-star game. I love the instant offense he brings and I think he’ll be an integral part of the championship contending Blazers but he won’t have a bigger impact that Roy. Rudy has more deficiencies in his game than Roy (ability to create his own shot being the biggest) but he still brings a lot to the table. Roy and Rudy will learn to play well together and the combo will be amazing.
Welcome to the BEdge Dani
Thank you for posting your view point. I enjoyed reading about it.
Elizabeth had a partner and he had a rap from the cops, Him and Lenny Suckerpunch were just out Tooling around
Welcome to the best site in the NB
It is more based on getting the ball to your scorers and playmakers and letting them make or break your team. In the NBA there is a hierarchy within teams in terms of who makes the plays. For instance, Nate would not want Joel putting up as many shots as Roy. In the NBA there are role players, stars, and superstars. If your role players are scoring more than your stars and superstars, you are probably losing. That’s not to say the role players are not important, because they are. However, role players are filling a niche…usually they have a particular skill set, but do not have the all around game or elite ability that stars and superstars have. One thing the Euro fans that come on here will have to understand that right now the top of the pecking order on the Blazers is Roy and Aldridge….with Oden coming in slightly behind them.
Man I hate when accidentally hit post.
Why can’t you delete after you have posted?
Anyway, I was going to say welcome to the best site in the NBA with the most passionate and informed fans.
My opening line was…The NBA is different than the international game. (then take it from there)
You can't delete
To keep people from using all kinds of cuss words to provoke someone then delete it after they are provoked.
Absolutly brilliant Dani
i was thinking to write somthing similar but my limited english hold mi back
l’has clavat !
;)
Tacus, I read you loud and clear
Please keep your comments coming. Your english is outstanding. Mi espanol es malo. – Elgin.
All the kids who played the blues would learn my licks with a bottleneck slide. - Richard Palmer-James
The forum seems to be a tad narrow minded these days and nights.
Rudy has mad skills and JasonT cannot handle it.
PS I have no interest in being GM so you have nothing to worry about. :-0
You actually may be right about Rudy, IMO
Both of these players are cold-blooded assassins. You do NOT want to be playing against them at the end of the game.
Roy has better one-on-one skills, and Nate’s offense is designed to leverage that ability. If Rudy ends up on a team here or elsewhere coached by a coach (Nate or someone else) who designs an offense to maximize what he does, Rudy could have a greater impact. The guy is crazy good, and plays offense with better fundamentals. Roy is fundamentally better on defense.
Both are phenomenal. I think Roy would actually be better in a motion offense, too, because defenses would have even more difficulty keeping him out of the paint.
The most amazing thing about my amazing ego is I have amazingly little about which to be egotistical.
The pick and roll this year will emphasize "roll" followed by "dunk", followed by the wailings and lamentations of your women.
hmmm
They extremely good but in different ways. I think Rudy sees the fast break FAR better and has the instincts to exploit. Roy has the ability to break down a double team and move through a crowd for a basket where Rudy might be slapped down. Roy is better at a solid conservative defense where Rudy excels at taking risks on defense and getting steals.
I’ve been an advocate from day one that Rudy needs to come from the bench. he plays with a unit that has a lot of punch and movement and let’s us change up the offense and speed of the game. I also want Rudy as an endgame player.
They’re not better or worse, I think they’re equally good but in different ways and it’s all about what you value more.
We haven't done anything yet... but don't blink.
Hmmm...
The forum seems to be a tad narrow minded these days and nights.
You’ve been a part of this forum for 6 weeks. I wouldn’t really say that you have the experience here to make that judgement.
As to Rudy having “mad” skills. I am thrilled to have Rudy on the Blazers and yes I agree he is excellent player. But you seem to be a Rudy fan (NOT A BLAZER FAN) and seem intent on bashing on Roy as a way of boosting Rudy…as evidenced by the history of comments (which are almost exclusively regarding Rudy) and you voting “yes” to the question “Is Roy a selfish player”
I would actually say you are the narrow minded one. It seems like you want Rudy to succeed and no one else on this team. Why don’t you try supporting all of the players? As this is a Blazers fan site and not a Rudy fan site.
I'm sitting here pondering
all the work it would take to look up how long a person has been on the board and then look at all their posts.
i laughed.
We haven't done anything yet... but don't blink.
Go ahead and try to run me out JasonT
Say what you will but you will still miss my point.
I want Roy to share the basketball to better the play of all.
I love the Blazers!
Sorry if you cannot understand my point of view.
I'm glad you love the Blazers
How long have you followed the team and been a fan? I’m wondering if you would be here posting on this site, if Rudy was traded to Indiana? Would you all of sudden become a Pacers fan?
is there any reason
to be attacking Lu here? Let it go.
We haven't done anything yet... but don't blink.
Why didn't people step up like this for Outlaw
Batum fans hate Outlaw
Rudy fans hate Roy
Sergio fans hate Jack, McMillan, and soon Bayless or Blake
After today, Oden fans will hate Przybilla
I’m a huge Frye fan, so I hate LA
It’s just the way it is. The back up quarterback is always a fan favorite, until he plays.
I agree
we should always play the back-up more often! Can’t people see the potential???
We haven't done anything yet... but don't blink.
"Trade value" and "potential"
The two most overused terms on blogs.
by tominhawaii on Nov 12, 2008 10:28 AM PST up reply actions
yeah
i’m boycotting potential this year. Unfortunately that means I expect perfection and I need a new computer monitor. That’s the real reason I’m taking a break from the blazers!
We haven't done anything yet... but don't blink.
If Sergio's fans were smart they would hate Roy as well
I think Sergio’s incompatibility with Roy is limiting his playing time more than Blake is.
That is moronic
Roy is the best player on the team, no matter how much a person is a fan of Sergio’s the team is clearly better off with Roy in games. Blake on the other hand… Sergio has a legit beef (or his agent).
Roy is moronic
so’s his mom.
oh yeah… i went there.
We haven't done anything yet... but don't blink.
But if Roy has the ball...
Then the team is clearly better off with Blake (or Rudy, or Bayless) in the game rather than Sergio. Sergio only has a legitimate chance of beating out Blake and Bayless in situations where Roy is not in the game.
Sergio is a player who’s only real skills (passing and ball-handling) require him to dominate the ball to be effective. Pair him with another dominate ball-handler (like Roy) and he becomes useless.
Not all Spaniards want to bash Roy!
Hi,
Yes, I’m Spanish and I’m a Rudy fan. But some Spaniards’ comments make me cringe.
The worse thing is it’s more widespread in Spain than in this forum. NBA TV commentators here are a disgrace, always calling the game from a nationalistic perspective: Sergio is better than Blake, Rudy should play more minutes, Pau Gasol should get more touches and so on. Invariably the NBA coach with a Spanish player, for any Spanish players in any team, is biased against him according to them, as are their teammates critiziced if they’re contending for minutes or stardom.
Their absolute lack of objectivity is depressing and ultimately makes me watch less NBA than I would otherwise. Yesterday on the Magic-Blazers the TV journalist said he would never go out for a drink with Nate McMillan after he subbed Sergio, as if he was not only a bad coach but a bad person for doing so.
So, the Roy bashing has belatedly started on Spanish TV. Right now they’re only saying that he should share the ball with Rudy a little more but it will get worse. I just hope the Spanish audience is more intelligent than the pundits, especially those who come here. But I also hope Blazers fans at large will appreciate that not all of us want to bash Roy.
Hi asola. I watch the NBA games by TV while I look at the Open Game thread at Blazersedge and listening the Portland radio (using the link provided by NBA.com)
I hate also the totally biased Spanish journalists. They are nationalist and stupid. Last game they said that they couldn´t talk about stats because NBA.com didn´t update them. I´m not a journalist and I could read the stats on time at ESPN.com. They are ignorant.
Sergio + Rudy = 16
Sergio + Bayless = 16
Batum 8+8=16
Thanks for that perspective
Obviously if one view point is constantly thrust down your throat, then people are going to develop opinions based on that one view point. Heck just take a look at our politics and our… er… right. No politics.
You may cringe at people who come here and represent the spanish fan base, but there are BE people here who will also cringe when you encounter OUR fan base. Fans are passionate people and we sometimes ALL have strong undeserved opinions (and even sometimes deserved).
So, welcome to our site and keep in mind that Fans here can be just as bad as yours and forgive us as many of us will forgive you.
We haven't done anything yet... but don't blink.
Thank you for a different perspective.
It is hard for some of us Blazer fans, who have been fans for years and some of us decades, to have people who have never taken a real interest in the team posting on this site from a nationalist point of view and not as an actual Blazer fan. And to make matter worse some of these folks bash the rest of the team in order to make their point.
I know this is something that other team’s deal with such as Raptors fans have deal with…Barganani or Calderon vs. Bosh and Laker fans deal with Gasol vs. Kobe. From my perspective, I have been a fan of this team since the days of Calvin Natt and Kenny Carr. I love the team, not just one individual player…though I was rooting for Drexler to get a championship with Houston since Portland could not win that year. I would guess most fans on this site feel similar to the way I do about loving the team and not just one individual player.
how can you NOT
some of the blazer players after they leave? I root for all the lovable ex blazers to do well.
We haven't done anything yet... but don't blink.
WELCOME!!!
I love learning about different perspectives and the different angles that different people view things. By all means continue to share your perspectives with us!
Also, please forgive the passionate fans that we have who are defensive over their beloved players or coaches. We all have a blind spot for those we love and some of us are more fanatical about that love than others.
We haven't done anything yet... but don't blink.
wow...that took a whole hour to read....
my thoughts…
roy is bigger than rudy. rudy may handle the ball better than roy. but rudy gambles alot with it.
roy makes calculated moves with the ball and knows what to expect from what he’s doing..kinda like he sees what is going to happen before he does what he does.
Rudy AND sergio both are a spur of the moment kinda players…not much planning in their game, other than “if there’s a hole run in it”..if I see an open man, pass it, if the back door is open ROB THEM BLIND"….there isn’t much planning in thier game…
I think that nate will learn how to get em in the groove of things…
takes time I suppose, but I do assume/notice a wee bit of anomosity building between the nationalities of the team…It’ll take a big boys hearts to get thru it if it get’s worse.
I think they’ll figure it out. I hope they’ll figure it out…
welcome and nice first post.
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out burns out farms and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
They're different
And both Roy and Rudy add delicious flavor to this team.
Rudy AND sergio both are a spur of the moment kinda players…not much planning in their game, other than "if there’s a hole run in it"..if I see an open man, pass it, if the back door is open ROB THEM BLIND"….there isn’t much planning in thier game…
They’re opportunistic. Gotta love that! Adds a nice blend. I wish the other Blazers could ALSO add a little bit of that to their game.
We haven't done anything yet... but don't blink.
but nate has already beaten it out of them....
and with rudy there’s no beating, no coaching…
it almost seems like nate let’s rudy do whatever he wants and ….well…kinda like a mother with a son, who marries a man with 2 daughters…
and the mother is the coach..
she’ll bark and reform her new daughters but never checks the son…
if that makes anysense…I’m terrible at this conveying thought thing though… :(
The Faith don't panic, the faith freaks out burns out farms and torchs small villages in the name of The Faith.
Look Roy is a great All Star no doubt...
I think that he is doing what he is told on offense. I also suspect that he has a lot of latitude in what happens in the fourth quarter and rightly so. My point about Roy and Rudy is simple: Roy don’t feel like you have to carry the team. Your surrounded by talent. Everything will change with Oden and Marty in the mix. I am not bashing Roy but it seems like his decision making abilities have shifted a little since last season. He is a stud. No question and the cornerstone of the franchise but Rudy is not just a supporting cast member and most everyone will know that soon enough. I mean Rudy is playing fantastic considering his pt in the NBA. We need their collective chemistry and while Roy is methodical and deliberate, Rudy can add the wahoo if you will!! No hard feelings Jason but I’ve been a Blazer fan for years and a Bulls fans back in the day. So I will not be going to the Indy site anytime soon. Nor that it matters to anyone. Agree to disagree and realize that my original post talked about Rudy in five years not just present terms. now. Hope that clears the air as I cannot explain it any other way. Thanks ratbastird for the props. Go Blazers!
Hilarious
That’s what all of the conversation is…
Consider this…Roy hasn’t had another stud of a guard since Nate Robinson back at UW, and at that time Nate was the pg. For those that think Roy is playing differently, he may be a little more aggressive for his shot (Nate McMillan has said that he wants Roy to take over more), but I don’t think his style of play up and changed all of a sudden. There are different pieces around Roy, so he needs time to adjust.
As for any other comments about this, just remember that Roy is #1 on this team for many reasons. Teams have leaders, Roy is our primary leader. He is a very talented player, and all-star, as well. Don’t just throw him under the bus because we now have some other players that are very good as well.
-Tyler
Oden and LaMarcus and Roy, oh my!
DaniBCN - That's a good post.
Thanks for the insight. For me, at least, it helps. I have been concerned with allot of Euro opinions about the Blazers because it seems like allot of the European Blazer fans have come to the bandwagon to follow their heroes Sergio and Rudy, and not necessarily to follow the Blazers. Some times their comments come off as being driven by an agenda to see their favorite players play, rather than letting Nate play the lineups and divide the minutes the way he thinks will give him the best chance to win. Maybe I was wrong. I would say, this team is in good hands, and Nate will get the best out of them. I’m still not sure where Sergio fits in, but Rudy is going to be a huge part of it.
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recommended FanPosts
Recent FanPosts
FanShots
Quick hits of video, photos, quotes, chats, links and lists that you find around the web.
Recommended FanShots
Recent FanShots
In Association With
Ball Don't Lie - NBA - Yahoo! Sport
- Behind the Box Score, where the Lakers absolutely melted down the stretch
- Shaving a picture of Matt Bonner in his head could net a young Spurs fan an in-school suspension
- Greg Oden wants to play for the Miami Heat
- LeBron James and Kobe Bryant on Forbes World’s Most Powerful Celebrities list
- Evan Turner loves getting his butt kicked
