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Bring back D-Miles?

Maybe the best addition for our team is already a part of the team (besides GO)

Star-divide

Now might be a good time to try to start bringing D-Miles back when we get back to portland after this tortuous road trip. we're tired and i think he's been chomping at the bit to play. he'd give the blazers another scorer who can create his own shot. Playing him along side Outlaw on the white team would give the blazers two quality slashers who can shoot. His presence would provide a different look than the blazers have with James Jones. Don't get me wrong; Jones has had a tremendous influence on this team, but he's not the athlete that Miles can be once he has fully recovered. Miles would also be able to take some of the scoring load for the second unit from Outlaw's shoulders, and probably some from Roy and Aldridge too. I'm under the impression that he's been more involved in the community over the past year. I don't think he's going to take a buyout unless it's at the full value of his contract, which would make no sense for the blazers to do for salary cap reasons. I think the new look blazers will do wonders for D-Miles maturity on the court  Plus, he wouldn't have the pressure of being a franchise-saver that he has had previously, hopefully making him more comfortable to play freely. Any thoughts?

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If it was a healthy Miles
circa 2004, I'd say yes.

I can't imagine Darius Miles, right now, being a better option than any of our SFs.

by jksnake99 on Jan 23, 2008 9:34 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

True, so call him a 5 and put him in....
.....the fricking game! Nate has fallen in love with small ball, and everyone just stands around at the 3 point line anyway. So just call Darius a center and put him in the game.

He gets into the paint as often as Channing Frye anyway...

Seriously, I hope Darius is getting close to being back. He was a 14 ppg guy when he went down, which is more than Outlaw and more than Webster and more than Jones. True fact.

t

by timbo on Jan 23, 2008 10:07 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Salary cap
Even if we buy him out for less than his full value his total salary counts against the cap for the same amount and for the same period of time as his original contract.

by jonestr on Jan 23, 2008 9:46 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Less than his full value?
Can you really "buy someone out" for negative numbers?

by rockingharder on Jan 23, 2008 11:18 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

That actually isn't true
Here's the link.

http://members.cox.net/lmcoon/salarycap.htm#60

The short version is that whatever buyout the team agrees to with the player is divided by three and that amount is counted against the salary cap for the next three seasons

by BlazersOrBust on Jan 24, 2008 5:12 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Oops, correction
Tom Penn I'm not. The buyout is divided by the length of the contract.  For example, if the player had three seasons left, the buyout would be evenly spread over three seasons against the cap.  Two seasons left, two seasons against the cap.

by BlazersOrBust on Jan 24, 2008 5:15 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Put him in
Having more options can only help us. Besides, if he shows that he can still play and he starts getting closer to his former level of play that gives him some trade value. He could even show he is more valuable than say, the buffet. Of course that isn't a likely scenario, but how likely is really anything this season?

by einman77 on Jan 23, 2008 10:33 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

His value... in cap terms
Buying him out wouldn't spare us much cap room as the buyout amount would be spread over the remaining years of his contract.

We would get some relief in that it would probably be a bit less than his current total and also, if he resigns with another team, part of what that other team pays him comes off our cap.  It still won't be much though.

The biggest benefit of buying him out wouldn't be cap space, but rather a roster spot.  We could sure use an extra one of those, however...

His greatest value to us at this point (and the reason we won't buy him out to save at least a couple bucks and get the roster spot) is because next year he will suddenly morph in to one of those super valuable "expiring contracts" that grease so many trades.

by Gargen on Jan 23, 2008 11:11 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Next year
There are going to be a lot of those. Why take one that won't help your team much at all?

by einman77 on Jan 23, 2008 11:47 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I wish this were true
"His greatest value to us at this point (and the reason we won't buy him out to save at least a couple bucks and get the roster spot) is because next year he will suddenly morph in to one of those super valuable "expiring contracts" that grease so many trades".

According to HoopsHype, Miles's contract runs through the 2009-2010 season, however "Raefer Madness" becomes expiring next season. At $12.7 mil, that will be a nice financial load to get rid of.

by t jay on Jan 24, 2008 2:09 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Who would have thought it?
Darius' agent posts diaries on BE!

If he proves in practice that he is ready to play, ready to be part of the team chemistry, and ready to play well enough to take playing time from someone else, Nate will play him.  Until then, he won't.  Simple as that.

by jscot on Jan 23, 2008 11:38 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

How to make Darius go away...
I'm not sure anyone is suggesting that Darius is going to become part of the core of this team, barring a major transformation of himself a la Damon during his late mea culpa phase.

The Blazers need to get him back, take advantage of his services briefly (he was a legitimate offensive force, may I remind you), and get him traded for value.

t

by timbo on Jan 24, 2008 9:00 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Why ruin the chemistry
by inserting a cancer?

He's already mouthing off about how he's ready to play, when quick and everyone else is saying that he's light years away from being at NBA speed.

We have excellent chemistry and rewarding a character like that is going to have adverse affects on others.

"No way. I love this town. We're gonna bring back the glory years. These boys are my boys. This is my team and my town." - Greg Oden when asked about leaving.

by ratbastird on Jan 24, 2008 9:29 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Agree 100%
It's going to take a lot of showcasing to get anybody, even IT or McHale, to believe that Miles still has something left in the tank desire- and physical-wise.  I don't want those minutes to come at the expense of any of our young guys or our fledging and ever-strengthening chemistry, and I would rather we eat Miles' contract and let him walk than try to reestablish his value. Simple as that.

by BlazersOrBust on Jan 24, 2008 9:32 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Dude, he has no value
He's 26 years old, coming off major knee surgery, and has't played basketball in two years.  Even when he did play he had major question marks surrounding him.

You're living in a dream world if you think anyone will ever trade for Darius Miles.

by leeroyjenkins on Jan 24, 2008 9:38 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Ugh
Darius.  You guys are nuts.

by leeroyjenkins on Jan 24, 2008 6:38 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

Nope
Unless Blazers suffer through injuries and they need players, Miles won't see playing time as a Blazer.  If they had a plan to make him part of this team, they would be giving updates on his status and setting target dates for his progression back onto the court and basically keeping the fans aware of him.

This is the way Miles' career as a Blazer ends, not with a bang but a whimper.

by tssbro on Jan 24, 2008 6:41 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

Is Portland hosting an idiot's convention?
First somebody says we need to start playing Miles and then someone seems to seriously suggest that the Randolph trade was a mistake.

Who are you guys?  Former smoking buddies of Sheed, Zach and Darius?

by timg56 on Jan 24, 2008 7:48 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

Don't get too high, don't get too low...
First off -- my comment that "the Randolph trade doesn't look quite as good as it did a couple weeks ago" (paraphrasing myself).

We got nothing out of Steve Francis' one day presence on the Blazers' roster, however long he was "officially" a Blazer. That was just loading $21 million in a wheelbarrow and dumping it down the sewer.

The primary player who came over, Channing Frye, is a nice guy who is physically and stylistically unsuited to banging with the big boys low. He is, frankly, a 3 trapped in the body of a 4.

Maybe getting James Jones was part and parcel of that deal, I still don't understand how they got him -- but regardless, trading a 20-10 starting power forward for a rather inadequate 8th man off the bench doesn't seem like such a bright idea to me. That's the BEST that could be done?!?!

Now, as for Darius. I understand chemistry. I understand that he can be a petulant twit. BUT, he was a 14 ppg guy, the #2 guy after Randolph, a starter, a former lottery pick. They are paying the man -- get him back on the floor, get him in some games, and then TRADE HIS ASS FOR VALUE.

The Blazers, pretty clearly, have been angling for him to retire so that they can collect an insurance policy on his contract. Well, the man is only like 27 years old -- HE'S NOT READY TO RETIRE. That stupid strategy of a news blackout on his progress and hoping that he will be a good boy and roll over for them needs to be ditched yesterday. It has been 14 months since his surgery. They need to get him back NOW if he's capable of coming back this year, prove to other GMs that he can run and jump, and then make him go away.

My opinion.

And this has nothing to do with Hashweed or Bonzo or any other member of that motley crew. It's a specific situation that is being mishandled.

t

by timbo on Jan 24, 2008 8:51 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

you keep forgetting Rudy
the trade exception for James Jones helped us also aquire Rudy, and that shouldn't be overlooked.
"No way. I love this town. We're gonna bring back the glory years. These boys are my boys. This is my team and my town." - Greg Oden when asked about leaving.

by ratbastird on Jan 24, 2008 9:27 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Eurotrash rocks!
No kidding, that Rudy dude has made a ton of clutch shots on the road. I like his game- when I'm in my flying car, I usually turn off the news reports (what's up with all that world peace?) and watch sports highlight reels of him dunking over Shaq.

by fri2219 on Jan 24, 2008 10:56 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

That money
paid to Francis ($30 million, I believe) wasn't really dumped down the sewer.  I know what you're saying -- but number one, it did create for us a little bit of salary cap space, about 3.5 million spread over two seasons.  But two, and more importantly, it got the Blazers and Allen out from under the millstone of Randolph's onerous 4-year, nearly-$60-million contract.  Looking at it that way, it saved PA around $30 million bucks, which even for a billionaire is nice pocket change.

I actually don't think Randolph for Frye and Francis was the best that KP could have done; I think that he was fed up with Z-bo's nonsense and wanted to communicate unequivocally that such behavior would not longer be tolerated by the organization.  But give KP the benefit of the doubt -- how many wrong moves has the guy made?  If he couldn't swing a better deal, it might just be a sign of how low Randolph's stock was around the NBA after last season.  Looking at his performance in New York thus far, it's hard to disagree with their collective assessment.

by BlazersOrBust on Jan 24, 2008 9:28 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Thanks
for pointing out another factor as to why that was a good trade.

Really though, just look at this team.  WE love this team.  Most of us love it more minus Zach.  Not only that, the blazers are talking play-offs this year.

We're winning, so how could anyone call the zach trade bad?  We were NOT winning with him.

"No way. I love this town. We're gonna bring back the glory years. These boys are my boys. This is my team and my town." - Greg Oden when asked about leaving.

by ratbastird on Jan 24, 2008 9:33 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Zach's Defense
You really oughta take a few moments and read what the East Coast writers are saying about Randolph before you claim the trade was a bust or whatever it is you're claiming.  I actually read Zach's D described as "comical" by some writer the other day.

by leeroyjenkins on Jan 24, 2008 9:43 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

because being 17-25
was so much more enjoyable than competing for the playoffs. That was our record at this time last year. We stunk.

Mind you that LMA would have been stuck coming off the bench or playing out of position at the 5, and how many touches would he, Roy, Webster, and Outlaw get with him here.

I don't see ANY downside to that trade at this time, though I was skeptical at the time. It was a brave move that has paid off BIG TIME.

And Z still won't be an All-Star.

Can you smell what the Pritch is cooking?

by you'vegottomakeyourfreethrows on Jan 24, 2008 10:25 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

The problem - as I see it - with your argument
is many fold.

  1. An assumption Pritchard could have gotten a better deal.  How do you know that?  One almost has to assume that at least a few GM's out there are not very capable - i.e. they don't look past the 20 -10 stat line - to believe a better deal was out there.  Things like poor defense and a high dollar contract with 4 more years aren't worth thinking about.

  2. Forgetting about the positive benefits from substracting Zach from the mix or the fact at least one prominant member of the team asked management if Zach could be moved.

  3. Jumping to conclusions with regard to Frye.  Read Dave's interview with the Blazer's scout.  He says the organization looks for long, athletic power forwards - which seems to be a pretty good description of Frye.  Granted there is more than one successful management philosophy, but if I had to choose, I think I'll go with Pritchard's than whatever your's might be.

  4. An apparent fixation on scoring average.  It doesn't matter if Miles averaged 14 pts or 24 pts per game when he last played.  What matters is what he can do now and whether he can fit in with this team.  Right now there is zero evidence that Miles is ready to play at all, let alone contribute double digit scoring off the bench within the context of this team's play.

  5. Something like 80% of Miles contract, at least for this year, get's picked up by insurance if he misses more than 47 consecutive games.  Even if he's close enough to being in shape to play for the past 2 - 3 weeks, do you really think Portland is so dumb they can't do simple arithmetic?  Once they got within 10 games of that figure, you could guarantee Miles would be on the inactive list until that milestone was past.

  6. Believing that Kevin Pritchard, Nate McMillan and the rest of the Blazer management team either do not have the best interests of the team as their number one focus or that they are not competent at what they do.  If Miles was capable of helping this team win games, both right now and down the road, don't you think he'd be playing?  Thinking that his situation is being mishandled is akin to saying you don't think Pritchard and Nate really know what they are doing.

by timg56 on Jan 24, 2008 11:45 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Classic
"Granted there is more than one successful management philosophy, but if I had to choose, I think I'll go with Pritchard's than whatever your's might be."

Equal parts harsh and hilarious.

by BlazersOrBust on Jan 24, 2008 12:07 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Then I was only half successful.
I was trying not to be harsh.  In fact I apologize for the idiot convention comment in my original response.

by timg56 on Jan 25, 2008 6:48 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

BING! BING! BING!!!
We have a winner!!!

>>Something like 80% of Miles contract, at least for this year, get's picked up by insurance if he misses more than 47 consecutive games.

Assuming you're not making stuff up, THIS would explain the obviously coordinated information black hole surrounding Miles' rehab and the abject failure of Blazers management to try to "rehabilitate" his personality and get him back into good graces with the fans.

To trade him, they will first have to play him; they can't play him for another couple weeks without losing $6.5 million insurance dollars. Assuming, I reiterate, that you know of what you speak.

t

by timbo on Jan 24, 2008 2:50 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

He has to retire voluntarily
So far Darius doesn't seem to be on the same page with that.  

by leeroyjenkins on Jan 24, 2008 2:54 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Here's the scoop
http://www.portlandtribune.com/sports/story.php?story_id=117676745242986300

The enigmatic Miles, also 25, sat out the season after microfracture knee surgery and spent little time around his teammates. The 6-9 small forward is working with a trainer and says his goal is to be ready for training camp. No team would be interested in acquiring Miles, who is owed $26.25 million over the next three years.

If Miles can't make it back and doesn't play again, an insurance policy could kick in at the end of the 2007-08 season and cover the final two years of his contract. If Miles were to retire -- and it's the player's choice, not the club's -- his deal would go off Portland's salary-cap figures. But if he came back and played within that two-year span, his numbers would go back on the Blazers' cap.

by leeroyjenkins on Jan 24, 2008 3:00 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Yes, I read that...
Yes, I remember reading that. It has been obvious that this is what the Blazers WANT to happen. Problem is, the guy wants to play basketball.

Now, can you confirm or deny the bit about the team recovering 80% of salary if he doesn't play 47 straight games?

t

by timbo on Jan 24, 2008 3:09 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Question authority.
>>Thinking that his situation is being mishandled is akin to saying you don't think Pritchard and Nate really know what they are doing.

The road from blind faith to abject disbelief is but a short one. I give you that Kevin Pritchard is a GM genius, I do not give you that he is infallible. He certainly wasn't infallible as a coach, ha ha.

Darius' recovery is the subject of a coordinated news blackout. WHY?

Darius can not be traded until he is rehabbed and plays some games. It has been 14 months since surgery... WHAT IS HIS RECOVERY STATUS? WHEN WILL BE BE PLAYED?

I presume this: trading a $25 million contract for a needed player is better than eating a $25 million contract from an unwanted player.

t

by timbo on Jan 24, 2008 3:06 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Oh man
The emergence of you and Amlmart1 in the last two weeks has made for some entertaining copy.  That "coordinated news blackout" business is like something straight out of Team Bush's playbook: you planted that speculation yourself earlier, either in this thread or another one (I forget), now state it as if it's fact a couple of times, and wait for other people to pick it up and run with it. You're like Mulder and Scully, straight down to the "question authority" title, with a hint of Karl Rove thrown in.

Second, and incidentally, Pritch wasn't trying to win games as a coach. The season had fallen into a Mariana's Trench-sized abyss, and all he was trying to do at that point was evaluate talent for the future, probably with a whisper in his ear that he was the heir apparent at the GM spot.  To somehow link his brief coaching stint to second-guessing of his personnel decisions is disingenous.

by BlazersOrBust on Jan 24, 2008 4:29 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

It's 10 pm - Do you know where your Dr. Darius is?
Hmmmm, nothing different about the way the Blazers are treating Darius' rehab and Oden's rehab, right?

They're saying nothing.

Nate's made about one comment, negative in tone, through clenched teeth.

The Blazers broadcasters (team employees) have said nothing.

The Oregonian has reported nothing.

If there's no conspiracy of silence, it certainly looks like one.

You're right -- probably nothing to it.

So LET'S HEAR SOME NEWS ALREADY!!!

t

by timbo on Jan 24, 2008 4:49 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Glad to help...
>>The emergence of you and Amlmart1 in the last two weeks has made for some entertaining copy.

No charge!

t

by timbo on Jan 24, 2008 4:52 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

It could be said that all faith is blind.
It's part of the definition - believing in something that you can't necessarily prove as fact, reach out and touch or see with your own eyes.

When discussing the Blazers few of us have any first hand knowledge of what happens within the organization or insider information as to the workings of Blazer management.  We have to take a lot on faith and believe in what they are doing.  At least when the evidence that we can see - talented, likeable players and most of all winning basketball - tells us it is working.  

At this point there is little reason to believe that Kevin Pritchard and Nate McMillan do not know what they are doing, or that the odds are good they are making any major mistakes.  Granted they could be and we wouldn't know about it until after the fact.  But it is my opinion they've at least earned a suspension of our doubt, if not absolute faith.

by timg56 on Jan 25, 2008 7:05 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah, but...
....I'm an atheist.

t

by timbo on Jan 25, 2008 9:44 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Darius' path back
  1. Don't get anywhere near trouble.
  2. Work your rear end off in practice and whatever the physiotherapists/strength/conditioning people tell you to do.
  3. Recognize you won't be allowed to mess up chemistry this year.
  4. Go to summer league and play like a man among boys, but within a team concept.
  5. Show up for the unofficial early training camp and play like you want it more than you've ever wanted anything before.

Do that, and demonstrate in the process that you are good enough, and Nate will give you some playing time in exhibition games, and you'll have your chance to prove you belong.  And if you succeed, most fans will be pleased that you've reformed yourself and earned your way back.  Maybe you'll still end up being traded, but you'll always be able to hold your head high.

by jscot on Jan 24, 2008 9:49 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

Huhh ?
   "--- but regardless, trading a 20-10 starting
power forward for a rather inadequate 8th man off
the bench dosen't sound like such a bright move to me. That's the BEST that could be done ?!?!"
    Sorry we traded you Zach. Why are you or your
agent still unhappy ? You got out of Portland before you ended up in jail and got to Broadway.
Are you upset at these young Blazers because they
have come together as a TEAM ? You are a fantastic scorer. Even willing and able to score with two or three defenders on you. You are also
great at throwing your shot up and following to
make sure of the bucket. Excellent. The shooter
usually has the best read on the direction that
missed shot will rebound, so nice padding.
    To bad the game isn't about offense only, or
you might be a Hall of Famer. Oh I forgot that
they don't put gangsta wannabees in the Hall of Fame based on scoring. You actually have to play some defense, pass efficiently and help your
team win games. Well I guess your skill set isn't
translating into wins on the train wreck you
play for now.
    We'll keep our "rather inadequate 8th man",
the veteran "Team player" (James Jones), cap
space in summer of 2009 and our soon to be
Euro gunner that we got for SUBTRACTING you from
our roster. Oh, and our current starting PF is
having a pretty good year and will continue to
improve, while actually playing some defense and
running the court.
    Go back to your "hoops family" and the strip club, and stay off the grid.
It's GO time !

by walkoff41 on Jan 24, 2008 2:44 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Reference was to Channing Frye, actually...
>>We'll keep our "rather inadequate 8th man",
the veteran "Team player" (James Jones),

Ummm, maybe I counted wrong.

Okay, we got a "rather inadequate NINTH man off the bench."

I stand corrected.

t

by timbo on Jan 24, 2008 2:52 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

My purpose for this diary
Was to stimulate conversation about a player buried on our bench who has contributed previously. A few things i'd like to point out:

-that some of those who responded hold the belief that people can't change. What if darius can buy into the team concept? It seems like this idea is rarely entertained.

-darius is still pretty young. 26 is not well advanced even in basketball terms. look at chauncey billups, ray allen, allen iverson, all guys 30+ who are playing pretty darn good ball right now (iverson is having a career year and this is his 12th season)

-the human brain does not finish developing until around age 25. The last part of the brain to develop is the frontal lobe, where judgement, reasoning skills, and emotional control all reside. This is not an excuse for the behavior of Z-Bo or Darius, but when you have millions of dollars, developing judgement, and bad influences, you're gonna probably behave impulsively at some point. I'm not going to make a political point about the incarceration of 18 year olds in adult facilities, but this is something to consider when thinking about the bad behavior of some athletes, and young adults in general, Darius included.

I understand that darius ever playing for this team again is a long shot, especially considering the cap relief which we can get if he retires and the insurance which will pay his salary. We are fast approaching the 47 consecutive DNPs for the 80% kicker. I wanted to stimulate conversation, not be called a moron.

Oden=2009 ROY

by berrygraham on Jan 25, 2008 3:38 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

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