Realignment of the Western Conference
I found myself counting the seconds until the game tomorrow, so even though this isn't a big concern, it gave me something to do instead of stare at the clock. I hope this provides you a few minutes of distraction.
On the eve of the season I would like to point out a structural disadvantage of Portland basketball. It's basically the only thing we can complain about these days, so I thought I would do that before we starting winning. It doesn't seem like it would be that big of a deal to rearrange the divisions after the Sonics moved. So, I'd like to present 3 alternate division makeups. Please excuse my horrid "editing" of the pictures, I just wanted to include a visual aid to go along with the distance approximations I made. The distances listed are the mean of 1 way air travel between Portland, for example, and all of its division rivals.
Current:

Northwest Division:
Portland: 1128 miles
Minnesota: 892 miles
Denver: 628 miles
Utah: 700 miles
OKC: 907 miles
Div Average: 851 miles
Noteworthy: This division features the only 2 time zone difference (Pdx-Minn and Pdx-OKC) in the league.
Southwest Division:
Houston: 379 miles
San Antonio: 392 miles
New Orleans: 410 miles
Memphis: 500 miles
Dallas: 326 miles
Div. Average: 401 miles
Pacific Division:
L.A. L*kers: 267 miles
L.A. Clippers: 267 miles
Sacramento: 367 miles
Golden State: 354 miles
Phoenix: 500 miles
Div Average: 351 miles
Alternate 1:

Pacific Division:
Portland: 671 miles
L.A. L*kers: 387 miles
L.A. Clippers: 387 miles
Golden State: 328 miles
Sacramento: 326 miles
Div. average: 419 miles
Midwest Division:
Minnesota: 728 miles
Utah: 850 miles
Denver: 600 miles
OKC: 620 miles
Memphis: 800 miles
Div. Average: 719 miles
Southwest Division:
Phoenix: 1000 miles
San Antonio: 443 miles
Dallas: 438 miles
Houston: 508 miles
New Orleans: 625 miles
Div. Average: 602 miles
Alternate 2:

Northwest Division:
Portland: 660 miles
Golden State: 548 miles
Utah: 540 miles
Denver: 818 miles
Sacramento: 520 miles
Div. Average: 617 miles
Southwest Division:
L.A. L*kers: 730 miles
L.A. Clippers: 730 miles
Phoenix: 640 miles
San Antonio: 860 miles
Houston: 1061 miles
Div. Average: 804 miles
Midwest Division:
Dallas: 468 miles
OKC: 432 miles
Memphis: 487 miles
New Orleans: 594 miles
Minnesota: 817 miles
Div. Average: 560 miles
Alternate 3:

Pacific Division:
Portland: 671 miles
L.A. L*kers: 387 miles
L.A. Clippers: 387 miles
Golden State: 328 miles
Sacramento: 326 miles
Div. average: 419 miles
Midwest Division:
Phoenix: 911 miles
Denver: 530 miles
Utah: 670 miles
Minnesota: 860 miles
OKC: 750 miles
Div. Average: 744 miles
Southwest Division:
Houston: 379 miles
San Antonio: 392 miles
New Orleans: 410 miles
Memphis: 500 miles
Dallas: 326 miles
Div. Average: 401 miles
There are plenty of other things that should be considered other than just travel distance, like divison rivalries or division names that actually describe where its teams are located, but this post doesn't need to get any larger. Does Phoenix tend to get the short end of the stick? Is it even worth the trouble to rearrange the Western conference? Thoughts?
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47
comments
Comments
Your first realignment proposal makes the most sense.
There’s a division with five teams that are actually located nearby the Pacific Ocean, a division with five teams located in states across the Southern United States, and a division with five teams throughout three different subregions of the Midwest (i.e., the Mountain West, the Upper Midwest, & the Mid-South).
by AK1984 on Oct 27, 2008 4:45 PM PDT 0 recs
I like the 2nd alternate
Because it starts another “OKC vs. Dallas” rivalry, you just can’t split those two cities up
by two4larue on Oct 27, 2008 4:56 PM PDT 0 recs
Yep.
The NW division spans two time zones, and the SW division spans three, but this is easily rectified by our Dear Leader Stern, if he simply decrees that all NBA cities in the Western Conference convert to PST / PDT during the duration of the NBA season. He should do that anyway, IMO.
… … …
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by G_dubs on
Oct 27, 2008 6:03 PM PDT
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but
But it puts five teams in Portland’s division. I like four, leaving room for an expansion team in Seattle
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by isaacjoe on
Oct 28, 2008 11:49 AM PDT
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there would be
5 teams in each division, like there is now
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by johnv59 on
Oct 28, 2008 10:42 PM PDT
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first alternate is the obvious choice
option 3 is ok too – it essentially trades us and Phoenix. Option 2 breaks up the Texas teams, which I just don’t see Stern going for at all.
Rule #1 of nitpicking is to get it right.
by douglast on Oct 27, 2008 4:58 PM PDT 0 recs
Phoenix and the Lakers will stay in one division as long as Shaq is active for the rivalry with Kobe
After that, the NBA might be open to consider alternatives. I think option 2 has no chance, the others are good with the first alternative getting my current vote. Phoenix sounds like South to me, not like Midwest.
Odenied: If you're given lemmings—make lemming-ade (Bow4Meow)
by Norsktroll on Oct 27, 2008 5:06 PM PDT 0 recs
Why can i only vote once?
I wanted to vote for alternate 3 and for your mad MS paint skills
"It's not who jumps the highest -- it's who wants it the most" Buck Williams
by Fund A Mental on Oct 27, 2008 5:11 PM PDT 0 recs
my bad
skillz
"It's not who jumps the highest -- it's who wants it the most" Buck Williams
by Fund A Mental on
Oct 27, 2008 5:11 PM PDT
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I lobby for Alt-3 whenever I get the chance.
I’m sure Norsktroll is right about Stern not wanting to separate LA and Phoenix until Shaq retires at the end of next season… or is it this season? If Stern drags his heels after that, there can be only one reason: he thinks the Sonics will rise from the ashes. If they do, maybe they should call themselves the Seattle Phoenix instead. Ha ha, that would be funny when they play the Suns. Better idea: OK moves to Seattle and Minnie moves to Boise.
"Personally, I'd rather give an elephant a prostate exam on Chili Day." --Dave on rooting for the Lakers or Celtics
by MiledAnimal on Oct 27, 2008 5:28 PM PDT 0 recs
What would also make sense is the NBA trying to create a rivalry between Dallas and OKC – and putting them in a SW division. Probably we will have to look at the bigger picture anyway, even with a team moving between East and West.
Odenied: If you're given lemmings—make lemming-ade (Bow4Meow)
by Norsktroll on
Oct 27, 2008 5:39 PM PDT
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Sooners-Longhorns
There’s a natural rivalry already. When the “Thunder” gets their act together and starts beating the Mavs, things could get interesting…
by two4larue on
Oct 28, 2008 2:17 PM PDT
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The big wild card in the equation is the Sonics.
As in, is Seattle going to replace their departed team Browns-stylee,
and if so, will it be soon? (If so, realignment should wait for that.)
And, where will their “new” team come from?
"Mister Oden is a very, very big human being." - Jerryd Bayless
by QualityPie on Oct 27, 2008 5:31 PM PDT 0 recs
Time Zones!!!
You are right I never realized that our divison spans three different time zones. Each of the other divisons in the western conference are concentrated in one time zone. With the exception with Arizona for part of the year.
by RipCityRoyCity on Oct 27, 2008 5:32 PM PDT 0 recs
I think theres a good chance memphis will move to seattle
They do have young talent, but I really doubt that those future high flying high scoring budding stars are gonna want to stay on a team that is perpetually bad and seemingly always in cost-cutting mode. I believe the team is already for sale, and the team does not do well there.
by oden is GOD OF WAR on Oct 27, 2008 5:35 PM PDT 0 recs
Although I live within a half-hour drive from Seattle, ...
it seems to me that Kansas City is a more practical landing spot for the Memphis Grizzlies.
by AK1984 on
Oct 27, 2008 7:24 PM PDT
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no, it doesn't
Seattle has is a bigger market with a history of supporting NBA basketball. The KC market is already saturated—which is why the Royals can’t compete in MLB.
--Dave
Addicted to Quack, SBN's Oregon Ducks blog
by Addicted to Quack on
Oct 28, 2008 12:17 PM PDT
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The Grizzlies return to the Pac NW?
What is this, a migratory cicadian pattern?
by two4larue on
Oct 28, 2008 2:19 PM PDT
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the one who gets stuffed..
in any alternate scenario is phoenix. they would lobby hard against all of these.
by blazersunited on Oct 27, 2008 6:44 PM PDT 0 recs
yep
--Dave
Addicted to Quack, SBN's Oregon Ducks blog
by Addicted to Quack on
Oct 28, 2008 12:17 PM PDT
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I have a problem
With the fact that we call anything east of Colorado ‘Western’.
by DonkeyShins on Oct 27, 2008 6:55 PM PDT 0 recs
The center of population is somewhere in Missouri
Memphis and New Orleans are very borderline, but it’s not that bad. Maybe a Great Plains conference is in order?
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by Magnum on
Oct 27, 2008 8:05 PM PDT
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You'd hate the East coast.
They think Cleveland is in the Mid-West.
One of Two Official Blazer's Edge Poets Laureate for the 2008-2009 Season
"In vino veritas." - Latin proverb
"Ich sitze hier und trinke mein gutes Wittenbergisch Bier und das Reich Gottes kommt von ganz alleine" - Martin Luther
"μηκέτι ὑδροπότει, ἀλλὰ οἴνῳ ὀλίγῳ χρῶ διὰ τὸν στόμαχον καὶ τὰς πυκνάς σου ἀσθενείας." - 1 Timothy 5:23
by T Darkstar on
Oct 27, 2008 8:07 PM PDT
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Yep
it’s gotta be a mentality left over from when Jefferson was president. Everything on our side of the Appalachian mountains is “the west” as if the Louisiana Purchase were still unexplored (by whites) and Ohio was ‘wild’.
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by Magnum on
Oct 27, 2008 8:11 PM PDT
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Full Realignment
You might as well considering teams flipping conferences.
If baseball could move teams from the AL to NL (Milwaukee), and Football from AFC to NFC, then basketball teams could (potentially) switch conferences.
M, period. Fresh, comma.
by manzell on Oct 27, 2008 7:10 PM PDT 0 recs
It wouldn't be a stretch to see Chicago back in the West.
They were out here once before. If we went by Geography:
West
Pacific:
Portland, Sacramento, Golden State, Lakers, Clippers
Southwest:
Phoenix, Dallas, Houston, San Antonio, Oklahoma City
Midwest:
Utah, Denver, Minnesota, Milwaukee, Chicago
East
Southeast:
New Orleans, Atlanta, Miami, Orlando, Charlotte
Northeast:
Boston, Philadelphia, New York, New Jersey, Washington
Great Lakes:
Detroit, Indiana, Toronto, Cleveland, Memphis
One of Two Official Blazer's Edge Poets Laureate for the 2008-2009 Season
"In vino veritas." - Latin proverb
"Ich sitze hier und trinke mein gutes Wittenbergisch Bier und das Reich Gottes kommt von ganz alleine" - Martin Luther
"μηκέτι ὑδροπότει, ἀλλὰ οἴνῳ ὀλίγῳ χρῶ διὰ τὸν στόμαχον καὶ τὰς πυκνάς σου ἀσθενείας." - 1 Timothy 5:23
by T Darkstar on
Oct 27, 2008 8:03 PM PDT
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for geography
take this, but move Indy to the MW, Chicago to GL, Memphis to SE, and Charlotte to NE
Rule #1 of nitpicking is to get it right.
by douglast on
Oct 27, 2008 9:33 PM PDT
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good stuff Magnum
Those maps are very helpful to understand the alternatives. And darn straight I don’t see how the NBA can avoid conference switcheroos.
Hopefully in a few years Stern will be gone and the new commish can get to work on this. Heck I’d like to get started tomorrow.
The perfect is the enemy of the good.
by fisheyes on Oct 27, 2008 7:28 PM PDT 0 recs
thanks
the maps were a big help for me when I was mulling this over. I’m especially glad they help considering how 3rd grade they look. I did my best to make the dot placements accurate though!
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by Magnum on
Oct 27, 2008 8:08 PM PDT
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is it possible we may see a conference realignment
if the west continues to be so much better than the East for much longer? The East does look to be better this year though.
by oden is GOD OF WAR on Oct 27, 2008 8:33 PM PDT 0 recs
other options
Their is continual talk about a 6-team division in Europe in 5-10 years. If you do this, you are at 36 teams, or 18 per conference (3 6-team division each). This essentially moves 3 of the “border” teams in the East into the West. chicago, Milwaukie and Indy make the most since geographically. That gives you the following:
WEST
Midwest:
Chi, Min, Mil, Ind, Mem, NO
Southwest:
Dal, SA, Hou, OKC, Uta, Den
Pacific:
LAL, LAC, Pho, Sac, GS, Por
EAST
Europe:
(6 new teams)
Northeast:
NY, Brooklyn, Bos, Tor, Cle, Det
Southeast:
Mia, Orl, Atl, Cha, Was, Phi
Rule #1 of nitpicking is to get it right.
by douglast on Oct 27, 2008 9:41 PM PDT 0 recs
I get to nitpick the nitpicker!
Typo: Milwaukee and Indy make the most sense geographically.
I’ll give you a pass on misspelling Milwaukee. And not capitalizing Chicago. And forgetting the ‘s’ on division the 2nd time is appears in your post. And for using their instead of there. But that’s it.
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by Magnum on
Oct 27, 2008 11:08 PM PDT
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Milwaukee is easy to misspell if you're from Portland
Because there happens to be a suburb with a name that is pronounced the same way but spelled differently.
by royroty on
Oct 28, 2008 8:14 AM PDT
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keeping the teams we have in the west,
and align them like this…portland,utah, golden state, sac, l.a. (take your pick)……la (the other one),pheonix and the stateoftexas(s.a, houston, dallas)…..minni denver memphis n.orleans, n the hillbillies.
(forgive me if anyone already did it like that, I didn’t really read all the comments, but I’m gonna now :))
The faith (and I'm a guy) perverts. :)
by faith on Oct 27, 2008 10:05 PM PDT 0 recs
Glad to see this Magnum
I actually have a similar experiment sitting on my desk right now. Literally almost the same as yours. I was very close to submitting it a couple times 2 weeks ago, but your presentation puts it together better than I would have.
I favor the 1st option, but the problem you run into is there’s no perfect option. Maybe that’s why I never submitted it. It’s clear we kind of get the shaft with the division we’re in right now, so a change would definitely help us. Puting all of the Pacific coast teams together is an obvious must. There was once a time when the Pacific Division was: Seattle, Portland, Sacramento, Golden State, LA. If Seatle were still around we would have a problem of 6 teams on the coast, but with them gone, the solution is obvious.
I don’t remember exactly when things got changed, or why, but what we have now is far from ideal. WHO IS OUR DIVISION RIVAL? CAN WE REALLY HAVE A RIVALRY WITH TEAMS SO FAR AWAY?
I kept on trying to keep Oklahoma together with the Texas teams, but doing so makes other areas messy.
Yep, option 1 makes the most sense. Can we get this done soon?
by GoBlazersWIN on Oct 27, 2008 10:10 PM PDT 0 recs
It's true
there is no ideal option. Some teams will still have a lot of traveling. Phoenix seems to be getting the bad end of the deal in the options I listed, especially since they have relatively little division traveling now.
One of the reasons I really don’t like the current arrangement is that Portland, OKC and Minn have to travel across 2 time zones to play a DIVISION rival. That just doesn’t make sense. Portland already has to deal with being the most ‘remote’ basketball franchise. Long distance division rivals shouldn’t be another problem.
And you’re right. How can you have a rivalry between teams that are 1000 miles apart? I don’t run into many Wolves fans here in Oregon. I could troll other teams’ conversation threads on ESPN, but the sorts of people you usually find there are L*ker fans (for example) that would argue a wall if it had a poster of Kobe looking like fool on it. Not satisfying.
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by Magnum on
Oct 27, 2008 10:47 PM PDT
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Right now the NW division is just a catch-all.
They had a bunch of teams sitting there in no man’s land in the middle of the country, and couldn’t figure out what to do with them. So they played favorites with everyone else, and put all the red-headed step-children into one division and called it the NW division. Even though most of the teams are not in the NW. Every one of the teams in the NW division actually have a team in another division who is much closer to them than most of the teams in their division.
by GoBlazersWIN on
Oct 27, 2008 11:09 PM PDT
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A few months ago
I saw something akin to this on another basketball site, but they were also switching teams between East/West. Your realignment is much more practical and really makes sense. Send it to the commish!
Things happen for a reason they say, but I say there's a reason things happen.
by sixth on Oct 27, 2008 11:10 PM PDT 0 recs
It's only fair
We have the talent. Other teams have the divisional/travel advantages. It helps them to have a remote glimmer of hope. Foolish, misplaced hope, but hope nonetheless.
The most amazing thing about my amazing ego is I have amazingly little about which to be egotistical.
The pick and roll this year will emphasize "roll" followed by "dunk", followed by the wailings and lamentations of your women.
by jscot on Oct 28, 2008 2:14 AM PDT 0 recs
the lonely west is just that
Good post though. I WAS ONLY ABLE TO WASTE 30 SECONDS HERE THOUGH. is it game time yet?
by 50backflips on Oct 28, 2008 12:52 PM PDT 0 recs
only 30 seconds?
even if you didn’t like the OP, there’s been some pretty good conversation.
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Ambassador to the Miami Heat
by Magnum on
Oct 28, 2008 2:53 PM PDT
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The third alternative
The third one makes the most sense in terms of distances to travel. Nobody averages over 1000 miles travel and the divisions are the most even in terms of distances to travel.
by boppitywop on Oct 28, 2008 1:06 PM PDT 0 recs
No point in realignment
To me this is much ado about nothing, if anything the NBA just needs to get rid of the divisions, they are meaningless in almost every way.
Teams play balanced schedules within the conference (4-5 games vs. everyone with no unbalance towards divisions).
In the playoffs, the better record gets HFA.
The only meaning left to divisions is the guarantee of the 4th seed (which is meaningless if the 5th seed gets HFA).
I say just get rid of the divisions, but they really do not matter, Portland would travel just as much regardless of the division alignment.
by warner28 on Oct 28, 2008 5:57 PM PDT 0 recs
We only played 3 games against
San Antonio, Phoenix, Memphis and the Clippers last season whereas the division opponents are always 4 games.
You’re right about there being no tangible significance to divisions vs just conferences. But if we want to keep them and add a layer of rivalries and such, why not have those divisions make sense?
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by Magnum on
Oct 28, 2008 6:21 PM PDT
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You are right, 3-4 games vs. everyone. But still pretty meaningless.
I really would prefer no divisions or 7/8 team divisions with an actual unbalanced schedule (and playoff structure that follows that formula) to the current meaningless made up divisions.
by warner28 on Oct 28, 2008 6:31 PM PDT 0 recs
First one
I like the first one. Portland can be in the same division as the Lakers, and Phoenix and San Antonio can be in the same division as well and intensify their rivalry from the recent playoff meetings.
by PABroncofan on Oct 29, 2008 7:55 AM PDT 0 recs














