Oden vs. Durant

by berrygraham on May 31, 2007 6:20 PM PDT Comment 49 comments

Who do we pick? I think it's an obvious choice...

I think that this debate regarding whom the blazers should select is ridiculous. The choice is obvious: Greg Oden. Not only is the guy a man-child, but he has a great character. I mean, watching the brief interview with him during the McDonald's All-Star game was so telling. He speaks honestly of school coming naturally while basketball was difficult. He reminds me so much of Tim Duncan, with a similar quiet but intense demeanor. Oden will improve our defense so much more than Durant it's not even funny. Having a mobile big man who can patrol the lane, step out on guys like Nowitzki and Okur while still being able to move with them, and keep little guys like Nash and Parker out of the lane, all of these will improve our defense. How many times during the Suns/Spurs series did Nash drive to the hoop, only to circle out again because of the forest of big guys. With Duncan and Robinson formerly and Oberto/Elson now, it's like the Spurs start two centers, even though duncan's listed as a PF. With LMA and Oden, we'd have our Redwoods in the lane. Additionally, guys like Oden come along, oh, never! He has the potential to be one of the 10 best centers of all time, and bring rip city back from the nursing home. I'm sure Durant will be a great great wing, but how many more wings are there than great centers. I don't really want to be searching for more Ha's or Jake Voskhul's in the second round (i know, not possessives, but oh well). Another thing that scares me about durant is his body type. I know he's only 18, but he has such a slim frame. He reminds me of having a body too much like Rip Hamilton, one to which he won't be able to add enough muscle so as to take the punishment that he will with his inside game.

I hope my point is clear enough. I would also like to see the blazers pick up Jeff Green if possible. I think he'd be the sort of glue guy we need going forward. I mean, i sort of equate green with my favorite blazer of all time, Buck Williams, a guy who'd be willing to do the little things we need (rebound, play solid d, move the ball) and score without needing the ball in his hands every time down the floor. Even if we don't get him, I think that we should make a big push to get Rashard in a sign and trade with the Sonics. He'd provide us with a guy who really can score at will, could improve our rebounding and 3 point shooting, and isn't known as the same sort of cancer as Z-Bo has been.

Addressing the conley rumours, I seriously would like to see the blazers make a push to pick him up. I like JJ, but he disappeared at times last year, and, contrary to what some of you think, he DOES NOT score at will. If he's confident, he can work for his shot off the dribble or move to get open. But when he's not confident, It's ugly. I like sergio, but I think he's at least a year away. Oden and Conley have such chemistry, and i think they'd provide a great center for the team. I think also it would change the dynamics of the team used to being dominated by Z-Bo.

This is way more than I thought i'd write, but i've been totally engrossed with how to make the blazers better since the end of the season. KP, if you read this and you have some internship positions availible, please let me know. I'm young, love the blazers, bright (latin/greek double major), and a hard worker. Just kidding.

Go Blazers. Bring back the Shonz.

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im in the oden camp

because I think we could easily have a dynasty in the making, and it would be much easier.

Welcome Greg Oden

by junit3123 on May 31, 2007 6:31 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

On the demeanor/presence thing:

I've found it helpful to compare Oden not to other basketball players (Duncan, Russell, et c.),
but to some non-basketball entities--four so far, two people, two groups of people.
Here they are, listed in the order of which I thought of them:

John Coltrane, saxophone player
Lawrence Taylor, NFL linebacker
Black Sabbath, early heavy metal band
Russia, vast impenetrable Eurasion nation

Blazers have a five-on-three...and they pull it back and wait for help.

by QualityPie on May 31, 2007 6:50 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Dang QP.

Nice effort drawing analogies of Oden to Coltrane AND Sabbath.....rather impressive. I would've chosen one or the other, but I see your point & I hope it's completely accurate.

As for berrygraham, I totally agree.

BRING BACK THE SCHONZ! This could be the year, and no better voice is applicable to the Blazers' culture (to borrow a KP term) and history.

I miss Bill Schonley's presence.

'Nuff said.

I wonder how many times I'm gonna end up blowing my voice out at the Blazer games next season?

by patrickroy on May 31, 2007 6:57 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Shonz...

Yeah dude, i love the Shonz. Don't get me wrong, Wheels has done a great job, but I was rip city, lickety-brindle up the middle, and all the rest ringing in my ears as i catch as many games as i can via NBA.com (I'm going to school in DC). BBBBLAZERS ROCK!

by berrygraham on May 31, 2007 7:47 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Schonz

Oh please, great basketball gods. Keep us saddled with the remainder of Z-Bo's contract, maybe even Miles' too. Anything but bringing back that awful windbag Schonely!
Please, not while so much is looking up for basketball fans in this town.
Yes, yes, (most) Portlanders love him. He loved the team and he had his little catchphrases, sure. But as a play-by-play broadcaster he was an obvious mediocrity. Listening to him was entertaining -- if, and only if, you didn't actually care to have any idea what was happening on the court or where. He called the games with no visual sense whatsoever.
One of his habitual things that drove me crazy was saying things such as, "Drexler to Porter, guard to guard exchange."
If I know the roster at all, I know they're both guards! And even if I didn't, what useful info would that give me in the moment?? Tell me where on the bloody court the action is happening so I can visualize it! That's supposed to be the whole point of play-by-play! Not wasting time with "lickety-brindle" and "climbs the golden ladder" and all that.
Now, if Bill King was still alive, THAT guy knew how to call a game!

by hugs on May 31, 2007 11:40 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Wow that is harsh

I grew up listening to Schonley and I have great memories of Blazer games I listened to. He brought the characters of the game to life. He declined with age and I think people who didn't grow up with him, Allen and Whitset, couldn't let it go because they didn't have the connection to him that Blazer fans did; thus the disconnect with fans that lead to the past few years of frustration on both sides.

But that is the past. Wheelers all good.

by tssbro on May 31, 2007 11:59 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Schonz is probably too old these days

to do a full play-by-play schedule. His command of the game had deteriorated noticeably in his last couple of years behind the mike.

Much like the great baseball play-by-play man, Harry Caray. If you heard him in the last few seasons before he died, you would wonder why anyone wanted to listen to such a senile old fart.

But if you are old enough... you remember both men before they started to decline. Caray and the Schonz, at the primes of their career, were simply among the best in the business at calling their sport. In basketball, the greatest radio play-by-play men to ever wear headphones are, in no particular order, Chick Hearn, Johnny Most, and the Schonz. Hearn and Most are no longer with us, but we should be fortunate that the Schonz remains alive and well.

So show some respect, you young whippersnapper. :)

by EngineerScotty on Jun 1, 2007 10:21 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Oden

Agree on Oden. He fits perfectly on the Sonics, so why let him go there?

Also, is there anyone reliable who would put money on the Blazers taking Durant? I'd be very curious to see the Oden/Durant vegas line. My guess is that it's somewhere around 80% that we take Oden. Anyone feel differently?

If KP takes Oden and Durant ends up better, he'll have blown with the prevailing winds and his career will be fine. If he takes Durant and Oden dominates, he'll be the butt of jokes and wrath for all time.

I agree with your point about hunting for a center. I don't want to be one of those teams (cough...sonics...cough) that churns through every 7 foot stiff they can get their hands on in hopes of being able to D-up Oden. Let that be Seattle's gig for the next 10 years, not ours.

If the Blazers do the Zach to Bulls deal, at least one of Conley, Green, and Brewer will probably fall to #9...

by Engineering Problem on May 31, 2007 7:06 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

One thought

I don't think KP should base his decision on this but I'm weary of the inevitable media criticism the Blazers will get if we pick Durant.

I mean can you imagine a month where Durant has a Adam Morrison-esque stretch of shooting while Oden is absolutley dominating? I know the opposite could be true but I'm sure not looking forward to moron columnists trashing the Blazers and invoking memories of the 84 draft without any context.

Again I'm not suggesting we should draft Oden just to avoid criticism but it's something to think about for us fans.

If this was a gameshow I see Oden as the safe prize like a car and Durant as the mystery box. We're happy with a car but can we avoid the temptation of the mystery box, which could either be 50 million dollars or a pack of mentos.

by jayseyfield on May 31, 2007 8:03 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Oden as a Safe Pick...

I don't understand everyone thinking that Oden is the safe pick. Wasn't Bowie supposed to be a safe pick too? No one knew that his knees were going to be so bad. I think the only reason people are saying that he's the "safe" pick is because of the saying that 'big men win championships.' In light of this saying, of course Oden is the safe pick. I mean, insofar as injury history goes, Oden is the bigger risk with the wrist injury, whereas Durant has never had a major injury. I mean, look at what Oden did having to play all year with just one arm, and his weak arm at that! I also think that Oden has the temperment where he doesn't mind playing in a small market like Portland. With the so-called 'drive' that Durant has which is what KP is reported to really like, I would think that he'd have the ego to go with the drive, not so much à la Kobe, but you get the idea. And if you look at Brandon Roy's attitude and how KP is really using him as a marketing tool, you can't help but think that Oden would be the better fit with our new 'culture.' ODEN BABY ODEN!!!!

Please KP, Give Portland a little bit of Oden...

by berrygraham on May 31, 2007 8:33 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'm an Oden guy ...

but I think you underestimate Durant. Sure he's slim, but some reports I've heard have him doing 500 pushups and 2000 leg raises a day since he was 12. He's got some mean wiry strength in that body--and there's nothing wrong with being slim with his kind of game. He can post the block against smaller players, but he's going to be a bombs away slasher, and a darn good one at that. I could easily see him averaging 30+ ppg in the near future--say by his 4th year. And he's no slouch on defense, either. He averaged 2 blocks and over 10 rebounds in college--often outhustling the entire opposing team to the offensive glass. We could certainly use a little more of that fire down below in our club ...

That said, I'm definitely an Oden guy. For all the reasons already stated, I think he's the right choice. When Roy and Aldridge and Webster and Jack mature a little more, this franchise will not be lacking for scoring. In fact, I'd be worried about getting all those guys enough shots with Durant around. And defense is what gets you to the finals. Most teams in the league can score--it's those who can stop the other team from scoring that win championships. With Oden, that task becomes much easier ...

by bfan on May 31, 2007 8:36 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

RE: Durant's Work Out Stats

It's easy to do push ups when you weigh 104 lbs. By the way, check out this video of Oden dominating Durant. I'd wear a bag over my head if we picked durant after watching this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1xEtSZof7zk

I mean, I do appreciate Durant's talents, but how many times have we heard of young wings going to be "the next michael jordan"? Wasn't Darius supposed to be amazing? We already have two guys in the league vying for Michael's title: Lebron and Kobe. If Durant can enter that equation, I think it's great, but he's entering tough territory. Can't teach size, baby.

Please KP, Give Portland a little bit of Oden...

by berrygraham on May 31, 2007 8:50 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

This topic is seriously getting ridiculous

but can we at least try to not talk out our asses? Durant got dominated in the one game that actually had both players on the court at the same time? The 2005 McDonald's game where Durant shared MVP honors with Budinger, with a stat line of 25 pts 5 rebs 4 dimes, 2 steals, on 10-17 shooting in 18 minutes? The game where Oden went 10/5/4, and by the way, Oden's team lost?

by howlingfantods on May 31, 2007 9:14 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

So..

...you're saying you want durant? The next jordan? The next bust? Durant, MVP of a game with no defense. Where Chase Budinger was MVP with 11 points and 4 assists? And that's worthy of a co-MVP? No no, you're right, i didn't know what I was referring to with the McDonald's game. But how many teams won championships with dominant wings?

Please KP, Give Portland a little bit of Oden...

by berrygraham on May 31, 2007 9:30 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Teams that won with dominant wings

Isiah's Pistons, Bird's Celtics, Jordan's Bulls, Magic's Lakers (it stopped being Kareem's Lakers at least by the 87 and 88 teams, arguably the 85 team as well), the 04 Pistons (a mishmash of good wings instead of one dominant one), the DJ Sonics, the Havlicek Celts, the Rick Barry Warriors.

by howlingfantods on May 31, 2007 9:38 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Well...

Touché. However, here's something to chew on: Pistons had lambeer, rodman, bird celtics had walton, parrish, McHale, magic had kareem, rambis, ac green, 04 pistons had ben wallace and rasheed, DJ sonics had sikma, silas, lagarde, Rick Barry Warriors had george johnson and cliff ray.

Please KP, Give Portland a little bit of Oden...

by berrygraham on Jun 1, 2007 7:45 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Um, and the relevance of that is?

You mean winning teams usually have some good players other than just their one star? wow, that's a shock.

by howlingfantods on Jun 1, 2007 8:43 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

inside presence.

no, it was only to point out that those teams had a pretty decent inside presense, many of the hall of famers in their own right. your reading skillz impress me.

Please KP, Give Portland a little bit of Oden...

by berrygraham on Jun 1, 2007 9:29 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Your original argument

was that you have to have a dominant center to compete for a championship, I pointed out that many many teams have won without a dominant center, now your response is that those teams with dominant wings also had good interior players.

Ok, so we can get Durant and also seek good but not great interior players and compete for championships, and your original argument is completely mooted. That's why I question the relevance of the comment; for you to say that those wing-dominated teams have other decent players doesn't have any relevance to the question of Durant vs. Oden, it just indicates that no matter what, we need to surround those players with other quality players. Duh.

by howlingfantods on Jun 1, 2007 10:25 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Oh, and "can't teach size"

Durant - 6/9.5, 219 at 18 years old, 7/5 wingspan
LaMarcus - 6/10, 234 at 20 years old, 7/5 wingspan (measurements from last year's predraft camp)

If LaMarcus is a "big", how is Durant a "small"?

by howlingfantods on Jun 1, 2007 10:34 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I certainly...

think that my comment definitely relates to the aforementioned discussion. A number of the teams you mentioned has not just good interior players, but great. Though the NBA may be entering an era where smaller, quicker players dominate, I think that Size matters more. The NBA is now on the tail end of an era where size mattered more. During the late '80's and '90's, the NBA was dominated by smaller players. Ewing, Olajuwon were great, but I think a step down from guys like Duncan and Shaq. You can think i'm wrong, which is totally fine.

In re. Durant's size, have you seen the guy!? He's like Rip Hamilton plus a few inches. Rip might even have bigger biceps than this guy. One of the biggest reasons why Lebron has played well is because he's built like a Tight End, bigger even. He's like the Shaq of small forwards. Durant, skilled as he maybe, will have a hard time guarding a guy like that, regardless of his length. Your agonistic spirit wears thin.

Please KP, Give Portland a little bit of Oden...

by berrygraham on Jun 1, 2007 10:50 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Disagree.

Last I checked Hamilton is pretty effective. There's more to playing than biceps--unless you're Dale Davis.
I don't see how Durant will have trouble guarding other forwards. He's taller, has longer arms, and in many cases will be quicker. I think he will be a VERY good perimeter defender. It's not like Lebron is going to run over him. That would be an offensive foul. His size and agility will also help him lead the league in rebounds for his position.
For the same reasons, opposing players will have a VERY hard time guarding him. For defenders who are shorter than him, he will simply post them up or jump over them. For defenders who are slower than him, he will simply go around them. I remember a game this last season where Durant nearly put up 30 against Kansas--a very good defensive team--IN THE FIRST HALF! Do you know who was guarding him most of the time? Julian Wright--another top flight SF in this draft--likely a top #10 pick. Durant just made him look absolutely SILLY! He shot over him, he drove around him, he posted him up. Now, if he's that far ahead of his peers right now at age 18 (Wright is 20), don't you think he'll continue to improve and still be better than the competition with one or two years of seasoning in the NBA?
I think you mean "antagonistic," not "agonistic."
Most of Blazer Nation seems to think we should draft Oden--me included. But nobody--save you--is disparaging Durant's size or skills. The fact is, he's going to be a beast of a player--one of the most dominant the game has seen. Once again, I'm a little embarrassed for you that you've taken this stance. But it is what it is. As for me, I hope we get Oden, but I'll be thrilled if we get Durant.

by bfan on Jun 1, 2007 1:24 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Glad i got your hackles up...

...but is there any better place to argue than the internet? I mean, both will be great players, and I wanted to make my case, strongly in fact, for drafting Oden. One way of making a case in Rhetoric is through disparaging all other options but your own argument. And that's the way i did it. And yes, i did mean 'agonistic' not 'antagonistic.' 'Agon' is the greek word for 'contest' and i made it into an adjective in english. I appreciate the help with my word choice, but I don't need it. I wasn't making this a contest, but merely stating my point of view. I didn't mean to hurt your feelings. I'm sorry.

Please KP, Give Portland a little bit of Oden...

by berrygraham on Jun 2, 2007 10:25 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Tone it down, guys

I'm undecided. Either guy is gonna be a player.

And yer argumenting is getting a bit to argumentative-like.

by EngineerScotty on Jun 1, 2007 10:26 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yeah, I'm sorry bout that

Even though I'm in the pro-Oden camp, I have to admit I have a huge mancrush on Durant, and I'm seriously terrified of watching him destroy the league and especially us if we pick Oden. Seeing uninformed stuff about how Oden "dominated" Durant and how we need to cover our heads if we draft him made me see red a bit I guess.

Out of this thread, my apologies.

by howlingfantods on Jun 1, 2007 10:53 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Agreed.

As I have said elsewhere, I think we should take Oden. But it would please me VERY much to watch Durant shred the league in a Blazer uniform. The mere thought of it gives me chills. I think the Blazers would still compete for a championship if they took Durant, but I almost feel like it would be worth it even if they didn't.

by bfan on Jun 1, 2007 1:28 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

And I've been on the record

as marginally a pro-oden guy since the night of the lottery, but I'm sick of seeing these comments that seem to be kind of lacking in any grounding in sufficient familiarity with the two prospects, but asserted as if these opinions were bedrock fact.

by howlingfantods on May 31, 2007 9:39 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

You'd wear a bag on your head if you ...

got blocked by Greg Oden? I'm not seeing how 1 block counts as domination. And wasn't Durant the MVP of that game? And Durant is currently listed as 225 pounds at DraftExpress. Not 104. Perhaps he weighed 104 when he was 12 (though I doubt it), but even so, I don't know any 12-year-olds with the drive to do that every day. And are you're insinuating that he's not doing more than that now?

I don't think anybody is calling Durant the next Michael Jordan. In fact, everyone is saying he is a completely unique player with his combination of size, athleticism, and shooting ability, the likes of which the NBA has never seen. (And please don't compare him to Darius. That's just silly. How many centers and big men has the league seen never live up to their hype? Olowakandi anyone? This argument simply holds no water when talking about Oden and Durant. They are simply different players who will both be two of the greatest to have ever played the game.)

Like I said earlier, I'm an Oden guy, but to just throw Durant to the curb like this is a little naive. In fact, I think I'm a little embarrassed for you that you're even trying to back up this argument. Durant was the most dominating player in ALL of NCAA basketball last year. I would be thrilled to have him, even though I think Oden is the right choice.

by bfan on Jun 1, 2007 6:48 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Remember when Hollywood...

dunked over Hakeem? Man, I'm glad we got Robinson instead of Olajuwan.

by ken on Jun 1, 2007 7:02 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Durant...

weighs 225, not 104? Jeez, my bad. Not like i was being sarcastic or anything. Nothing is guaranteed.
And I know that big men can be just as big a bust as a wing. See above Jake Voskhul comment. I'm not throwing Durant to the curb, but I think the right choice is Oden. Also, I would like to point out that just because Durant dominated in college, he's going to dominate in the NBA. I don't know if anyone who has commented on this has ever played college ball, but one of my closest friends played D-I ball for OSU, and he said that the games weren't much better than High School games, aside from the few guys that were just dominant. Well, I'm glad to see my post has stoked a few fires out there. I should do this more often. Get the experts to really weigh in on what counts, because this is so much more important than, say, Darfur or anything. Serious question: does anyone feel guilty for spending so much time thinking about basketball as opposed to anything more important?

Please KP, Give Portland a little bit of Oden...

by berrygraham on Jun 1, 2007 7:33 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Ooooh, crap,

you were trolling. Ok, you got me.

by howlingfantods on Jun 1, 2007 8:51 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

No prob.

I just read and responded to your above comment. You got some fire down below. I like it. Go UN in Darfur!

Please KP, Give Portland a little bit of Oden...

by berrygraham on Jun 1, 2007 9:31 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

225

i read an interview with him where he said he has never wighed 225 and he didnt know where that number kept coming from. Just to let you guys know :). now....1....2....3....FIGHT! lol

Bucky

by Bucky Blazer on Jun 2, 2007 10:06 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yes, howlinggantods,

it is getting real tiring.

by TwoDeep on May 31, 2007 10:42 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

something i hate to even bring up

but who knows if lamarcus will have any further cardiac trouble? everyone seems to be just taking for granted that this was minor and is now a forever closed book.

if we draft durant, we must play lma at C, we are committed, and there's no good plan b if that goes wrong. pryzbilla? uh-uh.

whereas, if we draft oden and have him at C and lamarcus at PF, the best case is great -- and the worst case, if lma had a recurrence, would be that we might be looking for a fill-in PF. that's just not as much of a problem.

a tiago splitter type might work out fine.

we need oden.

ignacio

by ignacio on May 31, 2007 10:53 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

The Aldridge heart thing

is not brought up, because it is treatable and has been treated. Sudden death is incredibly rare, but only a risk if not treated, and recurrence from treatment is rare as well. Meat Loaf and Joey Harrington also suffered from Wolf-Parkinsons-White syndrome, and I believe at least Harrington had the same corrective procedure done as Lamarcus. Unless it comes back, which, again, is rare (and I assume will be caught as the Blazers no doubt are keeping tabs on the situation), the problem is done with, and Aldridge faces no greater risk of cardiac trouble than the rest of us; he should be no more of a worry than Harrington is to NFL teams, and Meat Loaf to his fans.

Though in fairness, Harrington worries NFL teams anyway (the ones he plays for, and for different reasons), and Meat Loaf worries his non-fans ("I'll do anything for love but I won't do that? That makes no sense!")

Oh, Nancy! The Superpan is not magical, it will burn you.

by supremepuntiff on Jun 1, 2007 2:42 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

His name isn't actually "Meat Loaf".

HIS NAME IS ROBERT PAULSON.

Blazers have a five-on-three...and they pull it back and wait for help.

by QualityPie on Jun 1, 2007 10:19 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

If the Cavs win the Title

It's a sign from the basketball Gods to draft DURANT.

When the Cavs lose to the Spurs, they will be saying draft ODEN.

But then people will say "What if Lebron was on a team that wasn't awful besides him?"

Portland has the lineup a young superstar could mesh with well and succeed. Durant isn't the same type of player as Lebron (Lebron is more of a distrubutor, but Durant is a much better scorer).

If Lebron makes it all the way as a superstar without a dominant center, maybe Durant could do the same with an Aldridge and Roy core?

I never thought Lebron could get this far with that awful team. It's a sign the east really sucks more than anything, probably. The Pistons don't have a dominant post player.

But if the Cavs beat the Spurs, who do have a dominant post in Duncan (one of the best ever), then it raises questions about "How You Make a Championship Squad". The Cavs have done decent against the Spurs the last 2 years... but I can't see the Spurs losing to the Pistons, let alone the Cavs.

But I never thought Cavs would be up 3 to 2. Could Durant do it as well? Or is the only way to the top with Oden. I don't know. This whole playoff run could be a historical fluke.

I got a feeling about that Durant kid, and I'm staying a Durantian until I hear something that tells me I am dumb. I think one uber-special player surrounded by unselfish, smart stars (like Roy and Aldridge) could be a pretty good damn team. Often, like Lebron now and early career Jordan, these ultra-special players are surrounded by fluff. Durant isn't either of those players, but only in style... I think he'll do what he does at the same extremely high level.

Not that Oden won't be the best center ever also. It's a tough tough choice. But I think there is more than one way to win a title.

Mortimer

by Mortimer on May 31, 2007 11:14 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

when i first saw durant

i thought "this guy is going to change basketball." then i calmed down a little....but his ability to shoot from distance and to score when double and triple-teamed is uncanny (and reminiscent of bob mcadoo when he was in his prime).

i saw durant score 37 and get 23 rebounds.

in other words, i am not immune to his charms.

my point is that lamarcus is at this point ever-so-slightly a question mark, and this swings me to the belief that we must begin with greg oden rather than risk (even if it's a slim risk) being left "naked" (so to speak) in the middle if lamarcus ever has any more cardiac distress.

ignacio

by ignacio on May 31, 2007 11:34 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Soaring wing or great wall

I might be with ya on that thought Mortimer.
The way I was thinking of it after watching LeBron go OFF on the Pistons, was this:
After three or four years of NBA experience (and weight training), will Durant be able to give you a crunch-time performance like that?
Will Oden be able to prevent a crunch-time performance like that?
At the moment, I'm thinking the answers are 1) Yeah, baby! and 2) umm, decent chance.
By and large, I think Oden's not just the safe choice but the right choice. LMA's more 4 than 5, interior prescence is valuable cornerstone, etc. etc.
But the thought of Durant playing somewhere else scares me. Plus, I'm a big Longhorn fan (partly why Aldridge was my dream choice for last year's draft) Durant would look awful in green.

by hugs on Jun 1, 2007 12:29 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

But the current player Oden's most oft compared to

. . . is Tim Duncan, who awaits LeBron in the finals should he vanquish the Pist-Ons.

So we won't just be watching LeBron in the finals as a proxy for Durant in the draft;
we'd be seeing LeBron vs Duncan in a proxy fight on behalf of Durant AND Oden.

Blazers have a five-on-three...and they pull it back and wait for help.

by QualityPie on Jun 1, 2007 10:22 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yup yup WORD

That's what I was getting at, but as I re-read it I didn't really say it. It's like a Cavs/Spurs matchup is fate, just as our #1 pick is.

So THAT's why KP is waiting to make his choice... he wants to see the pro doppelganger's fight it out first!

Aside from Webber, Detroit is a good defensive team, with one of the best one on one defenders in the league in TeyShaun(sp) Prince. 1 player has destroyed them the past few games. Didn't think that could happen.

Mortimer

by Mortimer on Jun 1, 2007 1:44 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Travis Outlaw

He showed flashes of being legit at the end of the season when he was getting 25 with zero help. He is nowhere near durant but he could be Tayshaun Princeish. Zach Oden Outlaw...Lamarcus maybe one more year as 6th man...id take it

by Sabonis4Ever on May 31, 2007 11:24 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

i'm trying not to hype outlaw anymore

but yeah, Sabonis4Ever, absolutely.

ignacio

by ignacio on May 31, 2007 11:36 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

I still like Durant better.

I'm still not buying that "you need a dominant center to win a ring" nonsense. Way too many exceptions not just in the NBA, but in college and in international hoops too. It's about having the best team. If you don't believe me, just ask Shaq whathappened in the 2004 NBA Finals next time you see him.

I'm surprised no one is giving Joel more love. Everyone seems to forget how good he was when he was healthy, and how badly KP wanted him, and how much the Pistons and Spurs wanted him as their 5th starter.

If Joel really is that good, LMA becomes better than Rasheed, Durant becomes better than T-Mac, Roy becomes better than Manu, and Conley Jr. becomes T. Parker with a little less offense and a little more defense and creating, then that's the 5 I'm rolling with in the future. Sorry Greg.

by JMblazerfan on Jun 1, 2007 12:11 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Joel

I'm in the Oden camp, but you make a great point about Joel. The 2005/2006 Joel was a damn fine player. Mobile, active, a presence on D. The problem is that he's played at a high level for only about one and a half seasons of his career.

When going for a championship, you need to know who you can count on month-in and month-out. Thus far, that hasn't been Joel. I hope that changes, since he brings more game than he's often given credit for.

by Engineering Problem on Jun 1, 2007 12:30 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Passing on Oden because of Pryzbilla

Might be the ugly-step child of "We don't need Jordan because we have Clyde". At least Clyde was an all-star, I like Joel by he's not on Oden's level and let's not even mention how we couldn't give him away with his contract at this point.

I'm not going to say something like "We must have a dominant center to win" but I'd rather bet on the big guy who blocks shots and rebounds over any wing player any day. The default choice is Oden and the burden of proof is on Durant supporters to why he should be the pick.

I'm not trashing Durant but it continues to puzzle me why people almost automatically assume he's going to be on the TMAC/Kobe/Lebron level, because that's the only justification for taking him 1.

by jayseyfield on Jun 1, 2007 1:22 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Well, it's ALL unknown

It's not known whether Oden will dominate in the NBA or develop an offensive game. If it's Mutumbo versus an Athletic Dirk, I'd go for the Dirk. But I don't believe Oden is "only" a Mutumbo, just pointing out that even though BOTH players are as sure of a sure thing as I've ever seen, we don't know for CERTAIN how good each will be in the NBA.

I think it's safe to say Oden will be one of the best centers in the league today. I also think it's safe to say Durant will be one of the most dominant wing players. I think he'll be unstoppable. If Oden develops a post game, he could be too.

Just like we can't automatically assume Durant will be a better version of Larry Bird, you can say the same for Oden. Maybe Oden will only be a defensive stopper. Is that worth missing out on a 6'10" multi-positional unstoppable scorer who no one can guard AND rebounds more than Oden thus far in their career?

I think BOTH will reach the full potential that everyone hopes they can be. So really I'm not arguing AGAINST Oden, cause I love him. We are best friends. I just like Durant more. Right now, he is my BFF. If we get Oden, then me and Oden will share bracelets and all will be good.

It just depends on who will be MORE dominant at their position, and whether they are the major piece of the puzzle that gets us all the way back to the Champeeownship. The "Big Man Win Titles" is true but I say it's more the TEAM... Olajuwan is one of the greatest and more underrated centers ever, but he couldn't win the title until Jordan semi-retired. Others have pointed out other examples of dominant-big-man-less teams winning it all, often multiple times.

A good team with unstoppable players at a few positions (Aldridge, Roy, Durant) will do nothing but win. None of those big three are defensive liabilities either, so you don't need to compensate for them like a Z-Bo.

If Oden can dominate on BOTH offense and defense, then he'll be tooooo sweet to pass up. And if we're talking about not drafting either of these guys because of pre-existing players... I agree that would be a HUGE mistake. That shouldn't even enter our thought process. We need both players and positions, and a back up center like Joel (I love him and he could start on a lot of teams, but compared to Oden he is a back up) or a glut of non-starter SF's should NEVER stop us from drafting the best player possible. The cream will rise to the top, just get the best dude.

I don't think the burden of proof is on either player's supporters, it'll be on the players themselves to show KP why they should be a Trailblazer. These two guys are smart basketball players, and they know Portland is a much better situation than Seattle. I can only say what I feel and point to semi-meaningless college stats (who knows if they translate to the pros); the players will decide who we pick at #1.

Mortimer

by Mortimer on Jun 1, 2007 2:45 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Well-Said...

I also would like to cite Thad Motta's recently saying that he was blown away when he worked out Oden a few weeks after the season ended. Either way, the blazers are going to be much better next season regardless of who they draft. I'm just hoping for the next incarnation of Mychael Thompson.

Please KP, Give Portland a little bit of Oden...

by berrygraham on Jun 1, 2007 7:49 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs